flong: Effexor XR Tapering

[flong]

Ok ok...its possible that im becoming somewhat of an expert at the effexor taper, HOWEVER, i really messed up. I went down to -67 beads per pill, and am having a bad reaction to it. Two nights ago i layed down and closed my eyes and had the very real sensation that i was in a small boat in a storm, and the waves were tossing me around violently. NOT NORMAL.

I am on my phone writing this, so its difficult for me to go back and see exactly what my recent dosing history has been, but i may need to go even slower unfortunately. This morning was horrible...i slept a very broken and terrifying sleep for almost 11 hours before work, and felt completely out of it for hours after. I feel not too bad right now. I am having to deal with an extremely stressful life situation at the moment, and the last thing i need is to be having nasty effexor withdrawal symptoms on top of it.

[peggy]

flong, reading back, you said you were on 67% of your initial dose, so you accidently took 67 beads per capsule instead of around 130?

 

I strongly suggest that you print yourself off a schedule - don't go too far ahead incase you need to change, but just so that you can record what you took when and any withdrawal symptoms you may have experienced. That way it is more difficult to make an error.

[Altostrata]

If you've subtracted 67 beads per capsule, you may wish to subtract a smaller number next time you take your capsule, to fine-tune your taper.

 

Or, immediately take a couple of beads, to bring your adjustment to -65 beads. (Not sure how many beads you're dropping per decrease.)

[flong]

Im holding at -67 beads per pill, which is almost -34%.

Withdrawal symptoms persist today, and maybe for the next few days, but im confident this is the "second wave" of symptoms which hits about 2 weeks after a taper.

Thankfully, this is the least painful one yet so far, and i think it must be due to the micro-tapering i did this time as opposed to the 5% or 10% drop i was doing before.

As always guys, great suggestions, and I thank you kindly for helping me come off this drug in a less violent way than i had initially planned.

Until I feel a bit back to normal, i wont consider going down any more. Its still horrible, but managable for the time being.

[flong]

One more thing...I was talking to a 22 year old girl who was on the exact same dose as i was for the last few years. She was on it for maybe 6 months to a year, and stopped cold turkey when her dad's insurance ran out. She said she mostly felt overwhelmingly tired and "foggy" for a few weeks, but then she felt evrn better than before she was on it...and i'm thinking to myself, if i tried that it would absolutely kill me.

Is it possible that i am so sensitive to the amount of this drug because i've been on it for 12.5 years? I think it must be a major factor, along with the fact that it doesn't seem to be beneficial to me any longer. Any thoughts?

[Altostrata]

Duration of treatment and age both factor into ease of discontinuing.

 

We also see 22-year-olds with severe withdrawal symptoms after cold turkey. It's the luck of the draw.

[flong]

I am feeling pretty good right now. Weird "waking up" halucinations are very sporadic now, once every few days at most. Most importantly the anxiety level seems to be lower. I feel a bit more solid overall. The more time goes on, the more i am convinced that Effexor has been causing an adverse reaction in the last several years of my being on it.

It started out as such a good drug. The benefits simply can't be ignored. But the withdrawal combined with the weird symptoms ive had over the last few years almost make it not worth having been on it at all. ALMOST.

I'm starting to see the light. I am down over a third since around Haloween. At this rate i should be off around the same time next year. Roughly.

And im realizing more and more NOT to push it. As tempting as it is, I have to remember to take my time, or else face the consequences.

I started -68 beads per pill today, and will continue to go down -1 per pill per day for the next 10 days or so...and if i notice a big difference I'll hold where I am.

[peggy]

sounds good flong - it is a good feeling to feel more solid after being wobbly isn't it?

 

don't forget to have periodic holds of a few weeks to consolidate your tapers so it doesn't catch you up.

[PRISONERofEVILpills]

You had that reaction to Effexor XR because it is excessively activating for you. No wonder you feel better reducing the dosage.

 

Hi Alto--

I am reading through Flong's posts (VERY HELPFUL!), and saw this. What does excessively activating mean?

[PRISONERofEVILpills]

One more thing...I was talking to a 22 year old girl who was on the exact same dose as i was for the last few years. She was on it for maybe 6 months to a year, and stopped cold turkey when her dad's insurance ran out. She said she mostly felt overwhelmingly tired and "foggy" for a few weeks, but then she felt evrn better than before she was on it...and i'm thinking to myself, if i tried that it would absolutely kill me.

Is it possible that i am so sensitive to the amount of this drug because i've been on it for 12.5 years? I think it must be a major factor, along with the fact that it doesn't seem to be beneficial to me any longer. Any thoughts?

 

 

This must be true. I have heard of this happening, but I know how much it physically hurts to go without for 2-3 days...progressively until it overwhelms you entirely. I wish that was all we needed. I've spent way too much time on this nightmare drug.

 

Thanks for sharing! Your posts are really helping me, as you seem to have a similar taper to me :-)

[Altostrata]

Excessively activating means causing anxiety, sleeplessness, jitters, akathisia, etc.

[flong]

Over the last few days I went down 1 bead per pill per day, and I'm at -75 beads per pill per day.

I feel pretty good right now, so I'm going to hold for two weeks, since I've gone down quite a bit over the last month already.

Time to wait out any WD symptoms that may come.

I'm realizing more and more that this drug has been weakening me over the last few years...the opposite of what it did when I started taking it in 2001.

[flong]

There is a BIG difference between the 75mg and 37.5mg capsules in the TEVA-generic brand of Effexor. I don't have time to get into details, but trust me, the beads are different sizes, different numbers, and with some experimenting, presumably even different ingredients.

I realize that I am VERY sensitive to changes in this medication. But I have never felt a difference like this before.

It got so bad I couldn't even post about it here for weeks.

Now I'm better after taking different measures. I got my doctor to prescribe the 75mg pills I'm used to, and I am now counting IN my doses instead of removing beads from the pills.

Unfortunately I have to guess at the % I am down now. But two and a half weeks later I am feeling almost back to normal again. I have removed all the beads in these pills, and am counting IN 120 time release beads twice daily.

If I am feeling OK by this time next week I'll go down again. That will make about 3 weeks at this dose.

[Altostrata]

Good to hear the taper is manageable.

 

Yes, we know about the variation in beads among the dosages and manufacturers.

 

You did the right thing in sticking with the same dosage and manufacturer.

[flong]

Ten days ago i started tapering one bead per pill per day. I have gone from 120 to 110 twice daily.

I originally planned on going down to 100 before taking a break. However, i am REALLY feeling it today. So it looks like ill wait until it passes, then wait another 10 or so day until the secondary wd symptoms pass, then try 10 more beads over 10 days again.

[Finn]

Hey, flong! I'm relatively new here, but I'm tapering off Effexor XR too, so there's someone else who is going through it with you.

[Altostrata]

flong, you're tapering too fast.

 

Please do hold on the taper until those symptoms go away.

 

When we suggest tapering by one bead per day, we mean decrease by one bead and take that decrease amount for some amount of time, not to decrease by 10 beads in 10 days. For example, take one bead out of the capsule each day for a week, then take 2 beads out of the capsule each day for a week, and so forth.

 

For the sake of your nervous system, you must slow down if withdrawal symptoms appear.

[flong]

Holy crap I'm going literally 14 times faster than your method.

Like I said, Im going to hold here for the next two weeks. When it comes time for me to go down again, Im going to check back in here.

[flong]

Oh and btw, very nice to meet you Finn. Ill pm you in the next couple days...sorry im in a hurry right now. D:

[flong]

I am really very happy to report, aside from a few obvious life stressors, I am feeling as normal as I have in a long time after stablizing for the last 3 weeks. Sometimes when i bump down my dose, I get so stressed out about going crazy...but it really IS temporary.

Unfortunately, I guess this means I should probably think about going down in dosage again D:

[Altostrata]

Yay for stabilizing! Thanks for letting us know how you're doing, flong.

[flong]

As of today, I am at 99 beads twice a day.

I got rid of the biggest stressor in my life two days ago (abusive, drug-addict girlfriend of 2.5 years). It hurts like hell. But after over a year of trying to get myself off effexor and healthy, and spending every day worrying and caring for her, I finally cut her out completely. I am trying to get better, and it seems like she is actively and steadily getting worse, which has serious concequences on my getting better.

She is like a drug herself: I am definitely going through WD from her even though she is bad for me! But in the long run I KNOW I will be better off.

Hope I can find the strength to stay away.

[flong]

About 2 weeks ago I reduced my dose by almost 10%. Within a couple days I was having horrid headaches, vomiting, sensitivity to light...almost migraine-like symptoms. So I went up about 2% for a few days until the symptoms wore off, then settled back down 2% again. I thought I was in the clear, but then I had one of those 10-hour panic attacks again. I havent had one since BEFORE I started coming off Effexor. Ever since it happened almost a week ago, I havent been right at all, though it seems to be slowly getting better.

I dont know how much can be blamed on the drug, and how much can be blamed on my own susceptability to having them.

The point is, I thought they were a thing of the past. Now all I can think about is that Im stuck with them until I die. It is easy to deal with wd synptoms of Effexor compared to the absolute horror of one of these epic, marathon panic-attacks.

[Altostrata]

It sounds like you are reducing by too much and too quickly. Suggest stabilizing and then reducing by perhaps one bead at a time.

[flong]

I am down to counting in 87 beads twice daily. I am afraid to go down any quicker than I am. Its been almost two months and Ive only gone down 3 beads twice a day. At this rate it will be years before Im off it. But I have been so unstable lately that Im afraid of going down any further.

I know that the reduction must be gradual, one or two at a time, and never 10 or more at a time like before. I re-read my last post...and its almost like Im stuck in this kind of "de-realization" state since I dropped so much in June. I can't even imagine what it would be like if I had gone cold turkey like I had pondered at one point...

[Rhiannon]

I know how discouraging it can be to have a calendar goal in mind, and then to realize you aren't going to make it. I have finally (after 3 years of tapering multiple meds) given up the calendar goals altogether, but it sure took me a long time to do it.

 

The important thing is to listen to your body and taper at the rate your own individual body can handle.  Reading over your thread it sounds to me like you tend to push it and then get slammed.  You can actually temper that so that you don't have to get so slammed.  

 

And when you hold and stabilize and you're feeling better, once in a while just give yourself an extra week or two of holding. I think our brains thank us for it when we do that. 

[flong]

I'm at 72 beads twice daily. Over the last month or two I have been stepping up the tapering, but have now reached my limit again. One yeat ago I started at 214 beads twice daily. I am staying positive that within the next year Ill be completely off Effexor. I am staying realistic though. According to almost everything I've read, the toughest battle is ahead of me this year.

[Lexy]

Flong

How are you doing?

I see you decreased last month, how are the WDs?

[flong]

As of about 10 days ago I am down to 58 beads twice a day, which is about 27% of my original dose in October 2012. I'm pretty happy about this. And I'm still shocked I haven't been able to go down faster and be rid of it by now. I would like to be off this stuff in 2014, but I'm being realistic too. I made some pretty crazy jumps down in dose last year, and I really paid for it. Going down by 10X2 beads at once is really hard. I'm sure some people can handle the jump, but I can't. I notice a decrease of one or two X2. So I've decided to stick with decreasing by 1X2 at once when I feel strong enough to do it. Right now I can't even think about it. Last week I was having those "morning hallucinations" again, which I haven't had in several months, and I can feel it in my bones that it's because I decreased too fast since early December. So I just have to keep the slow and steady routine, and encourage others to do the same.

[Altostrata]

The advantage to tapering using Effexor liquid is that you can reduce by less than the amount in a bead.

[Lexy]

Flong

I know what you mean...I can feel a .25mg decrease. I have been holding for 3weeks. Yesterday I felt it in my bones. Barely made it to school, came home and stayed in bed all day.

[flong]

It's been quite a while since I posted here. I have some updates.

I'm now at 12.5% of my original dose of Effexor XR. Almost all of the horrible parts of being on it are gone now. That's the good part.

The bad part is, I had to deal with a major stress, and I came totally unglued. I ended up in the hospital last week, and was actually tested for Ebola and quarantined because I had many of the symptoms...obviously that's not what it was! But the stress caused a physical reaction I've never experienced before. Not even close. Which scared the hell out of me. For the first time I am considering seriously taking something else because I simply can't handle major stress like I used to. I talked to my doctor and was given a script for 100mg Wellbutrin once a day. Which I haven't filled yet. Until I talk to y'all.

After this last ordeal, I admit that I may not be wired to deal with MAJOR stress on my own like I used to. I also don't use drugs or alcohol whatsoever any longer, which admittedly would have temporarily helped me through this life-bomb. I'm also so low on Effexor that any therapeutic effects are long gone.

I don't know what to do here. But I know I shouldn't leave myself in a position where that can happen to me again. 

[Lexy]

Hi Flong

I am so sorry you are going through this. Could this be neuro emotions? When I get upset, stressed, angry Over something minor I tend to feel it to an extreme. I can't even imagine a major life changing event.

Someone once told me...

When we're in distress, we want to change things in order to fix it. It's human nature. What you're going to have to do is ignore that way of thinking! Which isn't easy, because it's built right into us! Stay the course for the next month. I bet you'll start feeling a bit more normal as time goes on. Your body and mind know how to deal with it...you just have to work on outsmarting your natural instincts to make a change every time you don't feel right!

That was you my friend.

You are strong, you have gotten over other downs I have complete faith this will past. It When we're in distress, we want to change things in order to fix it. It's human nature. What you're going to have to do is ignore that way of thinking! Which isn't easy, because it's built right into us! Stay the course for the next month. I bet you'll start feeling a bit more normal as time goes on. Your body and mind know how to deal with it...you just have to work on outsmarting your natural instincts to make a change every time you don't feel right!may take time but this is the cards we have been dealt with, we learn to play them.

I've always felt your support no matter what my actions were...I am here for you as well.

Take care.

[flong]

Good God. I did say that didn't I.

Well that certainly gives me something to think about.

I have been completely against taking something new, but I've recently been brought to my knees by something that normally wouldn't be that bad. Well it was BAD by normal standards, something that should have majorly stressed me out. But when I think about it, what I went through in 2012 was WAY worse. By a long shot. And though I survived that, I never had the physical symptoms I had recently. It's been over 3 weeks, and I'm still sick. But yes, now I am reminded that things get better. I'm just wondering if I'm suffering far more than I should be.

Effexor is bloody evil. Wellbutrin is probably evil as well, but it's a completely different drug, and even if it doesn't work out (eventually I'll need to get off it anyway) it's reportedly far easier to come off than Effexor.

I am totally divided. I don't want to suffer this much, but I don't want to be on these drugs anymore at all.

[Lexy]

I had been very against taking snythjng rlse to get off this crap, however I got to a point where the depression withdrawal was not letting up.

My new advised me to take a new med at a very low dose. Not sure if it's helping or if I am stabilizing or maybe a placebo effect. I debated for more than a month whether to take it or not. One day I just felt it was time to either take it or stop thinking about taking it.

Well I've been going lower on effexor a bit quicker

than I had been.

You will come to a decision sooner or later. Only thing I can advise is to start at a very low dose to see how you do. And wait there to see if it has a therapeutic effect.

Hugs

[Ramsnic]

Hey. I'm down to 10mg Effexor and my emotions are all over the place. I don't get sad u get devastated. I don't get stressed I get suicidal. I wS told on here it's the withdrawal and I agree.

We feel draper pain and anxiety because our minds are in pain of the withdrawal.

I wouldn't take the new tablet us you can hold off doing that. Continue getting off this one and focus in getting healthy. Starting a new drug with new side effects and new anxieties is a big chance to take.

Thinking of you.