AlexKidd: Lexapro nightmare, need advice.

[AlexKidd]

Thanks for your reply Dina

Well I definitely can't afford that test anyway, way too expensive for me atm. I'm not sure if I'm a fast or slow metaboliser, the severe pains and side effects I've got from this stuff makes me think maybe I'm a slow metaboliser of it and it builds up in my system. They are so bad that sometimes I wonder if this stuff is actually going to kill me. Its very hard to hold sometimes because I just want to get more of it out of my system, but I know I can only go as quickly as my nervous system will allow me. Its going to take me years to get off it at this rate, quite a depressing thought, but what else can I do? The alternative is to go CT and be in absolute hell for years. I dont think I would be able to handle that! This drug has caused me so much pain and suffering, its hard to stay positive sometimes.

[Petunia]

So I'm going to try another taper in a week or two. I'm currently taking a 15 mg tablet plus 3 mg in liquid every day. I can only get the 20 mg/ml liquid though, so I'm going to try to dilute it with water to get more accurate doses as I want to reduce by 5% increments from here on. I know 5% of 18 mg is .90 mg, but I'm just wondering how I'd go about getting that dose by diluting the liquid?I've never been very good with figures! By the way, I'll still be taking a 15 mg tablet every day. Also, it says on the bottle that the liquid must be used within 8 weeks of opening it. Is this definitely true? Or could you still use it after that without it deteriorating?

Many thanks, Alex.

 

I've asked for some more help with this Alex, my brain isn't working too well right now either

 

This drug has caused me so much pain and suffering, its hard to stay positive sometimes.

 

Hang in there, you will get through this, you're not alone, we are all going through it.

[AlexKidd]

Thank you Petunia

Yeah, it really messes up your brain alright doesn't it? Since I've been on it I've had a lot of short term memory problems, forgetting simple words, etc. Before I went on it I had a very good sense of humour and razor sharp wit, but that seems to have deserted me now.

It definitely helps knowing I'm not alone in this, this site has been a godsend for me. Everyone is so supportive and give great advice. If I kept following my doc's advice God knows how I'd be feeling now. He even suggested putting me on Olanzapine at one stage! I think I'll pass on the tardive dyskinesia and diabetes, thank you very much. I told him I just want to get off this drug and I absolutely refuse to ingest any other toxic substance.

[Dina]

I also had horrible beginning effects on lexapro. They lasted for 3 months and they faded away. Each of the 2 times that i had re-instated i had the same horrible beginning effects. Anyway. About Diluting.

Take 1 ml of 20mg/ml solution. Put in clean dry container. Add 99 ml distilled water.u now have 100 ml of liquid with 20 mg of lexapro in it. It means that if u take 1 ml of this new concoction u have 0.2 mg lexapro in it. Very useful for adjusting small doses. Same calculation apply when u want to make a solution of 20 mg per 10 ml i.e. 2 mg / ml. U just add 9 ml water to 1 ml solution u bought. I think its correct. Bon appetit!

[JanCarol]

Hey Alexkidd, Dina's math and procedure looks good. Though you might not need to dilute quite that much, as you need to be concerned about use-by date.

 

Yes, the solution from the chemist will spoil!  It will get weaker and weaker, until you won't be getting the exact dose you need.  Very important to pay attention to use-by date on liquid.

 

ALSO, if you dilute, adding water to the liquid, you will shorten its shelf life.  I'm not a liquid expert, but I've heard 4 days max, and sometimes 3 days only.  Kept in the fridge.

 

Apparently you can have an oral syringe out of the fridge for a few hours, if you need to travel with a dose, but it loses potency fast.

 

Anyone else know - if you put a tablet in liquid, it spoils quickly; if you put a liquid in liquid, is it the same?

[Rhiannon]

So I'm going to try another taper in a week or two. I'm currently taking a 15 mg tablet plus 3 mg in liquid every day. I can only get the 20 mg/ml liquid though, so I'm going to try to dilute it with water to get more accurate doses as I want to reduce by 5% increments from here on. I know 5% of 18 mg is .90 mg, but I'm just wondering how I'd go about getting that dose by diluting the liquid?I've never been very good with figures! By the way, I'll still be taking a 15 mg tablet every day. Also, it says on the bottle that the liquid must be used within 8 weeks of opening it. Is this definitely true? Or could you still use it after that without it deteriorating?

Many thanks, Alex.

 

Oops, I wrote a long post then realized I had misread, I thought you said 20 mg per 20 mL or 1 mg per mL. Let me redo that.

[Rhiannon]

 Hi Alex,

 

just seen your lexapro thread and decided to chime in. I have looked very quickly at the messages here and looks like you got a lot of useful replies of how to get off the thing. As one of the ex-lexapro users (see my signature), i would like to warn you about something which i had learned from my own (bad) experience with tapering lexapro:  even though you taper slow in the beginning , you have to go EVEN SLOWER at the end of the taper. A small amount of lex in your system can have a huge effect. It lookes like you react to even small changes at high doses. I would think that you may be a quick metaboliser of this drug (there is a liver enzyme which eliminates lex from our bodies, and while the dosages are calculated for the average person, there are people out there who eliminate the drug slower (me) or very very quickly (you)). In case you are a quick metaboliser, you must go even slower than the 10% rule. Otherwise your body can't keep up with the change. And even slower at smaller doses. It is possible to test whether you are one of the rapid metabolisers, but this test has to be sent to the US and costs around 600 euro, so  unless you can afford it, it is actually better to assume you are a quick metaboliser and taper EXTREMELY SLOWLY. In case i have repeated somebody's else advice, sorry for doing so, i just have a busy day with a small child and can read here only when he sleeps.

Just want to say, this is actually true with all these meds, it's not just about metabolizing them; they are all very powerful and have to be reduced slowly at the lowest doses.

 

The charts here show why: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6036-why-taper-paper-demonstrates-importance-of-gradual-change-in-plasma-concentration/ 

[Rhiannon]

I also had horrible beginning effects on lexapro. They lasted for 3 months and they faded away. Each of the 2 times that i had re-instated i had the same horrible beginning effects. Anyway. About Diluting.

Take 1 ml of 20mg/ml solution. Put in clean dry container. Add 99 ml distilled water.u now have 100 ml of liquid with 20 mg of lexapro in it. It means that if u take 1 ml of this new concoction u have 0.2 mg lexapro in it. Very useful for adjusting small doses. Same calculation apply when u want to make a solution of 20 mg per 10 ml i.e. 2 mg / ml. U just add 9 ml water to 1 ml solution u bought. I think its correct. Bon appetit!

 

That math looks correct to me.

 

I think it might be good to get a 1 mg/mL solution because that way each milliliter of liquid holds a milligram of drug, and that makes it easier to do the math and figure out what you're getting. 

 

The first dose will be 17.1 mg, so the 15 mg tablet plus 2.1 mg, and the second dose will be 16.25, so the 15 mg tablet plus 1.25 mg. If you have a syringe that has ten lines between each mL mark, that would be 2 mL plus one tenth (one line) and the second will be 1 mL plus two tenths (two lines) plus halfway to the next line. Does that make sense?

 

To get the 1 mg/mL dilution you can put 1 mL of the 20 mg/mL solution into the container with 19 mL of water for a total of 20 mL of liquid containing 20 mg of drug. If you stir that up well you should then have 1 mg of drug in 1 mL of solution.

 

I don't know how long that will last but I would guess that refrigerated it should be good for 2-3 days.

[AlexKidd]

Thanks very much for your help guys, I really appreciate it!

I think I will go with the 20 ml diluting method, I can use a higher dilution when I get to lower doses. I'm feeling pretty good the past couple of days, if I'm feeling good next week I think I may try my next taper. I just need to get some bigger oral syringes as I only have a 1ml one at the moment. Although I suppose I could still work with that. Thanks again folks

[AlexKidd]

Feeling really bad today, it's been 8 weeks now since I reduced from 18 mg to 19 mg. Shouldn't I be feeling better at this stage? I've been measuring my dose with the oral syringe perfectly every day. I keep the liquid in the fridge but I take the dropper cap off when I take my dose because the syringe tip doesn't fit into it properly. Could this be affecting the stability of the liquid, by being exposed to air, light etc. when I take it off?

Or maybe its stress that's causing my problems, I can't help it but I'm still stressing about the relationship even though its been three months.

[AlexKidd]

Ok I think I'm actually going to go crazy from this stuff, the obsessive thoughts about my ex girlfriend are driving me crazy. I've been having quite disturbing thoughts about harming myself and others, I know its not really me and its the drug that's causing this, but it just seems to be all consuming at the moment!

I really want to get off this but I'm afraid my mental condition will deteriorate even further when I try my next taper. The pains and stuff I'm getting from this are seriously concerning, I'm so sorry I ever touched this despicable drug in the first place.

I saw the post about micro tapering, maybe that would be a better option for me given my current mental state. Maybe it would lessen the psychological and emotional turmoil of getting off this. Any thoughts?

[AlexKidd]

I've tapered down to 18 mg Lexapro, been trying to stabilise on that dose for 9 weeks now. I went to the doctor on Monday and had like 5 vials of blood taken and I've noticed my symptoms have ramped up since. I'm just wondering if this could have caused a fluctuation in the amount of drug in my bloodstream? I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has noticed this before or has any insights?

Many thanks, Alex.

[AlexKidd]

Haven't been on here in a while. I couldn't stabilise on the liquid Lexapro, so I'm in a bit of a pickle again. I decided to try making my own liquid out of some 5 mg tablets I had at home. The tablets dissolved easily enough after 5 or 10 mins. Its really hard to get an even suspension though, the particles tend to sink pretty quickly so I'm not too sure if I've been getting the same dose everyday. Its been about 8 or 9 days since I switched. I'm currently on 18.65 mg. The pains I'm getting are really making life a misery at the moment, crazy pain in all sorts of places. Nobody should have to suffer like this.

 

I purchased a laboratory scales online the last day, it should be here on Friday hopefully.

 

http://m.ebay.ie/itm/151667331254

 

I really want to just stabilise now and continue on with my taper, all these setbacks are so demoralising.

So I'm not too sure if I'm going to weigh just the pills themselves after shaving bits off them, or crush the pills up and put them in gelatin capsules and weigh them. I want to be really precise about the dosages this time, so I'm leaning toward the latter. Anybody have any ideas or thoughts on the matter?

 

Thanks, Alex.

[LexAnger]

Thanks for the update Alex!

So sorry you are still having so much pain. I don't have much to offer but can let you know you are not alone. You are absolutely right that no one in the whole world should suffer these constant, intense and allover pains. I tried almost everything and monitored them so deliberately but unfortunately nothing helps but endure. A bit good news that I do get some days with less pain after down to 3.6 mg and hope this trend continues.

 

Hanging on, as someone said, time and slow taper is the only way for better.

[Altostrata]

You won't want to weigh your dose with the gelatin capsule, that will throw the measurements off.

[AlexKidd]

Thanks for the update Alex!

So sorry you are still having so much pain. I don't have much to offer but can let you know you are not alone. You are absolutely right that no one in the whole world should suffer these constant, intense and allover pains. I tried almost everything and monitored them so deliberately but unfortunately nothing helps but endure. A bit good news that I do get some days with less pain after down to 3.6 mg and hope this trend continues.

 

Hanging on, as someone said, time and slow taper is the only way for better.

Thanks for the reply Lex. Yes, I suppose that is all we can do. It is really hard sometimes to keep going, but the reward will come when we get off these despicable drugs for good.

 

Good to hear that the pains are lessening a bit for you.

 

Thanks, Alex.

[AlexKidd]

You won't want to weigh your dose with the gelatin capsule, that will throw the measurements off.

Thanks Alto. Which method would you use if you had to? Shaving and weighing tablets or weighing the powder of the tablets? I want to be very precise about the dosages from now on.

 

Thanks, Alex.

[AlexKidd]

So my lab scales finally arrived today, 3 days late. I'm going to start weighing out my doses from tomorrow onwards. I had a really bad night last night, took me a few hours to fall asleep. Every time I was about to fall asleep I got a pain in my chest and woke up. Pretty bad day today too, been getting burning sensations on my face, on my eyeballs etc. The pains I'm getting from this toxic drug are just horrendous, I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Its making life torturous at the moment. I can see how people kill themselves being on these drugs, you just sometimes think you'll never get off this stuff. Just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other.

[LexAnger]

so sorry to hear this alexkidd! I am having a bad neeling day as well.

one thing interesting I'd like to share with you though, that since I cut down to 3.6mg, it got lots better and gone most days. when it came back after several day's break, i do another cut which usually take care of it in 1-2 days. 

 

I know how difficult to handle this one alone thank God it lessoned a lot lately. 

 

do you still have other symptoms?

[AlexKidd]

Hi Lex, thanks for your reply.

 

Sorry to hear you're having a bad day too. Good to hear it has got better since you dropped to 3.6 mg though.

 

Its mostly the parasthesia at the moment, crawling sensation on my face sometimes too, plus the odd palpitation, chest pain, few muscle twitches and stuff.

 

Hopefully I'll be able to stabilise now that I've got the scales. I've been trying to stabilise for the past few months but its just not happening for me. I think I probably have not been getting consistent doses and that's what's caused my inability to stabilise.

 

Thanks, Alex.

[ikam]

I also have this strange crawling sensation, it is mostly on my head and face, also a bit in my knees and hands. Paraesthesia is almost gone...

 

I have not decreased anything recently, but I think that my recent (huge) stress over-activated my nervous system...

It is so strange sensation...

[AlexKidd]

I also have this strange crawling sensation, it is mostly on my head and face, also a bit in my knees and hands. Paraesthesia is almost gone...

 

I have not decreased anything recently, but I think that my recent (huge) stress over-activated my nervous system...

It is so strange sensation...

Yes, Ikam, it certainly is a very strange sensation. It has lessened a lot over the last few months and I'm pretty stable now again thankfully.

[AlexKidd]

Hello everybody, I haven't been on here in a long time so just thought I'd give a bit of an update on my situation now.

 

I'm doing much better now thankfully, I was in some pretty dark places over the past several months. This drug really messes with your head. I've been taking 18.65 mg for the past few months, shaving tablets with a razor blade and weighing them out on the lab scales. It took a while to get stable, but I've been feeling pretty good the past couple of months.

 

I've been going to the pool swimming almost every day for the past couple of months, and I've been going to the gym lifting weights for the past 6 weeks or so. I've never been in better shape physically and I've got a spring in my step for once.

 

I work in a really busy bar and summertime is the busiest time of year, so I didn't want to start tapering again until things quietened down a bit. I've been seeing a counsellor for the past 6 or 7 weeks and we're making good progress. We've only just scratched the surface, but I'm confident we can get to the bottom of the reasons why I've always struggled with poor self esteem and incredibly negative thinking.

 

I'm in a much better place and the season is winding down a bit now, so I decided it was a good time to start tapering again. I decided to go for a pretty conservative cut, I went from 18.65 to 18.25 mg. Today is my ninth day since I made the cut and I'm feeling pretty good so far. Some minor withdrawal symptoms like a few twitches and some sporadic burning sensations on my face, but very mild. Hopefully it continues to be mild.

 

I'm thinking of cutting down to 18mg maybe next week sometime, depending on how I'm feeling. My plan is to try doing a micro taper this time. Small cuts, but more frequently.

 

Thanks for listening, Alex.

[Altostrata]

Thank you, Alex. Good to hear from you.

[ikam]

Hello everybody, I haven't been on here in a long time so just thought I'd give a bit of an update on my situation now.

 

I'm doing much better now thankfully, I was in some pretty dark places over the past several months. This drug really messes with your head. I've been taking 18.65 mg for the past few months, shaving tablets with a razor blade and weighing them out on the lab scales. It took a while to get stable, but I've been feeling pretty good the past couple of months.

 

I've been going to the pool swimming almost every day for the past couple of months, and I've been going to the gym lifting weights for the past 6 weeks or so. I've never been in better shape physically and I've got a spring in my step for once.

 

I work in a really busy bar and summertime is the busiest time of year, so I didn't want to start tapering again until things quietened down a bit. I've been seeing a counsellor for the past 6 or 7 weeks and we're making good progress. We've only just scratched the surface, but I'm confident we can get to the bottom of the reasons why I've always struggled with poor self esteem and incredibly negative thinking.

 

I'm in a much better place and the season is winding down a bit now, so I decided it was a good time to start tapering again. I decided to go for a pretty conservative cut, I went from 18.65 to 18.25 mg. Today is my ninth day since I made the cut and I'm feeling pretty good so far. Some minor withdrawal symptoms like a few twitches and some sporadic burning sensations on my face, but very mild. Hopefully it continues to be mild.

 

I'm thinking of cutting down to 18mg maybe next week sometime, depending on how I'm feeling. My plan is to try doing a micro taper this time. Small cuts, but more frequently.

 

Thanks for listening, Alex.

Hi Alex,

in my view therapy/counselling is very important, as it helps to get to the roots of problem...It has helped me a lot. I understand my triggers better, still get surprised when something hits me badly...

 

I want to do micro taper as well, but I have problem with starting the process...

[AlexKidd]

Hello everybody. Just checking in, haven't been on here in a long time.

I finally managed to get off the Lexapro completely. I didn't even taper it, I just went cold turkey and didn't have any withdrawal symptoms whatsoever. I got myself really fit and strong and was seeing a counsellor and made great progress. I had a breakthrough in therapy and went on a bit of a high for 10 days, never felt so confident in all my life. I felt as if I could do anything.

Then something really stressful happened and I started drinking again. I was drinking for a few months and had unprotected sex with a girl and got prescribed Ciprofloxacin. I did something incredibly stupid and took one 500mg pill and I have been floxed now, I can't even work in my parents' bar now. It has affected my legs and joints badly and I've had terrible pains all over my body since.

I just feel so incredibly stupid for taking it without researching it properly. I had a quick look at the Wikipedia page but didn't see the part about tendon rupture and other side effects.

After all I went through with the Lexapro I cannot believe I've got myself into this situation, I just feel like a complete fool. I'm only 32 and should be in the prime of my life and this drug has severely harmed me and I don't know if I'm going to recover from it. What a disaster

[nz11]

Alex great to hear from you why so long between posts?

Anyway thanks for the update.

So how did you taper? And when did you go drug free off the lex?

Given that 17 months ago you were on 18.25mg of lex and now on none reveals you have tapered faster than the 10% method rec here.

 

Hypomania and acting impulsively irrationally and irresponsibly are all wdl symptoms. Many people come of these drugs and experience this before  the crash.

[AlexKidd]

I hadn't been on here because I was enjoying life. I was seeing a counsellor and was exercising a lot, was finally starting to feel happy for once in my life. I think the more you dwell on the medication the worse you will be, when I started doing things I really enjoyed I felt much better. I just stopped taking the Lexapro and I was fine, I didn't have any withdrawal symptoms whatsoever. It's 11 months since I stopped taking the Lexapro.

I had been off the drink for 3 years, but I started drinking again for a while and made that really stupid mistake. It has been a very costly error of judgement. I only took one pill of Cipro but it has severely affected my quality of life, I'm feeling incredibly stupid for taking it. After my experience with Lexapro I can't believe I've ruined my life by taking that stuff.

[LexAnger]

So sorry alexkidd,

You may want to check out areman thread. He survived lexapro 4 yrs after CT, then cipro throw him back to a similar hell. I believe he is recovered after many months or a year since then.

[LexAnger]

Here is his topic

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7761-☼-aeroman-hello-from-aeroman/page-8#entry252335

[AlexKidd]

Thanks, LexAnger. His symptoms were mostly CNS related. They tend to heal quicker than the bad musculoskeletal issues I'm having. I've been hit pretty hard in that department. It's just so devastating - I was in the best shape of my life this time last year and now I can't even work, nevermind work out. I don't know if I'll ever recover from this, a lot of people are permanently damaged by these drugs.

How are you doing with your tapering these days?

[LexAnger]

hi Alexkidd,

 

Thanks for asking about me!

I'm in a very bad shape currently after a big dro in dose due to severe drug reaction. Yeah, I often feel my faith is in shaking about the permenant damage these poisons made to us. But I do try to convience myself by thinking about those success stories. And when I am in a window even just half hour or so, I tend to feel hopeful and confident. I think these drugs also make you think that way.

 

So how are you these couple days? Are you feeling any better?

 

Please don't give up hope. From what I read, Cipro is not as nasty as the SSirs and the side effects won't last that long.

[AlexKidd]

I'm sorry you're not feeling too well at the moment, hopefully you will stabilise and start to feel better soon!

 

I can tell you from first hand experience that the Cipro is a million times worse than SSRI's. I always thought Lexapro was the worst drug ever when I was on it, but this stuff is absolutely horrific. It is toxic to muscles,tendons, cartilage and all connective tissue. The list of side effects from this stuff is absolutely mind boggling. The side effects can actually be PERMANENT in a lot of cases.

 

It's 11 weeks since I took that one pill and it has destroyed my quality of life. I can't work in my parents' bar now, can't exercise, can't do anything strenuous. I've had terrible pains all over my body since, cracking joints, peripheral neuropathy and loads of other adverse effects too. I don't think I'll ever fully recover from this, it's an absolutely horrific drug and should be taken off the market completely.

 

Feeling so incredibly stupid for taking it now, I really should've learned my lesson after the Lexapro. This stuff has literally ruined my life, I was in the prime of my life before I took it and it has severely damaged my body.

[LexAnger]

I'm so sorry you were hurt so badly. It's absolutely heartbreaking that you were hit twice by these poisons! It makes me very angry!

 

Do you think it's anything to do with the original damage made by Lexapro? I'm amazed by how well you were doing since being off Lexapro. It seems you had difficulties before trying to get off lex, so it's quite mysterious the last time it went so well. Do you mind of sharing more details about your experience with that?

 

Anyway, I really believe it won't be permenant. Even the brain altering poisons like ssir damage can be healed, how could it be possible anything else hurts people permenantly. You are so young and your body has amazing healing ability. You got to have faith in it.

 

Hardest lessons learned for all of us, never take any drug before careful checking online. Never put trust in anyone else especially doctors.

 

When I lose hope, I watch the movie shawsank redemption over and over again. It gives me streghth and keeps me going.

 

Hugs,

Lex

[Aeroman]

CNS issues dont tend to heal quicker - they are harder to detect.  I had both physical and mental issues and both resolved with time.