Lexy: tapering off Effexor

[Newbeginning]

Why then did you continue decreasing, instead of staying or even going back to the prior dose?

 

I agree with what you said. Don't cut the dose unless the withdrawal has subsided, which is a sign your body has adapted to the new dose (or at least it's safe to assume that).

 

I'm not even sure the problem started in May, if you say you've had withdrawal symptoms all along while microtapering. It might be you never really gave your body enough time to adapt before you tapered further. Then symptoms worsened with every microtaper until they got bad enough that you noticed.

[Lexy]

NewBeginning

My last decrease was in May 22, 2014. I've been holding since then.  My new doctor seems to think that my dosing (using both XR and IR) is not the problem.

I'm not sure if I believe that since when I changed  dose from IR to XR my headaches and vertigo were completely gone the very next day.  However the mood swings started coming in more frequent and lasting most of the day.   I immediately changed back partial dose to IR and seemed to help the depression mood.  During these changes I did not taper until these moods were gone.  Zaps had diminished by a third and decided to use part of my summer to taper and stabilize. I know I can't really say where I went wrong….not holding until zaps were gone?….switching to XR?….Tapering a little faster than usual?

 

I'm so afraid to get on new Brintellix AD as it is brand new med, not much on internet about it.  I know one person who took it and depression got worse.

I know if I dont try it I'll never know,  but am I able to stabilize if I don't change anything without getting on any other drug?

 

I am trying to find a psychologist who can help me deal with antidpressant withdrawal syndrome.  

[Newbeginning]

What about your hormones? Could it be something else changed in May? Have you had a medical check since?

 

When did you start the cannabis and the hormones?

 

I do think tapering when you still had brain zaps was a mistake. A 30% decrease in symptoms means your brain is adapting, but is still unbalanced and any change could destabilize it more.

 

I think it makes sense the change from xr to ir could cause problems. You are more sensitive than average to these meds and so in your case it makes sense the change from xr to ir could affect you.

 

Your sigtnature says you decreased to 40mg in June. I guess you meant in May.

[trouper]

newbeginning,

sorry for highjacking lexy's thread but what is the best way to get hormones tested? an ND had mine tested using saliva but not sure how accurate they are. i asked my PCP to check them and he did a pituitary test (FSH & LH.) 

[mammaP]

Lexy I would not risk starting a new med, these poisons were all new meds once and were 

considered wonder drugs. Now look at us.....all of us! 

You tapered too fast and pressed on even when you had withdrawal and it caught up with you. 

I think your doctor is clutching at straws, you are wanting something to make it better and he is

offering what he has at his disposal.  There will have been no trials on someone in effexor 

withdrawal, or any trials mixing the drugs. It will be entirely experimental. 

I would stay put and things will settle down in time. 

[Lexy]

Family and I went to a out of town function and i missed a dose one day and few days later was late taking morning dose.  I've had so many zaps, I wonder if thats whats giving me a migraine.  At one point these zaps were so many that paralyzed me and had to sit on the ground for few seconds.  It seems that when I get so many zaps then the depression comes on stronger.  

I"ve started taking the fish oils to try and see if they calm down a bit.

 

I started cannabis when I was experiencing a lot of headaches and vertigo; it does help bring the depression and wds a level or two lower.  I told my doctor this and his attitude was if I don't experience any paranoia or have worse symptoms after using it, then its helping only by dampening the wds.

 

Trouper, feel free to ask anything on my thread.  That's why we are all here to learn from others.

 

New Beginning, appreciate all your interest and concern.  I hope you are doing better.

 

MammaP, I am very weary on starting a new med and I understand what you are saying.  My new doctor does believe in withdrawals however I am afraid of adding more poison to the pot. (lol)

[Lexy]

I am corresponding with someone who also has been struggling with effexor.  She's on 37.5mg and just emailed me to let me know that she tried Fo-Ti (chinese herb supplement) and decreased her depression mood.  I am trying to research this herb and asking if anyone has tried this? She has been struggling for years and started taking Fo-Ti, and also switched from  brand name Effexor o Generic Effexor immediate release and feels that this combination has helped her from one day to the next.  She hasn't felt this good in years although not all wds are gone but the crying and depression have subsided a lot.

 

I feel I should go this route before any other drugs.  Any suggestions?

[trouper]

hey, lexy.  how are things going? did you find the fo-ti?

[Lexy]

Hi

Yes I took it and didn't seem to help. I need to ask how long it took to feel benefits from the Fo-Ti.

I will be trying the Taurine next. I read in the symptoms and care topics that it's helped others.

[trouper]

sorry it didn't help good luck with the taurine. i've never tried it.

[Lexy]

Just got back from new psychologist, who i wanted to help me with coping with withdrawal symptoms.   She said I should be tested for Lyme.  Im really freaking out about this.  What if all this time I had been thinking its withdrawals when actually its Lyme and have not been treated??

[flong]

My ex had strange symptoms for years, and it turned out she had a parasite. Easily treated, but difficult to diagnose properly.

Sounds unlikely and far-fetched that you have Lyme disease, but you never know until you have it looked into. Can you imagine if you had an answer so easily?

How have you been anyway? Any improvements?

[Lexy]

Hi Flong

Seems like one symptom overpowers another. The depression wave is not as intense as it was however the joint and body aches are higher, plus dealing with nausea and lightheadedness of new med, brintelix. I'm only taking 2.5mg to ease symptoms but I don't know if I can take the nausea and queasiness.

About the lyme I spoke to psychiatrist who also said it's unlikely because it would be such a coincidence that my symptoms started the second day when I cut effexor by half.

Also he mentioned the tests for lyme have many false positives and I would be placed on antibiotic treatments which could hinder the tapering if effexor.

 

How are you? Are you almost done getting off effexor?

[flong]

I'm down under 15%. It's harder going down at this point. I'm dropping slowly. At this rate it will take between 6 months and a year to be completely rid of it. And who knows...maybe longer. I'm being patient. I'd rather have a tiny bit in my system than have to deal with the horrid WDs.

[Lexy]

Good to hear. You know exactly what to do.????

[Lexy]

I was on effexor immediate and switched part of my dose to XR last year. Big mistake!

I now don't have any idea as to how to taper. Do I taper the XR first? Or intermittently?

What I have been doing is going down by one bead which is about .30mg and adding it back to immediate. I use a scale to decrease the immediate. I decrease by .25mg on the IR. When I decrease the XR I am subtracting a bead .30mg and adding .25mg of immediate. I only actually decrease .05 using this method.

My taper schedule has been as follows:

.05mg - one bead .30mg off add .25 IR

.25mg - decrease IR

.05mg

.25mg

Tapering 6-7% a monthly

Question Should keep tapering this way? To afraid to switch to liquid.

[Altostrata]

If it works, why not stick to it?

[ladybug]

Good to see you, Lexy! I've been wondering how you've been. You probably don't know me since I mostly posted on PP, but I've been following your story here and have been rooting for you.

 

I agree with Alto, this method seems to be working for you so far so why change anything?

[Lexy]

Thanks for your replies.

I needed reassurance as I'm always second guessing myself.

[westcoast]

Lexy, how are you doing?

[Lexy]

Hi west coast

Thanks for asking. I am still tapering and struggling along. I haven't updated however I am often on the forum looking for any info, advice, suggestions that can help.

When I get a chance I will update my sig line.

[Newbeginning]

Hi Lexy,

 

How is the tapering going? How did you do with the Brintelix? Still with the withdrawal specialist?

 

Wish you well,

[Lexy]

Hi NewBeginning,

I have been taking 3mg of brintellix. It seems to buff the wds a little. My doctor doesn't want to up the dose on Brintellix as I am to sensitive. It took months for the nausea to subside which is a common side effect of Brintellix. My doctor gave me this new med because of the long half life as opposed to effexor's short half life.

Last summer the sad intrusive thoughts came in, I had no relief. That's when I decided to find a new doctor, thanks to Alto, she referred Dr. Prey to me. With his help I've been able to decrease consistently since September 2014. I am currently at 23mgs on effexor/3mgs Brintellix. I've been tapering at about 6-8% monthly. I am planning on going even slower when I reach 20mgs.

I am still feeling a whole bunch of sxs however they're not as severe as they were last summer. This has been the hardest thing I've had to endure; hopefully this will soon be over and forgotten.

[Lexy]

Update

For the past two weeks depression has been appearing again almost all day. I rate it a 6.5 out of 10 being worse. There are spikes of 7-9 for couple hours. Prior to two ago it was about a 5 and would spike up to 7.5.

Did I drop too much last month? I dropped 10% in April, before that I was doing 6-8 % cuts. I have been micro tapering through out my tapering. Should I go slower? My doctor doesn't want to increase the brintellix as I have too many side effects. Nausea, more fatigue, etc

[Lexy]

Has anyone heard of low dose naltrexone? My doctor has prescribed for me for chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia wd symptoms. Ha vented tried it yet. I'm still trying to get info. Haven't heard anyone whose tried it to help wds.

[Lexy]

I'm tapering both immediate and XR effexor.

I decrease by one bead a week which is about .30mg

and decrease by .25mg of immediate/weekly. Since I'm at lower dose 20.60mg now I find decreasing a bead a

Week too much. Now I'm taking out a bead and also weighing the beads and adding .25mg immediate back which is a decrease of .05mg. I've also added back .50mg of immediate then decrease the immediate by .25mg twice that week to get back to my dose and that seems to help with a softer landing a little when decreasing the XR bead. Is that way too inconsistent? I do that because I could immediately feel the decrease in one bead.

[Altostrata]

I can't follow what you're doing. I would decrease the immediate-release (by making a liquid) rather than reducing the XR at all right now.

 

Decreasing the XR by one bead a week is clearly too fast. When you've finished tapering off the IR, perhaps you should think of decreasing a bead of XR every 10 days or 2 weeks.

[peggy]

I am with Alto here Lexy - I am completely confused by your method.

 

I haven't read your thread, so don't know why you are doing both XR and IR - i am personally all for simplicity; why not convert to IR and either have a liquid made or do it yourself and then dose twice daily and - i would think that would be a much more consistent way of getting your dose even, rather than mucking around with the way you are at the moment

[Lexy]

I don't know what's going....

Last month I did try the low dose naltrexone in hopes it would help the fatigue and fibromyalgia symptoms. Doctor prescribed the .5mg twice however I only took .5mg once daily for 10 days. After the third day of taking I felt drugged, and dizzy. My doctor wanted me to keep taking it as it takes a while to start working. I couldn't handle these side effects and wds at only once a day. I stopped the naltrexone and felt nauseous, vomiting, faint, dizzy. Doctor said it was wds from the naltrexone which I had I asked him the first place if there were any wds,,!!??

 

It's been 3 weeks since I last took it and am currently at 19.14mgs of effexor. I'm still feeling all above symptoms and more; very faint, flurry of brain zaps, sugar cravings. I had these wd symptoms when I cut effexor by 50%. I'm not sure if it's the naltrexone wds or the vomiting up my effexor doses, or if its the tapering.

On a positive note the mood swings and dark thoughts have decreased in length and intensity. Hope I don't jinx myself.

Usually when a wd symptom moves to the forefront other sxs will step aside and wait it's turn again.

[Lexy]

I forgot to mention I'm still on the same dose of brintellix 3mg which doc said it would help buff Effexor wds because it has a longer half life. Not sure it's helped.

Another symptom I've noticed more often now is ringing in my ears. Is all this due to being lower on Effexor? It's taking me three years to in trying to get off this drug and the last 2 1/2 years I've been lowering 3-8%. Why is it still going on?

[Newbeginning]

Wow Lexy. It sounds like you're going through a rough time.

 

I feel for you girl. The uncertainty of not knowing what is the exact cause or when it's going to end; the lack of control over it all, the lack of reliable help from professionals, it all adds up to a lot of stress, which undoubtedly makes everything worse. It intensifies every symptom, especially the anxiety, but also the depression and fatigue.

 

If you've given any med enough time to work and it is not helping, I would carefully taper off of it. The last thing you need is to add to the neurological chaos in your brain by taking more stuff with no obvious benefit.

 

You also don't want to get hooked on any new drugs if they're not really helping you tapering or dealing with withdrawal. That happened to me with prozac: I used it to taper effexor and when it wasn't helping cross taper anymore, it was too late to quit it. I had to taper from it too, and even worse, endure its horrible side effects. How I wish I had just tapered effexor on its own!

 

All along, I've suspected there might be something else going on in your case. Withdrawal may still affect you, but it doesn't mean there is nothing else going on. I urge you to follow your psychologist's advice and get checked for lyme. Also get an updated thorough medical check. Consult with a naturopath physician. Consult with relevant specialists, such as endocrinologists, neurologists, etc. You need to get more perspectives on this that may shed some new light on the issue.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like in 3 years you have not really improved, even though you have tapered slowly for the most part. Exchanging one symptom for another is not really improvement, in my opinion. Your brain has had a lot of time to stabilize. Yet, overall, you're still quite unstable. This to me is also suggestive that there might be something else going on.

 

What about the cannabis? Are you still on it?

 

Needless to say, I wish you well. You have youth on your side and the support of your loved ones. Keep the hope. I struggled for years before I found some healing and peace of mind. You can too and you will.

 

PM me anytime if you need me. Warm hugs!

[Lexy]

Thanks NewBeginning for your warm wishes.

 

My pdoc thinks the lightheadedness & feeling faint (haven't fainted yet)

Is due to hormonal changes and being lower on the effexor. He asked about birth control, what kind and where I was at on the packet.

I take the birth control to stop my cycle however this past month I took the placebos which I'm supposed to take every 3-4 months.

However these symptoms began a day or two before starting the placebos.

He ordered blood tests to make sure nothing else is going on.

Now I'm feeling very anxious...if there is something else going on and I would need to take other meds that can interfere with effexor tapering.

 

Also I've noticed brain zaps and sugar cravings have increased during this time.

[AliG]

 Are you still on the "naltrexone" ??   It seems to be an off- label use , for  chronic fatigue & fibromyalgia.  Dizzyness& light- headedness, are"withdrawal symptoms".  It's an opiate antagonist.   I hope you're doing better , soon.

[Lexy]

Thanks for you reply

It's been three weeks since I last took low dose naltrexone. On it I felt drugged, had slurred speech, more loopy, increase fatigue.

Off it I had more nausea, vomiting and now increased lightheaded to point of feeling faint.

I specifically asked my pdoc if there were any wds. After the fact he said not to stop taking it since there could be withdrawals...,,??!

Actually I had already stopped before he mentioned it. He prescribed .5mg twice daily however I only took .5mg once a day so I figured it would go away soon.

[AliG]

 Thank god  you're off it.  They use it for so many different things. It's just more B/S.  I didn't want to say to much, but just "google" it  - It's just about the $$$$$.  I'm glad you're off.      These Doctor's are "idiots". !!

 

 At least you've only been going through this for a few  years. Not to "minimize" it, but the damage , is less. Take care of yourself,   Hugs,  Ali.

[Altostrata]

Good to hear some of your Effexor withdrawal symptoms have decreased.