gardenlady

[gardenlady]

9 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

 

It's not necessarily the only one.  It one that I was aware of who unfortunately didn't come back to write a success story.

I’ve scoured this site a few times and haven’t seen any success stories from  Cymbalta.  It doesn’t mean they aren’t there, but it’s unlikely.  And ominous.

[gardenlady]

37 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

 

It's not necessarily the only one.  It one that I was aware of who unfortunately didn't come back to write a success story.

Until you can show otherwise, it stands that it's the only one.  I've been through all the Success Stories and there isn't a single Cymbalta story there.  

[AJ716]

Hi gardenlady,

 

Please forgive the intrusion.  I caught an interest in your story after noticing the recent post about there seeming to be a lack of Cymbalta success stories.  

I'm curious about your HRT experience.  Have you stopped or reduced and if so, what was it like? Was it while tapering Cymbalta?  I am on HRT and a big cocktail of meds, and just started tapering Cymbalta a month ago.  

 

Btw, congratulations for successfully getting off of the Ativan/Valium and Ambien!  I hope you pat yourself on the back every day to acknowledge that accomplishment

 

[ChessieCat]

15 minutes ago, gardenlady said:

It doesn’t mean they aren’t there, but it’s unlikely.

 

I agree, it doesn't mean that they aren't there.

 

BUT saying that it is unlikely is not an accurate statement.  You do not know this.  You think it's unlikely.

 

17 minutes ago, gardenlady said:

And ominous.

 

I'm going to be very blunt.  And what I'm going to say is not related to the drug issues you have.

 

It's to do with the way you see/interpret things.

 

You are finding more negative Cymbalta stories than positive ones.  That doesn't not mean that people don't get off Cymbalta successfully.  It just means that either you haven't found the positive ones or the documentation of the stories doesn't exist (note that I said "documentation").  You are then using the negative stories that you find to confirm your negative and pessimistic thinking.

 

I am familiar with your situation from having PMs with you previously.  I do understand how difficult it can be to make changes and we get stuck in a rut and it can be hard to get out of it.  But I do think that you need to work on changing your catastrophic thinking.  I realise that it is not going to change the difficulties with getting off the drug but is can make a difference to how you get through that time.

 

Your post came through just before I finished typing up mine and your post just confirms what I've just typed.  Your lack of finding the positive stories just feeds your negativity.

 

I've spent a lot of time typing because I've carefully considered how to write it.   I've written this because I care and I think that there is a way to make things a bit better for yourself.  There are things that we can do to make a difference but we have to make the effort.  And yes, I know it's hard but if you make a start then you might feel a tiny bit more positive and that can make a difference.  I hope what I've written helps.  Negativity can cause self-pity and self-pity can cause negativity.  It's a vicious cycle.  It can be broken but nobody can do it for you.

 

Take care.

[gardenlady]

8 minutes ago, AJ716 said:

Hi gardenlady,

 

Please forgive the intrusion.  I caught an interest in your story after noticing the recent post about there seeming to be a lack of Cymbalta success stories.  

I'm curious about your HRT experience.  Have you stopped or reduced and if so, what was it like? Was it while tapering Cymbalta?  I am on HRT and a big cocktail of meds, and just started tapering Cymbalta a month ago.  

 

Btw, congratulations for successfully getting off of the Ativan/Valium and Ambien!  I hope you pat yourself on the back every day to acknowledge that accomplishment

 

No, I'm still on the lowest oral dose of progesterone and estradiol and will stay on it for another two years at which time I plan to slowly taper off of both.  Unfortunately, the relief of getting off of the benzos and Z-drug has been eclipsed by the horror of the Cymbalta withdrawal, despite a slow taper. It has destroyed my personality, relationships and overall life (including loss of my home) in a way that I can't describe.  Cymbalta is worse than benzos and Z-drugs, combined...there is no comparison. 

[gardenlady]

8 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

BUT saying that it is unlikely is not an accurate statement.  You do not know this.  You think it's unlikely.

Do you know?  If not, who does?  Please correct me if Cymbalta success stories are there.  I'm perfectly fine with admitting I was wrong if I am.  But, you don't seem able to show that. 

[ChessieCat]

I wasn't referring to whether the stories exist or not.  I was pointing out the way made your comment and how it feeds your negative thinking because you believe it is a fact when it is actually your opinion.

 

From difference-between-fact-and-opinion.

Quote

 

The fact is described as the statement that can be verified or proved to be true. Opinion is an expression of judgment or belief about something.

 

 

From fact-vs-opinion-what-s-the-difference

Quote

 

People often try to treat their own opinion statements as truth statements because they want others to think they must agree with them.

 

 

This is making a factual statement:

 

It is unlikely.

 

This is stating your opinion:

 

I think it's unlikely.

 

I hope that clarifies it.

[AJ716]

4 hours ago, gardenlady said:

No, I'm still on the lowest oral dose of progesterone and estradiol and will stay on it for another two years at which time I plan to slowly taper off of both.  Unfortunately, the relief of getting off of the benzos and Z-drug has been eclipsed by the horror of the Cymbalta withdrawal, despite a slow taper. It has destroyed my personality, relationships and overall life (including loss of my home) in a way that I can't describe.  Cymbalta is worse than benzos and Z-drugs, combined...there is no comparison. 

 

I'd say that AD's have destroyed my life too but I haven't stopped fighting.  So I just say they messed me up, lol. 

 

At one point during your Introduction Thread you mentioned a desire for tips regarding hormone tapering in relation to the Cymbalta struggle.  I noticed it after I posted to my question to you.  Perhaps asking other members personally will get you somewhere? Unfortunately I don't have experience in hormone tapering.  

 

Hormone doses really confused me at first because the different forms of administration(pill verses patch).  The oral route requires a dose to be so much higher since a large amount much of the medication gets discarded and is unused by the liver.  However the medication from the transdermal patch gets absorbed through the skin and bypasses the liver, so the doses are much smaller (I think 10x but I'd triple check).  I use a weekly transdermal patch (actually two but I'll spare you specifics unless you're interested) and they are very easy to break down into smaller doses.  I researched it a lot and am sure that cutting the patch is safe (matrix transdermal system).   

 

Perhaps you can get the equivalent of your oral dose prescribed to you in patch form?  There is even a website with an instructional on how to cut the various size patches down and make smaller doses.  You could even have a higher dose prescribed and cut it down yourself to fit your dose (haha, I do that and it saves me money!).  Maybe you already know all this and considered it.  Just trying to be helpful.  Please reach out if there's any way I can help. Sorry I don't know more.

 

Btw, there's a general subreddit for Cymbalta: https://www.reddit.com/r/cymbalta/ and below is at least one of the discussion entries regarding successful Cymbalta tapers.  

 

 

Edited November 6, 2020 by AJ716
dumb errors.

[Shep]

I googled within the success stories for "Cymbalta" and found:

 

Healing IS possible: My "success" story by Gato123

 

jmim: My recovery story

 

I Quit the Cure by QuittheCure

 

FWIW, Gardenlady, I don't know anyone else who was able to go coldturkey or rapid taper off 6 psychiatric drugs after having been drugged for 30 years and still be functional enough to stay employed and to heal in 5 years, but I did it. (I don't recommend rapid taper and cold turkey, though - way too risky!)

 

Instead of the woe is me, "I'm never gonna heal because nobody every does," why not say, "I'll be the first"? 

 

That will set yourself up for success and go a long way toward inviting the positive side of neuroplasticity to help you along. 

 

Just a thought. You're carrying around an awful lot of weight that you don't need to carry. 

[ChessieCat]

Thanks Shep, I appreciate you taking the time to do that.  So that's 4 members that we know about on SA who have taken Cymbalta and have managed to get off.

[Longroadhome]

Well done @gardenlady

on your taper !!! 

you are getting very low now. 
ive been watching how the tapering goes as I am tapering every month at 10% reduction from Paxil. 
 

it’s hard going isn’t it especially because like you I am not symptom free on this journey . But ..  I am very determined to be off all medication 

 

how will you be tapering once you hit 1mg

will you drop 0.9, 0.8, 0.7 etc per month therefore taking around 10 months to reach 0? 

[Longroadhome]

Well done @gardenladyyou did it!!!! 
congratulations on being completely drug free. 
now you can really start to heal. 
 

[Altostrata]

Hello, @gardenlady, how are you doing?

[gardenlady]

On 9/25/2021 at 11:26 AM, Longroadhome said:

Well done @gardenladyyou did it!!!! 
congratulations on being completely drug free. 
now you can really start to heal. 
 

Thanks LRH.  I hope I will heal, eventually.  The 4.5 year taper was truly brutal and agonizing....beyond description.  

On 9/25/2021 at 1:27 PM, Altostrata said:

Hello, @gardenlady, how are you doing?

Hitting zero has been tough.  It's been over two months and I continue to spiral down.  The mental and verbal rage is frightening and has made me repellent to all who know me.  The akathisia continues along with insomnia, fear, terror and existential dread and doom to the point where I am unable to function socially, at all.  I am a complete recluse due to personality disintegration.   It's fearful being alone in this incapacitated state at age 69 having lost all relationships.  It's like having dementia while being on a bad acid trip that never ends.  I do wonder if I am insane and if healing will be possible for me since I was on antidepressants for so long.  I realize we are all different and that there is no way to predict.  I am glad to finally be off of the neurotoxin and hope that perhaps I will be one of the fortunate ones who does heal, eventually. 

[Longroadhome]

Everybody heals eventually @gardenlady

In their own time once off all meds. 
You will too when the timing is right for you. 

 

[Kat66]

8 hours ago, gardenlady said:

The mental and verbal rage is frightening and has made me repellent to all who know me.  The akathisia continues along with insomnia, fear, terror and existential dread and doom to the point where I am unable to function socially, at all.  I am a complete recluse due to personality disintegration.   It's fearful being alone in this incapacitated state at age 69 having lost all relationships.  It's like having dementia...

You're not alone @gardenlady...I can so relate to the rage, fear and reclusive tendencies and feeling like your personality is disintegrating. Also the not wanting to mix socially - I'm done with everyone's BS anyway so it's no great loss. Sending warm wishes to you.

[Altostrata]

That sounds awful. Cymbalta is right up there with the worst offenders for withdrawal. 

 

Has your symptom pattern changed over the last month?

 

How much fish oil and magnesium are you taking?

[gardenlady]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

That sounds awful. Cymbalta is right up there with the worst offenders for withdrawal. 

 

Has your symptom pattern changed over the last month?

 

How much fish oil and magnesium are you taking?

There is no symptom "pattern" as the state of being I described is constant without fluctuation.  The one exception is that the terror level increases while I'm in bed regardless of time of day, so it's more a matter of place than time.  I take 1 tsp/day of Nordic Naturals liquid 2840 mg omega 3.  It has no effect on my symptoms but I take it for other health benefits.   I no longer take magnesium glycinate after taking it for a year without discernible benefit.  I've also found that nothing I do or don't eat or drink has any effect on symptoms from the neurotoxic poisoning. 

 

I will add that I'm thankful for this safe community where people DO know the truth about these hideous drugs and where we are believed rather than being dismissed as mentally ill, marginalized, abandoned and hated because of what they have done to us.  Thank you, Alto, for starting this organization and for maintaining it through the years at what must be immense personal cost to you. 

[gardenlady]

9 hours ago, Kat66 said:

You're not alone @gardenlady...I can so relate to the rage, fear and reclusive tendencies and feeling like your personality is disintegrating. Also the not wanting to mix socially - I'm done with everyone's BS anyway so it's no great loss. Sending warm wishes to you.

Thanks, Kat66.  I'm so sorry that you're suffering many of the same things as I am.  It's truly an atrocity unleashed on a trusting population by ignorant Big Pharma cult members masquerading as medical doctors, nurses and physician assistants. 

[Altostrata]

Thanks for the recognition, @gardenlady

[JesusSavemefromWD]

1 hour ago, gardenlady said:

Thanks, Kat66.  I'm so sorry that you're suffering many of the same things as I am.  It's truly an atrocity unleashed on a trusting population by ignorant Big Pharma cult members masquerading as medical doctors, nurses and physician assistants. 

Could not agree more…. Sorry ur suffering so much, I am praying for all of us for healing from these poisons 

[Longroadhome]

@gardenlady

Have you looked at Baylissa Fredericks site? 
There is so much positivity there regarding healing and recovery as well as success stories. 
if you haven’t I urge you to do so. 

[gardenlady]

3 hours ago, Longroadhome said:

@gardenlady

Have you looked at Baylissa Fredericks site? 
There is so much positivity there regarding healing and recovery as well as success stories. 
if you haven’t I urge you to do so. 

Yes, I've known about Baylissa for years and am very familiar with her and her resources.   

[Longroadhome]

a member on this site posted this to another and I thought I’d send it to you @gardenlady Written by  Baylissa F.     You are stronger than you think. We know that withdrawal is complex and cruel, but you mustbelieve that you can make it through to the end. As challenging as it is, it won’t break you.  Nothing is going to happen that is life threatening. Once you are emotionally safe, you will get to the finishing line. Just like you have managed in the past, the strength that brought you this far will take you the rest of the way. Don’t underestimate your resilience and the potential of the human body to heal. Whether you are still tapering, you have come off the drug and are in withdrawal, or you have been suffering for longer than anticipated, you will heal. You are going to be okay. You won’t break. Remember those before you who were once where you are now. They made it to the other side and you will too. One day the symptoms will disappear, never to return, and you will be able to celebrate your recovery. The storm clouds will drift away and the sun will shine down on you again. Be patient and keep going. Always remember that, this is healing in action. This is passing. This, too, shall pass. It isinevitable.

[gardenlady]

@Longroadhome Thank you so much for your thoughtfulness and encouragement.  You are most kind and I really do appreciate it.  I hope your taper isn't too gruesome and that you are managing to live at least some semblance of a normal life.  Again, many thanks. 

[Longroadhome]

5 hours ago, gardenlady said:

@Longroadhome Thank you so much for your thoughtfulness and encouragement.  You are most kind and I really do appreciate it.  I hope your taper isn't too gruesome and that you are managing to live at least some semblance of a normal life.  Again, many thanks. 

You’re very welcome and thank you . 
Like you I have been able to go on and off my AD for years with no problem whatsoever. But not this last time. Previously  I had only ever been on them short term but from menopause the Dr advised me to just keep taking them so I did ... for a long time and developed tolerance (anxiety and many other  symptoms)  and decided I wanted off. That’s when the proverbial hit the fan ..!!

i started to taper quickly then crashed. Held for a year, no relief,  now tapering . In between this I was given Pregabalin to help with WD from Paxil but it didn’t work and now I’m stuck on that too, albeit a low dose now.  I have intense symptoms but am persevering with the taper. 
I’m ‘existing’ in my life at present waiting on the side lines to re join the world. 
I’ve followed you because some parts of our story are similar and I think you are an extremely determined person and very very brave. 
I’m 61 and like you,  I would really like some peaceful healthy years ahead of me before Its my time to leave . 
take good care 

[Kat66]

On 11/14/2021 at 9:54 PM, gardenlady said:

Yes, I've known about Baylissa for years and am very familiar with her and her resources.   

Has she been helpful to you @gardenlady?

[gardenlady]

10 hours ago, Kat66 said:

Has she been helpful to you @gardenlady?

I certainly laud Baylissa's tireless efforts, respect her greatly and have read many of her articles.  So,  I would say that I find her views helpful, but not more so than anyone else who offers support.   I never did engage her services, privately.  I understand that she is no longer active in providing individual counseling due to threats and pressures from nefarious factions.  Very sad as apparently many people benefitted from her one-on-one help. 

[JesusSavemefromWD]

24 minutes ago, gardenlady said:

I certainly laud Baylissa's tireless efforts, respect her greatly and have read many of her articles.  So,  I would say that I find her views helpful, but not more so than anyone else who offers support.   I never did engage her services, privately.  I understand that she is no longer active in providing individual counseling due to threats and pressures from nefarious factions.  Very sad as apparently many people benefitted from her one-on-one help. 

She actually is still active, I had an one time consultation about 4 months ago. She believes that everyone heals and time is the big factor of healing, in agreement with SA. So to be honest, I didn’t get/learn anything more out of this consultation than what I have learned from SA. 

[gardenlady]

So glad to learn that Baylissa is back in the game.  In April 2021, she went dark for a short time due to bullying from various people in the benzo community, but I see now that she quickly reversed course and resumed her work.  That's great to hear.

[Kat66]

11 hours ago, gardenlady said:

I certainly laud Baylissa's tireless efforts, respect her greatly and have read many of her articles.  So,  I would say that I find her views helpful, but not more so than anyone else who offers support.   I never did engage her services, privately.  I understand that she is no longer active in providing individual counseling due to threats and pressures from nefarious factions.  Very sad as apparently many people benefitted from her one-on-one help. 

I think I'll look her up - I'm feeling bloody awful. How are you doing? x

[gardenlady]

@Kat66  I'm sorry you're feeling so badly.  Thanks for enquiring about me...unfortunately, nothing has changed as I am constantly in the same state that I described in previous posts.  I've never experienced the waves and windows that others do as I have never had a window in all my years of being polydrugged, tapering and recovery.   I always feel like a demented person on a bad acid trip that never ends accompanied by insomnia, sleep inversion, fear, terror and existential doom and dread.

[Kat66]

13 hours ago, gardenlady said:

 I always feel like a demented person on a bad acid trip that never ends accompanied by insomnia, sleep inversion, fear, terror and existential doom and dread.

What is sleep inversion? I can certainly relate to the fear, terror and existential dread.

[gardenlady]

@Kat66  Sleep inversion is when one's sleep pattern is completely opposite of a normal one.  I had psych drug withdrawal insomnia for so long that regardless of what time I went to bed, I didn't fall asleep until after 4 am.  This cycle became entrenched and now, when I do sleep, it's not until 8 am or later.  And when I do finally fall asleep, I sleep only two or so hours at time with periods of waking in between.  It's wrecked my circadian rhythm and I've not been able to correct it because the insomnia is so severe.  I often go 24-36 hrs without sleep and then it takes me two days to recover only for the pattern to repeat.  Nothing helps....I've tried everything to no avail and have given up.  I hope that one day if my brain ever begins to heal that it will straighten itself out.

[Overwhelmedlady]

Hi @gardenlady I am almost reaching the two year mark off paroxetine and zopiclone (both cold turkey at the same time).That was January 2020. The start of the pandemic and subsequent lockdown followed (March) 2020 was just too traumatic to recall but going straight to the insomnia issue,I went through the same pattern you describe for a whole year.Tossing and turning for hours on end,waking up many times to go to the toilet,falling asleep at 8 or 9 in the morning,unable to leave bed till past 1pm (not because  I was sleeping but because I was totally exhausted) But as from January 2021, it slowly started to get better.At present I regularly sleep 5 hours (without waking up in the middle) very rarely sleep 6, and,if I do, it's because I woke up in the middle ( after 3 hours).So, it does get better considering I took z drugs for 2 decades or more AND I discontinued abruptly (not my choice)Sleep is a key aspect of healing and,if you ask me,5 hours is not enough for me and one of my withdrawal symptoms is chronic fatigue.So, hold on,I still fall asleep very late,around 3.30 am, but it's my choice since I read in bed.Hope that one day I will be able to sleep 7 hours .

[gardenlady]

@Overwhelmedlady  Thanks so much for your encouraging word....I'm so glad that your sleep has improved!!  My distorted sleep pattern has been going on for three years now with no sign of letting up, but then I've been off all psych drugs for only 2.5 months so perhaps I will see improvement in a year or so as you did.  Your pattern sounds exactly like mine.  The frustrating thing is that when I do fall asleep, I am often awakened by terror.  It comes over me when I'm asleep and wakes me up and isn't associated with having a bad dream.  It's truly horrific and is solely drug-induced as it doesn't happen in nature.  I truly believe that antidepressants and other psych drugs are every bit as dangerous, possibly more so, than illicit drugs such as acid and LSD.  Even a slow, proper taper like the one I did doesn't necessarily mitigate brutal withdrawal and long-term neurotoxic damage.