andy013: 4 years off and counting...

[andy013]

But dont kill yourself til you try EVERYTHING.

 

That's the plan. Actually, I don't even plan to kill myself but it's just that if things go wrong with an SSRI I can't imagine myself living for very long.

 

I have tried a few things but in general after my bad reaction to vitamin D I tried to avoid all supplements because I felt they were only making me worse. It is only more recently I have been willing to try things as I no longer believe I will recover on my own so I figure I have nothing to lose. I have tried trypophan, 5-htp, vitamin D, omega 3. I will probably try them again to make absolutely sure I get no benefits from them. I also have some magnesium I was going to try and take for a while.

[dalsaan]

Brassmonkey, there are other reasons people commit suicide other than depression. I wouldn't tell a terminally ill person to phone the good samaritans because they want to kill themselves. Talking to someone face to face will not do anything to help my situation. I have brain damage.

 

 

Something that is really crazy is that around 18 months off of the drugs I took a very high dose of vitamin D. It triggered a very negative reaction. I got an extremely bad fever. I was literally sitting in a bath of ice water. I also had diarrhoea and nausea and just felt very bad. I think it may have been serotonin syndrome. After a week the fever began to go down but then I started to feel very depressed. This depression lasted for about a month, I just felt terrible. However, after that month the depression began to go away and I slowly noticed myself feeling better and better. For the next 2 weeks I basically felt completely normal. My sex drive was normal. My social function was normal. I was smiling and laughing and friendly. This made me certain that these problems were 100% real and caused by something being messed up in my brain. 

 

Andy, if you had a period of two weeks where you were 100% normal then you do not have brain damage.   You have a significantly disrupted nervous system and anything that adds pressure to that nervous system, like catastrophising about your situation, will negatively impact your recovery.

 

Managing how you deal with your health situation so as to not entertain suicidal thoughts is the job of suicide helplines and face to face support agencies.  As BrassMonkey indicates, we are not equipped to deal with that and anyone that suggests that suicide is an option they are considering will be responded to in the same way.  

 

Expressing a possible suicide intent on a forum not equipped to deal with it is not helpful for you and its detrimental to the community.   Saying you are experiencing suicidal ideation as a symptom of your withdrawal is very different to saying you are contemplating suicide as a solution to your withdrawal.   Moderators will always intervene and direct you to face to face support at this point.

 

I believe you have the capacity to heal because you showed that in those two weeks.  I also believe that you can and need to do that through non-drug means.   Healing is about finding 100 little things that soothe your system and support healing.

 

Dalsaan

[andy013]

LoveandLight, I am from Scotland as well, just outside Glasgow.

 

I felt the same way in the early periods of withdrawal. I often thought, who cares about my social problems because I feel terrible anyway. I also feel that way about PSSD. It doesn't bother me as much as others because I can't interact with people anyway so sex is out of the question.

 

Studying from home would maybe be an option. Part of the problem is I feel I would need to stop going to work entirely in order to feel stable enough to do other things. I don't think my parents would like that very much. I work weekends and often I spend the first 3 days of the week just recovering from the depression and other symptoms caused by the social situation. Also the fatigue can make it difficult to do anything so I don't really feel confident that I would be able to successfully study from home.

 

Part of me feels a bit down about the whole situation though. I sort of feel like isn't it worth trying an SSRI to get a chance at a normal social life rather than living my life as some weird hermit?

[Petunia]

My experience of trying reinstatement after being 3 years off SSRIs was horrendous. I didn't know anything about withdrawal at the time and thought I needed to be on something.

 

First I tried Prozac and started to experience extreme restlessness, anger and rage. I was having homicidal ideation, nothing like anything I'd ever experienced before. I stopped that and then about a month later I tried reinstating with Lexapro, which was the drug I had previously taken. Within 3 days I was having thoughts which were urging me to to end my life, they were basically explaining to me why I had to do it, this wasn't me wanting to end my life, this was like something from outside of myself was trying to take control of me. I'm so glad I realized it was the drug reinstatement causing this.

 

A few weeks later I tried reinstating ADHD meds, which also made me feel worse and brought back symptoms which had already disappeared. 

 

Trying reinstatement for me, after being off 3 years didn't work, made me worse, brought back symptoms which had gone, and they stayed back. I think it probably set my recovery back about a year, I wish I hadn't tried it.

 

Some people take a long time to recover, stress, unhealthy diet and lifestyle, jumping around trying various drugs and supplements and not taking care of yourself can all make things worse and possibly add to the length of the recovery process.

 

I've also never been particularly comfortable in social situations, before drugs, but since being in withdrawal its become almost impossible, even with my own family members. At my worst I was needing 2 days to recover from a short visit from my mum. But its getting better with time and patience. I spent yesterday afternoon at my parents house and felt fairly comfortable the whole time, I got a bit tired, but it was a huge improvement on how I was about a year ago.

 

My advice, which comes from my own experience is don't add toxic substances (drugs) or high doses of stimulating supplements to a nervous system destabilized by withdrawal. Minimize situations and activities which increase stress, accept that its going to take as long as it takes, focus on the positive, be grateful for the symptoms which have gone or improved, notice that recovery is happening and trust your own body in its healing process.

 

As a moderator here I would just like to reiterate what brassmonkey requested:

 

Andy013 and NoMeaning25-- It is impossible for us to offer any constructive advise if we can't see what your background is.  The moderation staff does not have the time to dig back trough all your scattered posts to try and determine what drugs you took and when and how you came off of them.  All of this information is very important to determining how you should proceed.  If you won't help us, we can't hep you.  Please fill out a signature block;

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

 

Not only is it hard for staff to offer relevant and accurate advice, no one is able to know and understand your history and situation and so any comments, suggestions or responses are based on only the partial information you provide in that one post. This not only puts you in the position of receiving advice which may in fact be harmful, if you follow it, but it can also present a misleading picture of your real situation to anyone who reads your post. This often causes unnecessary fear and discouragement.

 

Please maintain an up to date signature with a summary of your drug and tapering history, and use your intro/update topic, for updates, questions and discussion about your own personal situation.

 

...and what Dalsaan wrote here:

 

 

Expressing a possible suicide intent on a forum not equipped to deal with it is not helpful for you and its detrimental to the community.   Saying you are experiencing suicidal ideation as a symptom of your withdrawal is very different to saying you are contemplating suicide as a solution to your withdrawal.   Moderators will always intervene and direct you to face to face support at this point.

 

A lot of time and consideration has gone into developing the rules and guidelines for this site, so that it can be a safe and helpful resource for all members wishing to safely come off medications or find support for recovery from withdrawal.

 

Please help us to help you, and if you haven't already done so, read through this topic, especially the posts pinned at the top: Read This First

[Altostrata]

andy, I joined your new posts to your Intro topic. Your Intro topic is the place for those "what should I do?" questions because we invariably need the context that your Intro topic (plus your signature) might provide.

 

Some time back you took an overdose of vitamin D that made you ill. Then as the blood levels got lower, you felt better. Have you ever tried taking a reasonable dose of vitamin D? Low vitamin D is common in your part of the world.

 

The best way to take vitamin D is to get vitamin D3 in a liquid form and take it by drops. This gets right into your body, bypassing any digestive issues. (Coincidentally, I was just researching vitamin D for myself.) You might try starting with 400IU per day and, barring any adverse reactions, work up to taking 2,000IU per day. See if it helps. It's a very important vitamin.

 

As to what drug for you to take now, we can't tell you that. If you want to try one, your guess is as good as anyone's. You may have seen our warnings about taking drugs when you have a sensitized nervous system -- try a very, very small dose first to see how it affects you.

 

We cannot predict if this will work or not. The decision is up to you. Good luck.

 

If you are feeling suicidal, phone a suicide hotline in your area rather than posting on this site. Thank you.

[andy013]

What is the best method for taking a low dose?

 

I'm not sure if it will be possible for me to get a liquid drug. The last time I just had little tiny 10mg tablets. I guess I would need to crush them and weigh out the right dose.

[LoveandLight]

Yes loads of info in tapering section..weigh, or make into liquid

[Hopefull]

Hi Andy013,

I just read through your post and sorry to hear that you are still feeling bad after 4 years out.

I can completely relate to some of the wd symptoms.

I have experienced pins and needles in the head, burning at the back of my head, pressure in the temples.

Stiffness of the neck, pressing down feeling.

Anxiety triggers by situations and recently thoughts bring on a wd symptoms.

It almost feels like someone is pushing through a thin barrier of stability.

Like pushing through a thin membrane. That is the only way to describe it.

Doctors don't believe me that I am experiencing sensitivity to supplements as a result of ad's.

Low in vitamin d, iron .

Can't take anything. Can't use aroma roll ons etc.

Burning and tingling in the head. Arms etc.

So I can relate to everything that you have mentioned.

I must have experienced seratonin syndrome from Inositol powder, like you did from vitamin d.

Not long after I took inositol 2 servings on that day, I experienced flu like symptoms. Muscle stiffness, temperature, could hardly walk.

The next day I was fine.

It is hard to know what is what.

Wd symptoms or reaction to things.

Don't loose hope Andy!

You have come so far. Don't reinstate SSRI.

Hang in there anf you will heal.

It angers me to see how many young people get prescribed SSRI's.

You are still young.

Maybe seek help for social anxiety through

talk therapy.

Even though this is the condition induced by SSRI'S, in your case.

Since being on ad's I have de

experienced weird anxiety triggers.

Things that I did not have before .

Hang in there, you will get better.

Best wishes, Hopefull.

[JanCarol]

Hey Andy - I came to see how you were going - and the first thing I check, your signature.

 

I realize that even though I've made some notes based on what you said, I have no idea who you are, what you are taking, and how that fits with your situation.  I know it seems like the mods harp on this, but we're really quite useless without your signature!  Now I have to go back and re-read to see if I can make sense of what you are or are not taking, or whether you are tapering, and when, etc. And I am a slow reader!

 

It is my understanding that P-Progress was also strict about this.

 

So - I just have my notes to go by - I saved a class action lawsuit for Celexa, even though I cannot find reference to any specific drug (without in depth re-reading) - but it seems I wrote that down because I thought you have a clear pointer to one drug starting your problem.  Maybe I'm wrong, I'm shooting in the dark here:  http://www.nationalinjuryhelp.com/defective-drugs/celexa/

 

And I was also concerned about magnesium.  You will need to get your magnesium levels up before you can take vitamin D.  Likely, both are depleted.  When a nutrient or hormone (Vit D is really a hormone) is depleted, and you take it - your body goes wacky trying to take it in.  This is why severely depleted people have strong reactions to them.

 

That's why it is important to get the cascade properly.  Magnesium first, then Vitamin D.  And you need to start low and gradually increase to prevent strong reactions.

 

Here's my notes:

 

Reading your thread makes me wonder - when you take vitamin D and fish oil - are you also taking magnesium?  Magnesium and D are co-factors (as is calcium, but don't take magnesium and calcium at the same time, they cancel each other out), and sometimes you need to build up you magnesium in order to effectively use Vitamin D.

 

Additionally, some people react to Magnesium, so it is vitally important to start very low, and build up.   If you are deficient in magnesium (likely) you are more likely to get a reaction to it until you gradually fill the deficit.

 

See  Magnesium

 

I hope you are feeling better.  Please keep us posted on your progress, and please, help us with your signature line?

[nz11]

Hi Andy, like JC i too was wondering how you were doing.

What did u decide to do back in sept.

[andy013]

Hey, sorry I didn't update this thread for a while. I never noticed the newer replies. I did not take any drugs yet. I decided to wait a while and continue experimenting with vitamin D to see if I could somehow use it to feel a bit better. After trying many things (including using a vitamin D lamp) it seems like the benefits that I did get from vitamin D are not going to be easy to maintain.

 

I am pretty close now to finally making the decision to reinstate. I don't really see any other options. I am almost 5 years off a drug that I took for 5 months and I still have long term symptoms that have not improved for many years. It does not make sense for me to continue to live like this. I think I got really unlucky because it seems that most other people can function normally by this point, even if they still have some problems. I don't have any hope that the symptoms I continue to experience will improve significantly in the future. This is my only chance at being able to live a normal life so I need to go for it.

[divalee]

Andy I am sorry for your suffering - I am 34 months off Zoloft and still suffering tremendously from side effects - one that bothers me a lot is distorted vision...pins and needles in my head and face, pressure in my head and across the bridge of my nose. Always feel my ears blocked which they are not. I started taking Vitamin D 3 weeks ago due to vitamin D deficiency ll.5 ...Canadian testing....so it is very low - I always thought Vitamin D made me sick but I am wondering if it was just my imagination..cause I have so many symptoms and get worried that I may develop more symptoms by taking Vitamin D.

 

Did you ever have blurred or distorted vision.....

 

You are in my thoughts and prayers as everyone here is - no one should be allowed to suffer this much.....no one.

 

Love

Lee (f)

xxxxx

[andy013]

I wanted to post an update here and some info on my experience with Vitamin D as it might be helpful to others.

 

For my entire time in withdrawal I have had problems socializing with others as well as other long lasting symptoms like sexual problems. The only thing that has had any effect on these symptoms is vitamin D, however my situation is a bit complicated. At first the benefits I got were very powerful but it was hard for me to reproduce them even after taking vitamin D again. I also noticed that sometimes I would get significant increases in anxiety after taking vitamin D. After a lot of experimentation I have figured out that I need to take sulfur containing vegetables (mainly, broccoli and spring onion) in large quantities in order to maintain the positive effects of the vitamin D. I don't know if it's the sulfur exactly, that is just my guess after trying and excluding many other supplements and foods.

 

The reason why my situation is complicated is because I also experience symptoms of hypercalcemia (bone pain, increased thirst) when taking vitamin D. I believe I have hyperparathyroidism or some other condition that is causing this, but I haven't had it diagnosed. This might also be the reason why I get the improvements to my symptoms, I don't know.

 

I think the mechanism behind the benefits I get is vitamin D raising serotonin. There have been a couple of studies that have shown that vitamin D increases expression of tryptophan hydroxylase in the brain. This is the rate limiting step in the synthesis of serotonin. So, more vitamin D = more serotonin. However, as I said it is also possible that the only reason I am getting these effects is because I have some other condition that is raising my active vitamin D levels above normal. In an otherwise healthy person they might get no effect from vitamin D because it is stored as an inactive form.

 

I really don't know if these effects I get would ever work for anyone else. I also don't know if I managed to get the other condition treated if I would even still get the effects myself. Perhaps it was just a fluke that I happened to have these 2 interacting health problems at the same time.

 

I did find a case report in a medical journal that mentioned a women who experienced mania along with hypercalcemia. It is possible that the effects I am experiencing are via the same mechanism as her. I have noticed that if I take too much vitamin D then I start to feel like my mind is racing very fast, I become hyper sexual and can't stop thinking about sex (this is a massive difference from the low sex drive and sexual dysfunction I normally experience when off of vitamin D) and I can also feel like I am burning up quite a lot. Again it might just be a coincidence that this hypomania I experience happens to compensate for the lasting damage caused by the SSRI.

 

The social benefits I get are also significant. It's such a strange feeling. For my entire time in withdrawal I have been socially withdrawn and unable to do much about it. When I get the effects from vitamin D it's like someone has turned on a switch and I start to smile and joke around with people and start conversations. Unfortunately it doesn't cure me 100% in this regard but it is still a substantial difference.

 

As substantial as the effects are, they don't cure me and I still have significant problems. I also think that it is not really a viable long term solution for me because of the bone pain and increased thirst. I would no doubt have to get that treated and I don't even know if the benefits would remain afterwards.

I think an interesting experiment would be for people who have long term withdrawal problems to take calcitriol. That is the active form of vitamin D and it is possible that it could raise serotonin and help to alleviate some of the withdrawal symptoms like PSSD. However this would also result in some level of hypercalcemia so you would probably want to only use it occasionally. Even it it worked it might induce hypomania like I experience on some level so I don't know how viable it would be.

 

Earlier in this thread I spoke about reinstating and for the past year I have been experimenting with vitamin D and trying to get and maintain some of the benefits to see if they would ever be a long term solution for me. Since I have came to the conclusion that they are not a long term solution and they wouldn't allow me to return to work or have a normal social life I see no other options left for me but to try and reinstate citalopram at a low dose to see if it would help me become functional. For the last 5 and half years I been completely disabled by these withdrawal symptoms and I have no hope that there will be any improvements beyond this point. I consider myself to be permanently damaged by these drugs. It is very obvious that my brain has problems regulating serotonin because of all the symptoms I experience and it is impossible for me to live a normal life.

 

I am extremely scared of these drugs. In general I am doing better than i did in the first several years off of them. I know how dangerous they are and how bad it can be. However it is the only thing I think has a real chance of helping me to restore normal function. It is a huge risk but I need to try everything I can to restore my health. I don't see much point in continuing to live my life as I do now without any hope of improvement.

 

I will probably post again before starting the drugs. I will wait till after Christmas and into next year before starting.

[NoMeaning25]

Sure i've asked you this before, but what symptoms do you still experience at this far off?

Thinking of reinstating also at 4.5 years off...

[Flowers]

Hi Andy

 

Just been reading your thread about Vit D - very interesting.

 

I know you won't have reached your decision to reinstate easily. I noticed that from your signature you did try reinstating before a long time ago. It seems like you might have suffered a bad reaction to this then?

[andy013]

Hi NoMeaning25, the worst symptoms I have are to do with socializing. Ever since early withdrawal I noticed in social situations I acted very withdrawn and felt foggy headed and distant. I also noticed that I get significantly worse symptoms after being in a social situation for several hours. For example if I go to my work for 5 hours when I come home I will feel some of these effects mildly and they will increase over the next 5-6 hours. The symptoms are, my mood decreases substantially (feeling apathetic and depressed), I become even more withdrawn and foggy headed (I act very passive and withdrawn, I have even had people say to me that it is weird how quite I am, like they thought I had autism), I have problems focusing/concentrating, my sex drive decreases, my body temperature decreases, my appetite decreases and I just feel really sh*tty. It takes at least a day or two of staying away from most social environments in order for these symptoms to improve. If I keep going into social situations for consecutive days then these symptoms become significantly worse each day. It basically means I cannot do any normal activity that evolves socializing or being around others for very long (no career or full time job / education, no relationships, no friends etc.). Even after working for 2 days, 5 hours each, I feel like complete ****, just totally drained and I would dread going into another social situation because I know how much worse it makes me feel; not to mention that I act extremely distant and withdrawn when I am socializing anyway (not saying much, not smiling or making eye contact, just giving one world answers to people, acting like a robot).

 

I have read that socializing increases serotonin turn over (how much your brain uses). Perhaps I am running out of serotonin and it has this knock on effect, or perhaps too much is accumulating where it shouldn't. I have no idea, but the symptoms have been the same now for many years. I have just gotten used to feeling like **** every time I come home from social engagements.

 

I also have other problems, sexual function is reduced. I can sometimes feel fatigued or have problems focusing on things and concentrating for a length of time (I have to stop reading sometimes because I just can't focus for long enough to understand). I still get regular mouth ulcers (clusters of 3-4 at a time) which I only started to get when I took the citalopram for the first time.

 

I can also feel anxiety and anger on rarer occasions. The anger similar to that which i had in the early period of withdrawal only I don't feel the physical sensation in my brain anymore.

 

Also, I noticed that when I took vitamin D and got some of the benefits, one of them that I hadn't even realized before was energy levels. I felt like I had so much energy and at my work I got things done way faster than normal. My boss even noticed and commented on it.

 

It frustrates me how some of these symptoms seem vague or difficult for me to describe because it makes it easier for people outside of places like this to discount them and claim they are psychosomatic. I know they are real and the fact that the vitamin D causes such a huge effect in some of these areas just solidifies that.

 

Unfortunately the vitamin D doesn't cure me though and I still have the symptoms that come on after being in social situations. As I said in my previous post it doesn't look like I will be able to live a functional life even with these positive effects of vitamin D.

 

 

Flowers, you are right that I did try to reinstate after being off for 2 months, however I reinstated at the full dose right away and after 3 weeks I began to get suicidal thoughts (which I also had when I tried to increase to 20mg for a few days when i first started the drug). The suicidal thoughts were so scary that I thought it was safer to ride out the withdrawal. It is possible that if I tried a lower dose I may have been able to successfully reinstate without getting the suicidal thoughts, but I don't know.

 

I am extremely scared of these drugs for obvious reasons, but I cannot think of anything else to do. In the first few years it made sense for me to wait it out and see if things improved even though I was doing very badly. I read the success stories of people recovering and it gave me hope. I also noticed improvements in some of the physical symptoms and that made me think that perhaps eventually all the symptoms would resolve. However, at this point it has been 3 years without any significant improvement. I have lived completely disabled because of these symptoms for half of my adult life now. I do not believe that these symptoms will improve any further from this point on. So I have 2 choices, 1: just keep living this way for the rest of my life, 2: try and do something very risky that might allow me to live normally again.

 

If I could just have one day of being able to socialize with people normally again I think I would cry.

[Martina23]

Hi Andy, I was reading your last posts, and I am sorry that your situation is still so complicated. I have also problems especially when there are a lot of people but I am 17 months off and I thought it will go away. It is hard to give you some advice as only you know how you feel - if your life is livable like this or not. If not and you dont expect any change whatsoever, then reinstate but be prepared that it can also end paradoxical that you will get again suicidal. If the situation is only a bit manageable I would not reinstate. I am a firm believer that the body can and will correct itself.

[Altostrata]

Andy, don't worry about running out of serotonin, your body has lots of serotonin in it and is always making more.

 

Socializing is good for your nervous system, if you're around congenial people. You might seek counseling or therapy to learn new ways to socialize. Or, you can join interest groups (in the US, we have Meetup groups that can be found online) to do things like play sports, play games, go for walks, etc.

[andy013]

I don't really worry about the mechanism behind the symptoms Alostrata, it's just my way of thinking about it. I will probably never know what is causing the problems.

 

By the way, what dose would you recommend I reinstate at? I was thinking of trying 0.5mg at first, but I'm not sure if that's too high.

 

I wonder if anyone else has reinstated after being off for this long.

[nz11]

Hi Andy, You say:

I am extremely scared of these drugs. In general I am doing better than i did in the first several years off of them. I know how dangerous they are and how bad it can be. However it is the only thing I think has a real chance of helping me to restore normal function. It is a huge risk but I need to try everything I can to restore my health. I don't see much point in continuing to live my life as I do now without any hope of improvement.

 

Whoa just back up a minute but you have said, In general I am doing better than i did in the first several years off of them.

That sounds like an improvement of sorts to me.

 

imo i would not reinstate.

if you have had some improvement in the past 5 yrs (your words not mine) then why not some more in the next 5.

Im now in yr 7 and i still feel like im improving and still feel like im waking out of a rip van winkle -like state.

Why not give it some more time.

 

At the end of the day its your choice.

Regards

nz11

[nz11]

One more thought

Are you

taking your omega 3s

eating nourishing foods and berries -strawberries, cranberries, blueberries (im off to pick my own at the orchard next week), blackberries, berry smoothies.

have you considered going gluten free for a month- i myself dont know about this but its just a thought maybe.

and last but not least what about exercise. Im not talking about a stroll around the block im talking a sweat producing effort which is why i like racquet sports and one in particular. Of course one has to work up to it. So keep up the exercise at whatever level you can is the idea imo.

 

What do you reckon ?

[nz11]

So what's you're thinking Andy?

[nz11]

Andy what did you decide to do?

[andy013]

I think I am going to try and reinstate. It is a very hard decision but it seems to me that it is the only chance I have to be able to live a normal life. At close to 6 years off of an SSRI that I took for 5 months, it seems like the remaining symptoms are permanent. It's going to be really hard for me to go back to doctors and tell them that those drugs worked so that I can get a prescription for them again. I keep putting it off and making excuses but I need to do it eventually. I know that there are many people with permanent symptoms from these drugs. I also know that some people reinstate and it helps them, so there is at least a chance of something changing for me. Otherwise I need to live with these symptoms for the rest of my life and that makes no sense without at least trying to reinstate.

[nz11]

I'm sorry it has come to this point.

You dont know for sure these symptoms are forever.

I remind you of your ri back in june 2011 and what came of that. Do you want to risk that. Is your situation now worse than it was in june 2011 plus 3 weeks.

 

Its your decision of course.

Keep us posted.

nz11

[doggiemama]

Hi I'm 3 years c/t and there are many days that I think of going back to ADs but I think of the hell I might need to stop them again I could never go back to how I felt 2 years ago . I still have very bad days that last week's but I still can't put that pill in my mouth

[Chorlton]

Hi Andy,

Try and keep going. Why not set yourself some personal goals or plans. I guess it's easy just to look forward to recovery and nothing else. You will get better but set some other side argets away from recovery.

[Meeto]

On 4/25/2017 at 9:04 PM, andy013 said:

I think I am going to try and reinstate. It is a very hard decision but it seems to me that it is the only chance I have to be able to live a normal life. At close to 6 years off of an SSRI that I took for 5 months, it seems like the remaining symptoms are permanent. It's going to be really hard for me to go back to doctors and tell them that those drugs worked so that I can get a prescription for them again. I keep putting it off and making excuses but I need to do it eventually. I know that there are many people with permanent symptoms from these drugs. I also know that some people reinstate and it helps them, so there is at least a chance of something changing for me. Otherwise I need to live with these symptoms for the rest of my life and that makes no sense without at least trying to reinstate.

Have you reinstated?

[andy013]

No. I have developed some other health problems and I was hoping to get them diagnosed first before taking any other drugs. Unfortunately I have been on a waiting list to see a doctor for about 7 months so it is taking longer than I would like. If / when I reinstate I will update this topic.

[jonnypeters1234567]

I suffered from this 

On 12/25/2016 at 7:01 AM, andy013 said:

Hi NoMeaning25, the worst symptoms I have are to do with socializing. Ever since early withdrawal I noticed in social situations I acted very withdrawn and felt foggy headed and distant. I also noticed that I get significantly worse symptoms after being in a social situation for several hours. For example if I go to my work for 5 hours when I come home I will feel some of these effects mildly and they will increase over the next 5-6 hours. The symptoms are, my mood decreases substantially (feeling apathetic and depressed), I become even more withdrawn and foggy headed (I act very passive and withdrawn, I have even had people say to me that it is weird how quite I am, like they thought I had autism), I have problems focusing/concentrating, my sex drive decreases, my body temperature decreases, my appetite decreases and I just feel really sh*tty. It takes at least a day or two of staying away from most social environments in order for these symptoms to improve. If I keep going into social situations for consecutive days then these symptoms become significantly worse each day. It basically means I cannot do any normal activity that evolves socializing or being around others for very long (no career or full time job / education, no relationships, no friends etc.). Even after working for 2 days, 5 hours each, I feel like complete ****, just totally drained and I would dread going into another social situation because I know how much worse it makes me feel; not to mention that I act extremely distant and withdrawn when I am socializing anyway (not saying much, not smiling or making eye contact, just giving one world answers to people, acting like a robot).

 

I have read that socializing increases serotonin turn over (how much your brain uses). Perhaps I am running out of serotonin and it has this knock on effect, or perhaps too much is accumulating where it shouldn't. I have no idea, but the symptoms have been the same now for many years. I have just gotten used to feeling like **** every time I come home from social engagements.

 

I also have other problems, sexual function is reduced. I can sometimes feel fatigued or have problems focusing on things and concentrating for a length of time (I have to stop reading sometimes because I just can't focus for long enough to understand). I still get regular mouth ulcers (clusters of 3-4 at a time) which I only started to get when I took the citalopram for the first time.

 

I can also feel anxiety and anger on rarer occasions. The anger similar to that which i had in the early period of withdrawal only I don't feel the physical sensation in my brain anymore.

 

Also, I noticed that when I took vitamin D and got some of the benefits, one of them that I hadn't even realized before was energy levels. I felt like I had so much energy and at my work I got things done way faster than normal. My boss even noticed and commented on it.

 

It frustrates me how some of these symptoms seem vague or difficult for me to describe because it makes it easier for people outside of places like this to discount them and claim they are psychosomatic. I know they are real and the fact that the vitamin D causes such a huge effect in some of these areas just solidifies that.

 

Unfortunately the vitamin D doesn't cure me though and I still have the symptoms that come on after being in social situations. As I said in my previous post it doesn't look like I will be able to live a functional life even with these positive effects of vitamin D.

 

 

Flowers, you are right that I did try to reinstate after being off for 2 months, however I reinstated at the full dose right away and after 3 weeks I began to get suicidal thoughts (which I also had when I tried to increase to 20mg for a few days when i first started the drug). The suicidal thoughts were so scary that I thought it was safer to ride out the withdrawal. It is possible that if I tried a lower dose I may have been able to successfully reinstate without getting the suicidal thoughts, but I don't know.

 

I am extremely scared of these drugs for obvious reasons, but I cannot think of anything else to do. In the first few years it made sense for me to wait it out and see if things improved even though I was doing very badly. I read the success stories of people recovering and it gave me hope. I also noticed improvements in some of the physical symptoms and that made me think that perhaps eventually all the symptoms would resolve. However, at this point it has been 3 years without any significant improvement. I have lived completely disabled because of these symptoms for half of my adult life now. I do not believe that these symptoms will improve any further from this point on. So I have 2 choices, 1: just keep living this way for the rest of my life, 2: try and do something very risky that might allow me to live normally again.

 

If I could just have one day of being able to socialize with people normally again I think I would cry.

 

I suffered from this the first time I came off and fear I am going to be left with it this time. It all began when I was drinking too much alcohol at university- which led to me starting citalpram. I found that B vitamins helped- have you tried them?

[jonnypeters1234567]

I believe this is a deficiency of some sort, have you had blood work done?

 

I also felt almost better when i took chromium supplements, when i had a period of hypoglycemia, it balances blood sugar and stops the nervous system over reacting. try it

[andy013]

Hey guys, I think I am going to try and reinstate soon. I had some health problems since the last update so I put off reinstating as I didn't want the added complication of not knowing which symptoms were from the SSRI and which weren't. I really don't feel like I have improved at all in the past 5 years to be honest. No one can accuse me of not waiting long enough since it is now 9 years since I stopped.

 

I didn't taper the citalopram at all the first time around so I don't really know what dosage I should start on. I have a graduated cylinder and I'm going to get some syringes. I was thinking of dissolving the 10mg pill in 100ml of water and then taking 1ml to start with (0.1mg) and then increasing by 0.1mg each month. Does this sound too slow? I want to start on a very low dose in case I get a bad reaction. Would love to hear from someone with more experience tapering.

[ChessieCat]

I glad that you know to start with a very low dose and also that you plan to wait for a good amount of time before increasing.

 

I will also the other mods for their assistance.

[AlaskanGlacier]

Just my two cents, but given that nearly 90% of the serotonin in the body is made in the gut, I would do everything I can at this point to heal that and continue to support it over time. Whole foods, organic, mainly plant based diet... lots of bulking fiber,.. psyllium husk, chia seeds, flax seeds, slippery elm powder and lots and lots and LOTS of probiotic rich fermented foods such as saurkraut, kimchi, beet kvass, etc. Research the gut/brain connection. Research colon cleansing. Research how important the microbiome is to our gut, our serotonin levels, and our health. Also look into foods that help heal and support the liver. Raw apple cider vinegar, beets, dandilion, etc. At this point, I can't see reinstating something that did that much damage to your health as a good thing.

[AlaskanGlacier]

Also, check out my friend Heather's youtube channel. She's got some good videos on naturally healing/supporting your body to heal.

https://www.youtube.com/user/SteelSongbird

[DataGuy]

@andy013,

 

Your profile states that the last time you took citalopram,  you became suicidal, having SI within 3 weeks. Is this true? If it is, I would definitely not recommend taking citalopram again. In addition, reinstating is extremely unlikely to work after 5 years off the medication. 

 

Is there any reason you may not have recovered? Any supplement or drug use? Any extenuating circumstances? Environmental toxins? 

 

Sorry it has been so long, Andy. 

 

On 7/13/2020 at 5:02 PM, andy013 said:

Hey guys, I think I am going to try and reinstate soon. I had some health problems since the last update so I put off reinstating as I didn't want the added complication of not knowing which symptoms were from the SSRI and which weren't. I really don't feel like I have improved at all in the past 5 years to be honest. No one can accuse me of not waiting long enough since it is now 9 years since I stopped.

 

I didn't taper the citalopram at all the first time around so I don't really know what dosage I should start on. I have a graduated cylinder and I'm going to get some syringes. I was thinking of dissolving the 10mg pill in 100ml of water and then taking 1ml to start with (0.1mg) and then increasing by 0.1mg each month. Does this sound too slow? I want to start on a very low dose in case I get a bad reaction. Would love to hear from someone with more experience tapering.