Giulietta

[Giulietta]

Thanks, Gridley.  

 

sending you a quick PM now -

[Frogie]

2 hours ago, Giulietta said:

Yes, it started the first week of Dec but I don't know how to find that in the sequence of numbers (19, 20,...).

Try page 13. I saw conversations between you and Shep on there. I didn’t read any, just skimmed through your pages.

 

I hope that helps you a little.😊

 

How are you feeling? I hope you’re feeling well.
 

Take care,

 Frogie xx

[Giulietta]

1 hour ago, Frogie said:

I hope that helps you a little.😊

 

 

Hi Frogie!

 

I have been thinking of you - and yes this helps a great deal. I am doing OK - anxiety (external triggers) and new odd symptom since last night - pins and needs on my temples!  Slept pretty well the past 2 nights.

 

Managing to get some things done and sorting through next steps for me. I'll be writing for Shep's advice. I really hope I don't have to start a taper of clon now.

 

Will check your trhead later.

 

Big hug,

G.

 

 

 

 

[Frogie]

29 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

 

Hi Frogie!

 

I have been thinking of you - and yes this helps a great deal. I am doing OK - anxiety (external triggers) and new odd symptom since last night - pins and needs on my temples!  Slept pretty well the past 2 nights.

 

Managing to get some things done and sorting through next steps for me. I'll be writing for Shep's advice. I really hope I don't have to start a taper of clon now.

 

Will check your trhead later.

 

Big hug,

G.

 

 

 

 

G,

 

Glad you’re doing ok. Sorry about the anxiety though.

 

Are you running out of clonazepam? I hope not and you are able to obtain it so you don’t have to taper now.

 

 

I’m doing ok.  Except I pinched a nerve in my shoulder and it’s running down my arm. I was put on a very low dose of steroids and 3 days later I’m healing. Just uncomfortable. But trying to stay busy, makes wd a little easier.

 

Take care,

 Frogie xx

 

[Giulietta]

1 minute ago, Frogie said:

I’m doing ok. Just trying to stay busy... makes wd a little easier.

 

Hi Frogie

 

Absolutely - when I had a little part-time job at home - it was good because I could focus on it and nothing else. I had to get a certain amount of work done. I looked forward to doing it because it settled my mind.

 

Do you knit? I learned to do this on youtube. I found it helped with mindfulness. And I knitted some nice scarves. 😉

 

I am planning ahead for the possibility of not having clonazam in 90 days. Local pharmacies won't let me purchase now and release to me in 90 days nor can they assure me of availability then. I'm trying not be a drama queen, but don't want an unpleasant surprise...

 

How is your little one? Mine was out rolling in the grass and getting dirty - a particular favorite pasttime for him. 😉

 

speak soon,

Hugs,

G

 

 

[Frogie]

20 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

Do you knit? I learned to do this on youtube. I found it helped with mindfulness. And I knitted some nice scarves

I can’t hold knitting needles, unfortunately because my right hand is in a brace from a nerve injury. Wish I could do something like that, it would be nice to make some homemade gifts.

 

21 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

I am planning ahead for the possibility of not having clonazam in 90 days. Local pharmacies won't let me purchase now and release to me in 90 days nor can they assure me of availability then. I'm trying not be a drama queen, but don't want an unpleasant surprise...

I know that my Xanax can only be filled every 90 days also because it’s a controlled substance. But I can see the anxiety it causes. The unknown can be uncomfortable. Hopefully you won’t have to worry about it and will be able to get it refilled when it comes due.

 

23 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

How is your little one? Mine was out rolling in the grass and getting dirty - a particular favorite pasttime for him.

We bought a doggy door this weekend and taught her to go in and out. Now she lays out in the middle of the yard chewing on a twig. And rolling in the grass. They are funny creatures, aren’t they 🤣

 

I hope everything works out for you😊

 

Take care,

 Frogie xx

[Giulietta]

3 minutes ago, Frogie said:

Wish I could do something like that, it would be nice to make some homemade gifts.

 

Hi Frogie!

 

I forgot why you do not knit. 😕  Crocheting is a left hand focused craft - have you tried this? I was unable to learn to crochet as I have very poor motor skills in my left hand.  It is frustrating. Sorry to have drawn a blank.

 

12 minutes ago, Frogie said:

But I can see the anxiety it causes. The unknown can be uncomfortable.

 

It has been worrying me for quite a while. The unknown and what we can't control is uncomfortable - well put. I am better at supporting others with how to look at things, etc. - even though I tell myself to have 'positive expectations' that things will work out - it's hard to do for myself. 

 

I spoke with the MD and he will write me a script so I have some extra meds and I don't have to worry about starting an immediate taper. I feel better about this.

20 minutes ago, Frogie said:

We bought a doggy door this weekend and taught her to go in and out. Now she lays out in the middle of the yard chewing on a twig. And rolling in the grass. They are funny creatures, aren’t they 🤣

 

Awesome!  She is such a smartie - I bet she has such fun going in and out of the door too. 😉 And she must love the independence of it. They are precious.

 

I don't take very many photographs - but 90% of them are of my dogs.  They are so cute. Speaking of which it is itme to feed my little guy.

 

Hugs to you Frogie.

G.

 

 

[Frogie]

1 hour ago, Giulietta said:

I was unable to learn to crochet as I have very poor motor skills in my left hand.  It is frustrating. Sorry to have drawn a blank.

No problem. I’m just as uncoordinated with my left hand as it sounds like you are. It’s very frustrating to me also.

 

1 hour ago, Giulietta said:

It has been worrying me for quite a while. The unknown and what we can't control is uncomfortable - well put. I am better at supporting others with how to look at things, etc. - even though I tell myself to have 'positive expectations' that things will work out - it's hard to do for myself. 

I’m also better at giving advise and comfort to people than I am to myself. I need to use my toolbox and more CBT😊

 

1 hour ago, Giulietta said:

I spoke with the MD and he will write me a script so I have some extra meds and I don't have to worry about starting an immediate taper. I feel better about this.

That’s very positive news! Good for you! Hopefully that will settle the unknown a little for you.

 

1 hour ago, Giulietta said:

I don't take very many photographs - but 90% of them are of my dogs.  They are so cute. Speaking of which it is itme to feed my little guy.

I don’t take many photos either. Mine are of my granddaughter and her puppy and of course Delilah. I hope your baby eats well today.

 

Take care,

 Frogie xx

[Giulietta]

Dear Frogie,

 

Thank you for being compassionate about my memory. Short-term memory is associated with seizure disorders, themedications for it and these SAs and of couse clonazapem as you would know. I need to write peoples' names down and a blurb to jog my memory and keep beside my computer! It took me a long time to remember some things about Gridley, for example (and remember). I still have days when I have to wrack my brain to recall the names of his dogs, Humprhey and Yappa. Ii think your little girl is Delilah?

 

It is frustrating about fumbling with doing things. I make quite a few mistakes with  my knitting and the patterns I am able to make are fairly simple. I am much better at ripping this out. . 😉

 

16 hours ago, Frogie said:

need to use my toolbox and more CBT😊

 

Me as well. Do you have a worksheet you can use for this? I have one and can try to scan into a small enough size and email to you if you want.

 

16 hours ago, Frogie said:

I don’t take many photos either. Mine are of my granddaughter and her puppy and of course Delilah. I hope your baby eats well today.

 

I haven't figured out why I do that either.

 

Dogs and grandkids actually like to pose!
I think I don't take many pictures of people b/c  the people closest to me don't care to be photographed (they feel awkward anddmake a fuss), so I feel awkward and don't want to ake them feel uncomfortable. And if I'd like a personal memory feel odd asking them for a photograph of me.   what do you think?

 

I will check your thread now. 😉

 

Hugs,

G

 

 

[Frogie]

I hope this worked, I’m not sure if I did it right or not😊

[Giulietta]

Greetings to all....

 

Quick update on how I am doing.

 

After enjoying a number of sequential good days where I could walk - meaning no or slight imbalance, minimial headache and dizziness, no diplopia/blurry vision, etc. (13 - my first good run since August or September) - so maybe I was in a wave. Bummer. Starting to feel balanced enough to walk forwards. 😉

 

I am going to look on youtube for what exercises I could do to help with this. I decided to postpone my PT eval and appointments for this. 

 

 

More later both 😉

Hugs,

G

[Altostrata]

I would continue to work on your balance and walking, Giuletta, to the extent you're able. Was the PT to help you with this?

[Giulietta]

1 minute ago, Altostrata said:

I would continue to work on your balance and walking,

 

Hello Alto.  I am trying to do this on my own - using guidance from the Ashton Manual and what I can find on my own. I am not able to go to PT after all. Any ideas are most welcome. Thanks.

[Altostrata]

Just do what you can at home, even standing and moving with the support of a table or chair.

[Cocopuffz17]

7 hours ago, Giulietta said:

 

Hello Alto.  I am trying to do this on my own - using guidance from the Ashton Manual and what I can find on my own. I am not able to go to PT after all. Any ideas are most welcome. Thanks.

Have you tried nutrition changes? I remember falling down often earlier in WDs. The vertigo was overwhelming at times. 

[Cathy4]

On 3/10/2020 at 11:36 AM, Giulietta said:

I am trying to do this on my own - using guidance from the Ashton Manual and what I can find on my own. I am not able to go to PT after all. Any ideas are most welcome. Thanks.

Hi Giulietta, 

I have a couple Feldenkrais exercises that can help with this as well—I can consult my lessons/books and give you some ideas if you’d like.  Sounds like you’re really making progress with your walking.  
🤗Cathy

[Giulietta]

Dear everyone -

 

Thank you for your messages, which I haven't been able to look at now and absorb. I am off-planet as I come to grips with  the panic around me and effect on WD symptoms. It's a set back but will get through it after adjusting to temporary change. Change takes me a while to adjust to.

 

You are all in my thoughts, particularly @Rhiannon and @ShiningLight  who work in healthcare and friends around the world.   I am in avoidance mode of life issues and am off planet.  My location has suddently been impacted in a huge way and everyone's been told to stay indoors.

 

Hugs and thinking of you,

 

Guiletta

 

Thanks to @Altostrata @Frogie and @Cathy4 and @Cocopuffz17 for your notes.

 

 

 

 

[Giulietta]

Hello all,

 

I hope everyone here is safe, well, WD and anxiety unaffected, and taking as many precautiouns as they can with the virus.

 

Still having a rough time adjusting,managing, worrying about everyone and everything - near and far even though there seems nothing I can do about it. Thus I have been in absentia.

 

However - I would appreciate anyone's help.

 

• After 9 weeks on 1 bead (and previously 9 weeks on 2 beads) I today stopped my bead for the first time. One has to do this eventually and I am looking at starting a clon taper soon given what I have for meds.
• Four  hours after not taking my bead this symptoms came back in full. I immediately took 1 bead. I posted the below message on 'when to jump to 0' topic. The high level of anxiety and auras are the worst of them. Irritability, impatience, agitated, trouble focusing, 'depersonalization', dystonia, muscle pain, etc.
• My  gut says the drop preciptated the intense symptoms as there are so many of them and they came on all of a sudden. Yesterday was very difficult and this morning a little less so with external circumstances.

 

That being said - what to do next? My thought/plan had been to stay at 1 bead for two more months,   skip a day for 1 week, then skip 2 days, etc. then to 0. What does one do? After today I don't want to miss a bead.

 

Thanks - hugs - overwhelmed and felling crummy

 

Guilietta

 

 

8 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

 

Hello - and sorry if this has been addressed before. I've searched the thread and not found best next steps. @Gridley@brassmonkey @Rhiannon - tagged in case you can weigh in.

 

I looked at the Horowitz concentration and levels in the bloodstream after skipping days as a way to get off.

 

I have been on 1 bead (.2 mg) of duloxetine for 9 weeks. Today I stopped that bead and was thinking to do every other day so I didn't have to jump - and then maybe every 3 days. I am having a lot of symptoms 5 hours after skipping the dose.

 

I'm going to take one bead now and hope things improve extremely soon.

 

In meantime I have to get this s### at some point and I don't know when or how. I also need to start a clon taper I think soon. Will post onmy thread but any comments gratefully appreciated.

 

Thanks and trying to be calm

G.

[Giulietta]

Just an idea for people trying to  boost your immune system:

 

Vitamins A, C, D and zinc.

 

I just started with the C and zinc today and will add this to my signature.

 

 

 

[sunnysideup69]

@Giulietta, I'm so sorry you're feeling crummy and symptomatic. I also had a meltdown yesterday. I've been watching the news too much...

 

Is there any possibility that the symptoms were unrelated to the lack of meds? I'm just wondering that out loud.

Have you any idea of the dosage of one bead? I guess you'd do that by averaging the number of beads from a few capsules...and also, is your capsule part of the active ingredient? (Probably not but worth checking.)

 

If you could work out what one bead is worth in mgai, then I'm wondering if there's a liquid duloxetine that you could swap to and taper again from there.

Or is there an immediate release duloxetine tablet, to which you could switch , and from which you could make a liquid and taper?

 

No idea if these options even exist, just throwing some thoughts out there and hoping you find a solution  xxxxx Sending non infectious hugs xxxxx

[Giulietta]

14 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

I also had a meltdown yesterday. I've been watching the news too much...

 

Hi Sunny,

 

I am truly sorry. The past few days have been particularly bad for me too. I have good friends in the EU and UK so I am concerned for them.

 

I am trying to stay away from the news - and people and any triggers. I am isolating myself except for mandatory excursions - yesterday the pharmacy and today the vet. 

 

I look forward to life going back to usual from this new normal. Today they started testing a vaccine in the US.  Staying away from other people (until we are told otherwise) is really important.

 

15 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

No idea if these options even exist, just throwing some thoughts out there and hoping you find a solution  xxxxx Sending non infectious hugs xxxxx

 

This is a brilliant question and I have wondered this myself.   I don't know the answer.

 

The dosage of 1 bead is .2 mg. Dropping to 0 is a 50% drop. Unfortunately with beads there is no option to jump to 0 at a lower dose than .2 mg (with generic duloxetine). It cannot be compounded. The only option may be to skip a day before jumping to 0 if I understand. Since I am in prolonged WD - maybe I need more time on 1 bead.

 

That being said - I don't know if I am prolonging things by not jumping or not. It may not make any difference with a bead.

 

Non-infectious hugs back and many, many thanks for your excellent comments

Guilietta

 

 

 

[Giulietta]

Hello @Shep @Gridley @brassmonkey @Rhiannon

Hope you are all feeling well and managing this emotional turmoil. I am trying to stay calm.

 

That being said - I have 2 goals: taper off clonazepam 1 mg in 6 months (argh) and when to jump off 1 bead of duloxetine (100% drop). I seriously don't know if I can get more clonaz in 6 mos (I got that much fortunately from the MD). I also don't know if I should stay on the 1 bead during the clonaz taper. 

What I have read online about getting off benzos is terrifying. 🤪 I know I can do it and succeed. Positive expectations.

That being said -

• I have been on clon for 15 years thanks to medical malfeasance/malpractice for not taking me off this drug or informing me about its dangers

• I have epilepsy and I am treated on high dosages of lamotrigine and gabapentin. I think those may work in my favor?

• While I have improved very much from my CT of duloxetine in 12/2018 - I still have symptoms. Sleep is generally better.  The legs/imbalance/strength issue which has persisted monthly since August (initial presentation in June) has been improving since mid-February.

• I attempted to stop my bead of dulox on Sunday and experienced a significant uptick in symptoms - so got back on the bead (after 9 weeks). Maybe I should have let it ride. I will at some point I have to cope with this as I am on beads and see that you never jump to 0 from a low dose as you will undue the good you did tapering.   So I don't know what to do about this.

How do I go about this?  I am sensitive to changes in meds but this would be better to a CT if I can't get another prescription.

Thanks to you all,

G.

[Gridley]

27 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

That being said - I have 2 goals: taper off clonazepam 1 mg in 6 months (argh) and when to jump off 1 bead of duloxetine (100% drop). I seriously don't know if I can get more clonaz in 6 mos (I got that much fortunately from the MD). I also don't know if I should stay on the 1 bead during the clonaz taper. 

 

The others will have thoughts, I'm sure, but I'll give you mine.

 

First, I'd stay on the one bead of Duloxetine until you've completed your Clonazepam taper.  The old rule about one drug at a time has validity, especially given your reaction recently when you jumped to zero Duloxetine.  It would also give you six more months to stabilize on the Duloxetine.  You could continue to hold after your  benzo taper and let your system rest (I'm assuming you have an adequate supply of Duloxetine.)

 

You have six months' worth of 1mg Clonazepam.  Once you start tapering down and your dosage decreases, that would stretch out a bit longer than six months.  If you taper by 10% per month, you'll be at half your present dose in 6 months, which would be 0.5mg, a fairly high jump-off as I'm sure you know.  (I read somewhere on the site that 0.05 was a good end-of-taper point for Ativan.  There's always the chance that in 6 months you can get more Clonazepam and go lower before jump off.  If you tapered more than 10% per month, you'd arrive at a lower jump off dosage, but I wouldn't recommend that option--too much risk of encountering more than tolerable withdrawal symptoms, no inventory to allow you to updose if necessary, and you'd be forfeiting the possibility that in 6 months you could get more Clonazepam and go lower before jumping.

 

Hope this helps.

 

[Shep]

14 hours ago, Gridley said:

You have six months' worth of 1mg Clonazepam.  Once you start tapering down and your dosage decreases, that would stretch out a bit longer than six months.  If you taper by 10% per month, you'll be at half your present dose in 6 months, which would be 0.5mg, a fairly high jump-off as I'm sure you know.  (I read somewhere on the site that 0.05 was a good end-of-taper point for Ativan.  There's always the chance that in 6 months you can get more Clonazepam and go lower before jump off.  If you tapered more than 10% per month, you'd arrive at a lower jump off dosage, but I wouldn't recommend that option--too much risk of encountering more than tolerable withdrawal symptoms, no inventory to allow you to updose if necessary, and you'd be forfeiting the possibility that in 6 months you could get more Clonazepam and go lower before jumping.

 

This is excellent advice, Gridley.

 

 

On 8/2/2019 at 9:00 AM, Giulietta said:

Note about this (long) list: I never drink alcohol and the lorazepam is rarely used (maybe about 3 or 4 tabs in the last 7 months).

 

Giulietta, this is an old post, but do you still have access to lorazepam? If you were to run out of clonazepam, it may cover some of the withdrawal and you could taper a bit further from a benzo. 

 

With a history of epilepsy, I really think you're going to be able to get another refill for the clonazepam, especially when you go to the doctor and can show him or her that you've already made progress on a taper. But you may want to mention due to your susceptibility to seizures, you'd like to err on the side of caution and do a slow taper.  The fact that your doctor already trusts you with a long-term prescription is a good sign that you've already won their trust. 

 

[Giulietta]

18 hours ago, Gridley said:

First, I'd stay on the one bead of Duloxetine until you've completed your Clonazepam taper

 

Thanks, Gridley. I will hold at least a while longer. It occurred to me to use tiny amounts of ativan to get me over the worst bits.

 

My thoughts are that after clonazepam is 'out of my system' I will still ahve a period of recalibrating, etc. (duh) and WD - and then a jump of 100% from duloxetine. Eke.

 

18 hours ago, Gridley said:

If you taper by 10% per month, you'll be at half your present dose in 6 months, which would be 0.5mg, a fairly high jump-off as I'm sure you know.

 

This is sounds like h***

 

18 hours ago, Gridley said:

I wouldn't recommend that option--too much risk of encountering more than tolerable withdrawal symptoms, no inventory to allow you to updose if necessary, and you'd be forfeiting the possibility that in 6 months you could get more Clonazepam and go lower before jumping.

 

I feel the same way about 10%. What do you mean by forfeiting the possibility that in 6 mos I could get more clonazepam....?

 

How would you proceed - monthly % decrease target, daily, weekly, etc. holds, and I have tablets...is there a link to basics on starting this? Steps for dummies?

 

3 hours ago, Shep said:

but do you still have access to lorazepam? If you were to run out of clonazepam, it may cover some of the withdrawal and you could taper a bit further from a benzo. 

 

I do have a refill - but for only 25 tabs. Much of my emergency supply is 'old' and thus not so effective- plus I have taken it prn for years albeit infrequently except for it's regular use when trasitioning to lamotrigine 5 years ago.

 

3 hours ago, Shep said:

With a history of epilepsy, I really think you're going to be able to get another refill for the clonazepam, especially when you go to the doctor and can show him or her that you've already made progress on a taper.

 

I hope this is the case.  

 

@Gridley what did you end up doing to keep your tabs of ativan from degrading in the humid environment? I just realized it'simperative I do this pronto for my meds.

 

Thank you

 

Dear all -

 

I am thinking of everyone and hoping everyone's tapers and symptoms and general health is OK. Special thoughts and prayers go to a member on site having some issues now. General anxiety 'starting' to come down a bit as I adjust to this 'new temporary normal' at least for me. I am indoors, etc. Will be back on soon.  Sorting out some technical issues now as well. 

 

I decided to hold to one bead at least a while longer for now.

 

Angus' health issues have continued, poor thing.

 

Kindest to all,

G.

[Gridley]

22 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

What do you mean by forfeiting the possibility that in 6 mos I could get more clonazepam....?

You'd already be off the Clonazepam so getting a refill wouldn't do you any good. Whereas if you did the 10% taper in six months you'd have the option of trying to get more pills and going lower.

 

24 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

 

How would you proceed - monthly % decrease target, daily, weekly, etc. holds, and I have tablets...is there a link to basics on starting this? Steps for dummies?

 

  I don't know of any steps.  Just the usual 10% with 4-week hold.

 

25 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

 

@Gridley what did you end up doing to keep your tabs of ativan from degrading in the humid environment? I just realized it'simperative I do this pronto for my meds.

 

 

Mine come in a little sheet with each pill in individual airtight pouches.  I think that helps preserve them rather than loose pills the way they do in the U.S.  I don't know if you could approximate that maybe with plastic wrap.  Keep in cool dark drawer.

29 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

Angus' health issues have continued, poor thing.

So sorry, G.

[sunnysideup69]

@Giulietta, Hugs, hugs and more hugs xxx

[Giulietta]

3 hours ago, Gridley said:

  I don't know of any steps.  Just the usual 10% with 4-week hold.

 

What do I do with a .5 mg tab?  If I try 10% a month - I am thinking of the smoothest method possible. Would this be 2.5%, 2.5%, 2.5% 2.5% each week - then hold 2 weeks - how does one do this with a tablet? 

 

4 hours ago, Gridley said:

Mine come in a little sheet with each pill in individual airtight pouches.  I think that helps preserve them rather than loose pills the way they do in the U.S.  I

 

You are fortunate to get them this way. It preserves them better I think. I have seen same when in European countries.

 

I think I have found a solution for a dessicant - put them in an airtight container with dessicant beads in a glass bottle.

 

4 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Hugs, hugs and more hugs xxx

 

Back at you!  How are you doing? I am glad you stopped by my thread so we can connect. How are you doing - with your family, and I imagine you are off work with school closures, etc. I wonder if you are keeping to yourself (adised or other) in  your flat or if you are goint out at all. I am at home unless I must go out. Anyway, could update you more on that if you want.  I am acclimating myself to the idea of a clon taper. I am taking zinc sublingually (a good immune system booster) and boy is it rancid stuff. It takes 20-30 min to dissolve and hours to get the taste out of one's mouth - or it seems that way. 🤣

 

Huge hugs,

G.

 

 

 

[Gridley]

1 hour ago, Giulietta said:

 

What do I do with a .5 mg tab?  If I try 10% a month - I am thinking of the smoothest method possible. Would this be 2.5%, 2.5%, 2.5% 2.5% each week - then hold 2 weeks - how does one do this with a tablet? 

 

That's the Brassmonkey slide taper, a good taper. It takes a little longer but is gentler.

 

The Brassmonkey Slide Method of Micro-tapering

 

You'll need to get a Gemini 20 scale from Amazon and weigh.  

The GEMINI-20 Scale

 

Using a digital scale to measure doses

 

Here are 3 versions of Brassmonkey's explanation.  See if it makes sense to you.  If you're starting at 1mg clonaz., you'd use the weight of 2 pills

BRASS’ SPECIFIC MULTIPLICATION TABLES FOR BM SLIDE

The first thing you need to calculate is the average weight of one pill.  Weigh 10 random pills, add the weights together and divide the total by 10.  This is the number you will base your dose calculations off of. It is referred to as XXX mgpw (mg pill weight). A full pill ( XXX mgpw) gives you a dose of (in your case, G) two .5mg pills= 1mg active ingredient).



Slide One
   Week one: XXX times 0.975 =  YYY This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week
   Week two: XXX times 0.95 = WWW  This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week two
   Week three: XXX times 0.925 = VVV This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week three
   Week four: XXX times 0.9 =  UUU This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week four, five and six

The next time you base your calculation off of the number UUU

Slide Two
   Week one: UUU times 0.975 =  AAA This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week
   Week two: UUU times 0.95 = BBB This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week two
   Week three: UUU times 0.925 = CCC This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week three
   Week four: UUU times 0.9 =  DDD This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week four, five and six

The next time you base your calculations off of the number DDD

Slide Three
   Week one: DDD times 0.975 =  EEE This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week
   Week two: DDD times 0.95 = FFF  This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week two
   Week three: DDD times 0.925 = GGG This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week three
   Week four: DDD times 0.9 =  HHH This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week four, five and six

The next time you base your calculatons off of the number HHH.

At the same time you need to calculate the same progression starting with 1mgai instead of the XXX mgpw.  This will be the measurement you use in discussions on the forums. 

 

Another version:
Hope this helps.  Brass
   Week one: XXX times 0.975 =  YYY This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week
   Week two: XXX times 0.95 = WWW  This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week two
   Week three: XXX times 0.925 = VVV This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week three
   Week four: XXX times 0.9 =  UUU This is the amount you weigh out with your scales all week four, five and six
 

Same info - another version:

Hi Gridley-- Welcome to SA.  I'm very glad you find my experience helpful and upbeat. I've found that a positive attitude is very important to getting through everything that WD will throw at you, not just for me but I've seen in in others too.  I've also seen that the Brassmonkey Slide Method makes things a lot easier on people.  The whole idea behind it is to sneak up on the symptoms caused by a drop by spreading them over several weeks, instead of having them happen all at once. That's the main advantage of the Slide over the standard 10% drop.  It also makes a person feel like they're being more active in their taper instead of just drop and hold, drop and hold.

There are several ways to work the math. First the method you used, figure the total drop and divide it by 4 which works well. Then you can also calculate each dose by multiplying.  Starting with your previous dose the first week you multiply it by 0.975.  The second week by 0.95. The third week by 0.925 and the fourth week by 0.9.  So using the example of starting with 18mg you'd get 18 x 0.975 = 17.55, 18 x 0.95 = 17.1, 18 x 0.925 = 16.65, and 19 x .9 = 16.2. Rounding is either up or down which ever is closest, but doesn't happen that much.

I just kept track of each weeks dose as a list on a piece of paper, nothing fancy. I tracked both the mg weight and the actual weight of the dose.  Because of the pills containing fillers they weigh a lot more ( mgpw mg pill weight) than the weight of the active ingredient (mgai) which is the weight we always talk about.  You need to keep track of both. Also because of the difference in weights it is possible to get very accurate measurements using just a scale.  I use the Gemini-20 myself.

 

 

[Giulietta]

1 hour ago, Gridley said:

Here are 3 versions of Brassmonkey's explanation.  See if it makes sense to you.  If you're starting at 1mg clonaz., you'd use the weight of 2 pills

 

Hi Gridley

Thank you very much for the links. 

This looks very complicated, time-comsuming and laborious - or am I overstating it? 🤔   

Thanks and hugs

G

 

 

[Gridley]

39 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

or am I overstating it?

Not that hard after a few times.  Don't be daunted.  The verbiage is more complicated than the actual calculating. A regular 10% every four week taper is simpler to calculate but the BM slide is gentler.  I can make a week's pills in 15-20 minutes now.

It's just a matter of crushing the tablets, weighing to get the right weight, pouring into a size 00 gelatin capsule.  I can help.

[Giulietta]

1 hour ago, Gridley said:

I can make a week's pills in 15-20 minutes now.

It's just a matter of crushing the tablets, weighing to get the right weight, pouring into a size 00 gelatin capsule.  I can help.

 

Thank you. This is encouraging. I'm glad I bought the bag of 1000 capsules.

 

Do you use a mortar and pestle to crush the tablets? I found this on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9eJ47AE3ys

 

How do you get the powder into a capsule without spilling it?

 

Big hug,

G.

[Giulietta]

14 minutes ago, Giulietta said:

How do you get the powder into a capsule without spilling it?

 

I will order the scale tomorrow (along with the books) and also what I need to go with the scale - what items I need to get the powder in the gel capsule, where/how to store the powder, etc.  There are several products.

 

What might these items be? (says the woman in the tin foil hat)

 

Thanks

G.

[Gridley]

14 hours ago, Giulietta said:

 

Do you use a mortar and pestle to crush the tablets? I found this on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9eJ47AE3ys

 

How do you get the powder into a capsule without spilling it?

 

 

I just crush them between 2 spoons.  Works fine. Frogie ordered a pill crusher from Amazon that she likes.

 

You can use a bent post-it to slide the powder into the capsule.  I use LabExact grade WW weighing paper. The only things you'll need beside the scale is 00 size gelatin capsules and the weighing paper and Frogie's pill crusher if you want them.  The scale comes with a little spoon to handle the powder.  You can store the leftover powder in a glass pill bottle n a dark cool place.

 

This link lets you calculate your Brassmonkey taper doses. I think it will make it a lot easier.

 

http://www.taperoff.co

 

 

[Giulietta]

5 hours ago, Gridley said:

Frogie ordered a pill crusher from Amazon that she likes.

 

Hi Gridley

Thank you so much. This is hugely helpful.

 

I will look at the calculator later, but at initial try it doesn't let me build a schedule. I am sure I am doing something wrong.

 

Grateful for you as always,

G.

[sunnysideup69]

Hey @Giulietta, catching up on your thread. Hope you are doing okay in these challenging times. Seems like we are continually being asked to adapt and it's all moving soooo quickly.

Are you self isolating? Getting out for a walk etc?

 

I'm generally doing okay but with odd peaks of anxiety. My sleep is also suffering a bit...getting about 6.5 hours. I have a bit of an uptick in anxiety symptoms, noticing I'm a bit shaky generally, to be honest....you know , those odd body twitches and jerks? Ugh. So annoying. 

Work is off for the moment, but soon, we will be on a rota to go in, a couple of times a week, to look after the most vulnerable kids who are still coming to school.Don't quite know how that will pan out, which is also anxiety-provoking.

 

We have to keep reminding ourselves that these are all temporary situations...WD / grief/ pandemics etc. These too shall pass. It's hard, though, I'm finding. I'm watching the news but also setting limits as to how much of it I watch.

 

Sending you big hugs and love xxx