Arte: About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

[Arte]

I have stopped Zoloft on November the 15th, after having reduced my dose of 50mg by a half during 5 days (I took 25mg), but I still experience pain since, and I feel confused all the time. 

I didn't reinstate the medication before because I was absolutely disgusted by it (I was forced to take it during 8 months at 15 years old) and didn't want to think to it *at all*. 

Two months after the withdrawal, I am in a bad state, probably due to the SSRI... what are your advices ? Could I still recover from the lethal product ? 

I planed to reinstate Zoloft on January the 25th, because it would allow me to take the thing about 2 weeks and a half, to recover during 2 weeks and then to complete my exams. Those aren't really important so it wouldn't be fatal to me to fail them, but I originally imagine this strategy to avoid being paralyzed during a too long time. 

It will be hard for me to live with the antidepressant after what it did to me... I am ready to make efforts to get back the capacities that allowed me to always be the first. 

My unique condition is the recovery before 1 year. 

Thank you. I already love this forum's principle and would absolutely be happy if I could recover from Zoloft. 

 

P.S. As implied : the faster you answer, the greater it is to me. 

[Arte]

Hi, 

 

Here is my case :

 

I have stopped Zoloft on November the 15th, after having reduced my dose of 50mg by a half during 5 days (I took 25mg), but I still experience pain since, and I feel confused all the time. 

I didn't reinstate the medication before because I was absolutely disgusted by it (I was forced to take it during 8 months at 15 years old) and didn't want to think to it *at all*. 

Two months after the withdrawal, I am in a bad state, probably due to the SSRI... what are your advices ? Could I still recover from the lethal product ? 

I planed to reinstate Zoloft on January the 25th, because it would allow me to take the thing about 2 weeks and a half, to recover during 2 weeks and then to complete my exams. Those aren't really important so it wouldn't be fatal to me to fail them, but I originally imagined this strategy to avoid being paralyzed during a too long time. 

It will be hard for me to live with the antidepressant after what it did to me... I am ready to make efforts to get back the capacities that allowed me to always be the first everywhere. 

My unique condition is the recovery before 1 year. 

Thank you. I already love this forum's principle and would absolutely be happy if I could recover from Zoloft. 

 

P.S. As implied : the faster you answer, the greater it is to me.

Edited January 25, 2020 by manymoretodays
added name to title, moved from S and S

[Arte]

I forgot to precise that the symptom because of which I feel desesperate is definitively the brain fog, maybe induced in part by my terrible memory loss, and my extreme intellectual fatigability... 

help me

[manymoretodays]

Hi Arte,

And welcome aboard.  We do our best to get to everyone, as soon as we can after arrival.

And I think I've got all your posts consolidated here now.

 

I know you state feeling desperate, and I will go ahead and flag your case so that, hopefully, another moderator can also get to you as soon as possible.  It does sound like you are suffering from WD(withdrawal) syndrome now. 

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

Do you have any Zoloft/sertraline available now?  And keep in mind that the reinstatements we recommend are generally much lower than, say......the last dose you were on.  We have you start very low, so that you can see if you are sensitized to your past drug.  Take a look at the first post there please. 

 

And try not to panic right now.  I know it's tough and the WD symptoms can be quite severe, just do your best to stay as calm as possible right now.

 

Tips for tapering off Zoloft(sertraline)

^ you'll find more information on how to get a low dosage from the available types of Zoloft here.

 

If I were you, I might try reinstating with just 1  mg now. 

Keep notes.  Keep us updated.  And stay put with the effort for at least 4 days, if not 7.  It might mitigate some of your symptoms.....lessen them a bit, however, it's unlikely to completely get you back to baseline.

Ultimately, it's up to you, the decision, once you feel like you can understand the information here.

 

Arte, yes, you will recover Arte.......most of us do, with time, patience, faith, and lot's of non-drug coping skills.

 

What is withdrawal syndrome?

Brain Remodelling

 

Dr.Glenmullen’s withdrawal symptom list.

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

When we take medications, the CNS (central nervous system) responds by making changes over the months and years we take the drug(s). When the medication is discontinued, the CNS has to undo all the changes it made.  The CNS likes stability. Rebuilding the neurotransmitter production and reactivating the receptor and transporter cells takes time -- during that rebuilding process symptoms occur.

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and omega 3 (fish oil).   Generally, it's best to only make one change at a time in anything now.  You might just try one or the other, start low, and go slow with the addition of anything now.

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker 

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

 

And okay, I need to run.  Committments today   Lot's of them.  Some fun though.

Welcome again Arte.  @Arte

 

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature.  Just follow the instructions in the link.  Very helpful to us.

 

 

 

Edited January 25, 2020 by manymoretodays

[manymoretodays]

And hey again.  I'm just moving your PM here to your introduction as well.

"Do you think that an extreme intellectual fatigability could be linked to the withdrawal, 2 months after I took Zoloft for the last time ? 

I have also a really bad memory now, and my concentration's difficulties make my life horrendous. I feel bad for all I lost, and can't accept it : I'm only 16 years old...

 

I planned to start again taking Zoloft to tapper off slower (last time, I went from 50 mg to 25 mg during 5 days, after a taking of 8 months, and abruptly stopped, which gaves me dizziness during more than 2 weeks). 

I saw some advices on the "reinstatement" and wanted to interact with other members to ask them what to do. 

Do you think that there is any risk to take a dose lower than 25 mg during some weeks ? "

 

Arte, I'm sorry, but I can't give you one on one, individual attention, 24/7.  As explained in my PM response.

 

Best, and oh boy.......I've got to run now.   Time flies.  Welcome aboard!

.....and Arte, do you have a parent or older adult who might come on and help you with some of this?

I'm not sure at the moment, of dealing with a minor........here in the U.S. a minor is someone under the age of 18.

Edited January 25, 2020 by manymoretodays

[Arte]

I guess this topic is public.

 

I take a lot of supplements (Griffonia, Rhodiola, Krill Oil, Cod Liver Oil), that I stopped taking 1 day ago because I planned to get back under the medication today, and wanted to avoid any interaction.

1mg/day seems to be very little... I don't understand how it could act, specially for a taking of 1 week. I'm waiting for other advices (I don't want to follow the instructions for a safe tappering off by the administrator, because I did not take Zoloft for a really long time, so months of reinstating would be too much).

So, I'm looking for some other advices which could help me fast.

 

I forgot : yes, I'm 16 years old but there isn't any risk to deal with me. I don't bite.

 

Thank you. 

[Altostrata]

Hello, Arte.

 

Yes, 1mg per day is very small, but you'd be surprised -- a lot of people find this is enough to remedy the withdrawal symptoms. You'd take it for a while, maybe a month or a few, until you feel "normal," then taper off by very small amounts later.

 

The liquid form enables taking this very small amount to start. If it helps just a little, that might make your symptoms tolerable. After about a week, you may want to increase it a little bit -- but you don't want to go too high, because that might be upsetting to your nervous system.

 

Please let us know how you're doing.

[Arte]

2 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

After about a week, you may want to increase it a little bit -- but you don't want to go too high, because that might be upsetting to

It is scary to realize how only 1/50 of the dose I took, and during 1 month, so 1/400, can affect the organism 😨

It makes me feel totally destroyed, and I don't know how I could totally get back to my previous state if the substance is so potent...

(I know, my message seems depressed but the question of my capacities is too important for me to feel correct when I think to it)

[Altostrata]

Yes, the drug is very strong, but your nervous system is designed to adapt. You just need to give it a little help, it's shocked at the removal of the drug.

[Arte]

19 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

upsetting

I know that I'm always asking the same questions, but looking at your experience : is it possible to fully recover from the drug, and to come back to *exactly* the same state as before, even when the taker is young ?

I'm looking for hope. 

[Altostrata]

You'll be fine. "Exactly" is impossible, time has passed. You're almost a year older. But you'll be over the effects of the drug.

 

A lot of people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

Try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

[manymoretodays]

7 hours ago, Arte said:

I forgot : yes, I'm 16 years old but there isn't any risk to deal with me. I don't bite.

 

Okay then.  Thanks Arte .

So sorry that you got put on AD's at such a young age. 

I agree with Alto.  I think you can expect a full recovery.

 

Thanks for doing your signature.

[Arte]

7 hours ago, Altostrata said:

You'll be fine. "Exactly" is impossible, time has passed. You're almost a year older. But you'll be over the effects of the drug

It isn't reassuring at all... my life is ruined... I can't find again what I am... 

[Erell]

Hi Arte

 

I'm sorry you're going through this. I've been put on AD at age of 15.

 

1 hour ago, Arte said:

It isn't reassuring at all... my life is ruined... I can't find again what I am... 

It is all the contrary dear Arte : you're Young, your nervous system knows how To heal and he Will.

I know how hard it is To believe this in the midst of it, but i'm confident for you: you're gonna have a long and beautiful life ,and one day all this Will only be a memory ❤

 

Your life is ahead you, and one day you'll thank your old self for going through this!

 

Hang on dear, read the Success Stories here, take care of yourself as much as you can.

 

Your life is not ruined, believe me 🤗

[Shep]

14 hours ago, Arte said:

I take a lot of supplements (Griffonia, Rhodiola, Krill Oil, Cod Liver Oil), that I stopped taking 1 day ago because I planned to get back under the medication today, and wanted to avoid any interaction.

 

Arte, when did you start taking Griffonia? Please note this is 5 HTP. You mention needing to avoid interactions, so you may have already come across this information. If not, please see:

 

5-HTP (5-hydroxytryptophan) and l-tryptophan

 

Please add your supplements to your signature with the days you were on them and the dose so we have a record of the timeline. 

 

Quote

Took Cyamemazine (neuroleptic) during 29 days at 15mg/day.

 

This is in your signature. Please also add the date you started and stopped. 

 

As others have noted, you will heal from this. You may want to check out some of the non-drug coping skills and see if anything looks good to you. Although it's hard to concentrate and feel joy in hobbies and other activities, it's important to find ways of letting your nervous system relax. Here are some ideas:

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

There's no reason to doubt you will heal. I was polydrugged starting at 17 and took these drugs for 30 years, but I'm off them now and recovering. There's no reason to think you won't recover, too. It's great you did your research and found us. 

 

After you update your signature to reflect when you started and stopped the supplements and when you were on cyamemazine, we can give you more advice. 

[Arte]

I updated my signature.

By the way, I have an appointment tomorrow with a new pratician, who can't force me to take anything because I finally succeeded to convince my parents to trust me now. I'm free of what I take.

[Shep]

4 minutes ago, Arte said:

By the way, I have an appointment tomorrow with a new pratician, who can't force me to take anything because I finally succeeded to convince my parents to trust me now.

 

Thanks for updating your signature. And well done on getting your point across to your parents. 

 

While I do understand wanting to be drug free, please note, if your symptoms are severe, reinstating a small amount of the antidepressant can help with withdrawal symptoms. And then you can do a very careful taper to come off. Manymoretodays mentioned reinstating at just 1 mg to start, which sounds like a very safe dose to start. 

 

 

16 hours ago, Arte said:

I don't understand how it could act, specially for a taking of 1 week. I'm waiting for other advices (I don't want to follow the instructions for a safe tappering off by the administrator, because I did not take Zoloft for a really long time, so months of reinstating would be too much).

 

All it takes is one month to become dependent on an antidepressant and you were on Zoloft for 8 months. If 1 mg of Zoloft can help you feel better, sounds like a good thing to do. If it doesn't work or makes you feel worse, you can stop. 

 

Please let us know if you wish to reinstate and if you have any questions after reading the links Manymoretodays posted here. 

[Shep]

15 hours ago, Altostrata said:

The liquid form enables taking this very small amount to start. If it helps just a little, that might make your symptoms tolerable. After about a week, you may want to increase it a little bit -- but you don't want to go too high, because that might be upsetting to your nervous system.

 

Arte, if you decide to reinstate, please note Alto's comment about getting a liquid prescription. Might be something to mention at your doctor's appointment tomorrow. 

 

[Arte]

14 hours ago, Altostrata said:

You'll be fine. "Exactly" is impossible, time has passed. You're almost a year older. But you'll be over the effects of the drug.

 

A lot of people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

Try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

In your opinion, what would be the minimum amount of time taking Zoloft, and what would be the dose associated, which can help me to come back to a good state, with the ressources to fully recover my intellectual capacities within a year ? 

[manymoretodays]

Oh Arte, hugs buddy. 

 

31 minutes ago, Arte said:

In your opinion, what would be the minimum amount of time taking Zoloft, and what would be the dose associated, which can help me to come back to a good state, with the ressources to fully recover my intellectual capacities within a year ? 

 

We don't really have any exact data like that, to offer you.

Reinstatement, and of a small amount, is the only medically known way to reduce withdrawal symptoms.  And I've recommended a really low dose to start, as we use a harm reduction approach to all this.  And sometimes, if reinstating too much.......ones system will react, due to sensitization. 

 

Many times just the low dose reinstatement is enough to take the edge off some of the symptoms of WD.

 

Minimum time of taking, and time of exact recovery of full intellectual capacities, is just impossible to predict, Arte.

 

To tell you exactly what to take that will get you exactly back to where you want to be, in an exact time frame.........is pretty impossible.  I mean do you follow my logic? 

 

Have you been able to read through some of the links yet? 

Especially focus on reading about What is withdrawal syndrome? 

This may be something that your doctor is unaware of.   And many doctors practice under an entirely different paradigm, or way of thinking and understanding.

 

It isn't that you need Zoloft now to fix something that was ever broken, or not functioning, or a diagnosis..........it's that a small amount may help relieve some of the symptoms of WD and the changes in your CNS/ANS that the Zoloft/sertraline made.  And give your system a chance to heal from the chemical onslaught that you had.

 

I hope that helps your understanding, even a little.  And that you might be saved from further reliance on drugs, as performance enhancers or something.  I mean the main stream society and medical can really promote the use of these types of drugs.  It's all so crazy sometimes.  You have got what it takes on your own.  You just need patience with yourself and your capabilities to heal and recover.  Confidence in this.  Faith.

 

That's my 2 cents.  I could not help it, but to respond.

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[Arte]

12 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

 

It isn't that you need Zoloft now to fix something that was ever broken, or not functioning, or a diagnosis..........it's that a small amount may help relieve some of the symptoms of WD and the changes in your CNS/ANS that the Zoloft/sertraline made.  And give your system a chance to heal from the chemical onslaught that you had.

 

You mean that what was broken can't be totally repaired 😨

The thing that bothers me is that I always asked my parents to get me out of this... my pratician threatened me to put me again in hospital, illegally. 

In my country, people can't be put in hospital while they are not a danger for themselves of other ones... I wasn't, and never showed anything else than sadness... 

But this isn't the main topic... please confirm that what you said is what I noticed. 

[manymoretodays]

Yes Arte.  Except..........I'm going on the assumption that you were never broken.  Most of us weren't broken.  Just going through life.

Nothing was broken.  Everything can be totally repaired. 

 

 And so you will be totally repaired!  Back to factory settings if you will.

 

I don't know if you were feeling down, or having pangs of that good old adolescent angst, when you got started on the sertraline.  I can only assume.  And okay......you felt sadness.  Oh my gosh.  We all feel sadness from time to time.

 

So I hope that confirms your baseline normality for you.

(and I hope my use of the English language translates okay for you, thanks for asking for clarification)

 

Best.

Edited January 26, 2020 by manymoretodays

[Arte]

Is the breaking you are talking about the "serotoninergic syndrom" ?

[Altostrata]

No, Arte, serotonin syndrome occurs when you take too much serotonergic drugs, not when you come off drugs.

 

You most likely are feeling withdrawal symptoms from tapering too fast. These can feel like major damage, but you'd be surprised what a little bit of sertraline can do. It allows you to "do over" the very last part of your taper.

 

I am sorry so many doctors do not know anything about tapering or withdrawal symptoms. That they may misinform you is a difficult realization for people a lot older than you, too.

[Arte]

1 minute ago, Altostrata said:

No, Arte, serotonin syndrome occurs when you take too much serotonergic drugs, not when you come off drugs.

I wasn't saying that I have been victim from a serotonin syndrom. I only asked "manymoretodays" if she was talking about it.

2 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

You most likely are feeling withdrawal symptoms from tapering too fast. These can feel like major damage

Good to hear again that an important inability linked to antidepressants isn't permanent ^^

[Altostrata]

See What is withdrawal syndrome?
 
About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms
 
The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

[Arte]

Hi, 

I was prescribed 25 mg of Zoloft today. My pratician told me to take the full dose during 1 week each day, the full dose 1/2 day during 1 week, and 1/3 day during 1 other. 

According to the doctor, my organism must be steeped by the treatment before I organize a withdrawal. 

I asked for the sirup, but it isn't sold in France. 

Do you think that cut the pill in 2 parts is safe ? 

Could it unbalance the excipient and, in this way, the action of the drug ? 

[Arte]

The doctor said he can't make a prescription for less because the effects aren't described with a lower dose than 25mg.

[Arte]

I'm asking myself always more questions... according to you, is it useful to take the pill if the problems described aren't physical at all, and only about the thinking ? 

[Shep]

11 hours ago, Arte said:

I'm asking myself always more questions... according to you, is it useful to take the pill if the problems described aren't physical at all, and only about the thinking ? 

 

Yes, reinstating can help with the mental symptoms, such as difficulty concentrating and remembering things. 

 

On 1/27/2020 at 5:30 AM, Arte said:

I was prescribed 25 mg of Zoloft today. My pratician told me to take the full dose during 1 week each day, the full dose 1/2 day during 1 week, and 1/3 day during 1 other. 

According to the doctor, my organism must be steeped by the treatment before I organize a withdrawal. 

 

Please note this is too large a reinstatement dose. The recommended reinstatement dose is 1 mg to start. 

 

Because your nervous system is destabilized, too high a dose will likely make you very agitated and cause insomnia, as well as other symptoms. Start with a low dose to see how you do. You can always increase. 

 

On 1/27/2020 at 5:30 AM, Arte said:

I asked for the sirup, but it isn't sold in France. 

 

That's okay. You can make your own liquid. Please see:

 

"How To Make Liquid from Tablets or Capsules"

 

That post contains a video that may be helpful. You may also want to go on YouTube and search for "liquid titration" videos in French to see if there's one in your native language. 

 

Please post if you have questions about the math or getting any of the supplies. 

 

Another option is to use a compounding pharmacy. Please see:

 

Getting custom dosages at compounding pharmacies (US, UK, Canada, and elsewhere)

 

 

 

[Arte]

I took about 4 mg this morning... I hope it is not too much... 

I envisage to take 3 mg tomorrow. 

What do you think about that ? 

[pinciukas]

1 hour ago, Arte said:

I took about 4 mg this morning... I hope it is not too much... 

I envisage to take 3 mg tomorrow. 

What do you think about that ? 

You will see in a few days. I did first time SSRI reinstatement 1.5 mg was helpful but still not enough then upped 2 mg more and I am now ok stabile can sleep and don't have anxiety. But first week was difficult I had more anxiety and difficult to sleep. After 9 days my sleep improved a lot I sleep now 9 hours without waking up.

[Arte]

4 mg have a too potent action for me. I will take 3 mg tomorrow and 2 mg the next day, and try to stay with this dose for 1 week...

 

I guess the results of my test show that the 50mg/day I took for 8 months were obviously too much ?

[Arte]

Isn't the reinstatement supposed to be pleasant for the organism by relieving him ?

I feel bad since the time I took the pill. I can't stay sitten down, and isn't able to concentrate.

Is it a normal symptom, or could it show that I don't need the reinstatement ?

 

Thank you... I need help

[manymoretodays]

Arte,

It may just be that you reinstated a bit too much. 

About reinstating and stabilizing

^ especially the first post, get familiar with

Are We There Yet? How Long is withdrawal going to take?

# 5 and 9 may give you some more insight as well

 

9 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Yes, reinstating can help with the mental symptoms, such as difficulty concentrating and remembering things. 

 

 

Please note this is too large a reinstatement dose. The recommended reinstatement dose is 1 mg to start. 

 

Because your nervous system is destabilized, too high a dose will likely make you very agitated and cause insomnia, as well as other symptoms. Start with a low dose to see how you do. You can always increase. 

 

 

That's okay. You can make your own liquid. Please see:

 

"How To Make Liquid from Tablets or Capsules"

 

That post contains a video that may be helpful. You may also want to go on YouTube and search for "liquid titration" videos in French to see if there's one in your native language. 

 

Please post if you have questions about the math or getting any of the supplies. 

 

Another option is to use a compounding pharmacy. Please see:

 

Getting custom dosages at compounding pharmacies (US, UK, Canada, and elsewhere)

 

 

 

 

And in answer to your last question? 

17 minutes ago, Arte said:

Isn't the reinstatement supposed to be pleasant for the organism by relieving him ?

I feel bad since the time I took the pill. I can't stay sitten down, and isn't able to concentrate.

Is it a normal symptom, or could it show that I don't need the reinstatement ?

 

Thank you... I need help

 

It doesn't all happen immediately.......the relieve or relief.  Best to get a lower dose in next try, the 1 mg suggested, and then take it at the same time of day, same dose, for up to a week.  And then just stay put with it.  Yes, it could be a very normal symptom. 

 

Are your symptoms notably worse than they were before you reinstated one dose of 4 mg? 

 

This might take some time to settle is all.  If it takes you some time to get to the point where you have the equipment to do a lower dose now, that is okay.  If when you try the 1mg dose, same dose, same time of day.......you continue to feel over activated, then, at that point.......if it were me, I might cease the reinstatement trial altogether.  It's covered in the first post in the reinstatement topic.

 

Rooting or cheering you on now Arte,

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

Edited January 28, 2020 by manymoretodays
spelling, spacing, clarity

[Arte]

14 hours ago, manymoretodays said:

 

And would 8 days at 1mg be sufficient ?