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lex1989: escitalopram / Cipralex and clonazepam / Rivotril / Klonopin

lex1989

By lex1989
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Altostrata Grand Master

Altostrata

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These symptoms emerged after your last diazepam reduction about a month ago? If I were you, I'd updose to 11.5mg diazepam and stay there for a while.

 

It appears that prior reductions of 1mg per 3 weeks may have been a little too fast as you got closer to  11mg.

 

@LotusRising would you kindly consult?

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This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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getofflex
getofflex

When you say 4 -4.5, it suggests that you may be taking an inconsistent amount each day.  It is important to take precisely the same dose at the same time each day.  

lex1989
lex1989

I will keep as they are now, I made the changes, need to live with them now and stabilize. I will keep daily notes as well.   Thank you for the support !!

lex1989
lex1989

Thank you for the hint, for me, after I took some cuts to both Clonazepam and Escitalopram (when I did the mistake) I felt it afterwards, maybe I am a fast metabolizer. Will test the cut from Esc

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LotusRising Contributor

LotusRising

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Hi @lex1989,

 

I'm sorry to hear you're not doing so well. It sounds like you're experiencing withdrawals symptoms from the cumulative cuts you've made since October. Is your signature current with your most recent reduction?

 

6 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Also I think the destroyed sleep and all of the mentioned above have made me bed ridden and with horrible withdrawal symptoms.

There is to note I am in tolerance withdrawal since probably some time,

 

What other symptoms are you experiencing that have you bedridden?

 

Why do you think you're in tolerance? Did you have any symptoms before you started tapering the diazepam?

1

2003-2009 on and off various SSRI's for short periods, Ativan prn

2010-2011 Ativan, up to 1.5mg/day - tapered off without issue

2013-2021 ativan 1-1.5mg 10-12x/month, daily starting Oct 21 to help with buspar WD

2016 - Effexor 75mg, short-term

2021 Mar -Jun Buspar ADR at high dose, tapered 3 months

2021 Aug Wellbutrin 150mg for 5 days (ADR), then MIrtazapine 7.5mg for 7 days (ADR)

Oct 22/21 - Direct switch ativan to clonazepam (don't do this)

Tapered clonaz Oct/21 - Apr/23  - 0mg!

 

Supplements: omega-3, mag-glycinate

 

"Believe that your tragedies, your losses, your sorrows, your hurt, happened for you, not to you. And I bless the thing that broke you down and cracked you open, because the world needs you open" - Rebecca Campbell

 

*** Disclaimer: Please note, my suggestions/comments are based on my own personal experiences. Please consult a knowledgeable practitioner to discuss decisions regarding your medical care *** 

 

                                                             *** Please do not send me PM's ***

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  • 4 weeks later...
lex1989 Contributor

lex1989

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On 11/27/2023 at 5:11 AM, LotusRising said:

Hi @lex1989,

 

I'm sorry to hear you're not doing so well. It sounds like you're experiencing withdrawals symptoms from the cumulative cuts you've made since October. Is your signature current with your most recent reduction?

 

 

What other symptoms are you experiencing that have you bedridden?

 

Why do you think you're in tolerance? Did you have any symptoms before you started tapering the diazepam?

Hi, 

 

Sorry for the late reply.

 

The symptoms I had (still have some) are very frequently urinating during nighttime (5-8 times a night) which destroyed my sleep => makes sense to increase withdrawal symptoms, some insomnia, mental akathisia, etc.

 

I am more stable now tough, but still not enoug.

 

I am waiting to be more stable, because I need to change manufacturer versions of the Diazepam. As I need smaller pills to have a more accurate dry cut. 
I had only 10 mg pills, now I will take 2 mg pills, when I become more stable.

 

Question: When changing generic version of a drug with another generic version ( not generic to brand or the other way around) , different manufacturer ( e.g.: Diazepam Terapia with Diazepam Ratiopharm) should a small bridge be made ?

The pills are same : solid. No water, liquid, no powder.

I know that different manufacturers could have different fillers, but the body should adjust eventually.

I was thinking maybe do a 50-50 bridge only. 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg |  29/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.46 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 1/11/22 Escitalopram x 2 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 28/11/22 Escitalopram x 1.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/01/23 Escitalopram x 1.30 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/02/23 Escitalopram x 1 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/03/23 Escitalopram x 0.76 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/04/23 Escitalopram x 0.54 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 08/05/23 Escitalopram x 0.31 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 06/06/23 Escitalopram x 0.15 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 04/07/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 14 mg | 10/09/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 13 mg | 02/10/23 Diazepam x 12 mg |  23/10/23 Diazepam x 10 mg | 

 

 

 

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LotusRising Contributor

LotusRising

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4 hours ago, lex1989 said:

I am waiting to be more stable, because I need to change manufacturer versions of the Diazepam. As I need smaller pills to have a more accurate dry cut. 
I had only 10 mg pills, now I will take 2 mg pills, when I become more stable.

 

This sounds like a good idea. Starting from a place of stability will be the least disturbing to your CNS and I think it's smart to do a short crossover to the new manufacturer. Some people have an issue, but some are just fine.

 

When are you making the switch?

1

2003-2009 on and off various SSRI's for short periods, Ativan prn

2010-2011 Ativan, up to 1.5mg/day - tapered off without issue

2013-2021 ativan 1-1.5mg 10-12x/month, daily starting Oct 21 to help with buspar WD

2016 - Effexor 75mg, short-term

2021 Mar -Jun Buspar ADR at high dose, tapered 3 months

2021 Aug Wellbutrin 150mg for 5 days (ADR), then MIrtazapine 7.5mg for 7 days (ADR)

Oct 22/21 - Direct switch ativan to clonazepam (don't do this)

Tapered clonaz Oct/21 - Apr/23  - 0mg!

 

Supplements: omega-3, mag-glycinate

 

"Believe that your tragedies, your losses, your sorrows, your hurt, happened for you, not to you. And I bless the thing that broke you down and cracked you open, because the world needs you open" - Rebecca Campbell

 

*** Disclaimer: Please note, my suggestions/comments are based on my own personal experiences. Please consult a knowledgeable practitioner to discuss decisions regarding your medical care *** 

 

                                                             *** Please do not send me PM's ***

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lex1989 Contributor

lex1989

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On 12/21/2023 at 1:43 AM, LotusRising said:

 

 

This sounds like a good idea. Starting from a place of stability will be the least disturbing to your CNS and I think it's smart to do a short crossover to the new manufacturer. Some people have an issue, but some are just fine.

 

When are you making the switch?

Yes, I need to be somehow stable first, as right now I am not.

I added gabapentin to help

me stabilize , as I was very bad, it helped a bit, but not enough.

 

In January I receive the pills shipped from Germany pharmacy.

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg |  29/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.46 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 1/11/22 Escitalopram x 2 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 28/11/22 Escitalopram x 1.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/01/23 Escitalopram x 1.30 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/02/23 Escitalopram x 1 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/03/23 Escitalopram x 0.76 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/04/23 Escitalopram x 0.54 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 08/05/23 Escitalopram x 0.31 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 06/06/23 Escitalopram x 0.15 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 04/07/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 14 mg | 10/09/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 13 mg | 02/10/23 Diazepam x 12 mg |  23/10/23 Diazepam x 10 mg | 

 

 

 

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lex1989 Contributor

lex1989

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On 12/20/2023 at 9:31 PM, lex1989 said:

Question: When changing generic version of a drug with another generic version ( not generic to brand or the other way around) , different manufacturer ( e.g.: Diazepam Terapia with Diazepam Ratiopharm) should a small bridge be made ?

The pills are same : solid. No water, liquid, no powder.

I know that different manufacturers could have different fillers, but the body should adjust eventually.

I was thinking maybe do a 50-50 bridge only. 

 

@LotusRising Hi, 

Regarding the question above.

 

On 12/21/2023 at 1:43 AM, LotusRising said:

 

 

This sounds like a good idea. Starting from a place of stability will be the least disturbing to your CNS and I think it's smart to do a short crossover to the new manufacturer. Some people have an issue, but some are just fine.

 

When are you making the switch?

 

I will receive the pills in a few days and I am pretty stable.

 

I am on 10 mg of Diazepam. 5 mg in the morning, 5 mg in the evening.

 

I was thinking doing a 2-3 weeks change:

Morning 5 mg Diazepam Ratiopharm (new manufacturer) and evening 5 mg Diazepam Terapia (current manufacturer) , then 100% new Manufacturer.

 

What do you think?

 

They are both generic version, no brand version (Valium).

 

27/04/21 Escitalopram x 2.5mg Clonazepam 0.375 mg | 14/05/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg | 30/05/21 Escitalopram x 7.5mg Clonazepam x 0.375 mg | 14/06/21 Escitalopram x 10mg Clonazepam x 0.25 mg | 27/08/21  Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.5 mg |

28/08/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.475 mg | 04/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.4 mg | 09/09/21 Escitalopram x 5mg Clonazepam x 0.35 mg | 14/09/21  Escitalopram x 5 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 14/10/2021 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 22/10/21 Escitalopram x 4.5mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 19/11/21 Escitalopram x 4mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 29/12/21 Escitalopram x 3.92 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 2/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.84 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 7/1/2022 Escitalopram x 3.76 mg Clonazepam x 0.3 mg | 17/05/22  Escitalopram x 3.36 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 12/06/22 Escitalopram x 2.92 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 01/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg |  29/08/22 Escitalopram x 2.46 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 1/11/22 Escitalopram x 2 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 28/11/22 Escitalopram x 1.61 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/01/23 Escitalopram x 1.30 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/02/23 Escitalopram x 1 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/03/23 Escitalopram x 0.76 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 09/04/23 Escitalopram x 0.54 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 08/05/23 Escitalopram x 0.31 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 06/06/23 Escitalopram x 0.15 mg Diazepam x 14 mg | 04/07/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 14 mg | 10/09/23 Lexapro FREE Diazepam x 13 mg | 02/10/23 Diazepam x 12 mg |  23/10/23 Diazepam x 10 mg | 

 

 

 

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LotusRising Contributor

LotusRising

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2 hours ago, lex1989 said:

Morning 5 mg Diazepam Ratiopharm (new manufacturer) and evening 5 mg Diazepam Terapia (current manufacturer) , then 100% new Manufacturer.

You could try that, or you could do 25/75 new dose, then 50/50, then 75/25, then 100% new med.

2003-2009 on and off various SSRI's for short periods, Ativan prn

2010-2011 Ativan, up to 1.5mg/day - tapered off without issue

2013-2021 ativan 1-1.5mg 10-12x/month, daily starting Oct 21 to help with buspar WD

2016 - Effexor 75mg, short-term

2021 Mar -Jun Buspar ADR at high dose, tapered 3 months

2021 Aug Wellbutrin 150mg for 5 days (ADR), then MIrtazapine 7.5mg for 7 days (ADR)

Oct 22/21 - Direct switch ativan to clonazepam (don't do this)

Tapered clonaz Oct/21 - Apr/23  - 0mg!

 

Supplements: omega-3, mag-glycinate

 

"Believe that your tragedies, your losses, your sorrows, your hurt, happened for you, not to you. And I bless the thing that broke you down and cracked you open, because the world needs you open" - Rebecca Campbell

 

*** Disclaimer: Please note, my suggestions/comments are based on my own personal experiences. Please consult a knowledgeable practitioner to discuss decisions regarding your medical care *** 

 

                                                             *** Please do not send me PM's ***

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