Cocobiotics - anybody tried it?

[basildev]

Hi everyone,

 

I'be been reading up a bit about improving my digestive flora and fermented foods seem to be the way to go.

 

I don't have time to make my own stuff. Has anybody tried 'cocobiotics'? It's mentioned in the Body Ecology Diet book.

 

I've tried heaps of different kinds of probiotics in the past, usually over the counter pill form. Can't say I've noticed any difference in my health or wellbeing as a result of taking them.

 

Any advice?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Jemima]

I've never even heard of Cocobiotics - sounds expensive - but I started making Kimchi and following the Paleo diet (somewhat modified) about five months ago in hopes of soothing the vagus nerve and settling my stomach in general. I can't say I've noticed any improvement at all. In fact, small amounts of Kimchi can *still* upset my stomach, so I'm not at all sure what to believe about probiotics.

[basildev]

Yeah I'm not sure either Jemima.

 

I think I'll give it a miss. There are so many things you can buy out there. Most of it is snake oil.

 

I think forums are the only places you can get a real idea of what works and what doesn't.

 

Thanks for your input:)

[Nadia]

I'm a big fan of probiotics, but I make my own yoghurt and kefir, and drink miso soup.

 

Most probiotics for sale are no good. Usually the good kind are refrigerated, and you have to get a reputable brand. They are expensive.

 

Making your own yoghurt is easy.

 

For me, it has made a huge difference in my digestion.

[basildev]

yes I was originally researching how to make Kefir.

 

Do you use raw milk Nadia? Is it okay to use pasteurised milk?

[GiaK]

I make many assorted vegetable ferments at home, but if someone is looking for a good pill Primal Defense by Garden of Life totally and completely cured my long-term irritable bowel syndrome...(with a bit of dietary changes as well...I've now made many more) but initially I cleared up over 2 decades of chronic diarrhea...and cramps and all manner of heck in my bowel. I've recommended them to others with problems with constipation etc and they too have had some excellent results...

 

and you don't have to refrigerate these either...

 

when I took them for therapeutic purposes I started with one pill a day and worked up to 8 a day...that was because I had such severe issues. My issues cleared up within 6 months...I've been IBS free for about 7 years...

 

I continue to eat well and have added my own home made fermented veggies etc, but what really got rid of the symptoms at the get go was Primal Defense...I'm a fan, can you tell??

 

okay...if you want a whole post on it...here: How I cured my irritable bowel syndrome–healthy gut is needed for healthy body and mind http://beyondmeds.com/2010/06/30/cureirritablebowel/

 

I have to say for me, curing my irritable bowel, did not take care of my food intolerances and I still had to clean up my diet big time after using the Primal Defense...we're all different but I always encourage folks to just go at this stuff from as many directions as you can...(healthy non-toxic ways that is!!)

[basildev]

Thanks Gia!

 

My bowel is very 'fickle' and I'm prone to constipation so I'll have a read of all your info.

 

And I might try that supplement too

[Nadia]

Thanks for the info, GiaK! That is interesting about not having to refrigerate Primal Defense.

 

I have a friend who has severe gut problems that has had a good response to a probiotic that has no fillers (she is celiac and has other intolerances, so she has o watch out for no starches and sugars in the non-active ingredients). I'll ask the brand.

 

Basil... I wish I had a source for raw milk. You can use regular milk. I use organic milk, but it's homogenized and ultrapasteurized. Some people who can't tolerate cow milk do well with goat's milk. You can even use almond or nut milks.

 

Kefir is super simple to make. Yoghurt is as well, but it requires more work and a way to heat the mixture slightly.

 

My method:

 

First, find a source of kefir grains. You can buy them freeze dried or have someone send some to you in exchange for a small donation. Or ask around, I found some from a friend of a friend.

 

If you buy them freeze dried, it takes a week or so to reactivate them and get them healthy. All this means is you put them in milk, and then every day strain them from the milk and put them in new milk, as usual, but throw away the milk. You know they are good to go when they don't smell funny... when they start tasting and smelling like a sour yoghurt.

 

Then, all you do is drink the kefir that you strain from the grains and put them in new milk. The grains grow quickly, so you have to keep them in check by throwing out or eating the extra growth (or increasing your produciton with more milk, but that can get out of hand). If you need to go away for a few days, you put them in the fridge and that slows them down. If you want to stop production for longer, you strain them and put them in a ziplock bag and freeze them.

 

Look up Dom's Kefir site for tons of info!

[basildev]

Thanks Nadia,

 

We don't have raw milk in Aus. It's illegal, can you believe it?

 

I might try rice milk.

 

Anyway I bought some Primal defence. Will let you know if it makes a difference.

[Nadia]

Thanks Nadia,

 

We don't have raw milk in Aus. It's illegal, can you believe it?

 

I might try rice milk.

 

Raw milk is illegal here, too, at least for selling commercially. But you can use regular milk!

[basildev]

Hey Nadia,

 

I've just ordered my first batch - so excited!

 

Dom is actually Australian (from Adelaide) so it's even better.

 

He and his wife are really helpful.

 

 

Can't wait to try it:)

[Nadia]

Awesome! You'll see it's kind of like having tiny pets. It takes a bit to get the hang of it... not rocket science, but you know, you start to realize what makes them happy and what doesn't (like finding the best spot in the kitchen for them).

 

I once followed Dom's instructions for making butter from the kefir. He has tons of great info!

[basildev]

he sure does

[Shanti]

This is very interesting about kefir. I never heard of it. Is it good for chronic constipation? It's a probiotic? I wasn't clear which was from the yogurt or from the kefir.

[basildev]

Hi Shanti,

 

It's a fermented milk drink and supposed to be good for constipation.

 

It's a probiotic - and really easy to make! It has a texture kind of like a drinking yoghurt.

 

Supposed to be sensational for digestion and gut lining. I learnt about it from the body ecology diet book. I made my first batch 2 days ago from whole milk.

 

I'm going to make some with raw milk next.

[Shanti]

Great! I just read more about it and it sounds wonderful. I'm going to the organic store tomorrow and I'll get some and do this. Thank you for sharing the info

[basildev]

no worries!

[Nadia]

You found a source for raw milk?! I'm jealous!

[basildev]

yeah!

 

It turns out they deliver to your door (no charge) AND my husband regularly goes to that health shop anyway; we just didn't know they sold raw milk till I found it online.

 

But the kefir I'm making is very watery and no matter what I do I can't get the creamy consistency I got in the very first batch(:

 

I'm not sure if that's because I'm using raw milk. But hey, it's better for you so that's a plus

[Nadia]

Interesting... I've never used raw milk, but since it is not homogenized, maybe that is why. How does it taste?

 

My kefir sometimes is creamier or watery and I don't know why... the weather, etc. It does seem to vary with season and with brand of milk as well. I took my kefir to Canada and it seemed to really love Canadian milk!

 

Have you tried straining your kefir? Mostly I do that with the yoghurt we make. You need a lot of milk but it's sooo good to have it so thick and creamy!

[basildev]

The kefir tastes nice - kind of fizzy and yeasty. But it's watery. No thicker than regular milk.

 

Interestingly enough the very first batch I made was sensational. It was like the consistency of drinking yoghurt. I used normal milk with that one. But I've used normal milk since and it's never turned out the same since.

 

The only thing different about the first batch was that the grains were in some kind of milky solution that I was supposed to strain but forgot. The weather has been pretty much the same here so I don't think it's a temperature issue. If I try to leave it longer to get the kefir to thicken it just goes to curds and whey (:

 

You know the other thing? I think the kefir is making my constipation worse! I don't know whether my body needs time to adjust or something. I've been having half a cup each morning for about 10 days now. I don't know whether to keep going or not. I'm not sensitive to lactose or anything, I've never had any problems with milk before. It's soooo frustrating! Grrrr.

[Nadia]

Ah, if you are getting constipated, try leaving it less time. Dom talks about that somewhere on his site.

 

I usually leave mine 24 hours, and it separates, but I stir it before straining. The kefir I get is not as thick as yoghurt, but not watery. However, I put mine on hold in the fridge for 4 days last week, and when I came back the first day it came out really watery. I wonder if that means the grains aren't that happy. Are they reproducing at a good rate?

 

Do you take magnesium? That does wonders for me with constipation.

[basildev]

Hi Nadia,

 

I never leave longer than 24 hours. Just to clarify I don't normally get constipated, except a couple of days before my period is due.

 

So the kefir seems to be the culprit. Will keep an eye on it.

[Nadia]

Hmm... I read that it should have a slight laxative effect at 12 hours. I wonder if you could try that?

[basildev]

yeah I heard that too - but when I do that it doesn't seem to be 'ready' - no fizzy texture or yeasty taste and I'm scared I'm going to hurt myself drinking sour milk.

 

I'll lay off it for a couple of days then try again.

[Nadia]

It won't hurt you to drink it unless you are lactose intolerant! Anyway, hope you figure it out... maybe try moving it to a different area. I swear they are so sensitive to small changes.

[GiaK]

I can't have dairy and I'm actually intolerant of both casein and whey...lactose is not the only problem for some...

 

in fact casein intolerance is often associated with certain mental health issues...

 

I had opiate like withdrawals when I came off of milk due to the casein...truly ugly!!

[Nadia]

That is true... I was basing my response on her being able to tolerate milk in general. Gia... how did you realize you had problems with whey and casein? Was it only by going off them? My digestion is really good lately and I always have a cup of kefir in the morning. I also eat cheese almost every day. If it were affecting me in a negative way would I notice it in my digestion? I sometimes consider going off all milk products as an experiment, but have not had the determination to try it yet.

 

Basil... I also suggest trying reducing the number of grains. I just had my morning kefir and it was way more sour and waterier, and it was because I let my grains overgrow. (I eat the excess).

[GiaK]

yes...for a very long time I didn't think I had issues with dairy...my intolerances are very complex...though I don't think I'm particularly unusual and I think anyone with severe protracted withdrawal issues would do well to consider food issues...it's like an insane puzzle...heavy duty detective work

 

since I've been off milk I've tried to add whey protein powder as it's a very good way to get a glutathione boost and most people are not allergic to whey...and thus I discovered whey too is not something my body likes.

 

it bums me out.

[GiaK]

oh...I was eating kefir daily for a long time...thinking it was good for me...losing it was something I had to mourn :-(

[basildev]

Giak, I will mourn too if I have to give up kefir.

 

I never used to be able to tolerate whey powders either until I came across dr. mercola's whey powder. I take it a couple of times per day and maybe because it has probiotics in it, I don't know, but by body is fine with it.

 

Nadia, I've reduced the grains too but that doesn't make much of a difference. No matter though, I don't care if it's watery; I'm using it more for the probiotics than taste.

 

I'm pretty positive I'm not intolerant of casein either, since I have no issues with cottage cheese etc...

 

I'm thinking that maybe my body is just getting used to the 'good bacteria' and it could be an adjustment phase I'm going through. I'm going to keep going with it.

 

Thanks for your input girls:)