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Armorall

Armorall: CT from bupropion and risperidone

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Armorall

Ok thank you!

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Armorall

Do I tell my doctor that I'd like the liquid risperidone so that I can reinstate at a small dose? He's going to question it, I think since he's the one who pulled me off of it for elevated prolactin levels. 

What if he doesn't give it to me? eek.  

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Armorall

I'm feeling so regretful that I didn't reinstate the bupropion right when I got to SA. I really didn't understand the implications of tapering until this week, I was oblivious, thinking it was only the people that were on for a long time that needed to do that. I also wasn't very clear that I had no problem tolerating both the original drugs I was on. Who knows if bupropion was actually causing insomnia? it could have been withdrawal from the APs. I should have reinstated then and kept what little homeostasis I had. I hope this works withe risperidone.

such a messed up cocktail. And I only see Nadia who would reinstate both drugs and it work for her in the notes. I don't know about anyone else, they were luckily only put on one drug!

 

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Armorall

I felt fine on bupropion and risperidone together- no adverse reactions meaning it wasn't affecting me negatively. I can't believe I did this...

I pray this is going to work. And then perhaps I can add in bupropion afterwards if the risperidone takes or something. Why did I have to be on such a cocktail? At least other people only had one drug to answer to...

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Armorall

Is there a case for me trying to reinstate Bupropion instead of Risperidone? Bupropion is much more recent...and I'm not clear that it was causing me the insomnia. that's my psychologists take. i wish I never listened to her. @Altostrata

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Altostrata

Please re-read this topic for discussion of reinstating bupropion.

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Armorall

Yes, it's energizing and has an anxiety affect, but I was fine on it. I'm not sure anymore that the insomnia was from it. I guess you're saying risperidone is less risky, though. I'm trying to fix the recent past and I can't. 

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Henryk12
16 hours ago, Armorall said:

Yes, it's energizing and has an anxiety affect, but I was fine on it. I'm not sure anymore that the insomnia was from it. I guess you're saying risperidone is less risky, though. I'm trying to fix the recent past and I can't. 

I don’t know if I have to reinstate risperidone myself . My head tics/lip , tongue movement inside my mouth ,teeth smacking, facial spasms 

jerky movements all over me though not something I can’t cope with but trying to wait it out 6 weeks for improvement but if not I’m reinstating risperidone 0.1mg to see if it changes anything although I’m seeing improvements but just scared and they are all related to td . I’m lost , making the right call is the best option we all have . Think this thoroughly and listen to your body . God will heal you Amen 

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Armorall

 Henry, 

Thanks for the blessings. Have a good day!

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Armorall

So, I went to the doc today and he got me the liquid risperidone and also the immediate release bupropion. 

His reccommendation to me was to start on Bupropion 50mg and Trazadone for sleep. He of course knew nothing of withdrawal, I mentioned to him that I shouldn't have been been cycled through so many meds at once, and no one told me the danger of just abruptly stopping my medication. 

 

So, I have another question: who are all these people who post stories about "going back on their meds" online after quitting (and clearly they have withdrawal symptoms- anxiety etc etc that they think is their original symptoms). 

https://www.madinamerica.com/2015/05/my-story-and-my-fight-against-antidepressants-part-ii/

https://www.elle.com/culture/celebrities/a13052839/cathi-hanauer-quitting-antidepressants-elle-october-2017/

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/after-party-chat/201308/so-i-went-back-meds

 

They can successfully just reinstate their medication full dose whenever? Is that not something that we can do? What makes their withdrawal any different that anyone's on here? 

 

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Altostrata

No comment.

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Armorall

 @Henryk12Your drug history is much less confusing than mine. I would strongly consider reinstatement.  

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Altostrata

Actually, your history is much clearer, Henryk's is more complex, and you are in no position to give anyone else advice about reinstatement, @Armorall, since you know nothing about it.

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Armorall

Oh, ok, my  fault. 

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Armorall

I slept "well" last night. Just tossing and turning, pretty calm nervous system. So well, that I skipped my niece's early afternoon birthday party to sleep in (after visiting the evil psychiatrist in the morning). 

Spent the whole day on here reading, but pretty calm system. 

My son 2.5 year old son is getting very verbal and said "mommy stay home and rest? Mommy not coming with?" this is heartbreaking.  Now going to try to eat. 

Still wondering about how these other people online could get back on their drugs after 18 months, etc etc. Can this be a possibility? 

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Armorall

Update- liquid risperidone not available until Tuesday. 

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Henryk12
10 hours ago, Armorall said:

 @Henryk12Your drug history is much less confusing than mine. I would strongly consider reinstatement.  

Still thinking about that but going to wait out the six weeks 

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Henryk12
10 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Actually, your history is much clearer, Henryk's is more complex, and you are in no position to give anyone else advice about reinstatement, @Armorall, since you know nothing about it.

Please @Altostrata I’m scared now you say mine is complex . You think I will never heal ? 

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Shep

 

20 hours ago, Armorall said:

So, I have another question: who are all these people who post stories about "going back on their meds" online after quitting (and clearly they have withdrawal symptoms- anxiety etc etc that they think is their original symptoms). 

https://www.madinamerica.com/2015/05/my-story-and-my-fight-against-antidepressants-part-ii/

 

You may want to read part III of that story:

 

My Fight Against Antidepressants, Part III: Breaking Free

 

It's up to you whether or not you want to stay on these drugs, but I will caution you against repeatedly asking about staying on them in your intro thread. It makes it very hard to give you tapering advice when you're stating you'd rather be on them. We aren't doctors here, so we can't give you any sort of advice when it comes to setting up a new drug cocktail, such as what you're doctor has recommended. You'll need to work with your doctor. 

 

While we do support members who wish to reduce their drug burden, as opposed to coming off these drugs completely, that's not the situation you're in. 

 

We have a thread for members to discuss staying on drugs:

 

Has anyone decided that it was best for them to stay on meds indefinitely?

 

 

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Shep
6 hours ago, Henryk12 said:

Please @Altostrata I’m scared now you say mine is complex . You think I will never heal ? 

 

Henry, having a complex drug history does not mean you won't heal. My own drug history is extremely complex -- I came off a cocktail of 6 drugs after 30 years of psychiatric drug use. And I'm healing. There's no reason you won't heal, too. 

 

Please continue posting in your intro thread

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Armorall

@ShepI'm so sorry, but I'm just so confused. I read the stories online (I did read part III to that story before, too, he should have just stayed where he was at the first time). What happens to people who go back on full medication when they are already in WD? If reinstatement is risky at such a tiny amount, wouldn't a full dose just be disastrous? Have people done it with success? I empathize with the people who have written these articles because in the end, they did it so that they can be present to their children's lives, no matter the cost, no matter if it meant they were going to be more zombie-like. That's where I am now. I want to be fully present for my son's growing years. 

I'm sorry if that mucks things up, it's just that I came off the drugs as a fluke, guessing that it was causing insomnia, not because I necessarily needed to. I've read Shipko's stuff and that freaks me out too about being in WD and being done for. I should have just stayed on bupropion and continued to take melatonin for sleep. It was working, but I didn't want to be depedent on melatonin (ha) and came off of bupropion after my psychologist (not psychiatrist) told me it energized people. That was my biggest mistake, because that's what pushed me into WD. Maybe then I could just be tapering down from bupropion, but I lost the opportunity. 

 

I'm trying to find the best route, I see what other people have done. I wanted the option that will get me back to my baby in the fullest sense. The doc made it sound so easy- take 100 wellbutrin and trazadone at night for sleep. Would that even work with me since I'm already in WD? These stories of reinstatement online don't mesh with SA's perspective (and my feeling) that our CNS can barely take any type of drugs anymore, much less full blown doses. When I asked the psych if it would work, shouldn't I be introduced to low-dose, he was like "fine, cut them in half first". Totally barbaric. 

No sense of caution at all. 

I don't know what to do anymore. And I see that having come off two drugs makes my situation much more complicated than those who came off one, then they know what to reinstate, or they can look at other people's journey's on here that came off of the single drug and compare notes. No one had the combination that I did. 

 

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Altostrata

Armorall, your drug situation is not particularly complex, but you have a talent for making it very complex.

 

You are repeating questions that we've already answered. This is very wearing on the staff. Before post any more questions asking for predictions about your own personal future if you do this or that, please re-read this topic.

 

If your physician's advice is more attractive to you, follow it. Correct, it's different from what we've told you. We're not going to argue with you about it.

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Henryk12
4 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Henry, having a complex drug history does not mean you won't heal. My own drug history is extremely complex -- I came off a cocktail of 6 drugs after 30 years of psychiatric drug use. And I'm healing. There's no reason you won't heal, too. 

 

Please continue posting in your intro thread

Thanks shep . I know you want to calm my mind I understand that but thanks and I’m seeing improvements and having symptoms also just getting use to them and I have a lot of tolerance but I get freaked out sometimes that I burst to cry and I notice whenever I do my systems seem to ease a little bit . The only symptom that bothers me much is the head shakes and neck tightness but I’m sure it will definitely pass but just don’t know what to predict. 

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Armorall

Given that my psychiatrist's ill advice is what led me to this in the first place, I guess I shouldn't follow it. He is totally oblivious to withdrawal, etc. I am guessing that if I took the full dosages, my body would freak, then I'd go down the road of grabbing medication after medication to get back to where I am right now (and maybe not ever getting back to it).

 

So this is it. I'm at a standstill again.  I hope for healing. I'm overweight but losing a lot of weight weekly. I suspect I'll be thin enough in a few months to start running. I'll get on that vegan/fruit/vegetable diet. 

 

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Armorall

Update- I've had "better" sleep now for 3 nights in a row. Still have anxiety pangs at night, but able to go back to sleep, unlike before where I was just up for hours. Also, was able to nap profusely through the enter weekend. Hopefully my sleep will continue to improve. 

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Shep

Very nice update, Armorall. Sounds like you're stabilizing. 

 

Please be careful about overdoing it. A lot of people will start to feel better and then rush to catch up with things. Treat yourself as if you're made of fine china for a long time to come. Try to minimize stress as much as possible over the coming weeks and stick to a clean and healthy diet. 

 

Hopefully you'll see fewer waves and some windows over the coming weeks. 

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Armorall

Yes, even with some of the "inconveniences" (my arm started hurting through the night and I struggled to go back to sleep, resuming sleep at 5am from 3am) I feel like something is calmer at night, regardless of the situation. Yesterday I basically had a window from 11am all the way through the late evening hours where I felt mostly normal. I took a nap around 7pm and I had much louder tinnitus, though. 

I pray that I am improving.

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Armorall

Well Shep, you were right of course about the "fine china" part. I tried to up my magnesium dosage yesterday, hoping that using the liquid would mean that I could take more of it ( I heard the citrate just draws water into your bowels more). I was feeling good and had a huge appetite at dinner, so we went out to buffet. the whole night I got hot flashes- whether it be from the updose of magnesium or from all the carb-filled food, it was terrible. I can't believe how fragile I am now. 

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Armorall

* the whole night of sleep, meaning

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Armorall

Got to sleep on and off the whole day, then saw my new CBT (trauma-informed) therapist. She tried to give me some goals to focus on. She has no understanding of withdrawal, I have to keep explaining things to her. 

It only makes me feel sadder, having to explain. She says I have no hope. I'm not sure what I have anymore. I know I don't suffer as deeply as many in our group, but I don't know if I can take that as a sign that I'm any closer to healing than anyone else, or that I will be in a year, 2 years etc etc. Length of time of usage seems to be arbitrary. The scariness that I CT'd two drugs  within a month also adds doubt in my mind about healing.  I wish I could have August back to do over again, but that's not going to happen. 

 

On the flipside on entering November, knock on wood that no new symptoms have emerged. Tinnitus (only audible in quiet, thankfully), insomnia, anxiety (mostly morning until noon, but will also do a surprise appearance in the evening) some swings into depression in the evening, but sometimes clear. 

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Shep
6 hours ago, Armorall said:

Got to sleep on and off the whole day, then saw my new CBT (trauma-informed) therapist. She tried to give me some goals to focus on. She has no understanding of withdrawal, I have to keep explaining things to her. 

 

Many people report that therapy can be problematic during recovery due to therapists confusing their concepts of "mental illness" with what we, as survivors, know to be withdrawal symptoms. You may find trauma-informed yoga, meditation, or music or art therapy to be more helpful.

 

Calming the nervous system is what works best and if you find therapy to be a re-traumatization more than a healing process, than that's an indication that you may want to change paths. 

 

6 hours ago, Armorall said:

On the flipside on entering November, knock on wood that no new symptoms have emerged. Tinnitus (only audible in quiet, thankfully), insomnia, anxiety (mostly morning until noon, but will also do a surprise appearance in the evening) some swings into depression in the evening, but sometimes clear. 

 

No new symptoms is progress. Sounds like you're doing well in spite of the struggles of the continuation of symptoms. This continuation of symptoms can lead to battle fatigue. Even those with moderate symptoms will grow weary as weeks turn to months, so do the best you can with self care and rest. 

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Armorall

@Shep my therapist is trying best to understand withdrawal. She doesn't believe in the medical model and she has offered CBD oil, niacinamide, etc etc because she knows of those alternatives for her clients and is a distributor. (not that I am taking them, of course). i wish I had found her before so that maybe I could have managed things better before my fatal send off to the hospital and drugs. She's also introduced me to neural beats, tells me to do deep breathing in the morning and on the way home from work, take yoga. I do need to go somewhere to keep up hope. 

 

You think my symptoms are moderate? I thought they were mild...some part of me hoped that my recovery is linear. All I do is sleep in my off time (and excercise, lightly). I told my husband that I should be just shut in a black box and emerge when it is over. This goes against the idea that I should work, though.  

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Armorall

Sleep has been "normal". I could actually hit the snooze button twice today and get back to bed. Now I can see what people talk about in over-exerting, though. I ran to work today from my car because I had diarhea. I had muscle soreness on the back of one leg for a few hours. 

Also, I had abstained from the morning magnesium drink for three days, then I take it today and suddenly my body can't handle it? arg. 

I had a session with Baylissa yesterday and feel positive from the experience. 

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TurkeyCold
On 11/2/2019 at 5:56 PM, Armorall said:

[...]

 

They can successfully just reinstate their medication full dose whenever? Is that not something that we can do? What makes their withdrawal any different that anyone's on here? 

 

Hey Armorall,

 

as someone who reinstated the full dose many months after having coldturkeyed - and I did that even two times since I had no clue what was going on - I can confirm that it is possible. Symptoms (crying spells, dark depression) were gone within a few days both times but this doesn't mean that this applies to your or anybody else's case. We're all unique in our structures and reactions and it is like playing with fire when it comes to the question of how much to reinstate. Some people have enormous adverse reactions when even reinstating tiny amounts of their original dose, some don't.

 

Wish you the best,

C.

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