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Cadiedog20: starting taper journey..


Cadiedog20

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Hi everyone,

 

Wanted to introduce myself. My name is Heather and I am 35. Life has been a real journey! 

 

From the time I was 11, my Parents forced me to see a Psychiatrist and forced me to take Anti-depressants. They tried me on 12 different medications including:

 

Imipramine

Respiradol

Celexa

Wellbutrin

Fluvoxamine

Sertaline

 

I cant even remember all the drugs they tried. Those are just the ones i remember most.  The Phychiatrist and Parents were taking me on and off them so quickly. I had major stomach problems and digestion issues throughout my teens from it all.

 

Finally, when I was 18, I quit the latest drug I had been out on-Celexa. I did it cold turkey. The Psychiatrist insisted I stay on it, and of course, my parents believed I needed it. But somehow none of them clue'd in, that my depression stemmed from circumstances surrounding my upbringing and the anxiety came from all the trauma that began when i was 10 and was raped.  When i went off cold turkey, I decided to go to a counsellor on my own. And I dealt with a lot of things and got a lot of healing. Unfortunately, my Mother(who suffers from massive mental health issues my whole life) could never see the wholeness. She always believed I needed medication the rest of my life. 

 

From age 18 up until I was 23, I was free of medications. I was loving life and dating(my now husband) and then I got PREGNENT.  And life spiraled out of control. My body physically could not tolerate the pregnency well and I suffered from extreme pre partum and post partum depression that wasnt diagnosed until 3 months after the birth of my daughter.

 

I ended up in the ER for suicidal ideation and severe depression with insomnia. We don't have Psychiatrists in our small rural town hospital, so it was a GP that perscribed me 300mg Venlefaxine XR and Trazadone(dont remember the dose?) for sleep.

 

I was never warned about how difficult it would be to get off of these drugs. Unfortunately, when I did try to get help to taper off the Venlafaxine since my post partum depression was gone..i was unable to. I was told they only do that in the Summer time. So i had to wait till the Summer..but, by then, my GP had lost her license to practice. So I had to start looking for a new GP. I went through 2 more GP's due to them moving away(common for rural town to lose lots of Physicians to bigger City's). Finally, I found one GP in 2013 who helped me taper safely from 300mg to 75mg Venlafaxine. But then he left for the City and I had to find a new GP to help me continue.

 

At that same time, the Trazadone stopped working for sleep, so the new GP I was assigned, perscribed Mirtazapine 30mg.

 

Can I just say that he NEVER told me that Mirtazapine could cause

 

-unstable blood sugar

-drowsiness at higher doses all day

-digestive issues

-serious stimulation of appetite and weight gain.

 

Previous to this meeting, I had undergone weight loss surgery as I was 300 lbs. The GP perscribing the Mirtazapine knew I had weight loss surgery and was trying to lose weight and he still perscribed this drug! The one that has caused me to gain 80lbs. I have also lost 100 lbs at least 2x now because I can never keep my weight stable. If im not eating a Ketogenic Diet, fasting and doing strenuous exercise, my weight wont move and my blood sugar crashes because i developed reactive hypoglycemia. What a sabatoge! 

 

Anyway.. by 2015.. i suffered major heart problems and was diagnosed with Hypovolemic Postural Orthostatic Syndrome Adrenergic Form.  Basically i have low blood volume and my blood pressure is never stable-either too low or too high and my heart rate fluctuates on extremes and I get lightheaded and pass out easily, have heat intolrence, temperature dysregulation and my heart throws extra beats. 

 

From 2015 to 2019 I spent my life mostly in bed. I spent that time educating myself on this heart condition and then I started noticing somthing pop up in my support group... people having POTS are often on Mirtazapine and often misdiagnosed with Anxiety Disorders. So I thought..thats interesting. And what became more interesting as I started researching the drug Mirtazapine, is a lot of people withdrawling from it, have innapropriate adrenaline surges leading to BP being unstable or heart rate unstable.

 

Of course I am not a Doctor and I cant prove that Mirtazapine induced POTS in someone like me who had no prior history of heart problems. But it sounds suspect. However, i did learn that long term use of Mirtazapine has affected peoples kidneys and liver(of which i have issues with both even though I have never smoked, done drugs or drank before in my life) 

 

Anyway I am digressing...

 

Point is... I learned that Mirtazapine likely caused my weight gain and appetite issues and thats why its been impossible to keep my weight stable and that alone is enough to come off this drug. Though i will say that the insane sleepiness I experience through the day up until esrly evening, is another reason why I want off now! I feel like i live in a fog day in and day out.

 

So... 2021... I made the decision, time to taper. So far, I have been preparing myself. I got a jewlery scale and started weighing my pills. However, for 30mg, they are weighing 31.2 mg. So instead of shaving off amounts, I decided to split a 30mg tablet in half and take half of it by mouth, whole. I crushed the other 15mg with a pill crusher and put it into a 15ml suspension of water. So I was taking half whole and half liquid. My next step is to take all 30mg in a suspension and then to start micro-tapering at 2.5% per week up to 10% and then holding for a couple of weeks.

 

I have a lot of fear honestly, about how it will affect my body. Ive read nightmare stories of people going through tons of physicsl suffering as they withdraw and its given me some anxiety because I spent a lot of time being sick growing up and having little control over my health and the WORST thing would be suffering with horribly physical symptoms.

 

Anyway... this is long..🙄😬

 

Its nice to meet you all. Im glad I found a place to meet others on a similar journey!

 

 

Edited by Gridley

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

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  • Moderator

Welcome to SA, Cadiedog20.  It's nice to meet you, too.  Thank you for completing your drug signature.

 

It sounds like your preparations for tapering are going very well.  You're in the process of switching from tablet to liquid and you're wisely not tapering until you complete that process.  Take your time on the crossover to liquid.

 

The tapering method that you'll be using is known as the Brassmonkey slide taper. I used it to taper off Lexapro, and it is a gentle method that served me well.  Please don't be afraid.  

 

Here's some information on the taper method you'll be using.

 

The Brassmonkey Slide Method of Micro-tapering

 

For your reference, this link is specifically about tapering Mirtazapine.

 

Tips for tapering off mirtazapine (Remeron)

 

And this link is about making your own liquid.  

 

How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

 

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and omega 3 (fish oil). Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system. 

 

 

 

Add in one at a time and at a low dose in case you do experience problems. Get supplements that are single ingredient (not mixed with other types of supplements).

 

This is your Introduction topic, where you can ask questions and connect with other members.  We're glad you found your way here.

 

 

 

 

T

 

 

 

 

 

Gridley Introduction

 

Lexapro 20 mg since 2004.  Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017.   

End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg 

End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg

End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg  

Oct. 30, 2020  Jump to zero from 0.025mg.  Current dose: 0.000mg

3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete.

 

Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements

Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg 

Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper.  Current dose as of Jan. 11, 2022: 5.4mg 

Taper is 71% complete.

 

Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986.  Jan-Sept 2016 tapered to 16mg.  

Held until Aug 2021, tapered for 4 weeks to 14.4mg and holding.  

Taper is 80% complete.  

  

Supplements: omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotic, zinc, melatonin .3mg


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

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  • Gridley changed the title to Cadiedog20: starting taper journey..

Thanks for the welcome and information! :)

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

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So I am on Night 4 of my taper prep transition from solid to liquid. 

Since today, I have been feeling "off". It started with anxiety upon waking..feeling of lump in my throat and then waves of slight nausea(easily settled with a couple of ginger biscuits and tea). Then i started feeling really foggy in my head. Now.. normally the Mirtaz makes me feel sleepy(but not foggy) until early evening. But this was different. Its like i was struggling to hold a conversation or string words together. Its like having one massive brain fart mid conversation. Tonight i focussed on eating light(fruit and cottage cheese for dinner) and drank more tea and went for a 30 minute walk tonight to relax.  

 

Im kind of wondering if I am experiencing unplanned withdrawl already? I split my 30mg and it is scored but my knife cuts arent always percise. Then i crush 1/2 the dose and suspend it in an equal mixture of pancake syrup(dont judge!) and water and i make sure to try and disolve it in the water portion 30 minutes ahead of taking it before adding in the syrup to suspend it. There is obviously some residue left behind on the little medicine cup. Do you think its enough to make the difference? 

Then i take the other portion whole. 

 

Also i had an N=1 experience over the first 2 nights. I tried making a suspension with just water and BLECH! Then i tried milk the next night with water and that was worse. So finally tried the pancake syrup with water and it clicked! Now i realize why they use the Ora liquid. It tastes sweet and masks the bitter plus suspends it!  From now on its syrup. 

 

Day 4 is done... how long do I keep doing the half and half before transitioning to all crushed and liquid?

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Im having a wee panick attack...

I was stupid. I started pre-taper preparation of mirtazapine 30mg converting from tablet over to 50% whole and 50% liquid suspension home made.

 

Tonight in my impatience, i decided to crush my whole 30mg tablet and make a suspension and start taking all 30mg as a liquid dose.

 

But now I am panicking a little...not knowing what to expect tonight. Does it mean the effects of the Mirtazapine like sedation...will it hit me faster or harder? What happens? Im stupid for not checking first. 

 

Could someone please advise me  and put my mind at ease. I wasnt sure how long i was supposed to do my whole 30mg as 50% and 50% liquid? How long do you hold before you do your full dose as crushed? How long do you hold after that before starting a taper?

 

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

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  • Moderator

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03 

Ibuprofen 800 mg, or Tylenol 1000 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at breakfast, 3 PM 

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, calcium

suppl PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2.5 mg

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  • Moderator

Here is my understanding of doing a pill to liquid crossover.  

 

Week 1: 75% pill. 25% liquid

Week 2: 50% pill 50% liquid

week 3: 25% pill 75% liquid

week 4 and beyond: 100% liquid.  

 

I would just go back to doing the protocol for week 1.  How are you feeling today?  

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03 

Ibuprofen 800 mg, or Tylenol 1000 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at breakfast, 3 PM 

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, calcium

suppl PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2.5 mg

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8 minutes ago, getofflex said:

Here is my understanding of doing a pill to liquid crossover.  

 

Week 1: 75% pill. 25% liquid

Week 2: 50% pill 50% liquid

week 3: 25% pill 75% liquid

week 4 and beyond: 100% liquid.  

 

I would just go back to doing the protocol for week 1.  How are you feeling today?  

 

Ive been feeling really weird. Ive had waves of nausea at times and stomach cramps. I lose my appetite too. I think I am having auditory hullucinations at times because I hear "music" thats not really there and it wont stop playing the same song in my head. And then it sounds like I am hearing all kinds of noises amplified to the 10th degree. Sounds like the coffee maker or the fan sound or washing machine sound way louder..almost like in stereo. I end up getting headaches.

 

But all of these "symptoms" appear to be intermittent and random. I dont get them daily or hourly. They appear and then go away.  I feel like I am going crazy and i get a wave of anxiety with it, then it settles down and I am fine.

 

The most notable is how fast the sedation hits now that im taking it 100% liquid. I take it and instead of experiencing a slow increase in drowsiness like normal... it goes from 0 to 100. One minute im awake and then boom! Im so drowsy that i can barely stand up.

 

Luckily i have discovered gingersnaps made with crystalized ginger help to deak with the nausea and lavander oil helps with the nausea and stomach cramps.

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

So i just spent a couple weeks transitioning from taking whole 30mg remeron tablets over to making a 30mg/30ml liquid suspension.

 

I was hoping to use brass monkey slide micro taper method of 2.5% decrease. So I made my 30mg/30ml suspension and used a 60ml syringe to draw it up in, however 2.5% means im not on an even number. So i bought some 1ml syringes to use as well. But i cant figure out what my dosage should be? 

 

I tried weighing my pills after crushing and trying to remove powder but that didnt work well. I tried drawing up 29mls in my 60ml syringe but the amount left didnt seem like much. And i know how to use a syringe(medical background)

 

So im really confused.. I cant cut my pill pieces any smaller than into 1/8 pieces. But if i use all but 1/8 of a piece...my drop will still be 2.5mg.

 

So tonight out of frustration and being unsure I took 26mls of 30ml i created and discovered just now I took 13.3% because i guess 10% would be 27mls(?). Im incredibly bad at math...if someone could help me figure this all out..that would be amazing!

1999- Started Celexa 

2005- Cold Turkied Celexa-mood stable.

2010- Rx for PPD and Insomnja

           - 300mg Venlafaxine XR

           Trazadone(dose ukwn)

2013- Taper Venlafaxine down to                 75mg safely.

           Trazadone pooped out

            Perscribed 30mg                                Mirtazapine for insomnia

2020- Told by different GP 30mg 

            not right dose for sleep.

2021- 30mg down to 26mg Mirt

 

Link to comment
  • Moderator

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

***Please note this is not medical advice.  Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a doctor who understands psych meds and how to withdraw from them, if you can find one.

Lexapro   Started Apr 15 '02 - 10 mg;  Apr 2 '20  0.18 mg; Jul 16  0.17 mg, Aug 23  0.16 mg, Oct 7  0.15 mg, Nov 8 - 0.14, Jan 16 '21 - 0.13, Feb 7 - 0.12, Feb 22 - 0.11, Mar 26 - 0.10, May 21 - 0.09, June 15 - 0.08 Aug 16 - 0.07, Oct 6 - 0.06, Nov 21 0.05, Dec. 17 0.04, Jan 14 '22 0.03 

Ibuprofen 800 mg, or Tylenol 1000 mg as needed

other meds: Levothyroxine 75 mg

Trazodone on occasion, stopped in late 2019

Xanax on occasion, stopped in late 2019

magnesium in small amounts at breakfast, 3 PM 

suppl AM: fish oil, flax oil, vit C, vit E, calcium

suppl PM: magnesium 350 mg, GABA 750 mg, Estroven, melatonin 2.5 mg

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