☼ Skybert: needs help - delayed onset Lexapro withdrawal

[Nikki]

Hello Skybert....your English is excellent

 

Lexapro was one of the AD's I have taken.  I tapered for 2 years and my cuts were small.  They were never more than 1 mgs. sometimes in the beginning it was 2mgs.  My experience was a painful WD....Lots of anxiety/depression and crying spells.  I ad flu like symptoms and aches and pains and a big one was short term memory loss.  I could not retain information.

 

What you are experiencing seems like WD, very much so.

 

The first few times I tried to get off Lexapro I made 5mg. cuts in dose and after a few weeks I had to go back to the original dose where I stabilized and felt much better.

 

Maybe the increase you are on now is too small. I think for myself, the only way I can see if something is going to work is to just try it.  We usually know quickly whether or not increasing was a good thing.  Sometimes it doesn't feel right or the symptoms take a week of so to lift.  As Bubble said she started small and needed to increase a second time.

 

I had increased back to my original dose.  Wish I could have done it with 15mgs.

 

More will come along with suggestions and you can think about them all.  We know how it feels.....

[skybert]

Thank you for the advice (and the English thing:) )

I am just so scared of this whole mess. I don't want to make it worse. Like this is pretty much the limit of pain I can take before I have to do something drastic. What do I do if the increase is unsuccessful? Do I just stop taking it right away or do I have to taper that dose somewhat to? Do I go straight to 5mg or start with 1mg or something like that? I just really don't want to mess this up even more. Then I would need some kind of sedative or something just in case.  

[Narcissus]

 

 

What do I do if the increase is unsuccessful? Do I just stop taking it right away or do I have to taper that dose somewhat to? Do I go straight to 5mg or start with 1mg or something like that?

 

I'd be careful and move slowly at this point since you're struggling so much.  If you want to try going up maybe try with a milligram.  How are you measuring your dosages?

[Petunia]

Hi Skybert,

I just read back through your thread to get an idea of how your reinstatement is effecting you.  It seems like you got an increase in anxiety type symptoms soon after reinstatement, but then started to feel better and had quite a long window, but now, your symptoms have become worse again.  Would this be right?

 

Read through this topic again about reinstatement and stabilization and see if what you are experiencing seems like a normal window and wave pattern:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3079-about-reinstating-and-stabilizing-to-stop-withdrawal-symptoms/

 

In general, if you have felt better since reinstating 2.5mg, but have suddenly got a wave, you might want to to give it a few more days to see if it passes.  Stabilization can sometimes take several months, maybe longer.

 

You could updose, but you might not need to.  Last time, when you reinstated, at first you got an increase in symptoms, before starting to feel better, so there is a possibility that if you do increase your dose, you may actually feel worse for a few days.

 

Its your decision what you do, and no one can predict the outcome because everyone reacts differently.  But as Narcissus recommended, I would make only small changes at this time.

 

I hope this wave passes soon, if you are keeping a record of your symptoms, it will help you to look back and see that you are recovering.

 

Please let us know what you decide to do and keep us updated regularly, that way we can provide more support and help you through the rough patches.

 

Petu.

 

 

[skybert]

Thanks for all the good advice:) I use a special knife to cut a 5mg tablet in half to get the 2.5mg right now. I don't measure.

Petu: That would be right.

Last night at around 12 I got a small window that lasted for about 30 minutes. I have slept all night(JIPPI!) now and feel better than yesterday.

Still feel confused and unreal right now but better than yesterday all in all. The pain has shifted in my head and I no longer feel pressure in the face.

I usually feel worse in the morning and daytime anyways and calm down in the evening somewhat so I'm going to wait and see how this plays out.

Still pretty scared and dizzy but that little window kind of made me see that even when I'm this far out my normal self is still there, hidden under all the SSRI insanity. It's so weird to get that normal feel for a while and everything goes back into place in your head and you get so happy only to have it taken away again. This loss of myself is what scares me the most. And this whole experience is so unreal to me. I can't quite seem to get back to reality. It's so scary. I have had DP/DR before but this is not in the same way. Feels like a countdown to complete breakdown and losing my sanity a little more day by day.

 

Anyways... I got your nose! Hihi.

So right now I'm staying at 2.5mg and waiting for the calmness of the evening.

Thanks for all the help:) It really means a lot to me! 

[bubble]

what you write also means a lot to me. I'm so glad to hear about those little windows. I totalyl understand you how you feel. But isn't that a question of the glass being half empty or half full. I also feel at times like you so nicely put it that it's a countdown to complete breakdown and losing my sanity little by little but when I have a window, I could also say I'm pick up pieces of myself little by little.

 

Don't you think?

 

It's just that that fear generated pessimism is so much stronger...

[skybert]

Hi bubble:)

Spot on with that analogy.

I guess it all comes with experience. I remember when this first started in August and I started reading up on this stuff, I was terrified. It's been a process of denial, disbelief and grief. I think I'm now coming to accept it. But it's still very hard. 

I had been through what I thought was the hardest period of my life. I beat it! I was back! I was working 100% I could feel again my mind had calmed down I was looking forward to the future. I had figured it all out, it was the meds that made me feel so awful. But I was now off this **** so everything was going to be okay. I was confident I could beat this monster and move on. That all changed over one night. I just thought it was a setback that felt strong, but would pass. Turned out it was much more serious. How could I know? What have they done to me? How can I ever go through all of this again? And this thing cannot be beaten by the same methods and literature I used before. This is so much stronger. The windows always made me think it was over. How can I revert to think and feel awful again? I feel good now. It's over. I guess I wasn't as bad as I thought. Then the next wave hits and it turns out that is not true at all. I admire anyone that can go through this. This is so hard. And people suffering for years and years and never give up. Life after this is going to feel like a long vacation:) 

I've been hesitant in all the writing and keeping track of everything because deep down I thought this thing would be over soon so there would be no point.

Like oh hey yeah I hear what you guys are saying but I don't need to put so much effort into this cause I'm almost done with this thing. I think my initial learning curve on how to handle this thing is over. I now know it needs to be taken seriously and could last a long long time. 

Thank you all for saving me.    

[skybert]

bubble have your read http://npanth.wordpress.com/category/ssri-2/ ?

It's awesome. Start from the bottom. You probably have. But just thought I would mention it in case you haven't.

[bubble]

thanks a lot for the link skybert! haven't seen it yet. I only came to this site on the 1 October and started my process of enlightment.

 

It's funny though that a few days after I stopped teaking Escitalopram and experienced severe withdrawal symptoms my boyfriend googled this forum for me and read that sentence: stopping Lexapro too fast is like throwing your brain off the cliff.

 

But it was a beginning, I still felt strong, I felt like I could beat this thing just if I endure a little longer. It was only month and a half after that that I did the google search on my own on Lexapro withdrawal and hit this forum again...

 

So I'm still new and learning. Learning so much from all of you, especially people like you skybert who can put into words so nicely how we feel.

 

Had such a nice window after feeling completely disabled the whole morning. It's simply incredible how things change from feeling solid and everything is ok, I'm fine to the feeling of total dread, instability and the ground shaking under you...

 

Look forward to reading from the site

[skybert]

Glad my crazy streak could help you. To be continued...

Wishing you lots of windows.

[Rhiannon]

Hello Sky--

 

I agree 100% with Petu's and Narcissus's advice above. Stabilization is not linear and it can take a long time after reinstatement before things really settle down. Of course our first urge when we are in terrible suffering is "do something anything anything anything!" I have felt that urgency myself and I know what it's like. And at those times we tend to want to change our meds, add or subtract something. The problem is, often what our brains really need is just a long long time of stability. Nobody poking around in them, nobody yanking out one chemistry from them and shoving in another one. So our attempts to "fix" ourselves can end up making things worse.

 

But you do have room to updose a bit more if you want to, but I agree 100% that given your current unstable state, you should make only very tiny changes at one time and then hold them for at least two weeks before making further changes. I would not go up or down by more than 0.1 mg, and probably less.

 

Which means you need to be thinking about coming up with a more precise method of measuring your doses. Cutting with a knife allows quite a bit of variation from one day to the next. 

 

There are a lot of threads on this forum about different ways of measuring our meds. Amazon sells a milligram scale that's not the best in the world but is better than nothing. That's how I started, dry cutting using a scale, and it has worked for other people too. 

 

So please look into getting a scale so that you can make your dosages more precise and accurate.

 

And other than that, I am so sorry for the horrific suffering you endure, I know what that's like, I have been there too in the past.  My heart goes out to you.

 

In our Symptoms and Self-Care area, if you read back a few pages, you will find many good suggestions for things that can help. I would say that probably (for me) the most stabilizing, easiest thing to do is gentle walking for an hour or so, when you can. There seems to be something special about walking that helps regulate the nervous system.  And keep to a regular daily schedule of eating (when you can) and sleeping and other activity (when you can).

 

If you can keep things as steady as possible, as unchanging as possible, for your nervous system, so it can heal, over time you will definitely recover.

 

Also, this thread: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1160-brain-remodeling/

 

might help you understand why it is important to make either no changes or very small ones at this point in time.

 

Good luck!

[skybert]

Thank you Rhi:) 

I will stay at 2.5 for the time being and see how it plays out. It is just so scary when the waves seem to get gradually worse. Before I could at least feel normal every now and then and usually pretty good in the evening. That doesn't happen anymore. Today I feel dead inside. And everything seems of. Oh well I guess I could try and sleep... Thanks guys..

 

[skybert]

So I have decided to up the dose a little and see what happens. 

It's just to much now. No windows whatsoever and the pain of living is making me insane.

No calmness in the evenings. I'm thinking about doing 3mg. I would measure 5ml water and dissolve a 5mg tablet in it. Use an oral syringe and measure 3ml from it and squirt into my mouth. I would pour out the remaining medicine since that is only 2ml left and would make it hard to hit the 3ml.

I get all the meds free anyways.

Sounds like a plan?

[skybert]

I have some sedatives called sobril 15mg just in case this does not work out at all. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxazepam

I really despise meds in every way and form and would only do this if it is a crisis. 

[skybert]

Never mind! This to shall pass! But I will start using the oral syringe. The cutting is not good enough. Man I am such a mess! Please laugh at me:)

[Altostrata]

Your method of making and taking a liquid sounds good.

[skybert]

Having a window right now!!!

I'm so happy I'm crying!

I needed to tell you guys after this horrible horrible period!

Thank you all so much for helping me. This is what I needed. Hope. I don't care if it ends soon. I just needed some hope!

Laters

[bubble]

very happy to hear that;) and thanks for sharing

[skybert]

Hi bubble:)

Yeah it was great. I was just crying with joy. I felt connected and forgot what hurts so much. My thoughts went back to normal parsing and I felt love for the people around me. Well it lasted for about an hour and now I'm back in my hole. But like I said. It gave me hope:) That's all I needed right now. Because of the severity of this wave was making me very much scared and nervous. But my old self is still in there somewhere waiting.

[alex]

Having a window right now!!!

I'm so happy I'm crying!

I needed to tell you guys after this horrible horrible period!

Thank you all so much for helping me. This is what I needed. Hope. I don't care if it ends soon. I just needed some hope!

Laters

 

GOOD!!!!!!!!!!

[skybert]

I know:)

And: Gratulerer med vel overstått 60årsdag den 8 november!!!!

You get what I mean with that:)

[bubble]

very interesting that i felt my window yesterday as a very intense feeling of closeness and connectedness with whom i ve been rather detached as a symptom of my emotional numbness.

I think i wrote about it in detail in my thread during insomnic hours this night.

If i'm correct,you upped a dose a bit using a liquid and after a long while had a window?

Wishing you more windows!

bubble

[Petunia]

So I have decided to up the dose a little and see what happens. 

..... I'm thinking about doing 3mg.

 

Did you updose to 3mg?

[skybert]

No I did not updose. I decided to not do it. But I am using the the oral syringe now.

The pill cutting was not accurate enough. Maybe this helps and makes me more stable.

[alex]

I know:)

And: Gratulerer med vel overstått 60årsdag den 8 november!!!!

You get what I mean with that:)

 

Hello my viking friend.Mmmmm...something to do with my birthday....??

No hablo Noruego....

 Hugs,A.

[skybert]

You got it !

Anyways guys.. today I'm trying to take stock of this whole mess. 

This night was rough. I had a panic attack witch don't really scare me a whole lot anymore. Actually it's kind of refreshing to get all that built up adrenaline out in one heavy burst. When things feel over the top I kind of wish for it to happen so I can kinda get it out.

Question: When in a wave as bad as this is it common to have changing symptoms from day to day. In my case they are mostly emotional rape, obsessions, confusion, neuro-fear, depression, anhedonia, demotivation, some dizzyness, headache and face pressure. The psychological stuff is somewhat related yet everyday it's different and it seems to get worse and worse and kind of end up in the worst scenario witch I don't want to write, but we all know what it is.

It's just so overwhelming and it stays all day long. I don't know how I keep myself going right now. The thing is, when this mess started it was all about heavy pain and zaps in the head. I actually only had head zaps for one night and never got it again. The psychological stuff was there but in small bursts of dread, joy , anhedonia, depression but they only lasted for an hour or so each. It was hard but manageable. The next wave was more of this stuff but way worse than the first one, but still felt normal every now and then. I guess I was somewhat more agitated and bodily pains where more severe. That wave came to an end with a massive panic attack and went away after a few days after that. I thought, well that as bad as it gets and was kinda positive. I survived. But then this wave came along and man oh man, this thing is a mess. The daily "breaks" are over and I only got a 30min window of relief,  and why do I seem to get worse and worse? Why are my waves becoming more intense? Does anyone have any idea? Yes I'am back at the damn meds reevaluation thing. I need some kind of relief. I have not been at work since august and I was hoping for some more progress instead of worsening at this point. I don't need much. Just something.. Anything.. Are these intense long lasting waves a good sign of healing? And is the fact that they are more constant instead of up's and downs a good sign or is that a bad sign? I know nobody knows but I needed to vent.. 

Thanks guys.

[alex]

I am so sorry you are going through such a nightmare;yes, it is "normal" to feel the way you are.

It is the way your your body-brain tries to get balanced again.As horrible as it is, you have to think of it as your body healing.

It gets better S;believe me, I've been there.

How is your sleep?

 

Hang in there.

 

Hugs, A.

[skybert]

The sleep is okay I guess. I wake up early sometimes but usually I can go back to sleep.

I feel so strange though. I don't feel like myself anymore and can't put my anxiety into words anymore. 

I can't explain how I feel anymore it just feels so wrong and not like myself at all. It's like a knot in my head with fear that is stuck and I can't get it out or explain what it is. Always uneasy. I just hope I don't feel like this much longer. It's hard to stay calm when I feel so strange. Like I need to check that it's me and this is happening. Checking my memory both long term and short term. Unable to attach the right emotions to things. Feels like losing myself or something. Very unsettling feeling that won't leave me.

Thanks Alex:) 

[bubble]

i admire your endurance.You write so clearly about these extreme states and your spirit is strong under all this rubble.

 

I'm very impressed with the way you see panic attacks as a relief of built up anxiety.I m so so scared of panic attacks because in my experience they would always leave me devastated:like an awful typhoon from which i wasn't able to recover for months. I so fear this lack of functionality because i always had to provide for myself and could never afford it such ongoing dread. i would resort to any medication to save myself from that;(

 

i'm so glad you are on this forum where our co-sufferers support you and i'm learning so much from them and you.

 

i'm waiting for more replies for you.I invested quite some money today to buy some supplements:some fish oil finally,vitamin E and probiotics.

 

honestly,i seem to be a coward.i remember advising you some time ago to up the dose and then somebody encouraged you to hold on.And u did and had that great window.Things are hard for me but nowhere near as for you it seems.my suffering also started in august but i couldn't endure it and went back to 5 mg.I m struggling badly even at that those.But i go to work every day and God knows how i manage.

 

Walking in nature brings me relief.i walk feeling awful for an hour,I pant up the hill and then my head clears unexpectly and this lasts for up to 3 hours,i feel normal and whole.

 

I pulled out of my worst anxieties walking with my aunt when i felt as if i wouldn t be able to move and just wanted to curl in bed.

 

I can't think of anything else to tell you.I'm very touched with your struggle.

 

It will pass...

[skybert]

Thank you so much for the wonderful post bubble:)

Well, panic attacks is what got me in this place. I was scared too. Witch would be, and is a normal reaction to something like that:) Especially when it happens when you are having a good time and you have never heard about it before when it strikes. It's not pleasant at all. I was rushed to the ER the first time. And it kind of gained momentum and started to happen all the time. Witch lead me to taking the meds. Not that I wanted to, but I was told it was just some mild stuff to take the edge off. Yeah right! I was bedridden for 3 months after that. Probably mostly for because of the meds, but I didn't know that. I thought there was something seriously wrong with me and the meds was saving me. I got back up after some time and started working. I never felt the same and always had these weird thoughts and was unable to feel like myself again. Witch changed as soon as I started dropping the dose of the meds. I was slowly returning to myself! YES! I had it all figured out! I just needed to get off this crap and I would be fine! And I was for 7 weeks but then the withdrawal caught up with me...TADA here we are!

 

Don't feel to bad for me bubble. I have a huge support system, a loving family, and everything taken care of. I will be fine. I just can't see it right now. It's the meds talking.

About the updosing: I think it's so great that a complete stranger out there in the world would try to help me when I'm suffering. Just the fact that you cared enough to write something to me in my hour of need is so so so great! I don't know how to express myself good enough in English to truly describe how great I think it is! Maybe going up to 5mg would have helped? Maybe I have to do that at some point? Maybe it was a great advice? Nobody knows for sure. You where just trying to help me and I thank you so much for that! A lot of my faith in humanity has been restored in this experience. This is what being human is all about. And that goes not just for bubble but all of you! Thank you so much!

 

Please don't let my posts scare you. You are equipped to handle this kind of suffering if it where to happen to you. We all are. The people who don't handle it was never told they had what it takes to handle it. The human spirit is stronger then Lexapro. Bite me Lexapro!

 

Good night:) 

[bubble]

oh yes!human spirit is so much stronger than Lexapro!

 

I'm so glad you have such great support.

 

And that u can sleep;)good night

[skybert]

Depression and confusion is kicking my ass right now. 

I don't know where this is headed anymore. Why am I getting worse and worse? Shouldn't it be the other way around? 

Is a heavy wave with changing symptoms a good sign? 

It's impossible to prepare for.

So sick of this.

Venting frustration.. Hoping for a window..

[bubble]

i always check for the update from you here.i noticed you were absent and was thinking how you've been feeling.

 

i know there are differing opinions on whether to updose slightly or wait some more.maybe now enough time has passed to reconsider the decision on holding.it's really hard to tell especially for us inexperienced.

 

I hope somebody offers an opinion and i can only offer my support and reassurance that i will be checking on your journey to recovery which will come.it's just a matter of time...

[skybert]

Thank you bubble:)

I'm thinking the same thing. I don't recognize myself anymore. It scares me very much.

I might have to try a little more medication. I can't go on like this.

The fact that the tiny windows are completely gone scares me very much.

The other waves always gave me a little hope every now and then.

This one has given me 30min on Saturday but that was it.

I would not have been this concerned if the waves started out like this but my waves are getting worse and longer. 3 Months since I left work.

I really thought I would see some more progress by now instead of worsening.

[bubble]

I think that people on this forum rarely 'approve' or suggest updosing and prefer waiting for stabilisation. But i remember we discussed updosing in your case some time ago and then you were advised to wait.

 

During that waiting things have generally not improved but instead worsened to such an extent that a 'wave' has been going on for days now. You even know teh exact number: 4 days.

 

I really hope somebody else offers an opinion because my only opinion is that slight updosing might bring you a relief especially since the last updosing was month and a half ago and your symptoms seem to be getting worse...

 

On the other hand, things always change. Bad is followed by good and good is followed by bad. And the fact that you've been consistently in such a bad state without a relief since Saturday might mean that relief is close.

 

Keep us posted!

 

best, bubble 

[tezza]

We neither approve or disapprove an updose. That's why each person has to listen to their own body and, ultimately, it's their decision. We simply give our opinion based on what a person states, in comparison to the majority of situations we've seen in others.

 

Skybert, if you feel you'd like to try an updose, it's definitely an option. Some do updose and stabilize. We do 'suggest' that if you updose, do it slowly. Give a small updose at least four days to see how it's gonna feel. Some people find relief and some need to adjust the dose further.

 

I hope you feel better soon!