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Thank you, Healing for such a great post. I really appreciate it.

 

When I read it, things started to click into place and make sense at long last.

 

I feel that I have experienced neuro emotions at regular intervals throughout the period that I have used SSRI's (14 years). At these times, I felt an absence of myself and overwhelming feelings and behaviours that I just could not explain. These feelings were neither part of my original dis - ease (anxiety & panic attacks) or real self. Now I understand what they were.

 

Now that I am in the early stages of withdrawal, disturbing and often violent dreams accompany my sleep each night. Most often about toxic family members that I have cut contact with last year, after years of attempting to mend the abuse that they perpetrated but refused to acknowledge, let alone heal.

 

I am now more able to view these dreams more objectively as opposed to internalising the distressing nature of them. I acknowledge the distressing nature of these dreams and recount them to my partner in relation to past trauma. I then move on as best I can with my day, instead of allowing them to paralyse me.

 

Thank you again for this insight and healing tool. It has already alleviated a lot of distress and enabled me to view neuro emotions more objectively.

1999 - 2004 Paroxetine 20mg  -> 2004 - 2007 Citalopram 20mg -> 2007 -  short term Trazedone use (insomnia) -> 2007 - 2009 Fluoxetine 20mg  ->

2009 - Jan 2012 Citalopram 20mg  (Spring / Summer 2012 protracted withdrawal & related agoraphobia) -> 2012 - September Restarted Citalopram - unbearable start up effects. Discontinued in under 1 week -> Oct 12 -   October 2014 Escitalopram - 10mg prescribed. Started on 5mg and worked up to 10mg in 2.5mg increments  -> Oct 2014  - 5mg; 30/03/15 2.5mg; 15/04/15 3.5mg; 20/05/15 2.9mg;  19/09/15 2.8mg; 30/10/15 2.7mg; 13/11/15 2.6mg. Holding until March.

Diet:  mostly pescatarianl & lots of veg. Weekly offal for b vitamins.  Turmeric, nigella seeds, avocados, apple cider vinegar, coconut products daily. Lots of fluids: water, lemon juice, coconut water, herbal & green tea (decaffeinated).

Supplements: vitamin C 4000mg, Omega 3 fish oil - high DPA & EHA, vitamin E 400iu, vitamin D3 5000mg (Winter only - from sun in Spring / Summer), probiotics.

Current Symptoms: chronic fatigue, erratic sleep, extreme photophobia, eye floaters, noise sensitivity, tinnitus, cognitive & speech difficulties, dizziness, irregular gait, poor co ordination, severe facial and upper body muscle tension, head and neck pressure.

Coping Strategies: good nutrition, cooking, gardening & growing my own food, cycling, dancing, yoga, photography, sewing & creative pursuits, self massage, pampering, meditation, journalling, nature, cuddling cats & humans, laughter & humour, gratitude, self care, aromatherapy, audio books, word games & believing in myself, my potential and my future.

 

"Everything I need is within me" - Shakti Gawain

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I feel like Miss Serene today. For a few days. Can't be bothered phoning friends back, sick of this fight. Two years seven months don't I get time off for good behaviour ? Am thoroughly fed up and discouraged. The neuro emotion , not really here today has burned every atom of normality out of me and am just a shell. Forgotten what its like to be normal. Bit like Africa. I ve seen photos or on TV but never been there . That's how am viewing normality at the moment from the outside looking in. Can't be bothered. I ve got up showered , hair , make up , dressed going through the motions. Ha. Am like an anxious Stepford wife !

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Just wanted to say I have been reading this thread and the term neuro-emotion makes so much sense to me.  I can relate to a lot of the experiences people talk about on this thread.  Thanks all.

March 2013-June 2015 reduced from 40mg to 18.5mg paxil. In mid June 2015, switched to Zoloft 50mg. (was on paxil approx 20 years)

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I was thinking of leaving my husband and children - like I sometimes don't want to be around them. Is this a neuro emotion because I was always the opposite - couldn't bare am hour away from them!

 

I think this is part of withdrawal and the terrible adverse effects from the AD's. There is one thing that I can guarantee

100%, if you did leave your family you would bitterly regret it.  You think you are useless as a wife and mother but 

your family adore you and would feel abandoned. You know that and love them dearly so would never make that decision

if you weren't affected by the drugs. I felt the same when I started the psychiatric drug nightmare and my kids 

were young, but I now know that they kept me going and gave me a reason to live, to get out of bed and keep breathing.

 

My latest experience of withdrawal and living alone has been worse in the sense that there is no reason to get out of bed, no-one

is hurt or even knows if I stay in pyjamas for days and ultimately no-one would miss me if I died. It is an existence that is hard to

justify, taking up a house that someone else could be living in, money from the state when the prime minister is banging on about 

the benefits bill that is leading the country to ruin. All this thinking is withdrawal and not the way we would think when feeling more

rational. I am glad that I didn't leave my family, it would have been a disaster and now I shudder when I remember how it felt. 

 

You will get through this, and so will your family.  It is the effects of the meds making you feel that way. Yes, I would say it is part

of neuro emotions, take a deep breath and count to 10,20 or 100 when you feel like walking away and give them a hug instead. 

One day you will feel those hugs but until then fake it till you make it, keep hugging and your brain will be stirred to feel them again.

So this will pass? I can relate what you wrote about no reason to get up from bed...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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I have memories of a traumatic childhood playing over and over in my head. And, I live with someone who was a part of it. And, they are sorry and are trying to correct the wrong. But, the memories trigger rage and I just want to hit someone. It's awful.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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Is obsessiveness a neuro emotion? I feel like I got hit with a wave of guilt. And it's like a broken obsessive record! It just hit out of nowhere!

 

I think it is sometimes it is guilt some times other things  .. you will notice none of them are overwhelming happiness.. you just can't contain.  I don't have a big problem this usually not like I did the first few years but yesterday ... a rage came over me where I wanted to break things... really badly if I was at the Alice tea party I ...great satisfaction would have been found by me in breaking all those tea pots... I could do it in a fairy tale. :) 

They can be different things.. we just had a talk about it over in this thread you may want to read it.  

 

I can't believe I had that again yesterday I blamed it on too many days without a decent sleep... hope that is the end of it for awhile at least. 

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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Is obsessiveness a neuro emotion? I feel like I got hit with a wave of guilt. And it's like a broken obsessive record! It just hit out of nowhere!

I think it is sometimes it is guilt some times other things .. you will notice none of them are overwhelming happiness.. you just can't contain. I don't have a big problem this usually not like I did the first few years but yesterday ... a rage came over me where I wanted to break things... really badly if I was at the Alice tea party I ...great satisfaction would have been found by me in breaking all those tea pots... I could do it in a fairy tale. :)

They can be different things.. we just had a talk about it over in this thread you may want to read it.

 

I can't believe I had that again yesterday I blamed it on too many days without a decent sleep... hope that is the end of it for awhile at least.

 

Lol!!! The tea party!!! :P that would be hilarious if you broke all the teapots!!! Hahahahahaha! This just fixed my day.

 

I hate the thoughts. They are awful. I wish they would stop! They are utterly bizarre.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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Is obsessiveness a neuro emotion? I feel like I got hit with a wave of guilt. And it's like a broken obsessive record! It just hit out of nowhere!

I think it is sometimes it is guilt some times other things .. you will notice none of them are overwhelming happiness.. you just can't contain. I don't have a big problem this usually not like I did the first few years but yesterday ... a rage came over me where I wanted to break things... really badly if I was at the Alice tea party I ...great satisfaction would have been found by me in breaking all those tea pots... I could do it in a fairy tale. :)

They can be different things.. we just had a talk about it over in this thread you may want to read it.

 

I can't believe I had that again yesterday I blamed it on too many days without a decent sleep... hope that is the end of it for awhile at least.

 

Lol!!! The tea party!!! :P that would be hilarious if you broke all the teapots!!! Hahahahahaha! This just fixed my day.

 

I hate the thoughts. They are awful. I wish they would stop! They are utterly bizarre.

 

in my scattered thoughts I forgot to post the link here it is bit about neuro emotions and how we think in wd... 

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6656-skylarblue75-new-and-really-messed-up/page-10

 

I have an idea I am not sure where it came from one of the many varied groups I have attended in my past perhaps... 

 

A lady who had an alcoholic partner found great relief by going to the dump and breaking liquor bottles... a safe place to act up I guess.  

I on the other hand mindlessly threw a small rock at a large boulder at the beach and found some sense of freedom... it was accidental but found myself there a good long time breaking rocks.  I thought of my childhood how we use to have a wood stove and cutting wood could ease a lot tension... sadly I have hurt my body to the point I cannot use it as a tension relief system at this point but for those of you who can I think it is a great idea. 

 

I found after the last accident when I was high on some pain killer I think it was perkacette... I know it is not spelled like that but I don't care... I went to scrape something off the floor and the finish came off... I spent the day scraping the rest of the finish off most of the floor... that was over two years ago... 

 

Now a normal person taking that amount of pain killer would be fine but me... I get on the floor with a broken rib and injured back with only one good arm and scrape off the finish... that is insane... drugs no longer affect us the way they should and will bring on crazy thoughts.. and actions we need to be careful when we are sick and if at all possible engage some body at least one family member in our care... I never did this so when i got painpilles and antibiotics when I had penumonia... I ended up over drugged and super weird... 

yep scraping the floor with a broken rib pneumonia and one arm... 

 

nobody noticed... it odd lol this is where I live this is my world... I did not notice either this is another altered state of being... I mention it only as doing something with my body was a release ... a relief due to the meds I had no pain... but was also senseless. 

 

Its complicated... 

isn't it always 

peace all

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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  • Moderator Emeritus

When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household.  Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

*I'm not a doctor and don't give medical advice, just personal experience
**Off all meds since Nov. 2014. Mentally & emotionally recovered; physically not
-Dual cold turkeys off TCA & Ativan in Oct 2014. Prescribed from 2011-2014

-All meds were Rxed off-label for an autoimmune illness.  It was a MISDIAGNOSIS, but I did not find out until AFTER meds caused damage.  All med tapers/cold turkeys directed by doctors 

-Nortriptyline May 2012 - Dec 2013. Cold turkey off nortrip & cold switched to desipramine

-Desipramine Jan 2014 - Oct. 29, 2014 (rapid taper/cold turkey)

-Lorazepam 1 mg per night during 2011
-Lorazepam 1 mg per month in 2012 (or less)

-Lorazepam on & off, Dec 2013 through Aug 2014. Didn't exceed 3x a week

-Lorazepam again in Oct. 2014 to help get off of desipramine. Last dose lzpam was 1 mg, Nov. 2, 2014. Immediate paradoxical reactions to benzos after stopping TCAs 

-First muscle/dystonia side effects started on nortriptyline, but docs too stupid to figure it out. On desipramine, muscle tremors & rigidity worsened

-Two weeks after I got off all meds, I developed full-blown TD.  Tardive dystonia, dyskinesia, myoclonic jerks ALL over body, ribcage wiggles, facial tics, twitching tongue & fingers, tremors/twitches of arms, legs, cognitive impairment, throat muscles semi-paralyzed & unable to swallow solid food, brain zaps, ears ring, dizzy, everything looks too far away, insomnia, numbness & electric shocks everywhere when I try to fall asleep, jerk awake from sleep with big, gasping breaths, wake with terrors & tremors, severely depressed.  NO HISTORY OF DEPRESSION, EVER. Meds CREATED it.

-Month 7: hair falling out; no vision improvement; still tardive dystonia; facial & tongue tics returned
-Month 8: back to acute, incl. Grand Mal seizure-like episodes. New mental torment, PGAD, worse insomnia
-Month 9: tardive dystonia worse, dyskinesia returned. Unable to breathe well due to dystonia in stomach, chest, throat
-Month 13: Back to acute, brain zaps back, developed eczema & stomach problems. Left leg no longer works right due to dystonia, meaning both legs now damaged
-7 years off: Huge improvements, incl. improved dystonia

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For quite a while in withdrawal, neuro-emotion led me to memories where I embarrassed myself, made a fool or myself, or was rejected. I couldn't shake them, I was reliving them intensely over and over. The feeling of shame and worthlessness was awful. I had to make a determined effort, which wasn't always successful, to distract myself from these memories. I kept reminding myself to forgive myself for my mistakes.Then reliving these memories went away. I'm not having this problem anymore (I hope).I presume that some area of my brain was being stimulated by dysregulated neuro-hormones, and now it's recovered.

I started Lexapro 2013 30? mg

Changed to Effexor 75 mg Jan 2014

Started tapering. 1st Dec 2014 -

75mg down to 37.5 in 1st month.

18.7 mg to 9 mg between 1st jan- 1st feb.

Discontinued 1st Feb- 27th Feb

Have experienced, daily, vertigo, disassociation, chronic fatigue, insomnia,

Pins and needles down right side head and intense despair.

Reinstated 4 beads Effexor 28th Feb 15'

Side affects of withdrawal not manageable particularly

Depression/dispair.

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I identify Altostrata , ....'Neuroemotive' guilt, shame and self loathing I feel particularly around family. When most likely they only want to support me. Everything just seems to be amplified by WD. But is hard not to feel like a burden. I'm sure self recrimination only hinders the healing process, and evokes more, dire thoughts.

I started Lexapro 2013 30? mg

Changed to Effexor 75 mg Jan 2014

Started tapering. 1st Dec 2014 -

75mg down to 37.5 in 1st month.

18.7 mg to 9 mg between 1st jan- 1st feb.

Discontinued 1st Feb- 27th Feb

Have experienced, daily, vertigo, disassociation, chronic fatigue, insomnia,

Pins and needles down right side head and intense despair.

Reinstated 4 beads Effexor 28th Feb 15'

Side affects of withdrawal not manageable particularly

Depression/dispair.

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How to distinguish neuroemotions from emotions? As for me I have always had "different emotions", often over-reacted, so for me it is just normal. I feel much calmer now than I used to be...

Or maybe, since starting medications I have always been in some WD?

 

When I was a child I was exposed to severe trauma, so my autonomic nervous system always responded in some type of alert...and I have lernt later on to always question what I feel...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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How to distinguish neuroemotions from emotions? As for me I have always had "different emotions", often over-reacted, so for me it is just normal. I feel much calmer now than I used to be...

Or maybe, since starting medications I have always been in some WD?

 

When I was a child I was exposed to severe trauma, so my autonomic nervous system always responded in some type of alert...and I have lernt later on to always question what I feel...

I think Healing said it best in the OP

"For many reasons, our emotions are on a hair-trigger, amplified, and perseverative. We probably don't even know all of what's going on physically yet, but it includes diminished prefrontal lobe executive functions, rebound amygdala, dysregulated HPA, over-active adrenals, etc. The neuro-emotions include -- neuro-fear neuro-anger neuro-guilt neuro-shame neuro-hurt neuro-regret neuro-self-criticism neuro-grudge-holding ...and more! It is very, very confusing to have these intense neuro-emotions and try to remember that they are not what they appear to be. Emotions are compelling. Emotions during recovery from psych meds are even more compelling. Sometimes, the neuro-emotion is really totally artificial. Some of my neuro-fears have been so unlikely to come to pass as to bear no resemblance to reality or to my personal history. But, I think a lot of the time, part of what makes it so confusing is that there is a grain of reality to the neuro-emotion. For example, some situation might make you a bit angry under normal circumstances, but the neuro-anger is huge. This is when it's very difficult to 1) catch it in the first place and notice this is a neuro-emotion, 2) convince ourselves, yes, this is really a neuro-emotion, not a real emotion, 3) contain the emotion, try not to act on it, or channel the energy into something safe and constructive -- like exercise or journaling or building a birdhouse.  :) Whenever you're having an intense, disturbing feeling, try to remind yourself that, right now -- even if it does have something to do with reality -- it is largely a neuro-emotion that you wouldn't be feeling if you were fully healed. And you *will* be fully healed. It's happening! Get ready! "

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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How to distinguish neuroemotions from emotions? As for me I have always had "different emotions", often over-reacted, so for me it is just normal. I feel much calmer now than I used to be...

Or maybe, since starting medications I have always been in some WD?

When I was a child I was exposed to severe trauma, so my autonomic nervous system always responded in some type of alert...and I have lernt later on to always question what I feel...

 

I think Healing said it best in the OP

"For many reasons, our emotions are on a hair-trigger, amplified, and perseverative. We probably don't even know all of what's going on physically yet, but it includes diminished prefrontal lobe executive functions, rebound amygdala, dysregulated HPA, over-active adrenals, etc. The neuro-emotions include -- neuro-fear neuro-anger neuro-guilt neuro-shame neuro-hurt neuro-regret neuro-self-criticism neuro-grudge-holding ...and more! It is very, very confusing to have these intense neuro-emotions and try to remember that they are not what they appear to be. Emotions are compelling. Emotions during recovery from psych meds are even more compelling. Sometimes, the neuro-emotion is really totally artificial. Some of my neuro-fears have been so unlikely to come to pass as to bear no resemblance to reality or to my personal history. But, I think a lot of the time, part of what makes it so confusing is that there is a grain of reality to the neuro-emotion. For example, some situation might make you a bit angry under normal circumstances, but the neuro-anger is huge. This is when it's very difficult to 1) catch it in the first place and notice this is a neuro-emotion, 2) convince ourselves, yes, this is really a neuro-emotion, not a real emotion, 3) contain the emotion, try not to act on it, or channel the energy into something safe and constructive -- like exercise or journaling or building a birdhouse.  :) Whenever you're having an intense, disturbing feeling, try to remind yourself that, right now -- even if it does have something to do with reality -- it is largely a neuro-emotion that you wouldn't be feeling if you were fully healed. And you *will* be fully healed. It's happening! Get ready! "

Thank you, it makes sense. But it still seems that I have been in similar type of emotions most of my life...it was a type of increased alertness, as it was impossible to predict if my father will act aggressively or not...or would he act in a suicidal manner...

My mother was always in a panick state...

I often need to question my emotiond, if I really respond to the situation...

I guess WD added another dimension to it...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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If your not seeing any extreme emotions in wd maybe your not having neuro emotions yet I can't say.  I do see how your particular situation would may take a bit more awareness and acuity to sort.  This is something only you can know as it goes on inside of you.  In my case I know it as it is like an atomic bomb going off nothing like a normal emotion.  It is always bigger than life with dire consequences... like a complete drama queen in the control center of my brain.  Things that would not get me to raise an eyebrow can be the end of the world as we know in emotional response.  

Small things cat hair on the couch that the cat has been losing in the spot for 30 years suddenly was a reason for internal rage... and yes I would know all this going in.. I know the cat I know the couch I know the situation... cats have fur it falls out gets on things it is a natural normal thing in life for those who own cats... yet none of the rational would be related to my emotional take on the cat hair on the couch... I could have rage over such a mundane thing.

Then once it passes cause it does thinking back to why the intense feeling over such a mundane thing I have known since childhood and never had such a response to in the past... thinking this is part is why you can't trust yourself in the real world ect...and all the ODC like snowballing thoughts would take me to further snowballing.. of another aspect of wd. 

 

I think when it comes to neuro emotions some may be difficult to classify but others are so extreme there is no way to miss them. To me they sometimes lead to a flip out where actions followed the emotion.  

Complete despair and breaking a jug of juice on the kitchen floor to me that is a extreme action and something I had never done before. 

Extreme irrational fear caused me to run one day in a park I knew and went to for years.. I not only ran but I jumped a fence... again not like any actions ever done in the past. 

They don't always have an action that is out of the ordinary often such as with the cat hair it is followed by normal action like cleaning cat hair...but the internal feelings don't match the action... cleaning cat hair while enraged. 

 

I truly think if you have neuro emotions some of the time they are easy as pie to spot and generally if I was pushed forward to action I was not able to notice the emotion as out of ordinary before I acted... an agnosia of extreme emotion .. I was not aware at the time it was a neuro emotion and in such a state could not control my behavior.  I don't know about other people but for me I could not see it when I was in it especially early on.  It was after I had had several of these situations and then had a window where I would be calmer and look back that I could see it.  

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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For quite a while in withdrawal, neuro-emotion led me to memories where I embarrassed myself, made a fool or myself, or was rejected. I couldn't shake them, I was reliving them intensely over and over. The feeling of shame and worthlessness was awful. I had to make a determined effort, which wasn't always successful, to distract myself from these memories. I kept reminding myself to forgive myself for my mistakes.Then reliving these memories went away. I'm not having this problem anymore (I hope).I presume that some area of my brain was being stimulated by dysregulated neuro-hormones, and now it's recovered.

Whoa. I'm totally having this. I suspected it was withdrawal-related.

 

Also, even my happy memories depress me because they seem like they are taunting me.

*I'm not a doctor and don't give medical advice, just personal experience
**Off all meds since Nov. 2014. Mentally & emotionally recovered; physically not
-Dual cold turkeys off TCA & Ativan in Oct 2014. Prescribed from 2011-2014

-All meds were Rxed off-label for an autoimmune illness.  It was a MISDIAGNOSIS, but I did not find out until AFTER meds caused damage.  All med tapers/cold turkeys directed by doctors 

-Nortriptyline May 2012 - Dec 2013. Cold turkey off nortrip & cold switched to desipramine

-Desipramine Jan 2014 - Oct. 29, 2014 (rapid taper/cold turkey)

-Lorazepam 1 mg per night during 2011
-Lorazepam 1 mg per month in 2012 (or less)

-Lorazepam on & off, Dec 2013 through Aug 2014. Didn't exceed 3x a week

-Lorazepam again in Oct. 2014 to help get off of desipramine. Last dose lzpam was 1 mg, Nov. 2, 2014. Immediate paradoxical reactions to benzos after stopping TCAs 

-First muscle/dystonia side effects started on nortriptyline, but docs too stupid to figure it out. On desipramine, muscle tremors & rigidity worsened

-Two weeks after I got off all meds, I developed full-blown TD.  Tardive dystonia, dyskinesia, myoclonic jerks ALL over body, ribcage wiggles, facial tics, twitching tongue & fingers, tremors/twitches of arms, legs, cognitive impairment, throat muscles semi-paralyzed & unable to swallow solid food, brain zaps, ears ring, dizzy, everything looks too far away, insomnia, numbness & electric shocks everywhere when I try to fall asleep, jerk awake from sleep with big, gasping breaths, wake with terrors & tremors, severely depressed.  NO HISTORY OF DEPRESSION, EVER. Meds CREATED it.

-Month 7: hair falling out; no vision improvement; still tardive dystonia; facial & tongue tics returned
-Month 8: back to acute, incl. Grand Mal seizure-like episodes. New mental torment, PGAD, worse insomnia
-Month 9: tardive dystonia worse, dyskinesia returned. Unable to breathe well due to dystonia in stomach, chest, throat
-Month 13: Back to acute, brain zaps back, developed eczema & stomach problems. Left leg no longer works right due to dystonia, meaning both legs now damaged
-7 years off: Huge improvements, incl. improved dystonia

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When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.

Has there been any improvement? Do you so it less often? Are you less angry when it happens? Any small change at all?

*I'm not a doctor and don't give medical advice, just personal experience
**Off all meds since Nov. 2014. Mentally & emotionally recovered; physically not
-Dual cold turkeys off TCA & Ativan in Oct 2014. Prescribed from 2011-2014

-All meds were Rxed off-label for an autoimmune illness.  It was a MISDIAGNOSIS, but I did not find out until AFTER meds caused damage.  All med tapers/cold turkeys directed by doctors 

-Nortriptyline May 2012 - Dec 2013. Cold turkey off nortrip & cold switched to desipramine

-Desipramine Jan 2014 - Oct. 29, 2014 (rapid taper/cold turkey)

-Lorazepam 1 mg per night during 2011
-Lorazepam 1 mg per month in 2012 (or less)

-Lorazepam on & off, Dec 2013 through Aug 2014. Didn't exceed 3x a week

-Lorazepam again in Oct. 2014 to help get off of desipramine. Last dose lzpam was 1 mg, Nov. 2, 2014. Immediate paradoxical reactions to benzos after stopping TCAs 

-First muscle/dystonia side effects started on nortriptyline, but docs too stupid to figure it out. On desipramine, muscle tremors & rigidity worsened

-Two weeks after I got off all meds, I developed full-blown TD.  Tardive dystonia, dyskinesia, myoclonic jerks ALL over body, ribcage wiggles, facial tics, twitching tongue & fingers, tremors/twitches of arms, legs, cognitive impairment, throat muscles semi-paralyzed & unable to swallow solid food, brain zaps, ears ring, dizzy, everything looks too far away, insomnia, numbness & electric shocks everywhere when I try to fall asleep, jerk awake from sleep with big, gasping breaths, wake with terrors & tremors, severely depressed.  NO HISTORY OF DEPRESSION, EVER. Meds CREATED it.

-Month 7: hair falling out; no vision improvement; still tardive dystonia; facial & tongue tics returned
-Month 8: back to acute, incl. Grand Mal seizure-like episodes. New mental torment, PGAD, worse insomnia
-Month 9: tardive dystonia worse, dyskinesia returned. Unable to breathe well due to dystonia in stomach, chest, throat
-Month 13: Back to acute, brain zaps back, developed eczema & stomach problems. Left leg no longer works right due to dystonia, meaning both legs now damaged
-7 years off: Huge improvements, incl. improved dystonia

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When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.
Has there been any improvement? Do you so it less often? Are you less angry when it happens? Any small change at all?

 

Umm...my situation is a bit didfernt than yours. I generally direct my anger at my parents, and I have pretty good reason to be very very angry with them. However, I am trying to forgive them. I seem to freak out a bit less lately. But, I had a really bad bout during my trip to mania land. :(

I think you will be ok Wiggle. it will pass :)

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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If your not seeing any extreme emotions in wd maybe your not having neuro emotions yet I can't say.  I do see how your particular situation would may take a bit more awareness and acuity to sort.  This is something only you can know as it goes on inside of you.  In my case I know it as it is like an atomic bomb going off nothing like a normal emotion.  It is always bigger than life with dire consequences... like a complete drama queen in the control center of my brain.  Things that would not get me to raise an eyebrow can be the end of the world as we know in emotional response.  

Small things cat hair on the couch that the cat has been losing in the spot for 30 years suddenly was a reason for internal rage... and yes I would know all this going in.. I know the cat I know the couch I know the situation... cats have fur it falls out gets on things it is a natural normal thing in life for those who own cats... yet none of the rational would be related to my emotional take on the cat hair on the couch... I could have rage over such a mundane thing.

Then once it passes cause it does thinking back to why the intense feeling over such a mundane thing I have known since childhood and never had such a response to in the past... thinking this is part is why you can't trust yourself in the real world ect...and all the ODC like snowballing thoughts would take me to further snowballing.. of another aspect of wd. 

 

I think when it comes to neuro emotions some may be difficult to classify but others are so extreme there is no way to miss them. To me they sometimes lead to a flip out where actions followed the emotion.  

Complete despair and breaking a jug of juice on the kitchen floor to me that is a extreme action and something I had never done before. 

Extreme irrational fear caused me to run one day in a park I knew and went to for years.. I not only ran but I jumped a fence... again not like any actions ever done in the past. 

They don't always have an action that is out of the ordinary often such as with the cat hair it is followed by normal action like cleaning cat hair...but the internal feelings don't match the action... cleaning cat hair while enraged. 

 

I truly think if you have neuro emotions some of the time they are easy as pie to spot and generally if I was pushed forward to action I was not able to notice the emotion as out of ordinary before I acted... an agnosia of extreme emotion .. I was not aware at the time it was a neuro emotion and in such a state could not control my behavior.  I don't know about other people but for me I could not see it when I was in it especially early on.  It was after I had had several of these situations and then had a window where I would be calmer and look back that I could see it.

 

  

 

When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.

  

 

 

When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.

Has there been any improvement? Do you so it less often? Are you less angry when it happens? Any small change at all?

  

 

 

 

When I get hopeless and depressed that I will never recover, I start fights with my family and sling every cruel word in the world at them, whether the words are true or not, and I'm not satisfied until I've created a storm of hatred and anger among the whole household. Never in my life have I ever done something like this, not until these medications ruined my health.

I've been doing this for 7 months.
Has there been any improvement? Do you so it less often? Are you less angry when it happens? Any small change at all?

Umm...my situation is a bit didfernt than yours. I generally direct my anger at my parents, and I have pretty good reason to be very very angry with them. However, I am trying to forgive them. I seem to freak out a bit less lately. But, I had a really bad bout during my trip to mania land. :(

I think you will be ok Wiggle. it will pass :)

I have had problems with expressing anger. When I get angrier at outside world I see it as a progress. I tend to turn anger against myself...less often now...

But I have had always problems with getting panicky...sometimes it has impact on my actions...such as when I have some symptoms I would run to doctors and let them to treat me...

But my panic is not worse than it used to be...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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It could be your not far enough into healing to see it yet I don't really know. 

peace

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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It could be your not far enough into healing to see it yet I don't really know. 

peace

Or it may be that I worked a lot in my therapy on emotions...i used to be much worse, getting into catastrophy mode easily...

Oh, yes, I remember now I used to selfharm, type of superficial cuts, but don't do it anymore...

 

If anything, I feel calmer now, which is such a nice feeling...i am able ti catch feeling before it errupts...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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I really needed to read this, today. I needed so badly to know that these fierce, sudden, great hurricanes of fear/sadness/terror/stress/pain/anger/guilt are not just my new 'me off drugs' brain (2 months off paroxetine completely, after a 5 year long slow taper from 80mgs). Thank you for this post.

'83-90: Various tricyclics, anti-psychotics, tranqs.
'90-02: Prozac - poopout 2002
'02-10: Paroxetine 40, 60, 80mg.
ENOUGH!
Jun10-Feb11: Slow taper 80-60, 5-12%
Feb-Jul11: 60-50, 5% 6wkly
Jul11-Mar12: 50-20, 10% 6wkly. Winter pause.
Aug-Dec12: 18-9.5, 10% 4wkly
2013: 8.6-2.1, 10% 4wkly
2014: 2.1 to 0.4, 10% 4-6 wkly, including reinstatement from 1 to 2 after crash

Off paroxetine since 18 Dec 2014.

2 months manageable to good. Currently suffering again.

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Appreciated reading this thread this morning. Since swtiching from capsules to liquid prozac I've noticed dips of "neuro-emotion" are more sudden and shorter in duration.

Sometimes I'll wake up thinking I'm wasting my life, comparing myself to others who seem happy, creative and competent. Thoughts cycling that  I'm a damaged person.

I'm a failure. That I'll never get off this drug, That I won't able to survive if I lose my partner or when my old dog dies etc .

Then a few hours later I'll feel fine. Look around at my life, my creative work, thankful I have a loving partner who is healthy, that my old animals are happy and well,

that I'm so much more myself  and more creative than I was when on 20 mg of prozac.

Whenever I'm in a  dark dip it seems totally real, and any other way of looking at my life is delusional.

However, I'm learning to ride out the dips, keeping my day as undemanding and gentle as possible. 

And every dip I survive gives me confidence I'll survive the next one on my way off this drug.

On 20 mg of Prozac for about ten years. Sept 2012 started reducing 10% a drop using gram scale, with average of one month holds.

When I'd reached the half way mark, taking 10 mg  powder out of the 20 mg capsules, I switched over to 10 mg capsules and cutting

down from those. Withdrawals got harder the lower I dropped.  May 2013 changed to 5% drops, holding until all withdrawal symptoms gone.

January 2015 changed to liquid prozac (concentration of 20MG per 5 mL) using a 1mL oral syringe.

Current dose of fluoxetine solution equivalent 3.4 mg. Any effort to drop below this has been disastrous so for the time being I'm staying at this level.
Adding 200 mg Tryptophan and 200 GABA a day has helped with anxiety.
Also take 1,300mg Omega- 3,  875mg  Magnesium, 1800mg Curcumin, 1000mg Vit C, 5000 Vit D.
 

 

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indigo, you just described exactly where I am right now. It helps a little bit just to know I'm not the only one.

'83-90: Various tricyclics, anti-psychotics, tranqs.
'90-02: Prozac - poopout 2002
'02-10: Paroxetine 40, 60, 80mg.
ENOUGH!
Jun10-Feb11: Slow taper 80-60, 5-12%
Feb-Jul11: 60-50, 5% 6wkly
Jul11-Mar12: 50-20, 10% 6wkly. Winter pause.
Aug-Dec12: 18-9.5, 10% 4wkly
2013: 8.6-2.1, 10% 4wkly
2014: 2.1 to 0.4, 10% 4-6 wkly, including reinstatement from 1 to 2 after crash

Off paroxetine since 18 Dec 2014.

2 months manageable to good. Currently suffering again.

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I just saw someone post that the feelings we are having are actually our feelings, just much more intense.

 

I don't buy this. I agree, some of them are ours. But, I have had a slew of emotions and thoughts that are nothing like anything I have ever experienced in all of my life.

 

Any thoughts?

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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If you want to be literal any thought was have is our cause we had it... but a drug or withdrawal induced thought.. can be identified as such by a few test and we can do our own as nobody knows us better than we do.. if we are not under the influence of one of the above... 

 

So when in a window we will see or when we are off drugs... but when we 're in it ... our ability is to see if lessened a lot.  

 

when we are in it we have this agnosia to it... can't see it are completely blind to it.. no body who has ever had it and lived beyond it would ever say these are your normal thoughts... Nobody.... sorry I am struggling with clarity it is in here but I can't line it up to set it on the shelf just now... I know what I mean ... can't find the words... so I guess that is a fail. 

 

Why I am not here much lately... sorry. 

peace

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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I just saw someone post that the feelings we are having are actually our feelings, just much more intense.

I don't buy this. I agree, some of them are ours. But, I have had a slew of emotions and thoughts that are nothing like anything I have ever experienced in all of my life.

Any thoughts?

I said it on many occassions that I am confused in recognising what is neuroemotion and what is my normal emotion...i don't feel anything extra or different...

For example, I felt a bit anxious today morning, but it is nothing new...I was worried if I will manage, which is nothing new...

I guess it is quite individal then, depends on our personality...maybe...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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I just saw someone post that the feelings we are having are actually our feelings, just much more intense.

I don't buy this. I agree, some of them are ours. But, I have had a slew of emotions and thoughts that are nothing like anything I have ever experienced in all of my life.

Any thoughts?

I said it on many occassions that I am confused in recognising what is neuroemotion and what is my normal emotion...i don't feel anything extra or different...

For example, I felt a bit anxious today morning, but it is nothing new...I was worried if I will manage, which is nothing new...

I guess it is quite individal then, depends on our personality...maybe...

I'm in acute withdrawal from a CT. So I have all kinds of crazy stuff going on that is simply not me. I don't think this would be nearly as pronounced if I were tapering.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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All my emotions I recognise that "this is me"...

I actually appreciate my feelings, as there was some time when I was simply frozen, but it related to PTSD...When I re-started feeling I have found it as quite pleasant, even if I have "bad emotions", such as anger...

There is something "alive" in feelings...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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I'm happy you have found some meaning in feeling again. :) that is a huge improvement.

 

Like I mentiined, we are not in similar situations, so I don't think what I'm experiencing is what you are describing.

2005-Zoloft bad reaction.....2006-Lexepro......2012-Upped Lexepro.......2013-Upped Lexepro......2/2014- Attempted Taper Lexepro...2/2014- Updosed Lexepro.......3/2014-Ativan.....5/2014- CT switch from Lexpro to Effexor.....

5/2014-7/2014-Tapered Ativan from 1mg to .25mg.....6/2014-Bad reaction to Effexor........7/2014- Rapid taper Effexor every other day......7/5/2014- Off Effexor.......7/2014-12/2014 - Ativan .25mg.......12/25/2014 -Taper Ativan by 4% due to paradoxical reaction .24mg...11/18/2015-Taper Ativan 1% CURRENTLY ON: .2376mg Ativan taken in 6 .0396mg doses.

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Sometimes I wonder if it is possible that I have been experiencing neuroemotions since I started medication, or when I selfmedicated with alcohol? And maybe at presenet I am just beginning to manage them in a better way?

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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For me, neuro emotions seem unrelated to the trigger, if there even IS a perceived trigger at all. This was more pronounced in my early wd. I could feel terrified, a very intense fear and aversion to the site of sunlight on my floor for example. there were no thoughts attached, like, oh the sun will damage my floor, or any such thing...it was intense emotion that had nothing rational to do with the so called "trigger" at hand. Or a deep sense of sadness and grief washing over for no reason at all, while not even thinking. To me, chemically induced feelings that make no sense are neuro emotions. When my dog barks too loud I feel intense anger for example...that sort of thing.

2 Timothy 1-7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

Effexor 75mg to 262.5mg 2005-2010 for post partum depression

Started having poop out mid 2010, also switched generic brands, then crashed in Dec 2010 (anxiety/ "terror", intense DR, anhedonia, suicidal ideation, chills, insomnia, horrible intrusive thoughts, disorientation, ect)
Rapid "tapered" from 262.5mg Effexor in 3 months

Tried Celexa,Cipralex, then Paxil to deal with wd(this switching made things worse and added akathesia)

Found online support and started tapering Paxil 7 months after quitting Effexor (at this point was having small windows).

Paxil taper: dropped 10% every 4-8 weeks

Year 1 October 2011 to Nov 2012 20mg to 10mg

Year 2 March 2013 to Feb 2014 10mg to 4mg

Year 3 April 2014 to May 2015 4mg to 1.1mg

Year 4 June 2015 1.1mg , dropping by 10% until .5mg, after then dropped by 0.1mg every 5 weeks until 0.1mg.

Finished! Official last dose of 0.1mg on June 15/16

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I often have had emotions unrelated to the trigger. Usually they relate to my past. E.g. I may be thinking that "I will not manage" and get into the panic state, but this is from my past. If the emotions is too strong, I ask myself if it relates to "here and now"...It is like a habit with me, always question my emotional states...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I just saw someone post that the feelings we are having are actually our feelings, just much more intense.

 

I don't buy this. I agree, some of them are ours. But, I have had a slew of emotions and thoughts that are nothing like anything I have ever experienced in all of my life.

 

Any thoughts?

I completely agree that the thoughts are foreign to our real personalities. These thoughts, feelings, and reactions I have now are NOTHING like my personality before meds and everyone in my family will attest to that.

*I'm not a doctor and don't give medical advice, just personal experience
**Off all meds since Nov. 2014. Mentally & emotionally recovered; physically not
-Dual cold turkeys off TCA & Ativan in Oct 2014. Prescribed from 2011-2014

-All meds were Rxed off-label for an autoimmune illness.  It was a MISDIAGNOSIS, but I did not find out until AFTER meds caused damage.  All med tapers/cold turkeys directed by doctors 

-Nortriptyline May 2012 - Dec 2013. Cold turkey off nortrip & cold switched to desipramine

-Desipramine Jan 2014 - Oct. 29, 2014 (rapid taper/cold turkey)

-Lorazepam 1 mg per night during 2011
-Lorazepam 1 mg per month in 2012 (or less)

-Lorazepam on & off, Dec 2013 through Aug 2014. Didn't exceed 3x a week

-Lorazepam again in Oct. 2014 to help get off of desipramine. Last dose lzpam was 1 mg, Nov. 2, 2014. Immediate paradoxical reactions to benzos after stopping TCAs 

-First muscle/dystonia side effects started on nortriptyline, but docs too stupid to figure it out. On desipramine, muscle tremors & rigidity worsened

-Two weeks after I got off all meds, I developed full-blown TD.  Tardive dystonia, dyskinesia, myoclonic jerks ALL over body, ribcage wiggles, facial tics, twitching tongue & fingers, tremors/twitches of arms, legs, cognitive impairment, throat muscles semi-paralyzed & unable to swallow solid food, brain zaps, ears ring, dizzy, everything looks too far away, insomnia, numbness & electric shocks everywhere when I try to fall asleep, jerk awake from sleep with big, gasping breaths, wake with terrors & tremors, severely depressed.  NO HISTORY OF DEPRESSION, EVER. Meds CREATED it.

-Month 7: hair falling out; no vision improvement; still tardive dystonia; facial & tongue tics returned
-Month 8: back to acute, incl. Grand Mal seizure-like episodes. New mental torment, PGAD, worse insomnia
-Month 9: tardive dystonia worse, dyskinesia returned. Unable to breathe well due to dystonia in stomach, chest, throat
-Month 13: Back to acute, brain zaps back, developed eczema & stomach problems. Left leg no longer works right due to dystonia, meaning both legs now damaged
-7 years off: Huge improvements, incl. improved dystonia

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Neuro-emotions are so deceiving. 

 

Right now I'm having a bad bout of akathisia that's been going on for almost a month with no relief. Along with this physical torment, I feel like I don't love my boyfriend anymore. I've been with him for 4 years and felt deep and true love for him before, but when waves come along I feel like I no longer love him and I shut him out and tell him he should better get a healthy and happy girlfriend, because God knows when I will recover, "probably never". Those are my thoughts and emotions. I know they are neuro-emotions, but they feel so real right now. I'm stuck in this loveless feeling right now, and it's bitter and painful and I know this is not me. 

-Effexor 150 mgs (2001-2009). Severe withdrawal symptoms during and after tapering for 6 months.  

-Pristiq 50 mg (2009-2012) Tapered over a year. Worst year of my life. 

-Prozac 20 mg (2012) Tapered over 6 moths to ease withdrawal. Still had severe WD symptoms. 

- (2012-2014) Doctor tried more than 20 medications for depression and WD, leaving me hypersensitive, and in protracted withdrawal. 

- Most debilitating symptoms during protracted withdrawal have been deep depression, anxiety, brain zaps, fatigue, akathisia, twitching, headaches and terrible PMS. 

-January 2015: Started Lamictal 12.5 mg, increased to 25 mg.- Bad reaction when updosed to 50 mg. Stopped. 

-February 2015: Doctor tried new antidepressant Brintellix - Horrible reaction. Discontinued completely. Severe AKATHISIA started.

-March 2015:  Started TMS therapy (Transcranial magnetic stimulation) for severe depression. Didn't work. 

-July 23-August 12: Had 10 ECT sessions which took away my protracted withdrawal symptoms including: akathisia, brain zaps, muscle twitches, fatigue and depression. Stopped medications. 

-September 2015: Experiencing bouts of depression again and muscle twitching. 

-March 2016: Started 20 mg Nortryptiline for depression. It helped. 

-August 2016: Slowly tapering Nortryptiline. 

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