Paxilated

[Paxilated]

Hello everyone,

 

I've been on Paxil for just 3.5 months, and I already have the following side-effects:

 

1) Weight gain (at least 10 pounds)

2) Inability to orgasm

3) Drowsiness

 

I want to get out of this deal, and taper it off. 

 

Will my tapering schedule be exactly the same as that of someone who's taken it for a much longer time?

 

Thanks!

[ChessieCat]

Hi Paxilated and welcome to SA,

 

I'm really pleased that you have found SA before commencing to get off your drug.  Unfortunately it only takes about 1 month for the brain to adapt to getting the drug.  However, if you have never taken any other psychiatric drug in your life time, you may be able to taper faster than SA's recommended 10%, which is a harm reduction method which generally suits most people, however there are some who have been on a drug a long time who can go faster than 10% and some that have to go slower than 10%.  But nobody knows who fits into which category. 
 

You could try a bigger than 10% reduction, but I suggest that you don't reduce more than 25%.  You could try 15% or 20% to start but you might have to make smaller reductions later on.  See Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves.  (Please note this is only information.  You need to decide from the information provided what you will try.)  You will need to listen to your body and if you start to get withdrawal symptoms which are more than mild you will need to reduce by less/go slower.  Please read Post #1 of this topic much of which is relevant to updosing if your withdrawal symptoms are unbearable.  About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

Please note that if you need to updose you only take a tiny bit more and you should not make another reduction until you have stabilised.  See next post.

 

Before you begin tapering what you need to know

 

SA recommends tapering by no more than 10% of the current dose followed by a hold of about 4 weeks to allow the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

When the drug is taken away too quickly we can get withdrawal symptoms:  Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

This topic explains how to get the dose you need:  Tips for tapering off Paxil (paroxetine)

 

Tapering Calculator - Online

 

Not many medical professionals understand psychiatric drug tapering and withdrawal which is why this site exists.  Before you see your doctor, I suggest you check out these topics.  You might find it helpful to write a script and rehearse what you are going to say.  Be calm, gentle but assertive.  You are the customer, it is your body.  Use words like I'd like to try this, or I'd prefer to do it this way.  If a suggestion is made that you don't want to follow, say I'd like to think about it before making a decision.

 

How do you talk to a doctor about tapering and withdrawal?

What should I expect from my doctor about withdrawal symptoms?

 

 

Please create your drug signature.  The mods like to be able to see a member's drug history at a glance and not have read through it.  The preferred format for your drug signature is as follows. 

 

Keep it simple.  NO diagnoses or symptoms please - thank you.

• details for last 2 years - dates, ALL drugs, doses
• summary for older than 2 years - just years and drug/s

as an example:

Drug name:  date, dose; date, dose; date, dose;

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

 

 

I will provide more information in the next post.  This is your own introductions topic where your can ask questions about your own situation and journal your progress.

[ChessieCat]

Here's some additional information which might help you to understand what is happening:

 

Recovery isn't linear it happens in a Windows and Waves Pattern

 

Withdrawal Normal Description

When we take a psychiatric drug, we are adding chemical/s to the brain.  The brain then has to change to adapt to getting the chemical/s.  It might have to change something to do with A and then once that change has been made it affects B so another change has to be made and so on down the line.  It is a chain reaction, a domino effect.

 

The same thing happens when we take the drug away.  That's why it's possible to experience such a vast array of withdrawal symptoms, and they can change, and be of different intensity.

 

are-we-there-yet-how-long-is-withdrawal-going-to-take

 

These explain it really well:

 

Video:  Healing From Antidepressants - Patterns of Recovery

 

On 8/31/2011 at 5:28 AM, Rhiannon said:

When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

AND

 

On 12/4/2015 at 2:41 AM, apace41 said:

Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.  

 

[Paxilated]

This is to update that after consulting a psychiatrist friend over the phone, I've dropped my dose from 20 mg to 10 mg. 

 

I plan to keep this up for a week, then go every alternate day, finally going down to zero the subsequent week.

 

I will hopefully keep you guys posted on my progress.

[ChessieCat]

Thank you for creating your drug signature.  Please add the drug name to the start of the information.

 

The information that I am giving you in this post is because I am concerned that you have been given really bad advice, not because I am trying to scare you.  If you follow this psychiatrist's advice you could end up suffering withdrawal symptoms and possibly become destabilsed and end up with a sensitised nervous system.  We have members here who have ended up having to leave their jobs, had their main relationship break up, move in with relatives and/or become bedridden because they have tried to get off their drug too quickly, even after only taking it for several months.

 

On 10/9/2012 at 10:17 AM, Altostrata said:

Once the nervous system is destabilized by withdrawal, all bets are off. Humpty Dumpty has fallen off the wall.  (Humpty Dumpty is a character in a children's nursery rhyme - he is an egg.)

 

Reinstatement does not always work, and you may have to live with severe withdrawal syndrome for a long while. Medicine wants to believe the acute phase of withdrawal lasts only a few weeks. From what people have posted on the Web, it can last many months.

 

Reducing your dose by 50% is a big risk.  It would be much better to reduce by 25% (ie 15mg).  It would be okay for you to change your dose to this straight away.

 

If you decide not to increase your dose, it is important to understand that if you start experiencing bad withdrawal symptoms it would be best to increase your dose as soon as this happens.  You would not have to go back to the last dose, you could increase it 15mg.

 

Making another reduction after only 1 week is also a big risk even if you are taking 15mg.  It is best not to go by the calendar about when you make the next reduction.  You need to listen to your symptoms.  If you are still experiencing symptoms it is better to hold for longer.

 

Please do not alternate doses to taper.  The brain likes consistency.  Skipping Days vs Every Day Dosing Graph.  The tips for tapering Paxil explains how to get the dose you need.

 

Obviously the decision you make about how you reduce your drug is up to you, but I hope you will consider the information I have provided and if things get bad, that you will refer back to this information and not end up taking too much drug which can make things a whole lot worse.

 

The goal of getting off a psychiatric drug is to get off with the least discomfort possible, not to get off as fast as possible.  Some members here have ended up taking longer by trying to reduce too quickly and then having to updose.  If they had reduced by less and held as needed they would have got off their drug a lot quicker.

 

Your brain has already adapted to receiving the drug, so you a physiologically dependent on it, not physically like nicotine or caffeine.  It's not a craving, it's your brain needing the drug because it has adapted to it.  We can only take the drug away at the rate the brain dictates, which is to do with how quickly it adapts to not getting as much of the drug.  Please go back through and read the links of the information I have already provided.  This will help you to make an informed decision.

[Paxilated]

Thank you for your concern and advice.

 

I will move up to a 25% reduction and keep at it for a while now.

 

The only challenge I foresee is the precise splitting of the pill. I have a pill cutter, but cutting into quarter will be challenging.

 

And liquid paroxetine is not available in this market.

 

Will keep everyone updated. 

 

Cheers.

[ChessieCat]

I'm pleased to hear that you have decided to make your reduction smaller.

 

You can make your own liquid from tablets. This is from Post #1 of the Tips for Tapering Paxil topic:

 

On 5/27/2011 at 10:52 AM, Altostrata said:

 

Make your own liquid
You can make your own liquid with water. See How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

 

 

Edited February 26, 2019 by ChessieCat

[Paxilated]

Hi ChessieCat,

 

So I did 15 g today.

 

Can you tell me when abouts should I expect withdrawals (if any) to start kicking in so I'm better prepared?

 

I'm also taking Magnesium, multivitamins, and Vitamin D daily. And I'm on a low-carb diet. AND I've started a new job.

 

So, a bunch of things happening here.

 

I'm grateful for this support.

 

Cheers.

[ChessieCat]

Hopefully if you do get withdrawal symptoms it will only be mild discomfort.  Everyone is different.  Some people notice a dose reduction within the first couple of days, others find that it can take up to 3 weeks.  There is no way to know if or when they will happen.

[Carmie]

Hi Paxilated, 

 

I just saw that you are taking multivitamins and wanted to let you know that vitamin B may be too activating for our systems when we are going through withdrawals. 

 

Wishing you all the best with your tapering💚

[Paxilated]

Hello all,

 

Just wanted to report that so far the tapering has been okay, albeit some increased fidgeting.

 

I'm wondering if exercise will help stabilize the effects of the tapering?

[ChessieCat]

Like anything during tapering, caution and moderation are suggested.  Start small and build up.

 

exercise-do-more-do-less-do-nothing-what-worked-for-you

 

[Paxilated]

Hello,

 

I'm dropping down to 10mg starting today. 

 

I know it is a bit quick, but the 5 mg drop was well-tolerated, giving me hope.

 

Also, I was getting too worried about my Paxil-supplemented obesity as well. 

 

Now, I'm at 10mg Seroxat (Paxil).

 

Here goes.

 

Love,

 

Paxilated

[Carmie]

Hi Paxilated, 

 

Please don’t do another drop today. Your last taper was on the 26th of February, is that correct? It’s only been thirteen days if that’s the case. You really need to hold for at least a month. 

 

Sometimes symptoms don’t show up straight away, but they can hit later. It had happen to me, I didn’t hold long enough and then it took me months to stabilise. Please give it another two weeks at least before you do the next taper. 

 

Also, it’s best to taper by no more than 10% each time. 

 

Take care💚

[Paxilated]

Thanks Carmie,

 

I'm holding it off for another month then.

 

Appreciate the support!

 

Paxilated

[Paxilated]

Hello - I was wondering something as part of my taper: do we ever worry about running into the same problems as before we started on the antidepressants? 

 

I mean Paxil did help with some of my problematic symptoms, but then its own side effects became more worrisome.

 

So, now, are we ready to live without medication, and is that the goal?

 

If so, how do we plan to cope in other, drug-free ways?

 

Thanks,

 

Paxilated

[ChessieCat]

Quote

ADMIN NOTE Nobody on this site thinks any disorders magically go away by going off psychiatric drugs. If you think the drugs are controlling certain symptoms, you will need to take responsibility for learning to manage those symptoms without drugs.

 

Taking responsibility for your own health and behavior is key to going off psychiatric drugs. If you cannot do that, and the symptoms are hampering your life, perhaps going off drugs is not for you.

 

If you have a tendency towards obsessive anxiety about your health, no amount of reassurance from others here will have an effect on it. You must do the work yourself.

 

Cognitive Behavior Therapy (CBT), Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT), other types of talk therapy, and meditation are non-drug ways to manage habits of obsessive thinking. People also find their own effective self-treatments, such as taking up various sports or hobbies.

 

SurvivingAntidepressants.org is not a general mental health support site. If you wish to talk about your obsessive preoccupations, you may wish to visit http://www.depressionforums.org/or other general mental health support sites, and post on SurvivingAntidepressants.org only when you have questions about tapering.

 

 

 

During any taper, there may be times of discomfort.  We strongly encourage members to learn and use non drug coping techniques to help get through tough times.

 

Understanding what is happening helps us to not get caught up with the second fear, or fear of the fear.  This happens when we experience sensations in our body and because we don't understand them we are scared of them and then start to panic.

 

This document has a diagram of the body explaining what happens in the body when we become anxious:

 

https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/docs/AnxietySelfHelp.pdf

 

Anxiety Stuff - all kinds of stuff about anxiety attacks and things that help ...

 

Audio FEMALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Audio MALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

dealing-with-emotional-spirals

 

Dr Claire Weekes suffered from anxiety and learned and taught ways of coping.  There are videos available on YouTube.

 

Claire Weekes' Method of Recovering from a Sensitized Nervous System

 

Audio:  How to Recover from Anxiety - Dr Claire Weekes

 

CBT Course:  An Introductory Self-Help Course in Cognitive Behaviour Therapy

 

Resources:  Centre for Clinical Interventions (PDF modules that you can work through, eg:  Depression, Distress Intolerance, Health Anxiety, Low Self-Esteem, Panic Attacks, Perfectionism, Procrastination, Social Anxiety, Worrying)

 

On 4/28/2017 at 4:03 AM, brassmonkey said:

 

AAF: Acknowledge, Accept, Float.  It's what you have to do when nothing else works, and can be a very powerful tool in coping with anxiety.  The neuroemotional anxiety many of us feel during WD is directly caused by the drugs and their chemical reactions in the brain.  Making it so there is nothing we can do about them.  They won't respond to other drugs, relaxation techniques and the like.  They do, however, react very well to being ignored.  That's the concept behind AAF.  Acknowledge, get to know the feeling involved, explore them.  Accept, These feelings are a part of you and they aren't going anywhere fast. Float, let the feeling float off as you get on with your life as best as you can.  It's a well documented fact that the more you feed in to anxiety the worse it gets.  What starts as generalized neuroemotinal anxiety can be easily blown into a full fledged panic attack just by thinking about it.

 

I often liken it to an unwanted house guest.  At first you talk to them, have conversations, communicate with them.  After a while you figure out that they aren't leaving and there is nothing you can do to get rid of them.  So you go on about your day, working around them until they get bored and leave.

 

It can take some practice, but AAF really does work.  I hope you give it a try.

 

 

[Paxilated]

Hello All,

 

This is to report that my last drop from 20 mg to 15 mg was reasonably comfortable. I had vivid dreams initially, which lasted for about a week. 

 

Now, I've moved on to 10 mg after feeling stable at 15 mg. Right away, the vivid dreams returned. Other than that, I'm not feeling much else. Though I have noticed certain anxiety symptoms returning, but nothing severe. 

 

So far, so good!

[coldturkmama]

You know, you can be hit with major withdrawal weeks later. Please be careful!

[Gridley]

Just now, coldturkmama said:

You know, you can be hit with major withdrawal weeks later. Please be careful!

 

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

You are tapering much faster than we recommend.  It is especially important to taper slowly at lower doses.

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

[coldturkmama]

19 hours ago, Gridley said:

 

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

You are tapering much faster than we recommend.  It is especially important to taper slowly at lower doses.

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

Me? Personally I didn’t know any better and I cold turkeyed. I have lived through terrible protracted withdrawal that didn’t hit me for weeks after being off the drug. I just wanted to warn them not to make the same mistake.

[Gridley]

Coldturkmama,

 

I was picking up on your advice to Paxillated.  The comment was addressed to Paxillated.

 

Thanks.

 

Gridley

[Gridley]

On 4/1/2019 at 3:04 AM, Paxilated said:

Now, I've moved on to 10 mg after feeling stable at 15 mg.

Paxillated,

 

I wanted to make sure you saw my earlier post to you about delayed withdrawal and your taper rate.  Here it is:

 

 

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

You are tapering much faster than we recommend.  It is especially important to taper slowly at lower doses.

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

Edited April 2, 2019 by Gridley