Scared4: Mirtazapine withdrawal??

[Scared4]

Hi

please could someone help me.

i have been off of Mirtazapine for 10 weeks now.

Insomnia has hit me really hard for the past 4 weeks, I don’t know what to do with myself. Most nights I get no sleep, other nights I get 1-2 hours. 
I was only on Mirt for a short time. I’m scared I will not return to normal and have done myself permanent damage. Can anyone offer me some much needed reassurance.

I have realised that I came off too quickly (followed my doctors instructions). Thank you 

Edited May 1 by Emonda
Name to title

[Emonda]

Welcome @Scared4,

 

6 hours ago, Scared4 said:

i have been off of Mirtazapine for 10 weeks now.

 

6 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I have realised that I came off too quickly (followed my doctors instructions).

 

Slow is definitely the way to go when tapering off ADs: Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

Unfortunately the advice from your GP to stop CT was not helpful. The likely outcome is unpleasant WD symptoms, and insomnia is one of those symptoms: Daily Checklist of Antidepressant Withdrawal Symptoms (PDF) 

 

6 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I’m scared I will not return to normal and have done myself permanent damage. Can anyone offer me some much needed reassurance.

 

You haven't done permanent damage, and you will recover with time and patience. For a little reassurance, pop over to the Success Stories section.

 

As to the sleep issues, I find this a little helpful: Melatonin for sleep.

 

This is your own Introduction topic.  Each member has only ONE Introduction topic.  Your own Introduction topic is the best place to ask questions and the place to journal your progress.  This keeps your history in one place and means you do not have to repeat your story. 

 

Once again, welcome to S.A.

 

Emonda

 

 

 

[Scared4]

Thank you for replying 

 

im already taking 2mg of melatonin.

 

I’ve read that this can go on for months or years, that thought absolutely terrifies me. 
 

Is it unusual for withdrawal to hit 6 weeks after stopping? Everyone around me tells me they would be out of my system by now? 

[Najla]

قبل 7 ساعات، قال Scared4:

مرحبا

من فضلك هل يمكن لأحد أن يساعدني.

لقد خرجت من ميرتازابين لمدة 10 أسابيع حتى الآن.

لقد ضربني الأرق بشدة خلال الأسابيع الأربعة الماضية، لا أعرف ماذا أفعل بنفسي. في معظم الليالي لا أنام، وفي الليالي الأخرى أحصل على 1-2 ساعات.
كنت فقط على ميرت لفترة قصيرة. أنا خائف من أنني لن أعود إلى طبيعتها وقد تسببت لنفسي في ضرر دائم. هل يمكن لأي شخص أن يقدم لي بعض الطمأنينة التي تشتد الحاجة إليها.

لقد أدركت أنني خرجت بسرعة كبيرة (اتبعت تعليمات أطبائي). شكرا لك

I am not an expert in this, but I wanted to share one point, which is the issue of panic, anxiety, and sleep from my personal experience, and because I am an expert in cognitive behavioral therapy. The best solution in such a situation is to talk to yourself and tell it that everything is fine and that what you are suffering from is just anxiety and do deep breathing exercises on a daily basis, at least twice a day, upon waking up and before going to sleep. I hope you get through this stage quickly

[Scared4]

Should I start taking Mirt again? I can’t do this for months on end

[Emonda]

2 hours ago, Scared4 said:

Is it unusual for withdrawal to hit 6 weeks after stopping

 

Not at all unusual.

 

2 hours ago, Scared4 said:

Everyone around me tells me they would be out of my system by now?

 

A very common misconception. It's about your brain readjusting to life without the drug...and that takes time.

[Emonda]

28 minutes ago, Scared4 said:

Should I start taking Mirt again? I can’t do this for months on end

 

I can't quite work out how long you took Mirt for. What was the exact date you started taking 15mg?

 

I can see you stopped it CT on Dec 27. Then you restarted two weeks later for two weeks at 7.5mg, then two weeks at 3.75mg.

 

Why did you stop after that? Did you have some sort of adverse response?

 

Here's some info for you to read:

 

About Reinstating and Stabilizing to Reduce Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Kindling

 

 

 

 

 

[Scared4]

Sorry I have just updated my info so it’s much more specific, apologies for not doing it sooner, I was in a panic at the time.

 

I’m so grateful for you to be looking over this for me, thank you.

 

Ideally I would prefer to not take it again, do you think because I wasn’t on it for that long it shouldn’t last for months on end or does it not work that way? 

[Scared4]

I stopped because it made every joint in my body hurt and I felt sedated all day. 
When I first started antidepressants in November it was because I was worried about a health concern, this has now come and gone and isn’t a worry any longer so l feel like I no longer need the medication.

 

 

[Emonda]

19 hours ago, Scared4 said:

Sorry I have just updated my info so it’s much more specific

 

Many thanks.

 

19 hours ago, Scared4 said:

do you think because I wasn’t on it for that long it shouldn’t last for months on end

 

I'd like to say 100% that's the case, but everyone responds differently. I've read that you can become dependent on ADs after 4 weeks.

 

17 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I stopped because it made every joint in my body hurt

 

If you restart, you may end up with this or something else. Again, we all respond differently. I developed tinnitus at the same time I reinstated, and I still have it years later.

 

17 hours ago, Scared4 said:

When I first started antidepressants in November it was because I was worried about a health concern, this has now come and gone and isn’t a worry any longer so l feel like I no longer need the medication.

 

 

Only you know how bad you feel and if you can ride it out. Have a read of the reinstating/kindling links...but unfortunately I can't say one way or the other what you should do. At ten weeks off, I've seen others reinstate 1mg or less, but on different ADs? But it's just a guess.

 

If you'd been on the AD for years, and had been off it for a few weeks, then reinstating would be a worthy consideration. From what I can see, you took it for 6 weeks, stopped for 4 weeks, then took half the dose for 2 weeks and a 1/4 dose for 2 weeks.

 

I'm sorry I can't be more helpful. You will improve with time and patience.

 

Emonda

 

 

[Scared4]

Thank you for your reply.

I’m sorry to hear you still have tinnitus, these drugs are so dangerous! If you have been left with this I am wondering if it is possible that I will be left with insomnia.

 

I read lots of success stories, a common theme is that it took these people years to get better. I just can’t imagine going on this way for a year or more! How brave they are! 
 

The last couple of days I feel sick and can’t eat, it seems I’m not at the peak of this yet. 

[Scared4]

Update

I’m at 3 months off now. Things have progressively got worse. Lots of nights with zero sleep, struggling to eat as I feel so sick, anxiety through the roof! I am going to ring the doctors tomorrow to see about reinstating as I just can’t keep this up. Any advice how much to reinstate? I’m so scared to reinstate but equally I can’t cope with this any longer. 

[Scared4]

Hi

 

the gp has given me sleeping tablets for 4 nights.

If that doesn’t reset my sleep I will reinstate, has anyone got any advice for how much I should??

[Scared4]

Can anyone offer any advice as to how much to reinstate or think of a different AD? I really could do with some advice from someone more knowledgeable than me. After reading stories on here I don’t trust doctor’s recommendations but equally I’m not getting any advice here, I don’t know which way to turn. Anyone with any experience please comment. Thank you 

[Emonda]

On 5/29/2024 at 3:59 PM, Scared4 said:

gp has given me sleeping tablets for 4 nights.

 

Be very careful with these. Do you only have 4 tablets? If so, that's good. People can become dependent on these very quickly.

 

15 minutes ago, Scared4 said:

Can anyone offer any advice as to how much to reinstate

 

As I have said previously, there are no guarantees this far out.

 

If you have decided to try to reinstate, then less is best. As in <0.5mg.

 

I can't say if it'll be beneficial or not. Maybe you will respond well, maybe you won't respond well.

 

Trying another AD is not our domain. This site can't recommend a new AD. It could be a gamble to add somethign new to your system.

 

22 minutes ago, Scared4 said:

don’t trust doctor’s recommendations

 

What are they recommending?

 

22 minutes ago, Scared4 said:

but equally I’m not getting any advice here

 

Maybe go back to the start of your thread...

 

You said:

 

On 5/1/2024 at 11:18 PM, Scared4 said:

I stopped because it made every joint in my body hurt and I felt sedated all day. 

 

On 5/1/2024 at 9:56 PM, Scared4 said:

Ideally I would prefer to not take it again,

 

I provide some info on reinstating and kindling, but respected the concerns you raised above.

 

I hope this helps.

[Scared4]

Thank you for your responses

 

yes, I only have the 4 sleeping pills

 

just got off the phone from the doctors. She has recommended I start a new antidepressant (this scares me).

 

I think I will reinstate. I just need to work out logistically how I will do this, it’s so hard to work out. Even if they were to give me the liquid it’s 15 per ml. How do i get to a 0.5 measure. 
 

im finding this all so overwhelming and yet to see any improvement in my withdrawals.

 

will I ever be able to sleep again unmediated? I feel like I have ruined my life 

 

 

[Emonda]

16 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I think I will reinstate. I just need to work out logistically how I will do this, it’s so hard to work out. Even if they were to give me the liquid it’s 15 per ml. How do i get to a 0.5 measure. 

 

This link should be helpful:

 

 

16 hours ago, Scared4 said:

will I ever be able to sleep again unmediated?

 

Sleep problems are a common WD symptoms. I struggle with it, too. I find melatonin helpful.

 

16 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I feel like I have ruined my life 

 

Not it all. Better days are always ahead. With time and patience, you'll improve.

[Scared4]

Complete panic

 

I’m embarrassed to say I did something stupid.

 

i had had enough last night, i took quarter of a tablet before bed. Against all advise, I’m ashamed. 
it gets worse, after only sleeping 2 hours I took another quarter. Then was awake feeling anxious and now I’m spiralling that I’ve messed up my body further. 
 

I’m sorry I didn’t follow advice, I felt absolutely desperate 

 

should I now stick with half a tablet before bed until I stabilise? 
 

Now I’m better informed I will taper as directed in the future.

 

Is there a rough timescale before I get stable on 7.5?

 

I can’t go in this way! I really can’t 

 

[WillBeHereTomorrow]

1 hour ago, Scared4 said:

Complete panic

 

I’m embarrassed to say I did something stupid.

It's okay, we all tend to do things we regret when we are desperate.

 

1 hour ago, Scared4 said:

i had had enough last night, i took quarter of a tablet before bed. Against all advise, I’m ashamed. 

it gets worse, after only sleeping 2 hours I took another quarter. Then was awake feeling anxious and now I’m spiralling that I’ve messed up my body further.

 

I'm assuming you're talking about the mirtazapine and not other sleeping tablets right?

 

1 hour ago, Scared4 said:

should I now stick with half a tablet before bed until I stabilise? 

 

Now I’m better informed I will taper as directed in the future.

 

Is there a rough timescale before I get stable on 7.5?

 

I can’t go in this way! I really can’t 

 

 

I can't really give you any hard advice only small suggestions. This is a form of reinstatement, but you don't necessarily have to continue at the dose of 7.5 mg. What symtoms are you experiencing after this one time dose 7.5 mg?

 

It's not too late to lower the dose and start treating this as a slow reinstatement attempt. As suggested earlier, you can weigh the dose on a scale or make a liquid to accurately get 0.5 mg. Did you read the suggested links that were posted earlier?

 

I'll tag @Emonda for you, he might have some more input for you.

 

Breathe, everything will be alright. You're in a pickle now but better times are ahead!

 

-WBHT

[Scared4]

Yes, i reinstated mirtazapine not sleeping pills.

 

Thank you for responding.

 

Do you think I have kindling now? 
 

yes I read the links, I didn’t have any of the equipment and made a last min decision. I can’t get the equipment today on a Sunday either. 
 

I just can’t see a way out at the moment.

i look at my children and just cry, I need to get  better for them but am so very broken

[Scared4]

Could I try and stay on 7.5 for a while and try a stabilise there? 

I know for the future to carefully taper off, I just really need to stabilise and have a break for a few months. 

[WillBeHereTomorrow]

10 hours ago, Scared4 said:

I just can’t see a way out at the moment.

i look at my children and just cry, I need to get  better for them but am so very broken

 

I understand. I have felt the same the last few months. Worrying about myself, my health and how to parent while going through withdrawal. It's not easy. It's very difficult to think clearly when sleep deprived and in withdrawal.

 

10 hours ago, Scared4 said:

yes I read the links, I didn’t have any of the equipment and made a last min decision. I can’t get the equipment today on a Sunday either.

 

10 hours ago, Scared4 said:

Could I try and stay on 7.5 for a while and try a stabilise there? 

I know for the future to carefully taper off, I just really need to stabilise and have a break for a few months. 

 

This is a decision that you will have to make for yourself, I can't do that for you. When I read through the thread I got the impression that you don't really want to be on Mirtazapine due to bad side effects. But at the same that you can't handle the withdrawal induced insomnia after tapering off quickly. The idea of a small reinstatement dose seemed to be the middle way and it also mitigates risks.

 

A reinstatement is usually done in a conservative manner. Partly to lessen the risk of further disturbing the nervous system and partly so you don't end up on a large dose that you most likely want to taper off sometimes later. If you start off low and things go well you can always up the dose a few days or weeks later in order to find a sweet spot.

 

As I said it's not too late to lower the dose, if you're feeling worse off after this one time dose at least lower the dose as much as you can. But it's up to you. Remember that you can get the equipment you need tomorrow or sometimes next week if you want to try a smaller dose. You have options.

 

I wish you all the best and hopefully you'll find some rest soon.

[Faure]

How are you feeling on 7.5mg?

 

How are sleep, anxiety, nausea?

[Scared4]

I slept terrible but maybe if I kept it up it would work?

 

spoke to another doctor today who said to start Amitriptyline tomorrow as a alternative to mirtazapine. I don’t love Mirt but would take that over what I’m feeling right now. Is it better the devil you know or should I try a new one? 

[marie123]

Hello. I would not try a new med. I do not think it will cover the symptoms you are feeling. You would also get another set of side effects.

 

There is a private facebook group called Mirtazapine warriors. It's very active and you can find info about mirt.

 

Marie

[Faure]

How are the anxiety and nausea? How is eating? How are you emotionally? How is fatigue - is it normal from lack of sleep or different? 

 

When I had this problem I reinstated the original mirtazepine dose (15mg). It did not work as a magic bullet, so don’t whatever you do, do that. It took over a year to stabilise emotionally and for 2 years I was so fatigued I could barely do anything. I worked a few hours a week at home. (Things started getting slowly better as soon as I started my taper using guidelines on here. Now I’m on 1mg and the end is in sight.)

 

Sleep didn’t improve till I had about a week on 5mg diazepam to help me sleep. That did work to reset my sleep which was then fine. Once sleep was good eating also improved. They are linked. As soon as the diazepam stopped working to help with sleep (tolerance) I stopped it so I didn’t get addicted. 
 

You might find something to help reset sleep plus a small reinstatement will work, as it did with me. But there are no guarantees. You should get out early in the day to expose your eyes to morning light, that will help reset your circadian rhythm. (Body clock)

 

Whatever you do don’t start a new anti depressant. Doctors tend to put people on a merry go round of drugs and then kindling really can set in, there is nothing to solve this apart from time.  
 

If I were you I’d pick a low mirtazepine dose, have a few nights with something to help you sleep and see how it goes. What you must not do is jump about with dosing to try to find the ideal dose. 
 

Please answer all my questions at the top of this post. I will check in later today. 

Edited June 3 by Faure

[Emonda]

On 6/2/2024 at 3:05 PM, Scared4 said:

I’m embarrassed to say I did something stupid.

 

Don't lose sleep over it. I know what it's like to feel desperate, and you just want relief. As above, a small reinstatement would have been preferable.

 

On 6/2/2024 at 4:43 PM, Scared4 said:

Could I try and stay on 7.5 for a while and try a stabilise there?

 

I'm with WillBeHereTomorrow as per below:

 

18 hours ago, WillBeHereTomorrow said:

This is a decision that you will have to make for yourself, I can't do that for you. When I read through the thread I got the impression that you don't really want to be on Mirtazapine due to bad side effects. But at the same that you can't handle the withdrawal induced insomnia after tapering off quickly. The idea of a small reinstatement dose seemed to be the middle way and it also mitigates risks.

 

A reinstatement is usually done in a conservative manner. Partly to lessen the risk of further disturbing the nervous system and partly so you don't end up on a large dose that you most likely want to taper off sometimes later. If you start off low and things go well you can always up the dose a few days or weeks later in order to find a sweet spot.

 

As I said it's not too late to lower the dose, if you're feeling worse off after this one time dose at least lower the dose as much as you can. But it's up to you. Remember that you can get the equipment you need tomorrow or sometimes next week if you want to try a smaller dose.

 

Great words.

 

18 hours ago, Scared4 said:

another doctor today who said to start Amitriptyline tomorrow as a alternative to mirtazapine.

 

I've changed ADs 3 times over the years. Based on my experience, I'd not recommend it.

 

On 6/2/2024 at 4:32 PM, Scared4 said:

I just can’t see a way out at the moment.

i look at my children and just cry, I need to get  better for them but am so very broken

 

Better days are always ahead 🙂

 

I'm sorry for my slow reply, I try to stay off the computer on Sundays (when you posted in my time zone).