lucidity Posted April 14, 2021 Share Posted April 14, 2021 Since this all began for me a couple of years ago, I've been noticing a very strange problem. Even though I'm quite sleep deprived, if I'm able to get any more than 3 hours of sleep (through drugs, supplements, or "luck") then I'm rewarded with a corresponding amount of tension/anxiety/panic feeling. Once I made the mistake of taking a sleeping pill to force sleep after getting 3 hours of sleep, and the result was an extra 1.5 hours of sleep followed by almost all-day-long panic attack. This problem has progressed now to where anytime I start to doze off at night, that panic/anxiety feeling starts to build and keeps me from sleeping. This doesn't seem to be a psychological cause, as I can be completely relaxed and sleepy when I start to doze off. I can't find anything on the internet about this problem, and doctors are clueless about it. I don't know where to turn or what the cause might be. Has anyone else experienced anything like this? I'm in agony 95% of the time now and seem to be getting worse. It really seems like there's only one way out of this hell 1997-2019 Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Amitryptiline, Mirtazapine, Lexapro (mostly, 10-20mg) Jan 16-Feb 2019 Fast tapered Lexapro after spontaneous kundalini syndrome Feb-Jul Used various herbs to deal with severe anxiety (bacopa, gotu kola) Sept 2019 Developed histamine intolerance and daily panic Currently taking high DHA fish oil, magnesium. Occasionally l-ornithine, l-lysine, l-glycine, melatonin for sleep. Dayvigo for sleep, and l-thp or seroquel (haven't settled on dose) for sleep when in sleep deprivation crisis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 @lucidity, I'm really sorry to hear that and it sounds incredibly awful and miserable. How are you doing today? 2017 Oct sertraline | Nov switched to escitalopram 10mg | 2018 Apr escitalopram fast taper (4-8 weeks) to zero/off 2018 Nov restarted escitalopram, increased to 20mg | 2020 Jan escitalopram fast taper (2-3 months) to zero/off 2020 Aug 27 restarted escitalopram 10mg tablet, came across SA.org 2021 Feb 27 complete switch to liquid 9.8mg | Mar 7 decreased to 9.5mg | Mar 14 decreased to 9.3mg | Mar 21 decreased to 9.0mg | Apr 11 decreased to 8.8mg | Apr 18 decreased to 8.6mg | May 9 decreased to 8.3mg | May 16 decreased to 8.1mg | Jun 6 increased to 9.0mg | July 18 decreased to 8.6mg | Aug 15 decreased to 8.2mg | Sept 19 decreased to 8.0mg | Oct 21 decreased to 7.6mg | Nov 18 decreased to 7.2mg | Dec 16 decreased to 6.9mg 2022 Feb 27 decreased to 6.8mg | Mar 31 decreased to 6.4mg | Jul 5 decreased to 6.1mg | Jul 23 decreased to 5.8mg | Aug 10 increased to 6.0mg | Nov 24 decreased to 5.4mg | Dec 31 decreased to 4.8mg 2023 Feb 1 decreased to 4.4mg | May 17 decreased to 4mg | Jul 6 decreased to 3.8mg | Jul 19 decreased to 3.6 | Aug 11 decreased to 3.2mg | Sept 9 decreased to 3.0mg | Sept 22 decreased to 2.7mg | Oct 24 increased to 2.775mg | Nov 12 decreased to 2.7mg | Dec 20 increased to 3.0mg I hold for longer periods of time when life gets stressful, usually work related. Supplements: currently none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 21, 2021 Administrator Share Posted April 21, 2021 @lucidity, that sounds grueling indeed. Hang in there. You may be having a paradoxical reaction to your own relaxation. Your own nervous system is activating you because it's over-reacting, afraid you're going unconscious. You might try distracting it with soft music or keeping the TV on low -- it's reassured if you can hear something. See Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep Have you looked at Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration White noise devices for sleep Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime Strange sensations while falling asleep -- surges, zaps, jerks This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marija Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 Hi @lucidity, I'm sorry to hear you've been struggling with sleep so much. I couldn't help myself but leave a comment on your topic because I am struggling with the exact same thing. For a while now since I started my taper I've been feeling like my body and mind are too scared to sleep. As soon as I start falling asleep, I am jolted out of it by an extreme adrenaline/anxiety rush and it does feel very much physical. I've had episodes with absolutely no sleep for 4-5 nights until I can't take it anymore and take a tablet of lorazepam. Are you anxious throughout the day at all? I find that if I'm stressed, this can often trigger these adrenaline/anxiety jolts when I'm falling asleep, and then I just can't snap out it. No matter how much I try to relax throughout the day, my body will still do it. I'm currently trying to find an answer that doesn't require me to rely on lorazepam as I don't want to create another problem for myself... Take care of yourself Marija Not sure of all dates and times 2008 as a teenager I took Haloperidol, diazepam and citalopram. Weird cocktail of drugs from a WEIRD psychiatrist for no reason. Stopped after 3 days. No WD symptoms. 2015 quetiapine for about a month and then stopped and citalopram for about a week and then stopped. No WD symptoms at all. 2018 15mg mirtazapine. The full dose taken only once or twice. Then 7.5mg as and when required (not every night) for about 3 months. Reduced further to approx 3.25mg and carried on taking them every now and then (anywhere between once a week and every night for a couple of weeks). Never consistently though. 7th Dec 2021 tried to stop taking it completely - cold turkey. Severe insomnia (several 0 hour nights), panic. Had no idea it was WD. Was determined to stop still. Was prescribed lorazepam 1mg before bed. Took it 6 times over 3 weeks for sleep and anxiety, it helped. Discontinued. 20th Dec, 2021 one 25mg tablet of trazadone as advised by GP to manage insomnia - didn't agree with it, stopped. Severe insomnia and anxiety again. 5th Jan, 2021 started 3.25mg mirtazapine again out of desperation due to insomnia. Took it approx every 3-4 days. With a two week period where I took it every day. 09/02/2021 last dose of mirtazapine approx 3.25mg on before stopping cold turkey again. Not coping. Total insomnia, anxiety, panic. 19/02/2021 discovered SA and reinstated 0.5mg and took 2mg lorazepam that same day as in crisis at that point. 06/03/21 took 2mg lorazepam as in crisis again due to insomnia and updosed to 0.75mg mirtazapine 09/05/21 took 2mg lorazepam as in crisis again due to sudden onset of insomnia AGAIN and updosed to 2.5mg. Other WD symptoms under control on 2.5mg, doing well but then BAM sudden onset of insomnia again after about 2 weeks on 2.5mg 27/05/2021 down to 2mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidity Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 17 hours ago, purple said: @lucidity, I'm really sorry to hear that and it sounds incredibly awful and miserable. How are you doing today? Thanks for asking. I'm about as bad as I've ever been, unfortunately. I'm spending much of the time by the toilet dry heaving Can only think of suicide options due to unbearable nausea, pain, depression, anxiety, panic and no end to this in sight. I still haven't been able to do it because I can't deal with the pain I'd cause my wife and family. They want to check me into a psych facility, but I fear I'd only experience worse hell there 1997-2019 Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Amitryptiline, Mirtazapine, Lexapro (mostly, 10-20mg) Jan 16-Feb 2019 Fast tapered Lexapro after spontaneous kundalini syndrome Feb-Jul Used various herbs to deal with severe anxiety (bacopa, gotu kola) Sept 2019 Developed histamine intolerance and daily panic Currently taking high DHA fish oil, magnesium. Occasionally l-ornithine, l-lysine, l-glycine, melatonin for sleep. Dayvigo for sleep, and l-thp or seroquel (haven't settled on dose) for sleep when in sleep deprivation crisis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidity Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 16 hours ago, Altostrata said: @lucidity, that sounds grueling indeed. Hang in there. You may be having a paradoxical reaction to your own relaxation. Your own nervous system is activating you because it's over-reacting, afraid you're going unconscious. You might try distracting it with soft music or keeping the TV on low -- it's reassured if you can hear something. See Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep Have you looked at Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration White noise devices for sleep Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime Strange sensations while falling asleep -- surges, zaps, jerks Yes except "path to better sleep." I'll check it out when I'm able, thanks 1997-2019 Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Amitryptiline, Mirtazapine, Lexapro (mostly, 10-20mg) Jan 16-Feb 2019 Fast tapered Lexapro after spontaneous kundalini syndrome Feb-Jul Used various herbs to deal with severe anxiety (bacopa, gotu kola) Sept 2019 Developed histamine intolerance and daily panic Currently taking high DHA fish oil, magnesium. Occasionally l-ornithine, l-lysine, l-glycine, melatonin for sleep. Dayvigo for sleep, and l-thp or seroquel (haven't settled on dose) for sleep when in sleep deprivation crisis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidity Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 3 hours ago, Marija said: Hi @lucidity, I'm sorry to hear you've been struggling with sleep so much. I couldn't help myself but leave a comment on your topic because I am struggling with the exact same thing. For a while now since I started my taper I've been feeling like my body and mind are too scared to sleep. As soon as I start falling asleep, I am jolted out of it by an extreme adrenaline/anxiety rush and it does feel very much physical. I've had episodes with absolutely no sleep for 4-5 nights until I can't take it anymore and take a tablet of lorazepam. Are you anxious throughout the day at all? I find that if I'm stressed, this can often trigger these adrenaline/anxiety jolts when I'm falling asleep, and then I just can't snap out it. No matter how much I try to relax throughout the day, my body will still do it. I'm currently trying to find an answer that doesn't require me to rely on lorazepam as I don't want to create another problem for myself... Take care of yourself Marija Thanks for writing. Yeah, sounds like the same thing. I used to have windows, now I no longer have any good days. Olanzapine used to work as my emergency drug for sleep, but now it's not working well either -- I fear I may have a dependency on it now. I'm benzo-injured, so am unable to use those in any capacity. I've have limited success with quetiapine, but now it doesn't let me sleep either because of the panic 1997-2019 Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Amitryptiline, Mirtazapine, Lexapro (mostly, 10-20mg) Jan 16-Feb 2019 Fast tapered Lexapro after spontaneous kundalini syndrome Feb-Jul Used various herbs to deal with severe anxiety (bacopa, gotu kola) Sept 2019 Developed histamine intolerance and daily panic Currently taking high DHA fish oil, magnesium. Occasionally l-ornithine, l-lysine, l-glycine, melatonin for sleep. Dayvigo for sleep, and l-thp or seroquel (haven't settled on dose) for sleep when in sleep deprivation crisis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus getofflex Posted April 21, 2021 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 21, 2021 51 minutes ago, lucidity said: no end to this in sight. It certainly seems that way now. But there is an end in sight. Try reading the success stories on this site. People who went through awful withdrawals do recover and live happy fulfilling lives. 1 Please do not private message me. Only tag me for urgent questions about tapering and reinstating - thank you. ***Please note this is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one. Lexapro Started Apr 15 2010 - 10 mg; started taper August 2017, recent taper info: Apr 2 '20 0.18 mg; Jul 16 0.17 mg, Aug 23 0.16 mg, Oct 7 0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03, Feb 19 0.02, Apr 18 0.01, May 15 0.005, Jul 8, 0.00. Psych Drug Free as of July 8, 2022!! Woohoo!!! other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg magnesium in small amounts at 4 AM, before bed suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, multivitamin, zinc suppl 8 PM: magnesium 350 mg, extended release vitamin C, melatonin 2 mg Paxil 2002 - 2010, switched to Lexapro 2010 Trazodone 50 mg. 2002 - 2019, fast tapered in 2019 Xanax 0.5 mg as needed 2002 - 2019, up to 3x weekly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 9 hours ago, lucidity said: Thanks for asking. I'm about as bad as I've ever been, unfortunately. I'm spending much of the time by the toilet dry heaving Can only think of suicide options due to unbearable nausea, pain, depression, anxiety, panic and no end to this in sight. I still haven't been able to do it because I can't deal with the pain I'd cause my wife and family. They want to check me into a psych facility, but I fear I'd only experience worse hell there Yeah, the brain tries to find a solution to the problem which in this case is believing that ending the physical body will end the suffering you are currently go through. I've had that too, many times. I understand them wanting to check you into a psych facility. I've wanted to check myself into ones before but I assumed and have seen that what usually happens is they try to sedate you if you're agitated/irritable (more likely it's that you're perceived to be so because they already have a bias/mental filter that they see you through) and/or restart you on your past medications or try a new combination. Again, I'm really sorry and I really really hope you can pull through this awful period. Please feel free to direct message me if you'd like to. It's no bother. I am concerned and would like to offer my time to you. 1 2017 Oct sertraline | Nov switched to escitalopram 10mg | 2018 Apr escitalopram fast taper (4-8 weeks) to zero/off 2018 Nov restarted escitalopram, increased to 20mg | 2020 Jan escitalopram fast taper (2-3 months) to zero/off 2020 Aug 27 restarted escitalopram 10mg tablet, came across SA.org 2021 Feb 27 complete switch to liquid 9.8mg | Mar 7 decreased to 9.5mg | Mar 14 decreased to 9.3mg | Mar 21 decreased to 9.0mg | Apr 11 decreased to 8.8mg | Apr 18 decreased to 8.6mg | May 9 decreased to 8.3mg | May 16 decreased to 8.1mg | Jun 6 increased to 9.0mg | July 18 decreased to 8.6mg | Aug 15 decreased to 8.2mg | Sept 19 decreased to 8.0mg | Oct 21 decreased to 7.6mg | Nov 18 decreased to 7.2mg | Dec 16 decreased to 6.9mg 2022 Feb 27 decreased to 6.8mg | Mar 31 decreased to 6.4mg | Jul 5 decreased to 6.1mg | Jul 23 decreased to 5.8mg | Aug 10 increased to 6.0mg | Nov 24 decreased to 5.4mg | Dec 31 decreased to 4.8mg 2023 Feb 1 decreased to 4.4mg | May 17 decreased to 4mg | Jul 6 decreased to 3.8mg | Jul 19 decreased to 3.6 | Aug 11 decreased to 3.2mg | Sept 9 decreased to 3.0mg | Sept 22 decreased to 2.7mg | Oct 24 increased to 2.775mg | Nov 12 decreased to 2.7mg | Dec 20 increased to 3.0mg I hold for longer periods of time when life gets stressful, usually work related. Supplements: currently none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple Posted May 11, 2021 Share Posted May 11, 2021 Hi @lucidity, just wanted to check in and see how you are. *virtual hug* 2017 Oct sertraline | Nov switched to escitalopram 10mg | 2018 Apr escitalopram fast taper (4-8 weeks) to zero/off 2018 Nov restarted escitalopram, increased to 20mg | 2020 Jan escitalopram fast taper (2-3 months) to zero/off 2020 Aug 27 restarted escitalopram 10mg tablet, came across SA.org 2021 Feb 27 complete switch to liquid 9.8mg | Mar 7 decreased to 9.5mg | Mar 14 decreased to 9.3mg | Mar 21 decreased to 9.0mg | Apr 11 decreased to 8.8mg | Apr 18 decreased to 8.6mg | May 9 decreased to 8.3mg | May 16 decreased to 8.1mg | Jun 6 increased to 9.0mg | July 18 decreased to 8.6mg | Aug 15 decreased to 8.2mg | Sept 19 decreased to 8.0mg | Oct 21 decreased to 7.6mg | Nov 18 decreased to 7.2mg | Dec 16 decreased to 6.9mg 2022 Feb 27 decreased to 6.8mg | Mar 31 decreased to 6.4mg | Jul 5 decreased to 6.1mg | Jul 23 decreased to 5.8mg | Aug 10 increased to 6.0mg | Nov 24 decreased to 5.4mg | Dec 31 decreased to 4.8mg 2023 Feb 1 decreased to 4.4mg | May 17 decreased to 4mg | Jul 6 decreased to 3.8mg | Jul 19 decreased to 3.6 | Aug 11 decreased to 3.2mg | Sept 9 decreased to 3.0mg | Sept 22 decreased to 2.7mg | Oct 24 increased to 2.775mg | Nov 12 decreased to 2.7mg | Dec 20 increased to 3.0mg I hold for longer periods of time when life gets stressful, usually work related. Supplements: currently none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucidity Posted May 11, 2021 Author Share Posted May 11, 2021 Thanks for checking in with me. I'm better at this moment. That particular problem has gone away for now. It seemed to stop when I started taking taurine -- I'm probably deficient and I suspect that feeling was adrenaline building, for whatever reason. Now I'm having trouble getting to sleepy at all except during the middle of the day. I resort to some quetiapine every few days when I just can't take the sleep deprivation any more, but always hate myself for doing it since I'm likely building a dependence on it, but can't see any other options 1997-2019 Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Amitryptiline, Mirtazapine, Lexapro (mostly, 10-20mg) Jan 16-Feb 2019 Fast tapered Lexapro after spontaneous kundalini syndrome Feb-Jul Used various herbs to deal with severe anxiety (bacopa, gotu kola) Sept 2019 Developed histamine intolerance and daily panic Currently taking high DHA fish oil, magnesium. Occasionally l-ornithine, l-lysine, l-glycine, melatonin for sleep. Dayvigo for sleep, and l-thp or seroquel (haven't settled on dose) for sleep when in sleep deprivation crisis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple Posted May 11, 2021 Share Posted May 11, 2021 8 hours ago, lucidity said: Thanks for checking in with me. I'm better at this moment. That particular problem has gone away for now. It seemed to stop when I started taking taurine -- I'm probably deficient and I suspect that feeling was adrenaline building, for whatever reason. Now I'm having trouble getting to sleepy at all except during the middle of the day. I resort to some quetiapine every few days when I just can't take the sleep deprivation any more, but always hate myself for doing it since I'm likely building a dependence on it, but can't see any other options Of course. Huh taurine, interesting. I've only heard of it as a stimulant I think? I can't recall. Yeah, I hated myself for even getting back on my AD but I'm glad I did and am restarting my tapering. Sending you warm wishes on this ruthless journey. Continue to keep us posted! 2017 Oct sertraline | Nov switched to escitalopram 10mg | 2018 Apr escitalopram fast taper (4-8 weeks) to zero/off 2018 Nov restarted escitalopram, increased to 20mg | 2020 Jan escitalopram fast taper (2-3 months) to zero/off 2020 Aug 27 restarted escitalopram 10mg tablet, came across SA.org 2021 Feb 27 complete switch to liquid 9.8mg | Mar 7 decreased to 9.5mg | Mar 14 decreased to 9.3mg | Mar 21 decreased to 9.0mg | Apr 11 decreased to 8.8mg | Apr 18 decreased to 8.6mg | May 9 decreased to 8.3mg | May 16 decreased to 8.1mg | Jun 6 increased to 9.0mg | July 18 decreased to 8.6mg | Aug 15 decreased to 8.2mg | Sept 19 decreased to 8.0mg | Oct 21 decreased to 7.6mg | Nov 18 decreased to 7.2mg | Dec 16 decreased to 6.9mg 2022 Feb 27 decreased to 6.8mg | Mar 31 decreased to 6.4mg | Jul 5 decreased to 6.1mg | Jul 23 decreased to 5.8mg | Aug 10 increased to 6.0mg | Nov 24 decreased to 5.4mg | Dec 31 decreased to 4.8mg 2023 Feb 1 decreased to 4.4mg | May 17 decreased to 4mg | Jul 6 decreased to 3.8mg | Jul 19 decreased to 3.6 | Aug 11 decreased to 3.2mg | Sept 9 decreased to 3.0mg | Sept 22 decreased to 2.7mg | Oct 24 increased to 2.775mg | Nov 12 decreased to 2.7mg | Dec 20 increased to 3.0mg I hold for longer periods of time when life gets stressful, usually work related. Supplements: currently none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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