☼ dan998: Cold turkey, reinstatement and tapering citalopram

[AliG]

 I'm pleased that you're seeing a change, for the better.  It is a slow process, but if you're seeing windows, that weren't there, previously, that's great !    Don't forget our party on " Flower's Beach" , one day !!       LOL !

[Dan998]

The slowness is probably the hardest thing to get my head around. Showing patience and restraining from cutting too quickly is such a test of my willpower. I want my old self back, NOW!

 

But, I'm getting glimpses of what will be and that is enough to allow me to put one foot in front of the other. I'll get there eventually, even if it is at a snails pace

[Dan998]

The important thing that I have to remind myself how well I'm doing. A year ago, when I was on 20 mg,  I was totally zombified and useless. I couldn't leave the house and I would just watch TV all day long.

 

I've come a long way since then. I'm starting to become a functional human being again, with ambition and plans that are tangible and not just a fanciful dream that will never come to fruition.

 

I'm taking 12.6 mg (63%) less poison now. That's two thirds less! Only one third to go!

[AliG]

 Dan,

 

You're doing so well !      Keep reminding yourself , of that .  You've come  such a long way !   You are definitely " healing " . I'm so happy for you !!   Keep in touch.

[bluebalu86]

You're doing great Dan. I'm very happy for you  

[AliG]

 Hi Dan,

 

How's it going ?     

[Flowers]

Hello Dan

 

It is great  to read that you are doing fine and I  can totally appreciate that you needed to take a break for a while.

 

You have done so well in striving to get to the place you want to be - drug free!

 

Let us know how you are doing when you can - I am so pleased for you.

 

Flowers xxx

[Dan998]

It’s been a while since my last update. Not much has changed. My symptoms have been fairly stable and constant over the past few months. The only real change has been that my dosage is lower, I’m now at 5.25mg of citalopram.

 

• Tinnitus. This has been with me constantly since September. Sometimes the pitch changes from a ringing to a hissing sound and I think it’s going to go away, but it doesn’t, it’s very annoying. I’m just going to have to accept the fact that I’m stuck with tinnitus for the foreseeable future and try to have faith that it will eventually resolve itself.
• Irritability. I can get really irritable and angry sometimes, it’s mostly caused by noise and is probably related to the tinnitus. Anything can set it off, the hum of the refrigerator, the central heating firing up, aircraft, traffic or even birds tweeting.
• Odd sensations in my scalp. It’s like a tingling, numbness or tightness and is sometimes accompanied by tension headaches, nothing too severe, and nothing like the zaps and migraines that I used to have.
• Low energy levels. I find it so hard to find the motivation to get started on anything. I think of something that I want or need to do, but the signal never reaches the part of my brain that controls taking action. It’s like part of the circuitry is broken and the connection cannot be made. Then I get angry and frustrated with myself for being so useless and lazy.
• Anxiety. It comes and goes. Not the constant terror like it used to be and I do get periods of calmness. I’m getting better at ignoring it and recognising that it’s chemically induced and has no basis in reality. Normal anxiety is going to be a piece of cake to deal with when I’ve recovered from withdrawal.
• Apathy. I still lack any enthusiasm to do much. Nothing gives me any pleasure. I don’t care about anyone or anything. My emotions are still completely flat and life seems fairly dull and pointless.

 

Although, it doesn’t feel like I’ve made any progress at all. I know this isn’t true, I’m just in a nasty wave right now and it feels like I’ve gone back to square one. I know this shall pass and I’ll be opening those windows again soon, but right now I’m feeling as sh*tty as I did 6 months ago.

 

I’ve given up on the Brassmonkey Slide method as the scheduled holds were far too demoralising and I also think it was too destabilising to my CNS as I would really notice the first drop after a hold. Instead I’m now just doing a basic micro taper of 2% per week. According to my new tapering schedule it’s going to take another 18 months to get down to 1mg and then who knows how long it’ll take to get down to zero.

 

I was really hoping to be feeling significantly better with the lower doses. True, there have been some significant improvements to memory and cognitive ability, but I was hoping for so much more progress than I’ve had so far. Maybe my expectations are far too high? Perhaps I won’t notice any real healing until I’ve gotten all the way down to zero? What scares me the most is that I’ll never recover and that I’ll never experience a positive emotion ever again.

 

I would do anything and pay any price to get my old self back again. To experience the ups and downs of normality. To live a fulfilling life, to laugh and joke with friends, to have hope for a better future, to feel excited about an upcoming event, to love and be loved, to feel the exhilaration of doing something risky and dangerous, to be proud of my achievements, to be confident about the decisions I make and to be able to relax and be comfortable in my own skin.

 

I’m seriously doubting my ability to see this through to the end, it’s the waiting that crushes my spirit and makes it so damned hard to carry on. But, then I don’t really have much choice knowing what I now know about SSRI’s. The options are fairly limited;

1)      Carry on with tapering and hope that things will slowly improve.

2)      Forget about tapering for now, settle on an effective dose of 5mg and possibly have another go at getting off in a few years’ time.

3)      Give up and go back to full dose and stay on psychiatric drugs for the rest of my life.

4)      Risk it all and try another CT, feel awesome for a few weeks, wait for the wheels to fall off again, try to reinstate at 1-2mg.

[Dan998]

Duh, just realised that I’ve been looking at this from the wrong perspective. When I think about it logically, the fact that I haven’t seen much improvement, but also, haven’t gotten any worse, is proof that tapering is actually working and that I’m probably going at about the right speed of reduction. 

 

It’s a delicate balancing act. I want to get free of the drugs as quickly as possible, but I also have to be wary of going too quickly and falling into the pit of despair. 

 

I got myself into this mess and only I can get myself out of it again. I chose to go to the doctor looking for a quick fix. I chose to believe that I had a lack of serotonin without doing my own research and discovering the truth. I chose to put these drugs into my mouth and swallow them. I chose to believe that I needed to continue taking them for 10 years despite the horrible side effects. I chose to ignore the warnings about abrupt cessation, and now, I am finally making a wise decision and choosing to carry on with the taper and to safely get off of them.

 

[AliG]

Dan. Don't beat yourself up. We have all done the same thing . The important thing is , now we know .

http://I did then what I knew how to do. Now that I know better, I do better.” ― Maya Angelou

Ali

[LoveandLight]

Yeah..your doing great..pm'ed you

[Flowers]

Hi Dan!

 

You have come so far since your last post and have done so well. None of this is your fault - we put our faith in Dr's!!

 

I am glad you are sticking with your taper. Keep it slow and hold if you have to - it will pay off in the end.

 

Flowers xxx

[SquirrellyGirl]

Hi Dan, 

 

I just read your update and understand the pain of remorse.  I've had all the same ruminations about 20 years on these meds!  If only....well, we know how self-defeating that kind of thinking is!  I can get myself pretty worked up if I think about how long it will take to taper off two drugs.  So I choose to look at it this way:  either stay on them the rest of my life, which is unacceptable now that I know the truth about these drugs or 2) take as long as it takes to get off safely and sanely, which in my mind is far more acceptable than #1.  There's the in-betweens, of course. Any lesser amount is better than a greater amount :-)

 

I sort of look at it this way:  my nervous system got so dumbed down by the drugs that it's going to take a lot of nudging, via small cuts, to wake it up and get it working for itself.  This will be especially true as I get to the lowest doses before jumping off.  We long-timers just have to baby our nervous systems along.  I believe in the power of neuroplasticity, but I think it just takes longer to happen than we'd like to accept. 

 

So the trick is to find acceptance and joy in the life we have before us today. We have unreasonable expectations, which cause us distress, but we can recognize them, be aware of them,  and find reasonable expectations to replace them, ones the brain can accept.  Unreasonable:  I feel down today and maybe it will never end.  Reasonable:  today is hard, but my nervous system is healing, and tomorrow may be better!

 

Congratulations on being at just over 5 mg!  You will make it this time!

 

SG

[Dan998]

Thanks everyone for the advice and support. I really got knocked off course by this wave after having months of stability.

 

I know that waves are necessary for healing to happen and it's just my brain trying to do some repairs, growing new receptors, making new connections and trying to reach homeostasis.

 

I having a better day today, still a bit up and down. Hopefully, will be back to an improved baseline soon.

[Dan998]

That’s enough negativity for now, because there have also been some very definite improvements as the dose has got lower.

 

They say that you don’t know what you have until you lose it. When it comes to antidepressants the reverse is true, you don’t know what you’ve lost until you get it back. Peter Breggin calls it the Spellbinding Effect and for me it has been the best thing about the withdrawal process. 

Our personality is shaped by both nurture and nature. We build our personalities upon the sum of our experiences. Anti-depressants seem to take these memories and lock them away within the darkest depths of our minds. The tapering process has allowed some of these memories to be slowly exposed to the light. Every now and then I’m rewarded with a new piece of the jigsaw puzzle. A memory of a forgotten life, which is slowly taking shape again after years of being subdued by mind altering drugs. 

 

Lately, I’ve been remembering some of my past with emotional context, I can remember the moment and I can almost, but not quite, feel how that moment felt. It lasts for a few precious milliseconds before evaporating back into the bubbling cauldron of consciousness. A fleeting glimpse of what will be? 

[LoveandLight]

Your a really good writer..do you keep a diary? Maybe you'll write a book when your recovered?

[SquirrellyGirl]

 

That’s enough negativity for now, because there have also been some very definite improvements as the dose has got lower.

 

They say that you don’t know what you have until you lose it. When it comes to antidepressants the reverse is true, you don’t know what you’ve lost until you get it back. Peter Breggin calls it the Spellbinding Effect and for me it has been the best thing about the withdrawal process. 

Our personality is shaped by both nurture and nature. We build our personalities upon the sum of our experiences. Anti-depressants seem to take these memories and lock them away within the darkest depths of our minds. The tapering process has allowed some of these memories to be slowly exposed to the light. Every now and then I’m rewarded with a new piece of the jigsaw puzzle. A memory of a forgotten life, which is slowly taking shape again after years of being subdued by mind altering drugs. 

 

 

You summed this up perfectly, Dan!  I have been spellbound and feel like my development was retarded during all the years of drug-taking, and that my sense of who I was before drugs has been lost to the ether.  I'm like a child in a 50 year old body.  Memories, if I have them, are not concrete, vague, without detail. The other day I had a spontaneous retrieval of a memory about my grandfather that had me crying, but it was such a joy to FEEL and REMEMBER!  

 

I agree with Loveandlight, your writing is a pleasure to read!

 

SG

[Dan998]

Thanks Love and SG,

 

I'm finding that the words are flowing more freely lately. I used to really enjoy creative writing. I had a few blogs and was very active on Twitter. After the last CT crash I was barely able to spell my own name.

 

I probably will write a book about all this once I've got the worst of it over with and have my brain back to 100%, actually, right now, I'd settle for 75% of what I used to be. I will need to do some more research and learn a bit more about neuroscience as well.

 

The message needs to be spread far and wide, "Psychiatric drugs are dangerous. Avoid them like the plague."

[Dan998]

Something new to report. A very odd thing happened to me whilst wandering around the supermarket. I had an almost uncontrollable desire to shout out the name of anything I was looking at, it was like a mild form of Tourette’s syndrome.  I really had to stifle the urge and bite my tongue. It was almost funny and I did actually have a little laugh when I walked past the bananas. Totally bizarre, hope it doesn’t happen again as a trip to the chemist shop will be a potential minefield of embarrassment. 

[AliG]

Dan.      LOL.  You do still have your sense of humor . 

My link " flipped out ", the other day.  This is the quote :   "  Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do better. "     - Maya Angelou.

Ali

[Dan998]

I'm starting to see the funny side of things again. It's such a wonderful gift. 

[Dan998]

Another thing that has improved are my concentration levels. A few months ago my brain was just a muddle of disconnected thoughts and ideas. The cog-fog has almost entirely resolved itself and things are so much better now.

 

I am now able to follow plots on film and TV. Up until recently I could just about follow a sports match and even then, a couple of hours later, I would forget who had won or what had happened. It’s a blessed relief to be able to concentrate and distract myself with TV and not have my brain ruminating on a million and one things at once.

 

I can also remember what I have read in books and online, which is encouraging considering how severely disabled my language skills had been during cold-turkey and as recently as last summer. 

 

About a month ago my car broke down. The suspension decided to self-destruct. I’m really skint at the moment and couldn’t afford to take it to the garage.  I used to be mechanically minded and did a lot of tinkering with cars and bikes, so decided to have a bash at fixing it myself. I’ll admit that I had my doubts about my own ability to tackle such a big job, but didn’t have much choice as I live in a really isolated location, there is no public transport and I absolutely have to have my car working.

 

I can’t say I enjoyed the process, but I was able to follow the instructions and work in a methodical manner and totally immerse myself in the task at hand. It took me a lot longer than anticipated as I had a few difficulties to overcome, such as poor weather and waiting for parts, but I kept calm, persevered and actually felt a minor sense of achievement once it was back on the road.

 

I suppose that these small victories are slowly helping to build up my self-confidence. I can actually do stuff when I put my mind to it, and I can probably do a lot more than I think I’m capable of doing.

 

[AliG]

Wow !  That's huge. Well done, you .     I hope you stay around . It's good to hear , that you're improving .

[Flowers]

Missed you making me laugh Dan! Love the supermarket experience!

 

I think you are doing much better than you think you are.

 

xxxxx

[Dan998]

Thanks Ali, I'm going to try and stay around. It's about time that I started to give back to the community. I never would have got this far without the lovely people on this site. I hope to be able to share some of my experience and provide some support and encouragement to the newbies.

 

Flowers, Glad I made you laugh. Just noticed that you've started your taper. Hope it goes smoothly for you 

[Dan998]

My mood is jumping all over the place today. I woke up to the wind whistling through the trees and rain drumming on the window and had absolutely no desire to get out of bed. I just laid there for a couple of hours, urinating about a few things and making myself feel more depressed. Felt a lot better once I’d dragged myself downstairs and forced some breakfast and a cuppa down my neck. Spent a few more hours cycling between anxiety and calmness. Snapped out of it by distracting myself with some chores. I was hoping to get out for a nice long walk, but the weather is still much too yucky, it’ll be like a mud bath out there today. Instead, I’m gonna sit on my big fat arse and watch the Six Nations Rugby. My life is so very, very, very dull at the moment. I hate winter.

[Dan998]

Just noticed that 5 mg is right on the precipice of rapidly declining SERT occupancy - http://www.mediafire.com/view/f3h1ao5ijfj93/papers#0yp2c8pbjrziaab. No wonder I'm having difficulties. I'm going to put the brakes on and only cut by 1% this week.

[SquirrellyGirl]

I love thatpaper, really slams it home that we must take it really slow. I wish we had one for mirtazapine. I'm at 14 mg, 15 being the minimum effective dose. I switched to making a liquid and am having some unsettling anxiety, really not liking it! So, I am empathizing with you big time, Dan! Maybe you could look into a SAD lamp?

 

SG

[Dan998]

The wave seems to be lifting. I'm feeling a lot more positive today. Feeling slightly agitated and restless, but still lacking the energy to do anything much about it.

 

I’ve been having some really pleasant dreams the last few nights. They’ve been so vivid and seemed so real. In my dreams I don’t have withdrawal symptoms. I’m the real me. I can think clearly, I have tons of energy, no anxiety and can feel normal emotions again.

 

The subjects of my dreams are nothing special. It’s all ordinary stuff, but totally out of character of the drugged me. For instance, last night I started a new job, made some new friends and went for a drink at the pub. I was confident and calm. I was telling anecdotes and jokes. I was the centre of attention and was absolutely loving it. It was such a massive disappointment to wake-up into reality.

 

I think my brain is testing its new circuits and just enjoying a bit of play time. Getting itself ready for when I'm able to integrate myself back into society. Whatever it is doing, I like it, and hope that these dreams will one day become my reality.

[SquirrellyGirl]

That is so great, Dan!  You will get there.  We will get there. The waves are so hard, as I'm in one myself, so I am glad that yours is declining :-)

 

I would love to have dreams like yours!

 

SG

[Dan998]

Hey, wouldn't it be great if we could stay asleep until our brains had healed.

[SquirrellyGirl]

Funny you should say that, Dan!  When I've been at my worst, I wished I could be put into a coma until my brain healed, or have a lobotomy so I could forget being who I hated being.  Thankfully, I don't hate that "self" anymore :-)  

 

Reminds me of James Herriot's story of the sheep (or lamb) that was not doing well, so he gave it a barbituate overdose to put it down.  However, he didn't give it enough, and a few days later it came to and had healed, was well!  I'm sure I butchered the story, but you get the gist 

 

SG

[Dan998]

You, me and everyone else on here would take the medical induced coma if it were an option. Yeah, I'd be the first in the queue. Unfortunately, we have to do this the hard way. I know one thing for sure, once this is over I am never going to take drugs ever again and will find better ways to cope with life's ups and downs.

[Dan998]

I thought I was turning a corner and coming out of the latest wave, but alas no. That awful chemical anxiety has made an unwelcome return today . Knotted stomach, chest and throat tightness, jelly legs. I can best describe it as a sense of impending doom, it feels like I’ve forgotten to do something really important, but can’t remember what that important thing is.  I’ve also got a banging headache and am really fatigued, sort of feels like a hangover. Yuck!

 

Getting down to 5mg is proving to be so very difficult. I’ve read that many people have sticky doses that are hard to get through. I wonder if this is what is happening to me or is it that my brain is struggling to adapt to the cumulative effects of all those reductions? I believe that I’d been taking it nice and steady (10mg – 5mg in six months) but I could be wrong. 

 

I hate holding, I’d rather poop into my hands and clap, but it might actually be wise to tread the path of caution here and take a nice long hold after all? 

I know that I have to follow the collective wisdom and to keep reminding myself that this is normal for withdrawal. It will pass… Hang on in there… Take it easy… Healing is happening…  A nice big window will be opening soon... You probably all know these mantras off by heart by now, but it’s so hard to remember these comforting words whilst battling to stay afloat on a big scary wave.

 

It has been almost a year since I started this journey. A year of unimaginable mental torture. The question is, how much more of this **** am I willing to endure? How long will I have to ride this crazy rollercoaster? It’s funny how a wave can make us totally doubt ourselves and make us blind to the progress we have made. Everything is black. You see it happen all the time around here. I guess that’ll be those pesky neuro-emotions messing with my mind again.

 

I think that a visit to the cursing thread might be in order.

[AliG]

Dan. Holding is hard work !   You have to keep enduring . what other choice is there?  You keep going until  ....  !

[Flowers]

Dan - Every time I hit a wave I think it is going to last forever so know how you feel. But like AliG says it isn't going to be forever and we have to hold and get through it!

 

From what I have gleaned from here some folk do find tapering harder when getting down to the lower dosages. Maybe once you have stabilised you may want to reduce by just a little bit next time.

 

I have all this ahead of me so can't really offer anymore personal advice.

 

Yep - waves are the pits but they will pass. I can cope reasonably OK with any physical symptoms but when the anxiety/ dread etc comes to visit it is hell isn't it?

 

Keep going Dan - hopefully you will feel better very soon.

 

xxxxxx