hopehope: in desperate need of advice

[hopehope]

Thanks for all answers.

 

I want to taper

 

The only question is:

 

Why did I have daily reductions in Overall total awareness for over 600 days now? Not daily reduced awareness that stays Same but walking up with Like 5% less every day for 600+ days? How is this biochemically possible(or rather Impossible If you ask me)? And how is this supposed to somehow reverse and Go Info the other Direction?

 

That is the only thing I care about.

[Shep]

18 hours ago, hopehope said:

Why did I have daily reductions in Overall total awareness for over 600 days now? Not daily reduced awareness that stays Same but walking up with Like 5% less every day for 600+ days? How is this biochemically possible(or rather Impossible If you ask me)? And how is this supposed to somehow reverse and Go Info the other Direction?

 

That is the only thing I care about.

 

The only way we know to reverse it is to taper. If all you care about is getting an answer to your question, you're likely to spend the rest of your life on this drug.  It's likely your perception of your symptom pattern is skewed because you're under the influence of a large dose of one of the most potent benzos out there. I can't imagine not being affected by going from 1 mg Klonopin to 8 mg when it comes to cognitive skills and processing. The dangers of cognitive decline with even moderate doses is well known. 

 

Benzodiazepine use may raise risk of Alzheimer’s disease

 

If you wish to taper, we can guide you in coming off. But if all you wish to do is repeatedly ask the same question, you'll need to go to a site that's for people who wish to take these drugs (like depressionforums.org  or patientslikeme.com). 

[Altostrata]

You have been taking too much Klonopin for a long time. Over time, the adverse effect gets worse.

 

We have discussed this many times. There is no point in continuing to discuss it. Please let us know if you want help tapering. If you don't want to taper, please talk to your doctor about the effects of Klonopin, we can't help you here.

[ChessieCat]

From https://www.drugs.com/sfx/klonopin-side-effects.html

 

Common side effects:

• Body aches or pain
• chills
• cough
• difficulty breathing
• discouragement
• dizziness
• ear congestion
• feeling sad or empty
• fever
• headache
• irritability
• lack of appetite
• loss of interest or pleasure
• loss of voice
• nasal congestion
• poor coordination
• runny nose
• shakiness and unsteady walk
• sleepiness or unusual drowsiness
• sneezing
• sore throat
• tiredness
• trouble concentrating
• trouble sleeping
• unsteadiness, trembling, or other problems with muscle control or coordination
• unusual tiredness or weakness

[hopehope]

Thank you.

 

1. Started taper from 8mg k to 7,5mg on monday 13th and reinstated Back 6 days later to 8mg because mania, enormous overstimulation and inability to get any rest at all.

 

2. I know the benzo sx but 600 days of daily reduction of space is Impossible and has nothing to do with my cog. function as ppl percieve me Well spoken in a 1 to 1 Setting. And Nobody ob the benzo forums can relate to my situation

 

3. My Challenge is to decipher whether I have still the adverse/wd from my short course of ad in sept 2017 and the 30 day No sleep adverse from the antipsychotic because the Not sleeping Not resting Not sleeping & No drifting sensation caused the continual Dr/reduction in mental space

 

4. I constantly think that having ad/so adverse withdrawal added onto the K withdrawal just is Not managable because they throw my cns further Off Balance though I def. want to taper off at some Point. And the daily mental space reduction started while I was still on 0.5mg equiv of k somewhere around octobre, the other sx don't bother me much

 

5. I am totally confused as to how to proceed because I feel I add wd/adverse from ad/ap that is hitting 3 years next month is colliding and adding further stress to the System by tapering the K.

 

To summarize how I percieve my brain Situation is Like this:

 

-I feel as though the cognitive battery I used up in one day is Not being recharged and I ended Up day by day with LEss for 600- days. I Unserstand a slow decline but this is just bizzare 

 

-I feel as though my epi/norepi receptors get constantly downregulated because compared to the First year of massive massive adrenaline/norepi waves and second year it feels like my Body still wants to Pump Out those stress hormones but it Just can't do it anymore so I feel Sort of asleep in my waking state wheareas before I would feel Like I was of 10 cups of caffeine but my Body could handle it.

 

Please help me how to Further proceed.

 

Thanks

 

[Shep]

11 hours ago, hopehope said:

Please help me how to Further proceed.

 

 

You may want to do a taper using the Brassmonkey Slide method. This will allow you to make much smaller reductions at a time. 

 

The Brassmonkey Slide Method of Micro-tapering

 

For a 10% total monthly reduction: 

 

            Week 1 reduce 2.5%

            Week 2 reduce an additional 2.5% (for a total of 5%)

            Week 3 reduce an additional 2.5% (for a total of 7.5%)

            Week 4 reduce an additional 2.5% (for a total of 10%)

            Weeks 5 and 6 Hold at the last reduction level

 

Or you could reduce by just 5% per month: 

 

 

            Week 1 reduce 1.25%

            Week 2 reduce an additional 1.25% (for a total of 2.5%)

            Week 3 reduce an additional 1.25% (for a total of 3.75%)

            Week 4 reduce an additional 1.25% (for a total of 5%)

            Weeks 5 and 6 Hold at the last reduction level

 

[hopehope]

Thank you but that did not really adress the issues I mentioned.

[Shep]

Hope, if you feel your symptoms are more related to AD withdrawal, you could hold the benzo at 8 mg for a bit longer.

 

However, you are likely suffering from side effects from being on a very dangerous amount of Klonopin. It's your choice whether or not to taper at this time. 

 

We've given you all the information we can. If it's not the advice you wish to take, please work with another forum or with your doctor. We've given you the best information we can. 

[hopehope]

On 9/25/2020 at 1:21 PM, Shep said:

Hope, if you feel your symptoms are more related to AD withdrawal, you could hold the benzo at 8 mg for a bit longer.

 

However, you are likely suffering from side effects from being on a very dangerous amount of Klonopin. It's your choice whether or not to taper at this time. 

 

We've given you all the information we can. If it's not the advice you wish to take, please work with another forum or with your doctor. We've given you the best information we can. 

 

Why is it an "extremely dangerous" amount?

 

Thanks

[Shep]

Very few people come onto this site on more than 2 mg of Klonopin. Klonopin is 20 times more potent than Valium, so 8 mg of Klonopin equals 160 mg Valium. This is a high dose. 

[hopehope]

I was trying from 8mg to 7,5mg...

 

Want to try from 8 to 7,75mg...

 

You shep, at the start of the post told me I will be fine it is just the high dose of benzos even though it started with an equiv of 0,5mg...

 

I went on the depersonalization forum and found a guy with similar symptoms, he just smoked weed once and had a few panic attacks... so something is wrong..

 

"

I have finally been able to summarize what my dpdr is, and now would like help if any of you know any leads. Basically, 15 months ago I had a panic attack on weed and I woke up the next morning in an altered state of consciousness. This panic attack happened while I was really drunk also, and lasted for hours with significant breathing problems throughout.  This altered state of consciousness has gotten slowly worse over the past 15 months, to the point where I am for all intents and purposes dead. I am not exaggerating when I say this. I have experienced depression before, but nothing even comes close to the physical chronic deadness I now experience. The interesting thing is how it makes jumps and then never returns to the previous state--it is chronic. These jumps so to say usually happen at night during a panic attack type moment, but never a full panic attack. I relate it most to an aura in a seizure as it feels like my brain gets scrambled, but besides that I don't know what is happening. Once they happen, boom, I am permanently more disconnected.

 

Anyways, the way I would describe my changed "consciousness" or "perception" is that of something very neurological. I've done inpatient treatment twice, therapy, healthy lifestyle choices, you name it, but I never felt like I was correctly addressing the problem. See, the problem with my "disassociation" is that I don't really relate it to most stories here, save for the fact that a night of weed made it all happen. For me, my dissociation primarily exists as a lack of ability to feel connection to my sense of "self." Each time it gets permanently worse, I am more miserable and less capable of reaping enjoyment from anything or even having thoughts that I can entertain.

 

This is where I say it gets very meta because instead of traditional anhedonia, its like the very basic neural network of pleasure gets destroyed. Its like the ability to even have the neurological basis for some sort of dopamine activity breaks down. This, is where I came up with the idea that my dissociation is a chemical illusion. Each time I get worse, my brain is less capable of experiencing any sort of pleasure or anything. My conclusion is that part of the sense of self is derived from an ability to reap a reaction (or have your own brain focus on the chemical reaction) from stimuli, both internally and externally. The sense of "self" resides in the ability to feel pleasure (for lack of a better word) because if you aren't having any sort of chemical reaction to anything, there is no basis to form your sense of self. This is why, for instance, I no longer feel any emotional attachment to music I once cherished. Since I don't have any dopamine in the first place, I can no longer have a connection to the music, which gives the illusion that my sense of self no longer exists. I know I did not explain this well, so if it needs clarification, fire away."

 

 

 

 

 

 

Basically I am at 8mg of KLONOPIN I want to go to 7,75 but I am reducing 20 or 30 times already... anytime I encounter symptoms I notice my consciousness dropped further and my dopamine levels dropped further....  and that keeps me from doing it.... Because maybe the meds other meds are still causing it.... I just turned 28 abt. 2 weeks ago...

 

I was still very grounded just 6 months ago but now I can do anything and it's like I am not awake anymore. I can not wake myself up... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[hopehope]

On 9/28/2020 at 6:56 PM, Shep said:

Very few people come onto this site on more than 2 mg of Klonopin. Klonopin is 20 times more potent than Valium, so 8 mg of Klonopin equals 160 mg Valium. This is a high dose. 

 

I've seen people on BB on 13mg K, I understand they are not me but none of them has what I am experiencing.

 

I want to be off meds and live just a life where I am at least a little burned out the way I was before...

[hopehope]

Please help me Out, I can't think outside the Box I feel Nobody experienced this before...

 

On benzobuddies I get this:

 

This sounds like something an expert would need to address. Maybe a really good psychiatrist or neurologist. But, I think if I was on 8mg of klonipin, I would be feeling a fair amount of disconnectedness just from the benzo. Xanax always made me feel that way, even on a much smaller dose than that. Withdrawals also cause feelings of unreality but nothing to the extent of what you are talking about. I may 'feel' as though I'm disconnected but I can still make myself connect when I need to. I hope you find some answers. 

 

 

 

So what am I to do even?

 

 

Edited November 18, 2020 by ChessieCat
reformatted text

[Shep]

On 11/11/2020 at 12:18 PM, hopehope said:

Want to try from 8 to 7,75mg...

 

This is a reasonable reduction, Hopehope. Let us know how you do. 

 

[hopehope]

Thanks, this is all you can say?

[Shep]

On 11/13/2020 at 6:10 AM, hopehope said:

Thanks, this is all you can say?

 

Please post any questions you have about your taper. 

[hopehope]

On 11/15/2020 at 11:21 PM, Shep said:

 

Please post any questions you have about your taper. 

 

Even going from 8 to 7,75mg caused signifikant symproms

[Shep]

On 11/17/2020 at 7:50 PM, hopehope said:

Even going from 8 to 7,75mg caused signifikant symproms

 

That's a 3.125% reduction, which is a very reasonable micro-taper. But still being on that high of a dose, you may be getting hit with some difficult side effects, in addition to withdrawal. So that complicates your taper. 

 

You'll have to find ways of managing both withdrawal symptoms and side effects if you wish to come off this drug. 

 

You've dug yourself into quite a hole with these drugs. Unfortunately, there's no easy way out of this. 

 

Are you spacing these drugs out evenly throughout the day to prevent any inter-dose withdrawal? Klonopin has an 18 - 50 hour half-life, so depending on how fast you metabolize it and how often you take it, some of your symptoms could be interdose withdrawal. 

 

Please post the time(s) of the day when you're taking Klonopin if you wish to have more feedback. 

 

 

[hopehope]

12:45 PM 5:45pm and 11:45 pm are Times I Take my dosages.

I go to bed at 2-4 am and wake Up 12-1 am/pm

 

Thanks 

 

Still at 8mg.

 

Just reduced dosage Back to 7,75mg

 

Still having Had further reductions/collapsing Sensory perception.

 

Might I bei the only individual who experiences some weird toxic reactions even though the drug itself Works?

 

I don't know.

 

Thank you very much for your Help.

 

[hopehope]

I'm on day 6 of 8mg to 7,75mg reduction.

 

I feel very Overstimulated, I don't calm down after I eat Something.

 

My nervous system is Just on all the time.

 

Is this supposed to Stabilize where I feel the same on 8mg as I feel on 7,75mg? 

 

Or am I going to be Overstimulated for the Rest of my Taper?

 

During my 20 Times of trying to reduce I never got to a comfortable Level after day 7.

 

Symptoms begin at day 3.

 

Most important question is in Caps.

 

Thanks

[hopehope]

On 4/13/2021 at 5:15 PM, hopehope said:

I'm on day 6 of 8mg to 7,75mg reduction.

 

I feel very Overstimulated, I don't calm down after I eat Something.

 

My nervous system is Just on all the time.

 

Is this supposed to Stabilize where I feel the same on 8mg as I feel on 7,75mg? 

 

Or am I going to be Overstimulated for the Rest of my Taper?

 

During my 20 Times of trying to reduce I never got to a comfortable Level after day 7.

 

Symptoms begin at day 3.

 

Most important question is in Caps.

 

Thanks

Wishing for answers. Back to 8mg. Thank you.

[hopehope]

Thanks for the help