Rico: Zyprexa tapering

[FireflyFyte]

58 minutes ago, Rico said:

Any advice would be highly appreciated.

 

I am not a moderator but it appears that you have a history of fairly fast tapers which are then followed by hospitalizations. It might help to stabilize on your current medications for a few months and then start a slow taper (no more than 10% per month) off of medication if that's your goal. Your CNS has been through a lot and might benefit from no further changes for some time.

[Rico]

Thank you for your prompt reply.

 

The most recent hospitalisation occurred after I started the Abilify injection. I made the decision myself to try it out instead of Lithium after a relationship breakup before NYE. 

 

Thanks,
Rico.

[hayduke]

8 hours ago, Rico said:

Hi all,

 

I am currently taking an Abilify depot, with my last injection on the 2/2/2023 having started the first depot on 5/1/2023.

 

I have ran out of lines in my signature to provide an update, so here it is:

 

2023: Hospitalised in January - Abilify Maintena (400mg), Lithium 900mg, tapered down to 500mg (18/2).

 

I don't want to take this drug anymore, but my psychiatrist told me yesterday that I have a "serious mental illness" and should stay on the depot. The next injection is due on 3/3/2023, and I am not sure if I want to take it or not.

 

Both the Abilify and Lithium have made me ill, especially the Abilify depot where I don't feel well for 5 or so days after the injection is administered. 

 

I would love to live a life without drugs, but I have the diagnosis of Bipolar 1 Affective Disorder hanging over me.

 

Any advice would be highly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

Rico. 

Hi mate,

 

I would say never mind the diagnosis, plenty of time to quarrel with the bobble heads once you are stable.

 

Is your depot shot ordered?  The quack I was saddled with by my parents against my valid objections kept trying to get me on those, a la "you can have the large Coke for just $3 extra".

 

I only tried "abilify" for a week, interestingly the change was suggested and applied during a period of high stress with a violent and abusive neighbour who had fixated on me after realised I had called the cops on his wife bashing.  I would do the same again, she moved out the next day after my call and he found out, because I had discussed it with the other neighbours.

The "abilify" seemed helpful for a day or two because suddenly I had a lot more energy.  But when you are not safe in your own home, or at least feeling safe, more "activation" is not what you want.  I began having trouble sleeping, and had to come back off the drug.  Side note:  benzos had a paradoxical effect at that time.  I had a script for oxazepam for occasional anxiety, which worsened from them then!  I had been on risperodone before that, and went back on olanzapine after.

Any prescriber who supports changing drugs that were previously stable enough during crucial life stressors can take a long walk off a short pier, IMO.  Evidently they do not have your best interests at heart.

I moved away from that place and found a better community only a few miles away.  I would say that was a healing change, although I did suffer a few months of post traumatic stress after the move I was welcomed and supported.

 

Anyways, yep you need to find some measure of stability first I would say.  I cannot advise which drug might bring that about for a time, but it does not sound like the "abilify" is much good.
 

It also sounds like you might have unresolved trauma going on.  I would prioritise finding a sympathetic trauma informed clinical psychologist who you feel comfortable with.  When I sought that, I was supported through my taper as well.

 

I couldn't have got off the drugs without the trauma therapy, and I couldn't have done the trauma therapy without getting off the drugs.  Among many other things, as a consequence of the major childhood trouble being "set straight" in my organism, I no longer suffer generalised anxiety.  If am ever anxious now I can tell you exactly why!

 

Be well, brother.

Edited February 18, 2023 by hayduke

[Shep]

18 hours ago, Rico said:

I would love to live a life without drugs, but I have the diagnosis of Bipolar 1 Affective Disorder hanging over me.

 

Any advice would be highly appreciated.

 

 

It's unclear what you mean by you "have the diagnosis of Bipolar 1 Affective Disorder hanging over" you. If you define yourself as "Bipolar 1" (whatever that is), you likely will never get off these drugs. I had the same diag-nonsense, among other nonsense labels. Un-patienting yourself is a necessary part of coming off these drugs. If you think you are "mentally ill," there's nothing we can do for you here. If you think of yourself as someone who needs to learn better coping skills, then you'll be able to chart a path toward getting off these drugs and handling stressors without needing to be numbed down. 

 

While trauma can certainly play a role, other things can, too - have you been tested for any vitamin deficiencies such as low vitamin D or B12? You may also want to look into the Ketogenic diet, as going very low carb, high fat, and moderate protein has been effective for some people in regulating mood (see Dr. Chris Palmer's book Brain Energy). There are many paths to get off these drugs and live drug free, but for the past 7 years that you've been a member here, you've had a number of crisis states that lead to drug changes. Please note we have a very small staff here and as an online forum, are limited in what we can do. 

 

Rico, please re-read your thread. I know it's 15 webpages, but it may help to pinpoint places where you started, stopped, and then ended back on these drugs. At some point, your stress overwhelmed your coping skills. This is a repeated pattern. If you can break this pattern and learn better coping skills, work on your diet and any vitamin deficiencies, and deal with your traumas, you may find your mind/body strengthened to the point where you don't end up back on these drugs. 

 

Right now, you need to stabilize to the point where you're able to transfer from the injection to pills so you can eventually taper. And while you're in process of doing so, work on building up your coping skills and getting your body as healthy as possible. 

[Rico]

Hi Shep,

 

Thanks for your reply. The Abilify injection that I have been on for 2 months is causing awful insomnia and making me feel terrible. I am not going to take another one of these injections. 

 

As for the lithium, I am on a very low dose which I will hold for a month or 2 before tapering. That causes me bad side effects too. 

 

I am so confused right now...do I have a Bipolar 1 diagnosis? Can I live drug free? I am so scared that I am going to crash and burn again if I stop medications, but I can't live with these awful side effects. 

 

I am interested in the non-drug coping techniques, and I have a psychologist who is willing to help me learn strategies for sitting with my feelings rather than run to medications and hospitals. I don't know...I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed right now, not sure where to start. 

 

Thank you for your reply.

 

Rico.

[hayduke]

3 hours ago, Rico said:

I am so confused right now...do I have a Bipolar 1 diagnosis? Can I live drug free? I am so scared that I am going to crash and burn again if I stop medications, but I can't live with these awful side effects. 

 

I am interested in the non-drug coping techniques, and I have a psychologist who is willing to help me learn strategies for sitting with my feelings rather than run to medications and hospitals. I don't know...I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed right now, not sure where to start. 

 

Things really changed when I read Your Drug May Be Your Problem.  Breggin is contentious on some thing but that book shook my mindset out of a ton of things brow beaten into me.

 

Why not browse the Mad In America web site for a start, and start making a list of interesting books that might be liberating for you to read?

[Rico]

Hi all,

 

I haven't posted in a while, but it's good to be back.

 

It's being 3 days since my last dose of Abilify (2.5mg). I have come off this drug under doctor's supervision, and glad to say that I have an understanding psychiatrist this time. 

 

I had a stressful relationship breakup in July last year (2023) which caused me to become unwell, ending up in hospital. I am no longer in this relationship.

 

The hospital deemed that I was non-compliant and I was placed on a court-ordered Abilify depot of 400mg. This was later reduced to 300mg due to side effects. I was barely able to work and function properly even on the 300mg and once the court oder expired, I sought a new psychiatrist and complained of all the side effects.

 

He was happy for me to just not take another injection, but I was concerned about withdrawal symtpoms - which did occur. I therefore obtained a script of Abilfy 10mg, and over the course of roughly 3 months, tapered down to zero (going from 10 - 5 - 2.5 - 0). 

 

Today is my 3rd day without any Abilify or other drugs, and I am starting to function a little better, but I know I have a long way to go.

 

I am back on this site to get some support through my new journey, and hopefully this time, I stay well and out of hospitals.

 

Kind regards,

Rico.

[hayduke]

Hi Rico,

 

Glad you have found a supportive psychiatrist.

That does sound like a very fast taper though.  Did you discuss the 10%/month guideline with them?

[Rico]

Hey hayduke,

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

Initially, the Dr said I don't need to taper the injection with oral meds at all due to its long half-life, but I tried that and experienced bad withdrawal symptoms. So, we agreed to taper from 10mg.

 

I was experiencing some very bad side effects with the Abilify, and switching to the oral version seemed to make me worse. I therefore tapered it rather quickly, not using the 10% rule. 

 

The side effects were really prohibiting me from being able to work, so I felt like I had no choice but to taper it quicker. 

 

So far, I am doing ok, just my sleep isn't long enough, but I do feel that I am functioning better. 

 

I notice that you have been on Paliperodone. I had a severe allergic reaction to that drug after the loading doses. I'm sorry that you were given this drug. It took me a long time to recover from it, but I hope you're doing ok. 

 

Do you have any tips on how I cam regulate my sleep again. I'd love to be able to "want" to sleep as opposed to forcing myself to sleep each night and only sleeping a few hours here and there. 

 

Wishing you all the best in your recovery. 

 

Kind regards,

Karim.

[hayduke]

OK, the risk of course is having trouble symptoms re emerge and getting drugged again.

 

I'd suggest reviewing this thread.  Many helpful suggestions - regular exercise, yoga and epsom salts baths are three things that helped improve my sleep.  Also getting a red filter going at night on your phones, computer etc.