Heather Rose: Hello

[JanCarol]

Golly, it seems like I'm the only one posting here - but here you go.

 

This is what one of the brilliant SA researchers came up with  -  starting with Hashimotos:

 

People with Hashimoto’s usually have a combination of nutrient deficiencies, food sensitivities, adrenal dysfunction, gut infections and an impaired ability to get rid of toxins. This Hashimoto's vicious cycle of events (http://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/whats-really-going-on-in-hashimotos)   causes an immune system imbalance, which leads to the autoimmune destruction of our little thyroid gland. An enzyme deficiency can directly and indirectly contribute to thyroid symptoms and autoimmunity. 

 

This led him to look at the psych texts, our "friendly Uncle Peter Breggin" has written several books and is an expert witness on the damages these drugs cause.  I can list a whole bunch of problems, but I think the ones that are relevant to you are:

 

With this knowledge going back to my favourite all time hero Breggin i will look for a new word 'enzymes' and i  read this: On a cellular level, the neurotoxicity of antipsychotic drugs has been studied and demonstrated for decades. Clinical doses of haloperidol and olanzapine over 17 to 27 months duration in Macaque monkeys have been shown to cause 8 to 11% loss of tissue weight throughout the brain. The toxicity of the antipsychotic drugs on a cellular level includes the inhibition of most enzyme systems in the mitochondria.  (Inuwa, Horobin, Williams 1994, a TEM study of white blood cells from patients under neuroleptic therapy ICEM 13 Paris International Congress of electron microscope pp 1091-1092. ; Breggin give another reference for this Teller and Denber 1970 Kim et al 2006 observed that chronic blockage of dopamine neurotransmission by antipsychotic drugs "results in persistently enhanced release of glutamate, which kills striatal neurons" above is taken from Breggin, psychiatric drug withdrawal 2013 , page 41

 

Now, you understand mitochondria with your training - and you can see how the extreme exercise would be burning the candle at both ends.  You've stopped the extreme stuff - but the Invega is likely still damaging mitochondria and enzymes.  It might also explain your "big fluffy red blood cells" (we talked about this elsewhere - but I'm less sure about this.)

 

Food for thought.  Harm reduction says:  optimize the thyroid first, then start tapering.

 

Also - found this benzodiazapene sufferer's group:

 

and I could find you similar ones for antidepressants and neuroleptics, and anti seizure drugs, too.  This is just one tiny piece of the puzzle of what has been making you sick.

 

Oh, and we just had a member who tapered off of Invega by switching to Resperdal (which is the "ancestor" of Invega):  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/12695-morgane-tapered-off-invega/

[Aria]

Greeting HeatherRose,

 

Seroquel was my undoing (off the charts akathisia for years seem as mania) and I also was taken off it abruptly. The pdoc said it was small does (300 mg) but it was NOT a small dose to me.I applaud your determination to lower the amount of psych drugs you are on. I had to use a suspension agent to help me taper slower. Using this method can be a chore but it helped me tapering 1, 2, 3% per week. Tapering can make you feel surreal and have unbelievable insomnia. The SA members are super and can help you a lot.

 

Psychiatric drugs change your perception and emotional state. I became extremely sensitive and would cry for hours on end.The pdoc told me I was severely mentally ill but to his surprise my so-called mental illness was due to him prescribing psychiatric drugs.

 

Aria

[HeatherRose]

I am on Mobic 15 mg a day

[HeatherRose]

I am on remeron 7.5 mg a day

[HeatherRose]

 

For over 20 years. Well almost 30 years now. Wow.

Welcome, Heather Rose! Was just reading your posts and this just jumped out at me.

I know that feeling! It's like, where did all that time go!?!? I'm hoping, for all of us, that the same affect happens years after we're off these drugs!

 

BTW, I used to spend quite a bit of time in southern Indiana, including Bloomington from time to time. Spent a lot of time on Monroe Reservoir. Not a bad place to live in Indiana, as opposed to say Northern Indiana where it's all cornfields (where I lived for 20yrs).

 

hi. sorry i have not been posting responses. I am not good at this. I am tired all the time and keeping up on things is hard. I am glad you spent time here. IT IS a nice place to live. Northern Indiana is quite different.

[HeatherRose]

Golly, it seems like I'm the only one posting here - but here you go.

 

This is what one of the brilliant SA researchers came up with  -  starting with Hashimotos:

 

People with Hashimoto’s usually have a combination of nutrient deficiencies, food sensitivities, adrenal dysfunction, gut infections and an impaired ability to get rid of toxins. This Hashimoto's vicious cycle of events (http://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/whats-really-going-on-in-hashimotos)   causes an immune system imbalance, which leads to the autoimmune destruction of our little thyroid gland. An enzyme deficiency can directly and indirectly contribute to thyroid symptoms and autoimmunity. 

 

This led him to look at the psych texts, our "friendly Uncle Peter Breggin" has written several books and is an expert witness on the damages these drugs cause.  I can list a whole bunch of problems, but I think the ones that are relevant to you are:

 

With this knowledge going back to my favourite all time hero Breggin i will look for a new word 'enzymes' and i  read this: On a cellular level, the neurotoxicity of antipsychotic drugs has been studied and demonstrated for decades. Clinical doses of haloperidol and olanzapine over 17 to 27 months duration in Macaque monkeys have been shown to cause 8 to 11% loss of tissue weight throughout the brain. The toxicity of the antipsychotic drugs on a cellular level includes the inhibition of most enzyme systems in the mitochondria.  (Inuwa, Horobin, Williams 1994, a TEM study of white blood cells from patients under neuroleptic therapy ICEM 13 Paris International Congress of electron microscope pp 1091-1092. ; Breggin give another reference for this Teller and Denber 1970 Kim et al 2006 observed that chronic blockage of dopamine neurotransmission by antipsychotic drugs "results in persistently enhanced release of glutamate, which kills striatal neurons" above is taken from Breggin, psychiatric drug withdrawal 2013 , page 41

 

Now, you understand mitochondria with your training - and you can see how the extreme exercise would be burning the candle at both ends.  You've stopped the extreme stuff - but the Invega is likely still damaging mitochondria and enzymes.  It might also explain your "big fluffy red blood cells" (we talked about this elsewhere - but I'm less sure about this.)

 

Food for thought.  Harm reduction says:  optimize the thyroid first, then start tapering.

 

Also - found this benzodiazapene sufferer's group:

 

and I could find you similar ones for antidepressants and neuroleptics, and anti seizure drugs, too.  This is just one tiny piece of the puzzle of what has been making you sick.

 

Oh, and we just had a member who tapered off of Invega by switching to Resperdal (which is the "ancestor" of Invega):  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/12695-morgane-tapered-off-invega/

Yeah. I am not good at this. I don't understand any of this. My brain is too foggy, my memory sucks. I cannot keep up with all this information. I am trying really hard. Thank you for all your help JanCarol. I appreciate all the help.

[HeatherRose]

hey. sorry have not been posting or answering. was at family's house for two weeks and my computer access was limited. I am also having a lot of problems with brain fogginess, memory problems and motivation for anything...even cool stuff like this. Last night was a bad night and today hasn't been much different. I am angry, sad, lonely and tired. You know what HALT means? Never do anything rash when you are HUNGRY, ANGRY, LONELY or TIRED. So I am Halting things. I am doing my best to keep up with everything on here, on the web, researching stuff about my meds, about my thyroid, about my Hashimotos but it's all very overwhelming right now. Thanks for being there.

[HeatherRose]

i want back on my seroquel again. tired of figthing all this stuff i was able to handle better on it. I THOUGHT anyway. Felt really successful and find on my seroquel. they take me off of it and i suddenly can't cope with anything. getting to be almost agoraphobic. Have to steel myself to go out. Went off my seroquel in the hospital two months ago. they brought me down from 300mg a day to nothing in only 5 days. now i am on a monthly shot. I miss my seroquel b/c i felt like it helped with all of this stuff. HATE it...hate the anger, frustration, sadness, over sensitivity and general messiness of my life and my mind right now. Very frustrated!!!

[HeatherRose]

the good thing that happened? my aunt bought me an MP3 player so I don't have to choose between having earplugs on or getting overwhelmed by the noise of the world. I can now delve into my music when I am upset or feeling stressed out in the world.

[scallywag]

Have you discussed switching from the monthly injection to daily oral Seroquel with  your doctor(s)?

[HeatherRose]

Have you discussed switching from the monthly injection to daily oral Seroquel with  your doctor(s)?

I see my doctor next Tuesday. I am going to ask him if i can go back to the seroquel but on a lighter dose and then get off the invega shot. He seems to think, at last appointment, that may be the way to go. The invega just doesn't seem to stall the racing thoughts, feelings of paranoia and give me the peace of mind the seroquel did. but am scared as i have been off of it now for two months. I will talk to him about it.

[JanCarol]

Heather, how long since your last invega shot?

 

On page one are some charts and lines that Scallywag created to help you understand the "ups and downs" of the Invega shot.  You may just be on the "down slope" of the Invega shot.

 

I think that you are going too long in between shots, and that it might be better to take smaller shots, closer together than the big shots further apart.

 

I think you are in withdrawal from seroquel, and it is possible you are having interdose withdrawal from the Ativan and Rozerem.  Our Benzo moderator, Wellness, is on holiday right now, but she would start talking to you about splitting your dose of Ativan to 2x a day, to help "cover" those times of panic and anxiety in between.

 

Here's the Kombucha thread we talked about - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2805-make-your-own-kombucha-httpwpmep5nnb-7pj/?hl=kombucha

 

And I have a feeling you might enjoy the Music thread, too: (more of a social place - and it will give you an idea of the different people here, and who might be fun to talk to):  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7839-music-what-music-helps-you-put-it-here/

[HeatherRose]

i'm not having the best day today. Trying to get up the energy to do a load of laundry. Not sure right now if this is my thyroid tired or withdrawal symptoms. Just. Tough. I need to do laundry.

[HeatherRose]

Heather, how long since your last invega shot?

 

On page one are some charts and lines that Scallywag created to help you understand the "ups and downs" of the Invega shot.  You may just be on the "down slope" of the Invega shot.

 

I think that you are going too long in between shots, and that it might be better to take smaller shots, closer together than the big shots further apart.

 

I think you are in withdrawal from seroquel, and it is possible you are having interdose withdrawal from the Ativan and Rozerem.  Our Benzo moderator, Wellness, is on holiday right now, but she would start talking to you about splitting your dose of Ativan to 2x a day, to help "cover" those times of panic and anxiety in between.

 

Here's the Kombucha thread we talked about - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2805-make-your-own-kombucha-httpwpmep5nnb-7pj/?hl=kombucha

 

And I have a feeling you might enjoy the Music thread, too: (more of a social place - and it will give you an idea of the different people here, and who might be fun to talk to):  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7839-music-what-music-helps-you-put-it-here/

I think also the shots are too long in between. I am going to talk to my doc about it when i see him next Tuesday.

[JanCarol]

Hey Heather - sorry about your foggy brain.  

 

I won't post any more links.  Just keep reading what you have here.  Read it over and over - I still read stuff over and over sometimes.  I never get it all, but I always get something, if I read it again.

 

Keep asking questions.  

[HeatherRose]

Jan. I will definitely keep reading. It is hard to concentrate to read. Thanks for all the llnks and help.

 

so here is the thing: I spoke with my medical doc (ie. not psych doc) yesterday and she thinks I need to get off my invega and/or my remeron. I would really like to just get back on my seroquel. I felt like I was taken off of it really quickly and also it didn't add all the weight. I know that part of my weight gain is possibly also my thyroid but it really started escalating when i was wrenched off of my seroquel. I know nothing here is an easy fix but would really like to get off the shot and remeron and just put back on my seroquel. It helped me sleep (without the remeron) and also made me feel better and not with all the weight gain. I stayed steady on my weight for years on seroquel. I spoke to her that i think the thing that ended me up in the hospital was just a flare up of my current disability and not because i needed this major drug change. she is forwarding our conversation on to my psych doc i see next week. I will speak to him about all of this.

[HeatherRose]

 

 

So I am feeling a bit frustrated about the thyroid thing right now. Doc said it was an autoimmune disorder but wouldn't say what one. She listed several. Also trying to figure out the Hashimoto diet. And one that will work with my psych drugs.

[HeatherRose]

I saw my doctor yesterday and she said my weight gain was a side effect of my drugs. I am on a shot of Invega once a month and also have been started on Remeron for sleep. When I was on my seroquel for years and it didn't give me any weight gain and i was able to run ultramarathons and i am an athletic trainer so it's hard to be gaining so much weight. It makes me want to stay in and not see my running friends because i have gained weight. She is talking to my psychiatrist now to go to another med change--putting me back on my seroquel and off the invega and remeron so maybe i can lose the weight again but I also have been dealing with a new (maybe new??) diagnosis of an autoimmunde disorder and hypothyroidism which can ALSO add weight gain so I am confused as to what is causing it. I am still exercising although my muscles and joints hurt more now so I am not able to run at this time which is also causing me to have more problems with stress and anxiety because running was my way to deal with anxiety and stress and now I have no outliet.

 

I am writing a lot on my blog which helps--writing more poetry--but I am also having trouble leaving my house now because the weight gain when I am a --for now--past runner--and also an athletic trainer is making me feel so bad about myself and judged by others (whether they truly are judging me at the time or whether it is just my self-consiousness about it) and so I just want to stay home. I have also been having thoughts again about running away from home so that people won't know me. But that is what landed me in the hospital in june so I don't tell my docs that but have been writing about it and also telling my therapist.

 

Anyway, right now things are very heavy and very mixed up so it's hard to tell what is my meds and what is my thyroid and what is withdrawal.

[Shep]

Hi, Heather.

 

I completely understand what you're saying about running. I had to give that up two years ago and I'm only now slowly getting back into it. I'm actually "tapering in" by 2 minutes a week until I'm up to 30 minutes. And it seems to be working okay.

 

You mentioned that running was too hard on your joints right now. Are you able to swim or do any kind of water aerobics?  It might help with stress and anxiety. I used to really like the "runner's high" and miss that a lot. 

 

Writing sounds healthy. Seems like a lot of people who enjoy writing and are creative end up on these meds. I'm glad you're finding healthy ways of coping. Running away from home doesn't sound too good, but this will get better.

 

Sending healing vibes your way.

[HeatherRose]

Yeah I'm able to do swimming and biking but it's not the same.

 

I do love to write. I am doing g more of that. Good job on your running. I can't wait until I can do that again.

 

Thanks for the healing vibes!

[VitaminB]

Hi HeatherRose,

 

I want to commiserate on the Invega shot and propranolol. They tried that on me too, and I had to beg to get back on Seroquel. Akathisia is truly torture. Propranolol is a joke. 

 

I have the same sort of history of landing in the hospital and being ripped off Seroquel onto a new drug to try. I remember trying to explain to my psych doctors face that you can't take me off Seroquel so fast and expect me to be doing well. They think the new med will just take over. Thankfully, with the exception of the Invega shot, I could get them to put me back on seroquel.

 

I had a doctor who was willing to help me taper say that he didn't know if the akathisia would come back if I successfully got off all of the seroquel. I pressed another doctor into telling me the same chemical reactions for akathisia are going on within me on seroquel, there is just a masking agent at work. When they rip me off seroquel in the hospital it is hard to know if the akathisia comes back because of the drug or lack of masking agent. I haven't been able to taper off successfully yet, so I don't know. 

 

I put up a post under self care about getting nutrient testing done. If you get a good practitioner they could help you with getting a bigger, more focused picture on how to deal with underlying issues. 

 

I also suggest, "A Mind of Your Own" by Kelly Brogan. She healed herself from thyroid issues and her books talks about it. There are more details about her at my post under self care. 

 

Take it easy,

 

VitaminB

[VitaminB]

also, you could go to kellybroganmd.com and search for thyroid in the search box. 

[HeatherRose]

Hi HeatherRose,

 

I want to commiserate on the Invega shot and propranolol. They tried that on me too, and I had to beg to get back on Seroquel. Akathisia is truly torture. Propranolol is a joke. 

 

I have the same sort of history of landing in the hospital and being ripped off Seroquel onto a new drug to try. I remember trying to explain to my psych doctors face that you can't take me off Seroquel so fast and expect me to be doing well. They think the new med will just take over. Thankfully, with the exception of the Invega shot, I could get them to put me back on seroquel.

 

I had a doctor who was willing to help me taper say that he didn't know if the akathisia would come back if I successfully got off all of the seroquel. I pressed another doctor into telling me the same chemical reactions for akathisia are going on within me on seroquel, there is just a masking agent at work. When they rip me off seroquel in the hospital it is hard to know if the akathisia comes back because of the drug or lack of masking agent. I haven't been able to taper off successfully yet, so I don't know. 

 

I put up a post under self care about getting nutrient testing done. If you get a good practitioner they could help you with getting a bigger, more focused picture on how to deal with underlying issues. 

 

I also suggest, "A Mind of Your Own" by Kelly Brogan. She healed herself from thyroid issues and her books talks about it. There are more details about her at my post under self care. 

 

Take it easy,

 

VitaminB

 

 

Thank you very much. Yes the akathesia is awful! I have it this morning. They have put me back on my Zoloft and off my Remeron--so this morning i dont' know if it's my thyroid or my new meds or both but i feel horrible. Muscle aches, itchiness, joint pain, woozy and tired but unable to settle on anything for long..just restless but tired. It is awful. I want my doc to put me back on Seroquel but he said he only wanted to do one change at a time and wanted to try the Zoloft again first. So I am at a crossroads here. I get my Invega shot on the 18th. I think I am squirrely too b/c my body needs my shot.

[HeatherRose]

InNeed, a 10% reduction is suggested as a starting point. Some people find they cannot tolerate that amount of reduction and need to taper by smaller decrements. Some people, such as yourself, have a great deal of difficulty tapering by any amount. David Healy has discussed this. You're not the only one. Given that you can't divide Cymbalta beads, tapering by one at a time is the lowest you can go. It's true that as you go down in dosage, one bead represents a larger and larger percentage of the whole, but it's the best you can do.

 I tried to taper off my seroquel and ended up in the hospital on the psych ward. They put me on new meds. They took me completely off the seroquel from 300mg a day to nothing in 5 days. I didn't sleep for 25 hours the first day I was off it. I had been relying on it to sleep at night. I am still not completely sleeping at night without it. I am trying to get my body used to going without it but have been having symptoms without it. They put me on an Invega shot (177mg a month) I take once a month now. They switched my Remeron I was taking to sleep at night with Zoloft 100mg about two days ago. They gave me 3 days to go off my Remeron which was at 7.5mg a night. I was very sick yesterday morning, possibly from the Zoloft. I had muscle aches, dizziness, wooziness, headache and trouble sitting still. I was so sick I had to go back to bed. I woke up at 10am feeling a little better but had a headache. I am feeling more with it this morning but am worried it had such a dramatic effect on me.

 

When I was reducing my Seroquel with my doctor's help he was reducing it by 100mg each time. It was too much I now know, too fast, and then when I was down to 300mg from 800mg a day I started having troubles. I started feeling like running away from home--researching it on the internet and buying a lighweight tent and sleeping bag. Though I have two cats i love as Emotional Support Animals I was even thinking of leaving them with a friend and just taking off--then the next few days later when I was all packed up to leave i ended up in the psych ward. They completely took me off my meds--from Zoloft to Remeron in 5 days--from 300mg of Seroquel to nothing in 5 days--gave me a boost of Invega two shots in the first 5 days and a pill to take at night--then went down to once a month at 177mg. I am due for another shot coming up in a few days. I have noticed I am not quite right in the first 2 weeks after taking my shot. I start to have ideas of running away again-i start to not care about things, get more depressed and have more weird ideas about numbers. My ideas about numbers are like synchronicity-that numbers are talking to me and that they are giving me signs as to what to do with my life. Though I feel still this is real they tell me I am delusional and give me shots.

 

I feel I am not delusional. Though I worry about the ideas of running away I am not sure I would do it. Though i feel now about numbers I still take the shots. I still feel like running away but am not researching it and haven't packed up again or made a plan like I was.

[freespirit123]

Heather, I was just reading your signature. What were you diagnosed with?

[HeatherRose]

Scizzoaffective disorder

[HeatherRose]

I was wondering how do I bring it up with my doctor?

[JanCarol]

I have moved your posts from 10% tapering thread to this one, since it involves your case specifically. 

 

This thread is your journal, where you can ask questions about your case, share with us what you've learned, and log your journey.

[HeatherRose]

Ok

[Shep]

Hi, Heather.

 

Your comment on running away again sounds drastic, but totally understandable. Problem is, wherever you go, you've still got all of these really bad symptoms to deal with because they come with you. They are the unwelcome traveling companions no matter where you go. 

 

The true escape was getting off the drugs. They are the captors and once you are released from the drugs, all of these unwelcome traveling companions started to fade. 

 

You already are running away, in a sense. This constant struggle of medication changes is a type of "movement", a distraction from your main goal. 

 

 

I was wondering how do I bring it up with my doctor?

 

 

 

There are a couple of links that deal with this:

 

How do you talk to a doctor about tapering and withdrawal?
 
What should I expect from my doctor about withdrawal symptoms?

 

I think once you truly believe that the drugs are not the solution, it will be much easier to convince a doctor. Doctors rarely can tell the difference between a withdrawal symptom and a mental illness. So it's like we're dealing with doctors who suffer from a kind of delusional disorder themselves. 

 

So in order to get the drugs and the doses needed to taper, we have to fit into their delusion. It's unfortunate we're in the position we're in, but learning the non-drug coping skills are essential to fitting into this delusion. We have to "appear" to not suffer from anxiety in order to come off anxiety drugs, even if the drugs themselves cause anxiety.

 

Same is true for antidepressants and antipsychotics. We have to "appear" not to have rebound psychosis, including delusions. I'm not sure what you mean by "numbers". Are you fixating on statistics? 

 

Try to replace the thought of running away with the thought of escaping these chemicals. 

 

If the "home" you're searching for is a state of mind, you don't have to go anywhere to find it. It will come as you slowly taper off your meds.

 

Sending healing vibes your way, Heather. I really think you can do this, but staying in one place is key. Healing will come to you. 

 

 

 

[HeatherRose]

HI Shep,

  Thank you for your thoughtful answer. I appreciate it. I know I have a long way to go but it is hard to convince my doctor when I have such a long history behind me of breaking down. I will not run away. At least now I won't. I cannot be completely clear on the future as I have no way of knowing how that will go but I think for now I will stay put here with my cats.

 

Thank you for the links. As to the numbers I believe numbers have many magic qualities in that 11:11 means you are on the right path and should listen to what you are thinking at the time and 222 means you are on the second stage of your journey and 1234 means you are going in the right direction...etc....so when I tell doctors and others about that they say I am delusional but I am not. It is only syncronicity and many things mean many things.

 

so do I not tell people that anymore? What if they need to hear it?

 

Thank you again!

[Shep]

Thanks for explaining your numbers to me. I used to be an accountant and work in accounts receivable research analysis, so I also have a fascination with numbers.

 

They are mysterious, indeed. And for me, working in accounting came with a certain "calmness" and sanity because 1 + 1 ALWAYS equals 2. Where else can you find that type of "certainty"? 

 

 

 

so do I not tell people that anymore? What if they need to hear it?

 

 

Like I wrote in my previous post, doctors are under their own delusional disorder right now because they believe these drugs work and are safe long term.

 

This is simply not true. But for now, we must play by their rules and accommodate their narrative.

 

And in their narrative, they do not understand the mystery of numbers, so it's best to not speak of it - it only comes with more drugs and more trauma to you, based on their delusions.

 

Safeguard your delusions. They are yours to keep. From what you've described, they don't need to hear this because they simply aren't "listening". 

 

I hope this makes sense. 

[HeatherRose]

It's funny because i am more of an english person than a math person. I never got beyond pre-algebra in school no matter how hard I tried. But the mysticism of numbers is what interests me. Like numerology means something to me. It means something to a lot of people. So it's not delusional it's just a different way of seeing them right? :-)

[ChessieCat]

Hi Heather,

 

Many of us have things that we believe in.  People believe in different things.  However we need to choose carefully who we tell about what we believe in.  In your case, it may be wise not to talk to your doctor/s about believing in numbers.

[HeatherRose]

yeah. It is unfortunate. But it's true.

[Shep]

Thanks for explaining your numbers to me. I used to be an accountant and work in accounts receivable research analysis, so I also have a fascination with numbers.

 

They are mysterious, indeed. And for me, working in accounting came with a certain "calmness" and sanity because 1 + 1 ALWAYS equals 2. Where else can you find that type of "certainty"? 

 

 

 

so do I not tell people that anymore? What if they need to hear it?

 

 

Like I wrote in my previous post, doctors are under their own delusional disorder right now because they believe these drugs work and are safe long term.

 

This is simply not true. But for now, we must play by their rules and accommodate their narrative.

 

And in their narrative, they do not understand the mystery of numbers, so it's best to not speak of it - it only comes with more drugs and more trauma to you, based on their delusions.

 

Safeguard your delusions. They are yours to keep. From what you've described, they don't need to hear this because they simply aren't "listening". 

 

I hope this makes sense. 

 

 

I forgot to add that I'm glad you're not running away again. 

 

You sound calmer now, and that's a good thing. Having a safe home is also a good thing.