Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted October 16, 2018 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 16, 2018 Just now, wantrelief said: So true....I really understand how difficult this aspect to tapering/withdrawal can be. I really hope this last cut settles down for you very soon. You have come such a long way!! You will get off of this medication, no doubt. Hang in there, Andy. You are such an inspiration! Thanks as always for your kind words, WR. You are always so sweet. Hope you are doing well (I keep up so I know ). Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Blondiee1915 Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 Hi Andy, I completely understand the frustration. I also feel my tiny cuts not immediately but a few days later. Sometimes I think how can this be? This is so tiny is it even possible but it is possible. I have to remind myself that this is not me this is WD and that I am very sensitive to any med changes and just have to give myself time to adjust. What helps me also is the knowing that a few years ago I was on 20 mg of lexapro and now I am taking a much smaller dose (of another SSRI). We will be off these medications one day and our bodies will eventually thank us I am positive. You are doing amazing great, I truly think so. The fact that you came off benzo and almost off Zoloft after so many years on is admiring. And this is all while working full time and supporting your family! I know you know this Andy and I have mentioned this a few times before, but it is always a good reminder on what a strong and determining person you are. And it is okay to complain and whine, we are doing the best we can. B 04/10 Luvox 25 mg PM, Nortriptyline 1 mg PM 03/08/19: Buspar 2.5 mg AM, 5 mg PM 01/01/19: Xanax 0.125 AM 5 times a week. Occasionally, 0.125 twice a day AM & noon 12/18 Armour Thyroid 60 mg (for hypothyroidism) Supplements: B Complex, B12 (adeno), multi-vitamin, D, Adrenal Cortex, iron Lexapro 20 mg 2007 - 2013 with various attempts to stop 2013 found a new Dr and started trying other meds: Prozac, Notryptoline, Effexor, Buspar, Gabapentin, Paxil, Nardil Lexapro 15 mg 2015 - 04/2016 Vibryiid 10 - 15mg 05/16-06/16 NO MEDS 07/16 - 10/31/16 Reinstated 10/31/16 at 2.5 mg lexapro, increased to 5 mg 1/13/17 switched to Luvox 50 mg before bed 1/20/17 Luvox 37.5 mg PM 12/18 Luvox 10 mg PM, Nortriptyline 2 mg (started Nortriptyline 06/17 at 10 mg) Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted October 16, 2018 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 16, 2018 27 minutes ago, Blondiee1915 said: I also feel my tiny cuts not immediately but a few days later. Yes, Blondiee, same here. A tad day one, a little more days 2 and 3 and still more on 4 and 5 before (hopefully) receding. As I said, if that pattern emerges and settles in there would be some certainty and I'd be thrilled. 28 minutes ago, Blondiee1915 said: What helps me also is the knowing that a few years ago I was on 20 mg of lexapro and now I am taking a much smaller dose (of another SSRI). We will be off these medications one day and our bodies will eventually thank us I am positive. Agreed. I also comfort myself by saying that if I never tapered further and was able to fully stabilize where I am, I'd have greatly reduced my long-term risks. Our beloved Rhiannon has a great post on this somewhere that I can't dig up at the moment. 30 minutes ago, Blondiee1915 said: You are doing amazing great, I truly think so. The fact that you came off benzo and almost off Zoloft after so many years on is admiring. And this is all while working full time and supporting your family! I know you know this Andy and I have mentioned this a few times before, but it is always a good reminder on what a strong and determining person you are. And it is okay to complain and whine, we are doing the best we can. Thanks for saying that, Blondiee. You are a good friend. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Mentor Happy2Heal Posted November 14, 2018 Mentor Share Posted November 14, 2018 Hi Andy hope all is going well with you you've been such a huge help to me along the way, I wanted to thank you personally PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME PRIVATE MESSAGES, thank you. pysch med history: 1974 @ age 18 to Oct 2017 (approx 43 yrs total) Drug list: stelazine, haldol, elavil, lithium, zoloft, celexa, lexapro(doses as high as 40mgs), klonopin, ambien, seroquel(high doses), depakote, zyprexa, lamictal- plus brief trials of dozens of other psych meds over the years started lexapro 2002, dose varied from 20mgs to 40mgs. First attempt to get off it was 2007- WD symptoms were mistaken for "relapse". 2013 too fast taper down to 5mg but WD forced me back to 20mgs June of 2105, tapered again too rapidly to 2.5mgs by Dec 2015. Found SA, held at 2.5 mgs til May 2016 when I foolishly "jumped off". felt ok until Sept, then acute WD hit!! reinstated at 0.3mgs in Oct. 2106 Tapered off to zero by Oct. 2017 Doing very well. Nov. 2018 feel 95% healed, age 63 Jan. 2020 feel 100% healed, peaceful and content PRESENT DAYS: Loving life! ❤️ with all it's ups and downs Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted November 16, 2018 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 16, 2018 On 11/14/2018 at 5:11 PM, Happy2Heal said: you've been such a huge help to me along the way, I wanted to thank you personally So sweet of you to come back to my thread to thank me personally, H2H. I'm glad I could be of some little help to you on your journey -- you've done so well! On 11/14/2018 at 5:11 PM, Happy2Heal said: hope all is going well with you Thanks for this. I'm still mired in the muck. Some days are marginally better and others not so much. I try to take it in stride as best as I can and hope that over time, as I drop further on the med, I will start to see the "real" healing we all crave. There are lots of low moments but I try hard to contain them and continue moving forward. Thanks, again. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus bubble Posted November 17, 2018 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 17, 2018 Was thinking about you too Andy and entered you in search only to find out you posted recently In October you wrote about the hope for finding a pattern with cuts: how long before symptoms appear and how long before things settle down and you can cut again. Has anything emerged? I could so relate things being a tad more bearable once we can settle in that kind of routine (I had it with the first half of my Xanax taper). What dose are you on now? Current: 9/2022 Xanax 0.08, Lexapro 2 2020 Xanax 0.26 (down from 2 mg in 2013), Lexapro 2.85 mg (down from 5 mg 2013) Amitriptyline (tricyclic AD) and clonazepam for 3 months to treat headache in 1996 1999. - present Xanax prn up to 3 mg. 2000-2005 Prozac CT twice, 2005-2010 Zoloft CT 3 times, 2010-2013 Escitalopram 10 mg went from 2.5 to zero on 7 Aug 2013, bad crash 40 days afterreinstated to 5 mg Escitalopram 4Oct 2013 and holding liquid Xanax every 5 hours 28 Jan 2014 Xanax 1.9, 18 Apr 2015 1 mg, 25 June 2015 Lex 4.8, 6 Aug Lexapro 4.6, 1 Jan 2016 0.64 Xanax 9 month hold 24 Sept 2016 4.5 Lex, 17 Oct 4.4 Lex (Nov 0.63 Xanax, Dec 0.625 Xanax), 1 Jan 2017 4.3 Lex, 24 Jan 4.2, 5 Feb 4.1, 24 Mar 4 mg, 10 Apr 3.9 mg, May 3.85, June 3.8, July 3.75, 22 July 3.7, 15 Aug 3.65, 17 Sept 3.6, 1 Jan 2018 3.55, 19 Jan 3.5, 16 Mar 3.4, 14 Apr 3.3, 23 May 3.2, 16 June 3.15, 15 Jul 3.1, 31 Jul 3, 21 Aug 2.9 26 Sept 2.85, 14 Nov Xan 0.61, 1 Dec 0.59, 19 Dec 0.58, 4 Jan 0.565, 6 Feb 0.55, 20 Feb 0.535, 1 Mar 0.505, 10 Mar 0.475, 14 Mar 0.45, 4 Apr 0.415, 13 Apr 0.37, 21 Apr 0.33, 29 Apr 0.29, 10 May 0.27, 17 May 0.25, 28 May 0.22, 19 June 0.22, 21 Jun updose to 0.24, 24 Jun updose to 0.26 Supplements: Omega 3 + Vit E, Vit C, D, magnesium, Taurine, probiotic I'm not a medical professional. Any advice I give is based on my own experience and reading. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted November 17, 2018 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 17, 2018 12 minutes ago, bubble said: Was thinking about you too Andy and entered you in search only to find out you posted recently Thanks for thinking of me! I was thinking of you, too, Bubble, especially now that I've been seeing and responding from time to time to Bubbles. So confusing!!! 14 minutes ago, bubble said: In October you wrote about the hope for finding a pattern with cuts: how long before symptoms appear and how long before things settle down and you can cut again. Has anything emerged? I kind of put a lot on hold (I know you are a fan of that notion) as I was trying to stabilize. Didn't have a whole lot of success unfortunately so I restarted the taper. I'm now at 10.6mg and am planning to do small cuts every 2 weeks or so if I can sustain that (probably around 2%). Maybe a small sense of a pattern related to the cut. I'm a week from the last cut and there are some things the journal I keep suggest are common from the last two cuts (e.g. 7 days out -- today -- feeling some level of depression that lifts after a relatively short time). My hope -- ala Tom (Brassmonkey) -- is that as I reduce I will start to feel better and develop more of a sense of how my body is reacting. At least it sounds good. 23 minutes ago, bubble said: I could so relate things being a tad more bearable once we can settle in that kind of routine (I had it with the first half of my Xanax taper). I feel like my "asks" are very small -- I'm not looking for much -- a pattern to my suffering so that I can move forward with some confidence. A little healing so I have the sense that I'm moving in the right direction. Not much to ask for, but... How are you, Bubble? Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus bubble Posted November 17, 2018 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 17, 2018 Thanks for the details Andy and asking after me. It's pretty similar in a way: holds don't seem to work any more and side effects/paradoxical effects are equally pronounced as WD. Reductions slow and painful as always. For a few years now fatigue is making me quite disabled but I'm pushing forward and also hope for what Brassmonkey experienced: that it will get better as I reduce. It means so much not to be alone and have my tribe. I hope your life overall is not too disrupted. It was great catching up Current: 9/2022 Xanax 0.08, Lexapro 2 2020 Xanax 0.26 (down from 2 mg in 2013), Lexapro 2.85 mg (down from 5 mg 2013) Amitriptyline (tricyclic AD) and clonazepam for 3 months to treat headache in 1996 1999. - present Xanax prn up to 3 mg. 2000-2005 Prozac CT twice, 2005-2010 Zoloft CT 3 times, 2010-2013 Escitalopram 10 mg went from 2.5 to zero on 7 Aug 2013, bad crash 40 days afterreinstated to 5 mg Escitalopram 4Oct 2013 and holding liquid Xanax every 5 hours 28 Jan 2014 Xanax 1.9, 18 Apr 2015 1 mg, 25 June 2015 Lex 4.8, 6 Aug Lexapro 4.6, 1 Jan 2016 0.64 Xanax 9 month hold 24 Sept 2016 4.5 Lex, 17 Oct 4.4 Lex (Nov 0.63 Xanax, Dec 0.625 Xanax), 1 Jan 2017 4.3 Lex, 24 Jan 4.2, 5 Feb 4.1, 24 Mar 4 mg, 10 Apr 3.9 mg, May 3.85, June 3.8, July 3.75, 22 July 3.7, 15 Aug 3.65, 17 Sept 3.6, 1 Jan 2018 3.55, 19 Jan 3.5, 16 Mar 3.4, 14 Apr 3.3, 23 May 3.2, 16 June 3.15, 15 Jul 3.1, 31 Jul 3, 21 Aug 2.9 26 Sept 2.85, 14 Nov Xan 0.61, 1 Dec 0.59, 19 Dec 0.58, 4 Jan 0.565, 6 Feb 0.55, 20 Feb 0.535, 1 Mar 0.505, 10 Mar 0.475, 14 Mar 0.45, 4 Apr 0.415, 13 Apr 0.37, 21 Apr 0.33, 29 Apr 0.29, 10 May 0.27, 17 May 0.25, 28 May 0.22, 19 June 0.22, 21 Jun updose to 0.24, 24 Jun updose to 0.26 Supplements: Omega 3 + Vit E, Vit C, D, magnesium, Taurine, probiotic I'm not a medical professional. Any advice I give is based on my own experience and reading. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted November 17, 2018 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 17, 2018 11 minutes ago, bubble said: For a few years now fatigue is making me quite disabled but I'm pushing forward and also hope for what Brassmonkey experienced: that it will get better as I reduce. I hope this for you too, Bubble. 12 minutes ago, bubble said: I hope your life overall is not too disrupted. It's hard to measure to be honest. I still work and do most of what I need to do, but I don't have the enjoyment and I struggle with the anxiety, depression and insomnia. Things I never had in my life. I feel like the past couple of years have been a big black hole cut out of my life. I'm hoping the hole can get filled in soon. By way of example, I felt decent this morning and ran a bunch of errands, did things around the house, etc. Did not "tax" myself too much. Regardless, I'm getting hit with mini-wave of symptoms that triggers anxiety and general body discomfort. Is this 7 days after a cut? Is it just what happens when the CNS has been fried by the process? Is it some underlying anxiety that is rearing its head? I understand there is no real way to know and my only choice is to try to accept and move forward anyway. It's not easy and it's not fun so, in a word "yes" my life is being disrupted. Having said that, I know there are plenty who are way worse. Hang in there, bubble. Read success stories -- time is our ally. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus bubble Posted November 17, 2018 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 17, 2018 Success stories are everything! I was so happy the other day when I read about Claudius I used to come across his posts in the early days and he was really in a bad way. So I was very happy when I found this update. Shep is helping me so much that I can't explain it in words. Luckily I always feel a lot better in spring and summer. At the moment I'm getting a lot of comfort in Tara Brach... 7 minutes ago, apace41 said: Is this 7 days after a cut? Is it just what happens when the CNS has been fried by the process? Is it some underlying anxiety that is rearing its head? I understand there is no real way to know and my only choice is to try to accept and move forward anyway. It's probably everything listed. I find it easier to cope with stuff if I have an idea of why. It's easier to accept and move on... Current: 9/2022 Xanax 0.08, Lexapro 2 2020 Xanax 0.26 (down from 2 mg in 2013), Lexapro 2.85 mg (down from 5 mg 2013) Amitriptyline (tricyclic AD) and clonazepam for 3 months to treat headache in 1996 1999. - present Xanax prn up to 3 mg. 2000-2005 Prozac CT twice, 2005-2010 Zoloft CT 3 times, 2010-2013 Escitalopram 10 mg went from 2.5 to zero on 7 Aug 2013, bad crash 40 days afterreinstated to 5 mg Escitalopram 4Oct 2013 and holding liquid Xanax every 5 hours 28 Jan 2014 Xanax 1.9, 18 Apr 2015 1 mg, 25 June 2015 Lex 4.8, 6 Aug Lexapro 4.6, 1 Jan 2016 0.64 Xanax 9 month hold 24 Sept 2016 4.5 Lex, 17 Oct 4.4 Lex (Nov 0.63 Xanax, Dec 0.625 Xanax), 1 Jan 2017 4.3 Lex, 24 Jan 4.2, 5 Feb 4.1, 24 Mar 4 mg, 10 Apr 3.9 mg, May 3.85, June 3.8, July 3.75, 22 July 3.7, 15 Aug 3.65, 17 Sept 3.6, 1 Jan 2018 3.55, 19 Jan 3.5, 16 Mar 3.4, 14 Apr 3.3, 23 May 3.2, 16 June 3.15, 15 Jul 3.1, 31 Jul 3, 21 Aug 2.9 26 Sept 2.85, 14 Nov Xan 0.61, 1 Dec 0.59, 19 Dec 0.58, 4 Jan 0.565, 6 Feb 0.55, 20 Feb 0.535, 1 Mar 0.505, 10 Mar 0.475, 14 Mar 0.45, 4 Apr 0.415, 13 Apr 0.37, 21 Apr 0.33, 29 Apr 0.29, 10 May 0.27, 17 May 0.25, 28 May 0.22, 19 June 0.22, 21 Jun updose to 0.24, 24 Jun updose to 0.26 Supplements: Omega 3 + Vit E, Vit C, D, magnesium, Taurine, probiotic I'm not a medical professional. Any advice I give is based on my own experience and reading. Link to comment
bubbles Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 On 11/18/2018 at 2:57 AM, apace41 said: By way of example, I felt decent this morning and ran a bunch of errands, did things around the house, etc. Did not "tax" myself too much. Regardless, I'm getting hit with mini-wave of symptoms that triggers anxiety and general body discomfort. Is this 7 days after a cut? Was it 7 days? I find I barely notice a cut for about 5 days or so, and by about 2 weeks it's all resolved, but 7 days after a cut does seem to be a time when symptoms might surface. Anxiety is a symptom for me when it happens. It does help me that for me it's predictable - days 1-5 no problem, 7-14 might not be great, days 15-onwards okay again. That week might not be good, but I can hang in there knowing that it's typically "finite". 2005 St John's Wort / 2006-2012 Lexapro 20mg, 2 failed attempts to stop, tapered over 4.5 months in early 2012 January 2013 started Sertraline, over time worked up to 100mg July 2014 Sertraline dropped from 100mg to 75mg, held for six months, slower tapering until 2019 22 Dec 3.2mg 2020 Sertraline 19 Jan 3.1mg, 26 Jan 3.0mg; 1 Mar 2.9, 7 Mar 2.8, May (some drops here) 24 May 2.5, May 29 2.4, June 21 2.3, June 28 2.2mg, July 4 2.1mg, July 24 (or maybe a bit before) 2mg, early Nov switched to home made suspension; 29 Nov 1.8mg; approx 25 Dec 1.6mg) 2021 Some time in about Jan/Feb realised probably on more like 1.8mg and poss mixing error in making suspension; doses after 10 Feb accurate; 10 Feb 1.6mg; 7 Mar 1.4, continued monthly 10% drops until 1mg, then dropped 0.1mg monthly. May 2022,0.1mg, now dropping 0.01mg per week 29 August 2022 - first day of zero! My thread here at SA: https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1775-bubbles/page/21/ Current: Armour Thyroid Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Carmie Posted January 11, 2019 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 11, 2019 Hey Andy, Just popping in to see how you’re doing.💚 ( the steam train emoji seems to be right next to the heart emoji as I use it a lot, and when I press on the heart emoji I accidentally press on the steam train one as well a lot of the time, do you like steam trains? 🚂, I do😃) Hope you’re doing okay, sending hugs 🤗 Seroquel. 2019:➡️ From 7.25mg to 5.80mg✔️ 2020➡️From 5.60 to 4.80✔️ 2021➡️From 4.60 to 4.0✔️ 2022➡️From 3.95 to 3.55✔️2023➡️ Jan 26=3.50✔️March 17=3.45✔️ June12=3.40✔️ July30=3.35✔️ Sep14=3.30✔️ Oct31=3.25✔️ 2024➡️Jan15=3.20✔️ Feb19=3.15✔️ March26=3.10✔️This is NOT medical advice.Consult your doctor. Link to comment
Martina23 Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 Hi Andy, I saw you answering by pb. How is your sleep now, did it go better? 05/2013 Lyrica 100 mg / per day for pain + PGAD resulting from caesarian delivery11/2014 started to taper: 50 mg per day/ for one week then c/tafter one month reinstated at 50 mg /per days of 10 July 2015 drug free- symptoms OCD Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 Thanks, Carmie and Martina. Nice of you to check in on me. It's been a long rough road for the past several years. I have never really been able to stabilize and feel like I'm in control of the taper. I've been functional enough to continue doing what I need to do, working a 60 hour week at a demanding job, and keeping those who need me satisfied and comfortable, but I have not really been having a whole lot of fun while I do it. Very symptomatic much of the time, with the most prevalent being: pretty much 24/7 dizziness (off balance sensation) depersonalization/derealization anxiety that comes and goes depression that comes and goes disordered sleep and frequent insomnia pains in various parts of the body burning mouth periodically It's not disabling but I must confess to feeling pretty crappy much of the time. I remain uncertain as to how much of this is drug withdrawal and how much is underlying issues and the general effects of stress and anxiety on the body (whether withdrawal induced or otherwise). As per my signature, since I was not seeing any improvement, and I discussed a potential cross to Prozac with Alto, I instead decided to updose to 12.5mg because that allowed me to take a 25mg pill and break it in half. Frankly, after 2 years of microtapering klonopin in milk (2012-2014) followed by liquid sertraline for the better part of 4+ years (2014-2018), I was sick and tired of the home chemistry kit and mixing drug potions every day! So, here I sit, holding, hoping that will allow me to stabilize to make the final assault on the mountain for the last 12.5mg. To be candid, if I stabilized on this dose and felt good I would not necessarily feel compelled to rush off the last portion since I believe the 87.5% reduction I have made has effected great harm reduction already. Of course, I would love to be drug free and that is the ultimate goal. At this point I'm not sure if what I'm experiencing is due to the SSRI or the benzo as I've been in touch with several people who got off a benzo 4-5 years ago who are still struggling with waves. Unfortunately, I have a lot of factors in play. As far as sleep, Martina, it varies a lot. I just returned from a 2 week vacation in FL. For the first 8 days I slept between 6.5 and 8 hours with most days being around 7.5. It was the first time I'd had sustained sleep like that in several years and it barely made a dent in my sleep debt but it still felt pretty good. Then the sleep started to deteriorate and, after my return a week ago, I've had several nights with very little or no sleep. This suggests that the stress of home/work, etc. is a big factor in my sleep issues. I have been working in therapy to try to deal with several issues, including the health anxiety that troubles me from time to time. I was always health "sensitive" but in the past several years it has escalated. I think the work I'm doing is helping and, while I still have moments where I struggle with the fears, I am better able to contain my anxieties when they arise. Rewiring the brain at 56 is not the easiest chore in the world. Neuroplasticity is meeting its match with a curmudgeon like me! Long story short, I continue to work at it but could use some movement in a positive direction to buoy my spirits with regard to all of this. As everyone on here knows, this is a long and difficult road. Hope you are all doing well. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Martina23 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Andy, this really must be stress and nervousness from the work at your sleep issues. Because when you could sleep 8 hours, it is wonderful. It shows that the body is able to regulate itself. I wouldnt put the anxiety to your underlieing issues yet. You still havent stopped tapering, the drug can still change your chemistry in major way. Cant you take more off from your work? I know it is hard but a lot of anxiety and sleep issues would go with it away. 05/2013 Lyrica 100 mg / per day for pain + PGAD resulting from caesarian delivery11/2014 started to taper: 50 mg per day/ for one week then c/tafter one month reinstated at 50 mg /per days of 10 July 2015 drug free- symptoms OCD Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Carmie Posted January 12, 2019 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 Hi Andy, I’m so sorry to read you’ve never really felt stable. How do you manage to work 60 hours a week? Wow, you’re some kind of super hero! You make a good point that stress could be ramping up your symptoms. That’s the first thing I thought when you said you worked 60 hours a week. Do you get rest? Yes, it’s certainly a pain having to make up medical concoctions every night. I’m crosstapering back to my original tablets as brassmonkey said that it’s best to stick with the original formula. Now I have to do two different water titrations every night for three weeks. I have to make sure I don’t muddle them up. Brain fog makes everything so overwhelming, and I started bawling the other night. Microtapering for years like you did would have taken some effort. Did you go down a bit every day or just change down once a week? It must be easy for you at the moment just having to chop a tablet in half. When I was on higher doses I just kept splitting the tablets with a pill splitter too. You’ve done amazing getting your meds down by 87.5%. Well done! If you end up tapering the rest of your tablet are you going to water titrate it or use a scale? Did the people you are in touch with who are still going through waves due to benzo withdrawals after 4 or 5 years taper slowly? This is quite a journey, isn’t it? Hope you’re coping okay today, sending hugs🤗 Seroquel. 2019:➡️ From 7.25mg to 5.80mg✔️ 2020➡️From 5.60 to 4.80✔️ 2021➡️From 4.60 to 4.0✔️ 2022➡️From 3.95 to 3.55✔️2023➡️ Jan 26=3.50✔️March 17=3.45✔️ June12=3.40✔️ July30=3.35✔️ Sep14=3.30✔️ Oct31=3.25✔️ 2024➡️Jan15=3.20✔️ Feb19=3.15✔️ March26=3.10✔️This is NOT medical advice.Consult your doctor. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 4 hours ago, Martina23 said: Cant you take more off from your work? I know it is hard but a lot of anxiety and sleep issues would go with it away. Thanks, Martina. I'd love to take more time off but that could put my job in jeopardy. I am working more from home than ever before and this summer I will be on a schedule of T-Th in the office and M and F from home (4 day weekends from home). That will help reduce some of the work stress and commuting stress. If I didn't have my work, however, I'd be crazy bored and not know what to do with my time. I failed to mention that I was just evaluated due to terrible chronic hip pain and my hips are completely shot and need to be replaced. I'm hoping that once that is done and rehabbed I can do more physically which will hopefully lift my mood. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 4 hours ago, Carmie said: Microtapering for years like you did would have taken some effort. Did you go down a bit every day or just change down once a week? Hi, Carmie. The benzo withdrawal was a slow microtaper for 2 years daily. The SSRI was much less of a daily process and more of an every couple of weeks (using the BrassMonkey slide approach). 4 hours ago, Carmie said: If you end up tapering the rest of your tablet are you going to water titrate it or use a scale? I'm not sure to be honest. Probably go back to the liquid for ease of accuracy. I'll figure that out when the time is right. 4 hours ago, Carmie said: Did the people you are in touch with who are still going through waves due to benzo withdrawals after 4 or 5 years taper slowly? One did a slow taper and the others either rapid taper or c/t. It seems to be all over the place. 4 hours ago, Carmie said: This is quite a journey, isn’t it? Hope you’re coping okay today, sending hugs🤗 I'm ready to be finished with the "journey" to be honest! Hugs back at you. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Martina23 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 hour ago, apace41 said: Thanks, Martina. I'd love to take more time off but that could put my job in jeopardy. I am working more from home than ever before and this summer I will be on a schedule of T-Th in the office and M and F from home (4 day weekends from home). That will help reduce some of the work stress and commuting stress. If I didn't have my work, however, I'd be crazy bored and not know what to do with my time. I failed to mention that I was just evaluated due to terrible chronic hip pain and my hips are completely shot and need to be replaced. I'm hoping that once that is done and rehabbed I can do more physically which will hopefully lift my mood. Best, Andy Andy, you meant this hip joint that it needs to be replaced? This is not so harmless operation. I read once a book from one doctor who said very often it looses off and the patients are left even almost unable to move. He said the people should rather go to the spa, swimming, rehabilitation, no cycling, no football + tennis and such games, lose a bit weight and let the other people - your wife and daughters to help with the household works and other daily necessary things. Maybe you can send him your x-ray. It is a Czech doctor but I guess he speaks english. His name is Dr. Hnizdil recepce@hnizdozdravi.cz (I hope I didnt write the mail wrong) It is great that you love your work so much. I am still thinking to leave mine. I would rather paint even if I dont sell it. Van Gogh also didnt sell anything. I feel I am wasting whole my potential just to listen to bosses. 05/2013 Lyrica 100 mg / per day for pain + PGAD resulting from caesarian delivery11/2014 started to taper: 50 mg per day/ for one week then c/tafter one month reinstated at 50 mg /per days of 10 July 2015 drug free- symptoms OCD Link to comment
wantrelief Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Hi Andy, I so relate to all that you have written. I am so sorry you again are struggling with sleep on top of everything....you are amazing for continuing to do what you need to despite your symptoms and lack of sleep. I really hope you can gain some stability with the 12.5 dose. 12 hours ago, apace41 said: could use some movement in a positive direction to buoy my spirits with regard to all of this. As everyone on here knows, this is a long and difficult road. I am really hoping you notice some positive changes soon. As you know I am in the same boat....symptomatic and not noticing much change in the positive direction so very much empathize with how hard this all is. It is indeed such a long and difficult road to say the least, especially when you've been at this for a long time. I am thinking about you, Andy, and hoping you get some relief very soon! -1/06 - 3/07 Cymbalta. Fast taper (essentially CT); withdrawal symptoms after 4 mos (didn't realize was WD) -10/07: 100 mg Zoloft; 1 mg Klonopin - tapered off Klonopin after 4 mos. Several unsuccessful slow tapers of Zoloft; went up and down in dose a lot -Spring 2013 back on 1 mg Klonopin to counter WD symptoms; switched over 5-6 mos from Zoloft to 35 mg citalopram -Two attempts at slow tapering citalopram, always increased dose due to WD; also increased Klonopin to 1.25 mg in 2014, then to 1.5 mg in 2015 -8/17-9/17: After holding one year at 20 mg, feeling withdrawal symptoms due to stress - slowly increased to 25 mg. No change in symptoms after 6 months (? tolerance ?) - decided to start citalopram taper February 2018 (still on Klonopin 1.5 mg). Supplements: fish oil; magnesium; vitamin D3; curcumin Citalopram taper: 2/2018 - 12/2019: 25 mg - 11.03 mg I 2020: 10.89 mg - 7.9 mg I 2021: 7.8 mg - 5.26 mg I 2022: 5.2 mg - 3.36 mg I 2023: 3.3 mg - 1.47 mg 2024: 1/5/24: 1.44 mg; 1/19/24: 1.40 mg; 1/26/24: 1.37 mg; 2/2/24: 1.34 mg; 2/9/24: 1.31 mg; 2/23/24: 1.28 mg; 3/1/24: 1.25 mg; 3/8/24: 1.22 mg; 3/15/24: 1.19 mg; 3/29/24: 1.17 mg; 4/5/24: 1.14 mg; 4/13/24: 1.11 mg; 4/20/24: 1.09 mg Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted January 12, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 12, 2019 I'm so sorry to hear about the hip problem Andy. Monica use to be a dancer and in the process destroyed both of her knees. She has put off replacement for seven or eight years by getting periodic Euflexxa shots. They kinda make a synthetic cartilage and cushion the joint. Something you may want to look into before jumping into replacements. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Junglechicken Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Andy, As others have said, you are an inspiration to us all, and are so generous with your time on SA despite having an exhausting work schedule. You mention not wanting to have to deal with a chemistry lab every night in order to get the right dose etc.,. this is what I found all those months ago - I just didn't want to "go there", and was prepared to live with physical discomfort as a consequence of inaccurate doses (I did the pill cutting method without using lab-grade scales). I wasn't prepared to do titrations as I was in no fit state and still dealing with clinical depression. Also really sorry to hear that you will have to have hip replacements. Yes, it'll increase your quality of life re: sports, but I know another SA member who ended up in a huge wave due to the anaesthetic and had to updose as a consequence. I don't mean to scare you, only to talk to the consultant and anaesthetist re: AD and anaesthetic interactions. Rooting for you Andy. Best, JC Dose History: 19 Feb 2014 - Escitalopram 10mg daily June 2015 - Started taper, 5mg every other day July 2015 - 5mg every 2 days August 2015 - 5mg every 3 days September 2015 - 5mg every 4 days Sept 14th - Completed tapering, but at 7 weeks "drug free" I suffered serious WD symptoms as a consequence of "incorrect" tapering. Nov 25 2015 - Re-instated Cipralex @ 2.5mg daily. WD symptoms faded. Held at this dose and experienced "windows and waves". 12 Oct 2017 Reduced dose to 1.25mg. 13 Mar 2018 Reduced dose to 0.625mg (approx.). 16 April 2018 0mg. Windows and waves triggered by stress (IBS/reflux, headaches, sinus issues) Aug 2019 Mirena coil fitted 6 Jan 2020 MAJOR Wave hit 19 months following last dose (protracted WD). Symptoms listed below Mar 2020 Mirena coil removal. Therapy: Nov 15th 2016 Re-started therapy Jan 19th 2017 Started CBT Dec 2017 Started listening to Hypnotherapy CD (self-esteem). Nov 2019 Started couples therapy. Supplements: "Bioglan" Biotic Balance Ultimate Flora 10 billion CFU, live Bacteria, Probiotic, suitable for Vegetarians, with Lactobacillus Acidophilus, Lactobacillus Rhamnosus, Bifidobacterium Longum. "Pukka" Vitalise a unique blend of 30 energising botanicals. Diet: 16 April 2018 Detox cleanse / anti-candida for 90 days. Jan 2020 Started "small plate" diet (i.e child size portions). Exercise: Stretching, Yoga, Pilates, Spinning, Elliptical/upper body workout, walking. Medical Test Results: 4 Jan 2017 Homeopathic Treatment starts 24 Feb 2017 Started weight loss program 24 Mar 2017 Naturopathic Treatment + anti-Candida diet started due to suspected Candida Related Complex (CRC). DETOXED for 7 weeks to "re-set" gut. April 2017 "Genova Diagnostics" Comprehensive Stool Analysis NEGATIVE; Full Blood Count (Normal) / Blood Cholesterol: 5.6 (Borderline) / Blood Sugar (Normal) / 28 Jun 2017 FSH 8.2 / 14 Nov 2017 FSH 17.7 Dec 2017 Blood Cholesterol: 3.9 (Normal) / Kidney Function (Normal) / Blood Sugar (Normal). December 2017 "Genova Diagnostics" Food panel allergy (bloodwork) analysis - a few "VERY LOW/VL" allergens; Mar 2018 "Genova Diagnostics" SIBO urine analysis: High Level of Yeast/fungal markers found in small intestine but NO SIBO. April 2018 Thyroid (Normal) / Full Blood Count (Normal) / FSH (Normal). 16 April 2018 Started anti-Candida diet - 3 month protocol. 25 March 2020 All test results "Normal". CRP" 5 mg/L (normal range to 0-5 mg/L). Symptoms: Flu-like symptoms, anxiety, anhedonia, sinus headaches right-side (severe), IBS issues/reflux (severe)**, tinnitus, fatigue, inner tremor, nausea, chills/hot flushes, pounding heart, muscular issues including stiff left hip flexor, intense anger, PSSD (ongoing). **Histhamine intolerance (suspected). Major Life Events: Re-located to UK from Canada: Jan 2016 My father died: 5:05pm, Monday 5 Feb 2018 Last Lexapro dose: 16 April 2018 (its now been over a year since I quit ADs) Moved house: Friday 23rd February 2018 "Divorced" toxic Mother: Monday 26 March 2018 Starting working again: 19 November 2018 Diagnosed with: 5th August 2021 PTSD/C-PTSD Diagnosed with: March 2022 Interstitial Cystitis (IC)/Painful bladder syndrome Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 9 hours ago, Martina23 said: Andy, you meant this hip joint that it needs to be replaced? This is not so harmless operation. I read once a book from one doctor who said very often it looses off and the patients are left even almost unable to move. Martina, I think we are talking about different things -- hip replacement is very common and at this point pretty low risk in the States. I've tried all kinds of non-surgical therapies for the past several years and it's not responding. I'm pretty debilitated and have no other real options at this point. I have several friends who have had the procedure and are doing great. 9 hours ago, Martina23 said: I am still thinking to leave mine. I would rather paint even if I dont sell it. Van Gogh also didnt sell anything. I feel I am wasting whole my potential just to listen to bosses. You've been unhappy for a long time. Find something else. Follow your passion. Life is too short. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 6 hours ago, wantrelief said: I so relate to all that you have written. I am so sorry you again are struggling with sleep on top of everything....you are amazing for continuing to do what you need to despite your symptoms and lack of sleep. I really hope you can gain some stability with the 12.5 dose. 6 hours ago, wantrelief said: I am really hoping you notice some positive changes soon. As you know I am in the same boat....symptomatic and not noticing much change in the positive direction so very much empathize with how hard this all is. It is indeed such a long and difficult road to say the least, especially when you've been at this for a long time. Thanks for your kind words, WR. I'm sorry you are in the same rocky boat. 6 hours ago, wantrelief said: I am thinking about you, Andy, and hoping you get some relief very soon! Thinking about you too, WR, and hoping for relief for you as well. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 3 hours ago, brassmonkey said: 'm so sorry to hear about the hip problem Andy. Monica use to be a dancer and in the process destroyed both of her knees. She has put off replacement for seven or eight years by getting periodic Euflexxa shots. They kinda make a synthetic cartilage and cushion the joint. Something you may want to look into before jumping into replacements. Thanks, Tom. My doc and I discussed other options and he said that my hips are so far gone there are a bunch of cysts forming so that something more "permanent" needs to be done. At this stage, my ortho (who I trust a great deal) says this is really the right option. I meet with his partner who specializes in hip surgery a week from Thursday so I'll have more info after that. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 12, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 12, 2019 3 hours ago, Junglechicken said: As others have said, you are an inspiration to us all, and are so generous with your time on SA despite having an exhausting work schedule. Thanks for your kind words, JC. Paying it forward on this site gives me a sense of doing something positive out of a negative set of circumstances. I care about the people who I've worked with on this site. 3 hours ago, Junglechicken said: You mention not wanting to have to deal with a chemistry lab every night in order to get the right dose etc.,. this is what I found all those months ago - I just didn't want to "go there", and was prepared to live with physical discomfort as a consequence of inaccurate doses (I did the pill cutting method without using lab-grade scales). I wasn't prepared to do titrations as I was in no fit state and still dealing with clinical depression. I get it. Completely. 3 hours ago, Junglechicken said: Also really sorry to hear that you will have to have hip replacements. Yes, it'll increase your quality of life re: sports, but I know another SA member who ended up in a huge wave due to the anaesthetic and had to updose as a consequence. I don't mean to scare you, only to talk to the consultant and anaesthetist re: AD and anaesthetic interactions. Yes. I'm aware of the risks of anesthesia, and will have them use the least amount necessary, but I've got no real choice at this point. Watching me walk is getting very depressing. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
wantrelief Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 25 minutes ago, apace41 said: Thinking about you too, WR, and hoping for relief for you as well. Thanks very much, Andy. I wanted to also tell you that I am so sorry about your hips on top of all of this withdrawal crap. I too have had friends and family members who have had hip replacement surgery and are doing great now. -1/06 - 3/07 Cymbalta. Fast taper (essentially CT); withdrawal symptoms after 4 mos (didn't realize was WD) -10/07: 100 mg Zoloft; 1 mg Klonopin - tapered off Klonopin after 4 mos. Several unsuccessful slow tapers of Zoloft; went up and down in dose a lot -Spring 2013 back on 1 mg Klonopin to counter WD symptoms; switched over 5-6 mos from Zoloft to 35 mg citalopram -Two attempts at slow tapering citalopram, always increased dose due to WD; also increased Klonopin to 1.25 mg in 2014, then to 1.5 mg in 2015 -8/17-9/17: After holding one year at 20 mg, feeling withdrawal symptoms due to stress - slowly increased to 25 mg. No change in symptoms after 6 months (? tolerance ?) - decided to start citalopram taper February 2018 (still on Klonopin 1.5 mg). Supplements: fish oil; magnesium; vitamin D3; curcumin Citalopram taper: 2/2018 - 12/2019: 25 mg - 11.03 mg I 2020: 10.89 mg - 7.9 mg I 2021: 7.8 mg - 5.26 mg I 2022: 5.2 mg - 3.36 mg I 2023: 3.3 mg - 1.47 mg 2024: 1/5/24: 1.44 mg; 1/19/24: 1.40 mg; 1/26/24: 1.37 mg; 2/2/24: 1.34 mg; 2/9/24: 1.31 mg; 2/23/24: 1.28 mg; 3/1/24: 1.25 mg; 3/8/24: 1.22 mg; 3/15/24: 1.19 mg; 3/29/24: 1.17 mg; 4/5/24: 1.14 mg; 4/13/24: 1.11 mg; 4/20/24: 1.09 mg Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted January 13, 2019 Administrator Share Posted January 13, 2019 12 hours ago, apace41 said: Thanks, Martina. I'd love to take more time off but that could put my job in jeopardy. I am working more from home than ever before and this summer I will be on a schedule of T-Th in the office and M and F from home (4 day weekends from home). That will help reduce some of the work stress and commuting stress. .... Good to hear. I was just about to suggest a shorter week at the office and more working from home. Hope this helps the sleep. 12 hours ago, apace41 said: .... I failed to mention that I was just evaluated due to terrible chronic hip pain and my hips are completely shot and need to be replaced. I'm hoping that once that is done and rehabbed I can do more physically which will hopefully lift my mood. Oh, noes! Get the best surgeons, Andy, we want this to go well. They get you back on your feet and moving very soon after the operation, physical therapy every day, you could be dancing again in no time. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Carmie Posted January 13, 2019 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 Hi Andy, I’m really sorry that you’re having such trouble with your hips. I got hit by a car crossing the road many years ago. I don’t remember the details as I ended up being unconscious. I broke bones from head to toe and ended up in the hospital for three months. I broke my pelvis as well, it was terrible. I’m not in any pain at the moment, it subsided, but it might catch up with me later on. My knee never healed properly, you can see the deformed bones. I have to strap my knee in sometimes when I’m walking too much or doing something else like the aqua park the other weekend. If you do the hip surgery, I wish you all the best. You did amazing doing a microtaper daily for two years. Such patience, what an example you are to all of us. Yes, I certainly get you. I’m ready to be finished with this journey as well. Reality dictates though that this isn’t the case. Shame. You are shining light on this site✨✨✨✨ and I wish you all the best💚 Seroquel. 2019:➡️ From 7.25mg to 5.80mg✔️ 2020➡️From 5.60 to 4.80✔️ 2021➡️From 4.60 to 4.0✔️ 2022➡️From 3.95 to 3.55✔️2023➡️ Jan 26=3.50✔️March 17=3.45✔️ June12=3.40✔️ July30=3.35✔️ Sep14=3.30✔️ Oct31=3.25✔️ 2024➡️Jan15=3.20✔️ Feb19=3.15✔️ March26=3.10✔️This is NOT medical advice.Consult your doctor. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 13, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 16 hours ago, wantrelief said: I wanted to also tell you that I am so sorry about your hips on top of all of this withdrawal crap. I too have had friends and family members who have had hip replacement surgery and are doing great now. Thanks for the encouragement, WR. Other than the withdrawal implications, I'm good with the prospects of success from the hip replacement. I waited through pain for several years to allow the technology to get where I was comfortable and I think it is there now and that I should not need a revision in my lifetime. I'm going to look at the option of doing it bilaterally (both at once) as I don't want to do this twice with two anesthesias and two recoveries. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 13, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 14 hours ago, Altostrata said: Good to hear. I was just about to suggest a shorter week at the office and more working from home. Hope this helps the sleep. Thanks, Alto. I'm going to do my best to try to work remotely when possible. After 30+ years, I'm tired of the commuting! 14 hours ago, Altostrata said: Oh, noes! Get the best surgeons, Andy, we want this to go well. They get you back on your feet and moving very soon after the operation, physical therapy every day, you could be dancing again in no time. I'm meeting with the hip guy in my orthopedic group a week from Thursday, a military guy who was at Walter Reed in DC. He's supposed to be very good but I will do my diligence. Nowadays they have you up and starting rehab day 1. I've had my rotator cuff repaired and 2 achilles both torn and repaired and my recoveries have been very good -- I'm hoping to continue the trend. If you'd have seen me dance you'd probably suggest I could be playing tennis in no time. Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 13, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 13 hours ago, Carmie said: I got hit by a car crossing the road many years ago. I don’t remember the details as I ended up being unconscious. I broke bones from head to toe and ended up in the hospital for three months. I broke my pelvis as well, it was terrible. I’m not in any pain at the moment, it subsided, but it might catch up with me later on. My knee never healed properly, you can see the deformed bones. I have to strap my knee in sometimes when I’m walking too much or doing something else like the aqua park the other weekend. Wow -- you poor thing. It's good to hear you have recovered by and large. 13 hours ago, Carmie said: If you do the hip surgery, I wish you all the best. Thanks, Carmie. It's not an if but a when. 13 hours ago, Carmie said: You did amazing doing a microtaper daily for two years. Such patience, what an example you are to all of us. Thanks for that. At that time, I didn't know about A/D withdrawal and thought, "if I get off the benzo, I'm home free." Thus, I was fine with the idea of being very slow and careful as I did my taper. I was so motivated. I often wonder how I would have reacted if someone told me then that 6 years later I'd still be working on tapering the A/D. 13 hours ago, Carmie said: You are shining light on this site✨✨✨✨ and I wish you all the best💚 And you are so sweet. Thank you. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted January 13, 2019 Moderator Share Posted January 13, 2019 I can understand that Andy. If there are cysts and the like then something has to get done. and I have to remember that hips have a much higher success rate than knees, totally different type of joint. Best of luck and keep us informed. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus apace41 Posted January 13, 2019 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 12 minutes ago, brassmonkey said: I can understand that Andy. If there are cysts and the like then something has to get done. and I have to remember that hips have a much higher success rate than knees, totally different type of joint. Best of luck and keep us informed. Thanks, Tom. The big challenge will be fitting it into a very busy schedule we have with several weddings and other engagements. Never a dull moment. Best, Andy Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012 increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first") Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15 Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15 Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016 10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg. No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold. After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C, Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Gridley Posted January 13, 2019 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 13, 2019 Andy, I wish you the best. You definitely win the still-carrying-on-with-life award. Gridley Introduction Lexapro 20 mg since 2004. Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017. End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg Oct. 30, 2020 Jump to zero from 0.025mg. Current dose: 0.000mg 3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete. Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium End 2021 year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper. Taper is 95% complete. Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986. Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper. Current dose as of April 1: 6.8mg Taper is 91% complete. Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs. Link to comment
Martina23 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Andy thank you for your explanation, it helped me a lot 🙂 I wish you today a good today's nights sleep of at least ten hours (but hopefully you will not then miss the work :-)) 05/2013 Lyrica 100 mg / per day for pain + PGAD resulting from caesarian delivery11/2014 started to taper: 50 mg per day/ for one week then c/tafter one month reinstated at 50 mg /per days of 10 July 2015 drug free- symptoms OCD Link to comment
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