Margaret1: an attempt to discontinue paroxetine

[Margaret1]

Having the terror feeling again. It seems to become worse as the day progresses. I know it is due in part to the paroxetine withdrawal but I wonder if there is a nutrient I am missing. There is absolutely nothing to be in fear of so I don’t really understand it. At times it succeeds in getting me worked up and afraid and then at times I am able to laugh at it. Either way, it is uncomfortable. The tinnitus in my right ear is still there but not as intense. 
I will be watching and show and become so immersed in the drama whereas before when I was on the meds I was so bored. 
 

[Margaret1]

One more thought. I am so grateful I stayed on 20 mg paroxetine after I dropped from 40 mg to 20 mg in two months. That drop was way too fast. I should have taken a year or more to of done that. But I am trudging forward on 20 mg and do not wish to lower this until I stabilize. And even then, it seems that my body takes longer than 30 days to recover from dose drops, so I will take that into consideration when and if I am able to lower this dose. I hope to be able to, I have been on this med since 1992 or 1993 and it has I am sure had a profound effect on my body and mind. This is scary and hard but I think it will be worth it in the end. 

[Margaret1]

Ringing in ears very high pitched and loud. Chest tight and spiraling thoughts. 3rd hand smoke smell so bad in apt don’t feel safe here. 
trudging on. No panic attacks but extreme anxiety and more as day progresses and depression bad all day. Thinking of going back up on paroxetine until I can move out. The smell really triggers me. Once I get home from work it hits me as I walk in the door. I smell it on my clothes at work. It’s horrible. 
I will try to not obsess over it but the obsession is getting worse as I withdrawal from the medicines. 
face feels hot tonight. Having spiraling depressive thoughts and paranoia. Having resentment towards people that smoked in this apt before I lived here and for the management for not dealing with the damage from the smoke. 
I snapped at a coffee shop worker the other day for something so trivial. 
this is really hard. I know I will get out of this apt at some point in the future but it’s really hard to see and believe that will ever happen. And I will have to deal with this indefinitely. Having more resentments surrounding this but won’t go there! 

[redkite]

Hi, redkite here

Keep being their for the lovely cat who also has to put up with the smoke smell!!!!!!!! You said you were starting to see real beauty and that is a brilliant scene that you are healing. It started to get better for me when I could really notice the beauty around me and grew, the feeling of calm, serenity and joy grew, it will grow for you. When Im terrible i stroke the cat and find 4 things about it to rejoice in so for instance, soft fur, beating heart, colour, purr, character ect. this I do as part of the 54321 game. So stop, count five things around you, then four on say the cat then 3 you can here then 2 to smell and 1 to eat. It grounds you in the moment. I reckon you  need to cut yourself some slack, you work, have a pet and home. The smell could be got ride of with decorating? anyway love the cat!!! and for me say hello to him/ her. stay strong 

redkite

[Margaret1]

Thank you redkite for your time and words. Feeling a bit better today and, yea miss kitty is naughty! But I love her and she has been here for me throughout this process. 
I went off the paroxetine way too fast but holding here at 20 mg for the foreseeable future. When I feel stable enough I will lower the dosage incrementally, 1 mg at a time or maybe even .5 mg. This stuff is brutal. My head aches a lot now and te ringing in the ears comes and goes. The tinnitus is back full force. My face gets really hot now when I lay down and I’m thinking I am starting to have minor hot flashes. But the worst and absolute hell is the anxiety and depression. My hearing will get muffled as well. I know my hearing has been effected by these meds. 
but the depression can almost be paralyzing. And I think I am doing everything right. Eating well, exercising, etc it grips me at work and it makes me see the world as ugly. It makes me think I have no interests. The anxiety feels like terror but thankfully I am not having the panic attacks. If this starts I will have to updose. 
my body will feel so hot then cool down. 
Drinking lots of water these days and taking vitamin c, omega 3 fish oil, zinc, and cod liver oil. Trying to eat the good fats and plenty of veggies. 
my cat has been so important during this time. Also, I feel so much more connected to her and I think she feels that way too! She will rest her little paws on my chest and take a nap up close to my head. She keeps her ears wide open in case something moves around her! Her breathing calms me down and her cute little nose squinches up when she eats. She likes to sit in patches of sunlight as they come through the windows and hit the floor. She’s my baby. 

[redkite]

hi,

your cat sounds lovely. it sounds like she has picked up on the vibes around you and is protecting you. your lucky to have a feline in your life they are lush!!! I feel the same about my cat who is ill at the mo but a vet visit £100!!!! and some meds and care is fixing the problem.  she is a proper princess !!! i would love to get a kitten but i do not think she would like it although she loved my old farm cat, top cat ,they used to chase each other around all day!!!! the depression and anxiety are truly awful and yes you dropped to quick but like i said before keep on.  the world is ugly, its not only you who sees this but, their is immense beauty like your girl cat, your trips in the woods, the sun in your flat threw the slats. lie with your cat in the sun rays and listen to her purr!!!! Years ago when i was recovering from major surgery I remember the only good thing that happened all day was the moment my cat came and purred on my chest. Enjoy the moments they are liquid gold. You will get better, bit by bit and eventually be free from this withdrawal hell. Drop me a line if ever you want to talk. Take care redkite

[Margaret1]

I took 30 mg of Paxil last night because the terror feeling, obsessive thinking, depression and I think the 3rd hand smoke stench in the apt drove me to it. I was taking 20 mg daily. Don’t know if I should take 30 again tonight and continue this. 

[Spenitate]

4 hours ago, Margaret1 said:

I took 30 mg of Paxil last night because the terror feeling, obsessive thinking, depression and I think the 3rd hand smoke stench in the apt drove me to it. I was taking 20 mg daily. Don’t know if I should take 30 again tonight and continue this. 

Oh Margaret!  Believe me I understand the terror and desperation. I’m not a mod who can probably give you proper advice but please please be careful about changing your dose. I remember making changes to my sertraline out of desperation (increased from 50mg to 75mg) and it did me no good at all and trapped me at an even higher amount.

 

I’m so sorry you are feeling that way, I have been exactly the same recently but my obsession is getting older and all the negatives attached to that which are rubbish!

 

Is there anything you can do to mitigate the smell just to help you feel better? A fan or air spray or something?

 

sending you all my love and thoughts 

[Margaret1]

Thank you spenitate. I’ve tried what I can think of about the smell. It’s so much worse when I leave for a few days and return. I just hope it’s not really bad for me. that’s what I worry about. 
I wonder if this ne face flushing and getting hot is from withdrawal or anxiety. Feeling better today don’t know why. Had a wonderful walk to the bus stop. I will take 20 mg tonight as usual. 

[Happy2Heal]

11 hours ago, Margaret1 said:

I took 30 mg of Paxil last night because the terror feeling, obsessive thinking, depression and I think the 3rd hand smoke stench in the apt drove me to it. I was taking 20 mg daily. Don’t know if I should take 30 again tonight and continue this. 

 

oh I am so sorry you felt badly enough to increase your dose to 30mgs

I hope that you will not go up and down like that in your dose again. I see from your signature that you were off and on paxil a few times, also that you stopped two other meds just this past Feb!!

this can be an issue that slows down your healing.

 

I know it's very hard not to, when you want relief, but it's really not a good thing to do,

so please try not to do that, OK? things will go better for you if stay on a stable dose.

Maybe you'll be lucky and it won't be an issue,  but it's really kind a big risk to take, ok? I didn't understand that when I was getting started on a proper taper (and even when I did know better, I still messed up!! but I made it through, anyway, it wasn't pretty but here I am LOL)  you will make it thru too but why make it harder on yourself that It has to be, right?

 

so I am telling you this from experience!  My advice: don't be like me! please don't make the same mistakes I did.

I got thru it all ok but it almost surely made things tougher than they would have been if I had just stayed stable on my doses. I decided to stay around on the forum, even though I am fully recovered and off all meds now for 5 yrs, just because I Felt if I could just help ONE person not make the same mistakes I did, my suffering would all have some meaning, you know? 

 

You also seem to be very anxious to be off all meds and to do this quickly and BELIEVE Me I understand that!! I was the same way but I can tell you that if you go too fast, you are almost surely going to regret it. Please think about it this way: you can go slow and have very mild and manageable symptoms or even barely any at all, as some other members did when they went SUPER SLOW in their taper.

OR you can rush things and end up back where you were the last time you tried to get off this drug.

 

The time is going to pass either way, why not slow down and just be as good to yourself as you can be?

 

sorry about the smell! that's awful. I find that putting out a small container of plain vinegar sometimes help absorb? maybe? or some how get rid of bad smells. (edit: I see now that was already mentioned) 

I am very sensitive to odors so I know a lot of tricks

 

if you can find activated charcoal, and put some of that in a container near where the bad smell seems to be coming from, that can help

Or if you cant' find that, even just plain charcoal briquettes that you grill with (Not the one with a fire starter/ignitor, the plain ones) can help

 

49 minutes ago, Margaret1 said:

I wonder if this ne face flushing and getting hot is from withdrawal or anxiety

flushing and getting hot can be from either of those things.

 

 

49 minutes ago, Margaret1 said:

Had a wonderful walk to the bus stop.

That's great!!! gentle walks are very good during WD recovery!!

 

glad you were able to enjoy it!
 

I hope you see lots of good days and times, what is often called "windows" on this forum. The pattern for recovery often comes in windows of feeling better and waves of not feeling so great.

so please don't get discouraged if you have a wave of not feeling so great.

it's kind of part of the process.

 

 

 

Edited September 19, 2022 by Happy2Heal

[Margaret1]

More thoughts on this process. I am back on 20 mg paroxetine daily. I took 30 mg two nights ago instead of the 20 because I was desperate. 
I am crying once a day or more now. I feel now and it’s overwhelming. I am like a cave dweller that hasn’t seen the sun in years and now is sun bathing! I talk a lot more now to others. I need to implement a meditation practice because my thoughts are not helping at times. I feel now. I was listening to someone talk and felt immersed in their words and truly felt something again. Tv is scary and intense! Did I say I feel overwhelmed. I feel closer to God. I laugh again. I find myself chuckling at something and really enjoying this. 
was reading online about bipolar type 1 and 2. I may have major depression and anxiety. I may have type two but I also don’t think I have it and that I am just human and have moods. Who knows. I’m sticking to my plan of trying this and see where it takes me. 
I don’t want to be on meds. I don’t like feeling pain but I don’t like feeling numb. Which is worse? 
 

[Margaret1]

Thank you happy to heal. Your kind words and time spent was appreciated. I do hope I can do this. I don’t know. I just kind of let go of the safety net and and trusting that my mind and body can heal over time. There are times of immense terror and anxiety and depression and just horribleness! And agitation my oh my. I go back to the breath. Breathing and more breathing and walking. 

[Margaret1]

Ok I’m having anxiety and depression and bipolar 2 symptoms possibly. But I’m still on the 20 mg paroxetine. But things are so much better now. I was going to get on more meds but had an awakening. The awareness I have around me now of others and just the world is amazing! I can read and the words just flow and I understand the words now! I started praying to my higher power. I am sleeping well except for the other night I got 3 hours. But so grateful for this site it has changed my life! 

[Spenitate]

41 minutes ago, Margaret1 said:

Ok I’m having anxiety and depression and bipolar 2 symptoms possibly. But I’m still on the 20 mg paroxetine. But things are so much better now. I was going to get on more meds but had an awakening. The awareness I have around me now of others and just the world is amazing! I can read and the words just flow and I understand the words now! I started praying to my higher power. I am sleeping well except for the other night I got 3 hours. But so grateful for this site it has changed my life! 

That’s wonderful news Margaret I’m so happy you have seen a positive improvement. 

[Margaret1]

@Spenitate it took months and patience and struggle and oh my such struggle the long nights! But it is so worth it to be truly alive again and to be grateful

[redkite]

well done for sticking on 20mg. Your on the journey now. so pleased for you. Take care redkite

[Margaret1]

Has a rough day yesterday. Felt manicky again. Sensitive to light, sounds, quick to anger. Can taste food again though! And what a joy that is. and can smell again! 
high anxiety but getting through. It felt so unbearable yesterday I wanted to take a higher dose again but didn’t and feel better this morning. 
neck is very tight, dense ringing in ears, head has an achey feeling, 

I will sleep good one night then the next not so good. prayer is helping me through this time. 
Now that I am alive again and off all that stuff I am doing things to improve my life possibly because i am in this struggle if withdrawal and need to improve things idk 
My god is working wonders in my life now 

[Margaret1]

Having paranoia sometimes I think being caused by anxiety being so high. Feeling manic and talking to everyone and then today I got depressed and came out of feeling manic. Sleeping poorly. Will sleep decent then get 2-3 hours only the next night. 
went to psychiatrist today. She said I would have to get on another med for the paranoia. I told her I didn’t want to. Then she said I should up the Paroxetine. Soooo I’m currently taking 20 mg paroxetine. She sent in the script for 25 mg paroxetine extended release. I wasn’t able to pick it up today as the pharmacy had to order it.

Should I updose to 25mg paroxetine? I know I lowered the dose from 40 mg to 20 mg in 2 months instead of spending years doing this which I should of.

is it wise to updose to 25 mg? She said she can’t get 21 mg pills and seemed like I was crazy to ask for it! 

[ChessieCat]

You can make a liquid from paroxetine tablets.  See Post #1 of this topic:

 

Tips for tapering off paroxetine (Paxil, Seroxat)

 

Personally I think it would be better to stay 20mg  and continue holding which will allow your brain a chance to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.

 

Jumping around in doses is not good.  The brain likes consistency. 

 

The only time I updosed was when the withdrawal symptoms were absolutely unbearable.  Other than that, with time the withdrawal symptoms eased.  When I got withdrawal symptoms I would not get worried about it because I knew what it was and why it was happening.  I would just try to "go with the flow" and allow my brain the time it needed to work things out.

 

Even with an SA recommended taper a person may still experience some withdrawal symptoms at various times, however they are generally mild and resolve fairly quickly.  If the drug has been taken away too quickly then is it more likely that the withdrawal symptoms might be worse and last for longer because the brain has to do more adapting.

 

Instead of changing your doses when you get withdrawal symptoms SA strongly encourages members to learn and use:

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

And also please note that SA's suggestion when making an updose is to only make a small increase because if you take too much it might make things worse - and sometimes it can be very worse - some members regret trying to find the "perfect" dose and realise that their symptoms were not as bad as they thought when they fiddle with their dose and make things even worse.  Please read Post #1 of this topic, much of which applies to updosing:

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

[Margaret1]

Thank you so much chessiecat. I slept well last night so feeling much better. I don’t want to make a rash decision and updose. I just need to get control of myself so I don’t say mean things to other people! 
im crying daily which feels so good to cry again. I found a new place to move to that doesn’t smell like 3rd hand smoke! 
I have such rages of anger at times and my thinking is clouded being forgetful. And then the high anxiety causes paranoia I think. I want to pursue a natural cure for mental health. 
I will stay on 20 for another day. That’s all I can do one day at a time. 
the yoga technique I want to get into and go back to walking more. When I stopped walking as much it got much worse in my head. I need to slow down and breathe. 
this morning I feel alive again. Those medicines were robbing me of my life! Miss kitty is lying near me. Yes, she notices the change too! She purrs loudly. I love her! 

[Margaret1]

Wake up head feeling buzzy, aches, feeling super happy! Slept last night but not feeling like deep sleep. Paranoia comes in questioning myself. Periods of feeling exhaustion but can’t nap during day. So thirsty trying to drink enough water. Thinking not clear sometimes. 
still on 20 mg Paxil. Things going d so I much better though in so many ways! I am talking to people. I am alive again! 
Worrying that I have bipolar type 2 or is it the withdrawal from Paxil?!?!

[Margaret1]

Eating very healthy, not exercising as much as I was though maybe this is doing it. Will try the yoga move of putting legs on wall to ground myself. Going to work, being forgetful at times, not remembering things, high anxiety turning to paranoia

[ChessieCat]

7 hours ago, Margaret1 said:

Worrying that I have bipolar type 2 or is it the withdrawal from Paxil?!?!

 

If these symptoms developed after you started/reduced/stopped a psychiatric drugs, ie you didn't have them before you ever took a psychiatric drug, then it cannot be a true diagnosis.

 

This is even stated in the DSM.

 

A diagnosis cannot be made whilst someone is tapering or experiencing withdrawal symptoms because the drug/s have changed the brain.  From this post Ch4 of The Antidepressant Solution by Glenmullen 2005:

 

"Antidepressants can certainly make patients look manic or hypomanic. But the American APA DSM explicitly states that “manic like [or hypomanic –like] episodes that are clearly caused by somatic antidepressant treatment (e.g. medication) should not count toward a diagnosis of bipolar I or bipolar II disorder because these are drug induced states."

[redkite]

hi, its bloody withdrawal I expect. Try not to worry. I have only been doing miniscule cuts and feel like I am going to have a heart attack!!!!!! Racing heart and OUTRAGOUS anxiety that's so high when my stomach rumbles I jump!!!!!!, and a headache that never leaves me!!!! Makes me so upset that I am virtually disabled with this problem, had even considered putting my micro taper up a bit to stop the anxiety but am going to stick it out.....I think!!! I would never have started this journey if I had known the pain to come but would also never have taken the prescription either!!! You have done so well doing a big drop try not to go up to 25 it may not help. Interestingly I have just found an old diary from when I was on 30mg of the bloody stuff and the symptoms were similar so you could be struggling with the side effects as well as WD!!!  Keep posting your thoughts and let people help you, plus your lovely cat sounds adorable, your lucky to have her.

Take care redkite

[Margaret1]

Red kite and cheesie cst thanks! My mind is really trying to go back to what it was over 20 something years ago. It’s very hard. The anxiety attacks I’m having, elevated heart rate it sucks. And when you are in it it is hard to see out of it. I try to just accept it and let it be what it will. But it’s amygdala hijack! I’m losing weight as well. My body is pushing food I do eat through quickly. The anxiety is horrible. The depressive moods really suck. When will this get better because so far it’s getting worse. 

[Margaret1]

All day in and out of anxiety attacks, heart rate rises, chest tightens, neck is so tight I am taking muscle relaxers and putting a patch on it. Obsessing obsessing can’t stop trying to figure everything out!!!

[Margaret1]

Not sleeping well either so this could be making me crazy. And obsessing over smells, light is too bright, head aching, gosh. I really have to learn coping mechanisms. I try meditating only works for 1 second. Walking helps. Deep breathing kinda helps, then the anxiety comes in and it’s horrible! Face flushing, running higher than normal temperature. I’ve packs on tight neck helps! Can’t function like this! So glad I stayed on at least the 20 mg. I’m crying over things, I’m so worried. I am in recovery for alcoholism and am in early sobriety so I know that is hard! Anyway, lots of thinking lately. I will not feel comfortable going down on dose until I find some more stability. I am eating good but my apt is a mess and I’m trying to keep self care going. 

[Margaret1]

And it’s gets better…I have black mold in my apt as well as 3rd hand smoke. It turns out the black mold can cause racing heart rate and anxiety and depression short term memory loss insomnia and a host of other things I am having. I am moving out of here on the 15th. So only 6 more days! I found a great place to move to. No smoke smell and no mold! 
The mold is such that if I spill some water on the carpet, overnight it turns to black mold. I have been living in this for 5 years and that was making me sick and lethargic also all the meds I was on kept me from realizing how bad it was. 
I pray there will be no long term side effects from this. what I read online is that you detox from the mold once you remove yourself from it. 
So Paxil withdrawal + mold symptoms + 3rd hand smoke  is not fun. 
thank you god for letting me find a new home that I can move to. I can’t figure this all out! I have to let go and let god. 

[Margaret1]

Feeling better now. I walked and ate.

[Margaret1]

The weight loss over the last week has been significant. I am eating! The food seems to just go through me. Any advice? 

[ChessieCat]

There are links to other "food" topics in Post #1 of this topic.

 

food-sensitivities

 

[Margaret1]

Current symptoms:

diarrhea 

nervousness

paranoia 

buzzy head

thirsty

Mood swings 

depression

mania

Racing heart beat 

tingleing extremities 

listening to music really loud

talking excessively 

awareness

shortness of breath 

Short term memory loss

sinus soreness

Nasal irritation 

excess Phelgm 

lung irritation 

stinging eyes

Bladder infections

 

I am still drinking one cup of coffee a day in morning probably shouldn’t but I feel better in the morning and then the anxiety gets worse 

thanks for the food list I am mostly Keto 

 

hard to say what us coming from the toxic mold or the drop in meds. Probably mostly drop in meds. But a bit the mold.

sticking with 20 mg Paxil 

[Margaret1]

Taking quickly

feeling like I have to get everything out just perfectly 

[Margaret1]

It doesn’t seem to matter what I eat. I have diarrhea the next morning and continue to lose weight. Windows and waves pattern. Still on 20mg Paxil. Crying daily, sense of taste, hearing, touch, all senses getting stronger. Not sleeping good. Then I had a good hour nap yesterday that was amazing. Walking everyday. Do not want to go back on more Paxil or an antipsychotic. I’m functioning. Bathing, eating, doing laundry. In my new home now. No toxic mold or 3rd hand smoke smell! Will continue to do self hypnosis this helps me calm down. I look up, then slowly close eyes and breathe in, then raise one arm and breathe out, and float. 
check out Andrew huberman and dr speigel the reveri app. Andrew has bipolar but doesn’t take meds. His site is great. 

[Margaret1]

Weight loss significant now. How did you deal with this? Updose? See a doctor? 

[ChessieCat]

weight-gain-weight-loss-appetite-changes-hunger