stevenb: need advice on tapering Zyprexa and citalopram

[stevenb]

None yet chessie, just praying for my prescriptions to come through and have the plan to reinstate at 10mg citalopram and 10mg olanzapine and maybe go from there if that sounds like a decent plan?

 

I had the citalopram laying around but am out of the olanzapine, so I took 10mg citalopram this morning.

[ChessieCat]

I do not know if that is a good plan or not because you've been chopping and changing your drugs and doses over the last 2 years.

 

We have members of SA who have changed drugs and doses multiple times and they say they have had no issues doing it.  And then one time they try to do the same thing that they have done before and their nervous system has become destabilised and they end up worse.  This is because the effect of taking psychiatric drugs is cumulative.

 

[stevenb]

Yeah that makes sense. I feel like I hadn't been the same person since that abilify injection.

 

My reason for switching is, feels like I've hit a tolerance or something. I could take the meds for weeks, months continuously and end up sooooo depressed it's painful.

 

I'm making it a goal of mine now to stop trying to switch meds and stabilize on 10mg citalopram(from 20mg)and 10mg olanzapine(from 15mg)

 

 

[stevenb]

What are your thoughts on blood pressure medicines? I had an appointment yesterday but missed it cause I was doing really bad mentally.

 

I've had a systolic blood pressure of 140-150 for years now.

[ChessieCat]

SA is a site for going off psychiatric drugs.  The staff are peers, not medical professionals, and therefore cannot provide any advice regarding medical conditions including blood pressure.  You will need to follow up with your doctor.  

 

One general suggestion that I will give is that if the readings are only taken in the doctor's office (which can be stressful and cause an increase in blood pressure), then it may be helpful to be fitted with a halti monitor and track your blood pressure over a 24 hour period which can give a more accurate assessment; you will need to request this from your doctor.  The other option is to get your own blood pressure monitor and take readings at different times throughout the day and record them over a period of time and then show them to your doctor.

[stevenb]

Just some daily notes I've gathered.

 

August 23rd
10:00am woke up, took 10mg citalopram
12:00pm daily exercise of jump rope
3:00pm had family visit, felt very off first half of session, felt extremely awkward until it finally eased up towards end of visit
5:20pm walked around backyard for 20-30minutes
8:00pm took olanzapine 10mg
10:00pm fell asleep

 

August 24th
11:35am woke up, ate food
11:50am took citalopram 10mg
2:00pm workout with a 25 pound weight plate
3:15pm watched TV for a bit(Jersey shore lol)
4:35 walked for a good 10 minutes
4:35 felt very angry about having to take medication, feeling it's hindered my life greatly
6:15 had my first cig in over 24 hours (trying to quit)

At 8:00pm I'll take my 10mg olanzapine and go to bed few hours later. So far so good.
 

[stevenb]

 

Fell asleep around 10pm, woke up at 11:30am, sleep is still good, anxiety not too bad either. Think this is working. I plan to hold for as long as necessary

 

 

 

I was going back and forth between my mom's and my aunt's and misplaced my Chantix.. they were working too I think, only took for 2 days and they really reduced my smoking cravings 😕 I'll have to wait a month to try again. I went from smoking a pack a day to not smoking for a day then only having 1 or 2 a day.

[stevenb]

Also for sleep I'm taking melatonin 5mg.

[Altostrata]

Good to hear your regimen is working. We don't have to monitor the drugs you've decided to take.

 

Please let us know when you want to taper.

[stevenb]

Would just like to note that after reading more on melatonin I think I may be taking too much so for now will be cutting a 5mg tablet into quarters 

[stevenb]

So everytime I have tried to do a med change, that's made it harder on my nervous system and the way I feel on the original medication I'm trying to taper?

 

I'm just waiting for the moment I start feeling really bad down the road again so I can just ride it out and hopefully never try to switch again.

[stevenb]

Also I'm unfortunately most likely starting Wellbutrin tommorow for smoking cessation. 

 

Open to suggestions on weather or not that's a good idea. Maybe hold off? Or is it no issue to just start?

[ChessieCat]

You have a choice about whether you start Wellbutrin or not, so there is no "unfortunately" about it.

 

Wellbutrin is a psychiatric drug and you might get withdrawal symptoms when you try to stop it.

 

Tips for tapering off buproprion (Wellbutrin, SR, XR, XL)

 

I suggest that you do your own research about possible side effects of Wellbutrin as well as drug interaction check for Wellbutrin plus the drugs you are currently takings.

 

https://www.drugs.com/

 

Drug.com Interactions Checker

Medscape Drug Interaction Checker

[ChessieCat]

It can take as little as 4 weeks to the brain to fully adapt to getting a psychiatric drug.

 

From:

 

https://www.drugsdb.com/rx/wellbutrin/wellbutrin-use-to-quit-smoking-cessation/

 

Quote

Normally, this medication is taken on a daily basis for at least 1 to 2 weeks before cigarette or tobacco is stopped. This helps the medication to achieve the desired level in the body. After the tobacco is stopped, Wellbutrin should be taken for the next 7 to 12 weeks, although treatment can last for as long as 6 months to one year.

 

[Shep]

On 8/28/2022 at 12:02 AM, ChessieCat said:

You have a choice about whether you start Wellbutrin or not, so there is no "unfortunately" about it.

 

Wellbutrin is a psychiatric drug and you might get withdrawal symptoms when you try to stop it.

 

@stevenb I agree 100% with CC on this - you DO have a choice. 

 

Not only might you get withdrawal symptoms from Wellbutrin, you may also end up in the emergency room or the morgue. There are multiple adverse reactions to adding this drug to your current drugs, including possible seizures and increasing the blood level of citalopram.

 

Drug Interaction Report - Wellbutrin, citalopram, olanzapine

 

Please research before posting. 

 

If you add this drug in, you'll need to work with your doctor. This is beyond what this site is capable of handling. As noted many times in your thread, this is a site for coming off psychiatric drugs, not drug shopping for the next pill. 

 

If you want to stop smoking, you can taper your cigarettes just like we recommend tapering psychiatric drugs. You may want to research the effect of nicotine on neuroleptics (antipsychotics). Many people on neuroleptics smoke because it reduces the side effects of the neuroleptic. I would consider cigarettes another drug to taper and do so strategically so you don't conflate the withdrawal symptoms. In other words, taper them when you're not reducing your other drugs (see: The rule of 3KIS: Keep it simple. Keep it slow. Keep it stable.).

 

But again, if you decide to add Wellbutrin to your already complicated mix, you need to work with your doctor, not an online forum. 

[Altostrata]

@stevenb, as this is a site for going off drugs, we are not going to get involved if you want to increase drugs. There is no reason to announce it or discuss it here. You may wish to join sites such as patientslikeme.com or depressionforums.org

 

Please let us know when you want assistance in tapering.

[stevenb]

Sorry guys, im not meaning to cause any trouble, im just bored in my own head on these psych meds. Very sorry.

[Shep]

Thanks, Steven. In order to break the boredom, you may want to work on developing your non-drug coping skills: 

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Starting a project such as a new hobby in music, photography, art, yoga, meditation, etc. can help you pass the time and give you the skills you need to live drug free. 

[stevenb]

Having insomnia now. Do you know any links for distiguishing between withdrawal and relapse of illness?

[ChessieCat]

22 minutes ago, stevenb said:

Do you know any links for distiguishing between withdrawal and relapse of illness?

 

Is it withdrawal or relapse?  Or something else?

How do I know it's withdrawal and not relapse?

 

22 minutes ago, stevenb said:

Having insomnia now.

 

https://getselfhelp.co.uk/sleep-insomnia-self-help/

 

Here is a list of Alto's favourite sleep topics:

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Sleep and withdrawal

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

[stevenb]

I slept. Overslept actually, i was up so late cause i didnt take my 10mg olanzapine until like 1:00am.

 

Cant help but think about making another cut and when i should do that.

 

Any signs i should be looking out for?

[stevenb]

I am happy where i am at though, it was just something ive been thinking about. I dont actually want to make another cut for realistically 1-2 months at least im thinking.

 

Maybe longer... My aunt says 6 months, idk

 

[stevenb]

My ocd was raging last night, so much so that i forgot to take my pill and fell asleep without it. Ughhh

 

Im just starting to gain interests in old hobbies again and such. Hope i dont mess myself up with that missed dose

[getofflex]

You may want to set a reminder on your cell phone, assuming you have one, to remind you to take your drugs.  Missing doses can confuse the brain, and worsen symptoms.  so can taking the drug at different times of the day, and 

On 8/31/2022 at 5:01 PM, stevenb said:

Cant help but think about making another cut and when i should do that.

 

Any signs i should be looking out for?

Wait until you are stable. This link explains what we mean by that: 

 

Stability

[stevenb]

Took my evening dose a little late again tonight, thankfully I took it though. So I am up kinda late and really just thinking a lot. It's extremely upsetting to realize that the whole "treatment process" was a lie and I was just being programmed and rewired to be dependant on these pills, that in my case, are completely ruining my health and life.

 

I've been gaining weight lately, I was, for years stuck at a specific unhealthy weight, but the past few months it has been slowly increasing and it's very depressing because it's not that i'm not doing anything, it's that the damn med I take completely hinders my ability to have any health or happiness. (olanzapine notorious for causing high blood pressure, weight gain and metabolic complications)

 

Will continue holding at this dose for i'm sure a long time to come. Also worrying a little about not having any support system in place, other than this site for tapering, but hopefully I can get something figured out with my upcoming appointment in mid october.

[stevenb]

Struggling with personal hygiene lately. I brushed and showered super good today but... it has not been going so well lately. Emberassing but the reality for me on these demon drugs..

 

[Altostrata]

Olanzapine quite commonly causes people to become sluggish, demotivated, and gain weight.

[stevenb]

This is probably reaching a bit but.. do you guys know the dose equivilent of 10mg olanzapine to Rexulti(name brand)? I checked the dose equivilent thread but cannot find Rexulti or brexpiprozole(generic) anywhere probably because it's so new.

[ChessieCat]

Q:  Are you thinking of changing from olanzapine to Rexulti?

[stevenb]

I am yes

[ChessieCat]

SA is not able to assist with drug switches like you are considering and will not be able to provide any support.  You will need to work with a medical professional.

 

SA is a site for reducing/getting off psychiatric drugs.  During your time here, 2 years, you have not given any serious indication that you are attempting to do that.  The SA staff are unpaid peers, not medical professionals, the site is very busy with a lot of members, and we prefer to spend our valuable time working with members who are genuine about getting off their drugs.

 

Sorry, but SA will no longer provide you with assistance; SA is not the right site for you.  There are other sites and support groups where you can discuss drug changes etc.

 

There is a lot of information on SA about how to taper.  If in the future you decide that you want to get off your drugs, then you know where to find the information.  The first thing you could do is go back and read through your topic and the suggestions and links already provided.  And this topic has links to some of the information:

 

Important topics in the Tapering forum and FAQ

 

Out of curiosity I did an internet search using this term:

 

olanzapine brexpiprozole rexulti switch

 

 

[ChessieCat]

Please see this member's experience of Rexulti.  Drinking and gambling.

 

labrat15-comment=613067

 

labrat15-comment=613112

  

 

  

 

 

[stevenb]

Thank you for the links chessie am reading them right now. I must've ready somewhere on here before something about cross-tapering to other meds and so just assumed it was allowed. Also, I AM serious about getting off the meds, I have not touched my dose this whole 3 weeks and considered myself in withdrawal. Not sure where the miscommunication on my end is coming from but sorry for wasting your time, I will search another forum

[ChessieCat]

I think you need to seriously think about what your goals are and how you are going to achieve them.  Since you joined SA you have been provided with a lot of excellent information about psychiatric drugs and how to get off them.

 

Please read this new topic.  You have gone on and off various drugs and changed your doses a lot in the last 5 years.  The information here is very relevant to your experience with drugs:

 

 

You were recently asking about switching to Wellbutrin and now you are thinking about changing to Rexulti.

 

Bridging or switching to another drug is a last resort.  If you read Post #1 of the Prozac Bridge/switch topic, much of which is relevant to other drugs, you will see that changing to a different drug is not guaranteed to work.  And keep in mind the possibility of kindling/sensitisation in the above topic.

 

the-prozac-switch-or-bridging-with-fluoxetine

 

Some things to remember:

 

Do your own research about side effects and interactions of drugs BEFORE taking them.

 

It can take as little as 4 weeks for the brain to FULLY adapt to getting a drug.

 

You have already been given a lot excellent information in your topic; you can always go back and read through the responses and the links.

 

You might find the following helpful:

 

Harm Reduction Guide to Coming Off Psychiatric Drugs and Withdrawal

 

Video:  Coming Off Psychiatric Drugs: A Harm Reduction Approach to Medication Withdrawal | Will Hall

 

Getting off psychiatric drug/s is a serious business.  I suggest you also read this:

 

Before you begin tapering what you need to know

 

[ChessieCat]

This is the link that I meant to give you for the new topic; the other topic also  has information:

 

 

 

[stevenb]

5 and half years total on citalopram 20mg and olanzapine 15mg. I tapered off them and last dose was October 2nd 2022.

 

Things have been okay since off. Still depressed mainly because my health is shot to hell after them. My metabolism is completely broken, trying to work on that through exercise and nutrition.

 

The only supplement I take is melatonin 5mg for sleep. My sleep was bad first coming off but has been improving. Last few nights it was 6 hours, then 7, then 8 and last night I got 9 hours.

 

My biggest complaint, other than the handful of very serious health problems i've collected over the years of taking medication I should have never been on is my smoking habit. It started a year ago before I got off meds and presists still.

 

Since so much of medication problems are time based just curious if anyone has any idea how long it may take to quit? I hate everytime I light one more and more by the day now but cannot quit. I've tried many times, so please don't say to just stop or something, every single time I think about how long it may take to quit I think "well I was on those meds for half a decade so could take potentially years" it's super depressing.