Mattie: tapering off Pristiq

[Mattie]

I usually get pretty good windows by 4 pm on most days, some days my windows are up and down all day and some days I feel bad all day and through the evening (tired and sleepy feeling with depression)

[Mattie]

I usually have pretty good windows by 4ish most days however some days I get them earlier during the day, some days I get windows and waves all day and some days no windows at all, that’s when I feel the most tired and drained with the depression. 

[Altostrata]

Have you accidentally skipped any doses or taken them off-schedule?

 

On 5/8/2023 at 11:01 PM, Mattie said:

@altostrata, before taking my meds I’m usually having a pretty good window after about 30 to 40 minutes I get a bit groggy and usually fall asleep on my chair. 

 

How often does this happen?

 

23 minutes ago, Mattie said:

I feel the most tired and drained with the depression. 

 

Do you have any other symptoms? How's your sleep?

 

Please update your signature with the information about the switch to Lexapro.

[Mattie]

@altostata, I have not skipped any doses but I did move my dose to 8 pm when the time changed weeks ago. 
As for any other symptoms I do get very tired and drained and slightly depressed after a meal, more than you would normally do and last for a few hrs, this doesn’t happen after every meal mostly after lunch but sometimes after breakfast, I’m thinking something going on with blood sugar possibly , I also submitted my signature you asked for, thanks 

 

[Mattie]

After being on lexapro for 9 ish months I tried my first 4% drop from 5mg to 4.8 mg 11/3/23 . The withdrawals were so severe that I upped dosed back to 5 on 11/22/23 after 19 days. I lost 13lbs because I couldn’t eat and my stomach was like a huge iron ball of pain, depression through the roof extreme exhaustion and only a very slight reprieve of depression around 830pm. Since I up dosed back to 5 all my symptoms remain except the bad stomach issue cleared but zero appetite still but can force myself to eat and no longer losing weight. Please advise me! I’m so discouraged and sick. @Altostrata I promise I will listen to any and all advice , thanks 

[Altostrata]

Try to eat foods that appeal to you. This should gradually go away.

 

How has your symptom pattern changed since you started taking only 5mg Lexapro on February 14, 2023, and before you tried this reduction?

[Mattie]

@Altostratafirst of all thanks for your quick response. When I first started talking the 5mg of lexapro on Feb 14 23 the transition was very rough but as the weeks went by and months I started having windows and waves pattern and some days windows as early as 8 am other days 12 pm , 3pm but always could count on a window by 4 

[Mattie]

@Altostrata I’m so unbelievably tired drained and sleepy, and depressed all day. I’m still forcing myself to eat due to no appetite. I will myself up by the hardest to go to restroom and force myself to walk around my living room because I know how unhealthy to be bedridden. I feel like this all day and through the evening and like a light switch around 730 / 8pm I get a nice window of relief psychically and mentally but my head has a slight pressure and I feel very cloudy . I don’t understand how such a tiny switch made such a huge impact. I should tell you the way I made my transition from pill to liquid was making my own liquid with my 5mg pill .

[Altostrata]

What times o'clock do you take your drugs, with their dosages? When did you start using Lexapro liquid?

[Mattie]

@Altostrata

10/3/2023 thru 11/2/2023 (5mg homemade liquid to transition)

11/3/2023 thru 11/19/2023 (4.8mg

homemade liquid 

11/20/2023 thru 11/24/2023 (5mg

homemade liquid 

11/25/2023 to present (5mg tablet) 

I take every evening at 8pm

[Altostrata]

How do you feel after you take your evening dose of Lexapro compared to how you feel earlier, before the dose?

[Mattie]

About 1hr before my dose I can feel myself slowly lifting out of the wave and after my dose I feel lifted but within 30 to 40 minutes I can feel the grogginess from the meds and fall asleep after about 1 hr or so. Also I’ve been having early morning wakening about 1:30 - 3:30 with severe anxiety @Altostrata

[Altostrata]

It appears that perhaps 5mg Lexapro is too much for you and you're having adverse effects from it -- grogginess, etc. It may be causing activation at peak plasma around 1:30 a.m. or so.

[Mattie]

@Altostrataso what would you suggest? 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

On 3/28/2023 at 5:46 PM, Altostrata said:

See Tips for tapering off escitalopram (Lexapro)

 

[Mattie]

@Altostrata, I’ve read through the info but I just failed my first 4% drop and upped dosed back to 5mg 18 nights ago due to extreme withdrawals and since I upped dose I really haven’t seen any improvement yet. Perhaps my central nervous system wasn’t ready for the drop? I was still having a window and wave pattern and maybe should have given my body more time?

[Altostrata]

3 hours ago, Mattie said:

upped dosed back to 5mg 18 nights ago due to extreme withdrawals

 

What do you mean by "extreme withdrawals"? What you're describing now does not sound like extreme withdrawal symptoms.

[Mattie]

I can’t function physically or mentally. So exhausted yet full of anxiety. Just thinking of having to do anything puts my body into a panic. I’m so depressed, crying spells daily, fear . I’m so foggy headed. Don’t feel well like I have low grade flu, no appetite, lost 15 1bs in 3 weeks. Sounds drive me crazy like Tv , anyone talking etc. i feel so hopeless like I’ll be like this forever and there’s no way out @Altostrata

[Altostrata]

I'm not seeing grogginess in your description. When does grogginess occur?

 

How is your current symptom pattern different from when you were taking 5mg in June?

[Mattie]

@Altostratai really feel groggy all day until I lift . Maybe that’s the word I wasn’t using to describe but yes also after I take my nightly dose but feels more sleepy than groggy after my nightly dose. I feel way worse than I felt in June. My symptoms are highly intensified now and no windows all day. In June I still had symptoms I have now but to a way lesser degree maybe 75% less and would have windows starting as early as 8 am but sometimes not before 3-5 pm but usually by then had a window and could still function before window although very uncomfortable 

[Altostrata]

It's been 7 pages for more than a year where I cannot understand your symptom pattern from your description. Are you groggy or are you fatigued? What do you mean when you say you feel like you have low-grade flu? 

 

In May, you said 5mg Lexapro made you sleepy and groggy. Then we didn't hear from you for 6 months. Now you say 5mg Lexapro made you sleepy and groggy.

 

On 12/3/2023 at 9:34 AM, Mattie said:

After being on lexapro for 9 ish months I tried my first 4% drop from 5mg to 4.8 mg 11/3/23 . The withdrawals were so severe that I upped dosed back to 5 on 11/22/23 after 19 days.

 

What exactly were these withdrawal symptoms from a reduction of 0.2mg?

 

You lost 13 pounds in 19 days?

[Mattie]

@Altostrata yes I lost 13 lbs in 19 days when I made my first drop. I say flu like symptoms because I’m trying to explain you how it feels when your that sick like you would have the flu your body feels extremely weak and you can’t function because you feel so unwell . I feel a heaviness in my body and mentally I feel defeated and depressed because I can’t force myself to function but just lay there.i guess my mind is groggy and my body fatigued.Also when I try to think about getting up or doing anything my anxiety goes through the roof.I get so sleepy but my body is full of anxiety so I can’t nap. The fear of staying this way is getting unbearable. I have major crying spells also like doom and gloom feeling like everyone I know and love will die and these thoughts loop in my head. I’m sorry if it’s frustrating for you but it’s so hard to describe. As for the  reduction that’s when all these extreme symptoms started and have not gone away since I upped my dose back to 5. I say extreme , I mean intensify greatly since I made drop because I felt like this before attempting a drop but to a much less degree  where I could function in life even if I didn’t feel great. I hope this makes more sense. Thank you for your patience , and help. I’ll add last night about 30 minutes after meds I felt a nice window , calm , alert, more like myself, I also noticed if I wake up during the night I’m still fine as far as symptoms like I’m still having a window and can fall back asleep but then like a light switch I start to feel all my symptoms upon awakening . So if I wake up before 3ish or earlier I don’t have symptoms. So it’s like from the time I take my meds at 8 pm it seems my window of relief would be from 8 pm - maybe 3pm sometimes 4pm even though I’m sleeping but upon waking after those hrs I can literally feel those symptoms coming on like a surge .

[Altostrata]

You had said before that you feel better in the evening *before* you take your Lexapro dose.

 

Perhaps you might stay at 5mg for a while longer and see if these symptoms fade away.

[Mattie]

@Altostrata yes I do feel myself starting to lift around 7ish but by 830 I’m having an actual window it’s like a light switch goes on and my body and brain stops the chaos . It’s the strangest thing. I’ll definitely take your advice and hold on to 5mg. I had so much high hopes to make my first drop but I guess my central nervous system was still destabilized and not ready. Thanks for your time. I’ll reach out to you if something changes hopefully for the better. Thanks again oh my last post at the bottom I meant to say 3am and 4am sorry 

[Mattie]

@Altostrata, it’s 2 months since I updosed my lexapro and I’m not seeing much improvement, I’m having a tiny bit improvement in my exhaustion (maybe 15 or 20%) and my appetite is slowly coming back. My biggest battle is the depression/ SI/despair/crying spells and zero motivation. My mood is extremely low. I do still get a window of relief starting anywhere from 6pm till bedtime where physically I feel more lifted but mentally only a bit but noticeable. Is this a good sign? With all the drug changes in the past could this tiny drop in dose and then upped dose have kindled me? Reaching out for your advice, thanks for your time 

[getofflex]

Can you please update your signature with all drug changes (dose changes up or down, starting/stopping drug/ etc.) since 2/14/2023?  

[Mattie]

I’m sorry I’m having trouble figuring out how to update signature. But this is the update if you would be so kind to help get it to signature. Thanks 
 
10/3/2023 thru 11/2/2023 lexapro 5mg homemade liquid to transition 

11/3/2023 thru 11/19/2023 lexapro 4.8mg homemade liquid 

11/20/2023 thru 11/24/2023 lexapro 5mg homemade liquid 

11/25/2023 to present lexapro 5mg pill form 

i think I figured it out and updated signature 

@getofflex

[getofflex]

I'm willing to venture a guess that your bridge from Pristiq to Lexapro has destabilized your nervous system.  It can take a very long time to find stability again.  I suggest that you continue to hold on the 5 mg of Lexapro for a long time. The fact that you are seeing at least some improvement is very good.  

23 hours ago, Mattie said:

I do still get a window of relief starting anywhere from 6pm till bedtime where physically I feel more lifted but mentally only a bit but noticeable. Is this a good sign?

Yes, this is a very good sign. 

 

23 hours ago, Mattie said:

With all the drug changes in the past could this tiny drop in dose and then upped dose have kindled me?

I don't know if it kindled you, but it could very well be that your system wasn't yet stable when you did this, and it further destabilized you.  

 

During my taper, I did 2 very long hold, and they helped me tremendously.  I would suggest holding for as long as it takes to reach stability.  Then, you might try micro tapering.  In the meantime, try some non drug techniques for coping with your symptoms.  Taking walks outside can be very helpful for depression and low mood.  I try to do that every day.  

 

Micro-Taper Instead of 10 or 5 Percent Decreases

 

Important topics about symptoms, including sleep problems

 

 

Stability

 

WD Normal

 

 

Post Withdrawal Nervous System Hypersensitivity - Kindling

[getofflex]

Also, when you switch from pill form to liquid and vice versa, do not change your dose at the same time.  And, do the switch gradually.  

 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/forums/topic/28978-cross-over-from-tablet-to-liquid-or-changing-the-brand/?do=findComment&comment=465046

 

[Mattie]

Thank you so much for your quick response, you are right, I was still having windows and waves before I attempted this small drop and foolishly thought it was just side effects from lexapro but clearly it was still withdrawals still after being on lexapro 9 months. I will definitely hold for a long time and hopefully my depression lightens up a bit. It’s ruff to feel absolutely no positivity, I don’t feel human. Thanks again. May I reach out to you in the future if things get better or worse? @getofflex

[getofflex]

This is a team effort.  If you need help, one of us will help you, it may not necessarily be me.  I'm sort of a retired mod, but I've been doing more on the forum recently.  Please refrain from tagging me unless you have an urgent tapering question - thank you.  

 

Developing a spiritual life can help a lot with depression as well.  

[Mattie]

Thank you, sorry about the tag, didn’t know if anyone would respond without a tag 

[getofflex]

There are 6 people following your topic.  If no one responds, you have the option of clicking the 3 dots in the upper right corner and issuing a report to bring your post to the attention of the staff.  

[Mattie]

 I realize now with the information I received here and read that I’ve been in withdrawals for a few years now. Having been switched, upped and down on doses of so many antidepressants my central nervous system took a bad blow. I’ve been having windows and waves for years and I always thought it was bad side effects from the drugs even though I know there are side effects. Every time I’ve had a switch or adjustment my symptoms although the same got a little worse in intensity. Though I have many symptoms, my worst by far is my low mood and has been noticeable lower than before my drop .  What I’m trying to say is with every drug change my mood got  noticeable lower and stays that low even when my other symptoms are improving. I guess my question is in time and holding a long time as suggested will my mood eventually lift ? I’ve never had depression prior to messing with the meds only a bit of anxiety or shyness really. Thanks for your support 

[getofflex]

2 hours ago, Mattie said:

Having been switched, upped and down on doses of so many antidepressants my central nervous system took a bad blow.

I'm so glad you are aware of this now.  These drugs are not good for our nervous systems.  

 

2 hours ago, Mattie said:

What I’m trying to say is with every drug change my mood got  noticeable lower and stays that low even when my other symptoms are improving. I guess my question is in time and holding a long time as suggested will my mood eventually lift ?

I don't know the answer to this.  Your low mood could be a combination of withdrawal, plus other things causing it.  As we taper off the drugs, it is important to find non drug ways to deal with anxiety, depression, etc.  I'm willing to bet that with a long hold, the depression will probably improve to some degree.  What things are you doing to help you lift your mood naturally?  For me, I go for walks outside everyday, make my spiritual life a high priority, and try to get out and be with people by going to church, and to a fitness center.  Other things to help depression are cognitive behavior therapy.  There is a good book for this called "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy" by Dr. DAvid D. Burns.  Here is the link on amazon.  Sometimes, changing the way we look at things and think about things can make a big difference.  

 

https://www.amazon.com/Feeling-Good-New-Mood-Therapy/dp/0380731762/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3Q4VV9QZJBALV&keywords=feeling+good+by+dr.+david+burns&qid=1706034913&sprefix=feeling+good%2Caps%2C107&sr=8-1

[Mattie]

Thanks for all the tips and I’ll definitely look into the book. I definitely need something to detour my negative thoughts of being like this forever , thanks for your time