Tips for tapering off Zyprexa (olanzapine)

[Nicjk]

On 5/27/2018 at 12:46 PM, Evoldnahturt said:

 

I started having heart issues while still on Olanzapine.  I still do, to some extent, but I suspect that this, like most issues caused by poor lifestyle choices, is one of those things that the body can repair on it's own once you start being good to it, so I'm not too worried about it.  Time will tell!

Hi @Evoldnahturtjust wondering what your tapering method is? Do you cut and weigh your tablets? 

[Nicjk]

On 5/27/2018 at 12:46 PM, Evoldnahturt said:

 

I started having heart issues while still on Olanzapine.  I still do, to some extent, but I suspect that this, like most issues caused by poor lifestyle choices, is one of those things that the body can repair on it's own once you start being good to it, so I'm not too worried about it.  Time will tell!

Hi @Evoldnahturtjust wondering what your tapering method is? Do you cut and weigh your tablets? 

[Spideygsm]

Nicjk,

 

I tapered from 30mg Olanzapine to zero by cutting tablets.  My withdrawals were the worst at 2.5mg and less. It sucks and took about 16 weeks from my last dose until the withdrawals decreased.

 

For me there was nothing that helped the withdrawals or lack of sleep. Don’t let the doctors replace one nasty Psych drug with another. Exercise (even just a walk outside) everyday. No caffeine. Willpower. It’s tough, takes a long time, but things do get better.  

[Nicjk]

8 hours ago, Spideygsm said:

Nicjk,

 

I tapered from 30mg Olanzapine to zero by cutting tablets.  My withdrawals were the worst at 2.5mg and less. It sucks and took about 16 weeks from my last dose until the withdrawals decreased.

 

For me there was nothing that helped the withdrawals or lack of sleep. Don’t let the doctors replace one nasty Psych drug with another. Exercise (even just a walk outside) everyday. No caffeine. Willpower. It’s tough, takes a long time, but things do get better.  

Thanks for sharing your experience Spideygsm. Congratulations for coming off this horrible drug! It looks like you made quite large cuts which is very brave. I am keen to do a really slow microtaper but I just need to find out how it would be possible to do so using regular tablets. I’m hoping that by cutting extremely slowly some of the horrible withdrawals will be mitigated. 

[Spideygsm]

The withdrawals suck. I had to get off the drug quickly because of very negative side effects. I withdrew under my physicians directions.

 

I exercised and drank lots of water. I did try CBD but I could tell you for sure if it helped or not.

 

Good luck. You can do it. A strong mind and not giving up is the key. I never bounced back up on a dose because I knew that would be a setback. 

[Nicjk]

1 hour ago, Spideygsm said:

The withdrawals suck. I had to get off the drug quickly because of very negative side effects. I withdrew under my physicians directions.

 

I exercised and drank lots of water. I did try CBD but I could tell you for sure if it helped or not.

 

Good luck. You can do it. A strong mind and not giving up is the key. I never bounced back up on a dose because I knew that would be a setback. 

Thanks very much! I’m glad you’re out of the woods

[Mahadeva]

On 10/9/2021 at 4:40 AM, Nicjk said:

Does anyone know if it is possible to do a daily micro taper off Olanzapine with the regular tablets? I unfortunately can't tolerate either the liquid version or the orodispersible/wafers in water. I have found an expensive scale that weighs 0.0001g and it theoretically could be possible to reduce by minuscule amounts per day but I just wonder how difficult that would be. Any ideas and input is most welcome. Thanks everyone 

 

Hi, i'm doing a standart liquid suspension tapper with a generic brand of olanzapine and its working well.

 

I just measure 20ml of filtered water with a syringe and pour in a small glass container with a plastic lid, i place my pill there and wait to dissolve for about half n hour, then i stirr very well with the syringer and take the right dose in mls following the sheet calculator for my current dose, now im removing 7.4mls out of 20, and it works, i was doing very good till now, not much side effects and improvements on my mood/mind, but lately the last reduction gave me insomnia so i cut back the dose a bit and tonight i will check if i can sleep.

[LHRG]

Hi everyone,

 

Is anyone using the orodispersible tablet to taper ? I'd like to know if making a water solution with it is possible.

I'm tapering from 5mg, and I powered through 5-2,5mg with short-lived WD symptoms (lifting in 3-4 days), but now I am stuck at 2,33 mg with severe and longer-lasting symptoms. I'm going to be way more conservative with the last reductions, but the small orodispersible tablets make it hard to make precise cuts. Is everybody using the regular tablet or is there a way to get through with the orodispersible ones ?

[manymoretodays]

Hi LHRG,

If you read through the first post in this topic you'll see more about using the orodispersible wafer/tablets in water, down towards the bottom.

I do know one member who did so, and I'll do an @stelahere in case they sign in and come on, they'll find your post.

I'll also divert back, to your Introduction topic now too.

Edited November 11, 2021 by manymoretodays

[Intense]

So I have a question. I want to try making a liquid dose of olanzapine especially once I start getting to really small doses. Do I use crushed up 5mg olanzapine tablet, put it in 2.5ML of DMSO, let it sit for an hour and keep stirring it. Then after that, I put it in 2.5ML of Ora-Plus, then take the dose? Or alternatively, do I mix 2.5ML of DMSO and 2.5ML of PBS first and then add the crushed up powder, shake it up, let it sit for several hours, then take the dose? I don't know how reliable this method will be once I start getting to really small doses, like 0.23mg dose. Just to clarify, I do want to start off the tapering by using crushed up powder, weighing the contents on a digital milligram scale, put it in capsules, and swallow them. As I get closer to lower doses, I wanna switch to the liquid form. When I get close to the 0.56mg dose, the weight will be in 0.0001g format and my digital milligram scale does not go that far.

Edited February 4, 2022 by Intense

[hayduke]

Hi @Intense

 

In practice most people don't worry about compounding a solution.

 

Making a suspension in clean water is better than good enough.  I used to leave the tablet for 15-60 mins to dissolve in a small brown glass bottle in the fridge, maybe breaking it in half first.  After it's sat, you just need to make sure it's well shaken or agitated just before you measure out and drink it.  That way you have a good even distribution of the active ingredient.

 

You can use the same batch for up to 7 days if your fridge is good.

 

 

[Intense]

I think I will use herewego's advice regarding using the Ora-Plus, water, and crushed up olanzapine powder. In my experience, I tried putting the olanzapine tablet by itself in water and it disintegrated, but it quickly sunk to the bottom. So, I tried to pipette with the syringe and I wasn't able to get a good amount of the olanzapine, and thus I wasn't able to go to sleep. And I think even if I had left the olanzapine in the fridge for 1 or 2 hours and shook it around for some moments, it probably wouldn't have done anything and the powder would still be in the bottom. I think herewego's advice sounds better. I was able to get Ora-Plus on Amazon easily, so that's not a problem.

[hayduke]

2 hours ago, Intense said:

In my experience, I tried putting the olanzapine tablet by itself in water and it disintegrated, but it quickly sunk to the bottom. So, I tried to pipette with the syringe and I wasn't able to get a good amount of the olanzapine, and thus I wasn't able to go to sleep. And I think even if I had left the olanzapine in the fridge for 1 or 2 hours and shook it around for some moments, it probably wouldn't have done anything and the powder would still be in the bottom.

 

You do need to give it a good shake.  I was in the habit of squishing it in and out of the pipette or syringe quickly before drawing out the dose, too.  (Agitating the liquid).  It's definitely a proven and reliably accurate method done that way.

 

Of course, you're in charge of your taper, and there are many ways to skin that cat.  If the other chemicals are easily available to you, why not see how you go.  (Personally I would vigorously shake those too 🙂)

 

Also noting that any residue you see is the filler and packaging from the tablet, not the actual drug - that is too fine to see.

Edited February 10, 2022 by hayduke

[Spideygsm]

Try using warm water towards the hot side and shake vigorously. 
 

You’ll feel so much better after your long journey getting off this poison. 

[Intense]

Well, I have a 5mg olanzapine tablet. I'm thinking of just putting it in water, putting it in the fridge, shake it, and dose from that. But I don't know how much water I should use. I tried 20ML but it doesn't look like a lot of water and I don't think I can get enough medication with just 20ML water.

[hayduke]

12 minutes ago, Intense said:

Well, I have a 5mg olanzapine tablet. I'm thinking of just putting it in water, putting it in the fridge, shake it, and dose from that. But I don't know how much water I should use. I tried 20ML but it doesn't look like a lot of water and I don't think I can get enough medication with just 20ML water.

 

I did a fair bit of trial and error with that.  50ml water worked pretty well for me in that range with a 50 or 60 ml syringe. 

 

Makes the maths simple too, just move the decimal point

 

Cheers

[Intense]

So, I bought some 60ml syringes and some 50ml measuring cups on Amazon. They just came in today. I measured out 50ml water with the syringe and put it in the measuring cup. The measurements seem to be accurate. I put the olanzapine pill in the water and it started breaking up. Then I swished it with a plastic coffee stirrer and it seemed to be mixing well. I put aluminum foil over it and closed it off with a hair elastic band and put it in the fridge. I guess I leave it in there for 15-60 minutes? After that, I shake it vigorously and take the dose? So, when I put it in the water, it's not so much about seeing if the particles are evenly distributed because the stuff you see in the bottom could just be the filler and packaging from the tablet, but it's more about just making sure the actual olanzapine drug itself, which you can't see very well, is evenly distributed in the water?

[hayduke]

12 minutes ago, Intense said:

So, I bought some 60ml syringes and some 50ml measuring cups on Amazon. They just came in today. I measured out 50ml water with the syringe and put it in the measuring cup. The measurements seem to be accurate. I put the olanzapine pill in the water and it started breaking up. Then I swished it with a plastic coffee stirrer and it seemed to be mixing well. I put aluminum foil over it and closed it off with a hair elastic band and put it in the fridge. I guess I leave it in there for 15-60 minutes? After that, I shake it vigorously and take the dose? So, when I put it in the water, it's not so much about seeing if the particles are evenly distributed because the stuff you see in the bottom could just be the filler and packaging from the tablet, but it's more about just making sure the actual olanzapine drug itself, which you can't see very well, is evenly distributed in the water?

 

Sounds about right.  I used a small brown glass bottle with a lid, left over from the chemists.  This is helpful once you get more than one dose out of the suspension, which is something to look forward to.

 

I didn't worry about stirring it after I put the tablet in to disintegrate.  Some brands take longer, but yep I found 15-60 mins was a good time frame.  Then a big shake once you're ready.  I also liked agitating the liquid with the syringe before drawing it, just to keep it all nicely mixed.  Small flakes of filler and some cloudiness are usual.  

 

Discard the mix after 7 days tops.  I used to have a pretty beat up fridge which lowered that to 3-4 but the newer one did a week easily.  Beyond that though, something chemical and gross happens - a bad metallic taste develops, and you don't know what happened to your dosage.

[Intense]

After I put it in the fridge for 45 minutes, I took it, tried to shake it as best I could which I couldn't because the water was close to the top and the water could've easily came out if I shook it too hard and then agitated it with the syringe. It looked like all the olanzapine was evenly dispersed. Tried taking 4.5ml water, or 4.5mg. Tried going to sleep, but I was unable to fall asleep and I didn't get any sleep. I think I will wait till I get those small brown glass jars from Amazon and try it again.

[hayduke]

35 minutes ago, Intense said:

After I put it in the fridge for 45 minutes, I took it, tried to shake it as best I could which I couldn't because the water was close to the top and the water could've easily came out if I shook it too hard and then agitated it with the syringe. It looked like all the olanzapine was evenly dispersed. Tried taking 4.5ml water, or 4.5mg. Tried going to sleep, but I was unable to fall asleep and I didn't get any sleep. I think I will wait till I get those small brown glass jars from Amazon and try it again.

 

If that's your first cut, not surprising.

 

Best to start with the full 5mg of liquid and see how you adapt to that over a while.  Some people have trouble just crossing over to a liquid even with the same amount of the drug in it, so best to start there and see how you go.

 

Insomnia wouldn't be unusual after a cut anyway.  There are avenues for gentler tapers than 10%/mo - I based mine around the Brass Monkey Slide Taper, which uses a 2.5% cut per week for four weeks, then a two week hold as a template.  Obviously you always adjust the times and amounts as your body dictates  

[Miko789]

On 2/10/2022 at 9:32 AM, Intense said:

Ora-Plus

 

https://www.amazon.com/PADDOCK-LABORATORIES-Ora-Plus-Suspending-Vehicle/dp/B000GGHSQM/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=Ora-Plus&qid=1644960044&sr=8-2

 

you mean this?

[Intense]

So, I put the olanzapine in a brown glass jar and put it in the fridge. After shaking and agitating it with a syringe, I took 50ml of water, or 5mg, and I was able to go to sleep. I guess I might need to taper more slowly like you said.

[Rrsfc]

Hi, just sharing the method I am using right now. I make a fresh water suspension everyday. I draw 10ml water with a 10ml syringe and drop it in a glass, dissolve half a 5mg orodispersible tablet (cut it in half with my finger nails because I'm tapering from 2,5mg), stir it with the syringe and draw immediately the ammount I'm taking. I make 2,5% cuts each time, I measure by the scale in the syringe, each time I cut half a ml. I make a cut every 15 days to a month or even more depending on symptoms, life, etc. It may seem innacurate but I can get an even enough dose with this method, I don't have any symptoms of withdrawal at the moment. The advantage is it's quick, easy, no calculating involved. I made a kit (syringe, old vitamina package with a lid) that I have in my purse so I can do it when going out. Just sharing my thoughts on the subject, hope this helps someone understand this method better. I am not saying it is the best method, each one of us has a preference.

[Intense]

The 2.5% microtapering method might be too slow I think. I think I'll stick to 10% taper. It may be possible that the reason I wasn't able to sleep was because I either didn't get it all distributed due to not being shaken vigorously or I switched to liquid 4.5mg too fast. Or maybe the cut was too much. I think I'll stick to liquid 5mg for now and then next month do 4.5mg and see how that goes.

[Rrsfc]

5 hours ago, Intense said:

The 2.5% microtapering method might be too slow I think. I think I'll stick to 10% taper. It may be possible that the reason I wasn't able to sleep was because I either didn't get it all distributed due to not being shaken vigorously or I switched to liquid 4.5mg too fast. Or maybe the cut was too much. I think I'll stick to liquid 5mg for now and then next month do 4.5mg and see how that goes.

You must cut what you can handle safely, you must find your own tapering dosage. It may change over time though, and with different dosages it will be easier/harder and you have to adjust. For me at this point it's 2,5%. I tried 10% and 5% and it didn't work well for me. 

[Intense]

On 2/16/2022 at 2:59 AM, Rrsfc said:

Hi, just sharing the method I am using right now. I make a fresh water suspension everyday. I draw 10ml water with a 10ml syringe and drop it in a glass, dissolve half a 5mg orodispersible tablet (cut it in half with my finger nails because I'm tapering from 2,5mg), stir it with the syringe and draw immediately the ammount I'm taking. I make 2,5% cuts each time, I measure by the scale in the syringe, each time I cut half a ml. I make a cut every 15 days to a month or even more depending on symptoms, life, etc. It may seem innacurate but I can get an even enough dose with this method, I don't have any symptoms of withdrawal at the moment. The advantage is it's quick, easy, no calculating involved. I made a kit (syringe, old vitamina package with a lid) that I have in my purse so I can do it when going out. Just sharing my thoughts on the subject, hope this helps someone understand this method better. I am not saying it is the best method, each one of us has a preference.

Could I do the same thing but with regular olanzapine tablets? If so, how could I do it? Do I cut the tablet in half with a pill cutter and a half would be equal to 2.5mg? I don't have orodispersible tablets and that would require asking my doctor to change my prescription to orodispersible tablets and he's going to ask why do I want to change it? I think I'm going to do the 2.5% brassmonkey slide taper because it's gentler and would the take the least amount of time to fully taper off.

[hayduke]

On 2/22/2022 at 5:27 PM, Intense said:

Could I do the same thing but with regular olanzapine tablets? If so, how could I do it? Do I cut the tablet in half with a pill cutter and a half would be equal to 2.5mg?

 

Much easier and more accurate to keep the whole tablet suspension in the fridge.

 

Cutting pills is crude and inaccurate, you can easily see big wobbles in your dosages doing this and no one needs that.

 

I wouldn't be shy of finding a different doctor who supports your taper either, if your present one is hostile to the notion.

[Nicjk]

Hi everyone, I spent a year and 3 months tapering off Valium and I want to begin my Olanzapine in a couple of months (I am on 5mg). Has anyone come across any articles and information regarding the distribution of the medication in the pills? Is the medication evenly distributed throughout the pill? I already know that I can’t tolerate the liquid version of Olanzapine unfortunately- I tried switching to liquid and had a terrible time for almost 3 weeks so had to go back to the tablet. I will either cut and weigh or have my medication compounded into capsules. Thank you 

[ChessieCat]

1 hour ago, Nicjk said:

I will either cut and weigh

 

It might be better to crush and weigh.  Brassmonkey did his whole Paxil taper crushing and weighing tablets.  He would crush 10 tablets and have a stockpile.

 

Here are the search results for the terms "stock pile" and "stockpile" in posts by Brassmonkey:

 

stock pile&author=brassmonkey

 

stockpile&author=brassmonkey

 

1 hour ago, Nicjk said:

Has anyone come across any articles and information regarding the distribution of the medication in the pills? Is the medication evenly distributed throughout the pill?

 

See:

 

even-distribution-of-active-ingredient-in-tablet

 

[Nicjk]

1 hour ago, ChessieCat said:

 

It might be better to crush and weigh

I just worry that it will be very messy doing it that way - there might be excess powder left in the mortar and pestle that will be hard to scrape up. I guess I just need to look more into this method

 

In terms of the medication distribution- a while ago someone shared a really good article with me on here about this topic. I can’t seem to track it down sadly. They reassured me that the medication is evenly distributed 

[Nicjk]

2 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

 

It might be better to crush and weigh.  Brassmonkey did his whole Paxil taper crushing and weighing tablets.  He would crush 10 tablets and have a stockpile.

 

Here are the search results for the terms "stock pile" and "stockpile" in posts by Brassmonkey:

 

stock pile&author=brassmonkey

 

stockpile&author=brassmonkey

 

 

See:

 

even-distribution-of-active-ingredient-in-tablet

 

Thank goodness I found the post about medication distribution! It was from @brassmonkey: 

 

[geezee74]

On 5/26/2018 at 1:32 AM, arwilliams said:

Another reason Seroquel might be a good jump medication for last resort is that Seroquel has a 6 hour half life while Zyprexa's is more like 30.

 

This would give your brain time to reset during the day potentially.  Of course it takes longer then 6 hours for medication to clear your system.

Hi Ar, did you switch to seroquel?

[Spideygsm]

1 hour ago, geezee74 said:

Hi Ar, did you switch to seroquel?

Not a great idea to switch from 1 mind altering drug to another. Quit 1 at a time. 
 

FYI, I had as much difficulty stopping Klonipine as I did Zyprexa. The Benzodiazepine withdrawal was much more intense, the Zyprexa took longer.  

[concerned]

[Here] is an oral suspension guide made by Medisca, a large company specializing in compound pharmacy supplies. It states that under this preparation, the shelf-life is 14 days. I do not believe the flavored syrup is necessary, just the suspending vehicle and possibly the glycerin. Any deviation from their instructions may change the amount of olanzapine per unit volume, so please be careful with your calculations. 

 

In this particular compound, they use a vehicle called "Oral Suspend," which only pharmacies may order. This is very similar to "Ora-Plus," which has been suggested earlier on this topic. My comparison between these two vehicles was made from this [review].  

 

Also, I've found this line of [pipette syringes] for more precise administration. The increments are smaller than those regularly found on other over-the-counter syringes. They are expensive but should last with regular cleaning between uses. 

 

I have not begun tapering, so I cannot comment personally on the oral olanzapine suspension or the pipette syringes. I hope this helps!

 

[Svie]

Hi.

I have a question about the coating on Olanzapine STADA/Zyprexa. My tablets have a smooth white coating, not a yellow-ish inside. They are round and rather flat. Standard form i guess. My doctor insist that cutting these may cause a different effect in the body because of the coating and that the coating makes the absorption more even and steady throughout the day. Hence saying that cutting them makes the the effect much unstable.

Is this true? I can see that it´s true when it comes to very hard surfaced yellow-ish insides, and if you convert Olanzapine into liquid it absorbs differently

 

Thanks for reading

[hayduke]

6 hours ago, Svie said:

Hi.

I have a question about the coating on Olanzapine STADA/Zyprexa. My tablets have a smooth white coating, not a yellow-ish inside. They are round and rather flat. Standard form i guess. My doctor insist that cutting these may cause a different effect in the body because of the coating and that the coating makes the absorption more even and steady throughout the day. Hence saying that cutting them makes the the effect much unstable.

Is this true? I can see that it´s true when it comes to very hard surfaced yellow-ish insides, and if you convert Olanzapine into liquid it absorbs differently

 

Thanks for reading

 

Not typically a problem.  You could also try a different generic brand if you actually noticed problems.  I tended to keep a few on hand.