John Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 After "recovering" from Dr Shipko's hopeless article, I did some more research for some kind of hope and came across this: http://www.cchrflorida.org/blog/ssri-withdrawal-effects-are-brutal-and-long-lasting/ Now I don't know if this site/and or the study is legit, but man, it scares the hell out of me, as I had the initial symptoms then 8 weeks later the hell began. Anyone see this article, and whats your opinion on it? When I first went cold turkey, I went through hell and symptoms were much worse than they are now which is 3 years later, although im still tapering. Wouldnt that disprove (for me anyway) that theory of it staying forever? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 26, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 26, 2013 That site is sponsored by Scientology. We have a discussion of the article it references: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3132-belaise-2012-patient-online-report-of-selective-serotonin-reuptake-inhibitor-induced-persistent-postwithdrawal-anxiety-and-mood-disorders/ This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meimeiquest Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Well, that's pretty much our world. BUT the knowledge and context we face it with are so important. I was thinking about that As I was hyperventilating and my heart was racing 2 nights ago. I was not anxious at all, I just knew I had inexplicably thrown my autonomic nervous system somehow, and I was trying to think how we would get my kids through Christmas if I was sick or too tired, should I change any thing about the blood pressure drug I'm tapering. I hate it, but I didn't think it was scary or unusual. But I have made 3 expensive trips to the ER in my life as a psych patient due to issues of side effects or WD symptoms that I didn't understand....it is education and perspective that made this episode different. This is the only place I know of that is smart and realistic, yet optimistic..and offers 24/7 services! I think the whole perspective of withdrawal needs to be more like childbirth...yes, it's risky, but most of the focus is on receiving a whole new person. 1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms. Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12 Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13 Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15 11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble) 9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol 7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol 56 years old Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted December 26, 2013 Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 That site is sponsored by Scientology. We have a discussion of the article it references: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3132-belaise-2012-patient-online-report-of-selective-serotonin-reuptake-inhibitor-induced-persistent-postwithdrawal-anxiety-and-mood-disorders/Maybe I'm stupid, but this means there's truth to this article? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 26, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 26, 2013 Read the article and decide for yourself what it's saying. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted December 26, 2013 Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 Read the article and decide for yourself what it's saying. This article is the same article as the one I posted in the original post. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted December 26, 2013 Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 Read the article and decide for yourself what it's saying. Actually, isnt this the same article, except for the part that says that it's permanent? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudius Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 The article is shocking but does not tell much new. We all know already that getting off an SSRIl especially cold turkey, can trigger a horrendous and long lasting WD which can leave you as a wreck for years. I suffer from WD now for more than 6 years but there is also progression and I see no reason why recovery cannot continue even after many years. 10 mg Paxil/Seroxat since 2002 several attempts to quit since 2004 Quit c/t again Oktober 2007, in protracted w/d since then after 3.5 years slight improvement but still on the road after 6 years pretty much recovered but still some nasty residual sypmtons after 8.5 years working again on a 90% base and basically functioning normally again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 26, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 26, 2013 One article is an interpretation of the other. It's like a game of telephone. The message gets more and more distorted as subsequent people interpret it. (The original source is called the primary source. The interpreters are called secondary sources. In this case, the original researchers were interpreting anecdotal reports on Web sites -- again, adding their interpretation.) Is there any reason why a site allied with Scientology would exaggerate the bad news? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted December 26, 2013 Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 One article is an interpretation of the other. It's like a game of telephone. The message gets more and more distorted as subsequent people interpret it.(The original source is called the primary source. The interpreters are called secondary sources.In this case, the original researchers were interpreting anecdotal reports on Web sites -- again, adding their interpretation.)Is there any reason why a site allied with Scientology would exaggerate the bad news? So the article I posted was the secondary which got somewhat distorted by republishing Scientology's article, which doesnt list the symptoms as permanent in some people. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 26, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 26, 2013 Maybe. There is no question that some people have a lot more difficulty in tapering than others. It's a normal curve, with a small number having extreme problems on the right side of the curve. There is no reason to expect you will be one of this minority. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted December 26, 2013 Author Share Posted December 26, 2013 Maybe.There is no question that some people have a lot more difficulty in tapering than others. It's a normal curve, with a small number having extreme problems on the right side of the curve.There is no reason to expect you will be one of this minority. Sure feels like it. I was doing almost "perfect" for months until this past November, which feels like it did almost when I went cold turkey 3 years ago (but not quite as severe). On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted December 26, 2013 Administrator Share Posted December 26, 2013 Try not to expect the worst. You get the distress for all the time of your expectation plus, if it happens, doom itself. Why dwell on what may or may not be? You might as well expect a better outcome. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts