TomB: Success recovery from Amisulpride after 15 years of heavy using

[TomB]

Original full topic title before shortening:  Success recovery from Amisulpride after 15 years of heavy using (i think it can relate to any drug)

 

Hello,

 

I was poisoned with this chemistry for over 15 years but i belive i finally recovered.
Currently i'm not taking it for a few days in a row and feeling pretty good (not awesome yet - but good).

This is how i approached it - step by step:

First part:
1. Firstly i googled how this medicine really works (it turns out that it is acting on dopamine D2 and D3 receptors) - so i googled how to recover those receptors and found a list of sumplements:
https://www.theoptimizingblog.com/repair-dopamine-receptors/ - then i bought all those supplements and started taking them (still with amisulpride).

2. I've also discovered that amisulpride is bloking 5-ht receptor - so i started to suplement also 5-HTP (just a few days) - at the start it was very heavy to bare.

3. I continued taking all the above suplements but still taking amisulpride and slowely tapping it of.

4. I've also started to raise legs over my head (like for example against the wall - to get more oxygene to my brain) whenever i started to feeling anxious or depressed.

Second part (i switched it to second part - cause i think it's the most important and it really changed everything for me):

1. I switched my diet to KETO (you can google) and it really did immidiet wonder - i just stoped taking amisulpride for good - just like that. I'm still feeling a little off the track - but it's bearable.

Here is my thoughts why it worked so fast with KETO. 
When you're switching to KETO diet your body is not producing energy from carbohydrates and slowly starting to get it from fats - but this transition is taking a while and at the start of the KETO you are just depleted of any fuel (so your brain also got no fuel untill ketons are absorbed). I'm still during the transition and i feel that my brain is switched completly off... (i can't focus and think clearly) but - negative symptoms of withdrawal are also gone.

I'll update you how things are going when my body starts consuming ketons. Cause right now my head is pretty foggy.

2. Last step was withdrawing 5-HTP cause it was to much "high" on serotonin for me and i'm continuing taking suplements for dopamine receptors. I feel much less agitated and calm and my sleep greatly improved (even if i can't sleep to much for now).

I hope this tips will help someone - cause i know how heavy is to withdraw those poisonous drugs.
Wish me luck and good luck to you on this most heavy journey of our lifes

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by ChessieCat
Topic moved from Success Story forum and added full topic title before condensing

[Onmyway]

Dear @TomB, 

welcome to SA. It is great that you are taking charge of your healing and thank you for sharing with us. I worry, however, that you have stopped your medicine abruptly, without tapering and we have no evidence that diet changes protect from withdrawal symptoms. It is possible that you will get withdrawal symptoms even with the supplements that you take. It is also possible that after stopping the medicine you become sensitive to these supplements. I would like to encourage you to reinstate and taper very slowly, instead. It is up to you what you decide to do but here at SA we recommend tapering your psychotropic medicine by lowering your dose by no more than 10% of your previous dose every 4 weeks. Here are the reasons why: 

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage? - Tapering - Surviving Antidepressants

Why taper? SERT transporter occupancy studies show importance of gradual change in plasma concentration - Tapering - Surviving Antidepressants

 

Can you tell us your drug history in a drug signature? This will help us advise you better in the future. 

How to List Drug History in Signature - Introductions and updates - Surviving Antidepressants

 

Wishing you good luck in your healing, 
OMW

[TomB]

Hello @Onmyway,

Thank you for sharing this - of course you where right.
My symptoms of withdrawal kicked back to me - so i returned to 150mg dossage and now i'll try tappering down.

I'm still trying to mantain KETO and taking suplements.

[ChessieCat]

Hi TomB,

 

Q:  Are you currently taking any supplements?

 

If yes, please post telling us what they are and what doses you are taking.

[TomB]

Hi - yes - i'm taking quite a lot:
Purslane - 400mg/day
Acetyl L-Carnitine - 2000mg/day
Choline - 500mg
Coleus Forskohlii - 400mg/day
Kordyceps - 700mg/day
Creatine - 3500 mg/day
Uridine - 50mg/day

I'm also taking 
Bromocriptine - 2,5 - 5mg/day (to lower my prolactine levels).
Before my prolactine levels was sky rocketing to the roofs - cause not a single doctor informed me of this.
So i needed to pursuade doctor to sell me this. And it's getting back to normal - but still got woman-like breasts  Thank god they don't lactate anymore...

[TomB]

I just wanna make an update cause i discovered something really strange.

As i told before - i was doing research on 'amisulpride' and thing is - it getting down your dopamine levels (that's why it's rising your prolactine levels cause dopamine is an antagonist of prolactine).
It doesn't make any sense - because when i'm taking amisulpride with bromocriptine (which is rising dopamine levels and getting prolactine down) - i don't have any withdrawal effects.

So i've got another theory - that you can somehow beat effects of dopamine blocking meds with bromocriptine
I feel really elevated right now - like there is a little struggle in my brain between those chemicals.

But i'll continue to take bromocriptine and tapping amisulpride in same time - cause i never try that - i was quiting bromocriptine when stoping using amisulpride.

[ChessieCat]

It is generally better to only make one change at a time.  That way if there is any change, worsening or improvement, then you might be able to attribute it to the one change you made.  If other things have changed at the same time then it makes it very difficult to know the cause and sometimes it is impossible.

[TomB]

Ok - i've done more research on amisulpride effects and here is what i found.

According to wikipedia article it's an antagonist od D3, D2 (dopamine receptors) and also serotonine receptors.
I've also searched about what is caused by low serotonin and dopamine in our brain and here is what i found:
Low dopamine and serotonin levels leads to:
- depression,
- anxiety,
- schizophrenia,
- alzheimers,
- parkinson,
- insomnia,
- iritation,
- etc.

And even worse stuff - so - this medication is not curing anything - its just worsen the symptoms.
Maybe if you took just one or two dossage it will reset you'r dopamine and serotonine levels (but that's just my speculations).

Lately i forgot if i took the dossage - so i took second dossage.
It immidietly lead me to feel iritated, pissed off, angry (i've started screaming, swearing and felt really really pissed off with no reason at all) etc.

So to counter attack those sympthoms i've took second dosage of: bromocriptine (to raise my dopamine) and also 5-HTP (to raise my serotonin).
I've forgot that bromocriptine is raising serotonin levels also - so short time after taking those two i was shoot out to the sky (probably my levels of dopamine and serotonine was skyrocketing so i couldn't focus and bare it).
I've also felt that world is getting better - everything is beautifull and great - but not so long after that it started to be eaven to heavy to bare.
I've even thought i was going away from this world. But somehow i feel asleep and i slept very very well.

So here is my final observation:
as far as amisulpride is lowering your dopamine and serotonine levels (to the point that you cant get anything pleasurable from life) - you becoming even more and more addicted to everything - cause you're body is trying to raise those things in some way. With 15 years of taking amisulpride i was: smoking cigarettes in vast amount, using casual and even payed sex in heavy ammounts, consuming junk foods, drinking a lot of sugarly sodas, masturbating frequently with very dark and heavy porn. In a simple words - this poison was lowering my dopamine to the levels that even cocaine wasn't working on me and i felt down even after using vast amount of cocaine.

One thing that got impact on me during that time was alcohol - cause alcohol somehow is switching amisulpride off - so i felt pretty good after consuming alcohol. But as soon as the effect of alcohol was going away (in half and hour or and hour) - i was again getting pretty angry, confused and anxious.

Final thoughts:
To withdraw this **** - you need to somehow balance you're dopamine and serotonine levels.
Bromocriptine works very well on this - cause it's raising your dopamine and serotonine levels and it's working like an antagonist to the amisulpride.
The issue is - it's pretty much like a heavy drug again ... so it can hook you up (and make you addicted) in different direction .... again.

Psychiatrists doesn't really know what they're selling - i was talking with a lot of them - and they have no idea how those meds are really working.
They're aware that this is lowering the dopamine levels but they're confincend that high dopamine is causing schizophrenia, depression, anxiety etc. when it is exactly the oposite.
I've found much more information on the internet than i was getting from them. They literally selling experimental chemistry being lied about by bigpharma.

More you can do:
Low dopamine and serotonine levels is simply killing your brain cells - so yeah - those meds is just frying your brain and killing your brain cells.
Most important thing to do is to work on your hipocampus - hipocampus is creating new brain cells (mine is damaged so it's hard, but you can restore it).
Search on internet what can you do to enlarge your hipocampus, here are some tips i've found:
- Vitamin B1 (thiamin),
- Vitamin D,
- Lot's of movement on fresh air (walking, running),

- Breathing excercises (you need to put a lot of oxygene to your brain) - you can experience breathing problems due to amisulpride (which is even worsening the stuff) so clean your sinuses - you can do this using some sea or mineral water spray. Also try Wim Hoff breathing excercise. (you can find on youtube with explenatations).
- Keto diet - it's also working great for the brain cells (hipocampus, dopamine and serotonine) - so very great tool.
- Buy a glucose measuring device and perform measuring glucose before and after a meal - when meal is rising your glucose - get rid of it from your diet (latest studies shows that different food have different impact on different people) - high glucose in blood stream is making youre dopamine raising so - amisulpride promotes those junk food consumption.
- Zinc suplementations,
- Magnesium suplementations (a lot of magnesium).

That's all for now - i hope you'll (and me too;) get better soon.

Disclaimer: you're doing it all on your own responsibility - right now i'm testing this approach on my own with a lot of risk and i'm not sure what will be the finall outcoume out of it.

 

[ChessieCat]

Chemical imbalance was a THEORY which was debunked several decades ago.

 

again-chemical-imbalance-is-a-myth-stop-the-lies-please

 

Yes, taking a psychiatric drug does add a chemical to our body, but when it is taken the brain automatically makes necessary changes in a whole lot of different parts of our system to try to regain homeostasis or balance things out to accommodate the drug.  When the drug is taken away the brain has to do the opposite, it has to change things to accommodate not getting as much or any of the drug.

 

[TomB]

Yeah but i'm talking about inbalance made by meds - and this is not theory but a fact.

Moreover - brain can't really fight the drug - if he can do it on his own we will have no issues taking meds in the first place.
Every substance we put in our bodies got impact on us - even water.

[ChessieCat]

5 minutes ago, TomB said:

i'm talking about inbalance made by meds

 

BUT

 

20 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

the brain automatically makes necessary changes

 

[TomB]

Quote

the brain automatically makes necessary changes

BUT
 

Quote

brain can't really fight the drug - if he can do it on his own we will have no issues taking meds in the first place.

 

[Onmyway]

@TomB, we advise against what you are attempting to do here which is 'brain hacking' - no one knows enough to impact the brain with precision. There are no magic bullets when it comes to the brain - it is a very complex system and one change can impact multiple other neurotransmitters and hormones and genes. So changing dopamine may have effects on serotonin, prolactin, may turn genes on and off and may change the sensitivity of receptors and so on. In addition these drugs are not precise enough to target only one chemical so they may target dopamine predominantly but may also impact other neurotransmitters. As a result, you have side effects (such as gynecomastia) etc. So it is up to you to play with your system but you don't know enough about your system to not mess it up further. Just so you know, you are welcome to post here about it but if you mess things up more we can't really help you - no one can. So if you experiment know that the consequences can be serious. 

 

OMW

[ChessieCat]

One thing that is very important to understand is that the effect of psychiatric drugs is cumulative. There are SA members who have been on/off drugs and up/down in dose multiple times with no issues, then one day they do the same thing that worked before and their nervous system cannot cope with it.

 

I have been a member of SA for almost 7 years now, and a mod for 6 of those years.  I have seen members here who have tried various things to try and make themselves feel better/fix things and they have only made things worse.  Some have had to leave their job, some have had their relationship break down, some have ended up bedridden, some have had to move in with family/friend; or any combination of those things.

[Josef]

Hey TomB!

I'm also on amisulpride, and tapering really slow.

Must mention to you something about amisulpride's mechanism of actio-

at higher doses (150/20+ and higher) it acts as a dopamine antagonist on the receptors.

But at lower doses (100mg and lower) is starting to be a pure dopamine agonist. 

 

VLDA (very low dose of amisulpride) is a used as an augmentation treatment for depression.

The doses are- 12.5/ 25 and 50mg. In these amounts their effect as an antipsycotic is almost nothing. But enhances and facilitates dopamine activity. prolactin level still be high as it's not a dose dependent.

 

I would not recommend you to take other meds that affect dopamine/seratonin in any way.

 

Good luck and all keep us updated

[TomB]

Thank you all for the advices.
It's really interesting how psychiatrists are throwing this meds on us like it's nothing: "ok, take this!", "ok, take that"... "you don't like it? take more", "or maybe take less".
They appearently doesn't give a slight **** and wanna just make expirements on humans.

@ChessieCat @Onmyway yeah i know the risks - even yesterday i was talking to myself: nevermind - in worse case scenario i'll just die.
I'm still concious so i can go on... yesterday i took only bromercoprine after 2 days of 100% withdrawal of amisulpride - it's weird feeling and i'm little bit off the charts today but i slept well so that's a good sign i think.
I'm considering to going slowely tappering - maybe it's not good way what i'm doing... i don't know. I understand that my brain is really a ecosystem but right now - it's damaged to the point that i don't care anymore.
After 15 years of heavy usage of those drugs it doesn't working anymore anyway... My life is messed up to the point that i can end on the streets and i'll don't even care. I've got nobody in my life anyway - what's the difference if i'm sleeping in rented house or i'll be sleeping in some homeless shelter? I'm lonely anyway and too old and too ***** up to changed that. So i'm running experiments on my own

@Josef where from you got this data? Can you show some evidence?
I'm taking mine out of wikipedia and there amisulpride is pure antagonist of D2, D3 and HT-5 receptors. In smaller dossage it's only D2 receptor antagonist - so it's getting more selective.

Also it's interesting what you're saying about prolactine - because prolactine is antagonist of dopamine (and vice versa).
Since i started taking bromercopine (which is dopamine agonist) my prolactine levels went much much lower. From like over 100ng/ml to 29ng/ml.
So in conclusion - if in smaller doses amisulpride is dopamine agonist - then it should lowering dopamine.

[JanCarol]

So sorry to drop in and be droll - but fiddling neurotransmitters is fiddling neurotransmitters.

 

We simply do not know enough about everything that they do in order to fiddle them.

 

For example, the vagus system - all of these organs are affected by neurotransmitters.

Which one do you want to fiddle?  And this doesn't include the endocrine system, which is a whole 'nother set of fiddling.

 

The best answer is to minimize fiddling of any neurotransmitters.

A slow, safe taper, with as few drugs as humanly possible.

 

I hope you see the sun today!

JC

[TomB]

@JanCarol yes - i know that messing with brain chemistry is not a good way to go...
... but to be honest - my brain was messed up since birth without my knowledge and somehow i can still menage life (little messy arround it - but i'm still going).
Don't wanna sound to cocky - i know that brain and body is not a toy and it's working like a whole - everything is connected and everything works like a whole eco-system... that we shouldn't mess with in the first place.
But someone already did that for me... so... i'll do everything to fix that - if i mess things worse - well ... it can't be any worse i think

But going back to scientific point of view and things that we already know - i'm trying to keep it simple... so:
If amisulpride is antagonist of D2, D3 and HT-5 receptors and i'm taking it for 15 years.... i strongly believe that when i'm trying to withdraw the meds - those receptors are simply getting imidietly messed up.
So - i'm currently using bromecropine + HTP-5 suplement to reverse what amisulpride was doing (cause bromecropine is agonist of D2, D3 and HT-5 receptors) to me for all those years - it's like changing gear from reverse back to 1... and then i'll try to stop using bromecropine + HTP-5 - cause in theory - everything should get back to normal.

Just imagine scale - you're putting amisulpride on one end of the scale... and then - when you're taking it off - the scale is starting to pendule.
So - i'm trying to balance that with bromecropine + HTP-5 on the other end of the scale.

As the Einstein said: "Everything should be as simple as possible, but not simpler" - i just hope... i don't make it to simple

Maybe i should get a mice for those experiments... but who care anyway? I don't - no one does - so ... whatever.

Also - repeating this stuff after doctors - that we don't really know how human brain is working - it's pretty much bullsh*t.
As far as i found informations on the internet - it's all there and currently i think i understand those things. Of course - i can be missing something important here - i totally agree with that.

Amisulpride was simply making me:
- felling exhousted,
- prolactynemia,
- issues breathing,
- heart problems,
- digestive problems 

So - it is messing with my body already - why not try to turn it over?
Maybe it will work... and if not - well i've already got right nickname for that

[TomB]

To add something i strongly believe that the best way to deal with this will be to put yourself away behind the closed doors ... and put one only on water.
After a month - the person will be clean as new and without any issues. Exhousted after fight? Of course - but then he can start rebuild himself from scratch.

The sad thing is - we don't have that luxury to put ourselves away for some time - we need to work, manage stuff and our life - so i'm looking for shortcuts... maybe it's a dead end ... but who knows?

[Onmyway]

30 minutes ago, TomB said:

@JanCarol yes - i know that messing with brain chemistry is not a good way to go...
... but to be honest - my brain was messed up since birth without my knowledge and somehow i can still menage life (little messy arround it - but i'm still going).
Don't wanna sound to cocky - i know that brain and body is not a toy and it's working like a whole - everything is connected and everything works like a whole eco-system... that we shouldn't mess with in the first place.
But someone already did that for me... so... i'll do everything to fix that - if i mess things worse - well ... it can't be any worse i think

But going back to scientific point of view and things that we already know - i'm trying to keep it simple... so:
If amisulpride is antagonist of D2, D3 and HT-5 receptors and i'm taking it for 15 years.... i strongly believe that when i'm trying to withdraw the meds - those receptors are simply getting imidietly messed up.
So - i'm currently using bromecropine + HTP-5 suplement to reverse what amisulpride was doing (cause bromecropine is agonist of D2, D3 and HT-5 receptors) to me for all those years - it's like changing gear from reverse back to 1... and then i'll try to stop using bromecropine + HTP-5 - cause in theory - everything should get back to normal.

Just imagine scale - you're putting amisulpride on one end of the scale... and then - when you're taking it off - the scale is starting to pendule.
So - i'm trying to balance that with bromecropine + HTP-5 on the other end of the scale.

As the Einstein said: "Everything should be as simple as possible, but not simpler" - i just hope... i don't make it to simple

Maybe i should get a mice for those experiments... but who care anyway? I don't - no one does - so ... whatever.

Also - repeating this stuff after doctors - that we don't really know how human brain is working - it's pretty much bullsh*t.
As far as i found informations on the internet - it's all there and currently i think i understand those things. Of course - i can be missing something important here - i totally agree with that.

Amisulpride was simply making me:
- felling exhousted,
- prolactynemia,
- issues breathing,
- heart problems,
- digestive problems 

So - it is messing with my body already - why not try to turn it over?
Maybe it will work... and if not - well i've already got right nickname for that

@TomB

1. It's not simple

2. It can absolutely get worse, much, much worse - we have people here completely bed bound for years and decades; just because you can handle life now doesn't mean that you can after you experiment more 

3. Just because someone says something on the internet does not make it true or accurate

 

Absolutely up to you what you do to your own body but we can't help you.

[TomB]

@Onmyway can i ask you who bound those people to beds?
Are they in mental institution with doctors?

[Onmyway]

27 minutes ago, TomB said:

@Onmyway can i ask you who bound those people to beds?
Are they in mental institution with doctors?

No, they were suffering from nervous system dysregulation due to their doctors putting them on multiple drugs and changing them constantly.

 

I have just given you info. What you do with it is up to you. Pls don't tag me if you don't have a specific tapering question.

 

Hope things go well for you.

 

OMW

[ChessieCat]

Several of the SA staff (including myself) and another member have all given their opinions that it is a very bad idea to do what your are doing/plan to do. 

 

What you take and do with your body is your decision.  And from what you have written you realise that you will be the one to suffer the consequences of your experiment if it makes things worse.  This being the case, you are making an informed decision.

 

SA, which is a very busy site with a lot of members needing assistance, is staffed by a small number of unpaid peers.  The staff prefer to use their valuable time (they have lives of their own as well as helping SA members) assisting members who choose to follow the SA protocol of getting off their drugs by tapering carefully.

[TomB]

Yes of course - thank you all for your opinions.
I've also made a more research and i find my favorite doctor talking about that:

 

Youtube VIDEO:   Dr. Eric Berg DC Transitioning Off Psychiatric Drugs

So it turns out that its all true - i've switched back to 150 mg of amisulpride for today.
I'll see how it behave and try to stay on that dossage for a month before i get to 140mg.

Thank you all for your concern!

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by ChessieCat
change video to video link with more info for searching if needed

[TomB]

Hello - i've found new interesting study that tells that you can use bromocriptine along with anty-psychotic drugs to lower your prolactine levels:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19968833/

So i believe it's safe reversing that effect with this and maybe then slowely tapping off amisulpride and also tapping off bromocriptine.

[Josef]

7 hours ago, TomB said:

Hello - i've found new interesting study that tells that you can use bromocriptine along with anty-psychotic drugs to lower your prolactine levels:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19968833/

So i believe it's safe reversing that effect with this and maybe then slowely tapping off amisulpride and also tapping off bromocriptine.

Everyone do whatever it takes, for myself I know that all pills including psychiatrics will have side effects. 

I understand where you come from, but it's a risk I myself wouldn't take as it could interfere with withdrawal process.

 

 

And about your reply to my post-

Dopamine Agonist -It's clearly written in Wiki. 

Also, I have a topic here on SA with some links about the mechanism of action of Amisulpride. Come by and say hello!

 

And about the prolactin- I toured daily (montha ago) at Reddit, search for "amisulpride" or "VLDA" or "LDA"- you'll find dosens of people on a low dose such as 12/25 and whom having high levels of prolactin.

[TomB]

Quote

And about your reply to my post-

Dopamine Agonist -It's clearly written in Wiki. 

Also, I have a topic here on SA with some links about the mechanism of action of Amisulpride. Come by and say hello!

 

And about the prolactin- I toured daily (montha ago) at Reddit, search for "amisulpride" or "VLDA" or "LDA"- you'll find dosens of people on a low dose such as 12/25 and whom having high levels of prolactin.

This is really strange for me on how it works...
... because in that case - if you tappering it really slowely and you start to move from 100mg like to 90mg - how it's possible that it will not immidietly mess up your system if it's switching from antagonist to agonist?
Wouldn't it be the same as switching from 100mg amisulpride to bromecroprine for example?

Als i wonder - how is it working in elevating your prolactine levels if its becoming dopamine agonist?

This doesn't make any sence!

 

[TomB]

In the meantime i would also like to recommend for you great channel which is my favorite channel on youtube - Dr. Berg.
I'm watching him for years now (as you probably know i was dealing with a heavy mass of my body).

When i was on high dossages of amisulpride (and at the beggining of my "hell" journey) my weight was around 110 kg with 177 cm of height.
Currently i'm on Ketogenic diet (for a month) - according to Dr. Bergs tips - and my weight is currently arround 82 - 79kg and my wrist brand is showing that my body age is 34 (when in reality i'm 38) few days before it was around 36-37 - so it's pretty good and going down.

I don't have any more cravings for sweets and carbohydrates and i feel much much better - even with amisulpride still on.
Dr. Berg is also providing a lot's of tips with suplementations for various mentall ilnesses - according to his study it's even possible to beat schizophrenia with high dossage of vit. B3 (like around 3000mg per day).
I just ordered vit. B3 today via internet - will see if it help with reducing the withdrawal symptoms. Also vit. B1 is great for lowering your cortisol levels - which is also great in our scenario. I just took one capsule today and felt really calm after that.

He is also mentioning that ketogenic diet is making withdrawal process much much easier - which is something i can confirm - cause after switching to it - my mood elevated highly and i'm only for a month on it (full transition is taking like 3 months). But be carefull when switching and read lot about keto adaptation - cause in first 2-3 weeks of transition - your brain will totally switch off for that time - cause you putting away current source of fuel - carbohydrates.

You can also find informations on his channel that those meds we taking are much likely depleting our sources of vitamins and minerals - so it's crutial to supplement them.

I'm currently on very high dossage of D3, Zinc, B1 and other stuff that makes me keep going even if i'm getting in to really sh*tty state i can still keep my senses in place.

So yeah - i'm recommending to anyone to explore his channel for start i can paste here some of his videos that are literally what i was saying erlier:

At least to take it from Dr. Bergs mouth: I've got no commisions in showing this to you - it's just my favorite channel and i never get dissapointed from his tips (I started suplementation with Zinc for like 2-3 days and my urination is much much better then before  So yeah - have fun.
 

 

 

 

[Josef]

2 hours ago, TomB said:

This is really strange for me on how it works...
... because in that case - if you tappering it really slowely and you start to move from 100mg like to 90mg - how it's possible that it will not immidietly mess up your system if it's switching from antagonist to agonist?

Sorry, but I didn't said that. That's you.

 

From 100mg you'll start to notice the effect while your going lower, that's it.  it's not working as all of a sudden receptors are going free and all of what you just wrote.

They're still blocked and the effect of dopamine agonist is still at it start.

It's a slow transition until you go down to 12mg or 25mg (my bet)

Bye for now

[TomB]

No hard feelings man - i'm just trying to figure this out.
Because if it's antagonist in higher dosage and agonist in lower ones - it should switch the on/off switch when you lower the dossage to certain point.

[Josef]

And for the last question - I don't know, I'm not a scientist, and so r u

All I know that dopamine and prolactin are connected.

The truth is all of us know so little about this drug.

It's a hard truth to except that there isn't Much of science behind Psych Drugs. Trial and error,political, someone wants to prove a point at all costs to get rich. Meh.

 

 

[Josef]

8 minutes ago, TomB said:

No hard feelings man - i'm just trying to figure this out.
Because if it's antagonist in higher dosage and agonist in lower ones - it should switch the on/off switch when you lower the dossage to certain point.

 

I don't know of any switch. Don't know how is supposed to feel. Basically it also can be a lie. 

Science today can't really follow neurons activity in the brain - that's a fact.. 

My tip to you is that you take it slow, and don't think about the data too much or analyze too much. Think about yourself and do your best efforts to fix and gain your life back.

[TomB]

Ok - but you wrote that it's antagonist in higher dose and agonist in lower dose - so this is the switch.
Hey man - you can't fight the enemy if you don't know how it's operating.

But anyhow - maybe i'm wrong and only way is really to get it down slowely - i don't deny that.
But also - i've got a little bit of scientific approach to life... so i wanna just understand how this things works.
Isn't it in human nature? Or is it just me?

Also i would like to ask - cause i didn't find any information on the internet and this is interesting - does anyone succesfully recover from this?
Do we have here someone who get off it completly? Cause that will explain a lot.

[Josef]

I've researched your last question for more than 8 months online and community.

 

The only ones I've found was on a german forum- 2 people said they're recovered.

It was a short post, and they are inactive in the forums,

I've sent them a message..Basically nothing,. I know.. it's frustrating. So yeah ..

 

You can see the posts on My Facebook group

 

[TomB]

So as you can see this going slowely off is not even prooven to be effective.
I highly believe in heavy suplementing our body during this transition to support our mind.

[Josef]

Lol! Good luck to you then