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Muscle and joint stiffness, aches, and pain

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Chicago77

Catnapt, do you still have pain. I too have pain in my right arm and leg constantly. Sometimes I will get little bursts of pain in other parts of my body. I'm super stiff and feel like a 100 yr old woman walking around. I can't tell if it's muscle pain or nerve pain. I had a MRI and it came back normal, but I'm still worried because it's not going away. I've been off Lexapro for 3 1/2 months now. Does anyone know if this is normal?

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SquirrellyGirl

I get those shooting bursts of pain, too, Chicago, but not often enough to do anything about it, just observe and think "well, that's interesting..and, ow!"  I've had them to where in a toe, a finger, a spot on a leg, sometimes enough that I need to rub it, but usually very short lived.  I've also had those weird muscle spasms where a spot in a muscle will vibrate like a pulse, sometimes for a few beats, pause, a few more beats.  Had that last night in a tricep muscle.  Get them under the eye as well.  Again, short-lived stuff.  I just thought it was something that everyone got now and again!  I've been on meds so long I can't remember if I got those before meds.  

 

I am stiff, too, and joints pop all the time when getting up, ankles and knees in particular.  I'm 51, so am not yet ready to attribute it to age LOL!

 

SG

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grandmaD

I just posted in my journal and then remembered that I could search stuff and found this!  So good!  Squirrelly Girl, I have the same things go on, and like you on the right side being worse.

 

I have had similar muscle spasms in my back in the past.  That is when I would go into panic mode thinking my "original condition" was back, because that is why I went on aropax/paxil in the first place.  It has been absolutely amazing when I would get them and after a year or so when they came, they would go just as suddenly in a day.  That was when I realised it was w/d.  I am wondering if this is a similar thing.

 

What took me by surprise the other day was when I woke up fine, but an hour later, out of the blue got excruciating neck pain and couldn't move my head.  I took painkillers and anti-inflammatorys for a couple of days, along with a hot pack and dencorub.  The severity is gone and I have better head movement, but not completely better yet after 5 days.

 

Added to that, the following day I woke up with severe muscle aching everywhere, mainly my right leg, hip, and butt and my knee so that I couldn't walk!  This was an added shock as it has been ages since I experienced the back spasms, but I do get cramping regularly in my right leg, which I am still not sure is w/d or from my spine.  I guess only time will tell.  After reading your post I am inclined to believe this too, is w/d.

 

It is just so incredible to think that you can still get these things in the 5th year of tapering at 2.5%!!!

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Happy2Heal

wow well I'm relieved I'm not the only one but definitely not HAPPY that so many of us suffer this way

 

I've had a few longish windows lately that  I'm happy about, still have pain but other problems have cleared up, so anytime things are more good than bad, to me, that's a window LOL
 

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Chicago77

Yes I feel a lot of my previous symptoms have gotten a little better, but my pain in my muscles and joints haven't subsided at all. I'm so scared I'm going to be stuck like this forever. Catnapt, do you have the same type of muscle and joint pain? Has it gotten any better? I wonder why withdrawal causes physical pain. Mine is mainly on my right side of my body.

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Happy2Heal

update, I have found that my pain returns when I do two things: #1 Ignore my "good" diet and eat too many unhealthy things or #2 if I 'overdo' it and am a lot more active than normal- like moving things around, walking a lot more or lifting heavy things, etc. I don't usually have pain that same day, it comes a day or two later

 

so I have to learn to pace myself

 

AND not eat donuts, ice cream or chips!! nor even bread and crackers, those are all foods that are not on the diet I TRY to follow (the Nutritarian diet)

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Junglechicken

Catnapt - you mention that you get pain 1-2 days after doing something physical/active.

 

I would say that it is totally NORMAL to get delayed muscle soreness like this; and I'm leaving AD medication completely out of the picture.

 

My experience with early stage AD WD and physical activity, was severe muscle soreness DURING exercise and significant recovery required following, I.e osteopath or physio sessions.

 

Fortunately I am past this stage now, but it was extremely distressing given that I was training for marathons a few weeks earlier.

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Chicago77

Ugh! My joints are killing me. I've never had joint pain until now and I'm so stiff. My elbows are cracking/popping. I feel like a box of rice krispies. I'm in my 30's so I can't really contribute this to old age. I'm starting to think Ive developed arthritis through withdrawal. Not to mention all my fibromyalgia symptoms I have. Widespread pain, chronic fatigue(I mean it literally feels like I have an elephant on my back), insomnia and brain fog. Ahhhhhhh! 

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Lakelander82

I still suffer with bad muscle tension in my back, shoulders and neck. The ONLY things that work for me are a full body massage (which can be pricey) or a front crawl swim. Other forms of exercise such as Yoga, Pilates, running, biking etc do nothing for me in terms of reducing muscle tension. Heavy weights add to the tension.

 

It's strange because my mood will only improve once the tension is removed from the body. When my body is still riddled with tension I could practise positive thinking, mindfulness, CBT etc to the cows come home - they wouldn't make a blind bit of difference.

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ChessieCat

I'm now down to 1/5 of my original dose and still getting very tight calf muscles when walking.  I've also found that at different times I have tight muscles in my body.  My most recent one is down the right hand side of my spine.  Previously I have had very bad tension in my right jaw.  I also had a tight muscle in my right sciatic area.

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Starboy17

I tapered by 5% almost a month ago this coming Sunday from 3ml to 2.8ml of mirtazapine/remeron, the last 2 weeks I've had intense pain in my calf muscles and hamstrings, I just want off this medication as its restricting my entire life, I do get concerned that something else is wrong. Do I just stay on the current dose or proceed with another taper of 5% to 2.6ml as its anyone's guess if the pain will pass regardless of tapering or holidng

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DaveWales

Hi, I was after some other peoples advice about the latest development I am experiencing. To try and help with the withdrawal I was experiencing i tried some vitamins Including vit C, magnesium, vit B (all at recommended doses). However, i started itching all over and stopped all vits 2 weeks ago. The itching stopped and all seemed back to baseline. But, after that I was mountain biking in fairly cold British winter weather. Upon returning home I suddenly developed joint pain in my hands and especially my fingers. since then (approx 2 weeks) I have had all sorts of joint pain in my neck, spine, fingers, hands, feet, knees. I have never experienced anything like this before, and have, in the past ran Ironmans, marathon etc and had no problems even in hard training times. This is currently my most worrying symptom. I am wondering if i have developed athritis as part of withdrawal, or , as i hope beyond words, this is yet another transient symptom. If anyone has any experience of this, or any immune disorder problems in withdrawal I would be most grateful of your advice. Regards Dave 

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UnfoldingSky

Hi Dave,

 

My history is different than yours, but yes I have issues like this too. I get a lot of muscle stiffness, joint pain, injuries too, it is getting really frustrating.  Wondering if anyone out there can explain what psychiatric drugs do to cause issues of this nature? I get injuries doing the smallest things, I feel like I'm a hundred years old!  I've also noticed if I don't pay exceptional attention to posture, I'll pay for it later. 

 

 

 

 

 

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Junglechicken

Yes, I do too, and I used to be a marathoner!

 

I can just about run 5k now, but 2 years ago I was clocking up big weekly mileage.

 

IBS and bladder issues have made it difficult for me to run at all these days :(

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DaveWales

Hi unfolding - thanks for your reply i would be interested in hearing why this happens too. 

 

Junglechicken - do you have any advice? 

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Junglechicken

Well, the thing is, don't give up!

 

We were living in Canada when I went through the worst of the muscle and joint pain, but I found that aqua running and aerobics really helped and was just as strenuous.  I haven't continued with this, as where I live in the UK, there doesn't seem to be much of it around unfortunately.

 

I think the pain is caused by excess cortisol and adrenaline in the body, and there is nowhere for it to go if we don't "release" that nervous energy.

 

And so its rather like lactic acid build up.  We HAVE to find a way to release that energy or we remain in pain.

 

I still advocate that pool based exercises are a winner for people in our situation, as our weight is supported, but we're still expending energy, loosening the muscles up and so minimising injury and maintaining muscle mass.  Very important when you're over 40!

 

 

 

 

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DaveWales

JC- many thanks for the advice there. So, you say the worst of the muscle and joint pain. But you have found that it got better with time? 

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Junglechicken
28 minutes ago, DaveWales said:

JC- many thanks for the advice there. So, you say the worst of the muscle and joint pain. But you have found that it got better with time? 

 

The worst of the muscle and joint pain occurred when I had severe WD.  I re-instated 2 months later as it was unbearable.

 

Even walking was painful, and I had to have months of osteo appointments.

 

Its better, but I've never returned to the fitness level that I had when I was marathon training.  

 

Don't want to discourage you either.

 

I also think that hormonal fluctuations are playing a part in my overall wellbeing.

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Survivor1

Hi Dave,

 

I too developed severe pains after discontinuing 2.4mg mirtazepine 7 months ago.  In the beginning it was debilitating - sciatica, plantar fasciitis-like burning in the feet, sharp pains in thighs and wrists, jaw and tooth pain.

 

There has been some improvement; sciatica is gone, pain in wrists and thighs tolerable, jaw pain occasional, but the fasciitis is still there and hobbles me at times. My limbs are also generally weak, and so I have some difficulty lifting weights and climbing stairs, etc. I also have low exercise tolerance.  I can only walk and not that fast, maybe 3 mph at best. I am hopeful that all will go eventually as I have seen some improvements. 

 

I think passage of time is the only solution ... all the best.

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Junglechicken
11 hours ago, Survivor1 said:

Hi Dave,

 

I too developed severe pains after discontinuing 2.4mg mirtazepine 7 months ago.  In the beginning it was debilitating - sciatica, plantar fasciitis-like burning in the feet, sharp pains in thighs and wrists, jaw and tooth pain.

 

There has been some improvement; sciatica is gone, pain in wrists and thighs tolerable, jaw pain occasional, but the fasciitis is still there and hobbles me at times. My limbs are also generally weak, and so I have some difficulty lifting weights and climbing stairs, etc. I also have low exercise tolerance.  I can only walk and not that fast, maybe 3 mph at best. I am hopeful that all will go eventually as I have seen some improvements. 

 

I think passage of time is the only solution ... all the best.

 

Survivor1,

 

"sciatica, plantar fasciitis-like burning in the feet, sharp pains in thighs and wrists, jaw and tooth pain"

 

I had most of the above, in particular awful sciatica, and deep muscle and nerve pain all the way from my right shoulder down to the tips of my fingers.

 

Been there :(

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Survivor1

JC,

 

Glad to see you are improving.  Didn't know that one could literally become crippled from WD!

 

Best.

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Junglechicken
1 hour ago, Survivor1 said:

JC,

 

Glad to see you are improving.  Didn't know that one could literally become crippled from WD!

 

Best.

 

Yes, it was BAD! 

 

It didn't make sense that I had been marathon training and competing for 3 years and then suddenly got hit with severe nerve, joint and muscle pain.  Fortunately, I wasn't so far gone that I put 2 and 2 together and realised it was because of the ADs.

 

I have right hip pain now, and random pains popping up - all due to stress :huh:

 

IBS still my enemy too.

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DLB

I can't begin to tell you what it did to my muscles. Also, now have psoriatic arthritis which came at withdrawal. Worst thing is my thighs. The muscles feel "sick" that is the only way to explain it. Very hard going up stairs (I used to run up stairs every chance I could) feel like legs are 100 pounds each. Visible loss of muscle. Have patellar pain syndrome from weak quads. It comes and goes over the months in intensity but it is always there. I have not moved faster than a walk in years.

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Hellbutrin

Since C/T from Wellbutrin completely 6 months ago I have noticed that I am beginning to feel very fatigued and sore in random parts of my body. I know that antidepressants can serve as a shield for your body's nerves, so I'm wondering if I'm feeling mild aches and pains that I've had since I've been on the drugs and I just didn't notice them before because the antidepressant was suppressing the nerve pain. Is the fatigue that I've been hit with lately a normal part of withdrawal that slowly dissipates like everything else in withdrawal? Or should I be checking into supplements and trying to exercise more in order to address these issues? Any feedback is welcome, thanks! 

 

My main concern is and will remain to be my extreme withdrawal depression symptoms, but I've come to terms that this symptom is likely going to stick around for a long time, and hopefully when it leaves my intrusive thoughts will go with it. 

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gigi63

Hi Hellbutrin, I must respond to this.  I basically, even though I tapered over 10 months, from Wellbutrin, then crashed, at about 11 mg and did a mild RI, my body has acted as though I CT’d this drug.  At about six months or so into my RI, I began to develop a vast array of nerve and muscle pain. At 21 months into my small RI, still waves and windows, I have various nerve and muscle pain continuing.  It changes and any given day it can lighten or get heavier.  I NEVER had this prior to WD.  If you read people’s stories you will see it is very common.  If you go to the International Antidepressant Withdrawal site and watch their videos on WD and recovery and such, you will see this is common, if you read the Benzo buddy Twin tower analogy you will see this is common.  Quite frankly, all of the morphing symptoms of WD are astounding to me.  However, when one considers the all encompassing effect of theses drugs on our ENTIRE body, it might not be so surprising.  The fatigue and pain is all apart of the healing CNS.  Hoping yours will heal quickly but, most times, it is an extended process. 

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Hellbutrin
3 hours ago, gigi63 said:

Hi Hellbutrin, I must respond to this.  I basically, even though I tapered over 10 months, from Wellbutrin, then crashed, at about 11 mg and did a mild RI, my body has acted as though I CT’d this drug.  At about six months or so into my RI, I began to develop a vast array of nerve and muscle pain. At 21 months into my small RI, still waves and windows, I have various nerve and muscle pain continuing.  It changes and any given day it can lighten or get heavier.  I NEVER had this prior to WD.  If you read people’s stories you will see it is very common.  If you go to the International Antidepressant Withdrawal site and watch their videos on WD and recovery and such, you will see this is common, if you read the Benzo buddy Twin tower analogy you will see this is common.  Quite frankly, all of the morphing symptoms of WD are astounding to me.  However, when one considers the all encompassing effect of theses drugs on our ENTIRE body, it might not be so surprising.  The fatigue and pain is all apart of the healing CNS.  Hoping yours will heal quickly but, most times, it is an extended process. 

 

Hi Gigi, were you taking any other medications with the Wellbutrin? I did C/T this drug, and I've only been off for 6 months, so what you are saying is pretty terrifying. Did you have mental symptoms as well as nerve pain, and if you did, did you see them slowly dissipate? What does the muscle pain feel like for you? I've been getting some shooting pains in the right side of my neck, and all of my muscles have felt like they are really tense the last couple of days. 

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gigi63

Hi Hellbutrin.  No, I was on nothing else. Took Wellbutrin 150 xl for 8.5 years.  Way too long!!!!!  I am not trying to scare you!  I have had it seems all symptoms!!!!  Psychological and physical, still do,  now, some days lighter, some not.  The healing is very slow.  This is the nature of the process.  Very gradual positive changes.  But, this is a non linear process as all have said and I am experiencing.   Yes, as you describe and feeling like chronic achy, sore muscles.  Lots of nerve hypersensitivity also, changes places.  How long were you on and dose?  Other drugs? 

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Hellbutrin
1 hour ago, gigi63 said:

Hi Hellbutrin.  No, I was on nothing else. Took Wellbutrin 150 xl for 8.5 years.  Way too long!!!!!  I am not trying to scare you!  I have had it seems all symptoms!!!!  Psychological and physical, still do,  now, some days lighter, some not.  The healing is very slow.  This is the nature of the process.  Very gradual positive changes.  But, this is a non linear process as all have said and I am experiencing.   Yes, as you describe and feeling like chronic achy, sore muscles.  Lots of nerve hypersensitivity also, changes places.  How long were you on and dose?  Other drugs? 

Hi Gigi63,

 

My waves have been primarily psychological. I had a wave of suicidal depression during acute and during my third month. This was genuinely terrifying because I’d NEVER had those thoughts before. I was taking 75 mg immediate release once daily for a year and 8 months. But I’m not sure that the dosage or time frame really has any impact on healing, especially since I cold turkeyed. This is the only drug that I’ve ever taken. How extreme were your psychological symptoms? Are you able to feel occasional feelings of joy now? I can’t appreciate anything, and it makes the depression SO much worse 

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gigi63

Hi Hellbutrin,  I want to tell you that I believe your shorter duration on the drug INDEED will make a difference in a positive way.   I cannot prove this but, from all I have read over time, it does seem to matter.   Also, your dose is pretty low.  That is wonderful!!!  Also, only on-the one med ever, that is a plus.   Hellbutrin, all of those three points are huge and very important, at least I think so.  

 

You know, for me, I was only ever on the one drug but much longer.  The taper I was put on by my Dr and a pharmacist was horrible!!!  Didn’t know this at the time.  Had no idea I had become dependent, never even knew it was a possible.  

 

Hellbutrin, the psychological is indeed horrible.  I too have suffered it terrible. I think we all do.  Those neurotransmitters are all over the place and the healing going on is incredible.  We just cannot see it, we just feel it all!!!  And in the psychological pain it is so hard to think it will ever end.  But, like you, I am HOPING and PRAYING for the beautiful outcome all of those who have recovered tell us about.  

 

Yes, I do experience moments of joy in a window, but, even in a window, I am still not 100 percent me.  Anhedonia, sounds like you are experiencing this Hellbutrin.  Loss of pleasure in the things that normally brought us pleasure.  It seems like it was much worse last winter.  I still have it but it is so hard to tell You degrees.  

 

Hellbutrin, this is the most difficult ordeal I have lived and I have lived through some tough times.  I still can just cry in a heap some days because this journey has been so difficult and long.  I still have windows and waves.  Weird thing is I always have since the crash.  This path has not been linear just like they have all said.  It is hard to measure progress because when in a wave, feels like all the others.  Although, when I look back a year ago, I know there is improvement.  

 

Do you know Baylissa Frederick?   She is a beautiful survivor and counselor who now encourages all of us!!!!  Look her up.  

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RealMe

What is a morning cortisol spike?

 

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Hellbutrin
1 hour ago, gigi63 said:

Hi Hellbutrin,  I want to tell you that I believe your shorter duration on the drug INDEED will make a difference in a positive way.   I cannot prove this but, from all I have read over time, it does seem to matter.   Also, your dose is pretty low.  That is wonderful!!!  Also, only on-the one med ever, that is a plus.   Hellbutrin, all of those three points are huge and very important, at least I think so.  

 

You know, for me, I was only ever on the one drug but much longer.  The taper I was put on by my Dr and a pharmacist was horrible!!!  Didn’t know this at the time.  Had no idea I had become dependent, never even knew it was a possible.  

 

Hellbutrin, the psychological is indeed horrible.  I too have suffered it terrible. I think we all do.  Those neurotransmitters are all over the place and the healing going on is incredible.  We just cannot see it, we just feel it all!!!  And in the psychological pain it is so hard to think it will ever end.  But, like you, I am HOPING and PRAYING for the beautiful outcome all of those who have recovered tell us about.  

 

Yes, I do experience moments of joy in a window, but, even in a window, I am still not 100 percent me.  Anhedonia, sounds like you are experiencing this Hellbutrin.  Loss of pleasure in the things that normally brought us pleasure.  It seems like it was much worse last winter.  I still have it but it is so hard to tell You degrees.  

 

Hellbutrin, this is the most difficult ordeal I have lived and I have lived through some tough times.  I still can just cry in a heap some days because this journey has been so difficult and long.  I still have windows and waves.  Weird thing is I always have since the crash.  This path has not been linear just like they have all said.  It is hard to measure progress because when in a wave, feels like all the others.  Although, when I look back a year ago, I know there is improvement.  

 

Do you know Baylissa Frederick?   She is a beautiful survivor and counselor who now encourages all of us!!!!  Look her up.  

Hi Gigi63,

 

Thank you so much for your encouragement. It helps so much to hear from others who are struggling through similar experiences. I hope that the short duration, low dosage and only taking one medication are all positive indication of the healing timeline that I'm looking at. I haven't seen much progress yet, but I've seen other first hand accounts that have reported that they turned the corner and noticed significant healing between 6-12 months. I pray that this is the case for me. 

 

I know that I am experiencing anhedonia. I got engaged when I was still on the meds, and I know that I haven't experienced the full range of satisfaction about my engagement due to being convoluted by the medication. My fiancee has been so supportive of me throughout this whole process, and I know that he would like to get the old me back. I'm hoping that in the next 6 months I will see a noticeable decrease in my depressive feelings and a return of my positive feelings that were once so familiar to me, and now seem like a distant memory. 

 

I'm very familiar with the windows and waves pattern. But I haven't had any windows, like you mentioned, where I have felt %100 back to the old me. I was a little unsure of myself and very anxious before I started taking the medication, but I was also a VERY happy positive person. I felt good about the trajectory of my life and I was able to reason that I was going in a positive direction with my future. Now I'm uncertain about EVERYTHING and it's all I can do just to get through each day. 

 

I haven't heard of Baylissa Frederick, but if she's as great as you mentioned then I will have to look her up.

 

Thanks for being such a positive presence on this site where there are so many people struggling. I hope that I can have the strength to provide support to those still suffering one day soon. 

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Hellbutrin
1 hour ago, RealMe said:

What is a morning cortisol spike?

 

Your stress hormones (primarily cortisol to my understanding) are naturally higher in the morning when you wake up, so some people see an intensifying of their symptoms when they first wake up and refer to this as a cortisol spike. They are very unpleasant and some have reported that they have had positive results with using a magnesium supplement to help calm their nerves and muscles. I hope that answered your question, there are those on this site that can provide you with much more detailed information on the topic. 

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RealMe

Thank you, Hellbutrin.  I wake up with dread and deep sadness that I am still in a pained condition.  I guess that is a cortisol spike.  Does it include both restless, anxious agitation at one end and exhaustion and dread at the other?

I can't believe I was updosed from 150 bupropion to 300 after only one week.  Such insanity.

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Downbutnotout

Sorry Real Me. Tomorrow may be better. I was updosed, downdosed. and changed like crazy. I was taken down from 150 mg of effexor to 75 without a second thought. Taken from 75 mg to nothing in 2 weeks. Given one thing after another.  This is from an esteemed university. Who would believe this? 

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gigi63
12 minutes ago, Downbutnotout said:

Sorry Real Me. Tomorrow may be better. I was updosed, downdosed. and changed like crazy. I was taken down from 150 mg of effexor to 75 without a second thought. Taken from 75 mg to nothing in 2 weeks. Given one thing after another.  This is from an esteemed university. Who would believe this? 

It is absolute madness!!  What’s worse is these ‘ professionals ‘ don’t seem to want to know and understand.  This crap is not candy!!!!!  They toss this stuff around in absolute ignorance to the effects it has on the human brain and CNS!!!!

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gigi63
1 hour ago, Hellbutrin said:

Your stress hormones (primarily cortisol to my understanding) are naturally higher in the morning when you wake up, so some people see an intensifying of their symptoms when they first wake up and refer to this as a cortisol spike. They are very unpleasant and some have reported that they have had positive results with using a magnesium supplement to help calm their nerves and muscles. I hope that answered your question, there are those on this site that can provide you with much more detailed information on the topic. 

Nice explanation Hellbutrin.  Accurate!  One might also try a baby aspirin at bedtime. Studies have shown that low dose ibuprofen pre op, decreases cortisol post op, after stress of surgery. Also, somewhere on here Altostrata posted about baby Aspirin at bedtime decreases AM cortisol.  Something to do with the HPA axis.  I researched and read that Vitamin C at 3000mg dose decreased cortisol also.  I personally take 1500 mg time released Vit C twice daily. I had no problem with this but one has to be very careful with any supplement as they can have an adverse effect.  We are all so different and what might work for one, not for another. Magnesium had a paradoxical response in me.  Be very careful!  

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