duvylove: insomnia suddenly stopping 10mg amitriptyline / Elavil

[Miko789]

you can try omega 3s fish oil which is recommended for wd and very nutritious but keep the capsules refrigerated. i take 3 caps /daily

has it helped with your insomnia?

 

good luck

[honingbij]

Duvylove:

I am tapering from amitriptyline and take part of my dose in liquid form.

Amitriptyline dissolves very easily in water. It's the drug's only redeeming feature.

What I do is dilute 25 mg in 25 ml of bottled water in a small jar. I use a graduated cylinder to measure the water, but you could use a syringe.

So, that makes 1 mg in 1 ml of water. [You can, of course, dilute 10 mg in 10 ml of water and get the same dilution 1:1]
.
Then I use an Aerolatte milk foamer to mix it thoroughly.
 

I then use a syringe to draw up my dose and put it in a shot glass with a little bit of water and drink it. I then put a bit more water in the shot glass and drink that, to make sure I got all the dose.

If you need to, you can make different dilutions [2:1, 3:1 etc] and then calculate how much you need to pull up in your syringe for your dose.

You can store the dilution in the refrigerator. I usually keep mine for about 2 weeks before changing it. The drug is very stable diluted if kept refrigerated. It's so much cheaper than the liquid Amitriptyline from the pharmacy.

Edited April 14, 2020 by honingbij
added information, punctuation

[duvylove]

11 hours ago, Miko789 said:

r wd and very n

 

11 hours ago, Miko789 said:

you can try omega 3s fish oil which is recommended for wd and very nutritious but keep the capsules refrigerated. i take 3 caps /daily

has it helped with your insomnia?

Hi Miko.....many thanks for the suggestion. 3 capsules daily but what was the concentration of each capsule?

[duvylove]

9 hours ago, honingbij said:

I usually keep mine for about 2 weeks before changing it.

Hi Honinggbij....million thanks for your tips. could you actually keep the solution as long as 2weeks, is that not too long?

 

[honingbij]

Duvylove:

I've had no problems keeping it in the refrigerator. I had checked with my pharmacist to make sure the drug would still be stable under those conditions.

But you can certainly mix up a fresh dose every day, if you'd prefer.

I had forgotten to add in my previous reply that, depending on the temperature of my kitchen, it takes anywhere between 10 minutes in the summer and 30 minutes in the winter for the tablet to dissolve. 


 

[duvylove]

4 hours ago, honingbij said:

I had checked with my pharmacist to make sure the drug would still be stable under those conditions.

Oh great. good to know you actually confirmed this from a professional as i would personally wish to keep my solution for 10 - 14 days 

 

All i  do now is dissolve 5mg armitiptyline in 20ml distilled water in a sealed urine sample container. Leave it for 2 hours in the refrigerator then shake thoroughly for 1 minute afterwards before extracting my  4ml (i.e 1mg) with a syringe.

 

Once i am done, i keep the urine sample container in a thick brown envelope then store in the refrigerator. I actually got this idea from @manymoretodays

 

Meanwhile, i have read from many people  in this forum that you need to keep the remaining solution away from light as much as possible and the reason i chuck it in brown paper bag after use.

 

Is this a fact or an opinion?

[honingbij]

57 minutes ago, duvylove said:

Is this a fact or an opinion?

 

I haven't a clue!😊

This is the first I've heard of it. Then again, I haven't been active on the board because up until now, I've had pretty smooth sailing tapering from 75 mg to my present 10.7 mg [although it's taken me years to get to this point]. I've just started to have some problems with my taper, so that's why I'm back on.

Thanks for the head's up on this; I'll look into it.

 

[Altostrata]

Thanks, @honingbij I think I might keep the homemade liquid only a week, refrigerated, to be on the safe side.

 

@duvylove, it sounds like you are set with the amitriptyline liquid?

[duvylove]

25 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

it sounds like you are set with the amitriptyline liquid?

Hi Altostrata,

 

Yep. yesterday I had my first 1mg (i.e 4ml) reinstatement dose and i notice some improvement in my sleep immediately.

Meanwhile, i intend to add omega 3 fish oil anytime soon, is it too early. if not, what dose do you recommend and how often? 

[honingbij]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

Thanks, @honingbij I think I might keep the homemade liquid only a week, refrigerated, to be on the safe side.

 

Thanks, Altostrata; I'll do that. Do I need to protect it from the light in the refrigerator?

[Altostrata]

Yes, protect it from light.

 

About fish oil https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/

 

 

[manymoretodays]

Hi duvylove,

I think the protection from light, even the on and off refrigerator light is standard practice for most medications.  Have you ever noticed the amber bottles that they come in?

And it sounds like you are off and running with the reinstatement now too.

5 mg in 20 mL gives you 1 mg per each 4 mL.  And that all looks good too, then.  Your math.

Stay consistent with your mixing and measuring now too.  And keep us updated please.

I too, wouldn't go longer than a week at a time with a homemade batch.

Best,

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[Miko789]

On 4/14/2020 at 11:01 PM, duvylove said:

 

Hi Miko.....many thanks for the suggestion. 3 capsules daily but what was the concentration of each capsule?

dont worry duvylove, about concetratio each capsule its like you having fish every day like paleo diet, dont worry about concetration, you make hard for yourself

[duvylove]

On 4/8/2020 at 4:14 AM, manymoretodays said:

duvylove,

 

I went ahead and put the information, from the post of yours, into your signature.

Let me know if you can't delete the attachment, and scribbles, and I can try and do that for you.

That way you will have room for further updates in your survivingantidepressants "signature".

Currently, members only get 12 lines.

Hi mmt,

 

I am finding it difficult to update my signature. I have attached a copy below

 

Could you help?

 

Thanks

2020-04-19_Signature.docx

[duvylove]

On 4/14/2020 at 11:57 AM, Miko789 said:

you can try omega 3s fish oil which is recommended for wd and very nutritious but keep the capsules refrigerated. i take 3 caps /daily

has it helped with your insomnia?

Hi Miko,

 

I just started taking 2 capsules (450mg EPD/DHA each) daily roughly two days ago. I also take it along size Vitamin E 400 UI to aid its metabolism.

 

My sleep has improved about 30% somewhat since i reinstated but there is something funny i have noticed consistently in the last 6 days and its making me worried. I wake up daily with sleep apnea between 3am - 4am daily then i dont sleep again till about 8am in the morning for about 2hrs and funnily this morning sleep is usually sleep apnea free. I find it very strange as my sleep is broken in two parts.  

[duvylove]

On 4/11/2020 at 9:44 PM, manymoretodays said:

With reinstatement though, generally you would just be HOLDing at the reinstatement dose.  You wouldn't neccessarily have to rush into tapering after just 6 weeks.  You might stay on the 1 mg dose for longer.   6 months or more.  

And just stay steady for awhile before even beginning to taper off again. 

 

Hi mmt,

 

its been 6 days now after 1mg reinstatement and my sleep is beginning to improve gradually. So you suggest i stay on this 1mg dose for about 6 months before i contemplate any form of tapering at all?

[Shep]

On 4/19/2020 at 9:38 AM, duvylove said:

I am finding it difficult to update my signature. I have attached a copy below

 

Duvy, please write the information for your signature in a post and either I or another moderator can help you get it in your signature. For some reason, I'm not able to see what's in your attachment. 

[duvylove]

58 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

Duvy, please write the information for your signature in a post and either I or another moderator can help you get it in your signature. For some reason, I'm not able to see what's in your attachment.

[ 1 ] Armitriptyline (10mg Daily) - 22 July 2019 - 01 August 2019; 30 August 2019 - 05 September 2019 & 21 December 2019 - 31 January 2020

Armitriptyline (20mg Daily) - 06 September 2019 - 20 December 2019

Armitriptyline (5mg Daily) - 01 February 2020 - 01 March 2020

Armitriptyline (1mg Daily) - 14 April 2020 - Till Date

[ 2 ] Gaviscon Advance (5ml 3 Times Daily) - 11 May 2019 - Till Date

[ 3 ] Vitamin D-3 (10,000 IU Every 7 days) -   30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 4 ] MK-7 Vitamin K-2 (100 mcg Every 7 days) - 30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 5 ] Omega 3 Fish oil (450 EPA/DHA 3 days) - 30 August 2019 - 14 February 2020  &  (450 EPA/DHA X 2 Daily) - 19 April 2020 - Till Date

[ 6 ] Vitamin E -400UI  (268mg X 2 Daily) - 30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 7 ] Tryptophan (500mg Daily) - 05 April 2020 - 12 April 2020

[ 8 ] Melatonin (3mg Daily) - 09 August 2019 - 16 August 2019

[duvylove]

On 4/14/2020 at 11:57 AM, Miko789 said:

you can try omega 3s fish oil which is recommended for wd and very nutritious but keep the capsules refrigerated. i take 3 caps /daily

has it helped with your insomnia?

Hi Miko,

 

I estimate it would take me roughly 24 months or more when i start tapering my current dose of 1mg Armitriptyline. Meanwhile, do i have to use omega 3 fish oil alongside till the end? If not, how do you use it?   

[Shep]

22 hours ago, duvylove said:

[ 1 ] Armitriptyline (10mg Daily) - 22 July 2019 - 01 August 2019; 30 August 2019 - 05 September 2019 & 21 December 2019 - 31 January 2020

Armitriptyline (20mg Daily) - 06 September 2019 - 20 December 2019

Armitriptyline (5mg Daily) - 01 February 2020 - 01 March 2020

Armitriptyline (1mg Daily) - 14 April 2020 - Till Date

[ 2 ] Gaviscon Advance (5ml 3 Times Daily) - 11 May 2019 - Till Date

[ 3 ] Vitamin D-3 (10,000 IU Every 7 days) -   30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 4 ] MK-7 Vitamin K-2 (100 mcg Every 7 days) - 30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 5 ] Omega 3 Fish oil (450 EPA/DHA 3 days) - 30 August 2019 - 14 February 2020  &  (450 EPA/DHA X 2 Daily) - 19 April 2020 - Till Date

[ 6 ] Vitamin E -400UI  (268mg X 2 Daily) - 30 August 2019 - Till Date

[ 7 ] Tryptophan (500mg Daily) - 05 April 2020 - 12 April 2020

[ 8 ] Melatonin (3mg Daily) - 09 August 2019 - 16 August 2019

 

Thanks, Duvy. Before we add this to your signature, please let us know what "till date" means. Does that mean you're still taking it? 

[duvylove]

47 minutes ago, Shep said:

Does that mean you're still taking it?

Hi Shep,

 

Yes, you are absolutely correct. "Till Date" means i am still on the drug

[Shep]

21 hours ago, duvylove said:

Hi Shep,

 

Yes, you are absolutely correct. "Till Date" means i am still on the drug

 

Thanks, Duvy. I've updated your signature, replacing "till date" with "present" to make it clear that you are currently on it. 

 

I placed what you are currently taking in blue. 

[duvylove]

2 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Thanks, Duvy. I've updated your signature, replacing "till date" with "present" to make it clear that you are currently on it. 

 

I placed what you are currently taking in blue.

Hi Shep,

 

Good. No problem. makes a lot of sense

Thank you very much for your help👍

[manymoretodays]

On 4/22/2020 at 11:08 AM, duvylove said:

Hi mmt,

 

its been 6 days now after 1mg reinstatement and my sleep is beginning to improve gradually. So you suggest i stay on this 1mg dose for about 6 months before i contemplate any form of tapering at all?

 

Hi duvylove,

How is it going this week?  And that's wonderful on the sleep. 

Yes, I think that might be best, to stay put with the 1 mg. dose.

When do you take it?

How are you doing this week?

 

Best, L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[duvylove]

11 hours ago, manymoretodays said:

Hi duvylove,

How is it going this week?  And that's wonderful on the sleep. 

Yes, I think that might be best, to stay put with the 1 mg. dose.

When do you take it?

How are you doing this week?

 

Best, L, P, H, and G,

mmt

Hi mmt,

 

how are you and hope you are keeping safe? Yea.....i am getting an average of 3 - 4 hours sleep per night now which is an improvement to where i was before the reinstatement. I have added the omega 3 fish oil which i suspect might be helping as well. Meanwhile, how long do you suggest i use the omega 3 fish oil? 

[duvylove]

On 4/9/2020 at 9:24 PM, Jen1234 said:

Oh CBT-I. I hope this works for you. I’ve been through two CBT-I therapists already. Lots of people have great success with it. But they didnt have a med history or didn’t feel meds were the cause of their insomnia. Insomnia is a tricky thing to understand tho so I’m hopeful this will work for you. Do you feel your insomnia is no longer sleep apnea related? Did you ever have sleep problems like this before amitriptyline. I never had this kind of shallow broken sleep prior to meds. Trying to push through and hold out hope it can get better but after two year I begin to wonder if any healing that was gonna happen already took place. Guess we’ll see. Keep in touch I’m rooting for

Hi Jen,

 

Few days after reinstating 1mg of Amitriptyline , I have now come to realize that withdrawal symptoms from Amitriptyline was the major cause of my insomnia or wakefulness. Apart from that, this is the second time i have "cold turkey" on the med so i can actually tell due to experience. My sleep apnea is a separate issue on its own but each time i drop weight to about 85kg, it usually resolve. The CBT for sleep is more of an additive measure to improve my sleep generally so i have decided i will take things very slowly this time around with Amitriptyline. Hopefully, in the next 24 months i should have been able to successfully taper it with minimal WD. 

 

So how is your insomnia? do you mean to say you have been having insomnia issue for the past 2 years now?

[Jen1234]

So happy you found the root of your symptoms and that a reinstatement helped! Slow and steady wins the race  you’ll be able to come just fine I bet. 
 

yes I’ve had the insomnia for two years now 

[manymoretodays]

Hi duvylove,

I'm still taking my omega 3's, as I find it hard to get from just dietary sources or foods.  So good, that it does seem to help you right now.  I too, take the Vit E, with mine.  You may be able to gradually increase too, with the Omega 3's.  Looks like you've gotten started with 900 mg/day and that's good, to start low and then perhaps increase slowly.  Most do best spacing it out, into 2 or 3 times taken per day, rather than all at once.  I take mine morning and at bedtime.

Did you come off the tryptophan?  And how?

 

Doing okay here, thanks for asking.  Root canal tomorrow.....oh joy and otherwise should be feeling real thankful.  Been a bit off balance with the antibiotics, and pain.......which kind of intensifies the rest of things for me........still.  I've got my skills, I've got my non-drug coping skills!!!!!  I do.  And this darn unshakeable faith in healing ......as well as growth, I suppose.  That personal growth that might one day benefit others.

 

Best, and virtual hugs,

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[duvylove]

16 hours ago, manymoretodays said:

Did you come off the tryptophan?  And how?

Hi mmt,

 

Yes  i did come off the tryptophan immediately i reinstated the 1mg Armitriptyline. I just stopped taking it at bedtime as i have only used for about a week and wasn't working fro me.

 

Meanwhile, good luck with the root canal.You sound very tough and clever so i trust you'll cope well with whatever it brings. 

 

 Have a splendid weekend and continue to keep safe

 

Best regards

[duvylove]

On 4/30/2020 at 4:37 PM, Jen1234 said:

yes I’ve had the insomnia for two years now 

Hi Jen,

 

sorry you have to cope with the insomnia for this long. Exactly what i was trying to avoid and the reason i had to quickly reinstate. 

 

If your insomnia is caused by WD then your nervous system is not at 100%. As it might be too late for you to reinstate, a supplement that will help you nervous system would really go a long way in my opinion.

 

Have you considered omega 3 fish oil?