Catzilla says Hi, 7 months off meds

[Catzilla]

Hi all!

Finally had the time and courage to start to tell my story. I'm thirty-something year old woman from Finland.
This forum has been really important to me on this dreadful journey. It's crucial to hear that you're not just imagining things and not alone in this.

When my withdrawal really hit me the first time, I was so scared. I had heard of AD whitdrawal but didn't really know what to expect. I've never felt so deeply depressed and utterly hopeless than in some waves I've had during this whithdrawal. That really puts you in to the darkest place ever

 

I have a wide range of symptoms, most of the Glenmullen's withdrawal symptom checklist
I have been under a serious stress on this past month and I have noticed that it has possibly made my symptoms worse again.

But fortunately I have noticed some progress too. I also have been able to sleep almost the entire time. That's HUGE!

Well, that's probably all I can write now. It's really tough to write in a foreign language with this braindamage, it has made me so slow..

 

[KarenB]

Hello Catzilla,

 

Thanks for writing to let us know how you are - sounds like you are on the way up .  That is so good to hear - I know it will encourage many of the people here.  We'd love it if you popped back in every now and then to keep us updated.  Most people disappear when they start to get better and then we never get to hear the good stuff! 

 

You did so well getting away from Venlafaxine - I know how nasty that one can be .

 

Keep taking good care of yourself,

Karen

[clearday]

Welcome -

 

It's great that you finally figured out that these medications eventually wind up causing more problems than they solve.

 

You'll probably have times when withdrawal symptoms lessen ("windows") along with times when they may seem to worsen ("waves").

 

Often, the waves will show changing symptoms ("morphing"); old symptoms may go away for awhile, then come back; new ones may pop up.

 

But always, in the direction of eventual healing and recovery. 

 

Healing often takes longer than we'd like; it's important to always "hang in there", and to cultivate patience.

 

Sounds like you have a good start on your way to recovery -

[NewMe]

Keep on keeping on!

[Catzilla]

I have to admit that I wasn't prepared for this withdrawal to last this long or be anywhere near this intense. I was expecting to have a few rough months and then be done with it. Well now it has taken seven months and still counting.

 

I certainly didn't have enough information about supplements etc and I hadn't started taking any while tapering. Now I'm taking several.

 

Couple of months ago I quit drinking coffee and about a month ago I started to use sleeping mask. All of which have helped me to get a little bit further and be a little bit healthier. I also take a brisk 30 to 90 minute walks at least three times a week.

 

This whole process has been kind of a metamorphosis from uninterested, unemotional, tired blob to a feeling, caring, active person.

 

I am truly aware that I still have a long way to go, but I have a strong belief that it can be done because so much recovery has already been done.

 

Just keep hanging on!

[Ayaa]

Catzilla, hi.

 

I like your signature very much. It sounds like a credo: “All is not bad anymore. I will survive!”

 

I have been under a serious stress on this past month and I have noticed that it has possibly made my symptoms worse again.

 

 

Of course, emotional distress can easily provoke a “wave”. I also noticed that the “wave” can be triggered by excessive physical activity, so in order to stay stable we should keep it simple and slow – as it is wisely advised in the basic rules Since I am already meds-free, for me the words “simple” and “slow” mean to live without panic. I am not really fan of Louise Hay’s method of affirmations (can’t imagine myself smiling to my own reflection in the mirror), but I like her idea that the way of our thinking can change our life. We can’t change circumstances I (“milk is already spilled” and it’s not possible to turn the clock back), but we can try to change attitude about life. I realize that it is very important to keep a sober look at life and be prepared for the worst, but in the same time it is not possible to survive without a hope for the best. And in the case a new “wave” suddenely comes and destroys our peace of mind then may be the cleverest decision will be not to fight with this wave, but to relax and let things go? Wave is in the ocean and ocean definitely has the bottom. When we are there it is to hit this bottom  and to come out! That's what I beleive in.
 

 

It's really tough to write in a foreign language with this braindamage, it has made me so slow.

 

 

I understand it very well. Every time I write here I feel like I have lots of rusty wheels in my brain and they are all spinning. But if something is spinning it means that brain is still there! And it gives me a hope, that it is not irreversibly damaged.  And who knows, may be this kind of language exercise will help to restore some of our cognitive functions?

 

Catzilla, I also wanted to ask, how do you solve the problem with the lack of sunlight in winter? I had some difficulties with sleeping in summer (white nights etc), but solved this problem (heavy curtains, sleeping mask). But in winter when duration of day is just few hours (and no sun at all) I really don’t know what to do. I think it effects our health a lot and may be even triggers a wave… Any idea?

 

P.S. By the way, the cat on your avatar looks exactly the same like my cat. He is handsome

[Catzilla]

 

Catzilla, I also wanted to ask, how do you solve the problem with the lack of sunlight in winter? I had some difficulties with sleeping in summer (white nights etc), but solved this problem (heavy curtains, sleeping mask). But in winter when duration of day is just few hours (and no sun at all) I really don’t know what to do. I think it effects our health a lot and may be even triggers a wave… Any idea?

 

 

I have used light box for years. From about october to march at least. And now I have been really persistent with that, I have missed only couple of days.

It helps that during this process I have somehow managed to turn myself from night owl to an early bird so I go to bed around 10-11 PM  and fall asleep really quickly and then wake up on my own around seven or at nine at the latest. Then I do something with the lightbox on for about 20 mins to an hour.

 

My posts sound maybe a little bit too positive in comparison to reality . It hasn't been easy road and I don't believe it will be for a while. But I have had many really good days in a row, so good that you almost forget anything is wrong. And my latest wave lasted only for a couple of days at its worst and I was back on my feet within a few days.

 

At the moment I'm really scared what the future might hold. My best friend, my life partner and my rock found a swollen supraclavicular lymph node few days ago. We're going to the doctor tomorrow. We both have our moments of pure horror and despair. I try to be there for her and I am, but I am also scared shitless for her and for me too. It might be something not to worry about or then it might not... This is making me crazy!

Do you have any good advice on how to cope with higly stresfull situations like this?

[Ayaa]

I have used light box for years. From about october to march at least. And now I have been really persistent with that, I have missed only couple of days.

 

 

Thank you very much, Catzilla!   I did not know there is a topic about light box on this forum. ChessieCat kindly gave me a link in my thread. I will read it with great interest, because I have never heard about this device before.

 

My posts sound maybe a little bit too positive in comparison to reality

 

 

As I wrote before, I believe that we can also participate in creating of our own reality. So the positive thoughts are very useful and helpful

 

It hasn't been easy road and I don't believe it will be for a while.

 

 

 

I think everyone who has experienced w/d knows how difficult it is. Usually people in real life don’t believe that something can be wrong when you are already med-free and they don’t even try to understand what’s going on with our body and mind. Here we can share with our thoughts, complaints, ask for advice, interchange with experience and no one will say: “Oh, yesterday you were ok, then what is wrong now, why are you complaining?”. People are very supportive and understanding, this is great. And this is one of the reasons why I have come to this forum.

 

But I have had many really good days in a row, so good that you almost forget anything is wrong.

 

 

This is a very valuable comment for me. It is so important to remember about those good days while you are in a “wave”.  This remembrance helps to endure difficulties and problems.

 

At the moment I'm really scared what the future might hold. My best friend, my life partner and my rock found a swollen

supraclavicular lymph node few days ago. We're going to the doctor tomorrow. We both have our moments of pure horror and despair. I try to be there for her and I am, but I am also scared shitless for her and for me too. It might be something not to worry about or then it might not... This is making me crazy!

 

 

I checked in Wiki and they say that a swollen supraclavicular lymph node can appear due to infection or stress. And as soon as they disappear the swelling of a lymph node goes back to its normal size. Today you had to visit a doctor, any news from the clinic?

 

Do you have any good advice on how to cope with higly stresfull situations like this?

 

 

Oh… I can just share with my own experience, but I don’t know if it suits to someone else. I am a believer and in the most difficult situations I surrender myself to God and ask Him to take care of everything. I remind to myself that life and death are not in our hands and the one thing what we are able to do in this situation is to ask Him to be merciful to us and to our loved ones. Well, I can’t say that after prayer I always keep calm like Buddha. But it really helps me to overcome my fear. I wish you to stay healthy and strong, and may God help you to overcome this crisis. Best wishes!

[Catzilla]

Hello Ayaa, thank you for replying me.

 

 

I checked in Wiki and they say that a swollen supraclavicular lymph node can appear due to infection or stress. And as soon as they disappear the swelling of a lymph node goes back to its normal size. Today you had to visit a doctor, any news from the clinic?

 

At the moment everything is ok, she had her bloodwork checked and an appointment for a ultrasonography for next week.  Then the doctor will be in touch about the results. Still keeping our fingers crossed!

[Ayaa]

Catzilla, I am happy to hear that everything is ok right now. And I think it’s a very wise decision not to delay all necessary medical tests. I hope results will be good and you will forget about your worries. I'm also keeping my fingers crossed for you

[Fresh]

Hi Catzilla , welcome to the site.  So good to hear you're on the road to recovery.

It might be helpful to note which symptoms from Glenmullen's list you still have at the moment.  As you know , they will

come and go , and vary in intensity.  This thread can be a personal record of your journey.  It also helps us to understand how things are for you on a daily basis.

 

There are some other members here from Finland:  reachingforthestars , Sampo , routamarja , Katamari , wulfgar , moodyblues78.  

Maybe we need a thread in the Relationship section for Finnish/Nordic members - what do you think?

 

Best wishes ,  Fresh

 

.

[Catzilla]

I have been extremely depressed from time to time now. I'm really agitated, I have suicidal thoughts and I'm very hopeless about the future. I know it will pass, but when I'm in the middle of these feelings it's so hard to be positive. I have been reading all kinds of success stories and they make me feel even more anxious. I can't wait another 5-65 months to get better! What if that never happens?!?

Sometimes it's unbeliveably hard to go on

[clearday]

Your body will heal, but at its own pace -

 

The only thing you need to do is hang on and let time pass.

 

Make the best of the good days, and do what you must do to survive on the rough days.

 

You're young, and you have a long life ahead of you. 

 

Let your body heal; we all have to learn serious patience to get through this.

 

It can be very hard to go on; this is certainly the hardest thing I've ever had to deal with in my life. Nothing else even comes close.

 

It is the fight of our life. 

 

Keep healing, ride the windows and waves - when you're going through hell, just keep going.

 

We're in this for the long haul. It eventually gets better.

[Ayaa]

Catzilla, hi. How are you there? 

 

it's so hard to be positive

 

 

Yes, it is, if by “to be positive” you mean “to be happy”. It’s almost impossible to feel happy when you are depressed and physically feel bad. But I think this is natural and there’s nothing wrong with this feeling. No one asks us to be happy when we stay in bed with flu or headache. Similarly it is strange to demand happiness from the person who is in the “wave”.

 

Some symptoms can be really hard to bear, especially if they make us dysfunctional for some period of time. But in the same time I think that it could be worse if there was no communication with our own body and we would not be able to get warnings from it. When we are in the “wave” the  body is sending the messages: “Slow down, reduce your activity, make some changes in timetable and diet” etc. It seems those signals protect us from damage. Sometimes I think that the function of negative symptoms of the “wave” can be compared with the function of pain. If we were born without pain or pain signal was not strong enough we would not be able to perceive messages from body about the dangers. And this would lead us to broken bones, wounds and other health issues. So from this point of view pain is not a curse, but a blessing. It helps us to survive. And may be the same way during the “wave” our body tells us how we can encourage the healing process?

 

I'm very hopeless about the future

 

 

When I was analyzing my own negative thoughts, I came to the conclusion that my expectations of life are overestimated. I used to take things for granted – health, wealth, happiness, love, care, presence of dear people, youth etc. If something disappears I am feeling betrayed and deceived. “what for?”, “why me?” – the most common questions. But I think it is not necessary to link them with the “wave” or w/d. This is the existential crisis and it can occur at any moment.

 

I can't wait another 5-65 months to get better!

 

 

Why not? Well, I also have many plans for my life… And I get very annoyed when my plans are messed up. But “Man proposes, God disposes”. And we can’t do anything with it. One of the forum’s member wrote earlier that the most wise thing in our fragile condition is not to fight with circumstances, but to learn something about acceptance.

 

”...do you want to enlist your energy against something you have no control over or do you want to use your energy to help yourself through this challenging time? It's really all about energy. Willingness and acceptance allows you to keep it”.

 

I like this idea, it helps me to deal with the “waves”.

 

There’s an interesting discussion about it here:

 

Acceptance

 

And may be information about neuro emotions will be useful too:

 

Neuro emotions

 

Please, hang in there! It will get better.

[Catzilla]

Still here. I have had the worst month of my life! One huge continuous wave. Never ever felt so bad. Now I'm having day four of feeling ok, almost good. What the heck happened here...

 

There were some seriously stressing events during this month, so maybe they somehow made me worse. Don't know.

 

Will tell more later.

[KarenB]

Sounds like a jolly good wave which is hopefully now opening into a window.  Well done getting yourself through that. 

 

And yes, stressing events do increase symptoms.  Happens to us all. 

 

Hoping you get more good days,

Karen

[Bellisimo]

Hello neighbour Im from sweden! 
Welcome here.. Stress is a bad trigger to symtoms, and i know its hard not to be stressed bc it feels like the body is stressed all the time.. Its a difficult situation, meditation can help , it helped me and when i tried to focus on something that was a calm activity could release some stress. and walk , long walks. it helps the body too with the stress hormones. 

[Catzilla]

I was wondering has any of you gyus had any help from a doctor? And what kind of help would that be? I got name of a neuropsychiatrist who might be able to help, he is supposed to be very anti AD... I got his name from a anti AD psychologist who has been starting these peer support groups here, so I guess he knows what he's talking about
I've come this far (8 months) by myself and I'm a little sceptical about this. It would be very expensive and I have very bad experiences with doctors about the matter. So I'm pondering wether to go or not.

[Mjau]

Hi Catzilla, I like your name 

Sounds good that he is anti-AD. Do you know anything about what he does other than being anti-AD? Does he know how to deal with withdrawal?

Personally I have no good experience from doctors, on the other hand I have never met an anti-AD-doctor... 

How are things going, are you free from the wave?

 

[Catzilla]

How are things going, are you free from the wave?

Thank you Mjau for asking. The wave's gone for now. Today's day 7 of feeling ok. I feel like my cognitive skills are somehow "off". I drop everything I touch and I have to multi check everythin I do. I also have fatigue I've never experienced. I this something that might happen after a powerful wave?

[AliG]

Hi Catzilla.   In answer to your question about the " neuropsychiatrist " or any doctor - I'm not sure . Maybe if he's sympathetic . If you think he can help -  but unfortunately  most doctors don't understand withdrawal .From what I can see, you have been off Effexor since June 2015. ( 7 months ). If you are patient and look for non- drug ways of coping with some of the symptoms, you will be fine . We all had a time before drugs , where we were whole and didn't need them to function or cope , but  they changed us . Now , if we go back  to the basics, and get reaquainted  with more natural ways of dealing with these symptoms , and  get off the medication " merry -go -round "  we can not only survive, but thrive. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1112-non-drug-techniques-to-cope-with-emotional-symptoms/

Ali

[Catzilla]

I am now stuck with this horrible anhedonia. Well don't know if it's "real" anhedonia or what, but total lack of positive emotions towards anything I used to care or love. I don't know what to do ???? Has someone here found their way through this kind of lack of emotions? I'm so afraid this is going to be permanent. That my brain is somehow damaged for good...

[Ayaa]

Hi, Catzilla.

 

This is the most unpleasant thing during the waves, in my opinion. When I complained about my “emotional numbness”  in December  I was told that the more correct term for this symptom is "emotional anesthesia”. Some people say here that they prefer this feeling (absence of feelings) to the depression, because they are feeling disconnected from traumatic experiences in that state. But I feel different. If I had to choose between depression and "emotional anesthesia ”I would choose my depression. Because "emotional anesthesia ”is a very inhuman feeling and I don’t like to feel like an alien.

 

I'm so afraid this is going to be permanent.

 

 

I don’t think it’s going to last long. In my case this kind of wave was lasting maximum for few weeks. And even “few weeks” happened only once. Then the waves get shorter and nowadays they come seldom and last for few days or even for few hours. And I hope they will completely disappear.

 

Has someone here found their way through this kind of lack of emotions?

 

 

In the mornings (when I was feeling like a demotivated boiled vegetable) I was forcing myself to eat something and to start a routine work. Usually it was something very easy, the task which I could do without any effort.  In the beginning it’s difficult, but after 2-3 hours I was feeling better. And in the evening I was almost OK. Another thing I try to avoid during the wave of anhedonia is introspection. Whenever I start to examine my feelings and thoughts  it destroys everything and I loose my courage completely. So I try to avoid it and keep in my mind only one thought: “This too shall pass”.

[Catzilla]

It's so hard again. The worst thing in this is this total feeling of despair and pure terror. On those moments I think I can't go on like this for a second. And yet it goes on for hours or a full day. Or more.

 

I've noticed that my mouth is often very dry, anyone else having that?

 

The worst part of that emotional anesthesia kind of passed but still don't feel much anything. Could there be some kind of PTSD thing in all this? That the horror is so intense that something in you just shuts down? That you can even carry on somehow.

 

I don't think there has been many moments I felt "normal" during these 10 months. Is that something I should be concerned about? What if this is something I just am? Life like this really isn't worth living, so I hope there will be some change for the good pretty soon.

Any thoughts?

[Mjau]

I know it's really hard...

 

Just remember -

 

when you are in the middle of a wave and it feels as though this is how it will be forever -

 

remember that the wave will pass!!

[Catzilla]

So, I went to see that neuropsychiatrist I talked about earlier. He was great! Really empathetic and seemed to have a really good idea about these ssri related problems. I am starting low dose naltrexone tonight, please keep your fingers crossed that it would be helpful. Feels like I had some new hope from seeing someone that recognizes this horrible condition.

[Altostrata]

Very interesting, Catzilla. Please let us know how you do on LDN. (It's easy to take too much LDN, which can go paradoxical, please be careful.)

 

If you can recommend your doctor for tapering, please add his contact information to http://tinyurl.com/7cp8l8v

[Catzilla]

Started carefully with .75 mg. Didn't notice any weird effects, slept normally. At the moment I'm not in the best place mentally, my dad was hospitalized this week. So hopefully I will notice if there is some improvements.

[Ignacio]

Hi Catzilla, two things: what did you tell the neurologist so that he seem concerned?- as withdrawal and ADs adverse effects are not shared between the medical community,and did he do you any tipe of tests? (I am going to try to aproach one too)

 

and why did he give you any reasons for that treatment? I only searched it on wikipedia and it looks like it is used for people who are trying to withdraw from opioids. Thank you all the best.

[Catzilla]

Very interesting, Catzilla. Please let us know how you do on LDN. (It's easy to take too much LDN, which can go paradoxical, please be careful.)

http://tinyurl.com/7cp8l8v

In what way can LDN go paradoxical?

 

Last night was third night I took the ldn in a row. Today my anxiety is through the roof and I feel awful on a whole. I have no way of telling if it is just another wave or something to do with ldn. Does anyone know is there some kind of pattern how LDN would work for paws caused by ssris? I mean should I feel the benefits within days or do I feel worse before it gets better(maybe due some changes in the body) or does it start to work gradually? This waiting is torturing. I just want to get better and get on with my life..

[Catzilla]

I feel awful. Just awful. Months and months of hopelessness, fear, emotional numbing. Then sometimes it flares up so bad that I just wish I wouldn't wake up... I just can't see how I could possibly cope for years like this. It's getting too hard. You are so alone in this. I can't relate to the world or people in it, they just live their lives while I'm suffering all the time. Help?

[Mjau]

I know Catzilla what you're talking about. People around me are getting on with their lives and myself being stuck in this strange place of withdrawal/adverse drug reaction place with a malfunctioning brain. It's hard and you're feeling so lonely!

Are you still taking naltrexone?

[AliG]

Hi Catzilla. I'm sorry that you're struggling so badly. You started low dose Naltrexone on the 13th May. Are you still on .75mg ?  Did you have any improvement at all? Have you had an increase in your symptoms ? You said your anxiety increased. If you can update us a little more, it might help us to see the full picture more clearly.

Ali

[Catzilla]

I don't think LDN has done anything really. Except for my sleep, it's really bad every time I go alittle higher. I'm on 3mg now, but I don't see any connection between me feeling awful and LDN. This has been it for me for since I quit and ecpecially about two months after that. I feel really bad all the time; no feelings, terror, somewhat anxiety, "not feeling like myself" and then suddenly everything goes even worse. Then I fel really, really, really bad and hopeless. My "good"" windows are really not about feeling good, just not so intense terror. I haven't had normal day since quitting.

[Catzilla]

Maybe haven't had normal day since I started the meds. I just didn't notice then.

[Catzilla]

Quick update. I had my blood results back. Deficiencies with b-12 and ferritin, vitamin D borderline. My father is really ill and my partner was hospitalized over a week ago due pneumothorax and is now diagnosed with lymphoma ???? Those lymph nodes which I talked about earlier weren't nothing after all... So I have no tools to cope with these things and yet I don't have a choice. Any ideas?