CeruleanSea: Introduction

[DancingBee]

@CeruleanSea

 

On 9/8/2023 at 5:48 PM, CeruleanSea said:

For people in our age group, it's been quite the ride!  SSRI's were heralded as a huge answer.  When I first tried to come off them in my 20's, I was assumed to be in relapse when I described brain zaps and brain fog.   NOW the truth is coming out, isn't it?  

The truth is indeed coming out. I'm so glad to have the info I've gleaned from this site, Dr. Mark Horowitz and Outro, Mad in America, etc. However, unlike you, I didn't have any physical symptoms, just intense depression and anxiety—the same things I went on the ADs for originally. I'm hoping using a super-slow 10% taper will have a much more positive outcome than my previous 2 attempts. But I do worry that having the same psychological symptoms I started with means I  "relapsed" rather than had withdrawal symptoms that will fade with time. We'll see.

 

May we both regain our ability to find words and remember things. I do think the drugs play a big role in this, more than can be accounted for by menopause and aging. 

[CeruleanSea]

@Shep ah thanks for pointing this out.

 

I had read Mark Horowitz paper on doing a hyperbolic reduction of 10% of receptor occupancy per month over 10 months, that is where I got the idea for this dose.  This is at approximately a 10% reduction in occupancy over the 50 mg dose.

Because of noting brain fog, I will go back up to 50 & then try reducing from there more slowly.

 

[Shep]

6 hours ago, CeruleanSea said:

Because of noting brain fog, I will go back up to 50 & then try reducing from there more slowly.

 

I wouldn't updose that much. You haven't been on 50 mg since June, so your brain and nervous system has started to adjust to the lower 37.5 mg dose. 

 

You may want to updose to 40 mg and see how you do. It takes about 4 days for your system to notice the change and it can take a week or longer to adjust. 

 

Looking at your signature, you have been a bit all over the place with the doses, reducing at the beginning of the year, and then bouncing from 27.5 mg back to 50 mg in June and now making too rapid reductions resulting in the need to updose again. Please note this can result in kindling. 

 

Hypersensitivity and Kindling

 

Regarding the hyperbolic taper reductions based on occupancy, please note the SERT occupancy rates only tell a partial story of how the drugs effect you and your milage may vary depending on how you metabolize them and other factors specific to your own biology. This is why we suggest going no faster than 10% per month based on the prior month's dose (not the originally prescribed dose) and also recommend going slower (such as a micro-taper) for folks with other health conditions, those who have long or complex drug histories, people who show signs of kindling, etc. 

 

A symptoms-based, micro-taper may be best, especially for those who are working and / or caring for family or have other obligations or anyone who wishes to be as functional as possible. 

 

 

[CeruleanSea]

😨 I did not know about kindling !! Pretty horrified when I consider my history of prescription drug use.  
 

Thank you for the advice, I’ll try up to 40 mgs and hope for the best. 

[CeruleanSea]

@DancingBee  wow I’m sorry to hear about those mood symptoms coming roaring back.  How long does it take to see that?

 

for me, I can come off and be fine for three or four months, but then a minor crisis kicks off BIG anxiety.  My whole adult life I was med free 6-7 years at the longest — I was fencing with anxiety the whole time.

[Shep]

16 hours ago, CeruleanSea said:

😨 I did not know about kindling !! Pretty horrified when I consider my history of prescription drug use.  
 

Thank you for the advice, I’ll try up to 40 mgs and hope for the best. 

 

Kindling is not a good thing, but that doesn't mean it's a permanent thing. You may want to check out the success stories forum if you haven't already. Many people were kindled, had severe withdrawal, but still went onto heal:

 

Success Stories

[CeruleanSea]

Thanks so much for the word of hope @Shep!

 

Im trying out 40.0 mg today & so far so good.  I had a couple of atypically foolish mistakes when speaking Spanish today, but honestly par for the course these days. 

[DancingBee]

@CeruleanSea

On 9/10/2023 at 5:52 PM, CeruleanSea said:

wow I’m sorry to hear about those mood symptoms coming roaring back.  How long does it take to see that?

 

I'm like you—I have no mood symptoms for 2-4 months, then they come roaring back over a couple days' time. That's why I waited for 6 months after my first drop last year and again after the one this April—but both those drops were large (20-25%) b/c it was before I knew about the 10% taper. Now I'm doing a 10% taper of one of my drugs. Given my past history of a 2-4 mo delay in symptoms, I'm a bit nervous about doing a drop every month. But since I'm still at a pretty high dose, I think I'll do it and see how it goes.

 

On 9/10/2023 at 5:52 PM, CeruleanSea said:

for me, I can come off and be fine for three or four months, but then a minor crisis kicks off BIG anxiety.  My whole adult life I was med free 6-7 years at the longest — I was fencing with anxiety the whole time.

 

Good point about how a life crisis can trigger symptoms. I've read some peoples' stories of being stable for 1-3years then being thrown for a loop. Withdrawal can be such a minefield. 

 

Sorry to hear you were dealing with anxiety in your years before meds. I'm glad to have found you since it doesn't seem there are many people who had ongoing, long term anxiety and depression before meds (seems many just had a short bout or none at all). So I identify and empathize with your struggles. You are far ahead of me on your taper and started from a lower initial dose. I'll continue to keep abreast of your journey, provide support and perhaps learn some things that will help me as I get to lower doses.

 

Cheers,
Dancing Bee

[CeruleanSea]

I have switched to 40.0 and feel fine, except for one problem.

 

I regularly find the wrong phrase/wrong word coming out of my mouth.  Often I say a related word, or a similar-sounding word.    This is happening several times a day.  It is embarrassing and concerning.

 

This symptom occurred years ago when I got off of an SSRI for 4-5 months. 

 

 

[CeruleanSea]

I’m feeling at a loss.  
 

im getting moody & unkind with my beautiful children. They are a handful but my behavior is inappropriate. 

 

I’ve been on 40 mgs sertraline for 6 days.  Prior to that, 37.5 mgs for a couple of weeks & 50 mg for 2 months before.

 

I don’t want the brain fog & negative sides of 50 mgs. But I want to be a patient parent.

 

any tips?

 

 

[Shep]

@CeruleanSea  If you haven't already done so, you may want to check out this forum:

 

Relationships and social life

 

You can search for threads about parenting during withdrawal and other aspects of this journey. 

 

Some of what you refer to as "inappropriate" behavior may be related to neuro-emotions. These threads may help:

 

Neuro-emotion

Coping with irritation, anger, and rage

 

You may be able to stop some of these overwhelming emotions before they spiral. Please see:

 

Dealing With Emotional Spirals

 

[CeruleanSea]

I’m realizing that I’ve been living with chronic stress.

 

During the pandemic, I moved to a new city where we didn’t have much community. At the time it was the best choice economically.  Unfortunately due to working from home + the pandemic slowing social opportunities, I still have not built a solid group of friends & community.

 

Fast forward— Lately my days are fully consumed with obligations, either work for my distant (100 miles away) employer or caring for my 2 grade school aged special needs children.  My mind is always full of tasks to accomplish in either area, and I haven’t taken the time for fun. 
 

Recently I took a one week family vacation and I felt unbelievably less stressed by the end, and I was so much more connected to my kids. 
 

Tonight. I took 90 minutes for myself to hang out at a board game meetup. It was fun! Just to be socializing & step away from my seemingly nonstop obligations felt great. 
 

I think this chronic stress I’ve had contributes nearly as much to my recently worrisome forgetfulness &  anxiety as ssri reduction.

 

Working to reverse this stress & its impacts on my health. 

[DancingBee]

I can only imagine how hard it is to consistently take time for yourself with a job and special needs kids. So a big kudos to you for doing so recently. May it motivate you to continue to do this to help weather the effects of your taper and overall life stress. Go @CeruleanSea, go!

[littlebird]

On 9/17/2023 at 9:07 PM, CeruleanSea said:

During the pandemic, I moved to a new city where we didn’t have much community. At the time it was the best choice economically.  Unfortunately due to working from home + the pandemic slowing social opportunities, I still have not built a solid group of friends & community.

This is so hard, hoping you can find a circle soon.

 

On 9/17/2023 at 9:07 PM, CeruleanSea said:

Tonight. I took 90 minutes for myself to hang out at a board game meetup. It was fun! Just to be socializing & step away from my seemingly nonstop obligations felt great. 

Yay!!! This is great news. 

 

On 9/17/2023 at 9:07 PM, CeruleanSea said:

I think this chronic stress I’ve had contributes nearly as much to my recently worrisome forgetfulness &  anxiety as ssri reduction.

 

Working to reverse this stress & its impacts on my health. 

Woah....... hadn't thought about chronic stress as a factor in forgetfulness and focus issues. Hm. Or maybe I did and forgot about it cause I was so stressed! 🤣

 

1 hour ago, DancingBee said:

I can only imagine how hard it is to consistently take time for yourself with a job and special needs kids.

For real!! I taught special education a long time, so many wonderful things about kids with special needs... and also it's a lot for parents. I'm so happy to hear you're taking care of yourself and have found immediate benefits to taking some time for yourself. Have you looked into respite care? It's often free, many counties offer free childcare to caregivers of children with special needs. 

 

Moving to a new area, taking care of your family, working, and tapering? You're doing so much! Hope you're able to be very encouraging to yourself and give yourself credit for all you do. Cheering you on!

[CeruleanSea]

Hello everyone!

 

I’ve made a huge life decision recently & left work to be a stay at home parent two weeks ago.  Focusing on quality of life for the family & I right now. I could see this is what we all needed & we could afford it. 
 

I had been working too much & juggling too much, not much time to just be. It will be interesting to figure out my next career move if any. I’m spending time in nature, volunteering, and homemaking lately.

 

I’m hoping to start reducing my ssri again soon.  I’ve been experiencing blepharospasm, a mild form of dystonia.  I had this with an ssri reduction in the past & when stressed… I believe that returning to reducing might cause more blepharospasm in the short run but improving neuroplasticity to reduce this in the long run.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CeruleanSea]

Also wow I’m realizing it’s been 2-1/2 full years since I first posted.  I would be further along if I had reduced just 1 mg/month. By pushing it too fast I’ve lost a lot of potential progress.  Please take it slow fellow reducers.

[CeruleanSea]

Tonight I’m resuming a reduction back to 33.75.

 

i’m stealing myself for a resurgence of dystonia symptoms.  But I believe they will abate as they did when I reduced before.

 

I’ve resigned from my old job and I’m currently off work. This is giving me a chance to catch up on sleep and seems like the best time to finally resume. 

[CeruleanSea]

Two days in. I’m quite crabby but also a little more motivated about things.  

[CeruleanSea]

Horrible!  I had a manic style rage yesterday. I was having an ordinary argument with my spouse about household chores, and yet once I became angry I felt irrationally angry for hours and hours.  I couldn’t stop thinking about the conflict. I knew that I was not being rational, but I couldn’t not stop these feelings.

I do not have a cyclical mood disorder & yet I felt so much like a person with that diagnosis. 
 

after good night of sleep, I woke up feeling fine, although unusually tired.

 

I’m taking precautions by reducing my ordinary intake of caffeine. So far so good.

[CeruleanSea]

I’m having a strange new symptom, wondering if anyone else has experienced?

 

I have the strange sense that one leg is an annoying amount longer than the other. My mental body map is now inaccurate, as my legs are basically the same length.

 

I am also feeling more tiredness in this leg.

 

 

[Poppy745]

4 hours ago, CeruleanSea said:

I’m having a strange new symptom, wondering if anyone else has experienced?

 

I have the strange sense that one leg is an annoying amount longer than the other. My mental body map is now inaccurate, as my legs are basically the same length.

 

I am also feeling more tiredness in this leg.

 

 

Hi @CeruleanSea I have had an odd feeling in my left leg on and off since WD began, also my left arm on and off. It is hard to describe. It is like I am more aware of it because it feels uncomfortable sometimes. I was more aware of it when waves were bad, but have not had it now for maybe nearly 2 weeks, but it has gone before and then returned. Hopefully it is gone for good. I wish all the awful symptoms would go for good. I read some time ago on one of the threads some people who had something similar, especially on the left side. 

[CeruleanSea]

@Poppy745 thanks so much for sharing your experience, it makes me feel a little bit better. For today, I found that stretching seemed to help alleviate a lot of the sensation.

 

I have had the other sensation where it’s a little bit more uncomfortable, maybe like mild muscle pain from withdrawal. 

[CeruleanSea]

I felt wound up with anxiety today & foolishly took a 5 mg thc gummy (low dose).   It was relaxing but as it wore off I experienced dystonia (uncontrollable twitching) of my eye & mouth. It was so small and imperceptible that nobody would guess. But it was there and I knew why.
 

in the future, I think I want to use a Calm app meditation and chamomile tea instead.

[CeruleanSea]

This reduction is hitting me hard. I’m feeling quite anxious & easily rattled.

 

I wish I’d faced up to anxiety instead of medicating it earlier in life. Now here I am aged 48 still learning the skills.

[CeruleanSea]

Happy New Year, everyone!

 

I am doing well & looking forward to 2024!

[CeruleanSea]

Hello all! Having grown accustomed to 33.75, I decided to drop to 32.5 on March 1st.

 

Symptoms have been easy to manage. I do have mildly concerning word-finding problems and some concentration difficulties. I’m having vivid dreams, not necessarily nightmares. Pressing on.

[CeruleanSea]

About 2 weeks into this reduction.

 

I’ve had a couple of tough weeks.  

 

After my last post I experienced pms & it was severe compared to normal. Everything felt so stressful & challenging. I yelled at my children one morning when they didn’t deserve it & regretted it.  And I may not have yelled at other times but I was short tempered. One child has told me I’m a mean mom.

 

I got past the pms & relaxed, but found that I had days of feeling fatigued & unmotivated.

 

Riding this out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CeruleanSea]

Down to 30 mgs as of April 1 2024.  It feels good.

 

I noticed less focus today but also more motivation.   I also had frequent sudden urination.  It will be interesting to see what happens. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DancingBee]

Congrats on your most recent taper (minus the sudden urination ). What an interesting combination: more motivation but less focus. May things continue to become better and clearer! 

[CeruleanSea]

Reviewing the past month, I’m noting sustained benefits at this lower dose: 

 

* motivation!

* energy!

* my word-finding problems from March are notably better 

 

My one concern is:

* involuntary movement of facial muscles. This mostly happens when tired, closer to my nightly dose. Currently my eye is involved & sometimes one cheek muscle.  It is fleeting & has improved over the month.