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Josie99: Withdrawal from polydrugs


Josie99

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Posted (edited)
Hi,
 
I've been reading everyone's posts over the last 6 months silently rooting for each of you.  I found this site after I came out of the hospital the end of February 2017.  
 
I was on an antidepressant combination drug, Limbritrol, for 12 years. The doctors in the hospital stopped the medication cold turkey with no tapering. I have no memory of the month I was in the ICU. My son was told by the doctors I was dying and I was in withdrawal but chose not to reinstate. Limbritrol is a combination drug that consists of Librium and Amitriptyline. I was on 75 mg.
 
After I was removed from the ICU, I was put on three new drugs I had never heard of or had been prescribed before. I was never told why I needed to take all these drugs. This was the beginning of a nightmare I am still living. 
 
I was put on mirtazepine 15 mg then reduced to 7.5, zyprexa at 2.5 mg then increased to 7 mg, depakote at 250 mg then increased to 500 mg., and ambien 5 mg all over a 9 day period while still in the hospital. 
 
I'm really not sure if I had serotonin toxicity from the combination of all the drugs in my system, or if there was one offending drug. I just knew I needed to get off all the drugs, but slowly. That did not happen. 
 
The nurse practitioner took me off the ambien immediately over a two week period right after I came out out of the hospital.  Within a week, I suffered from a ruptured eardrum and was put back in the hospital for four days. I believed then and still believe today that the drugs caused the ruptured eardrum. One month later I suffered a second rupture in the other ear and lost my hearing in both ears. 
 
After the second hospitalization, I lost my balance and couldn't walk. I starting having horrible panic attacks and experienced visual depth issues. The most terrifying experience was when I couldn't swallow. It's almost if I had lost the functional ability to swallow. I called the nurse practitioner and was told to go to the ER. 
 
Other than taking my blood pressure, no other tests were done once I told the doctors about all the psychiatric drugs I was taking. I was told I it was probably side effects from the mirtazapine. 
 
The nurse practitioner took me off the mirtazapine over a two week period and put me back on 25 mg of amitriptyline. Even though I had only been on the mirtazapine for six weeks, I experienced severe akathasis, derealization and depersonalization. 
 
I have never felt so terrified in my life. I told the nurse to take me off the zyprexa when I found out I was taking an antipsychotic. I didn't understand why I would even  be prescribed an antipsychotic. Again, I was tapered over just a two week period. 
 
Six weeks after leaving the hospital, I came off ambien in the first two weeks, mirtazapine after six weeks, zyprexa after six weeks, depakote after four months, and amitriptyline after four and half months. 
 
I was put on 25 mg of doxipen to deal with all the withdrawal issues I continue to have. I'm only a shell of a person I once was. I'm dealing with so many withdrawal issues that I don't know which drug is causing what. I haven't slept for six minutes months. I feel permanently damaged and I don't know why anyone would do this do another human being. I want to come off the doxipen but I don't think I can handle another two week taper. 
 
I'm sorry this is such a long post. There are so many courageous people on this site and everyone's story gives me hope that maybe I can become drug free. 
 
Edited by ChessieCat

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • ChessieCat changed the title to Josie99: Withdrawal from polydrugs
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

Hi Josie, welcome to SA. I was saddened to read your story of the way you were treated. Why on earth would a hospital take you off a drug cold turkey after 12 years? That is not actually a question I need an answer to, just angry on your behalf!   Sadly they don't have a clue what they are dealing with and prescribe drugs because it is all they know.  They are faced with a patient who is so very sick and do what they do, add or change a drug.   

Right now your nervous system is wrecked but it is working on regaining homeostasis. Things are happening all the time that you are unaware of. I liken it to untangling a huge ball of string, or a box of tangled necklaces. It takes a long time but will be done!  

 

How long have you been taking doxepin?

Do you have side effects that you are aware of? It will be hard to distinguish what is withdrawal and what is side effects.

Is there a pattern to your symptoms?  

Do you feel better after taking doxepin, even slightly, or worse after taking it?  

Hold on that for now until we have the drug history. 

I hope you recovered your hearing, that must have been very frightening.  

 

It will help us if you can fill in your signature as best you can. With all those drugs it might take a while but will give us an idea of the time frame. 

Just the approximate dates started and stopped, if you can remember. You can find instructions here... 

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/12364-please-put-your-withdrawal-history-in-your-signature/

 

About withdrawal and regrowing your brain. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1160-brain-remodeling/

 

There are lots of links to interesting topics on withdrawal syndrome. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/603-what-is-withdrawal-syndrome/

 

I am so glad that you joined us, we will support you through this and try to find ways of helping to ease the withdrawal without resorting to more drugs. 

 

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

Posted
Hi mammaP,
 
Thank you for your kind words and for the links. I have many more withdrawal issues than was included in the post. It's hard to keep track of everything that is happening. 
I do have waves and windows, but I don't know from which drug I've come off of, if that makes sense. 
I started the doxepin 3 weeks ago. I was put on the doxepin because of the extreme insomnia. It doesn't help with the insomnia but it may help a little bit with anxiety. I want so much to be off all drugs but I'm really scared to taper the doxipen when I'm still withdrawing from the amitriptyline. The pattern I've noticed when I taper is first I feel great like my brain/body is so happy to be free of the chemical toxins. Then depending on the drug, I feel the full impact of headaches, nausea, dizziness, extreme anxiety, dr/do, visual disturbances, my arms and legs extending, restless legs and arms, akathasia, fear, dread, agoraphobia and pain in my upper back, extreme fatigue and weakness, and blackouts when I bend over. The depression I feel is like a chemotherapy kind of depression. I don't have any motivation or life force but at the same time I don't feel like it's really me that is depressed. 
The nurse practitioner doesn't believe that I have been in withdrawal. I'm pretty shut down right now and really rely on everyone's posts to explain what is happening to me. I am scared because I can't take 6 more months of this. 
Thank you for your post. I will read the links you sent.
Josie99
 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted

Hi mammaP,

 

I read the link you sent to me on brain remodeling. I can't emphasize enough how helpful this information is especially the part that all neuractive drugs are not like taking an aspirin that is then excreted from your system after 24 hours. That really hit home for me. If we can start to understand, and accept that even if the drug (s) are eliminated from our system over a period of hours, days and weeks, the brain still relies on the drug to function - and that is at the crux of withdrawing from these drugs. For example, even though I'm starting taking doxipen to deal with withdrawing from the amitriptyline, I'm still feeling withdrawal from the amitriptyline because I was on it for 5 months and the brain still needs amitriptyline to function. It's like a car that uses diesel instead of gas, both gas and diesel are a type of fuel, but if you have a car that uses only diesel fuel, changing to gas will not do anything for your car and it will not function until it is converted to gas. This is a simplistic analogy, but hopefully helpful in some small way. I realized I haven't cried or laughed since I was put on all the drugs. I also haven't been able to take care of my cat, Josie. There's just something so very wrong with drugs that can take away our core humanity. 

Josie99

 

 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

I like that analogy Josie, you have got it, it isn't about getting the drug out of the body it's about the brain trying to function without it.  In your case there were many drugs and it looks like your withdrawal is from the benzo as much as anything. Benzo withdrawal is brutal and you were taking them in some form for many years. They were stopped cold turkey not just once but twice. Add to that all the other drug changes and it leaves a very upset nervous system. Frankly I can't believe that a medical professional can do that and not know anything at all about benzo withdrawal!  Amitryptiline and doxepin are both trycyclic anti depressants and it is good that the doxepin is helping a little with the anxiety. Is the doxepin the only thing you take now?  Can you add that to your signature for us?  It would be best not to stop that now when you are so unstable, you can taper that later, the main thing now is to get stable. 

Many of us here find that fish oil and megnesium help with withdrawal.  If you try them you should start with a very low dose and increase slowly. Only start one at a time. 

 

I am truly sorry to see that you have been treated this way, it breaks my heart to see so many people suffering the effects of these drugs. You will recover and will need to take very good care of yourself. Eat as well as you can, good fresh food, plain and simple. Bone broth is amazing, put some beef bones in a slow cooker and leave for 24 hours, then strain and drink the broth. It is really good for calming the digestive system. I need to buy another because I broke the bowl and really miss the broth. My local butcher gives the bones away and cuts them up. It is the collagen that is so good for us. I'm sorry if you are vegetarian, if you are, ignore that suggestion! 

 

There are many topics in the symptoms and self care section that will help you to cope with withdrawal. Members have shared what has helped and what has not. 

 

Fish oil

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/?view=findpost&p=100596&hl=magnesium

 

Magnesium

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1300-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

Paleo diets

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/890-scdgapspaleo-diets/?view=findpost&p=25707&hl=diet

 

Diets for supporting recovery

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4140-diets-for-supporting-recovery-restriction-ketosis-raw-low-carb/

 

 

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

  • 5 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted (edited)

Hi Josie, I saw your post on another member's thread and thought I should copy it into your intro so that all the mods and other members have the opportunity to answer your question and provide advice.  

 

From your post below it looks like you are now on 5mg of doxipen but you are having difficulty tapering below that?  From what I understand from your signature it's likely that your central nervous system has been destabilized by what I see as an abrupt discontinuation of Limbritrol in February '17 and further injury to your central nervous system by another quick taper off of Ambien very shortly thereafter and then it looks like your doctor prescribed a mess of drugs to cover up the withdrawal.  I have to ask, is there any way for you to find a different medical team?  I simply can't believe that medical staff would abrupt discontinue these drugs in this manner.

 

At this time, it would be best if you didn't attempt to taper off of Doxepin (or any other drug) until your central nervous system has had a chance to recover.  After what you have been through, this could take many months or longer.  Because of the highly irresponsible way you have been managed in a very short period of time, it will be difficult to make any suggestions until we have a better idea of what is going on with you, could you please answer a few questions?   

 

Regarding Doxepin:

Do you have side effects that you are aware of? 

Is there a pattern to your symptoms?  

What are your current symptoms?

Do you feel better after taking doxepin, even slightly, or worse after taking it?  

 

A request, would you mind updating your withdrawal history signature to indicate your current medication(s) and dosage?  

 

As well, it would be a good idea if you start to track your symptoms if you haven't already been doing this.  This allows you to keep track of your daily symptom pattern and keep track of your progress and can help us see what direction you are heading in.  It will also provide more information on what suggestions we can make going forward.

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist
Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

 

6 hours ago, Josie99 said:
Hi,
I've been taking a similar older antidepressant doxipen (tricyclic antidepressant) for 2.1 months. I started at 25 mg 2 weeks, then was increased to 50 mg for 2 weeks, then tapered to 25 mg for 2 weeks, then decreased to 12.5 for 2 weeks and have been stuck at 5 mg. Every time I try to taper off, I suffer from severe withdrawal symptoms. 
Is there anyone on this forum who successfully came off the antidepressant tricyclic doxipen? 
Edited by baroquep

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

Posted
Hi baroquuep,
 
Thank you for your reply. I apologize if I posted on the wrong site. I will do my best to answer your questions. 
Signature/History? 
-I'm not sure how to update my history/signature. 
Change Medical Care to Help with Withdrawal?
- They did take me off cold turkey of the Limbitrol and 10 days to 2 weeks on all the other drugs. I'm pretty much in the same boat as everyone else on this forum when it comes to medical care; they either really don't know about withdrawal or they know but don't know what to do. 
In my case, the mental health nurse/doctor knows I'm in withdrawal but doesn't know what to do except throw more psychiatric drugs at the symptoms. My primary care doctor is concerned that I may have a heart attack. I was sent to the ER twice this week by my primary care doctor to get my high blood pressure under control and now I'm also experiencing pain in both of my kidneys.  I'm now taking 200 mg of Labeatol to bring down my blood pressure.
How do I feel after taking Doxipen?
-The symptoms don't disappear after I take 5 mg of doxipen, but the symptoms are a tiny bit more manageable. 
Current Symptoms
Extreme high blood pressure 
Extreme insomnia 
Extreme early morning cortisol anxiety 
Pain in both flanks from kidneys
Internal shaking
Extreme sensitivity to heat
Extreme nausea 
Headaches from high blood pressure 
Non-stop Restless legs 
Constant sinus drainage     
Ongoing Withdrawal?
I see what you mean that I am still going through withdrawal from all the drugs I was put on after my hospitalization. And I agree that is what is going on. Even though I have been off most of the drugs my body is still experiencing withdrawal from all these same drugs. 
My question is if I reinstate to a higher dose of doxipen, will my symptoms subside and will I stabilize, especially my extremely high blood pressure? 
As far as medical care goes, why are doctors putting patients on drugs that can kill them for mild anxiety, mild depression, mild insomnia or even for people that truly have bipolar? Wouldn't it be more responsible to treat people with supplements, nutrition and exercise than dangerous drugs? And if someone really has actual bipolar or depression, which most don't actually have statistically speaking, treat patients by hospitalizing them for a few weeks to keep them safe because the mania and it depression does go away according to the medical literature literature without resorting to drugs that can kill them? 
I am not bipolar. I'm not depressed other than a chemical depletion feeling of depression from withdrawal and I feel sad that I may lose my life from psychiatric drugs - very sad. 
Final Thoughts 
My son and my previous psychiatrist, who treated me without prescribing any medications (doctor before him was the doctor who prescribed Limbritol), told the doctors in the hospital, who did not know me and who never treated me before, that I was not bipolar, and did not drink or do any drugs, and the doctors still put me on drugs for bipolar. If the medical community is not going to listen to another doctor about their patient, does anyone really believe they are going to listen to us?

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted

Hello Josie99,

 

You had posted in my thread perhaps in error, but I wanted to chime in anyway ...

 

First off, I am so sorry for the way you have been treated, it's criminal.  Now you are left to mop up this mess.  I have to agree with Baroquep in that you should not taper off anything.  You are still so destabilized.  Wait for as long as is needed to get back to stability, even if it takes months!

 

I so identify with you and the eardrum issue.  While I was lucky to not have a rupture in my taper journey (too rapid, of course), I had such incredible pain in my ear that I was expecting something to burst at some point.  Somehow I pulled through.  

 

Know that you are not permanently damaged.  It may seem that you will never feel better, but you will.  I am rooting for you.  Please take care.  All the best.

PAST

Gabapentin:  about 6 months in 2015, 300-900 mg, cold turkeyed Sept 2015 (at same time dc'd Klonopin)

Klonopin: June 2014- Sept 2015; 1mg tapered over 6 mths, dc'd at 0.25mg, withdrawal hellish (perhaps because of concurrent dc of gabapentin)

Mirtazepine: Jumped off at 2.4 mg. (stable in 8 months).

Seroquel:  June 14 - July 24, 2016, 25 mg alternate nights; smaller doses for shorter periods. Total use about 3 months 

Lamictal: March 19, 2018 - 1 mg; March 23 - 1.25 mg; April 6 - 2mg. Discontinued at 2 mgJuly 1, 2018 due to Steven Johnson Syndrome.

 

CURRENT

Supplements: Vit D, turmeric

Naturethroid: 65 mcg for hypothyroidism

Trazodone: Oct 2015 - June 2016; 75 mg tapered over 2 mths, intense w/d after 3 weeks. Reinstatement: 07/25/16 - 25 mg; updosed 08/03/16 - 50 mg;  10/01/16-  62mg; 03/24/17 dropped to 50 mg (stable in 2.5 months)

                           Current psych meds: Trazodone 50 mg

Posted
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Hi Josie99, 
Survivor1 has posted a comment on a topic, Josie99: Withdrawal from polydrugs 

 
Survivor1 said:

Hi Survivor1,

 

You had posted in my thread perhaps in error, but I wanted to chime in anyway ...

 

Thank you so much for your kind reply. I am learning we (surviving antidepressant forum folks) are the first line of defense in dealing with psychiatric drugs. I agree with Baroquep and you that I should not taper off the doxepin. I am staying at 5 mg unless the primary care doctor decides doxipen is causing the spike in my blood pressure -at this point, who knows. 

 The tinnitus is getting better and I've have accepted that I may have permanent hearing loss in my left ear. 

There are real consequences in prescribing these drugs. My feeling is if a doctor has the authority to prescribe powerful mood altering drugs down to the cellular structure, he/she has the responsibility to take you off safely, humanely and compassionately. 

I hope I'm not permanently damaged, but it's hard to say when I'm in the foxhole. 

I'm so happy to hear you made it! And less you for continuing to help those who are in the process. 

Now, we just need to use all of our resources to disentangle ourselves from the pharmaceutical behemoths. 

Kind regards,

Josie99

 

 

 

 
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Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted

Hi baroquep, 

 

Right after I replied to your post I starting experiencing a window after being in a 3 week long horrible wave. I also wanted to mention that my days were the worst and the nights better. That has flipped, now the days are better and the nights are really bad.

Mostly depersonalization/derealization, borderline panic attacks, full on anxiety attacks, claustrophobia, agoraphobia, dread, extreme insomnia, kidney pain in both kidneys, and a type of akathasia. 

I can sit for a little while but spend most of the night pacing. 

I hope this is helpful to anyone reading this post and in answering questions about pattern of symptoms. 

Best,

Josie99

 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • Administrator
Posted

Josie, I am so sorry you're dealing with this. When you feel up to it, I suggest you write a good, stiff letter of complaint to your state Medical Board.

 

Second all mammaP said, please take care of yourself and nurture yourself. A nice bowl of bone broth once or twice a day is a good way to start. Also, you might take these supplements, they often help:

 

King of supplements: Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil)

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker

 

On 9/5/2017 at 3:13 PM, Josie99 said:

The nurse practitioner took me off the mirtazapine over a two week period and put me back on 25 mg of amitriptyline. Even though I had only been on the mirtazapine for six weeks, I experienced severe akathasis, derealization and depersonalization. 

 

Did the 25mg amitriptyline help at all?

 

What time of day do you take doxepin? What happens after you take it?

 

Please keep daily notes on paper about your symptoms, when you take your drugs, and their dosages.

 

On 10/7/2017 at 8:58 AM, Josie99 said:

My son and my previous psychiatrist, who treated me without prescribing any medications (doctor before him was the doctor who prescribed Limbritol), told the doctors in the hospital, who did not know me and who never treated me before, that I was not bipolar, and did not drink or do any drugs, and the doctors still put me on drugs for bipolar. If the medical community is not going to listen to another doctor about their patient, does anyone really believe they are going to listen to us?

 

The reason they mixed up that cocktail for you is because sloppy, careless psychiatrists call anything that's not depression or psychosis some kind of bipolar disorder, which justifies throwing a basket of drugs at the person. They think the more of that type of drug they pour on you, the more likely your nervous system will quiet down.

 

However -- and I very rarely suggest this -- a benzodiazapine or lamotrigine is more appropriate for a nervous system riled up by drug pounding. Please read

One theory of antidepressant withdrawal syndrome

Lamictal (lamotrigine) to calm post-discontinuation withdrawal symptoms

 

You mentioned a psychiatrist you liked, is this person still available to you? Or do you have a sympathetic primary care physician? Any doctor can prescribe these drugs.

 

 

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Posted (edited)

Hi Alto,

 

Thank you for your kind support. I Looking back, I don't think taking doxipen helped with the withdrawal from amitriptyline after just coming off a very hard 30 day wave. I went on doxipen to help with the withdrawal and the extreme insomnia.

 

I take doxipen at 8 in the evening. Doxipen has somewhat of a sedative effect but then there is an activating rebound effect that causes me to become wide awake instead of falling asleep. I've been oscillating on my sleep from a couple hours one night and not sleeping the next night since the first withdrawal in February. I've had a few 5 hour nights recently.

 

I just started keeping notes on my symptoms. The private doctor I was seeing can see me for free when there is a crisis. He told the nurse practitioner I was not bipolar and did not need the be on the drugs they prescribed. I have a sympathetic primary care physician; she's just not knowledgeable about withdrawal related issues. They acknowledge I'm not bipolar, but the damage is done.

 

Right now I'm in a holding pattern with my blood pressure. I don't know if the doxipen or the withdrawal is causing the hypertension - or a combination of both. After just coming out of a very long wave and experiencing a short window on Friday, and going to the ER twice in one week for hypertension, I don't know what to do about stopping doxipen and starting the lamotrigine.

 

What do you think I should do? Stop doxipen and try lamotrigine or hold? I now have an extreme reaction to benzodiazepines; my blood pressure shoots up to 260/165 range.

 

Best, 

Josie99

 
Edited by ChessieCat
changed font size and added spacing

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • Administrator
Posted

Very, very few doctors in the world are knowledgeable about withdrawal. It's good to hear you have sympathetic doctors.

 

It sounds like doxipen helps somewhat. At what time of night do you get the rebound effect?

 

Is the doxipen a tablet or powder inside a capsule?

 

It sounds like you have a paradoxical reaction to benzodiazepines. If I were you, I would avoid them.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Posted
Hi Alto,
Thank you for your reply. Unfortunately you are are right; doctors know very little about psychiatric drug withdrawal. Looks like SA is the first and last line of defense in my experience. 

My plan to hold on tapering doxipen has changed. The blood pressure medications are not controlling my hypertension, which means I must come off the doxepin. With that said, I am thinking about asking my primary doctor today about taking 5 mg of  lamotrigine.  Because lamotrigine is a sodium channel blocker, and to some degree a calcium channel blocker, does it help lower blood pressure? 

Please, anyone with knowledge or experience with high blood pressure feel free to jump in. 

Best regards to all SA members and moderators,

Josie99

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted

Oh Josie, I'm so glad you're here at SA! 

 

You've been treated so outrageously, I don't really have the words for it. Forget Wonder Woman, you are a true Heroine to continue to heal yourself and survive through this ordeal. All power to you on your journey back to health xxxmollyn

 

Drug history

  • 20mg paxil in 2001 - 4 months use  
  • 20mg paxil in 2003 - 2 months use 
  • 20mg paxil in 2008 - 8 years continuous

Withdrawal history:

  • March 2014 - disastrous alternate day taper
  • Jan 2015 - 15mg to 10mg. Disaster
  • Sept 2015 -  10mg to 5mg. Disaster. Reinstated to 6mg. Relief
  • Oct 2015 - started slow 10% taper 
  • Oct 2016 - at 4mg- stop taking paxil (not recommended)

 

I'm not a medical professional. Seek advice from a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

Posted

Hi MollyN, 

 

Thank you for your kind reply. Everyone fighting their way through withdrawal and posting their experiences here on SA are heros!

Here's to many, many etermal windows in everyone's life!

Josie99

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • Moderator Emeritus
Posted

Hi Josie,

 

If you are experiencing adverse effects from the drug you've been taking for two months to compensate for withdrawal syndrome, you have no choice but to taper at the rate your nervous system permits.  Very severe or life-threatening adverse effects call for a faster taper, where withdrawal symptoms may be unavoidable.  Please be careful as you lower the dose of doxepin.  

 

I am not familiar with how Lamotrigine works but have included a link to our topic on this drug but you are best to discuss this with your doctor.
 

 

Current Prescription Drugs for Hypothyroidism:  Synthroid 100mcg / Cytomel 5mcg (15 years Pristiq/Effexor)

Tapering Schedule
September 15, 2016 - switched from Pristiq 50mg to Effexor XR 75mg; November 10, 2016 - reduced to 67.5 Effexor XR
December 9, 2016 - reduced 60.75
January 5, 2017 - reduced 54.67
January 30, 2017 - reduced to 49.0
February 20, 2017 - reduced to 44.0 
May 20, 2017 - reduced to 40.25 (holding for additional month due to late onset of withdrawal symptoms after this taper)
July 17, 2017 - reduced to 38.24
August 15, 2017 - reduced to 37.5 (50% of my original dose)

October 15, 2017 - reduced to 35.6

November 12, 2017 - reduced to 33.8
December 15, 2017 - up-dose to 35.6
December 28, 2017 - up-dose to 37.5

Posted

Hi Baroquep,

 

Thank you for your quick reply and concern. I am reading the links now. My thought is to have the lamotrigine if I need it and only at the lowest dose for the shortest time (2 weeks at the most) - and no up dosing! My biggest concern is getting my blood pressure under control. I didn't realize I was in a hypertensive crisis until my doctor sent me to the ER. I don't want to put my body under any more duress and I know I will go with withdrawal when I stop doxipen. 

I will let everyone know what the doctor recommends. Thank you again for the links.

Best regards,

Josie99

 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted

Hi Baroquep and Alto, 

My primary care doctor is not comfortable prescribing lamotrigine. She said it's not in her wheelhouse. I understand why she is uncomfortable prescribing a mood stabilizer; however, I told her that the reason I was asking her to help

me was my blood pressure is uncontrolled because of the offending drug (doxipen) and both the nurse practitioner and my primary were putting me, the patient, in the middle, which is not fair to me. She said fair enough. So she is going to reach out to the nurse practitioner (but not thrilled to do so and makes no promises). Why does this has to be so hard? Now I wait. 

Best,

Josie99

 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

  • Administrator
Posted

Well, Josie, you're working with the situation as well as you can.

 

I don't know if lamotrigine has an effect on blood pressure. It's action is mysterious to medicine.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Posted (edited)

Hi Alto,

 

Thank you for your reply. Unfortunately I had to stop the lamotrigine due to dry heaving and extreme itching. I don't know if it was due to a higher dose of 25 mg instead of the 5 mg I wanted to start with, or interaction with the Doxipen, or  withdrawing from poly drugs. I'm glad I tried it. It did help somewhat with the akathasia. It was 3 days before I had to stop. Right now I'm taking 10 mg (breaking it up dues to med sensitivity) of lisinopril for blood pressure and Zofran for nausea/dry heaving. 

 

Before I chronicle my symptoms below, it is important for survivors to take into account the poly drugs I was taking (forced to take while in the hospital) and the history of withdrawing from all those drugs. CAVEAT: These are my experiences while taking these drugs and coming off these drugs. 

I'm 8.5 months out from Librium/amitriptyline drug combo. And 6.5 months out from mirtazapine(horrible drug known for causing serotonin toxicity), 5.5 months out zyprexa(antipsychotics are pretty hard core drugs), 3.5 months out off  depakote(they - some doctors) believe depakote acts like benzodiazepines do on the brain, 2.5 months out off amitriptyline - again, and finally doxipen. I tried lamotrigine to help reset the gaba system in hopes of taking the edge off the withdrawal symptoms. 

 

Pattern of Symptons

10/9 Did not sleep. Day 1 of no Labetatol for blood or pressure. anxiety high. 

10/10 Horrible night. Serotonin toxicity?

Second night of stopping Labetatol? Heat sensitivity. Could not stop pacing all night/better in morning. 

10/11 Asleep at 3. Woke up at 5. Back to sleep to 6. Fatigue/depression 

5/10. Took 25 mg at 8 pm. Anhedonia

7/10 Arms feel electric 

          volts shooting through.

6/10 No energy. Walk to deal

          with restlessness

6/10 Took 2.5 mg

           lisinopril to bring down bp. Feeling calmer. 

10/12 Broken sleep from 3 - 7. Heat sensitivity. Walked most of day. feeling lightheaded and restless. Legs won't stop moving. Depression. Very tired. 

10/13 Stopped doxipen on Tuesday. Up    

Really bad night. Sleep at 3 - 6. Woke up fearful. Walked at 3, 6, 7:30, 8 am. Spacey. Feels like ice cold water in arms. Depression in morning. 

Very fearful. Feel better after walk. Very tired. Depletion (like chemotherapy) fatigue. Pain in kidneys. 

Nauseous. Threw up all night.

10/14  walked off leg numbness at 4 am, 6 am, 7:30 am. Took 2.5 mg  Linisprol at 6 pm,10 pm, 2 am, 6am dealing with leg numbness and morning cortisol spike. Shaking

started at 11 am. Restless/numbmess in legs most prominent along with 

nervousness. Linisprosil helps with restless legs? and heart palpitations? 4 days off doxipen. Pain in upper

back when I walk the same as when I came off mirtazapine. Legs start

to become restless at 5 pm. 

10/15  Did not sleep until 4 am to 7:30 am due to restless legs and anxiety.

Had to walk from 7:30 to 10:40 am. Feeling agoraphobic and extreme 

fatigue. Pain in upper back. In a bad wave. Walked! Walked! Walked! Took 1 mg of 

Zanaflex and 25 mg lamotrigine. Feeling better in one hour. Pain still in upper back. 

10/16 slept from 7 pm to 2 am from extreme sleep deprivation. Woke up vomiting from lamotrigine or wd?

Need to walk due to restless legs and must be outside! Pain still in upper back. Hard time sitting still. Feeling fatigue when walking.Walked from 1:30 to 4:00. Can't 

walk anymore - exhausted. Stomach is queasy. 

10/17  fell asleep at 4:30 to 5:30. Took 5

mg of lisinipril at 6 and slept to 9:30. Walked to 10:30. Extreme fatigue and moving slowly. Head is swooshy

with a headachey brain fog. Lot of fearful anxiety after 4 pm. Walked 2 hours. Legs restless. 

10/18 slept from 3 - 5. Took 2 .5 mg lisinipril slept 5:30 - 7:30. Walked.Very tired

shaking internally from?

very nauseated. Small window opened at noon to 5 pm. Closed from 5 to 6 pm. Opened again from 7 pm to 11 pm. Up most of night from anxiety. 

10/19 Slept from 4:30 to 6. Walked to 7 and slept to 7:40 am. Very tired and moving slowly. Walking to deal with anxiety and restless feeling.

Hope this is helpful.

Best,

Josie99

 

Edited by ChessieCat
changed font size

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

Posted
After going though 8.5 months of polydrug withdrawal and reading moderators posts and survivors heart searing experiences, I am strongly thinking of reinstating a small dosage of the antidepressant I stopped taking in September. 
I've really tried to listen, read, and look at this from every angle to do what's best for my body and peace of mind and be realistic at the place I am in now. I don't think there is a right way or a wrong way in trying to be free of these drugs; but moving in a path forward based on what I can do with the resources I have available to me. I took into consideration my age, my current physical condition, my financial resources, and all of my support systems including SA. I believed, like many, that if I could just get these drugs out of my system I would heal in a time frame I could handle. It's not that simple. I took a benzodiazepine and antidepressant for 12 years. That's 12 years my body functioned based on taking these 2 drugs. If I had never taken these drugs, my body would have functioned as it had before the drugs. But I did ingest these drugs for 12 years and my body is simply not going to function because the drug is no longer in my system. The body is a memory and it does keep score. I've tried to trick my body and it's not buying it. It's as if my body is telling me, "If you really didn't need this drug or drugs, then why did you make me work so hard metabolizing it through the entire body system for 12 years?" The dying process that I'm going through feels real because it is real; just because I don't actually die doesn't mean my body isn't going through the dying motions. I'm going to go out on a limb by saying that I do believe that doctors know about drug habituation and withdrawal. Their declarations that they don't know anything about withdrawal rings hollow. That would mean that not one of all these doctors had any clients who complained about withdrawal. If we were their only patient for the 30 odd years they practiced medicine; then maybe I would believe that. Why do they say that then? Look at what they rely on: test procedures and prescribing of drugs; those are the only tools they have in their toolbox. Doctors don't do a wait and see approach because we have a bout of insomnia, anxiety or depression; they run tests and prescribe drugs. I've read many heart-rendering stories about reinstatement versus non-reinstatement. I asked if I could go to the hospital to get through this without drugs. The answer was to stay on the drug. I feel totally defeated. Then I realized that is all the doctor had to offer me. It's not that I don't think they know or believe what I'm going through; but what are they going to do undue the damage caused by the prescriptions they prescribed. All they have is reinstatement. My ekg shows damage to the heart and I now take medication for high blood pressure. I thought I was finished with the benzodiazepine withdrawal; but I realize that what I think and what my body needs is a lot more than 8 months before I can withdraw from another powerful psychiatric drug. 
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. 
PS I tried lamotrigine to deal with withdrawal but I had a reaction to it after only 3 days. 
 
I no longer can drink a simple cup of coffee without fear of doing more damage to my CNS. 
I can no longer walk out the door

and know if I will be ok or experience terrifying derealization/depersonalization.

I no longer wake up relaxed and rejuvenated because I no longer sleep. 

I no longer enjoy strolling through the grocery story or Target without feeling intense out of body anxiety. 

I no longer feel I live inside my own body. 

I no longer know if it is ok to eat food that sustains my life. 

I no longer head out for a walk with a coat in extremely cold weather without feeling panic due to extreme heat sensitivity. 

I no longer feel comfortable coming back to my apartment without feeling extreme agoraphobia. 

I no longer know if I take

a life saving medication for blood pressure without fear there will be side effects from medication sensitivity from psychiatric drug withdrawal.

I no longer enjoy taking a hot bath or shower without the water feeling like something alien on my body. 

I no longer can be still in my own body. 

I no longer have hope that I can ever be free of these horrible drugs. 

 

 

 


 


 

Drugs Tapered From Feb to Aug 2017:

Limbritrol 75 mg on 12 years CT over one day February '17

Ambien 5 mg on 12 years over Stopped 2 wks March '17

Mirtazapine 15 mg on 6 wks Stopped over 3 wks April '17

Zyprexa 7 mg on 2 months Stopped over 3 wks May '17

Depakote 500 mg on 5 1/2 months Stopped over 10 days

July '17

Amitriptyline 50 mg on 4 1/2 months Stopped over 3 weeks August '17

Doxipen on 2 months currently on 5 mg since Aug.   

 

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