John Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) Hi. About 5 years ago I was prescribed Effexor 75mg for mild GAD. It seemed to work ok, but I was never really that bad to begin with. To make a long story (sort of) short, in July of 2010, I quit the effexor cold turkey. Shortly after I began having panic attacks which I now know was from withdrawals, and also head zaps. These seemed to of disappeared in August 2010. Then in September of 2010, I had a hair transplant. Minor surgery, but was given large doses of Keflex, and had local anasthesia injected that contained adrenaline to prevent excess bleeding. This made my heart race, but its a normal side effect. This is a second procedure that I had with the first being 2 years before this one. 2 days after the procedure, I was sitting at home and all of a sudden starting feeling a feeling I never in my life had before. I Although I had panic attacks from the Effexor withdrawals, these feelings were different. They felt like feeling of doom, dread, and all thoughts good or bad seemed to be amplified by 100 fold. I would be breaking out in sweats, then alternate with being freezing cold. My neck was streaked with a flushed red color, my eyelid constantly twitched, and my appetite disappeared. I lost about 25lbs in a few weeks. My mouth was constantly dry, and although I have perfect eyesight, it looked as if I was looking through a sheer veil. I would usually wake in the morning being ok, yet within a few minutes begin the cycle all over again. At work to subconciously run from the feeling, I would constantly be moving; I would walk around the block, move about the building all day, and avoid the lunchroom so I didnt have to sit in one place. I went to a psyciatrist for the first time, and he didnt act as though anything was odd. He tried to prescribe me ssris and xanax. I refused it and started going to a holistic therapist which was useless. At this point it was December of 2010. I caved in and saw another psyciatrist who prescribed me Effexor 75mg. I took this for about 3 1/2 months while seeing a psycologist who diagnosed my with anxiety NOS, and still had no relief. Then come April 2011, and I started to sporatically feel better. Not great, but I did notice improvement. My appetite returned, and I began regaining the weight I had lost, and began enjoying things once again. In June of 2011, I discontinued the psycologist, who said that it couldnt of been the Effexor giving relief since I would of seen improvement much earlier than 3 1/2 months. As the summer months of went on, I continued to improve, with many small bouts of "spells"; some larger than others. Now its Oct/Nov/Dec 2011. There are times where the feelings were completely gone for days, sometimes for weeks at a time. Christmas came and went, then the day before news years eve came and I regressed back to the way I felt many months ago. I seems like all my recovery has been thrown out the window. Thank you for reading this, as this has been a very long post. Any insights on what this can be? And what do you think has happened? I would like to add that im still on the Effexor, and am not taking any other meds or have ever done so. Edited October 15, 2016 by scallywag tags On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
renee Posted February 6, 2012 Share Posted February 6, 2012 HI john im sorry to here you went through all of that but glad u are feeling better.To me it sounds like withdrawel but others on this site with more knowledge will tell u.I know having tried to come off cipralex several times thts what would happen to me.A few months later terrible anxitey exactly like you have described.So i would go back on.Ive been on cipralex on and off for 6 years.Im slowly going down im at 11.5 instead of 20 which makes me so happy.Im not sure if i can get off totally for good, but with the support of this site i mite be able to,or at least get to a much lower dose.I realize now that the only way to go down is very slow.I ve been doing 10 percent every 3 weeks seems to be working. Link to comment
John Posted February 6, 2012 Author Share Posted February 6, 2012 What threw me off was that the surges, etc. started 2 months after i discontinued the Effexor and after the zaps stopped. I had no idea what was going on; I never had these problems before the effexor. After a year and 4 months I still occasionally have odd feelings. Whats also odd is that after I reinstated the Effexor, it took about 4 months until I started feeling better. So I guess it wasnt the reinstatement that made me feel better. God; I remember going to the psyciatristfor the first time in my life thinking I was having a nervous breakdown or becoming schitzophrenic and praying that it was withdrawals of the Effexor. But since everywhere I read said that "discontinuation syndrome" is mild and only lasts a few weeks, I had some serious doubts. "How long have you been off of them? 2 months?!? Oh no, its not them. Its anxiety. You need to go back on an antidepressant." Last words I ever wanted to hear. Since, then I searched high and low, and not once did I find any information of what was happening to me. It was only the last few months is when I noticed more and more of this delayed withdrawal popping up on the net. And by the way Doctor, what kind of anxiety is this? GAD? No. OCD? Nope. Social anxiety? Wrong again. Why havent I been diagnosed? Its because you have no idea what happened to me, since you havent been taught anything about the drugs you constantly prescribe. Remember the benzos? around almost 50 years, and it took at least 30 of them to discover that they were addictive and cause withdrawals? Why cant you give at least the benefit of the doubt that theres a possiblility that these might be similar or even worse for some people than the benzos? Because of money, thats why. Many of these so called Drs are in cohoots with those wonderful multi billion dollar drug companies. If we know better, why do the drs not? I have a coworker who went through the exact same thing as I did, around the same time too. Hes more trusting of thos drs, and so he was put back on celexa, and like me took 4 months or so to feel better, but it made hime very tired. So he asked his psych about it and guess what happened? He went home with a prescription of Wellbutrin XR to counteract the tiredness! I think theres thousands out there who have gone through what I have, and a spellbounded and think theyve lost their lives and minds, with the psyciatrists confirming it for them. How many suicides could have been prevented? How many people really belong in those mental hospitals? How many people are not really bipolar, but are diagnosed with it because their drugs are making them so? Well, thats my rant. Sorry if it wad so negative, but im sure most of you know this is true, and something needs to be done. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted February 6, 2012 Administrator Share Posted February 6, 2012 Hello, John. Thanks for joining us. What we have seen is that withdrawal syndrome, which you had after stopping Effexor the first time, can make your nervous system hypersensitive to neuroactive medications for a very long time. Many of us have experienced this. What probably happened was the drugs used during your minor surgery destabilized your hypersensitive nervous system. It took some months to recover. The second round of Effexor had nothing to do with this; you might have done better without it. You had a serious adverse reaction to Effexor with withdrawal syndrome. If I were you, I would avoid all psychiatric medications in the future and be careful about anesthetics, etc. The next time you might be anesthetized, tell the doctor you have autonomic instability. Anyway, it's very good news that your nervous system restabilized. (Please break up your writing into paragraphs. It's hard to read when it's all one big block.) This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
renee Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Im soo with u john the docters are crooks and screwing up alot of people.I wonder how many crimes and suicides ect are done when people are trying to get off this ****. Link to comment
renee Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Also all the weight gain everywhere we look?Is it our diets?Or our medication?Ive struggeled with 30lbs since being on cipralex and never had a weight problem in my life?How come thats never talked about when their telling us to exercise and eat better???? Link to comment
John Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 I had psycologists as well as myself telling me that this is me now; that it isnt the Effexor withdrawal. Some suggested that I might if been this way earlier had I not of taken the Effexor. Can this be? I never felt this way ever before I took Effexor before. But then what would explain the massive improvement, and will it ever get back to the way it was pre-Effexor? Since my improvement, I also noticed that from Monday to Friday just about every symptom I have is gone, and I work 9-5 Monday thru Friday. Odd since work is stress, and anxiety is not there during those tumes. For some strange reason, its mainly the weekends when and if I get my spell (since my improvement, I call these spells since they come and go). Also oddly enough, even when I was at the height of my withdrawals, I noticed that after 8:30 pm the anxiety goes away. Now I know that im not looking at the clock waiting for 830 so I can feel better. Why can this be? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted February 8, 2012 Administrator Share Posted February 8, 2012 John, they usually say it's relapse and not withdrawal syndrome. Very, very few doctors recognize withdrawal syndrome. The points you raise indicate your symptoms are withdrawal syndrome. In your case, the psychologists and doctors are wrong. This is true of almost every person on this site, and every person on every withdrawal site. Hundreds of thousands of people. Medicine does not recognize withdrawal syndrome. If you feel your medical caregivers are incorrect, you can reject their advice and look for caregivers who seem to have a better understanding of you and your situation. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted February 26, 2012 Author Share Posted February 26, 2012 I already posted my situation in another post. To make a very long story short, after 5 years of taking Effexor I went cold turkey. I suffered horribly from a delayed withdrawal. Immediately had zaps, panic attacks. 2 months later, that went away, but began having extreme fear and panic constantly. No relief whatsoever. 2 months into that I reinstated it at the same doseage, and after 4 months starting feeling better. Now 1 yr and 5 months later, I only get "spells" with sometimes last for about 10 days or so and severity ranges from moderate to light, and frequency is from 1 week to a month. I'm a little concerned (and aggravated) that this is still happening. The question I have is do you think that reinstating the Effexor prolonged total recovery? I'm in the process of tapering. Less than 10% every month, but just started yesterday. I did notice that this second time around of being on this drug I get different side effects than the first time; head zaps, extreme tiredness, etc, but not the heart palps or racing heart like I did originally. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted February 26, 2012 Administrator Share Posted February 26, 2012 John, I merged your new topic with your first one. There's only one topic to a member in the Introductions forum. Reinstating seemed to relieve some of the distress your nervous system experienced from the cold turkey, although it sounds like you either had continued withdrawal syndrome (yes, this can happen) or adverse reactions to Effexor (probably from cold-turkey-induced hypersensitivity) when you reinstated it. You did the right thing to reinstate. Cold turkey would have been worse. It sounds like a 10% taper may be too much for you. Assume your nervous system is sensitized by the cold turkey and go slower to reduce the additional distress of withdrawal this time around. It may take longer, but it's your only nervous system. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted February 26, 2012 Author Share Posted February 26, 2012 Thanks for the reply. But you dont think the reinstatement is what made these symptoms last so long? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted February 26, 2012 Administrator Share Posted February 26, 2012 We can't go back and see how long withdrawal symptoms might have lasted if you did not reinstate after cold turkey. For quite a few people, severe symptoms could last years. You might as well think you did the right thing by reinstating. It alleviated your symptoms somewhat and gave you the option of a slow, gradual taper now. Don't blame yourself for anything you've done, you did the best you could with what information you had. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Do you think it's wise to taper off at this point, since I'm not fully recovered? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted February 29, 2012 Administrator Share Posted February 29, 2012 Good question. You had a setback, how are you feeling now? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 Like you said in one of your posts, each time it returns it's a little different. Sometimes I feel like in a fog, other times I feel panicky. Then there are times when I feel nothing at all for a month. Right now I feel no panic, but have some hot flashes. But I asked if its a good idea to taper now because it's not like everything went away after I reinstated, and now can taper. Most of my symptoms are similar to withdrawals anyway, and I have a feeling i'm going to have a hard time distinguishing the tapering symptoms to the symtoms I already have. For some reason, I always am afraid that this is all not from the meds. I always fear that this is some new anxiety disorder. The psycologist diagnosed me with anxiety NOS (not otherwise specified). I do understand that he's not an MD, and even if he was wouldnt recognize the withdrawals if it slapped him in the face, but at the same time this has been going on so long, and I did have mild anxiety before I started on the Effexor 5 years ago. On the other hand, at 39 years old and never feeling this way before I took the meds plus an NOS diagnosis does indicate it is the meds since it started 2 months after I went cold turkey. Too big of a coincidence, don't you think? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted March 1, 2012 Administrator Share Posted March 1, 2012 They always say it's relapse or emergence of a psychiatric disorder. Since when are hot flashes part of an anxiety disorder? Sounds to me like your nervous system is still destabilized from that cold turkey -- those sound exactly like withdrawal symptoms aka autonomic dysfunction from withdrawal. I don't know, John. I guess if you have been improving on Effexor, it might not be a good idea to rock the boat now by fooling with your dosage. Are you taking tablets or capsules? If capsules, you can try taking out one pellet a day for 3 weeks, reducing your dosage very slightly to see if it helps or hurts. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 Well, I began tapering 5 days ago by taking out 13 pellets and will take these for 4 weeks. Then if I feel ok, i'll drop again another 13. My original dose was 75mg, so 13 pellets are a little less than 5 mgs. So far I feel no different than before. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted March 1, 2012 Administrator Share Posted March 1, 2012 You might want to keep a journal to see if you get withdrawal symptoms from dosage changes. Then you'll know whether to increase, decrease, or stay the same. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 Well, here I am for the 2nd attempt on ridding myself off of Effexor. If you read my story in the previous posts you'd see that the first time was over a year ago and it was cold turkey. This time around I removed 13 pellets from my 75mg pill and took that for 4 weeks. I then removed another 13 pellets bringing down the potency to about 66mgs. A week into this which was last night, I felt a heaviness in my chest; like the beginnings of a panic attack. It went away after a few minutes. Today it started again, and while its not a full blown panic attack, it feels like its "on the edge". When I went cold turkey the last time, I had many full blown panic attacks and palpitations, but went away eventually, then 2 months after that got some serious psycological issues manifesting in severe anxiety, panic, agoraphobia, when I never had any of this before. I guess the question that I'm asking is if this small reduction can start up these panic attacks? I never had Panic attacks before I went cold turkey over a year ago. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Nikki Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Hi John.... Effexor is tough. In answer to your question, Yes any deviation in dose can and for those of us on this site, cause all of the symptoms you mentioned. Over the years I have read posts from people who never had panic attacks until after they went off or tried to get off these meds. I had panic attacks and agoraphobia which led me to take meds. Can you reduce the amount of pellets you remove, let's say (8) or (6) so help ease the w/d? And leave more time before drops in dose. John I hate recommending drugs, but if the panic becomes very bad maybe you can take a tiny amount of xanax just to break the cycle. Or try Rescue Remedy, it helps some people out alot. Hang in there.... Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1902-nikki-hi-my-rundown-with-ads/ Paxil 1997-2004 Crossed over to Lexapro Paxil not available at Pharmacies GSK halted deliveries Lexapro 40mgs Lexapro taper (2years) Imipramine Imipramine and Celexa Now Nefazadone/Imipramine 50mgs. each 45mgs. Serzone 50mgs. Imipramine Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 2, 2012 Administrator Share Posted April 2, 2012 Yes, John, small changes in dosage can bring on symptoms. This is an indication that a drop of 13 pellets is too much at this point. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 I wouldn't mind too mu h except that I hope its not a precursor to the agoraphobia and extreme fear I had last time since then I had the panic attacks and 2 months later had those issues. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
angie007 Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Hi John, Yes i was the same way, never ever had anxiety/fear/panic nothing until i reduced paxil ( seroxat). My only advice is to go slowly and take your time, there is no rush to get off, its better to be able to have some quality of life while your doing this, plus it does get easier once you can get off too. All the best and hope your taper goes smoothly. Began taking 30mg Seroxat on 15th Jan 1997 for grief issues. Remained at that dosage until Dec 05, did doctor ct, akathesia set in along with being non functional and overly emotional, brain fog. Doctor prescribed prozac, propranelol and diazeapam to counteract side effects, and told me to ct those 3 after 2.5/3 months use, induced wd seizure on 2nd day after ct. Was reinstated on seroxat 20mg in april 06, remained at that dose until Nov 07 and began a very slow taper lasting 56 months, finally DRUG FREE on 11th may 2011. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 2, 2012 Administrator Share Posted April 2, 2012 I wouldn't mind too mu h except that I hope its not a precursor to the agoraphobia and extreme fear I had last time since then I had the panic attacks and 2 months later had those issues. Back up a little in dosage, taper slower, and you'll reduce the risk of that happening. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Nikki Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 John whenever I had to go back up in dose I felt a sense of failure and despair. Which are easy places for the mind to go while in WD. However, going back up providedme with much needed relief. Alto is right, it's a signal to go back up to stabilize. Someone once told me on another site...."to throw out the calendar" because I had a set deadline to get off Lexapro. I am not saying you feel despair or are in a rush ~ I was. Hugs Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1902-nikki-hi-my-rundown-with-ads/ Paxil 1997-2004 Crossed over to Lexapro Paxil not available at Pharmacies GSK halted deliveries Lexapro 40mgs Lexapro taper (2years) Imipramine Imipramine and Celexa Now Nefazadone/Imipramine 50mgs. each 45mgs. Serzone 50mgs. Imipramine Link to comment
Daisy Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Panic attacks, I too thought I would complete the tapering of Effexor XR 150mg in little over a month. The W/D symptoms came back within 2 days. I reinstated per the advise of SA members. I am holding at 20mg. Time will tell if I have protracted W/D in the future. Right now, I am comfortable, but do notice memory and concentration problems sporadically. I do cushion the almost daily anxiety with Xanax. I eventually want to get off Xanax too, but not right now. Hang in there. Updose to get comfortable if you need to. Set youself up for success vs failure by going slower than you had originally planned. Love and Peace Effexor XL 2009-2012. CT 150mg Effexor XR 2012, Effexor XR 75mg 2012 then rapid taper to 0, Reinstated Effexor XR 13mg then updosed to 20mg, Tapered to 18mg Effexor XR 4/9/12, Off Effexor XL ?Reinstated Effexor XL 150 mgs August 2012, Crashed in November 2012, Prozac 40 mgs 2012 to Feb 2018, Buspar 60 mgs 2012-stopped 2015, Remeron 7.5 mgs as needed for sleep-stopped Feb 2017, Prozac 50 mgs Feb 2018 to March 2018, Lexapro 5 mgs March 18 2018 to May 17th 2018, Lexapro 2.5 mgs May 18th to May 26th 2018, Prozac 10 mgs May 15th 2018, Prozac 5 mgs May 19th 2018 to current day May 28th 2018, Xanax 0.25 mgs to 0.5 mgs daily for over 15 years. Increased Xanax to 1.5 mgs Sept 2012, Tapered Xanax to 0 mgs May 2013.Reinstated Xanax Feb 2017 at 0.125 mgs as needed, Gradual increase of Xanax to 1.5 mgs daily till May 22nd 2018, Xanax 1.25 mgs daily. Holding Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Rhiannon Posted April 3, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 3, 2012 Hi John.... Effexor is tough. In answer to your question, Yes any deviation in dose can and for those of us on this site, cause all of the symptoms you mentioned. Over the years I have read posts from people who never had panic attacks until after they went off or tried to get off these meds. I had panic attacks and agoraphobia which led me to take meds. Can you reduce the amount of pellets you remove, let's say (8) or (6) so help ease the w/d? And leave more time before drops in dose. John I hate recommending drugs, but if the panic becomes very bad maybe you can take a tiny amount of xanax just to break the cycle. Or try Rescue Remedy, it helps some people out alot. Hang in there.... Just want to say: Please don't take Xanax! Benzodiazepines are a ticket to hell, and Xanax is one of the worst. Highly addictive, very difficult to get off of. Xanax in particular produces something called "interdose withdrawal" which actually CAUSES panic attacks. Also can cause agoraphobia, deterioration of cognitive function, and deterioration of social functioning. And did I mention, hell to get off of? And because of tolerance effects, benzos only work for a few weeks. After that all they're doing is preventing the increased anxiety that comes if you don't take them, no longer actually helping with the original anxiety itself. Please never take a benzo unless it's a matter of immediate life or death and never take it more than five days in a row--dependence and tolerance develop quickly. I work with people trying to get off benzos and I've seen many, many tragic stories. Including people who took a benzo for just two or three months and then suffer for a year trying to get off. Rescue Remedy, on the other hand, or valerian, or ashwagandha--herbal remedies are a whole other story. May or may not help, but not likely to destroy your life. Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010. Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea. Feb 15 2010: 300 mg Neurontin 200 Lamictal 10 Celexa 0.65 Xanax and 5 mg Ambien Feb 10 2014: 62 Lamictal 1.1 Celexa 0.135 Xanax 1.8 Valium Feb 10 2015: 50 Lamictal 0.875 Celexa 0.11 Xanax 1.5 Valium Feb 15 2016: 47.5 Lamictal 0.75 Celexa 0.0875 Xanax 1.42 Valium 2/12/20 12 0.045 0.007 1 May 2021 7 0.01 0.0037 1 Feb 2022 6 0!!! 0.00167 0.98 2.5 mg Ambien Oct 2022 4.5 mg Lamictal (off Celexa, off Xanax) 0.95 Valium Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion. Link to comment
Nikki Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Wow Rhi...I didn't know Xanax could actually cause panic attacks. I do not take Xanax on a regular basis, only periodically. Rarely. Even though I don't use it much I did notice a rebounding depression the next day. Slow, tired, like a hang-over type feeling. It does stop the panic. I purchased Rescue Remedy and it didn't help much. I have used Propanolol and that stopped panic too. I get a rebounding depression from just about everything particularly during WD or tapering. Hugs Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1902-nikki-hi-my-rundown-with-ads/ Paxil 1997-2004 Crossed over to Lexapro Paxil not available at Pharmacies GSK halted deliveries Lexapro 40mgs Lexapro taper (2years) Imipramine Imipramine and Celexa Now Nefazadone/Imipramine 50mgs. each 45mgs. Serzone 50mgs. Imipramine Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 5, 2012 Administrator Share Posted April 5, 2012 Benzos are prone to having paradoxical effects, such as panic attacks. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted April 6, 2012 Author Share Posted April 6, 2012 Thanks all for the replies. After 2 days I didnt up the dosage and the panic attacks went away. I have 3 more weeks at this dosage until I drop again. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Skyler Posted April 6, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 6, 2012 Wow Rhi...I didn't know Xanax could actually cause panic attacks. I do not take Xanax on a regular basis, only periodically. Rarely. Even though I don't use it much I did notice a rebounding depression the next day. Slow, tired, like a hang-over type feeling. It does stop the panic. I purchased Rescue Remedy and it didn't help much. I have used Propanolol and that stopped panic too. I get a rebounding depression from just about everything particularly during WD or tapering. Hugs Benzos are notorious for causing panic attacks during withdrawal. This is one of the most common complaints. Schuyler As always, LISTEN TO YOUR BODY! A proud supporter of the 10% (or slower) rule. Requip - 3/16 ZERO Total time on 25 years. Lyrica: 8/15 ZERO Total time on 7 or 8 yrs.BENZO FREE 10/13 (started tapering 7/10) Total time on 25 years. Read my intro thread here, and check the about me section. "No matter how cynical you get, it's almost impossible to keep up." Lily Tomlin Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 I think the anxiety and agoraphobia I experienced in 2008 was a direct result of stint in detox when they CTd Klonopin (gave me Ativan) and fentanyl and oxycodone all at same time (I had weaned myself down to 2 oxycodone IR/day) - Those 3 days did more harm to me both physically and psychologically - it triggered anxiety and agoraphobia I didn't have previously and it's very similar to anxiety I've felt during this w/d - I hate addiction medicine- Hindsight - a ***** Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
John Posted April 9, 2012 Author Share Posted April 9, 2012 So basically you all think I'm tapering too fast? Every 4 weeks I'm removing 13 beads. Regardless of how much, I'm sure ill have some type of symptoms. On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 9, 2012 Administrator Share Posted April 9, 2012 Not necessarily. The goal is to minimize withdrawal symptoms. As you go lower in dosage, the 13 beads represent a larger and larger proportion of your dosage. We suggest a 10% taper based on the last dosage. This keeps the reduction very gradual. If you are now taking 110 beads, 10% would be 11 beads. If you are taking 50 beads, it would be 5 beads. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
John Posted April 11, 2012 Author Share Posted April 11, 2012 So is it more important to reduce for example 10% of the amount of pellets in the capsule, or 10% of the milligrams? On Venlafaxine XR 75mg > 20 years, because a general MD decided to try these new "calming pills" taken from his sample closet because my pulse was a little high since I get nervous going to the doctor. June 2010 - Cold turkey September 2010 - Sudden onset of EXTREME anxiety, constant terror and fear that got marginally better at night. I had no idea what or why this was; had no idea it was the quitting of Effexor. December 2010 - reinstated 75mgs Effexor XR, felt no better months later January 2011 - Began 5% taper every month 2012 - Anxiety began improving by had many windows and waves January 2014 - Fell back into sudden onset of same anxiety, fear as in 2010; realized I was tapering too quickly. I was not allowing withdrawal effects to dissipate before another taper. Began 2% taper every 6 to 8 months 2016 - Fear, anxiety began to wane 2017, 18 & 19 - Constant Fear & anxiety stopped, just occasional minor bouts that lasted 3 days or so December 2020 - Now at ~31mgs Effexor XR, 5mgs Crestor November 2022 - Added 6% minoxidil and 0.3% finasteride topical. Used for a year. Got systemic side effects. Quit 11/19/2023. Also intermittently used 10 to 20mgs propanolol for adrenaline surges/pvcs. Stopped them also on 11/19/2023. Link to comment
Daisy Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Hi John, It is important to reduce by 10 percent of the pellets. For example, I am currently taking 20 pellets. When it is time to decrease by 10 percent, I will be taking 18 pellets. Now if you want more detail, my brand of generic 150mg Effexor XR has almost 150 pellets. That is close enough for me to feel comfortable saying that 1 pellet equals 1 mg. Your brand may have a different amt of pellets per capsule. I hope I am making sense It has been a long day and I am tired. Effexor XL 2009-2012. CT 150mg Effexor XR 2012, Effexor XR 75mg 2012 then rapid taper to 0, Reinstated Effexor XR 13mg then updosed to 20mg, Tapered to 18mg Effexor XR 4/9/12, Off Effexor XL ?Reinstated Effexor XL 150 mgs August 2012, Crashed in November 2012, Prozac 40 mgs 2012 to Feb 2018, Buspar 60 mgs 2012-stopped 2015, Remeron 7.5 mgs as needed for sleep-stopped Feb 2017, Prozac 50 mgs Feb 2018 to March 2018, Lexapro 5 mgs March 18 2018 to May 17th 2018, Lexapro 2.5 mgs May 18th to May 26th 2018, Prozac 10 mgs May 15th 2018, Prozac 5 mgs May 19th 2018 to current day May 28th 2018, Xanax 0.25 mgs to 0.5 mgs daily for over 15 years. Increased Xanax to 1.5 mgs Sept 2012, Tapered Xanax to 0 mgs May 2013.Reinstated Xanax Feb 2017 at 0.125 mgs as needed, Gradual increase of Xanax to 1.5 mgs daily till May 22nd 2018, Xanax 1.25 mgs daily. Holding Link to comment
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