success ☼ Katamari My story and progress so far after quitting venlafaxine

[Katamari]

Hello folks and sorry for my silly english!

 

My antidepressants history starts at my teenage years (depression, social anxiety disorder) and after trying escitalopram

and fuoxetine, I got prescribed venlafaxine ("the one that helps when others have failed", the gp said). It did help,

and now that I have built the life I'm comfortable with and no major stress triggers on sight, I decided to go off venlafaxine.

Reasons are that my emotional life had gone unnaturally smooth, like being "just ok" all the time. Also, my sexuality was 

non-existent.

 

I tapered off waaay too quickly, I know it now. I took only 31 days to taper off completely. But I had no bad withdrawal symptoms, 

just the brain zaps and nausea, but I found cyclizine very helpful with that.

 

Of course I started to get emotional symptoms too, I was very short tempered and had massive anger bursts. Some days I

was feeling little low, but nothing massive. I couldn't dring any coffee for about three months, got so sick from it.

 

After 4 months of being completely off venlafaxine, I got my first big bad wave. It lasted a week, when I was unable to go 

to work and just suffer in my bed. Symptoms were palpations and racing heart, nausea, anxiety, crying spells, insomnia, 

need to pee every 15 minutes, diarrhea, brethless feeling... Was that all? Anyhoo, I went to see physician and thankfully

he somehow understood my condition and gave me one week off so I could rest at home. He also prescribed propranolol for my heart

problems (which have helped alot) and said that if this episode of mine won't go away, I need to start taking venla's again 

with small doze. I refused, not going to give up yet!

 

After that wave, I had almost two months of feeling completely normal. Like my own self! 

 

But then, the second bad wave hit. This time it was different. More difficult and scary. I had the same symptoms I had

in the previous wave, but also these frightening episodes of de-personalization,feeling of losing my sanity and night terrors.

In those episodes I have been very close to call an ambulance. Thank god my partner is a huge support for me and with his

help I have been able to get through these attacks, that lasted sometimes few hours and sometimes about twenty minutes.

 

Now I'm once again feeling normal, thank goodness. I wanted to share my progress here, because I felt I owe this to you,

since I have got massive help from this forum. So thank you guys!

 

I'll report if something comes up. This is a long journey.

[peggy]

Hi Katamari!

 

Welcome! you did taper too fast, and you have been very lucky really... I hope that you are doing all the normal selfcare things, like good sleep, no alcohol, gentle exercise and good diet... you may also benefit from fish oil (although being in Finland you probably eat a lot of beautiful fish anyway!)

 

Thanks for your story!

[Petunia]

Welcome Katamari,

Thank you for posting and sharing your story, I'm glad to hear this site has been helpful.  As Peggy mentioned, you have been quite lucky to have had relatively mild withdrawal symptoms after tapering too fast, but some people do seem to have an easier time.

 

Are you still taking propranolol?

 

You might find this topic helpful if you haven't already seen it:

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Recovery

Many people find  fish oil and magnesium helpful, see King of Supplements: Omega 3 Fatty Acids (Fish Oil) and Magnesium, Nature's Calcium Channel Blocker

 

Please stay in touch and let us know how you are doing.

 

Petunia.

[Katamari]

Thank you.

 

Yes, I guess I'm lucky. My main consern is that how long will I get these waves, because I can't be a week off from work after every two months, can I? I mean, I feel like I owe an explanation about this to my boss. But this ad withdrawal syndrome is not commonly known in Finland, not sure if my boss is going to believe me... Especially because between those waves I'm functioning like a proper worker. I don't want them to think that maybe I'm an alcoholic or a drug user, or that I'm being bipolar or something... I'd like to be honest with this.

 

I've been off from work for two weeks now and haven't been taking propranolol. Normally I would take 10 mg in the morning before going to work, because my job is stressful and I get palpations easily. On weekends and day offs I don't need them, unless the palpations keep me from sleeping at night.

 

I do have healthy lifestyle and have always been interested in health stuff (and I'm a practical nurse myself, but I nurse teeth ) and I've became very good at listening to my body and feelings. I recognize when my "brain sensitive"-mode is on, then I need to slow down and live "simple life". Which basically means

staying at home and taking a rest, avoiding coffee, alcohol, all medicine, coca-cola, chocolate... My previous wave was triggered by my period, like they were not annoying enough already... 

[PurpleZ]

Hi Katamari!

 

Welcome! you did taper too fast, and you have been very lucky really... I hope that you are doing all the normal selfcare things, like good sleep, no alcohol, gentle exercise and good diet... you may also benefit from fish oil (although being in Finland you probably eat a lot of beautiful fish anyway!)

 

Thanks for your story!

Are you concerned with what to do about your depression once you are off the meds completely?

[Katamari]

 

Hi Katamari!

 

Welcome! you did taper too fast, and you have been very lucky really... I hope that you are doing all the normal selfcare things, like good sleep, no alcohol, gentle exercise and good diet... you may also benefit from fish oil (although being in Finland you probably eat a lot of beautiful fish anyway!)

 

Thanks for your story!

Are you concerned with what to do about your depression once you are off the meds completely?

 

If my depression is about to come back, I'm going to start seeing psychologist. This time I'm not going to take meds unless it is an absolute necessity. In Finland they tend to prescribe antidepressants way too easily. 

[Katamari]

Just a quick update:

After a very hard wave I had about 4 weeks ago, my system managed to get itself balanced once again. I guess that was a 6 month mark or something. It took 3 weeks to get better and now I've been somewhat normal for a week. Getting back to work after summer holidays caused major anxiety, but somehow being at work has actually made me feel better about myself. But I've also noticed that my smart isn't that sharp... Perhaps this is  temporary. 

It seems that those mental issues I had four months ago, have returned. I'm so irritable and get emotional easily. I cried at the movies when I saw Jurassic World.   

Now I'm living carefully and waiting for a new wave... but will it be after two weeks, a month or 3 months, nobody knows. 

[Altostrata]

Very good to hear, Katamari. Thank you for updating your topic.

 

Please see the Symptoms and self-care forum for suggestion about how to deal with symptoms.

 

Are you taking fish oil and magnesium supplements, see
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1300-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/
 

[Theon]

 

It seems that those mental issues I had four months ago, have returned. I'm so irritable and get emotional easily. I cried at the movies when I saw Jurassic World.   

 Wow, not like jurassic world is a very sentimental movie .  I actually didn't like it that much haha. Liked more Mad max, that one was awesome.

 

Did you get emotional flatness in your period of fluoxetine? I got it and it doesn't seem to want to go away.

 

I hope you will get through withdrawal soon and you manage your anxiety/depression by other ways!

 

All the best

[Katamari]

 

It seems that those mental issues I had four months ago, have returned. I'm so irritable and get emotional easily. I cried at the movies when I saw Jurassic World. 

 Wow, not like jurassic world is a very sentimental movie .  I actually didn't like it that much haha. Liked more Mad max, that one was awesome.

 

Did you get emotional flatness in your period of fluoxetine? I got it and it doesn't seem to want to go away.

 

I hope you will get through withdrawal soon and you manage your anxiety/depression by other ways!

 

All the best

 

Yeah, I have to see Mad Max too! Jurassic world was entertaining but also a bit silly at times... 

 

And yes, my emotional life with ADs had no ups and downs, and I never got excited about anything. I also stopped doing any kind of artwork, which had been a huge part of my life before those meds. All the creativity had disappeared. After quitting, I have already made two paintings!! 

It really seems that ADs made me a couch potato and very boring person, though mind was razor sharp. Now I'm more outgoing but dumb! 

[Katamari]

Aaarrgghh. I'm so angry at everything. Also feel like crying. Feels like I'm just a piece of crap. There is a party tonight and I hate all of them already. My partner annoys me big time. I'm bored but still not interested to do anything. I'm uncomfortable in my own skin.

Now I'm just wondering if this is something that normal people experience sometimes, or is this a reminder of withdrawal. Other familiar symptoms are here too, like headache, fast heartbeat and "aggressive feelings". 

There is a perfect summer outside and I just want to give a finger to the sun.

[ang]

You are doing extremely well, believe me..................It has been 8 months off the evil effexor (venlazafine), and you are still sane, and going to work most of the time..........

All of the things you describe are the withdrawal, you will not always be like that....................   

 

We all go through that............ seeing the sun outside, but not wanting to be a part of it, that is just the discontinuration syndrome.............  

 

Windows and waves, it just happens that way.  The one thing I truly missed while on the stuff, but I didnt know, was how all my artistic side, just disappeared......  I long for the day I can be creative, and knit, and sew, and make sculptures and do pottery again.................      I love horticulture, but to water one pot plant now, is a struggle...............

 

Effexor killed my marriage, your relationship has survived..............but I was on a much higher dose, and I had to witch to another AD to break free of the effexor..............the devils tic tacs.

best wishes, keep us all informed of your progress.

[Altostrata]

Is this constant or related to your menstrual cycle? Many women find withdrawal symptoms get worse at various places in their cycles.

[Katamari]

Actually, yes this could be related to menstrual cycle. I did hit the midpoint of my cycle couple of days ago. I'm not using any hormonal birth control, so at least that is real me!

[Katamari]

It's been a week since my last post and when I was feeling aggressive and angry. Apparently that's how my waves start. From irritation to aggression, and from aggression to anxiety and crying at the end. This pattern is familiar from those previous waves as well. I think I can say now that this is how my waves "work". 

Luckily this time I was able to go to work and survive the whole 5-day week. It was difficult at times and I got one panic attack but I managed to handle that pretty well... My working partner thought that I just got sick because of the heat and lack of fresh air. I'm glad that now I know that panic attack at the work is not an end of the world. I believe that panic is going to be a part of me in the future anyway, but that's ok if I can handle it.
I also had a strong urge to cry many times, but somehow I managed to keep myself together by trying to keep focusing my mind somewhere else.
I also had nausea and racing heart, the classic symptoms. At home I was completely symptom-free.

Now I'm at home alone this whole weekend. I'm crying and feeling anxious, but it seems that these episodes start to fade away after the point I'm crying. So that's positive. 

This week I've been wondering where the hell do these terrible fears and thoughts come from? Things like getting old, death, the fact that my family members will die someday really upsets me. Is this my own psychological issue or is this something related to withdrawal? Death related stuff has never been any issue to me, then why on earth is it now popping in my head all the time?? 
 

[Katamari]

It has been a long time since my last window. Week after week I feel sad, frustrated, anxious or desperate. I also got nausea and rapid pulse today, which I had almost forgot what it is like.

I've got other health issues too (nothing serious though) and that may have had something to do with these low feelings. Or maybe the medicines I took are guilty?

I've read somewhere around here that there is a magical "9 month mark" in withdrawal recovery pattern... Which is said to be difficult. I have now been 8 months off, so it's coming soon!! 

[LoveandLight]

Think related to withdrawal re. The death thoughts..I have this a lot!! Ruminating thoughts about worrying over people dying..

 

You may pass the 9 month mark fine! You seem to be doing really great by the way,.really great! Lots of windows. It's nice to see

[Altostrata]

Katamari, good to hear you surfed that wave. You may be interested in reading Neuro emotions

[Katamari]

I have noticed something. 

My style of dealing with argues or other emotionally negative situations have changed. With antidepressants, I was more like a martyr and crying alone and waiting for someone to understand me. 

Nowadays I feel anger. I the anger goes on long enough, it escalates into massive outburst of rage, with an urge to smash things up. After that and some hysterical crying, I calm down and feel somewhat normal again. No matter what the issue was, I stop to care about it anymore. This feels very unfamiliar to me. 

I've been thinking, maybe it is because my use of AD's started when I was so young. I have missed a period of age where we learn how to deal with these emotions.  Is this my new mental puberty?

[Katamari]

I'm just so angry at everything. And frustrated. 

[KT38]

I'm near the end of 6 months off and have extreme anger, too.  This started to get bad last month for me. 

[Altostrata]

Fish oil and magnesium?

[Katamari]

I've been eaten magnesium this whole time. Fish oils made me anemic, so I haven't tried them since. 

These last two weeks have been difficult for me. I've had two major argues with my boyfriend. Morning anxiety and 24/7 headache has come back again. 

But I'm glad that it getting easier every day. Even though this was a difficult wave, I've been able to go to work. Morning anxiety means morning nausea as well, so that is annoying. 

[JanCarol]

Hey Katamari - 

 

It sounds like you are well on top of the waves and windows - even though it may not seem like it!  Just that you are aware that "This is Withdrawal," and "This is a Wave" puts you ahead of the game.  When you are able to step back and say, "This is only a symptom of withdrawal," you are healing, you are recovering.

 

You asked:

 

 

This week I've been wondering where the hell do these terrible fears and thoughts come from? Things like getting old, death, the fact that my family members will die someday really upsets me. Is this my own psychological issue or is this something related to withdrawal? Death related stuff has never been any issue to me, then why on earth is it now popping in my head all the time??

 

Try this:  Neuro-emotion

 

Neuro-emotions have a seed of real emotion - like regrets from the past, or fears of the future, or feeling sorrow or loss at something that passed you by.  Except that Neuro-emotions pick up on the seed of real emotion and grow them into a giant tree that dominates and overwhelms.  The grain of sand which is the real emotion becomes and endless beach and when you perceive the enormousness of it - you become lost in the BIG feeling, and the bigness of that feeling.

 

But this is a sign that you are healing.  Neuro-emotions are symptoms of your brain going over the emotions that were once deadened, flattened by the drugs, and magnifying them as you learn to feel again.  While I can't really say embrace them (it's probably better to distract from them) - you can acknowledge that your feelings are healing along with your body.

 

Oh!  Now I see that Alto sent you that link, but it won't hurt to send again.

 

Then you ask:

 

 

I've been thinking, maybe it is because my use of AD's started when I was so young. I have missed a period of age where we learn how to deal with these emotions.  Is this my new mental puberty?

 

I asked myself this when I first started reading your thread.  I even went and looked up your gender to see if you were male (they mature later than women).  You said "teenage," and "puberty" but there is a huge difference between age 13, or 16, or 18 for women.  If it was 18, I would not worry so much - but there may still be some rebellion you have to get out of your system!

 

Many of us found that the time we spent on psych drugs - that as we come off we have some catching up to do.

 

So you might ask yourself - when you were a "depressed" and "socially anxious" teen - were you just a normal moody teenager? (one of my first thoughts)  Or was there something that precipitated the trip to the doctor?  Was that "something" your parent's concern?  Or something else?  You may have more to learn about yourself as you re-form your identity.

 

In my case I was wild, experimenting with drugs, and loose sexual morals = rebellious, what would now be called "oppositional defiant disorder." I am so grateful that there was no diagnosis back in the 70's!!  

 

Perhaps these links will help you explore your anger in a healthy way:  http://beyondmeds.com/2013/06/30/anger-and-rage-collection/

 

Really - for all of your frustration and difficulty, you are speaking very clearly, not at all like a "crazy person."  Remember to breathe, when you have emotion.  It's not about fighting the emotion, but allowing yourself to feel it from a safe space.  Emotions are like weather - we can't really control them.  But we can observe them, and realize that this, too, will pass.

[Katamari]

Thank you for your quality reply JanCarol. It gave me great comfort.


I'm now living the time I was dreaming about when I was at my worst condition in june. Now I've been 10 months antidepressants-free!! 
I believe the most difficulties are behind now. I haven't experienced any anger for a long time. Though I've had some anxiety and depression, but it was totally related to PMS (and there is an effective treatment for that: chocolate  ). 

Today I have more hobbies than ever and I enjoy doing new things. I think this is what life is supposed to be. In the other hand, I've started to get back those social anxiety problems I had before taking any AD's. Including blushing, excess sweating, palpitations and sometimes mild nausea. But if it stays on these levels I'm fine with them. I just hope they won't start to escalate and start that vicious circle that leads to other problems.

I did quit hormonal contraception as well when I stopped taking venlafaxine, and it seems that this may had caused some extra struggle in this journey... I've noticed that it took surprisingly long time for my body to start function properly again. I accidentally made an evil human experiment.

So, for now things are pretty well. I feel calm about the future, I believe there are still some waves coming, but they won't get as nasty as they did.


 

[JanCarol]

That's awesome!  I hope you will continue to check in with us from time to time - and encourage those of us who still struggle!  So many "evil experiments" as you say - were done with the best of intentions.  I know that my years on birth control were quite ugly, and cannot imagine them mixed with the drugs - or withdrawal.

 

Congratulations on surviving the first 10 months!  And coming out stronger, it seems!

 

We are here, should you need us.  Hopefully you are out of the thickest part of the woods, now.

[Altostrata]

Very happy to hear you're doing better. I added our cheerful "here comes the sun" symbol

☼

to the title of your Intro topic, to show you're recovering.

Please continue to let us know how you're doing. I hope you will add your story to our Recovery Success Stories eventually!

[Katamari]

Long time no anxiety...until now. It is the same old morning nausea and anxiety that is perhaps the most typical symptom of this whole withdrawal thing. A wave has come to say hello again. It is as exciting and new as a bowl of porridge. I never thought that one could get used to these! All it does is giving some extra struggle to my days, because that awful feeling comes at mornings, when I'm at work. 

There is one thing that worries me. Before taking venlafaxine or other AD's, my heart pressure was ideal, kinda low actually. So as we all know, those meds tend to rise blood pressure a bit. But the thing that worries me, is that mine hasn't gone lower. And my pulse is rapid too, no matter what I'm doing. I guess that as long as my nervous system is unbalanced and these waves keep coming, my blood pressure and pulse won't come down...   

After couple of weeks, I have been AD-free for 12 months!! 

 

[KT38]

When did your nausea start?  I had it for 1-2 weeks when I got off but went away and now 8 months later it is back.  I am usually bad around 10am-1pm with it everyday.  I get these waves of nausea and if I have stress it gets worse.  Have you found anything that helps it?  It's like an overwhelming sick feeling with nausea but it's not like you have to throw up...you just feel that sickness.  Almost like morning sickness.

[reachingforthestars]

Katamari, how high is your pulse when resting and how high is the blood pressure? Do you still get brain zaps and do you have sleep problems anymore? Remember to take vitamin D since in Finland you don't get sunshine during winter. Terrible weather by the way and looks like there isn't going to be white Christmas in Finland :/

[Katamari]

Hi KT38!
My nausea started about two weeks after I started tapering and I've had it more or less since then. Maybe one or two nausea-free weeks every now and then. It is true that mornings are the hardest. Only thing that helps me, is that I need to avoid coffee in the mornings, it just makes the nausea and anxiety ten times worse.


Hello reachingforthestars, 
Yes indeed, it is the darkest time of the year. No proper daylight at all. But I'm fine with it. It's the springtime and rapidly increasing light that can have some unwanted effect in my mental health...
Apparently, my pulse is normal. I just measured it. It is 63 beats per minute. Then why do I feel it so strongly?   
My blood pressure is usually 116/80, so it means that my diastolic pressure is higher than it used to. That worries me.

I had brain zaps only at the very first days after I started tapering. I can't remember how long they kept coming, but they did not bother me that much anyway. I would say maybe two weeks or something and they stopped.
I haven't got any sleeping problems for months! In fact, I sleep better than I ever did with venlafaxine!

[Katamari]

I thought these waves couldn't possibly bother me that much anymore. Well, this must some kind of one year mark thing I'm experiencing right now.
I'm having difficulties in my everyday chores, like cleaning the house or even getting myself out of the apartment. I am restless, anxious and I want to cry out loud. 

I'll stay under a blanket until this goes away.

[KarenB]

Hey Katamari,

 

I'll stay under a blanket until this goes away.

 

 

.... and it will go away.  You could have a good cry under there too .  Find all the soothing things you can.  How bout a hot bath with epsom salts? 

[Katamari]

Still struggling with a wave here. This is definitely one of those big ones. Like another boss fight in a game called withdrawal syndrome.

These big ones have one interesting thing in common: They force me to think that this is permanent now, my nervous system is damaged and my life is going to be like this forever. 

I haven't celebrated christmas or new year, because I'm not feeling well. I got panic attack at work. I can't eat because there are no appetite at all. After 12 hours of fasting, eating is very difficult and I want to throw up when I even see any food. If I get anything inside, I'll get diarrhea almost instantly. 

I guess I don't need to say how I'm feeling at the moment.



 

[Katamari]

Another wave down, again. This sure was one of the strongest. At one point I couldn't go to work.

I wonder if normal people understand to cherish these days when you feel good both mentally and physically.

This really is a character building experience too. My value system has improved and my self-confidence has grown. I feel like my life is given back to me. Sounding like a window, eh?

At the same time I feel sorry for them who aren't so lucky. And I feel a bit guilty for being so happy about myself. 

[KT38]

Hi! Was Dec 2014 when you had your last dose? Or was it 5 weeks after that? Happy to hear you are having a window!!