marie123: tapering trazodone

[marie123]

Hi Hibari. Yes, my stomach is popped up too. I expect to lose it some time after I'm finished with my taper. I should try some situps. I've decided to just keep going down with the weight until I'm slender and very fit. I was like this as a young woman. It helps that my spouse is heavy into sports, exercise and eating well. We play pickleball together and with other couples so it makes it fun. I used to play a lot of racketball many moons ago so I guess muscle memory is there. My backhand is pretty good lol.

 

I see you are getting lower in your taper in the 1's. Are you still able to measure the little dose?  I'm still able to get my dose measured at 2.1. I have to cut up lots of doses for my trip of 15 days. I will cut double (30) doses for my carryon. I like to cut up more  doses and throw them in the two suitcases just in case. Be well. Marie.

[Hibari]

Hi @marie123

 

I've done some research and it seems that the puffed up stomach is all due to Mirt. I also researched regular antihistamines and weight gain and that is a connection. Over the counter antihistamines seem to cause it and since Mirt is a powerful antihistamine at the lower doses, it makes sense that some of us are holding onto med weight. 

 

I too was slim and fit and plan to be  again once I'm off. Glad to hear your backhand is solid. I know from the little tennis I've played that having a good backhand can make a break the game. 

 

Yes, I'm still able to get cut my doses from my pill. I have a really good pill cutter and then I just shave them down. I too make a week of doses in advance. Since I'm now able to get two doses out of one pill, I have a stash of my brand, which makes me feel secure.

 

Sounds like you have a nice trip coming up and I'm wishing you wonderful time. 

 

Hibari 

[marie123]

Thanks Hibari. Having a stash is important. I think you can use them at least up to a year after the expiration date. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello everyone. I just got back from the trip. It was exhausting but amazing. I was busy every day and walked miles a day touring. I was able to drink some wine every day. I do not notice a wave so far. I will go down .1 mg Mirt after I have adjusted. This will bring me down to 2.00 mg Mirt. At this point I like going slow because I am able now to live my life as I please. Side effects are light. I am sure I gained a few pounds with too much pasta, pizza and desserts. I think they will come off quickly since I am now back to eating my normal healthy way. I have another goal of a 30 lb weight loss. I am shooting for being healthy as I can. Doctor doesn't believe it's the Mirt that is raising my cholesterol. I know it's partially responsible at least. I want to see if I am right. Be well. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello. Tonight I'm going down to 2 mg Mirt. I'm going to try and make some progress this fall and winter to get a decent amount lower. I got into better shape with all of the walking I did. I did not gain any weight during the trip even though I was eating like crazy. I feel more toned now too. I feel like a science experiment sometimes with the tapering. I do find it interesting to see the ebb and flow of symptoms, the brain waking up and getting a bit more clearer after each cut as settled, etc. I do a lot of self-talk and mind games to keep my mind on the prize. I've always tried to be positive and determined so that helps. I'll just keep going. Marie.

[Hibari]

Congratulations on getting to 2mgs @marie123. 

 

I relate to feeling like a science experiment or in my case a Mirt detective. 

 

You being able to enjoy your trip is the payoff for your mindful taper. 

I too have made sure I remain functional during my taper and am listening to my body.  

 

Self-talk is a great tool along with support from other people on the journey. 

 

Next thing you know, you'll be in the 1's! 

 

Hibari 

[marie123]

Yes the 1's soon Hibari. How is it going weighing the small doses? Marie.

[Hibari]

I'm still able to do it @marie123. I have a really good pill cutter and that helps. 

 

I did see how little a piece would register on the scale and the lowest amount that would register was 0.4.

 

I think if I go lower than that, I will use 7.5 pill, that usually weighs about 77grms and see if I can add a tiny piece to it so that it weighs 79grms, which means the little piece is 0.2.

 

I don't do well with liquid so I'm planning on dry cutting the whole way. 

 

Hibari 

 

[marie123]

Hello Hibari.

 

I think your method will work. I would like to be able to dry cut all the way so I'll be watching your progress. Thanks for the tip.

 

Marie.

[Bestill]

I really think dry cutting will work.  I have also read about other people who help others get off these drugs who prefer this method over liquid.  Every one has an opinion.  There really isn’t just one way is my point.  I use 15 mg pills and will be dry cutting all the way so imagine the size of my pill.  Super tiny but I’m doing it.  I feel like there needs to be more success stories that shows this option as well.  
 

That’s just me.  ❤️  Keep going Marie.  You are doing fabulous with so many who are cheering you on!

[Hibari]

11 hours ago, Bestill said:

I feel like there needs to be more success stories that shows this option as well.  

I agree @Bestill and I believe we will be the ones to write those stories. 

[marie123]

Hello. Are you ladies (Hibari and Bestill) drying cutting from a 15 mg pill or 7.5 mg pill? I'm curious since I am cutting from a 7.5 mg pill. I believe it's small in size than a 15 mg pill. Marie.

[Bestill]

I am cutting from a 15 mg pill and I known @Hibariis cutting from a 7.5 mg pill.  I have played around with my pill with the lower doses and it seems to work and I’m just gonna do it.  ❤️

[marie123]

Hi Bestill. I believe your pill is twice the size of the 7.5 mg pill. You will have an easier time than me. I guess I will follow how Hibari does. When I try to add a piece of .1 or .2 to get my dry-cut dose it's pretty tiny.

 

I am feeling my cut about two weeks after I cut. It's some nausea and back pain. It probably won't last too long. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello. I'm still wavy from the little cut on the 14th. Since I had back pain with spasm I took Ibuprofen a couple times. The back spasm went away with putting a pillow between my knees. The Ibuprofen helped with the stiffness but weirded me out. It's making me feel spacey and dizzy even two days later. Sometimes I can tolerate taking Ibuprofen like when I am stable. The cut I made did feel stronger than others. I would think that since I had a very long hold it would me easier.  Be well. Marie.

[Hibari]

Hi @marie123

 

I'm sorry you had back spasms. 

I can relate. I have a frozen shoulder right now and it has made me pretty uncomfortable at night. 

 

I get what you mean about ibuprofen. I've had to take some for pain and stiffness in the shoulder. It's hit or miss on when it works. I'm 4 days into a cut and maybe that's why it's not so effective. Maybe it fights the Mirt on some level? 

 

I started taking turmeric with black pepper but then forgot to keep going. It is supposed to be good for inflammation. I'm going to go back to it. 

 

Cuts can be funny and be more intense than others for no rhyme or reason. I hope your cut has stabilized.  

 

I also saw your post above. Bestill is right, I am tapering from a 7.5 pill and it is getting small. But, I'm going to make it work with my scale. 

 

Hibari 

[marie123]

I'm feeling a lot better today and almost stable. The Ibuprofen did work for me for the pain but my system couldn't tolerate it this time. I need to be stable to take it.  It could have been from the time difference of 6 hours when I was taking my doses in Europe. I came back and went back to my regular dose times. I waited a week and then re-started the taper. Maybe I should have waited longer. I did drink some good wine when I was away. Delayed wave? Who knows.

 

I had a frozen shoulder when I was tapering Ambien. I am not sure if it was related to the taper or not. I did PT for a while and just waited it out. It did go away some time later.

 

I remember you said that you have two scales. Do you weigh your dose on both scales for accuracy? I purchased a second scale but only to use if the other one breaks. Marie.

[Hibari]

@marie123

 

I had a frozen shoulder as well when I got lower on my benzo taper. I definitely think it was med related. I did PT and Feldenkris work and it cleared up in aboit 6 months. I'm doing PT now along with the Alexander Technique. I think this one will leave too but waiting can be a little frustrating!

 

I do have two scales but I have shifted over to using just one now. I think the two scale technique was a way for me to feel in control during my benzo wd because I was so afraid. It then carried over to my Mirt taper because I was also in a setback. 

 

Now that my symptoms are so minimal, I feel I can let go of the second scale. Feels a bit symbolic of how optimistic I feel about getting off of Mirt again without issue. 

 

Glad you are feeling stable and better. 

 

Hibari

[Estman]

On 10/27/2023 at 7:44 PM, marie123 said:

Hello. I'm still wavy from the little cut on the 14th. Since I had back pain with spasm I took Ibuprofen a couple times. The back spasm went away with putting a pillow between my knees. The Ibuprofen helped with the stiffness but weirded me out. It's making me feel spacey and dizzy even two days later. Sometimes I can tolerate taking Ibuprofen like when I am stable. The cut I made did feel stronger than others. I would think that since I had a very long hold it would me easier.  Be well. Marie.

Hi Marie,

I have a similar situation.
Around the beginning of September, I felt some weight and it caused a back muscle spasm
I applied different creams for 1.5 months with varying success
In the meantime, it's better, then it hurts for several days..
Unfortunately, I can't tolerate anything other than Paracetamol for painkillers. Ibuprofen starts to upset my stomach (gastritis)
Whenever my back pain gets worse, my digestion gets worse too
It is very slow, it occurs like Gastroparesis and often a lot of nausea.(night)
I have also cut my Clomipramine in the meantime
The last time I did it was 6 days ago
Unfortunately, the back pain is still worse and there is nausea.
Yesterday morning, I took half a tablet of Etoricoxib 30mg of (new drug)
I don't know if it's good for pain, but my mood is really bad
I slept badly with this v, confused and disturbing dreams
There is severe depression in the morning
There are strong neuroemotions and OCD
I had a  conflict with my wife and I can't calm down anymore, the thoughts are catastrophic, I'm afraid of losing control and ending up in the hospital
Apparently it's a wave
Can this Etoricoxib cause depression or anxiety?
If you take ibuprofen, do you feel a decrease in mood, does restlessness increase?

Could the back pain be related to tapering off the antidepressant?

[marie123]

Absolutely yes Estman, back pain is very common when tapering an AD. For instance, on my trip (with a 3 month hold) I had zero back pain and I walked miles a day. My back pain is from my AD cut. Your new drug that you took seems to have made it worse I believe. This is why I try not to take anything else when I am tapering. I hope you feel better soon. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello everyone. The last few weeks have not been so good. The cut was okay with the usual nonsense of some nausea and muscle tension/aches in my back. I rolled over in bed during the night and pulled a muscle in the back of my hip/lower back. I blame Mirt since my muscles were so tight. Pain was moderate but I knocked it down with ibuprofen and heat/ice. Now it's just achy in the morning until I get moving. It's enough that I have an appointment with my orthopedist.  I want to go to physical therapy for a better fix of the area and I like it because of the massages and exercising. I'll just have to fit in my cuts with PT and the holidays because I am not holding for anything. I also need to get my flu shot and covid shot. Both give me side effects for a few days or more. It all sucks but I'll keep going. On the positive side my next cut will get me to 1.9 mg Mirt. Marie.

 

[Utek]

Hi Marie,

 

It sounds like you are on the right track getting it checked and having some PT.  The magnesium oil has done wonders for my lower back pain.  I wish that I would have known about it years ago.  Once I strained a muscle in my back at work, and found that letting the water beat down on the troubled area in a hot shower gave me a good deal of relief.  It's so awesome you are going to be at 1.9mg.

[Hibari]

I relate so much to those tight muscles @marie123. 

 

I blame Mirt as well and right now I'm dealing with a frozen shoulder. 

I'm going to PT and I don't know if it's effective but I want to keep the area active. 

 

I'm using heat, magnesium creme, arnica and comfrey. I also take an occasional ibuprofen and should probably take more but fear any impact on my taper. 

 

I hear you about keeping the taper going in between the PT and treatments. I told @Bestill the same thing. I'm not stopping my taper because I know the meds are drying me out. The only way to feel better and heal is to get off. 

 

Step by step! 

 

Hibari 

[marie123]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:38 AM, Utek said:

Hi Marie,

 

It sounds like you are on the right track getting it checked and having some PT.  The magnesium oil has done wonders for my lower back pain.  I wish that I would have known about it years ago.  Once I strained a muscle in my back at work, and found that letting the water beat down on the troubled area in a hot shower gave me a good deal of relief.  It's so awesome you are going to be at 1.9mg.

Hi Utek,

 

I went to the orthopedist and confirmed I have a muscle strain. I have achey Mirt joints along with it too. I am going to PT next week. I love the massage on the sore muscles so I am okay with going. I'm making my next cut in a few days so I'll be down to 1.9 Mirt. Time to celebrate! I hope your taper is going smoothly. Be well. Marie.

[marie123]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:23 PM, Hibari said:

I relate so much to those tight muscles @marie123. 

 

I blame Mirt as well and right now I'm dealing with a frozen shoulder. 

I'm going to PT and I don't know if it's effective but I want to keep the area active. 

 

I'm using heat, magnesium creme, arnica and comfrey. I also take an occasional ibuprofen and should probably take more but fear any impact on my taper. 

 

I hear you about keeping the taper going in between the PT and treatments. I told @Bestill the same thing. I'm not stopping my taper because I know the meds are drying me out. The only way to feel better and heal is to get off. 

 

Step by step! 

 

Hibari 

Hi Hibari. I hear you on the drying out. I was looking at my arms waiting for the doctor and they looked so dried and crinkly. I used Nivea when I went home and slathered it on. My skin drank it up. I have to remember to use it daily. My hair is very dry too so I use a deep conditioning hair masque a few times a week. I'm using arnica and I'm going to look into comfrey. You are definitely right the only way to feel better and heal is to get off.

[Bestill]

Im in the same boat with the dry skin and hair is awful.  It won’t even hold a curl right now.  I am also feeling the aches and pains more and just feeling stiff.  I will take this over the anxiety any day and I’m thankful that’s been much lower as of late.

 

congrats on getting to 1.9.  I cut tonight as well.  2.7. Def feels good to be going down that hill to seeing that final destination (our end point).  

[marie123]

Hello Bestill. I tried the arnica cream and I was surprised it really helped the muscle aches. It's homeopathic.

 

I feel like the 1's give me the feeling of a countdown. It may be tough getting there but I am so stoked now. I know I will reach it now.

 

I am going to have a major celebration when this happens (even if I feel sucky lol). You are on your way to the 1's. This is so great. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello. I am down to 1.9 mg Mirt. I am so psyched now as I can see the end. I went to PT today and the therapist really stretched my sore muscle out. It felt great. He mentioned when he was stretching me that my muscles are stiff. I told him about Mirt and how a side effect of it is stiff muscles. He spoke about dehydration is bad for muscles too. I replied that Mirt causes me to feel dehydrated.

 

I am in a good mood today and feel good. Keep going folks, it gets better. Marie.

[Gigi68]

Well done Marie! I’m excited for you!!

[Hibari]

@marie123

 

Your PT noticing your stiff muscles is another validation of Mirts dehydrating effect on our bodies.

 

It will so interesting to see how we all feel once we are off. I can't wait to have loose muscles again. 

 

Congratulations to you, @Bestill and @Gigi68 for moving down even more on Mirt.

 

I too have dropped below 1mg. I feel solid and stable. 

Hibari 

[marie123]

This is so good to hear Hibari. Solid and stable sounds awesome.

 

I was thinking about how you would have weighed your dose of .8 mg. Did you put your pill (7.5 mg) on the scale and add .2 mg? I know the weight is the same for the pill and dose with Mirt.

 

Did you take the .2 mg divided into two piles of .1 mg and measured out your dose of .8 from a pile?

 

Marie.

[Hibari]

Hi @marie123,

 

I take my 7.5 pill and weigh it. My pills on average weight 77 grams 

 

Once I have a consistent pill weight,

I then split the pill in two. I then shave each half down till I get the pill weight I want. 

 

So for example, 

Since my pill weighs 77 grams, I need to have a pill weight of 10 grams for it to be equal to 0.8mgs of Mirt. 

 

The next time I cut, I will shave the two halves down to 8 grams, which will equal 0.6mg of Mirt. 

 

I'm shaving the .2 off of each pill half as opposed to grinding it into powder or using a small .2 piece and adding it to my 7.5mg pill.

 

It's only when I get lower, probably below 0.4mgs, that I will add the tiny .2mg or .1mg piece to the 7.5mg pill.  

 

I always cut .2 each time I cut, which is what mg brain and body have gotten used to. 

 

The good news is that I now get two doses out of one pill so I always have enough of my brand. 

 

Hope that makes sense. 

 

Hibari 

[marie123]

Hi Hibari. I understand what you are doing. I am doing something similar. I am not crushing the pill.

 

I cut the piece off that I estimate is my dose. I kind of know the size by doing the same dose a lot. I then shave it to the proper dose or add a bit more if necessary.

 

When I get to the tiny doses I will weigh/measure out a dose of 1 mg Mirt.

 

I will crush the 1 mg dose into a powder and divide it into smaller doses. Its going to be a tiny amount of powder though. From what I've read I should taper the last mg. One way or another we'll finish and feel better and better.

 

Marie.

[Hibari]

Yours is a good plan @marie123.

 

Makes me think I could actually get 4 doses about of one pill. That might save me some shaving time. 

 

We definitely will finish and feel better. 

 

Hibari

[marie123]

Hello everyone. This cut so far has been relatively easy. I am waking up with all day windows. I am tempted to cut again early but I'll see after Thanksgiving day. Mirt is sneaky after all. Maybe I'll cut at three weeks, and the last cut for the year in December. That will bring me down to 1.7 mg Mirt for 2023. It's possible I will make good progress and be finished in 2024. I hope so. Be well. Marie.

[marie123]

Hello. I hosted Thanksgiving and got through it easily. I have been feeling windowey (lol is that a word?) for days now. I took my covid booster shot recently. It was the new one Novavax. I read about it not having bad side effects like the others. the Pfizer shot made me feel like I had the flu with chills and aches for days. I also was able to get my flu shot and I think I'm feeling like a normal person would feel with a slight cold feeling. Improvements are happening.

 

I'm getting blood work done in a couple weeks and nervous about the cholesterol numbers. Doc is going to recommend statins since the niacin trial was awful. I'll just ask to try something else. I strongly believe the Mirt has raised the numbers up. I am taking a lot of fiber pills and Cholestoff (plant stenols). Now that my Mirt injury of my hip is better I have to exercise lots. I have to drink lots of water too. Lost another pound. Be well. Marie.