TomSawyer50: Hello with an intro and my story

[TomSawyer50]

Hello all just wanted to introduce myself.  I have been lurking for a while. 
 

Had a seizure in June of 2000 and was put on Tegretol as they researched the reason I had my seizure. Dr found no reason for seizure. A month or so later after I was driving home and had my first panic attack. May have been tapering Tegretol at the time or may have just gotten off of it. I cant remember. Was across the country from family at the time chasing a dream.

 

From the first panic attack I thought it was another seizure coming on so at that point forward i thought the panic attacks were seizures coming on. In November of 2000 i saw a local Neurologist and told him i felt like I was having near seizures and he said the were panic attacks which he sent me back to Gp who prescribed 20 mg of Paxil.

 

Within a week panic attacks and anxiety were gone. Over the next 10 years I tried multiple times to get off Paxil with typical fast tapers. 10 mg for 2 weeks then none only to crash 3 months later or when any stress hit. Each time I would reinstate Paxil and be fine within days. Sometime around 11/2006 I talked my Dr about fatigue and we seamlessly cross tapered to Celexa. Stayed on Celexa for months then fast tapered again. Again crashing at about the 3 month mark. When I reinstated Celexa I had a bad reaction and further bad reaction as the dose increased.

 

After a failed reinstatement went back to Paxil successfully until 12/31/2010 when it finally Pooped out on me. From there spent the next few months getting somewhat stabilized on 75-100 mg Zoloft and had to add Remeron 15 mg for sleep.

 

After about 3-6 months me and Dr “successfully” cross tapered to Lexapro 10 mg and remained on Remeron 15 mg until I moved to a Psychiatrist. In September of 2012 we did a med wash where I completely got of all meds and used only Klonopin for 2-3 weeks. At the end of the 3 weeks I think we tried Viibryd and Luvox only to end up back on 10 mg of Lexapro and 50 mg of seroquel. Stabilized here pretty good until December of 2017 when the Lexpro pooped out. At this time we tried 20 mg Prozac which didn’t help then Cymbalta which helped a little. I remained on 25 mg of Seroquel. 

 

I honestly dont even know exactly my Cymbalta dose as i was taking about half the beads out of a 20 mg pill.  In January of 2019 i started reducing beads every couple weeks and by 04/2019 was down to 3 beads at which I discontinued.  I remained still on the 25 mg of Seroquel until I crashed on 07/15/2019. At this time I increased seroquel to 50 and have been in a search. 

on 07/18/2019 started Remeron 15 mg and was using 50 seroquel.  For two weeks this helped but I needed more improvement so Psych put me back on 2.5 mg of lexapro increasing to 7.5 mg for 4 weeks until we decided it wasn’t working at all. Cross tapered to viibryd up to 15 mg for 4 weeks and it didnt work. Have since been off Viibryd, increased seroquel to 200 (crazy suicidal thoughts) decreased back to 75 mg, started depakote 250mg at 7:30 am and 375  mg at 7:30 pm, and increased Remeron to 22.5 mg. 

The addition of Depakote was due to an appointment with a neurologist who suggested that my seizure might have damaged brain cells which caused anxiety/panic. At some point I was improving with either the Remeron Increase or the Depakote bu I have no Idea. I have fried my CNS for now, barely sleep, and anxious most of the time. 

My crash on 07/15/2019 was due to protracted withdrawal and drinking too much 2-3 times a week.   

i thought i would share my story now which i hope motivates me to get stabilized and correctly taper these drugs. As for now i have no idea what my next step will be.

Edited October 22, 2019 by Altostrata
added line breaks

[TomSawyer50]

Med timeline 

Paxil 20 mg 10/2000-04/2002 fast taper 
Paxil 20 mg 06/2002-10/2002 fast taper and stress
Paxil 20 mg 11/2002-11/2006 cross taper to celexa as I felt tired all the time. 
Celexa 20 mg 11/2006-02/2007 fast taper. 
05/2007 started celex 20 mg again bad reaction anxiety 10 fold. Increased to 30 mg got worse. Cross tapered to Paxil 20 mg 06/2007-01/2011 until Paxil pooped out
Zoloft 100 mg 02/2011-06/2011 and Remeron 15 mg. Cross tapered to Lexapro 10 mg Remeron 15 mg. Stayed her until 09/2012. 
Tapered off everything and did an 3 week med wash taking Klonopin as needed.  Tried Viibryd and Luvox with them not working as well 
10/2012 Reinstated 10 mg lexapro with 50 mg of seroquel. 
10/2012-12/2017 10 mg Lexapro and 50 Mg Seroquel until Lexapro Pooped Out. Cross tapered to Prozac 20 mg and it was not helping.  
02/2018 cross tapered to 10 mg Cymbalta with 50 mg seroquel
04/2019 reduces to 2 or 3 beads of Cymbalta and stopped. Continued 25 mg seroquel
07/15/2019 Crashed
Current 22.5 mg Remeron, 75 mg of seroquel, and 625 mg of Depakote

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Tom.

 

You've had a succession of withdrawal syndrome, adverse drug reactions, withdrawal syndrome, etc. What we see is that people's nervous systems become hypersensitive after a series of psychiatric drug adverse events.

 

To help us out, please move your med timeline into your signature via these instructions <a href="https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/18343-please-put-your-withdrawal-history-in-your-signature/">Please put your drug and withdrawal history in your signature </a>  You may need to use a computer to do this.

 

On 10/18/2019 at 11:50 AM, TomSawyer50 said:

on 07/18/2019 started Remeron 15 mg and was using 50 seroquel.  For two weeks this helped but I needed more improvement so Psych put me back on 2.5 mg of lexapro increasing to 7.5 mg for 4 weeks until we decided it wasn’t working at all. Cross tapered to viibryd up to 15 mg for 4 weeks and it didnt work. Have since been off Viibryd, increased seroquel to 200 (crazy suicidal thoughts) decreased back to 75 mg, started depakote 250mg at 7:30 am and 375  mg at 7:30 pm, and increased Remeron to 22.5 mg. 
The addition of Depakote was due to an appointment with a neurologist who suggested that my seizure might have damaged brain cells which caused anxiety/panic. At some point I was improving with either the Remeron Increase or the Depakote bu I have no Idea. I have fried my CNS for now, barely sleep, and anxious most of the time. 

My crash on 07/15/2019 was due to protracted withdrawal and drinking too much 2-3 times a week.   

 

My take is your spells of anxiety or panic were due to drug withdrawal effects, not seizure-related. Use of alcohol may be involved.

 

You will not be able to drink any alcohol while you are recovering from adverse psychiatric drug effects, or you risk a severe setback. Are you willing to stop using alcohol?

 

In July, you found 15mg Remeron and 50mg Seroquel helpful. What were you trying to treat with the additional drugs? Did the Depakote help?

 

What times of day do you take your drugs, at what dosages? What is your sleep schedule?

 

 

[TomSawyer50]

56 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

Welcome, Tom.

 

You've had a succession of withdrawal syndrome, adverse drug reactions, withdrawal syndrome, etc. What we see is that people's nervous systems become hypersensitive after a series of psychiatric drug adverse events.

 

To help us out, please move your med timeline into your signature via these instructions <a href="https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/18343-please-put-your-withdrawal-history-in-your-signature/">Please put your drug and withdrawal history in your signature </a>  You may need to use a computer to do this.

 

 

My take is your spells of anxiety or panic were due to drug withdrawal effects, not seizure-related. Use of alcohol may be involved.

 

You will not be able to drink any alcohol while you are recovering from adverse psychiatric drug effects, or you risk a severe setback. Are you willing to stop using alcohol?

 

In July, you found 15mg Remeron and 50mg Seroquel helpful. What were you trying to treat with the additional drugs? Did the Depakote help?

 

What times of day do you take your drugs, at what dosages? What is your sleep schedule?

 

 

Thank you for the response. I quit drinking as of 07/15/2019. 
At first the 15 mg of Remeron helped but i just wasnt where I wanted to be so my Psych wanted to add something else. I think now the Remeron has pooped. 
We tried the depakote to see if my problems were from my seizure.  Per the Neurologist it might help if i had brain cells firing differently then others. My anxiety may have gotten better sense.  
My depression is awful now with suicidal thoughts daily.

Sleep is okay some days and bad other days. Typical day would be:

7:30 am take 250 Mg depakote

7:30 pm 375 mg depakote 

8:45 pm 22.5 mg remeron and 75 mg of seroquel

8:45-9:30 Read bible and pray assuming I can focus

9:30 laydown and watch tv until eyes get heavy

most nights ill wake up 3-5 times bad nights every 45 min-every hour 7-9 times. Real bad nights cant fall asleep.

I have noticed i am peeing a lot which is weird for me.  

 

[Altostrata]

Why are you taking Remeron and Seroquel at the same time? When did you increase to 75mg Seroquel?

 

Seroquel is a drug that's high-risk for adverse effects. When did increased urination start?

 

Please put ALL your drugs in the Drug Interactions Checker https://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php
and copy and paste the results or a link to them in this topic.

 

You'll want to minimize doses.

[TomSawyer50]

I have been on Seroquel since 2012 at 25-50 mg.  During this crash Psych increased up to 200 mg with crazy inner restlessness and suicidal thoughts all the way back to 75 mg.  200-75 mg updose was less than a week.

I tried to explain all this in signature but too many lines

[Altostrata]

Do you mean the crash in July? What were your symptoms then, before increasing Seroquel?

 

Why was Seroquel added in 2012?

[TomSawyer50]

Crash was 7/15/2019 Insomnia, overwhelming worry, crying, suicidal thoughts. Probably Cymbalta withdrawal as I had tapered (slowest taper I had done ever) finally discontinuing in April 2019
Seroquel was added as an anxiety adjunct and to help sleep in 2012. 

 

[TomSawyer50]

Oh and peeing started last 3-4 weeks.  May correspond with starting depakote but just figured it was anxiety 

[TomSawyer50]

@Altostrata do you think its better to get stable via a different drug and taper as I think the paxil has pooped out or start tapering now?  How would I know if the remeron has pooped?Any opinion about this still being Cymbalta wd 6 months later?

[TomSawyer50]

Remeron not Paxil

[TomSawyer50]

Edit fixed

@Altostrata do you think its better to get stable via a different drug and taper as I think the Remeron has pooped out or start tapering now?  How would I know if the remeron has pooped?Any opinion about this still being Cymbalta wd 6 months later?

[Altostrata]

Still looking for the drug interactions report, as requested.

[TomSawyer50]

All moderate

https://www.drugs.com/interactions-check.php?drug_list=918-484,1979-1274,1640-1015

[Altostrata]

One thing drug consumers need to do is review adverse effects of every drug they take. This is readily found on reputable Web sites such as drugs.com

 

Frequent urination is listed among Depakote's side effects.

 

You feel you have had improvement since taking Depakote, is that correct?

 

It appears you have seen at least one psychiatrist and neurologist, what have they said about your drug history and current problems?

[TomSawyer50]

Yes I had seen that about the Depakote. Thought it was that or increased anxiety.

Psych says there is no proof of long-term AD use creating problems. Ohhhh if he would just read here. Neurologist thinks if I could make it 6 months without ad use brain may get back to normal function assuming nothing happened with seizure. I thought maybe the depakote was helping but about the same time or close after Remeron was increased to 22.5 mg.  However last few days i seem to be getting more anxious with obsessive worrying which is why I think the Remeron maybe pooping.

[Altostrata]

What is your dosage history with Depakote, when did you start it, when did you last increase it? Please add this to your signature.

 

This seems the more astute opinion to me. Psychiatrists will keep adding drugs to your cocktail until your heart stops.

 

On 10/22/2019 at 11:46 AM, TomSawyer50 said:

Neurologist thinks if I could make it 6 months without ad use brain may get back to normal function assuming nothing happened with seizure.

 

I need to see more daily notes, at least 24 hours at a time. Please use this format:

 

Quote

6 a.m. Woke with anxiety
8 a.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
10 a.m. Stomach is upset
10:30 a.m. Ate breakfast
11:35 a.m. Got a headache, lasted one hour
12:35 p.m. Ate lunch
4 p.m. Feel a bit better
5 p.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
6 p.m. Ate dinner
9:20 p.m. Headache
10:00 p.m. Took 50mg Seroquel
10:20 p.m. Feeling dizzy
10:30 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. Woke, took 3mg Ambien (NOT "took 1/2 tablet Ambien")
2:45 a.m. Fell asleep
4:30 a.m. Woke but got back to sleep

 

[TomSawyer50]

On 10/22/2019 at 2:46 PM, TomSawyer50 said:

 

7:30 pm took 500 mg of depakote (increased from 375 mg)

9:00 p.m. took 30 mg of Remeron (increase from 22.5 mg) and 50 mg of seroquel (decrease from 75 mg)
10:00 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. woke to pee
2:45 a.m. back asleep
4:30 a.m woke to pee

4:45 am back to sleep

6:30 a.m. Woke with anxious and low
7:30 a.m. Took 250 mg of depKote and 1000 mg fish oil. Had yogurt and decaf coffee

8:45 am at work fighting anxiety and low thoughts
10 a.m. Anxiousness calmed down. Depression dread and worry still there
11:35 a.m. Drove home and had lunch 
12:35 p.m. Returned to work. Still worrying and low
2:45 p.m. Typing info on SA
5 p.m. 
6 p.m. 
.

[TomSawyer50]

Depakote was started probably mid September. Increased to 250 mg in the morning and 500 mg in the evening. 
I have been on the Remeron since July and 99% sure its pooped out. How fast can I taper off of this. I think its causing more problems than helping

[TomSawyer50]

On 10/24/2019 at 1:49 PM, Altostrata said:

What is your dosage history with Depakote, when did you start it, when did you last increase it? Please add this to your signature.

 

This seems the more astute opinion to me. Psychiatrists will keep adding drugs to your cocktail until your heart stops.

 

 

I need to see more daily notes, at least 24 hours at a time. Please use this format:

 

 

See above. Cant figure out how to quote someone 

[rola]

45 minutes ago, TomSawyer50 said:

See above. Cant figure out how to quote someone 

 

Hi @TomSawyer50 you quote someone with @ and the no of the person like this goodbye

 

if that's what you're asking😉

[TomSawyer50]

I think i got it after i posted that but thanks

[Rhiannon]

On 10/22/2019 at 11:46 AM, TomSawyer50 said:

 

Psych says there is no proof of long-term AD use creating problems. 

 

GRRR every time I hear this I want to say: Ask him to show you the scientific studies showing that there is no evidence of long term AD use causing problems. Ask him if he practices evidence-based medicine, and if so where is the evidence that long-term AD use does not cause withdrawal or other problems. Not his opinions, or the opinions of others, but actual valid published studies proving that long-term AD use is safe.

 

He will have NOTHING. Because those studies have never been done. He's talking through some orifice that is not his mouth.

[TomSawyer50]

@Rhiannon thoughts on need to slowly taper the Remeron as I think its pooped out and only been on since July?

[Altostrata]

Sorry for the misunderstanding, we need to see daily notes for several days in a row, not just once.

 

On 10/24/2019 at 11:52 AM, TomSawyer50 said:

7:30 pm took 500 mg of depakote (increased from 375 mg)

9:00 p.m. took 30 mg of Remeron (increase from 22.5 mg) and 50 mg of seroquel (decrease from 75 mg)
10:00 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. woke to pee
2:45 a.m. back asleep
4:30 a.m woke to pee

4:45 am back to sleep

6:30 a.m. Woke with anxious and low
7:30 a.m. Took 250 mg of depKote and 1000 mg fish oil. Had yogurt and decaf coffee

8:45 am at work fighting anxiety and low thoughts
10 a.m. Anxiousness calmed down. Depression dread and worry still there
11:35 a.m. Drove home and had lunch 
12:35 p.m. Returned to work. Still worrying and low
2:45 p.m. Typing info on SA
5 p.m. 
6 p.m. 
.

 

After discussing how Depakote could affect urination, you increased the dose on 10/24. You also increased Remeron and decrease Seroquel. Why did you do that?

 

Do you usually vary the dosages in your cocktail on the fly?

[TomSawyer50]

@Altostrata Urination has gotten better. I saw a thread on here today how 2 people months out from DCing Cymbalta were frequent urinating.

All my increases on Remeron and decreases have been Dr suggested.
The increase and drop in Remeron were done to see if it would help for 1 week as it was not working at 15 or 22.5 mg. It didnt sooo we are tapering it hence my question about how fast to taper a pooped out drug that I have been on since July 2019.  
Increases in the seroquel from 50 mg to 100 mg up to 200 mg were all done over a short period per doctor suggestion. Increases above 100 mg gave me suicidal thought and some inner restlessness at times. i wanted to get back to my normal dose of 50 mg since it was giving me problems. Im sure these increases and decreases are not helping anything but Im just trying to get somewhat stable. 
I dont really have a pattern and am sleeping pretty good now even with the up doses and decreased doses.

My main symptoms are weepiness. I cry over everything which is not me. Worry alot. PanickY which is why I started Paxil. 
The depression is bad which is something I never thought I had. I have no interest in doing things I love and commitments stress me out
 

[TomSawyer50]

11/5 pattern

7:30 pm took 500 mg depakote

7:45 bathed kids and put them to bed

8:30 played video games for 30 minutes (noticed i was quite irritable)

9:00 took 22.5 mg of Remeron and 50 mg of seroquel-Watched TV for 30-45 minutes 

10:00 asleep and slept good only waking a few times

5:30 am awoke anxious with a little racing thoughts and laid there dozing in and out until 7:15. 
7:30 got dressed ate yogurt took 250 mg depakote, 1400 mg fish oil, and 100 mg of magnesium citrate (day 1)

8:00 noticed chest and stomach are stiff/tight from anxiety and battling anxious thoughts

 

[Altostrata]

This is a site for going off drugs. Not sure how we can help you if you are increasing drugs instead. If you like your drug cocktail, please continue working with your doctor and convey your complaints to him or her.

 

You seem to be a normal working person who is taking a cocktail of highly risky drugs usually prescribed for people who are psychotic. If I were you, I'd look up the side effects of each of your drugs.

 

FYI At least you could inform yourself about drug-drug reactions. Please put ALL your drugs in the Drug Interactions Checker https://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php
and copy and paste the results or a link to them in this topic.

[TomSawyer50]

3 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

This is a site for going off drugs. Not sure how we can help you if you are increasing drugs instead. If you like your drug cocktail, please continue working with your doctor and convey your complaints to him or her.

As i have said above im trying to get stable. I want off drugs. 

[Altostrata]

20 hours ago, TomSawyer50 said:

@Altostrata Urination has gotten better. I saw a thread on here today how 2 people months out from DCing Cymbalta were frequent urinating.

All my increases on Remeron and decreases have been Dr suggested.
The increase and drop in Remeron were done to see if it would help for 1 week as it was not working at 15 or 22.5 mg. It didnt sooo we are tapering it hence my question about how fast to taper a pooped out drug that I have been on since July 2019.  
Increases in the seroquel from 50 mg to 100 mg up to 200 mg were all done over a short period per doctor suggestion. Increases above 100 mg gave me suicidal thought and some inner restlessness at times. i wanted to get back to my normal dose of 50 mg since it was giving me problems. Im sure these increases and decreases are not helping anything but Im just trying to get somewhat stable. 
I dont really have a pattern and am sleeping pretty good now even with the up doses and decreased doses.

My main symptoms are weepiness. I cry over everything which is not me. Worry alot. PanickY which is why I started Paxil. 
The depression is bad which is something I never thought I had. I have no interest in doing things I love and commitments stress me out
 

 

Since you made a change in 3 drugs at once, you're going to have to wait and see what the effect will be on your symptom pattern. This could take a couple of weeks.

 

I cannot make any suggestions that will immediately relieve your symptoms, your nervous system is now in flux from the drug changes. Adverse effects from the drug combination may emerge. You'll have to track this yourself, I'm not going to monitor you day by day when you increase dosages. It's not my job to fine-tune your cocktail. Please confer with your doctor, who should know better than to change 3 drugs at the same time.

 

Your doctor should also be aware you need regular liver and kidney tests to monitor potential organ damage from Depakote and the drug-drug interactions, plus blood sugar tests for Seroquel, which can cause diabetes.

 

Please come back in two weeks and post at least 24 hours of your symptom pattern at a time. You may not think you have a symptom pattern, but to answer your questions, I need to see your daily symptom pattern.