iicanoteii: Remeron Withdrawal? or Just me?

[iicanoteii]

Had a bought of BAD BAD BAD anxiety at age 23 (I'm now 30). Didnt know what was wrong with me. Couldnt sleep, eat, or sit still for 6 days. I thought I was sick. Went to the Dr.. Said what I was experiencing was anxiety. He gave me Ativan and Lexapro. That was 6 years ago. I ditched the Lexapro and only took Ativan. But I took it sparingly, b/c I did not like the thought of withdrawal or addiction. My Dr. told me that I can not get addicted.

 

Long story short over a 4 year period I had SO many UPS and DOWNS, strange symptoms that got weirder and weirder as the years went on. Numerous Dr visits. All crazy symptoms were ALWAYS written off as anxiety. The remedy? Take more ativan. Over a 4 years span I went from taking 0.25mg (and that knocked me out) to taking 2mg. Still not daily, but I realized I was building tolerance. I did research after getting REALLY sick, and found out I was going through benzo tolerance withdrawal. Probably have been for 4 years. My Dr. didnt believe me, so I saw a psychiatrist who believed me and helped me ween off. He gave me Remeron to help ween off. It worked wonders.

 

I then got excited about Remeron b/c I didnt think it was that potent. I was told it was more of a antihistimine at lower doses. It helped me sleep, and most of all helped with appetite. After weening off ativan, and swearing to NEVER touch a benzo again, I then weened off Remeron. It was not that difficult. Months went by and I seemed to have gotten my life back. It was amazing. But then I started having issues with sleep. So I thought 'd start up a small dose of Remeron again, thinking it was nothing. Fearing another withdrawal though, I only took Remeron for a month, then weened off. I did this kind of sporadic use for the past 2 years.

 

Example: On Remeron 7.5mg or 3.75mg for 1 month, then OFF for 2 months or 3, then Back ON Remeron for 1-2 months, then OFF for 2  months. This spring/summer of 2013, I was still having issues with sleep, but also having issues with high stress with the sell of our home and purchase of our new home. I was SO stressed, I couldnt handle it. SO I broke down and started taking Remeron again 7.5mg then to 3.75mg. Except this time, I could not ween off. I was on it for 1.5 months, and when I weened off, I kept getting these adrenaline surges in my sleep for 3 nights straight, followed by a heart rate of 114bpm. I then reinstated the drug at 3.75mg and did a SLOWER ween.

 

This made a total of 3 months of being on Remeron this time. That's the LONGEST I've ever been on it in one stretch. Basically I weened down til I got down to taking crumbs. The first few days were okay once I was off. Then the Adrenaline surges started again, mostly at night in my sleep. I could NOT sleep for 6 nights. I was pacing the floors, my heart rate was SOOOO high. 120bpm. I would be shaking and sweating. It was HELL. I finally broke down and HAD to go to the Dr.. I could not function at work. It was awful.

 

The Dr. told me it was not Remeron withdrawal and that I needed something. He said it was the return of my anxiety. I did not believe him. This was TOO intense. I then called the psychiatrist who I had not seen in 2 years who helped me get off ativan. I was hopeful he would help me and believe me that it was withdrawal. My Dr. gave me a small script of xanax. I swore I'D NEVER take a benzo again, but I was feeling SOOOO ROUGH I took a few rescue doses, but THAT WAS IT. NEVER AGAIN.

 

I then finally got into my psychiatrist, and was very disappointed. He told me I needed medication the rest of my life. He told me this in a 30 minute session. I was feeling SOOO POORLY, that I started to second guess myself. He prescribed me Serequel 50mg. I told him I'd take it. I took it 1 night, and 1 night ONLY. It was what I call THE DEVILS DRUG. It made me hallucinate in my sleep. Like REALLY bad sleep paralysis. I called his office the next morning and told them I WAS NOT TAKING IT, NOR was I taking ANY MORE PSYCH MEDS. I told them I believe this is Remeron withdrawal.

 

These adrenaline shocks ARE NOT ME. I prayed to God, waited it out, and sure enough I slowly started feeling BETTER. Day by day. Now Im 32 days clean off Remeron, and Ive had my ups and downs. I cant really complain compared to 3 weeks ago. But Im glad I stuck it out. Symptoms Im having: sleep is better, but some nights are choppy with early morning awakening. Mind chatter some nights in my sleep if awaken early in the morning or awakening in the middle of the night. Like I hear my own subconscious voice in my head chattering away. Im NOT hearing voices, its just my over active subconscious mind.

 

Im also losing appetite again, even though it came back a week or 2 ago pretty good. Ive also been having the urge to cry here and there. I feel some sort of weird "disconnection" feeling, not quite depersonalization, but kind of?? Im gassy. I feel depressed kind of? Cant feel like I can really relax. Just overall crappy. But yet, OKAY. I also struggle mostly with the fact of "Is this withdrawal still 4 weeks out? Is this just me? Can I do this without medication?" It's just tough. But I'm hanging in there.

Edited November 21, 2013 by Petu
Added member name to title

[iicanoteii]

anyone?

[tezza]

Hi iicanoteii, welcome! Your psychiatrist sounds typical. Most say we NEED the medicine! Phooey!!

 

Yes, it is still WD four weeks out and can last months or even years if not done slowly enough. It doesn't sound like you were getting the same dose toward the end, at least. (Compsports came off too fast and is still suffering, I think a couple of years, now).

 

I'm so glad you didn't take the Seroquel!

 

I know you don't want to hear this but your best option is to try a very small dose of Remeron, maybe 2mg, by making it into a liquid so you can measure precisely and make VERY tiny cuts after you feel stabilized. I'm using this method of tapering Remeron, myself.

 

I'm going to post this, then find some links especially for you...

 

I've been losing what I've keyed if I leave and come back with links.

[tezza]

Tapering Remeron:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2028-tips-for-tapering-off-remeron-mirtazapine/

[tezza]

How to make a liquid:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

[iicanoteii]

So you are saying that even though I've been off Remeron for 32 days, I should reinstate 2mg? Why not just continue to stay off of it for good?

 

I want to make sure you understand how I've taken it over the past 2 years. I havent taken it for 2 years solid. Just On and Off. Like Yo Yo use.

 

For instance, I would take it for a month, let's say December, then I would be weened off by the end of december, then not touch remeron for Jan, Feb or March. Then I'd start it up again, due to insomnia or other issues.

 

This time around I took it for 3 months. I NEVER had this problem coming off Remeron in the past. It was NEVER this bad. But I do have a past history of anxiety, so it's hard to determine what's ME and what's W/D.

 

Sucks. lol.

 

So you are suggesting though going back on a small dose?

[Petunia]

So you are saying that even though I've been off Remeron for 32 days, I should reinstate 2mg? Why not just continue to stay off of it for good?

 

 

Its completely your decision what you decide to do, but the reason for reinstating a small amount is that it may relieve your current withdrawal symptoms.  There is no guarantee at 32 days out though.

 

If it works, you could wait several weeks until you are stabilized and then begin a slow, safe taper from that amount as described in the links Tezza posted.  The idea behind this is to come off the medication with a minimum of discomfort and disruption to your life.

 

You could also choose to stay off it for good and endure the symptoms, for how ever long they last.

 

I understand your confusion about why you have managed to stop taking it before, with no problems, but now are struggling.  Its likely that the fact you have started and stopped it so often over the past 2 years has contributed to what you are experiencing now.  I would think your nervous system has become destabilized by all the changes over the last 2 years, and now this latest 3 month course and what sounds like a fast taper.

 

I'm sorry you are going through all this, please let us know what you decide to do and keep us updated of your progress.  I hope you feel better soon.

[tezza]

 

So you are saying that even though I've been off Remeron for 32 days, I should reinstate 2mg? Why not just continue to stay off of it for good?

 Its completely your decision what you decide to do, but the reason for reinstating a small amount is that it may relieve your current withdrawal symptoms.  There is no guarantee at 32 days out though. If it works, you could wait several weeks until you are stabilized and then begin a slow, safe taper from that amount as described in the links Tezza posted.  The idea behind this is to come off the medication with a minimum of discomfort and disruption to your life. You could also choose to stay off it for good and endure the symptoms, for how ever long they last. I understand your confusion about why you have managed to stop taking it before, with no problems, but now are struggling.  Its likely that the fact you have started and stopped it so often over the past 2 years has contributed to what you are experiencing now.  I would think your nervous system has become destabilized by all the changes over the last 2 years, and now this latest 3 month course and what sounds like a fast taper. I'm sorry you are going through all this, please let us know what you decide to do and keep us updated of your progress.  I hope you feel better soon.

Agreed...

[iicanoteii]

Hey guys. Thanks again for responding so kindly!

 

Last night was AWFUL, and today I'm feeling ROUGH too at work. I can barely focus.

 

Last night had it's ups and downs, but then took a turn for the worst.

 

I got home from work, had zero appetite, felt wired. Couldnt seem to sit still and relax. I finally took a shower, got in my pjs and played with the kids a bit, I felt much better then for some reason. More relaxed.

 

Then as it got closer to time to go to bed, I started feeling anxious again. In bed my legs started trembling, I couldnt stop. I felt as if I was pumped with fear and anxiety.

 

I told my wife that I needed to take a xanax which I have a script for, but dont' take them. I've been benzo free for 2 years.

 

She talked me out of taking a xanax, and told me to take 2 Unisom tablets instead (unisom is OTC sleep med, basically antihistimine) I took 2, got out of bed and laid on the couch and played with my phone. I then fell asleep on the couch for 2 hours. I woke up at 2:30am feeling cruddy still, crawled into bed, but managed to fall asleep.

 

I then woke up at 6am wide awake, which is super early for me, and had mind chatter and BAD waves of bad energy over my body in waves. My skin almost felt tingly all over. I laid in bed til 9am, just tossing and turning and sighing. It was awful. I've been at work today, and feel awful. Don't feel like I can sit still or concentrate. 

 

I called a psychologist today who is also a minister. He has 30+ years in psychology. He is NOT a psychiatrist. I'm hoping some CBT can help me through this. Whether it's withdrawal or a relapse in anxiety.

 

How can you tell the difference?

[tezza]

Usually, in WD , people will say it's unlike any anxiety, depression, (or whatever the symptom) than they ever felt before. That's how I knew, I'd never felt that way before.

[mammaP]

Hi iicanoteii, I agree with Petu and Tezza that reinstating a tiny amount might make you more comfortable. 

It's your call and we all understand your reluctance to start again but there is a chance you might be able to 

stabilise and taper slowly without too much trouble.It's a tough choice and whichever way you decide to go

I hope you can feel better very soon, withdrawal sucks! 

[Jemima]

Your off and on use of Remeron has very likely contributed to your difficulties with anxiety and sleeplessness all along. You didn't say if you took the Lexapro at all, but starting that and stopping abruptly can also bring on withdrawal symptoms.  Starting and stopping antidepressants and other psychiatric drugs without a very slow taper off is one of the nastiest things you can do to yourself.

 

I agree with my fellow staff members that reinstating, stabilizing, and tapering off very slowly is probably the best thing you can do.  Otherwise, I anticipate that you'll have long term withdrawal symptoms and continue the off-and-on pattern which is a straight shot to disaster in my opinion.

 

It would be helpful if you could give us a more specific drug history in your signature, like so: How To Add Your Drug History To Your Signature

[tgirl]

How are you doing now?

[Altostrata]

Welcome, iicanoteii.

 

Have your symptoms overall gradually gotten better over the 32-plus days you've been off Remeron?

 

You were taking 3.5mg for a while in the last round, correct? When did you drop from 7.5mg to 3.5mg? Did you feel any effects from that change?

 

Withdrawal symptoms come in waves. It might be helpful if you kept notes on paper about your daily symptom pattern, too see if they're getting better or worse.

[tgirl]

Hello there,

just wondering how you are doing?

Please keep updating.

[cactussunset]

Are you still active on here. I have those horrible adrenaline shocks as well.

[Irvingkirsch]

Hey guys. Thanks again for responding so kindly!

 

Last night was AWFUL, and today I'm feeling ROUGH too at work. I can barely focus.

 

Last night had it's ups and downs, but then took a turn for the worst.

 

I got home from work, had zero appetite, felt wired. Couldnt seem to sit still and relax. I finally took a shower, got in my pjs and played with the kids a bit, I felt much better then for some reason. More relaxed.

 

Then as it got closer to time to go to bed, I started feeling anxious again. In bed my legs started trembling, I couldnt stop. I felt as if I was pumped with fear and anxiety.

 

I told my wife that I needed to take a xanax which I have a script for, but dont' take them. I've been benzo free for 2 years.

 

She talked me out of taking a xanax, and told me to take 2 Unisom tablets instead (unisom is OTC sleep med, basically antihistimine) I took 2, got out of bed and laid on the couch and played with my phone. I then fell asleep on the couch for 2 hours. I woke up at 2:30am feeling cruddy still, crawled into bed, but managed to fall asleep.

 

I then woke up at 6am wide awake, which is super early for me, and had mind chatter and BAD waves of bad energy over my body in waves. My skin almost felt tingly all over. I laid in bed til 9am, just tossing and turning and sighing. It was awful. I've been at work today, and feel awful. Don't feel like I can sit still or concentrate. 

 

I called a psychologist today who is also a minister. He has 30+ years in psychology. He is NOT a psychiatrist. I'm hoping some CBT can help me through this. Whether it's withdrawal or a relapse in anxiety.

 

How can you tell the difference?

 

Getting off Remeron was almost as bad for me as going cold turkey off 100 mg of Parnate. Coming off both was like cold turkeying heroin. I had all your Remeron withdrawal symptoms. The worst of the withdrawal was over in 4 or 5 weeks. The adreneline surges and restlessness went on for another few months after that at least.