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Nocturna: withdrawal or relapse


Nocturna

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Hi all and thanks for welcoming me in this community! Here's my brief story with psychiatrists until now:

 

- In the end of 2015 I got a burnout which resulted in insomnia & psychosis. Visited the psychiatrist and was diagnosed with Schizoaffective disorder.

- Took Risperidon 2 mg for 2 months + Akineton (anti-Parkinson for the adverse effects)

- Took Abilify 7.5 mg for the next 10 months. Stopped it CT with the blessing of my doctor, because I had some adverse effects, the most obvious one was weight gain, but I also had some anxiety in situations like being in a car or train.

- 3 months later, being drug-free, I got involved in a road accident, which resulted in a lot of stress and triggered insomnia again. Was too afraid to go into a relapse, so I started with what I had left from the Abilify, again 7.5 mg for 1 month.

- In 2-3 months got gradually down to 2 mg Abilify (with mostly non-existant side effects) after some negotiation with my doctor (she sent me out with the words "You know your condition, do whatever you decide" - I guess I was being too pushy). Kept that for the next 2.5 years, as I was travelling a lot on my own.

- Moved to a new country, found a new doctor. When I settled down, went from 2 mg to 0 in 3 months.

- Around 3 months of being drug-free in April 2019, again after some stress (related to other health issues) and being alone for a while I started getting back into insomnia. Initial symptoms of psychosis started reappearing (paranoid thoughts and delusions), so I went straight to my doctor. After 1 week of Risperidon (this time 1 mg IIRC) and some Zopiclon and a melatonin additive, the insomnia was under control and the psychotic symptoms dissappeared, so we switched back to Abilify, this time 5 mg.

 

I've been on Abilify, 5 mg since then and I don't plan to go lower for now, as I'm travelling again in the next few months. I'm hoping to go down to 2 mg eventually, as with this dose the adverse effects were really tollerable. My sleep schedule is now mostly stable (going to bed around 10 pm and getting 8-9 hours of almost uninterrupted sleep). I got a sleep tracker, I take magnesium additive roughly 2 weeks/month (with intentional breaks) and I started doing mindfulness exercises. I do some light, not very regular exercise in the gym and swimming.

I'm mostly interested to hear if anyone had similar experience as mine and what did your doctor say about it - is the insomnia + initial symptoms of psychosis due to the withdrawal (don't know if it's realistic 3 months after stopping the meds) or is it due to a relapse of the underlying condition. Thanks! :)

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Welcome to SA, Nocturna.

 

We recommend tapering by no more than 10% of your current dose every four weeks.  As you get down to the smaller doses, the drops become smaller and smaller.  

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

Your going from 2mg to 0 in 3 months was quite a bit faster than our recommendation and would put you at risk of withdrawal symptoms.  Three months from last dose is a very common point at which withdrawal symptoms appears.

 

What is withdrawal syndrome.

 

Glenmullen’s withdrawal symptom list.

 

When we take medications, the CNS (central nervous system) responds by making changes over the months and years we take the drug(s). When the medication is discontinued, the CNS has to undo all the changes it made. Rebuilding the neurotransmitter production and reactivating the receptor and transporter cells takes time -- during that rebuilding process symptoms occur.  

 
   On 8/30/2011 at 2:28 PM,  Rhiannon said: 
When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

The overwhelming majority of doctors know nothing about safe tapering or withdrawal (which they don't believe exists).  You are the  only person who can determine whether your symptoms are withdrawal or relapse.  These links can help you make that determination:

Is it withdrawal or relapse?  Or something else?

 

How do I know it's withdrawal and not relapse?

 

This is your Introduction topic, where you can ask questions and connect with other members.  We're glad you found your way here.

Gridley Introduction

 

Lexapro 20 mg since 2004.  Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017.   

End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg 

End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg

End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg  

Oct. 30, 2020  Jump to zero from 0.025mg.  Current dose: 0.000mg

3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete.

 

Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements

Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium

Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium 

End 2021  year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg

End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg 

End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg

Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper.

Taper is 95% complete.

 

Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986.  Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg  

March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper

Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper

Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper.  Current dose as of Sept 25: 3.6mg

Taper is 95% complete.  

  

Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotic, zinc, melatonin .3mg, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase, L-Glutamine, milk thistle, choline


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice. It is information based on my own experience as well as that of other members who have survived these drugs.

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Thanks a lot for the links, @Gridley! Will read them thoroughly in the coming days.

Btw, I noticed that www.drglenmullen.com is live again and the daily checklist can also be downloaded from there.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 9 months later...

Hi Nocturna. I was reading your thread. Do you decrease your abilify 0,5mg every month? I spoke with my psychiatrist. He lowered down my abilify  to 15mg,but I am taking 10mg. I plan to reduce 2 percent per month. 

 

Abilify from 20 mg to 10 mg-Nov.29,2017 to March.24,2019; Abilify 10 mg March.24,2019 to Sep.26,2020; 9,4ml Sep.27,2020;9,8ml Sep.29,2020;9,6ml Oct.17,2020;9,4ml Oct.30, 2020;9,2ml Nov.15,2020;9ml November 25th,2020;8,8ml December 16th,2020;8,6ml December 30th,2020;8,4ml January 13th,2021;8,2ml February 2nd,2021;8ml February 25th,2021;7,8ml March 17th,2021;7,6ml April 6th,2021;7,4ml April 18th,2021;7,2ml May 4th,2021;7ml  May 26th,2021;6,8ml June 6th,2021;6,6ml July 5th,2021;6,4ml July 21st,2021;6,2ml July 31st,2021;6ml August 13th,2021;5,8ml August 31st,2021;5,6ml September 16th,2021;5,4ml October 1st,2021;5,2ml October 15th,2021;5ml Nov 1st, 2021;4,8 ml Nov 13th,2021;Abilify 4,6ml November 28th,2021;Abilify 4ml December 10th,2021;Abilify 3,8ml January 1st,2022;Abilify 3,6ml January 15th,2022;Abilify 3,4ml January 28th,2022;Abilify 3,2ml February 15th,2022;Abilify 3ml February 28th,2022;Abilify 2,8ml March 12th,2022;Abilify 2,6ml March 31,2022;Abilify 2,5ml April 19th,2022;Abilify 2,4 May 6th,2022;Abilify 2,35ml May 26th,2022;Abilify 2,3ml June 23,2022; Abilify 2,2ml June 28th,2022;Abilify 2,1ml July 19th,2002;Abilify 2ml August 19th,2022;Abilify 1,95ml November 6th,2022;Abilify 1,9ml December 16th,2022;Abilify 1,85ml January 13th,2023;Abilify 1,85ml January 14th,2023;Abilify 1,90ml January 15th,2023; Abilify 1,89ml February 5th,2023;Abilify 1,88 ml February 10th,2023; Abilify 1,88

ml February 15th,2023; Abilify 1,85 ml February,20th,2023; Abilify 1,83ml March,6th,2023, Abilify 1,80ml March 17th,2023; Abilify 1,77ml March 29th,2023; Abilify 1,75ml April 12,2023; Abilify 1,5ml September 22nd,2023

Cymbalta 120 mg Jun.28,2011; 90mg Feb.19,2013 to Jun 5,2014;60 mg Jun.5,2014 to present

Klonopin 1,25 mg Jan.3,2016; 0,25mg Nov.28,2017 to present

biperiden extended release 4mg April.25,2008 to Feb.6,2009;Jun 24.2011 to January 13th 2023;Biperiden 4mg extended release + biperiden 1mg

Risperidone 2mg May.4,2017 to Dec 6.2019

Risperdal 1,5mg 12/06/19; 1,75mg 12/08/19; 1,5mg 12/20/19; 1,75mg (0,018g) 12/26/19

Risperidone 1,75ml 1/8/20; 1,70ml 1/18/20; 1,62ml 1/30/20; 1,54ml 2/29/20; 1,44ml 5/6/20; 1,42ml 5/7/20; 1,40ml 5/18/20; 1,30ml 6/1/20; 1,25ml 6/11/20; 1,12ml 7/5/20; 1ml 7/21/20; 0,96ml 8/16/20; 0,875ml 8/18/20; 0,86ml 8/28/20; 0,80ml 3/24/21;0,84ml 3/27/21; 0,86ml 4/4/21

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  • ChessieCat changed the title to Nocturna: withdrawal or relapse

Hi Manny,

 

Indeed I started tapering the Abilify by 0.5mg/month. Now I realise it should be 10% of the last dose, not 10% of the initial (which makes sense - geometric progression instead of arithmetic). So in the next month I'm doing a smaller drop. My psychiatrist thought that's too careful (she keeps calling doses below 5mg "baby doses"), but still she supports me in tapering off. If you are stable for a couple of months, talk to your psychiatrist again and he might support you lowering the dose further. From my own experience, it's the easiest if you are as open as possible with your pdoc.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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On 9/30/2020 at 11:24 AM, Nocturna said:

Hi Manny,

 

Indeed I started tapering the Abilify by 0.5mg/month. Now I realise it should be 10% of the last dose, not 10% of the initial (which makes sense - geometric progression instead of arithmetic). So in the next month I'm doing a smaller drop. My psychiatrist thought that's too careful (she keeps calling doses below 5mg "baby doses"), but still she supports me in tapering off. If you are stable for a couple of months, talk to your psychiatrist again and he might support you lowering the dose further. From my own experience, it's the easiest if you are as open as possible with your pdoc.

Hi Nocturna.Yeah, I thought your taper was too fast,but maybe your body can handle It. Mine can't. I have been taking abilify since 2009 different doses maximum 30 mg. 

 

Yes, your psychiatrist can think the 10% is too little reduction. My psychiatrist thinks that too. What reduction method do you use? I use a combination of water tritation (5ml of an abilify 10 mg discmelt pill mixed with 10ml of water) and 4,8ml of abilify 1ml oral solution for a total of abilify 9,8ml. 

Abilify from 20 mg to 10 mg-Nov.29,2017 to March.24,2019; Abilify 10 mg March.24,2019 to Sep.26,2020; 9,4ml Sep.27,2020;9,8ml Sep.29,2020;9,6ml Oct.17,2020;9,4ml Oct.30, 2020;9,2ml Nov.15,2020;9ml November 25th,2020;8,8ml December 16th,2020;8,6ml December 30th,2020;8,4ml January 13th,2021;8,2ml February 2nd,2021;8ml February 25th,2021;7,8ml March 17th,2021;7,6ml April 6th,2021;7,4ml April 18th,2021;7,2ml May 4th,2021;7ml  May 26th,2021;6,8ml June 6th,2021;6,6ml July 5th,2021;6,4ml July 21st,2021;6,2ml July 31st,2021;6ml August 13th,2021;5,8ml August 31st,2021;5,6ml September 16th,2021;5,4ml October 1st,2021;5,2ml October 15th,2021;5ml Nov 1st, 2021;4,8 ml Nov 13th,2021;Abilify 4,6ml November 28th,2021;Abilify 4ml December 10th,2021;Abilify 3,8ml January 1st,2022;Abilify 3,6ml January 15th,2022;Abilify 3,4ml January 28th,2022;Abilify 3,2ml February 15th,2022;Abilify 3ml February 28th,2022;Abilify 2,8ml March 12th,2022;Abilify 2,6ml March 31,2022;Abilify 2,5ml April 19th,2022;Abilify 2,4 May 6th,2022;Abilify 2,35ml May 26th,2022;Abilify 2,3ml June 23,2022; Abilify 2,2ml June 28th,2022;Abilify 2,1ml July 19th,2002;Abilify 2ml August 19th,2022;Abilify 1,95ml November 6th,2022;Abilify 1,9ml December 16th,2022;Abilify 1,85ml January 13th,2023;Abilify 1,85ml January 14th,2023;Abilify 1,90ml January 15th,2023; Abilify 1,89ml February 5th,2023;Abilify 1,88 ml February 10th,2023; Abilify 1,88

ml February 15th,2023; Abilify 1,85 ml February,20th,2023; Abilify 1,83ml March,6th,2023, Abilify 1,80ml March 17th,2023; Abilify 1,77ml March 29th,2023; Abilify 1,75ml April 12,2023; Abilify 1,5ml September 22nd,2023

Cymbalta 120 mg Jun.28,2011; 90mg Feb.19,2013 to Jun 5,2014;60 mg Jun.5,2014 to present

Klonopin 1,25 mg Jan.3,2016; 0,25mg Nov.28,2017 to present

biperiden extended release 4mg April.25,2008 to Feb.6,2009;Jun 24.2011 to January 13th 2023;Biperiden 4mg extended release + biperiden 1mg

Risperidone 2mg May.4,2017 to Dec 6.2019

Risperdal 1,5mg 12/06/19; 1,75mg 12/08/19; 1,5mg 12/20/19; 1,75mg (0,018g) 12/26/19

Risperidone 1,75ml 1/8/20; 1,70ml 1/18/20; 1,62ml 1/30/20; 1,54ml 2/29/20; 1,44ml 5/6/20; 1,42ml 5/7/20; 1,40ml 5/18/20; 1,30ml 6/1/20; 1,25ml 6/11/20; 1,12ml 7/5/20; 1ml 7/21/20; 0,96ml 8/16/20; 0,875ml 8/18/20; 0,86ml 8/28/20; 0,80ml 3/24/21;0,84ml 3/27/21; 0,86ml 4/4/21

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1 hour ago, Manny78 said:

What reduction method do you use?

I'm using only the 1mg/ml oral solution, as we don't have discmelt in my home country. Unfortunately the oral solution is also not covered by insurance here (I even have to buy it over post from a neighboring country), but I hope soon to be back to Germany, where it is available and covered by insurance even without a disability certificate (I don't have one). The main downside of this whole story is that I pay the whole ~100€/1.5 months myself.

Indeed, if you've been taking it for 10 years, maybe your body is more accustomed and the tapering has to be slower. I'm also planning to go slower and stop for a while at 2mg, as this dose was really successful for me in the past w.r.t side effects vs. not having a psychotic relapse.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 4 months later...

Small update from me - about a month after my last dose cut 2 months ago (down to 2.3 mg), I started experiencing really bad PMS (with mood swings, crying spells in the morning and headaches) and to make it worse, my insomnia came back. I've been combating it with Melatonin supplements and meditation and today, a couple of weeks later, the insomnia seems to be under control. This time I didn't experience any psychotic features, not sure if it was just an episode of depression and anxiety (as my psychiatrist said) or the "baby dose" of the antipsychotic does its job. In any case, I'm grateful for being where I am now and still waiting to do the next cut.

In the meantime, I took some blood tests and visited an endocrinologist, who got concerned with my high glucose level and near-the-limit HbA1c. He wanted to send me to a detailed screening for diabetes, but since I'm still in my home country where I don't have a health insurance, I can only visit doctors privately. Does anyone have experience with such a screening?

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

SA staff does not counsel about general medical issues.  However other members might be able to answer your question/s.  If you do a search you can find members' topics where diabetes is mentioned.  Instead of discussing diabetes in a member's introduction topic that you take your discussion to the SA topic linked below.  And discussing it in the diabetes topic may provide information for other members, both now and in the future.

 

There are many topics on SA.  I like to use a search engine and add site:survivingantidepressants.org to my search term.

 

Here is the discussion topic about diabetes which would be a better place to ask your question because other members are more likely to see it:

diabetes

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thank you for pointing me to the other topic, ChessieCat! I didn't realise introduction topics are not intended for discussions. Seems there's a lot to learn in the forum, so I'll make sure to read through the topic you pointed me to.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • Moderator Emeritus

You are welcome.

 

The reason I said to take the discussion of diabetes elsewhere is because it is not about your psychiatric drug withdrawal.

 

The Introduction is a member's journal of getting off psychiatric drug/s and where they can ask questions about their own situation.  This way all the history is in one place.  Members can also be supported by other members in their Introduction topic but it is better for general chit chat to be done elsewhere, either in PM or by creating a topic in the Off Topic Forum so that when a member needs assistance there is less chance of their question/s related to tapering/withdrawal being overlooked.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • 2 years later...

Another update from me (also updated my signature). Last two years were basically an attempt to taper down the Abilify during the summer-autumn and then upping it after the beginning of the new year and fighting with depression and insomnia. This year it's still lingering hard, with my main concerns being super de-motivated, lacking energy to do more than basic functioning throughout most of the days and also having focus for only 30-40 minutes a few times a day (which led to a job loss), which is overall impacting my ability to live autonomously atm.

 

Does anyone have experience with such sever thinking and mood disruptions while tapering Abilify? I'm getting somewhat scared I might be developing negative symptoms of schizophrenia, though I haven't had any positive symptoms in 4 years.

 

Here are the details of my taper, I know at times it was pretty fast and adding the quetiapin in 2023 for longer than a few days (as in 2022) probably did more bad than good:

 

May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg Abilify  down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

Jan - 1 mg Abilify + Quetiapin 6 mg in the last 2 weeks

Feb - 1.5 mg Abilify + Quetiapin 6 mg

March - 1.5 mg Abilify + Quetiapin down to 1 mg (tapering in a few day increments)

April - 1.5 mg Abilify + Quetiapin back up to 2 mg; Added L-tryptophan in mid-April and tapered Quetiapin to 0 mg

May - 1.5 mg Abilify (only) down to 1.25 mg and 1 mg

June - 1 mg Abilify down to 0.75 and 0.5 mg

Current: staying at 0.5 mg Abilify to stabilize.

 

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 5 months later...

Not an update really, more of a rant. Will update my signature and post a proper update soon, hopefully.

 

After being unstable on 0,5 mg Abilify and upping to 0,75 mg, a few months later I'm back to 0,5 mg again, not stable still and I'm really getting tired of it. After losing my last job, I got a very stressful semi-voluntary job at an NGO (I really care about the cause, but the work habits are leading to everyone's stress spilling over on top of others half the time..). Fortunately I have a super supportive husband, but he's getting tired of our struggles too (as he's also back to his demanding, but fulfilling job in our home country). I got an advise from my therapist to look for a calmer job, but I'm holding on heroically to this supposedly "important" job at the NGO. Probably not a good idea for long.

 

Also my therapist really pushed me this time into getting a habit of doing regular sports. But that's super hard for me, as I lacked much freedom to stay outside as a kid. I was even being ridiculed in primary school for being clumsy, running the slowest or just being short (I realise now my edginess worsened all of this). That pushed me into an emotional breakdown, though I'm getting used to those in the past year and feeling as a "walking failure", as my brother sometimes describes himself..

 

Sorry for the long rant, I just wanted to let it out.

 

Interesting experiment was taking a night off of Abilify on Friday. Saturday was my most normal holiday I've had in a few years!

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 3 weeks later...

Update:

 - I've moved my 0,5 mg Abilify to morning 2 weeks ago. Thanks to @gdsequoia for the support, as always! Initially that helped me sleep very well and even returned some dreams, so nice! Some of them nightmares though. Now in the last few days I have an interrupted sleep again and my fitness watch shows close to 0 REM.

 - My psychiatrist told me to stay 3 more months on this dose and then lower it by 0,05 mg each 2 months, though she think it's too slow. I also don't think I'll be able to handle for so long.. so I'm trying to figure another safe approach with my family and suggest it to her.

 - In the meantime my ability to stay focused during the day totals 3-4 hours, mostly in the afternoon/evening. That makes any work super hard.

 - Some days I feel so low and unfocused that I take a 0,5 mg L-Tyrosine supplement. This helps short-term.

 

The theory we have with my husband is that I'm mostly lacking the "upping" effect of Abilify during its withdrawal. I really hope that's the case, otherwise my worsened cognitive abilities (which are apparent to me and my family, but not recognised by the doctor) will be really hard, if at all possible, to handle. Interestingly enough writing is easier in such moments than speaking.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 2 months later...

Another small update, not sure if it's useful to anyone besides me.

 

I tapered from 0,5 mg down to 0,3 mg over the past 3 months. Each little reduction would result in 2-3 days with strong headache, remembering a few dreams (also only in the first few nights after the cut), becoming more nervous and irritable, then settling down a little bit. I'm planning to stay on this dose for now, as I'm trying to get a cyst surgery in my nasopharynx, to hopefully help me breathe better while asleep. I gathered some PulseOx data from my fitness watch at night (extremely useful device!) and it seems I really suck at breathing while laying down. 😅

 

Besides that, sometimes I get really desperate about my situation, mostly scared by the brain fog and letargy. So at one of those occasions I said - I'm done with this, I'm just stopping the drug for a week, to see what will happen. The first day was the most wonderful day I've had in probably 2 years, feeling so much like "actual me"... Then slowly I got sinking into the letargy, to the point my husband was afraid to leave me alone for long periods of time, as I could forget to eat... So I quit the experiment after 5 days only, upped the dose back to 0,3 mg, only to find that indeed I need the stimulation effect of Abilify atm.

 

Overall I feel like I'm very slowly getting back to myself, to my organic ways of stimulation, like doing yoga, listening to music, solving simple programming tasks and even playing the mandolin yesterday. I just hope this is a stable course of healing and not just another overly hopeful burst of my exhausted brain and soul.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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  • 2 months later...

Update from my side: after tapering down Abilify gradually to 0.3 mg, without reaching much of a stability, I decided to drop down to 0 exactly one month ago.

 

First week was tough, with tremors, tearfulness and anxiousness quite often (luckily the tears came together with tremors, so it seemed to me they are both related to withdrawal). Over the month I think I'm gradually improving. Still crying spells appear, I sleep poorly on some nights, after which I feel very reactive and grumpy.

 

One thing hard to handle is that it's very hard to get early in bed. Before on Abilify I would hardly crawl from the sofa to the bed at around 9 pm. Now I'm energetic up until 1 am and I have to convince myself hard to go to sleep at a more regular time. On the positive side, on many nights I'm getting 6-7 hours of sleep and I started feeling refreshed by sleep again. Also dreams came back, woohoo!

 

Supplements I take: Hübner Gute Laune in the morning (with L-tryptophan and L-tyrosine), Chinese angelica during my PMS time, Doppelherz Omega-3+ginkgo at night. I use green tea as an energy booster and try to avoid caffeine otherwise.

 

I have more physical energy, so I try to do yoga, swimming, some skating. Focus is still not ideal, but I'm lucky to be able to do reasonable work on the PC or read for 3-4 hours with breaks. Everyday brain fog is mostly gone.

In the end of 2015, got into a few days of psychosis and got an outpatient appointment with a psychiatrist, a diagnosis of schizo-affective disorder and a 2 month treatment with Risperidone. At the current point in time, my doctor is not convinced anymore in the diagnosis, rather points out depression and anxiety as my main condition, but I'm still taking Abilify as prevention therapy.

  • 2016 - 7.5 mg Abilify; 2017 - 2018 - 2 mg; April 2019 - May 2020 - 5 mg; June - December 2020 - 4.5 - 2.3 mg (-10% / month)

-> early 2021 - upped a little bit because of a depressive episode and insomnia

  • March 2021 to Jan 2022 - down to 0.7 mg

-> Feb 2023 - another depression+insomnia episode, so up again; added vit. B3, melatonin, L-tryptophan and split the Abilify dose in two

  • May 2022 to Nov 2022 - 2 mg down to 0.75 mg

-> middle of January 2023 - insomnia kicked in, some derealizations too; so up to:

  • Jan-April - 1 mg Abilify up to 1.5 mg; added Quetiapin 6 mg for a month, then down to 0 mg
  • 2024: dropped gradually Abilify to 0.5 mg and further down to 0.3 mg

Current: 0 mg Abilify since 8th of July 🥳 Holding the situation with aminoacids (tyrosine, tryptophan), Omega-3, Gingko biloba, occasional magnesium, calming herbs and CBD. Getting agitated, 2-3 nights of reduced sleep or depressed at certain phases of my period, overall improved mood and motivation is coming back. Appetite has reduced dramatically, weight is also slowly going down and energy levels - up. I can sweat again!

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