choytu: Cipralex (Escitalopram) Tapering

[manymoretodays]

Hi choytu,

I wouldn't if it was me......updose further.  I expect new symptoms will improve.  Waves can be misleading, in that one thinks it's forever.

Try the magnesium.  I found it very calming.

On 10/27/2023 at 5:43 AM, choytu said:

Do you recommend a good magnesium supplement as well as a probiotic for the gut (maybe from Amazon)?

 

I used a citrate for magnesium and emptied capsule contents into a water bottle.  I felt kind of bobble headed, but that was a whole lot better than feeling frantic.

 

I am doing a probiotic now.....to hopefully offset anything from my course of antibiotics.  It's once a day, brand Reuteri by Nature's way, probiotic.  I'm almost wondering though if it's making me feel sick- headaches, visual changes, etc.  Likely I'll continue it.  And will be done with my antibiotics tomorrow.  Yay!  I got a cat bite infection-cellulitis, lymphangits.  It's improved and overall doing better.  I have no idea if it is Amazon available.

 

Just the magnesium, really is all I can recommend for calming.  I'm a fan of the epsom salts in a warm bath too.  Don't overdo though.  Just one magnesium supplement at a time.

 

Sorry your plans didn't go well.  You'll get there though.  You will choytu.  Never did healing  go on my schedule.  Honest.  It does keep getting better now though.  No regrets and glad I went the distance.

 

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[choytu]

Hey @manymoretodays

 

I have some questions that I will try to summarise below:

 

1. What can I do for these symptoms? => Asthenia (muscle weakness, aches, fatigue), Headache/Numbness in the forehead.

 

The muscle weakness is really disabling, I need to rest most of the time (which also leads to losing muscle mass and strength), headache is unpleasant.

 

Blood pressure is good, no fever. Yet I still feel sick and most of the time I stay at home.

 

2. What are the signs of healing?

 

I know about the windows and waves, but the muscle weakness for example is a symptom, that I do not think has improved.

 

Thank God my sleep is good, the gut is so so. There are times when I burp, times when I get nauseous, times when it is okay, although past two days I had diarrhoea (don’t know if it can be withdrawal)

 

3. Are the symptoms going to improve as long as I hold?

 

P.S. I tried doing bit of exercise (dance cardio) at home (because only resting is also not good) and the next days was hit with a wave of symptoms.

So I said to myself, only short walks with the dog, stretching and rest.

[choytu]

@@manymoretodays
Any suggestions on the above topics?

I noticed that cardio exercise puts me in a huge wave of symptoms, but I have been active all my life and is really upsetting when I can't exercise and I lose muscle mass as well.
I tried lifting some light weights and I get soreness in my muscles very easy, which also brings me in a big wave as I said above.

It has been two months since I up-dosed to 6.4mg.
Overall, vital things like sleep and gut are good, I walk the dog around the block for movement, take magnesium (which helps) and a probiotic for the gut.

Emotionally and mentally not so numb (which is good), but also my anxiety gets more easily triggered and I have hypersensitivity to loud noise for example.

So, you suggestion is to now start with 5% decrements instead of 10% and again hold for a month?

[choytu]

On 11/11/2023 at 10:05 AM, choytu said:

Hey @manymoretodays

 

I have some questions that I will try to summarise below:

 

1. What can I do for these symptoms? => Asthenia (muscle weakness, aches, fatigue), Headache/Numbness in the forehead.

 

The muscle weakness is really disabling, I need to rest most of the time (which also leads to losing muscle mass and strength), headache is unpleasant.

 

Blood pressure is good, no fever. Yet I still feel sick and most of the time I stay at home.

 

2. What are the signs of healing?

 

I know about the windows and waves, but the muscle weakness for example is a symptom, that I do not think has improved.

 

Thank God my sleep is good, the gut is so so. There are times when I burp, times when I get nauseous, times when it is okay, although past two days I had diarrhoea (don’t know if it can be withdrawal)

 

3. Are the symptoms going to improve as long as I hold?

 

P.S. I tried doing bit of exercise (dance cardio) at home (because only resting is also not good) and the next days was hit with a wave of symptoms.

So I said to myself, only short walks with the dog, stretching and rest.

 

@Altostrata

[choytu]

And also do you need to wait before all symptoms subside in order to continue with the next percentage taper?
What is the advice on that part? @Altostrata @manymoretodays

[Altostrata]

From your signature, it appears that your withdrawal symptoms are slowly improving. If I were you, I'd get as much gentle exercise as is comfortable and allow the stabilization process to continue over the next month or two. You might think about more reductions in the new year.

[Jakeblack14]

On 11/29/2023 at 3:45 AM, choytu said:

I noticed that cardio exercise puts me in a huge wave of symptoms, but I have been active all my life and is really upsetting when I can't exercise and I lose muscle mass as well.

 

Hey hey, sorry about this. I have been working through withdrawal from this medication for a while now. I was a tri athlete and that came to an abrupt stop. Listening to our body and taking it extremely slow is super annoying, but we will get back to being more active, for now our nervous systems just need rest. 

Anyway, here should you need anything or have any questions, don't hesitate to reach out. 

In regards to your question above: 
Stabilize. Get back to a normal before thinking about reduction again. You will thank yourself later down the road  

[choytu]

16 hours ago, Altostrata said:

From your signature, it appears that your withdrawal symptoms are slowly improving. If I were you, I'd get as much gentle exercise as is comfortable and allow the stabilization process to continue over the next month or two. You might think about more reductions in the new year.

Thank you for the advice, Alto.
I will stick on the same dose for the next month or two as you said and will continue with 10% reductions next year.

[choytu]

14 hours ago, Jakeblack14 said:

 

Hey hey, sorry about this. I have been working through withdrawal from this medication for a while now. I was a tri athlete and that came to an abrupt stop. Listening to our body and taking it extremely slow is super annoying, but we will get back to being more active, for now our nervous systems just need rest. 

Anyway, here should you need anything or have any questions, don't hesitate to reach out. 

Hi Jake,

Thank you for joining in on my topic.

Yes, I have also been active as an individual - I would go play football at least 3/4 times a week. But for now I cannot, because even if I only jog and raise my cardio, I feel exhausted the other days and recovery is very slow (as if I am sick with temperature).

I can walk my dog, do some stretching and do at home exercise light (pushups, plank, ab-workout), but very minor.

What did you do when you were withdrawing, regarding exercise/rest?

 

14 hours ago, Jakeblack14 said:

In regards to your question above: 
Stabilize. Get back to a normal before thinking about reduction again. You will thank yourself later down the road  

Yeah, I think I will give it a month or two more on this dosage before I make a new reduction


P.S.: I even bought a portable inflatable bathtub, because submerging in warm water helps me with muscle tension and relaxation.

[Jakeblack14]

2 hours ago, choytu said:

What did you do when you were withdrawing, regarding exercise/rest?

 

I am currently in Protracted Withdrawal. Meaning I have been off medication for a couple of months, but still have the windows and waves. 
Everything I have been doing or not doing has been based on my body and how we are feeling. Though, recently it has not become an option at all even if we are feeling good in a window. 

Everyone is different, so try little things and see what works or doesn't work for you. Mine is major rest. I am moving, just not working hard to move. Cardio seems to be the biggest factor to how I feel the next day, if I don't work the cardiovascular system too hard, I seem to be okay the next day. I have been trying something light like Yoga, then seeing how I feel the next day and then going from there. I tend to get worsening symptoms after every bout of exercise whether small like yoga or more like a light run. 

 

The symptoms come in forms of foggy brain, headache, sickness, weakness, depression or bouts of crying, and anxiousness. So I will most likely just stick with yoga once a week. Assess, rinse, repeat. 

You got this. I don't say any of this to scare you, but encourage you that it will get better, just takes a whole lot of time and a smidge of hope to keep us going. 

[choytu]

@Jakeblack14

 

Today I decided for example to take my dog for a walk at the beach.

 

Tought to myself - lets do 10 squats and 10 pushups to see how I feel.

 

I regretted it, because now I am laying in beed with weakness, dizziness, cold hands/feet, headache and nausea.

 

Damn… our system is so sensitive to everything (sounds, light, temperature, including exercise).

 

@Altostrata

I am also struggling to work. How do people manage to work? Do they take a break? Do you work?

[choytu]

@Jakeblack14

And also, what helped you the most with the physical symptoms?

 

Did you take some supplements like vitamin D, vitamin B12, probitoics or some herbal remedies that help the CNS relax - like passiflora, valeriana, ashwagandha?

 

I am asking, because at this point it is for me even hard to work (and I work at home + the job is not physical).

@Altostrata @manymoretodays

I know that the site only suggests Magnesium and Omega 3, but anything else for this fatigue?

 

I cannot be physically active, because that fires an onset of symptoms. I can only walk the dog for 10 minutes and do a light stretching yoga at home.

Wim Hof breathing technique is also too intense for me.

 

What helped you with the fatigue symptom, and how did you cope with working?

[Jakeblack14]

5 minutes ago, choytu said:

And also, what helped you the most with the physical symptoms?

Hey @choytu, 

I took Magnesium Glycinate and Omega 3 fish oil for a long time, but stopped at I have gotten to a point where I found them to be no longer benefical in my current situation. 

The most helpful thing for me is small bland meals and a whole lot of water. Cucumbers, bananas, water, decaf coffee, rice, veggies, bread and olive oil. Small bits, often, and drink water like your life depends on it. 

I have the same thought process as you, the idea that we need something to mitigate the fatiuge. Unfortuantely we are in a place where instead of fixing it, we need to listen to it. I hate it. lol but nonetheless, if yoga is too much, we dont do yoga, if walking is too much we sit down. We get to use this time to get to know our bodies again and listen to them. 

I also work from home, I have a really awesome boss who I communicated what was going on, I take regular breaks at work, work a little longer in some cases. 

[choytu]

13 minutes ago, Jakeblack14 said:

Hey @choytu, 

I took Magnesium Glycinate and Omega 3 fish oil for a long time, but stopped at I have gotten to a point where I found them to be no longer benefical in my current situation. 

The most helpful thing for me is small bland meals and a whole lot of water. Cucumbers, bananas, water, decaf coffee, rice, veggies, bread and olive oil. Small bits, often, and drink water like your life depends on it. 

I have the same thought process as you, the idea that we need something to mitigate the fatiuge. Unfortuantely we are in a place where instead of fixing it, we need to listen to it. I hate it. lol but nonetheless, if yoga is too much, we dont do yoga, if walking is too much we sit down. We get to use this time to get to know our bodies again and listen to them. 

I also work from home, I have a really awesome boss who I communicated what was going on, I take regular breaks at work, work a little longer in some cases. 

 

I also take magnesium, but in citrate form. Just now starting with the Omega 3. I also take probiotic

 

Your boss is cool. But not all people have this possibility even to work from home and I just cannot get my mind straight how are they coping.

 

Fatigue is draining and awful. With combination of winter and everyday greyness and darkness. It really contributes to low mood.

 

I am even hesitating getting vitamin D supplement and am also researching for something that helps with the fatigue, but no luck. Some people say B12 helps, other Ashwagandha, third say acupuncture etc…

 

I also noticed that I have this strange feeling underneath  my feet like ants crawling or small needles. So yeah, very debilitating and it makes me angry and upset at the same time.

[Altostrata]

On 12/6/2023 at 11:46 AM, Altostrata said:

From your signature, it appears that your withdrawal symptoms are slowly improving. If I were you, I'd get as much gentle exercise as is comfortable and allow the stabilization process to continue over the next month or two. You might think about more reductions in the new year.

 

[choytu]

Today again, although I sleep 9 good hours, I feel exhausted and sluggish.
As if my muscles are going to cramp, they are stiff and somewhat ache.

On top of that I feel tears creeping in round the corner, I feel kinda low and just upset.

My girlfriend said to me that next year 3 of her friends are getting engaged and we are going to be guests on their wedding. And I am here wondering... how? When I cannot even go to the mall, because there are so many people and the lights are bothering me, and I feel like I cannot breathe. Plus on top of that I noticed dizziness there, which also contributed.

Holiday are coming. Hooray... I guess...

I do not understand how can getting of these pills be such a pain in the ass. And the undefined withdrawal time is just killing me - you do not know when you are going to be better, if you are going to be better, you wake up and you are wondering what day is it going to be another wave or maybe a light window breeze...

The tiredness, dizziness and just resting I think also contribute to my inner sadness, because I have always used sport as a way out of stress and just feeling overall well when I play football.

@Jakeblack14 how are you doing?

@manymoretodays @Altostrata please tell me something encouraging and that this is not gonna last forever. I am trying to be patient, but man it is exhausting to just cancel things with your gf for example, because most of the time you feel unwell...

[Altostrata]

This is what I can tell you: You can manage your own thoughts. There is no reason to pre-grieve having a bad time at parties next year. If you have a habit of making yourself miserable, you can make yourself miserable. You can make a new habit of thinking if you want to. Strongly recommend you read these topics:

 

 

Creating a new self after withdrawal

 

Progress! What withdrawal symptoms have gone away for you? 

 

Withdrawal dialogues & encouragement

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Easing your way into meditation for a stressed-out nervous system

 

Music for self-care: calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

Ways to cope with daily anxiety

 

"Change the channel" - dealing with cognitive symptoms

 

Dealing With Emotional Spirals 

 

Shame, guilt, regret, and self-criticism

 

Health anxiety, hypochondria, and obsession with symptoms

 

Please do not tag me again, I am phasing out active participation here.

 

[choytu]

Thank you Alto.

I wish you good holidays. Sorry for being so annoying.

[choytu]

Hi 👋🏻 

 

I have read a lot about people withdrawing have come across this ongoing fatigue.

 

I am currently tapering Lexapro with 10% each (from 10mg to now 6.4mg). I am holding at the current 6.4mg for almost 3 months now.

 

How do you cope with the fatigue?

I never have seen anyone that says if any supplement helps or something that eases the symptom.
 

Some people say that exercises helps them, but for me exercise just worsens it and I pay for it the next couple of days with severe fatigue, stomach problems, muscle soreness & body aches.

 

Personally, I have always been moderately active and now the best thing I can do is small walks.

 

I am also hesitating if I should keep it at this dosage for more or should I continue tapering, because I do not see much of an improvement in that symptom specifically.

 

Please share your experience. It would be much appreciated to know if someone has at least made it a bit better with some method or supplement.

 

All the best in the new year!

[FireflyFyte]

9 hours ago, choytu said:

Some people say that exercises helps them, but for me exercise just worsens it and I pay for it the next couple of days with severe fatigue, stomach problems, muscle soreness & body aches.

 

Personally, I have always been moderately active and now the best thing I can do is small walks.

 

A lot of people can only handle gentle exercises during tapering such as short walks and yoga (non-strenuous).

 

Regarding fatigue, I would search the site using the instructions at How to find just about anything on this site to find how others have addressed fatigue during their tapers.

[choytu]

what do you think about reinstating to the previous dosage to try and alleviate this debilitating fatigue and afterwards try to continue with a 5% taper with a month hold?

 

because it really affects my everyday functioning.

 

would it be better? or should I stay at the same dosage for now?

[Jakeblack14]

I wouldn't rock the boat. I would hold another 2 weeks or so and monitor symptoms.

 

Have you seen any improvement from October to now?

[choytu]

24 minutes ago, Jakeblack14 said:

I wouldn't rock the boat. I would hold another 2 weeks or so and monitor symptoms.

 

Have you seen any improvement from October to now?

 

Mm I would say extremely minimal. Most of the days I am very fatigued, and with body aches and muscle weakness. I do something just one bit more strenuous I get soreness for the next days and my symptoms worsen.

 

That is why I think 10% maybe too fast for me and I am considering the BrassMonkey.

 

I want to experiment with some natural supplements like Passiflora or Ashwagandha, to see if there will be any noticeable change, because on my badest days a tiny dose of xanax helped me alleviate my symptoms.

 

!! Definitely not taking benzos long term or on a daily basis.

Only if symptoms are very bad. 

[Jakeblack14]

Totally get it, my suggestion would be to hold until you stabalize. Then start brass monkey. 

 

Ashwaganda is a anxiolytic. It mainly effects GABA activity in the brain. I would be careful.

 

I have found that Magnesium is the most beneficial. Magnesium glycinate specifically is absorbed really well and clams the body and brain🤗

[choytu]

3 minutes ago, Jakeblack14 said:

Totally get it, my suggestion would be to hold until you stabalize. Then start brass monkey. 

 

Ashwaganda is a anxiolytic. It mainly effects GABA activity in the brain. I would be careful.

 

I have found that Magnesium is the most beneficial. Magnesium glycinate specifically is absorbed really well and clams the body and brain🤗

 

Yes, Passiflora and Valeriana also target GABA the same as benzos, which help me with my symptoms.

I will try to introduce them gradually to see if it helps.

 

Otherwise I was thinking the same about holding and when everything stabilizes to continue with the BrassMonkey.

 

Did you taper Lexapro with his method?

And also:

Magnesium glycinate by which company do you use? I see good reviews for Pure Encapsulations.

[choytu]

Past 3 days I have been feeling better.
Don't know if it is a window, if the Passiflora is helping or if my newly changed eating habits (more fruits and veggies + meat - removed gluten and diary) are influencing the outcome.

Also I have started stretching everyday for 20mins, so that maybe helps too.

On 1st of January I was feeling dreadful though - I was super exhausted although we did not stay too late.
I am assuming it has something to do with alcohol, because I had 1 glass of wine and it maybe can intensify withdrawal symptoms?

[getofflex]

8 minutes ago, choytu said:

On 1st of January I was feeling dreadful though - I was super exhausted although we did not stay too late.
I am assuming it has something to do with alcohol, because I had 1 glass of wine and it maybe can intensify withdrawal symptoms?

Yes, definitely.  We strongly suggest people in withdrawal/tapering completely avoid alcohol.  It can further upset your nervous system, and in some cases make you feel worse for a while, as in several weeks.  

[choytu]

yesterday I had to take a test for a potentially new job.

 

i am working in the tech industry and thinking of solutions of problems is the main thing I do.

 

i noticed that i could not think properly and could not concentrate on the tasks - i was trying so hard to focus and come up with a solution, which increased my anxiety and stress which contributed to even worse results in thinking.

 

last time I stopped the antidepressant I remember the same thing - I was getting easily stressed, anxious and overwhelmed when trying to work and could not focus and concentrate.

 

has some experienced something like this? is this what brain fog is?

 

p.s. I also become easily anxious not only in this situation, maybe my nervous system is super sensitive now…

[choytu]

Okay, this was a first for me.

 

I was my usual body achy and weak and muscle stiff and decide to take a warm bath.

 

Got out and laid on the couch. After 10 mins decided to get up and was hit by dizziness. Usually not a problem, because it happens, but the dizziness continued throughout - plus my head was numb as well.

 

checked my blood pressure - good, no temperature. so I laid in my bed and waited it out. tried couple of times to get up, but was still dizzy.

 

after 2.5 hours most of it went away, but left not understanding if it was withdrawal somehow.

 

as for my other symptoms that bother me - could the withdrawal cause adrenal fatigue?

[choytu]

On 1/1/2024 at 9:40 PM, Jakeblack14 said:

I wouldn't rock the boat. I would hold another 2 weeks or so and monitor symptoms.

 

Have you seen any improvement from October to now?

 

I am wondering now, if I hold for example one more month which I am doing, but still the debilitating fatigue continues and I do not see any improvement, should I go back to a higher amount to elevate symptoms and continue with a smaller percentage taper or BrassMonkey? (Although it maybe too late after 4 months hold on the same dosage.)

 

What would your advice be on this topic?

[Jakeblack14]

I would hold at whatever dosage you are at until symptoms are almost non existent or really manageable. 

Constantly going up and down in dosage can cause some resiliency to happen making getting off medication harder and harder. Not to say that increasing dosage for severe withdrawal is not an option as much as we would just like to avoid it if possible. 

Once we are at a place where fatigue is minimal or non existent, I would then begin brass monkey taper. I know it can feel like we want it to be a sprint to get off of medication, but the reality is we are in a marathon. Good luck, you got this. 

[choytu]

hi, for the last couple of days I have tension headache that starts when I wake up and continues all day long.

 

i can explain it like I have a tight band around my head.

 

any suggestions if I can make it better somehow? or where to find information about it?

 

@Jakeblack14 did you have something like that?

[Jakeblack14]

I would suggest lots of water and reduce/remove caffeine. That's a common symptom I get every once in a while, just means you are healing 🤗

[VA2202]

Hi @choytu 

 

I have the same thing for the past 4 days and is extremely annoying. Feels like an aura and from time to time like a pulse in different parts of the head. 
As long as I do something and I’m engaged in some activity everything is fine, soon as I want to relax starts all over again … painkillers don’t work that much. 
@Jakeblack14 thanks for your answer, already started to feel better after seeing your replay to @choytu 😊

 

All the best to everyone and keep on going 👍🏻

[choytu]

Hi guys, 4 months has passed since i reinstated back to 6.4mg as you can see from my signature.
I do however still have lingering withdrawal symptoms.
What is the most time you held at a specific dosage? Probably time as months does not matter, rather if all symptoms are gone, only then you should continue with the taper?

[LukeUK]

1 hour ago, choytu said:

rather if all symptoms are gone, only then you should continue with the taper?

 

Generally that is the advice given on this forum.