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gettingunstuck
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I am currently working on faulty thinking patterns using mindfulness-based therapy. Has anyone seen success with these methods. I always feel really good after meditating, but slip back when a negative event takes place. I can't seem to get unstuck with these thinking patterns (thus my screen name), however I don't meditate every day. Also, if anyone has any good studies to share on the effectiveness of MBT, I would love to see them.

Getting Unstuck

1999 – Zoloft for about a year. Stopped cold turkey.

2003 – Lexapro for about 5 years. Tapered off slowly for about 3 months, then stopped.

2008 – Prozac for about 4 years. Tapered off slowly for about a year and stopped completely December 2012.

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Hi gettingunstuck,

 

Yes I'm a big ban of mindfulness meditation. I used it frequently when I was stuck in a phase of my withdrawal where I was obsessively catastrophising about not getting enough sleep and ruining my health as a result.

 

It helped me enormously. But you have to practise it on a daily basis.

 

The key is to do 'rehearsals' every day for 10-20 minutes, where you practise the process (IE: Inviting the thoughts in, creating some space etc...) so that when the 'real thing' comes along you're more likely to respond with mindfulness. Like everything, mindfulness takes regular practise and commitment before it becomes a habit.

July 2001 prescribed 20mg citalopram for depression;
On and off meds from 2003-2006.
February 2006 back on 20mg citalopram and stayed on it until my last attempt at tapering in September 2011.
By far the worst withdrawal symptoms ever. Reinstated to 20mg citalopram
October 2012 - found this forum!
Nov 2012 to Feb 2013 did 10% taper, got doen to 11mg - was going great until stressful situation. Cortisol levels hit the roof, hideous insomnia forced me to updose to 20mg.
March 2016 - close to 100% back to normal!



****** I am not a medical practitioner, any advice I give comes from my own experience or reading and is only my perspective ******

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Thanks! That's good to hear. I try to do some type of mindfulness every day (even if it's some mindful yoga), but I probably need the regular, everyday meditation. My thoughts always get carried away into a "nothing will ever change" mode, and that's when I can physically myself sinking. It's startling how powerful thoughts can be and how they can affect an individual.

Getting Unstuck

1999 – Zoloft for about a year. Stopped cold turkey.

2003 – Lexapro for about 5 years. Tapered off slowly for about 3 months, then stopped.

2008 – Prozac for about 4 years. Tapered off slowly for about a year and stopped completely December 2012.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi gettingunstuck,

 

Be aware that the 'nothing will ever change' thinking is part of withdrawal and is actually a symptom. The ruminating thoughts soften with time. But you might want to add this as a 'symptom' to your daily diary (mentioned in your intro post), should you choose to keep one.

July 2001 prescribed 20mg citalopram for depression;
On and off meds from 2003-2006.
February 2006 back on 20mg citalopram and stayed on it until my last attempt at tapering in September 2011.
By far the worst withdrawal symptoms ever. Reinstated to 20mg citalopram
October 2012 - found this forum!
Nov 2012 to Feb 2013 did 10% taper, got doen to 11mg - was going great until stressful situation. Cortisol levels hit the roof, hideous insomnia forced me to updose to 20mg.
March 2016 - close to 100% back to normal!



****** I am not a medical practitioner, any advice I give comes from my own experience or reading and is only my perspective ******

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I never thought of the "nothing will ever" change thinking as a symptom. I always thought I did this type of ruminating before I ever started taking antidepressants, but now that you mention it, I think the rumination and the mind that just doesn't want to quiet did start after attempts of stopping the antidepressants. I've always been one of those people who analyzes things to death, but I've gotten more cynical in recent years. Interesting...

Getting Unstuck

1999 – Zoloft for about a year. Stopped cold turkey.

2003 – Lexapro for about 5 years. Tapered off slowly for about 3 months, then stopped.

2008 – Prozac for about 4 years. Tapered off slowly for about a year and stopped completely December 2012.

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  • 4 months later...

Does anyone have any good websites or books that can suggest for mindfulness for combatting depression?

Serzone (Nefadazone) and Wellbutrin (Buoproprin) for over ten years
Nefazadone Starting Point 150 mg
12/2 135 mg, 12/16 130 mg, 12/21 125 mg, 12/24 120 mg, 1/5 110 mg, 1/26 100 mg, 2/9 90 mg, 3/1 80 mg, 3/22 70 mg, 4/12 60 mg
5/3 50 mg, 5/15 55 mg, 8/15 70 mg, 10/15 90 mg, 11/1/12 100 mg, 10/1/13 90 mg, 10/15/13 85 mg, 10/20/13 90 mg, 3/29/15 16 mg

Buproprin Starting Point 300 mg

5/1/13 270, 5/15/13 240, 6/1/13 230, 6/15/13 200, 7/1/13 185, 7/20/13 170, 8/20/13 185, 3/29/15 170

Completely off Serzone: 10/1/17; Completely off Buprioprion 5/21/18

 

 

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Hi Greenwell,

 

One book I've recently begun reading is "Bouncing Back."  Here's the link: http://www.amazon.com/Bouncing-Back-Rewiring-Resilience-Well-Being/dp/1608681297

 

Another book I've read is "The Mindful Way Through Depression": http://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Way-Through-Depression-Unhappiness/dp/1593851286/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1378163859&sr=1-1&keywords=mindful+way+through+depression

 

Both books are very focused on mindfulness. I hope this helps!

Getting Unstuck

1999 – Zoloft for about a year. Stopped cold turkey.

2003 – Lexapro for about 5 years. Tapered off slowly for about 3 months, then stopped.

2008 – Prozac for about 4 years. Tapered off slowly for about a year and stopped completely December 2012.

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  • 5 months later...
The Mindfulness and Acceptance Workbook for Anxiety: A Guide to Breaking Free from Anxiety, Phobias, and Worry Using Acceptance and Commitment Therapy

by Georg Eifert and John P. Forsyth

 

I am recommending this workbook for those interested in trying the Mindfulness and Acceptance approach to anxiety therapy.  I have had a lot of success with this approach.  For me, it just seems to make a lot of sense.  

 

I will detail my thoughts on Mindfulness & Acceptance at a later time in this thread.

~August 2000 started taking Paxil, had a *very* bad reaction to it and went cold turkey after about 2 months

~December 2002 started taking 30mg Celexa

Buspar 30 mg added sometime after this

Dosage for celexa increased over the next couple of years to 90mg dialy, remained on this dosage for about 3 years or so

Switched to Cymbalta 60mg sometime in 2011, remained on the Buspar

~2012 Cymbalta dosage increased to 90mg daily, and 2.5 mg Abilify added

in 2013, Cymbalta dosage increased to 120mg daily

--current daily meds: Cymbalta 120mg, Buspar 30mg, Abilify 2.5mg

--UPDATE 4/9/2014 no longer taking Buspar

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that's a good book, I agree...I've been referring it to folks who are unfamiliar with meditation etc for years now...it's a wonderful intro.

Everything Matters: Beyond Meds 

https://beyondmeds.com/

withdrawn from a cocktail of 6 psychiatric drugs that included every class of psych drug.
 

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i always had issues grasping mindfulness meditation until a few friends recommended Headspace to me. (http://www.getsomeheadspace.com/)

its guided meditation and ever day is a new lesson which is bu upon from previous lessons - 365 different ones. he has such a great approach. its not spiritual or new-agey, which may help some people who are turned off by that. he is from the UK and used to be a buddhist monk so he's just teaching what he learned over the years in a very calm, educational, and informative way. you get the first 10 meditations for free to see if it works for you then you can choose to subscribe. there is also an iPhone app so you can listen to the meditations anywhere. he also has sleeping mediations, walking meditations, eating meditations, etc. i am so grateful i found it as it has helped me tremendously through withdrawal.

on 37.5 - 50mg zoloft/sertraline for GAD from 3/1996 to 4/2013 (17 years) 

too fast taper from 1/13-4/13

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  • 1 month later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Not sure if this has been provided before but this looks to be a good resource.

 

http://franticworld.com/free-meditations-from-mindfulness/

Please note - I am not a medical practitioner and I do not give medical advice. I offer an opinion based on my own experiences, reading and discussion with others.On Effexor for 2 months at the start of 2005. Had extreme insomnia as an adverse reaction. Changed to mirtazapine. Have been trying to get off since mid 2008 with numerous failures including CTs and slow (but not slow enough tapers)Have slow tapered at 10 per cent or less for years. I have liquid mirtazapine made at a compounding chemist.

Was on 1.6 ml as at 19 March 2014.

Dropped to 1.5 ml 7 June 2014. Dropped to 1.4 in about September.

Dropped to 1.3 on 20 December 2014. Dropped to 1.2 in mid Jan 2015.

Dropped to 1 ml in late Feb 2015. I think my old medication had run out of puff so I tried 1ml when I got the new stuff and it seems to be going ok. Sleep has been good over the last week (as of 13/3/15).

Dropped to 1/2 ml 14/11/15 Fatigue still there as are memory and cognition problems. Sleep is patchy but liveable compared to what it has been in the past.

 

DRUG FREE - as at 1st May 2017

 

>My intro post is here - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2250-dalsaan

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Had not seen that... thanks for the resource! I'm liking it already just from the descriptions. I think I need to do the "befriending meditation" today.

'94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.
6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.
11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.
9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.
10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?
11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever.

1/13 Best I've ever felt.

3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows.

4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time.

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Dalsaan, I've been doing these the past couple of days, and LOVING them! I sent them to a friend who has anxiety and depression and they are really helping her to. Thanks again for posting this! (And BUMP... you guys should try this, especially if you are like me and benefit from some guidance in your meditation.)

'94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.
6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.
11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.
9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.
10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?
11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever.

1/13 Best I've ever felt.

3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows.

4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time.

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  • 8 months later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

While meditation has proven benefits, mindfulness techniques can be used at any time, meditation is not required to use them.

2001–2002 paroxetine

2003  citalopram

2004-2008  paroxetine (various failed tapers) 
2008  paroxetine slow taper down to

2016  Aug off paroxetine
2016  citalopram May 20mg  Oct 15mg … slow taper down
2018  citalopram 13 Feb 4.6mg 15 Mar 4.4mg 29 Apr 4.2mg 6 Jul 4.1mg 17 Aug 4.0mg  18 Nov 3.8mg
2019  15 Mar 3.6mg  21 May 3.4mg  26 Dec 3.2mg 

2020  19 Feb 3.0mg 19 Jul 2.9mg 16 Sep 2.8mg 25 Oct 2.7mg 23 Oct 2.6mg 24 Dec 2.5mg

2021   29 Aug 2.4mg   15 Nov 2.3mg

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  • 4 months later...
  • Moderator

I have some difficulties with formal meditation, due to some cultic abuse in my past.

 

I did mindfulness BEFORE I landed into the cult meditation - but the cult (mantra) meditation is so "high" and effective, it has been more difficult to get back into mindfulness.

 

My first teacher was Thich Nhat Hanh - not in person, but through his texts - back before you could listen to him on the internet.

 

Anyhow, I consider yoga to be mindful meditation - most of my exercise is mindful.  My walks, I try and go slowly and feel the sun on my skin.  When I do physical workouts - like yoga or tai chi or karate, I pay attention to my body in space, and breath and how it moves with my body.

 

When hubby meditates, I "meditate" but it's not vipassana or mantra or even mindfulness - except it is.  I sit on a fitball and put my body in different positions.  Like lifting one leg and holding it for 7 breaths.  or doing a seated twist, and holding it.  IF I LOSE MY MINDFULNESS - I fall off the ball.  It's highly motivational!

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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The Mindfulness and Acceptance Workbook for Anxiety: A Guide to Breaking Free from Anxiety, Phobias, and Worry Using Acceptance and Commitment Therapy

by Georg Eifert and John P. Forsyth

 

I am recommending this workbook for those interested in trying the Mindfulness and Acceptance approach to anxiety therapy.  I have had a lot of success with this approach.  For me, it just seems to make a lot of sense.  

 

I will detail my thoughts on Mindfulness & Acceptance at a later time in this thread.

This is a great work book. It was recommended to me and I use it a lot.

A similar one that is really good is: Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life, by Steven Hayes.

40 yo Male. Started Paxil about 15 years ago. 10 mg (pill weight .125 - .129 g). 5 yrs wanted less side effects, doctor took me off Paxil over couple week period and put me on Wellbutrin. Not good. Went back on Paxil. Relieved my symptoms, but didn't work as well and more side effects. Severe reaction between Paxil and Zomig Summer of 2012. Head was affected during warmer days (cloudiness, confusion, pressure). Began 10% withdrawal 10/24/12.

Withdrawel helped many symptoms, but also added side effects: nausea, dizziness, tiredness. Hyper-anxiety started January 2014.

Went through a 2 year period of de-realization (2016-2018).  Rarely any windows.  
Current dose: 0.00 as of 4/10/21.  Made a lot of progress in my withdrawal symptoms the last 2 years of my taper.  I think doing a liquid taper helped stabilize things on the lower doses.  A lot of my symptoms have reduced significantly.  Hoping for even more improvement now that I am off.
My thread: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/8909-rusty1-paxil-withdrawal-help-and-advice-welcome/#entry150222

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  • 4 months later...

Mindfulness practice, like anything, can be good for some people or not so good for others...but I thought I'd pass this along, in case anyone is interested:

 

The Mindfulness Summit

Learn How To Live With More Peace, Purpose & Wisdom
A FREE ONLINE EVENT
 
Melli O’Brien of MrsMindfulness.com has gathered over 30 of the world’s leading experts on meditation and mindfulness for a series of online interviews, practice sessions and presentations taking place for FREE from October 1 – 31, 2015.
 
 

Remeron for depression. Started at 7.5 mg. in 2005. Gradual increases over 8 years, up to 45 mg. in 2012.Began tapering in June 2013. Went from 45 to 30 mg in the first 3-4 months. Held for a couple of months.Started tapering by 3.75 mg every month or 2, with some longer holding periods. Eventually went down to 3.75 mg. about April 2014. Stopped taking Remeron August 2014. Developed issues with histamine a week after stopping--symptoms reduced through diet and a few supplements. Currently having issues with a few foods. Most of the histamine intolerance has resolved or is at least, in remission.

Current Medications:

Current Supplements: Cannabis (CBD and THC), Vitamin C, D, Quercetin, CoQ10, Tart Cherry, Probiotic, Phytoplankton oil, magnesium, Methyl B. What has helped me most: spending time in nature, qi gong, exercise, healthy diet, meditation, IV vitamins, homeopathy, massage, acupuncture, chiropractic, music, and cuddling my cats..

My introduction: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/8459-mirtazapine-withdrawal-freespirit/#entry144282

Please note: I am not a therapist or medical practitioner. Any suggestions offered come solely from my personal experience in recovering from childhood trauma, therapy, and AD use. Please seek appropriate care for yourself.

 

“After a cruel childhood, one must reinvent oneself. Then re-imagine the world.”
Mary Oliver
 

 

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yeah mindfullness can help but it only helps me so much. You have to stick with it like anything else.

trintellix 1 mg and rexulti .5mg

 

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yeah mindfullness can help but it only helps me so much. You have to stick with it like anything else.

 

As I said, it can help some people, but not others. It depends. It is not a "cure" for WD, but it can be a piece of the puzzle. Being in wd would be, I think a very hard time to learn to meditate..but on the other hand, there's more motivation when a person is suffering. I'm grateful for the years of practice I had before, which does help me not get so attached to the feelings..and allows me to look deeper, when something is repeating itself. As I've posted elsewhere, I've found more benefit from Buddhist loving kindness and other heart practices in many respects..but without the foundation of mindfulness, I'm not sure that would be as true. And I know that strength of attending to things has made my qi gong practice something it wouldn't otherwise have been. It provided some ground from which other things could take root. That may or may not be true for other people, but it has been for me.

Remeron for depression. Started at 7.5 mg. in 2005. Gradual increases over 8 years, up to 45 mg. in 2012.Began tapering in June 2013. Went from 45 to 30 mg in the first 3-4 months. Held for a couple of months.Started tapering by 3.75 mg every month or 2, with some longer holding periods. Eventually went down to 3.75 mg. about April 2014. Stopped taking Remeron August 2014. Developed issues with histamine a week after stopping--symptoms reduced through diet and a few supplements. Currently having issues with a few foods. Most of the histamine intolerance has resolved or is at least, in remission.

Current Medications:

Current Supplements: Cannabis (CBD and THC), Vitamin C, D, Quercetin, CoQ10, Tart Cherry, Probiotic, Phytoplankton oil, magnesium, Methyl B. What has helped me most: spending time in nature, qi gong, exercise, healthy diet, meditation, IV vitamins, homeopathy, massage, acupuncture, chiropractic, music, and cuddling my cats..

My introduction: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/8459-mirtazapine-withdrawal-freespirit/#entry144282

Please note: I am not a therapist or medical practitioner. Any suggestions offered come solely from my personal experience in recovering from childhood trauma, therapy, and AD use. Please seek appropriate care for yourself.

 

“After a cruel childhood, one must reinvent oneself. Then re-imagine the world.”
Mary Oliver
 

 

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  • 4 months later...

It has been my experience, and I'm sure others as well, that it's hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel in the midst of severe withdrawl from SSRI's. You are living moment to moment, which can seem like hours in and of themselves. Something I learned while trying to taper off lexapro (went 11 days then reinstated), that I didn't even know was happening. My emotions were so extreme during that time and I was trying to go to work like everything's fine. I thought I was hiding it pretty well. Well in hindsight it turns out everyone around me knew something was drastically wrong. I didn't even notice that the littlest things would cause severe anger and that I would unintentionally snap at my coworkers. I opened up to one of my work associates about what's going on with me and it was amazing to me how obvious it was to everyone. I was so embarrassed that anyone saw that side of me show through! What I learned is that next time I try to taper, I must be mindful of my words and actions at all times. Hopefully I will spare myself and others emotional discomfort as I go through this incredibly difficult journey. I would like to hear other people's experience on how they handled going to work and keeping emotions in check while having withdrawls.

 

 

2000 - Paxil, cannot remember dosage

2001 - 2002 - Effexor

2004 - lexapro, 10 mg

2005 - lexapro, 20 mg

2007 - lexapro, 30 mg and lamictal, 200 mg

2011 - lexapro, 20 mg, lamictal 200mg and Wellbutrin 300 mg

2013 - lexapro 20 mg, slowly taper lamictal to 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed

2014 - present - taper lexapro from 20 mg to 2.5 mg, lamictal 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed, klonopin .5 mg 3 times per day

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And perhaps life as well.  

 

Yah, I blew it tonight.  I think sometimes we just have to eat crow and possibly lose friends in the process.  It is humbling.  I don't even want to apologize.  Other members report a lot of just sheer crabbiness and intolerance of others.  It IS, without a doubt an incredibly difficult journey.  Makes me feel selfish.  But what are my options?  I can no longer, at this time, go back on medications in good faith though.

 

I don't think anyone can be mindful of words and actions all the time..........maybe a monk?

 

I will be interested to see the replies.

 

I will try harder to get back to a better routine as I have been hit hard with stressful things I can't control and fairly depressed for a few months now.

 

Therapy, meditation(not just the sitting kind), regular exercise, healthy diet, yoga, qui gong, tai chi, prayer, faith, self forgiveness, etc. come to mind.

 

Are you tapering the Lexapro slowly.......it appears so.  Good luck.  I can commiserate.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. 

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. manymoretodays

 

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Silver star,

 

What a mess these drugs make of our minds! Total lack of self control when it comes to the emotional aspect of withdrawl. Humbling is a good word for it.

 

 

2000 - Paxil, cannot remember dosage

2001 - 2002 - Effexor

2004 - lexapro, 10 mg

2005 - lexapro, 20 mg

2007 - lexapro, 30 mg and lamictal, 200 mg

2011 - lexapro, 20 mg, lamictal 200mg and Wellbutrin 300 mg

2013 - lexapro 20 mg, slowly taper lamictal to 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed

2014 - present - taper lexapro from 20 mg to 2.5 mg, lamictal 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed, klonopin .5 mg 3 times per day

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Lol.  I am ManyMoreTodays........it's at the top.  In the blue line.  The silver star is for the number of posts I've done or something.  But thanks for the laugh.

 

It's not a total lack of self control.......just enough sometimes though.  It can be trying.......

 

Ahhhh, it's all the Lexapro I say!!!!  I really feel that that one is the major culprit for me now........some 16 months later.   It is real tough when you get to the less than 5mg. mark in my humble opinion.

 

Hang on.  Go very slow from here on down as instructed here.

Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988.  In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm.

Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time).

5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014)

12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs.  My last psycho med ever!  Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to

2016 Dec 16 medication free!!

Longer signature post here, with current supplements.

Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. 

None of my posts are intended as medical advice.  Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. manymoretodays

 

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Woops! Sorry, still new to this site. I'm on many meds but Lexapro is my demon right now. Currently on 2.5 mg and plan on hanging here for a while. So sorry you're sharing this awful experience, but I commend you for being brave enough to stick it out to get off of it.

 

 

2000 - Paxil, cannot remember dosage

2001 - 2002 - Effexor

2004 - lexapro, 10 mg

2005 - lexapro, 20 mg

2007 - lexapro, 30 mg and lamictal, 200 mg

2011 - lexapro, 20 mg, lamictal 200mg and Wellbutrin 300 mg

2013 - lexapro 20 mg, slowly taper lamictal to 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed

2014 - present - taper lexapro from 20 mg to 2.5 mg, lamictal 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed, klonopin .5 mg 3 times per day

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Ziggy

 

I totally understand your difficulties with work. I too am withdrawing from the dreaded Lexapro and totally relate to how hard it is to remain "normal" at work. I pretty much hate my job although I love my co workers. On co worker however causes me immense difficulty. I have considered moving jobs as this person has such a negative effect on me but I have no confidence to get out. Over time the combination of depression and bullying from this co worker at times has torn my confidence from me. I feel I have become a vulnerable victim and shadow of myself.

At times I find it hard to control my temper and anger bot at work and outside but in the work place I feel my anger simmering inside me. I wish I had the balls to confront the co worker but I am not a confrontational person and would feel guilty for doing so. When going through a bad wave I really don't know how I even manage to go to work and make it through the day. 

What you need to remember though is that it takes an incredibly strong individual to continue working, managing a family and just continuing with daily life whilst undergoing withdrawal. You are that strong person Ziggy and if you lose your cool a few times don't beat yourself up about it. You are doing your best and the  very fact that you are concerned about your behaviour to your co workers shows what kind of decent, caring individual you are. 

 

Be kind to yourself, speak up for yourself if and when appropriate and don't beat yourself up, we are our own worst critics.

 

Best wishes

 

PN

1995-1998 various SSRIs then withdrawal

2000 Sertraline

2003 Sertraline then changed to Prozac to attempt withdrawal.

2004 failed at withdrawal so Citalopram.

2010 attempted slow withdrawal over 12 months but failed- sever episode depression 2012

2012 3 days of Mirtazepine with bad reaction so started escitalopram 20mgs

2013 started very very slow taper with a number of slight reinstatements

Currently on between 0.5 and 1mg escitalopram drops at day.

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Another angry Lexapro damaged person here! I'm nearing 21 months off and while the mood swings and brain states are SO much better now, I still find myself so volatile in the second half if my cycle. One little thing can set off a cascade of anger, resentment, jealousy and downright irrirability. I practice mindfulness as much as possible but many times it feels like I'm a pot of boiling water and the spills just need to happen as part of the process. Of course, when the energy dissipates I apologize and can come back to a more peaceful presence, but when I'm in the dislocation often all I can do is let it out and feel the emotions in my body.

 

Hang in there!

9/2006 Began Lexapro

1/2014 Began taper from 15mg 

Cut dose by 2.5 mg every two weeks or until stabilized 

5/25/2014 Last dose 

 

Experienced: Anxiety/depression, intrusive thoughts, dizziness, de-personalization, mood swings, stomach pains, nausea, headaches, gastro upset, anger, many spells of brain fog, chills, water retention, hypoglycemia, heart palpitations, weight gain, light headedness, muscle constriction - jaw, chest, neck, cortisol surges waking me several times at night with heart racing, blurry eyesight / visual snow, neuropathic pain, burning/numbness in hands and feet, muscle twitching, light sensitivity, sinuses, temperature disregulation, ear zaps, FEAR, hopelessness, doom and gloom, muscle spasms and tension across whole body, low energy, apathy, depression, constant post nasal drip, ear pain, jaw pain and cracking, tooth pain, burning/tingling/numbing, right rib cage pain FOREVER, lymph congestion, hypersensitivity to many foods and many supplements, bladder/ urination issues, creaky bones, sallow, yellow skin on hands/feet, emotional dysregulation, back pain, vivid dreams, mucus, peeling lips.

 

What's left: Low energy some days, muscle pain, hormone imbalance, GI stuff here and there, eye floaters, peeling, red lips.

 

 

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Greentrain, you hit the nail on the head for me. I feel like a simmering pot of water slowly coming to a boil and then boom! I see red and totally lose it on the people around me. My patience and anger tolerance have severely diminished since tapering and it's hard to be at work while this is all going on inside me.

 

 

2000 - Paxil, cannot remember dosage

2001 - 2002 - Effexor

2004 - lexapro, 10 mg

2005 - lexapro, 20 mg

2007 - lexapro, 30 mg and lamictal, 200 mg

2011 - lexapro, 20 mg, lamictal 200mg and Wellbutrin 300 mg

2013 - lexapro 20 mg, slowly taper lamictal to 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed

2014 - present - taper lexapro from 20 mg to 2.5 mg, lamictal 50 mg, Wellbutrin 300 mg, Ativan .5 mg as needed, klonopin .5 mg 3 times per day

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  • 6 months later...
  • Moderator

Mindfulness needs to be a regular practice.

 

One session of mindfulness does not a zen master make.  And it takes very close to mastery to get through withdrawal!

 

One of the things that I don't see enough discussion of here, is rumination.  I learned this in "The Mindful Way Through Depression" listed above.

 

When we were primitive humans, rumination served a purpose.  When the sun went down, and there was nothing else to do, the tribal leaders - well - everyone - would spend some time thinking about - why didn't the rabbit snares work?  where is that bear, and are the children safe from it?  Was that a good plant to eat?  Or is that why 1/2 the tribe got tummy aches?  Where will we hunt tomorrow?  How can I take care of this baby that is due?  (and probably) Where do babies come from?

 

It's an effort to connect cause and effect in a way which teaches us.  It developed as a survival strategy, and differentiated humans from other animals - our ability to reason, even to ruminate.

 

But in modern society, survival is different, and rumination serves a different purpose.  The problems of modern living cannot be solved by moving a rabbit snare, or trapping a bear, or hunting a wolf pack that is competing for your food.

 

So instead, we ruminate on obsessive things:  Should I have said that?  What did she mean when she said that?  Am I right?  Am I wrong?  Why did I (do, say, behave, act) that way?  How will I get through tomorrow?  How will I get through the next hour?  I hate this!  Are they looking at me?  I am such a loser, they will never invite me into the group!  S/he doesn't really love me, does s/he really love me?  If I (did this, had that) s/he might love me!

 

None of these problems can be solved, and so the rumination continues, getting stuck in ruts which do not lead to solutions - because there are no solutions to these types of problems!

 

The longer it goes, the more it spirals in on itself, becoming more and more negative.  It can get down to the tiniest of details - details that might have saved your life in tribal times - why did I eat that?  why am I craving more?  when can I have more?  Will this feeling last forever?  Will I always feel like this?  - become motivators and drivers of your distress.

 

This distress is often fed into by media, advertising, and "reality" TV in a big way.  He drives that nice car, why can't I have a car like that?  Her (skin, hair, body) is so beautiful, I just look like a lump of lard.  I wish I could afford a real (insert designer here) (insert item of clothing or accessory) here.  It's obvious when you look at the "anti-aging" cosmetics, which make impossible claims.  We are constantly fed messages in media of "not good enough, unhappy, need more, if I consume more, when I get this, I will be happy." 

 

(I suspect that this is close to what Russ Harris is talking about in "The Happiness Trap" - still reading that one)

 

And - the more these messages repeat, they become statements, and the more they sound and feel like "truth."  I will always feel like this.  S/he hates me.  I am a (insert negative message here).  It will never get better.  This is what I deserve.  You have convinced yourself that you are hopeless and helpless.  This is a main contributor to depression.

 

So - how do we address this harmful rumination?

 

First, interrupt it. 

 

Oh.  I'm thinking again.  Look at that, I'm thinking.   (hubby calls it the "cement mixer")

 

Here's the weird and important part:  do not judge the content of your thoughts!  Most of them are old programming, or inserted by media, anyway!  Judgement makes an attachment to the thought ("I shouldn't think like this, this isn't helping") that keeps the thought in control of you.

 

Just watch them go by, like train cars along a track.  Be objective, don't look at the content of the train car, just let it go by.  You will notice, as soon as you detach from the thought - you don't need to look into every train car - it passes, and another comes along.  Clack-a-clack-a-clack-a-clack - I'm thinking, thinking thinking.

 

Your brain is designed to think, to receive and produce thoughts.  It's what it does.  You cannot stop those thoughts, anymore than stepping out in front of that train would stop it.

 

So let it go by.  Thinking, thinking, thinking.

 

Another image which helps is clouds.   The clouds come, the clouds go.  You cannot think them closer or further away, they will do what they do.  Let them come, let them go.  Sometimes (like in a wave) they are huge thunderheads, black, spitting lightning, rain, hail, and destruction.  They can even manifest as frightening events such as tornadoes - but - in the depth of a wave, if you can say:

 

"This is only thinking.  This is only feeling" and let the clouds alone - don't dive into that thunderhead.  Just accept that it is a phenomenon over which you have no control, and realize that it will pass.  There is no such thing as a permanent weather phenomenon.

 

There is no such thing as a permanent thought.

 

Now, after years and years of minding the trains, watching the clouds - there will come moments when the sky is clear, or the track is empty.  This is mastery.  The more moments you have where the sky is clear, or the track is empty - that's what becomes enlightenment, true clarity of presence and being.  That's what Tolle calls "living in the now."

 

But it takes practice - and here's the awesome thing about mindfulness:  you can practice and practice - and just practicing helps, even if you never achieve a moment of mastery!  The rumination no longer has power over you.  By accepting and allowing your thoughts, you sit again, in the driver's seat of your being.

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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  • 4 months later...

I just wanna throw in a book suggestion that helps me deal with and combat negative thoughts, & anxiety that has been a great read and very positive influence as I'm going through my withdrawal. Joel Osteen's "Think Better, Live Better". Hope it helps someone else as much as it has me

Was put on Zoloft 15mg 1/17/2016 after I had my first panic attack I believe due to excessive drinking mostly .

 

Quit Zoloft 4/16 due to side effects and was put on lexapro 10mg

 

Quit lexapro 10 mg due to side effects 8/16

 

I don't want to reinstate any drug

 

Started citalopram 10mg 1/10/17

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  • 2 months later...
  • 1 month later...

Another fantastic book, and it's FREE, is Mindfulness in Plain English.  Beautifully written, very practical, no superstition or hocus pocus.  It actually works.  

 

You can download a free PDF of the book from various sites.  Just search the title.

A closed mouth gathers no feet

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Mindfulness needs to be a regular practice.

 

One session of mindfulness does not a zen master make.  And it takes very close to mastery to get through withdrawal!

 

One of the things that I don't see enough discussion of here, is rumination.  I learned this in "The Mindful Way Through Depression" listed above.

 

When we were primitive humans, rumination served a purpose.  When the sun went down, and there was nothing else to do, the tribal leaders - well - everyone - would spend some time thinking about - why didn't the rabbit snares work?  where is that bear, and are the children safe from it?  Was that a good plant to eat?  Or is that why 1/2 the tribe got tummy aches?  Where will we hunt tomorrow?  How can I take care of this baby that is due?  (and probably) Where do babies come from?

 

It's an effort to connect cause and effect in a way which teaches us.  It developed as a survival strategy, and differentiated humans from other animals - our ability to reason, even to ruminate.

 

But in modern society, survival is different, and rumination serves a different purpose.  The problems of modern living cannot be solved by moving a rabbit snare, or trapping a bear, or hunting a wolf pack that is competing for your food.

 

So instead, we ruminate on obsessive things:  Should I have said that?  What did she mean when she said that?  Am I right?  Am I wrong?  Why did I (do, say, behave, act) that way?  How will I get through tomorrow?  How will I get through the next hour?  I hate this!  Are they looking at me?  I am such a loser, they will never invite me into the group!  S/he doesn't really love me, does s/he really love me?  If I (did this, had that) s/he might love me!

 

None of these problems can be solved, and so the rumination continues, getting stuck in ruts which do not lead to solutions - because there are no solutions to these types of problems!

 

The longer it goes, the more it spirals in on itself, becoming more and more negative.  It can get down to the tiniest of details - details that might have saved your life in tribal times - why did I eat that?  why am I craving more?  when can I have more?  Will this feeling last forever?  Will I always feel like this?  - become motivators and drivers of your distress.

 

This distress is often fed into by media, advertising, and "reality" TV in a big way.  He drives that nice car, why can't I have a car like that?  Her (skin, hair, body) is so beautiful, I just look like a lump of lard.  I wish I could afford a real (insert designer here) (insert item of clothing or accessory) here.  It's obvious when you look at the "anti-aging" cosmetics, which make impossible claims.  We are constantly fed messages in media of "not good enough, unhappy, need more, if I consume more, when I get this, I will be happy." 

 

(I suspect that this is close to what Russ Harris is talking about in "The Happiness Trap" - still reading that one)

 

And - the more these messages repeat, they become statements, and the more they sound and feel like "truth."  I will always feel like this.  S/he hates me.  I am a (insert negative message here).  It will never get better.  This is what I deserve.  You have convinced yourself that you are hopeless and helpless.  This is a main contributor to depression.

 

So - how do we address this harmful rumination?

 

First, interrupt it. 

 

Oh.  I'm thinking again.  Look at that, I'm thinking.   (hubby calls it the "cement mixer")

 

Here's the weird and important part:  do not judge the content of your thoughts!  Most of them are old programming, or inserted by media, anyway!  Judgement makes an attachment to the thought ("I shouldn't think like this, this isn't helping") that keeps the thought in control of you.

 

Just watch them go by, like train cars along a track.  Be objective, don't look at the content of the train car, just let it go by.  You will notice, as soon as you detach from the thought - you don't need to look into every train car - it passes, and another comes along.  Clack-a-clack-a-clack-a-clack - I'm thinking, thinking thinking.

 

Your brain is designed to think, to receive and produce thoughts.  It's what it does.  You cannot stop those thoughts, anymore than stepping out in front of that train would stop it.

 

So let it go by.  Thinking, thinking, thinking.

 

Another image which helps is clouds.   The clouds come, the clouds go.  You cannot think them closer or further away, they will do what they do.  Let them come, let them go.  Sometimes (like in a wave) they are huge thunderheads, black, spitting lightning, rain, hail, and destruction.  They can even manifest as frightening events such as tornadoes - but - in the depth of a wave, if you can say:

 

"This is only thinking.  This is only feeling" and let the clouds alone - don't dive into that thunderhead.  Just accept that it is a phenomenon over which you have no control, and realize that it will pass.  There is no such thing as a permanent weather phenomenon.

 

There is no such thing as a permanent thought.

 

Now, after years and years of minding the trains, watching the clouds - there will come moments when the sky is clear, or the track is empty.  This is mastery.  The more moments you have where the sky is clear, or the track is empty - that's what becomes enlightenment, true clarity of presence and being.  That's what Tolle calls "living in the now."

 

But it takes practice - and here's the awesome thing about mindfulness:  you can practice and practice - and just practicing helps, even if you never achieve a moment of mastery!  The rumination no longer has power over you.  By accepting and allowing your thoughts, you sit again, in the driver's seat of your being.

Hi jancarol this a brilliant post about mindfulness and ruminating ,I've watched my father's life consumed by ruminating and I live my life with mindfulness and learning about ruminating for a while now ,it's the key to ever living a functional life

Alcohol free since February 2015 

1MG diazepam

4.5MG PROZAC.

 

 

 

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  • 1 year later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

I have not done mindfulness therapy or meditation, but have found some mindfulness techniques helpful.   Here is my take on mindfulness.  With mindfulness, you are the observer in your mind and you just watch what is going on - kind of like you're a scientist studying some phenomenon.  The idea is that the observer is objective and does not get involved in the drama or pass any judgment on it.  Your goal is not to try to stop the thoughts from happening, but just let them happen without giving them any importance.  Watch the thoughts as if they are clouds floating by, or cars driving past.  Accept that the thoughts are there, but don’t attach any importance to them.

 

I’ve found it can also help to give your internal negative voice a name (e.g. “doomcloud", “chatterbox", "monkey mind" or whatever name you want) so that you can separate this voice from your real self.  When you are able to perceive that this voice is not “you”, it becomes easier to step back from it, get some distance from it, and observe it more objectively.  Many years ago I named the negative voice in my mind the "Doomcloud”.  When the negative thoughts came, I could just observe it happening and say to myself  "oh, there's the Doomcloud again, doing its thing".  This helped immensely to step back from all the negative thoughts and emotions, to be less involved in them, and by getting some distance from them, they felt less intense and not nearly as upsetting or frightening. 

2001–2002 paroxetine

2003  citalopram

2004-2008  paroxetine (various failed tapers) 
2008  paroxetine slow taper down to

2016  Aug off paroxetine
2016  citalopram May 20mg  Oct 15mg … slow taper down
2018  citalopram 13 Feb 4.6mg 15 Mar 4.4mg 29 Apr 4.2mg 6 Jul 4.1mg 17 Aug 4.0mg  18 Nov 3.8mg
2019  15 Mar 3.6mg  21 May 3.4mg  26 Dec 3.2mg 

2020  19 Feb 3.0mg 19 Jul 2.9mg 16 Sep 2.8mg 25 Oct 2.7mg 23 Oct 2.6mg 24 Dec 2.5mg

2021   29 Aug 2.4mg   15 Nov 2.3mg

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On 4/28/2017 at 4:03 AM, brassmonkey said:

 

AAF: Acknowledge, Accept, Float.  It's what you have to do when nothing else works, and can be a very powerful tool in coping with anxiety.  The neuroemotional anxiety many of us feel during WD is directly caused by the drugs and their chemical reactions in the brain.  Making it so there is nothing we can do about them.  They won't respond to other drugs, relaxation techniques and the like.  They do, however, react very well to being ignored.  That's the concept behind AAF.  Acknowledge, get to know the feeling involved, explore them.  Accept, These feelings are a part of you and they aren't going anywhere fast. Float, let the feeling float off as you get on with your life as best as you can.  It's a well documented fact that the more you feed in to anxiety the worse it gets.  What starts as generalized neuroemotinal anxiety can be easily blown into a full fledged panic attack just by thinking about it.

 

I often liken it to an unwanted house guest.  At first you talk to them, have conversations, communicate with them.  After a while you figure out that they aren't leaving and there is nothing you can do to get rid of them.  So you go on about your day, working around them until they get bored and leave.

 

It can take some practice, but AAF really does work.  I hope you give it a try.

 

 

 MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:    13 November 2021 -  0mg Pristiq      

Woohoo!!!  Finally off Pristiq   

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

My full tapering program     My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)    My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.  I do not provide tapering advice via PM.  Please post questions in your Introduction topic.  Please do not tag me for any reason.  I am an unpaid volunteer and assist members if I am able to and when I have the time.  Thank you for your understanding.

Mid Nov 2021 changed to low carb diet due to diabetes & cholesterol.  Lost 1/16 body weight, BP has reduced a lot. 

Links to my exercises and weights.  I also do 3 x 5.5 min with HIIT on exercise bike with 20 secs/min as fast as I can cycle.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

 MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:    13 November 2021 -  0mg Pristiq      

Woohoo!!!  Finally off Pristiq   

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

My full tapering program     My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)    My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.  I do not provide tapering advice via PM.  Please post questions in your Introduction topic.  Please do not tag me for any reason.  I am an unpaid volunteer and assist members if I am able to and when I have the time.  Thank you for your understanding.

Mid Nov 2021 changed to low carb diet due to diabetes & cholesterol.  Lost 1/16 body weight, BP has reduced a lot. 

Links to my exercises and weights.  I also do 3 x 5.5 min with HIIT on exercise bike with 20 secs/min as fast as I can cycle.

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  • 7 months later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Found some more good stuff on the same site:

 

https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/now.htm

 MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:    13 November 2021 -  0mg Pristiq      

Woohoo!!!  Finally off Pristiq   

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

My full tapering program     My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)    My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.  I do not provide tapering advice via PM.  Please post questions in your Introduction topic.  Please do not tag me for any reason.  I am an unpaid volunteer and assist members if I am able to and when I have the time.  Thank you for your understanding.

Mid Nov 2021 changed to low carb diet due to diabetes & cholesterol.  Lost 1/16 body weight, BP has reduced a lot. 

Links to my exercises and weights.  I also do 3 x 5.5 min with HIIT on exercise bike with 20 secs/min as fast as I can cycle.

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