☼ Skybert: needs help - delayed onset Lexapro withdrawal

[bubble]

been meaning to ask about you for so many days!!!! was actually worried as I usually am

 

so good to hear from you! it seems tht overall you are better than your days on the floor and doing a very reasonable taper... 

 

and a very nice insight: we all focus on withdrawal so forget the underlying issues. And it's a good thing. The last thing we need on top of these horrors is to pry open wounds.

 

but if you want to write a bit about these issues, I'll be glad to hear.

 

hugs

[skybert]

Hi bubble:)

I'll go for some sharing soon, but I think I should wait a little since my neuro emotions are running crazy right now. I need some clarity to separate my true emotions from my WD induced ones and I'm not able to do that now. Just glad I'm able to kind of know the difference.

Right now life is a massive drag and I can't seem to understand how on earth I can go on living. Nothing makes sense and I have a lot of tension inside and disconnects from everything. It's an altered state of being that comes and goes and everything just feels wrong and off. I hate it. It's so inhumane. Kind of forget how to "be".When it clears it's hard to understand going back to such a state, but when it's there it not possible to see a way out of it.  

Hugs

[skybert]

I struggle quite a bit now. Could it be the cuts I'm feeling? Just say yes.

[Petunia]

Hi Skybert,

If you are having increased symptoms now, it may be time for a long hold and then slowing down your taper.  There are some charts on here which explains the need for going slower when the dose gets lower, I will see if I can find them.....

 

here they are:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6036-why-taper-paper-demonstrates-importance-of-gradual-change-in-plasma-concentration/

 

I'm assuming from your previous post that you may have some anxiety unrelated to withdrawal, or underlying issues.  Could you get some counseling to help you with that?

 

Petu.

[skybert]

Thank you Petu:) Yeah it's clear I overdid it. My body is clearly slow responding to changes. Just like when I stopped the meds it took 3 months until I really felt it. I was still stuck on this idea that the meds where holding me back since they where, and still are, the root cause to my GI issues that never lets up. I figured fixing my "belly brain" would speed up the recovery of everything. But now I struggle very much and I'm very frustrated. I'm tired all the time. My dreams are vivid and strange. I feel very disconnected from the world and like I'm going insane. I'm on the couch and can't handle anything. Get anxiety just thinking about doing anything. My brain is just a uncategorized mess of memories and feelings with wrong attachments.

Yeah I get counseling but that is just annoying for the most part when I'm like this.

 

Hugs 

[bubble]

Hi there Sky,

 

I always think about you and how you are doing, even when you are not posting.

 

Enduring all this for such a long time takes so much courage. So you say that every time you make a cut you feel like you first stopped taking the drug?

 

You wrote such a nice reply for a new member Leanne. How are you spending your days?

 

big hug

[skybert]

Thank you bubble:) I'm in complete crisis right now. I'll write something later when my head clears a little. Not that I believe it ever will right now, but that's probably wrong this time around to.

[bubble]

I understand, take your time. sending you some good energies

[skybert]

I'm very much concerned about these heavy duty wave type things this far out. I hope it's just delayed cut reactions but I don't know. I could go on and on about symptoms, but there is no point really, it's not like there is anything I can do about it. Whats done is done and I just have to keep going like this. I wouldn't say I feel as bad as when I first stopped the meds, but somewhat like that in a different way I guess. It's killing my fighting spirit which was much stronger at the start of this ordeal. That's terrifying. But pretty much it all comes down to trusting the process and try to relax. Whatever happens happens. I hope I come back to myself somewhat soon. Distract, ignore and wait. That's all I have to do really. Sounds so simple, yet it's so hard.

Hugs

[areyouthere]

Hi Skybert!

 

I just want to point out that if you were at 3 mg the beginning of May and are currently at 2.5 which you cut to on June 24th… that is a whopping 17 % cut! That's pretty huge.

 

I understand that you had the fantastic window the beginning of June & you felt almost NORMAL!! Wow!! That's GREAT! 

 

I can understand why you might feel tempted to cut but I hope that you are also considering a longgggg hold as Petu suggested or perhaps even a small increase and then a longgggg hold.

 

You have come so far!! And you know how good you can feel!! Why (maybe) jeopardize your progress by cutting too fast?

 

I just wanted to point out the 17 % cut to you. That's pretty huge.

 

I am tapering lex as well and was barely able to squeeze a 3% cut into two months and I'm currently holding a month before I try again.

 

RU

[skybert]

Hi areyouthere:)

Yeah I messed up. I had my reasons, and the way my body responds to changes had me fooled even further. I always listen btw, but I'm dealing with reactions to the meds usage as well, in form of nonstop GI issues which cause me a lot of distress. Not going into all the details about my decisions now since they don't matter much anymore.

Lesson learned, now I need to handle this new mess I have gotten myself into. Started 2.7mg today and hope it helps.

[areyouthere]

OK. I understand. I will be thinking of you and hoping that some of your symptoms resolve soon.

 

I have been a part of this forum for almost two years now & find it very interesting that when  first started it seems that Lexapro wasn't mentioned much but now there are all kinds of us having trouble getting off of it with various reactions.

 

It kind of pisses one off which doesn't help much. Anywhooooooo. Good luck to 'ya and whatever your plan is I'm sure that eventually it will work. We are definitely all in this journey together.

 

RU

[skybert]

Thank you for the kind words:) 

Long difficult journey with little to no outside help. Actually the "help" I've gotten have only made my angry and frustrated. 

Anyways, Yeah I see more lex users now to. I was under the impression I was on a low dose since I "only" used 20mg. Well turns out that was a max dose of lex.... wtf was my doctor thinking? There was hardly anything wrong with me at all. I was just a little stressed. Considering the added potency of lex 10% cuts is probably to much for most who struggle like this. 

 

I feel a little better this evening which makes me hopeful I didn't add another 6 months to recover from my stunt. Dealing with that thought today was really hard. I felt completely destabilized and feared it would be close to the same initial nightmare. Oh well, just keep walking I guess.

[skybert]

Hi:)

Just a small update. Doing pretty good:) Closer to normal than ever since this whole medication mess started. Or at least as close to normal as I remember it to be. I still have my flareups and my neuro emotions almost daily, but they will probably fade completely with time. It's somewhat strange to feel like this. Like I don't trust it. The WD has been a part of me everyday for so long that it almost feels wrong to not have it cripple everything I do. Being in such an altered state for so long and then feeling it fade like this is strange. Almost like something is missing or I'm forgetting something. Well I guess all of that strangeness will fade with time to.

 

Maybe someday soon I will start to enjoy my brand new flat stomach that I always wanted but never got around to. The compliments don't hurt.(The diet did!!)

Hugs

[Pokeshaw]

Hi Skybert ~  i just wanted to say hello and let you know that i too am on the taper off lex journey.  i have read some of your thread and i totally ID with your experience. especially the GI issues. i am so sensitive to cuts in the med especially now that i am down to very low doses. it is mind boggling how messed up my enteric NS got from tapering too fast off this drug.

 

i made a 3% cut 3 months ago from 0.5 mg to 0.485 (3%) and it has taken almost the total 3 months to even out. i am doing better now. think i will stay here for a while longer to regain some stability.  Today was one of those really good days. i too have become so accustomed to dealing with life thru the haze and struggle of symptoms that when they lift i find it very odd. wonderful but odd.

 

anyway ~ always good to hear of one of the SA gang doing well.  Enjoy!

 

best,

 

Pokeshaw in Bklyn

[skybert]

Thank you Pokeshaw:) 

Yeah it's beyond belief what a fast taper can do. Glad you are seeing some good days:) It's a tricky slippery slope this stuff and it messes with my head daily. Today I'm not doing to good I've done some things, but it all feels foggy and distant, I guess I could say brain-fog but it feels different than that. And that's the thing I keep repeating all the time "it's always something new somewhat related, but different" impossible to prepare when I don't know whats coming. I come back to myself mostly at some point but it messes with my confidence badly every time. "Sigh" I keep repeating myself over and over. I've done this post 20 times before. Just scared I guess. What will the end result be?

 

Annnnd just as I was about to end my post my thoughts shifted, and the brain returned to full capacity. I instantly knew the answer and I didn't care one bit about the past and my failures. The future sounds awesome, and life is not pointless. How convenient. Do I trust this to last? Right now it seems pretty solid. Do I know better at this point? Yeah. Do I remember that when bad times strike again? Yes, but that time it's going to be different and it will surly be the eternal wave that will kill my spirits and make me see the "truth" about my horrible life and meaningless existence. And off course the way I feel right now I just a fluke. Ahhh lexapro you...suck.

 

-Skybert

[skybert]

I celebrated with diet pepsi... Caffeine straight to the brain! Party! Yeah I should go to bed now.

Laters 

[Petunia]

Thanks for the update Skybert, it sounds like you are doing a lot better, I'm pleased about that.  I was wondering what it was like for people, to really start recovering and having life feel like its back to normal for long periods, like how long does it take to start to trust it again?

 

If you can have a diet pepsi and then go to bed, and sleep, you have to be doing well

[skybert]

Hi Petu:)

Hard question. Whenever I feel "normal" it is just that. It's normal.

I think when I say I don't trust being normal is probably because I'm not back to normal just way better than I was so I kind of mistake it for normal.

Let's call it "normal light" In normal light mode I'm still sick enough to worry about the horrors of lurking WD symptoms that could hit at any time, but still way better than wave type sick.

When I'm bad I don't even know what normal is. I just hold on for dear life so I can come back to something I have a memory of of being a good thing, but can't attach any sort of good emotion to that.

Kind of like I know what love is and can look like, but I don't feel it. Living like this for long periods can really mess with me. It starts to feel realer than the good times. Like this is the "truth" I've been fooling myself my entire life and it is just now I see how awful and pointless everything is. It's not true and I can tell myself that, but that does not change how i actually feel on the inside when times are bad. Scary stuff. But I'm rambling. Let's get back to the point.

 

For me getting back to normal it's feeling this constant cloud that that's been over me ever since I started taking meds lift. This melancholia (think that's the right word) that's been there overshadowing everything just kind of let's go. I can't describe it with words but it's just this thing that steals from my positive emotions and fuel the negative ones even more. This constant sadness that's been with me for so long and I didn't even know why, and I tried battling it with everything I had, but nothing helped. Turns out the cloud was given to me by my very competent doctor. He likes to change brain chemistry and tell me he's an expert on this subject.

 

Most things have been a chore this last year. Even when I felt better at home it was hard to do anything outside of the house. Better to stay home just in case my crazy streak started acting up, cause in my case when I get the symptoms rolling there is nothing stopping me. The world is weird, I'm weird, I'm real (oh crap), that moment has passed and is never coming back, my legs don't work, the left side of my face is numb, what's a face?,why do I feel like this?, what's a feeling? being human is absurd! absurd is a strange word, what's a word? I'm going crazy! Help! If i'm crazy just be crazy! Okay it's now official I'm crazy!    You know the whole drill.

So whenever I had to do something it was how to get through it without getting to upset. The way WD cripples everything I do is starting to lift. 

Like today my mom asked me if I could go to the store and get some things and I just went "Sure" and it was fine. It was not a huge undertaking that felt like walking in a nightmare. It was just a trip to the store.

My friend invited me over and I said "okay" and i actually felt okay, and did not start working on a backup plan to get out of it. To me that's huge!

 

Sorry about the rambling. I have much I want to talk about but my English skills are limited.

 

Hugs:)

[Petunia]

Thanks for explaining that Skybert, it made sense to me.  It sounds like when the actual symptoms stop, the emotional memory of them goes too, which is something I've been worried about, having long lasting trauma from the withdrawal experience, long after its over.

 

Your explanation of normal 'light' sounds like something I have had.

 

Those two examples of going shopping for your mom and visiting your friend, without a second thought, make me think that you are experiencing getting back to completely normal. 

[skybert]

Need some advice. I forgot my lex dose today and I'm freaking out a little bit. Just forget it and move on, or take it now? It's 13 hours to late. 

[bubble]

Hello Sky,

 

I'm sorry I didn't see your post earlier but I actually don't know what to advise. I only know it happens to all of us occasionally and there are usually some rough patches that follow but they level out soon. 

 

I can't even remember whether I still take the dose regardless of how many hours later I discover it  

 

I wasn't around to say how happy I am for your windows you described in August! It gives me hope and courage.

 

hugs

[skybert]

Hi bubble:)

No worries. I ended up not taking it and I suffer badly now. Or at least I think that's what it is. Really bad brain fog today. It's like revisiting the beginning of this nightmare, but not to worked up over it (right now) A lot of success lately so this is just a bump in the road I guess:P Glad to hear it will level out pretty soon (probably). I'll do an update post tomorrow if my head clears a little:)

 

Thanks for checking in on me like always:)

 

Hugs

[skybert]

Worse today. Memories of the past rushing in. Everything is sad and filled with dread. I totally recognize all of this. Neuro emotions running wild. It's all BS but I wonder why this happens in WD. Why is the past so important and memories so unbearable. It's really strange. It feels like a complete hijacking of my brain and there is nothing I can do, just hold on and wait. Man those neuro emotions are strong! They mess with me in indescribable ways. Glad I have experience with this. Easier to remain somewhat calm and just observe. Writing about it here helps to.

 

Hugs

[Pokeshaw]

Hey Skybert -

 

just wanted to say how much i identify with your post re neuro-emotions and memories and dread. i get that, it really sucks! been having low grade constant state of that lately. really have to focus on some nice mantra or brian eno music deep relaxation to tone it down.

i too skipped a dose 2 times recently. had never done that before. had a bumpy few days and then evened out.

 

i hope you ride it out and get back to a more level place.

 

Pokeshaw in Bklyn

[skybert]

Thank you Pokeshaw:) That post helped me a lot. I try to play it cool and collected, but I'm really shaken up by this. I can very much relate to the low grade stuff to. That's almost always there in some ways. But I've experienced it being completely gone to, so I'm hoping it will just go away completely with time. Never used to care to much about the past. It was just the past, and new opportunities and excitement was waiting the next day. Weird uncontrolled obsession induced by WD. I wish the brain/body would just work on unnecessary hair growth on my back instead of my memory and emotions.

Oh well, I distract myself with games and comedy mostly when I'm okayish. Right now I can't stand anything other then "quizclash" on my cellphone.

Hoping to even out somewhat soon:)

 

-Skybert

[andy]

Hang in there skybert,I feel your suffering I'm struggling terribly this week with Neuro emotions they are very hard to ignore

[skybert]

Thank you for the kind words andy:) Sorry to hear you are suffering. I hope you feel better soon.  

[skybert]

Hi guys:) 

Doing okay. My mod shift back and forth. Depressed at times, hopeless at times, positive at times, confused most of the time;) Gi issues still present. Then I ignore, distract and keep going. Feels like I have stalled a little. Haven't really seen much progress lately. I was wondering about something though. I have to go to the Philippines this summer and I need to take some vaccines to be able to go there. Would that mess badly with my WD? Not to excited about the potential problems that would cause. Anyone have any idea about stuff like that or experience?  

[bubble]

hello, hello

 

believe it or not, I've been thinking about you lately and wondering how you were doing so very happy to see this update :)It's not perfect but it's tolerable, right? 

 

This is a very good question and I'm sure there is a topic on it in symptoms. Will try to Google vaccines and survivingantidepressants and see if I get some hits...

 

laters

[bubble]

worked like a charm This is what Alto says:

 

 

I get flu shots every year, in November just prior to flu season. I've never had a problem except sometimes a sore spot and sometimes feeling tired afterward, so I get mine in the late afternoon or evening on the way home.

 

I've only had the flu a few times in my life, more often before I got flu shots.

 

In my opinion, the resistance to flu shots or any other vaccine is counterproductive, increasing the risk of disease. Other than complete isolation from people, animals, and insects, vaccines are probably the safest way we know of minimizing the risk of contracting a contagious illness.

 

While vaccines do incur a very small amount of risk of adverse effects and, like other drugs, contain chemicals you wouldn't want to take in any large amounts, the risk is tiny relative to the benefit.

 

You may, of course, make your own decision based on your own beliefs.

 

And this is the whole thread: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4976-flu-shots-and-other-vaccines/

 

By the way, I went to Vietnam on business for a few days and didn't remember to take any shots. I came back with some GI issues but nothing too drastic. Although I never explored whether the GI issues I developed for the first time in my life 3 months after that visit are in any way connected with that trip... Food for thought

[skybert]

Hi bubble:)

Thank you for the info. I'm gonna go ahead and take the shots. I was going to either way I just wanted to know if it would make me stay on the floor for a couple of months after:P Haven't spent to much time there lately so the dust bunnies probably miss me anyways. If i get to visit them this thread will probably be full of craziness and survival humor. I like that you use my former name "laters" at the end of your post. Remember it's ™  but you can use it whenever you want! 

Anyways, yeah it's tolerable but it's hard at times. I wonder if it would help to start dropping just a little soon. Recovery feels about 2.7mgs away in a way:) Like there is this little dose keeping me from letting go of all of this and preventing me from fully recovering. Like a small barrier in my brain I need to get rid of. Probably sounds strange, but that's how it feels. Probably should just leave it like it is for a couple more months. 

 

Thanks again bubble:) Hope you are doing okay. I haven't read your thread in a while. 

[LexAnger]

Hi Sky,

 

I found your thread last night and finished reading most of the posts. I have to say I feel excited as I found my situation is almost a mirrior image of yours (been online everyday read tons of posts from other Lex suffers never saw such a similarity) and I want to share with you some of my experience and thoughts.

 

I started tapering 10 mg lex May 2013 down to 2.5 in 3 months when I crashed with bad WD. I updosed 2,7mg and held until June 2014 with only one major issue, sever jaw pain.  I had to updose again to 4.5mg then due to new WD caused by stopping a PPI (for heartburn) then all went worng. It has been close to 6 months now what I have include; severe pain, numbness, swelling face. jaw. nose, head, neck, shoulders, back. the spot and type of extream discomfort changes every hour not only on daily basis. mental blackout (not processing anything), speak/type difficulties when the brain feels weak/passing out, coma like feeling (a few times), DPDR etc. I also have no problem of sleep, and quite opposite, I tend to sleep too much and fall into sleep too quickly like being drugged (indeed). I know its the effect of Lex as I always had difficulties with sleep before I start the med (2009). the funny thing is after tried all types of things, the only thing helps with symptoms is lying down (SO I am a floor model too for over a year+), its position related. I totally understand what you mean by 'weired feeling' as that's how my everyday feels like and hard to explain.

 

here are a few things I'd like to share in particular:

 

2.5mg is a mysterious dose for lots lex takers, the one lots ppl got hit badly

 

5-10% reduction for 2.5mg is way too much for me (I might have survived if I knew the true slow taper then)), I am now on 1% and still on the rocky road each time taking a cut. I learend this concept of micro taper from this forum and the successful story of RHI doing slow taper and I feel and believe this is the only way out http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2364-the-slowness-of-slow-tapers/

 

increase/reinstate after a long hold can be very harmful (I never had mental/pshcyc symptoms before the recent increase to 4.5, only physical) and this makes the micro taper even more critical so you wont run into the risk of needing a big increase for bad hit 

 

another thing also helps a great deal (consistent with the lying down position) is swimming, its actually even better than just lying down with the water's soothing effect 

 

when not energetic enough going out, floor exercise is something I keep up with staying in shape (tons programs on YouTube)

 

I hope you are doing better each day/month/year and I am very hopeful to eventually be out of this marathon of tapering regaining our full health with extrordinary endurance and patience. I like one of the members here once said, each of us should be awarded with a gold medel for going through all this incredible experience

[skybert]

Hi guys:)

Just a small update. I did a small cut from 2.7mg to 2.6mg. I'm terrible right now because I have the flu. I think I was doing pretty good up until that point. I have a hijacked brain atm so I try not to listen to it:P Bouts of depression from time to time. But why would I not be depressed from time to time living like this for so long. I work 20% now 2 hours 4 days a week. It's hard at times but it gives me some kind of purpose and goal. I still have some trouble driving. I can go to the store with little to no trouble at all. I visit friends sometimes and can enjoy it at times. Gi issues are still very much present, but I've gotten somewhat sloppy on my diet so it might be pretty good if I ate more "clean". Sometimes I just eat that friggin taco with my friends and deal with the mess after. Stupid I know, but I just need to do this to feel some kind of normal(+ good food is awesome) 

 

Long overdue but thank you LexAnger for that great post. I tried to respond to it in a good and clever way, but I write something, overthink it, store it in a notepad somewhere, figure I'll get back to it but never do. I do this a lot. I will never try a 10%cut again. I'll go really slow especially when I get to 2.5mg. I don't really care to much about being of the meds anymore it will happen eventually anyway. Quality to life is way more important. Looking at years of tapering, but that's okay. After the massive hit my CNS took it probably needs this. 
 

I have taken 3 vaccines since I last posted. (Going to the Philippines) The first two made me sick for about 4 days. The last one just gave me a numb hand for a day. Not sure what they are called in English so google is going to help me now:)  The fist one was like a refill of what they gave me when I was little it says: diphtheria, tetanus, pertussis(latin) and polio. The other one was for hepatitis and I needed one more of those later. The hepatitis vaccine I didn't even feel the second time except for arm numbness. So it seems like at least those vaccines was not any trouble while in WD and affected me any different than my healthy siblings. That's my experience with vaccines while in WD if anyone should wonder. I'll try to get the official names on them. 

 

Now I go back to my couch, blow my disgusting nose and wait for better days:)

Hugs

[bubble]

Hi there Sky,

 

so great to hear from you and read that things are slowly, slowly but IMPROVING! Despite your present bad condition which I hope clears out soon.

 

I like your attitude very, very much: I don't care too much about getting of the medication any more. it will happen eventually anyway. Quality of life is more important-this is an attitude of a winner!

 

it's also great that Lex reminded you of making smaller cuts especially at that 2.5 mg point which seems to be so tough for Lexapro...I make 2.5 %cuts on my other drug...

 

Thanks for letting us know about vaccines and happy that all went well.

 

Hugs,

Bubble

[skybert]

Hi bubble:) 

Yeah it seems like small cuts is the only way out:P It seems like I'm still recovering from the to fast taper back in 2013. It's been a very strange non-linear process. It's still very hard  sometimes and I feel completely powerless when times are bad. The logical part of my brain gets all worked up over it and I get this urge to try and resolve it somehow, but there is nothing to do.

This flu is totally kicking my ass now. Is it normal for regular sickness to really stir up the WD symptoms? This is really bad stuff. I feel so lost, depressed, obsessive, demotivated and broken now.