Sebas: seeking advice about paroxetine

[Sebas]

8 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

You could add the entire contents of the 0.5mg capsule to water and then extract the dose you need.

Thanks Chessie. Okay so how do i measure 0.1 or 0.2 from this water? So then i won't need capsules?

[ChessieCat]

No you wouldn't need additional capsules.

 

Please double check these calculations.

 

You could put 0.5mg in 50mL water:

 

0.5mg            50mL

 

divide both sides by 50

 

0.01mg            1mL

 

multiply both sides by 10

 

0.1mg             10mL

 

multiply both sides by 2

 

0.2mg            20mL

 

[Sebas]

9 hours ago, souim said:

Hi Sebas, as a fellow paxil taperer dealing with the liquid version shortage I just wanted to express my support. Hope you're doing okay. This situation is quite stressful. I guess I'll just buy a super precise scale myself..

Thx we're in this together. So in France, the Netherlands and Germany out of stock? Or perhaps it's a european issue. 

[Erell]

Hello dear @Sebas,

 

Have you seen this post : 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/405-tips-for-tapering-off-paxil-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=607437

 

 

It gives some important information about liquid paroxetine.

 

Sending my support and healing vibes 🌱

[Sebas]

@Erell thanks for the link. So GSK is going to stop liquid production. Well they have no long term commercial interest in tapering so that may be (one of) the reason(s).

[Erell]

Well, I'm glad you're making the transition to capsules before liquid becomes unavailable: I send you all my support in this transition  

[Sebas]

@ChessieCati've got another question.

 

I'm currently taking 10mg paxil tablet (Sandoz) and for the remaining 1.2 mg i'm taking 0.6 ml of orange liquid paxil.

Would it be beter to take the 10mg tablet and combine with dissolving the tablet in water to subtract the remaining 1.2 mg from the same tablet. Cause the tablet and the orange paxil liquid may conflict with eachother (they both have different additives).

 

That would mean i put the 10 mg tablet in 5 ml of water and then take 0.6 ml.

 

I read online that paxil has a sollubility in water of 5.4 mg/ml. Does this in any way effect the above?

 

Thanks in advance for your help or guidance.

 

 

[Sebas]

Hi Guys,

 

Here's an update from the last months.

 

End of august liquid paxil was out of stock, then i switched to tablets from compounding pharmacy. At first I was relieved they could produce 11.2 mg tablets. During the following 6 weeks i got worse. Loosing some weight, feeling tired, dizziness/brain fog, cold shivers, feeling more depressed and sleeping a lot.

 

I figured out it must be the tablets and gave feedback to the pharmacist. Of course in their opinion it was not due to the tablets. I switched to original 10mg Pandoz tablets and instantly felt they were more potent (have eversince developed withdrawal symptoms such as nausea, sleepiness, palpitations and anxiousness). For the remaning 1.2 mg i had some remaining liquid bottles. I noticed this wasn't a perfect combination and decided to dissolve a tablet in water every 3 days. So now i'm taking the original tablet, supplemented with a tablet/water solution for the remining 1.2 mg (10 mg in 20 ml). I had to get familiar with this new method (few mistakes).

 

Currently i'm still really tired especially in the morning and afternoon, nauseous, food intolerances, hot/cold shivers, dilated pupils, back pain and diziness. I'm working mostly from home office and persevering not to call in sick. It's a real struggle. I'm keeping a journal and it seems as though there have also been some windows. Very strange, for example:

- felt bad yesterday afternoon, sleeping etc.

- felt quite okay yesterday evening, doing some fitness exercises

- bad food reaction, felt very tired today, working just a few hours, then sleeping etc.

 

Do you think that I'm still 'building up the druglevels' after I deteriorated in august/september (tablets from another manufacturer)?

[ChessieCat]

It takes about 4 days for a drug dose change to get to a steady level and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.  The drug dose difference, if there was one, will become steady long after changing the drug/dose.

 

However, you might still be stabilising after the "upset" from the other brand.

[Hanna72]

Dear @Sebas

Just wanted to drop by with some support, as you have given me along my journey.

One thing I want to mention is that never underestimate Paxil. 
What you are feeling is in my opinion Paxil withdrawals. This drug is so much poison. Believe in what you’re body is telling you. If you feel like resting,then rest. It’s not your delusional mind speaking, but the drug minimising in your blood stream. 
You are doing a fantastic job and I am so proud of you. Keep at it💪 Mind over matter.

I am rooting for you 💕

[Sebas]

I've been really tired for the last days. Sleeping for most of the night, morning and afternoon. It seems like late in the evening i become a little better. The home made liquid that i take before bedtime is very potent and seems to knock me down. I've read that it absorbes much faster. Is this a matter of time for your body to get used to?

[Sebas]

I've been using a plastic jar for the last couple of days, i just ordered an amber colored glass jar online.

[Sebas]

@ChessieCat @brassmonkey I've recently gone into poop out. This may explain why i didn't feel stabilised for a long period of time and possibly also the hypersensitivity to food etc. As though druglevels in blood were never stable.

 

Here are some questions;

- i'm thinking about introducing a small amount of fluoxetine to manage poop out symptoms, say 0.5, what are your thoughts about this? I read that updosing paxil will probably not be helpful in the long run.

 

- i've read somewhere that tapering forward from poop out gives a different withdrawal respons, as in first things improve, then they worsten, what can you say about this? And is there still a 4-6 weeks cycle?

 

These are my main questions for know, maybe some more later. Thanks in advance cause this is quite stressful.

[brassmonkey]

Sorry for the slow response, I've been out of town.

 

Working with poopout is a whole other ball game. Increasing your dose may help as a short-term fix but will cause more problems down the road. Adding other drugs to cover it up doesn't work and just adds something else to be tapered later.

 

With poopout the only way out is down. Doing small reductions on a schedule and working your way through the symptoms. Once the symptoms start to stabilize and reduce, which can take a long time, you should start to see overall improvement.

[Sebas]

So here's a retrospective about last 4 years. Starting from november 2019 to december 2023 i never stabilised. Sensitivities were really severe, i literally couldn't eat, drink, smell, touch a thing without ramping up withdrawal symptoms. Shampoos, paint, oils, perfume, car scent, toothpaste, herbs, yoghurts, bread, candy, cookies, icecream, fruits, vegetables, meat and the list goes on and on. I was nauseous, dizzy, visually impaired most of the time. I felt really sick, lost weight and my photo album speeks for itself. When i showed my brother he was really shocked.

 

At first i thought it was paws, then possible kindling. It was really bad, missed out all kinds of social events and thank god i could work from home 80% of the time.

 

Fast forward tot december 2023 when i noticed the drug really stopped working. I realized I had been building up tolerance since 2019. Within a few days i could tolerate some foods again. I was very happy. Never did i eat as much as in the month of december 2023 (allthough still limited products).

 

I then resumed tapering and discovered that it seemed "more doable" than before. It's still harsh but it's possible. It wasn't even possible before. I'm still dizzy, cross-eyed and my short term memory and concentration is dramatic but i've come to terms with this.

a heavy psychological burden was lifted from my shoulders and there seems to be a way out of this hell

Today i've come down to 10 mg and feel blessed as well as determined. Went to the gym again last weeks and feel happier. Weight is up about 5 to 10 kg. Goddamn last years have been a daily zombie-like struggle like most of us go through for a long time.

 

Thought i'ld let you all know @Altostrata @brassmonkey @ChessieCat @Erell.

 

One question though @brassmonkey @ChessieCat; For the last years I've been containing the liquid solution 10mg/20ml in an amber jar in the freezer, 3 to 4 days and then refresh. I have to withdraw from the 10mg tablet down now (0.2 ml/week). Do i have to mix a 10mg tablet, withdraw and then refresh on a daily basis? Seems more labor intensive hence my question. Or do i buy 2 more amber jars, fill up 3 jars in advance so i don't have to refresh every day? Any best practices on this cause i may not be thinking straight.

 

Next goal: 9 mg (april).

 

Bye Sebas

[brassmonkey]

No AD, tablet or liquid, should ever be frozen. It will quickly degrade the active ingredient and render them worthless. I hope we have a language problem and you actually meant refrigerator. 

 

Yes, it would be fine to make up several doses and keep then in the refrigerator for 3 to 4 days, or you could just make up your doses one day in advance. Take todays dose and then immediately make up tomorrows and store it.

 

I would strongly suggest switching to a percentage reduction instead of a set weight reduction. Using a set weight, or linear reduction will start to cause problems the lower you go, as each reduction becomes a larger percentage of the dose.

[Safran]

I'm sorry for asking you like this in your introduction, two months ago my condition worsened a lot, and just then I was taking canderstad for blood pressure for about 7 days 4mg, so could that be the cause.

[Sebas]

@Safran yes i'm convinced thats the main cause, candesartan has lots of drug interactions, check google and you'll find out instantly; allthough updosing 0.56mg soon after has further upset your nerve system which by then had already become unstable. Last but not least the updose amount of 0.56mg was like going back in dose 3 to 4 months at once (way too much when it wasn't even necessary in the first place). Hope you understand now and hope in short time you'll be able to balance out and soon after resume taper. Cheers Sebas

[Safran]

2 minutes ago, Sebas said:

@Safran yes i'm convinced thats the main cause, candesartan has lots of drug interactions, check google and you'll find out instantly; allthough updosing 0.56mg soon after has further upset your nerve system which by then had already become unstable. Last but not least the updose amount of 0.56mg was like going back in dose 3 to 4 months at once (way too much when it wasn't even necessary in the first place). Hope you understand now and hope in short time you'll be able to balance out and soon after resume taper. Cheers Sebas

Thanks for the quick reply and cheers

[Sebas]

From december on i've reduced my dose from 11.2 mgai to 9.2 (current dose). @brassmonkey what would be an average estimated dose when homeostasis would reoccur? I know it will take much more time but just curious. Can hardly imagine what that would feel like being in withdrawal nonstop since 2019. Still every drop down feels like a tiny celabration. Hope to arrive at 5 mgai max 1 year from now.

[brassmonkey]

Not quite sure what you are asking about homeostasis.

 

Symptoms are going to be popping up all the time you are tapering. It sounds like they are staying fairly mild, which is good.

 

What is the rate at which you are reducing?

 

 

[Sebas]

@brassmonkey i meant that you wrote somewhere that during the taper from poop, which can be frustrating for a fairly long time, at some level some sort of homeostasis seems to re-occur. I'm cutting 0,125 mgai every week that is 0.5 mgai every month.

[brassmonkey]

I understand. There is not going to be a set level where things will settle out. It is going to happen when your body says it is time. Keep to your nice slow schedule and things should be fine. You may want to add in a hold period to let things settle in.