sama: using jewelry scale for tapering

[sama]

Thank you for answering alto, so the situation has nothing to do with the new job

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

New jobs might cause anxiety which can affect sleep, you wouldn't want to add withdrawal insomnia to that, correct?

[sama]

18 hours ago, Altostrata said:

correct?

Yes definitely.I’ll hold for weeks.for today I slept wonderfully after speaking to experienced teacher yesterday about my problem and what she did made me feel wonderful for a whole day and did make sense she like know exactly how I might be worrying myself.

[JanCarol]

Hey Sama - just catching up, here are a few things I picked up.  Other mods may have answered some of these by now, but I'm slow, still going through.
 

On 6/7/2022 at 7:18 PM, sama said:

when I was put on lithium my thyroid enlarged and after stoping it it hasn’t gone.

Is your water fluoridated?  If so, consider getting a filter to take the fluoride out.   

I strongly recommend Stop the Thyroid Madness.  I wish I'd found it before I lost my thyroid (surgically removed - same reason as you - swollen so large that it was cutting off blood flow to my head!).  There are other good resources at:  

https://www.verywell.com/lies-about-thyroid-treatment-3232916  (they have dozens of excellent thyroid articles, this is just the closest I found for you)

 

Your Prozac does not need to be taken with food (unless it upsets you, which can sometimes happen) - so if you have a fast time, do not change the time you take your Prozac!  Prozac is better taken earlier in the day, as it can be stimulating.  This, too, could mess with your sleep.

 

I hope you see the sun today!

 

 

[sama]

Titled:  Help with sleeping

 

I have been tapering for more than two years now and I managed to stop Prozac on first of January this year and on April I stopped Lamictal

 

so I was left with seroquel and due to war situation in my country I has to continue tapering and didn’t pause at all, then I had to flee my country I was doing okay and managed to 7-9 hours sleep and sometimes even more and even nap for an hour and more.when I reach 5 mg at beginning I was sleeping less and I wake up anxious but by midday my mood will emprove till I go back to sleep but then when I dropped from 5 to 4.4 four days ago I sleep for 2 to 3 hours waking up by either nightmares or the slightest movement then that it I will be awake till the morning anxious,depressed,feeling internal anxiety and afraid to nap because I will wake more anxious my mood isn’t all the day as bad as the morning,

 

during the who time I was sliding long release form, from today I have a 100 immediate release tablet.my questions are should I continue tapering or just stop here and face it now instead of later.my strees level is very high due to the war,changing places,no exercise,the room is not dark with street noise everyday wishing I could just go home are those contributing factors?

 

also I couldn't sleep at all when I skip a dose and I always end up take it after hours of trying the last time I tried this when I was at 5 mg.

 

I tried melatonin two weeks ago at only .3 or slightly more but  it make me depressed without any motivation so I stoped it after five days.here they don't have magnisum glysinate what other option could I take ?I was taking oxide for two months to help with keto constipation also.which I have been doing since last October to help with tapering and mood it does help with the latter but not like it use to do before the war thing does increasing the carbs for a short period will help sleeping and I am not that strict lately as before.I am also reading about complex trauma and I find a lot represent me and I think it’s triggering me should I stop reading.

Edited July 6, 2023 by manymoretodays
merged to main Introduction, from new Introduction topic, title added, spacing to body for readability

[manymoretodays]

Hey there sama, @sama

I've got your new post now merged up with your topic, your Introduction.  Just one Introduction per member is the rule.  So rather than starting a new one with a question, and update......just post here.  Thanks.

 

You'll see your post above mine now.

 

When you can please edit/update your signature to reflect all of the changes you've done, some fairly recently.  You may have to revise it, and consolidate a bit so it will all fit.  I'll copy the present signature here in another reply so we don't lose it completely.

How to summarize your drug signature history in your signature

Be sure and note the year, followed by month, then name of drug(s) and dose changes.  Thank you.

 

And woah.  Not an easy time for you by any stretch/means. 

 

What exactly are you taking now and at what time?  Just note the time, in o'clock then drug by name and dose. 

 

I also did some spacing in your last post, for ease of reading........one block posts can get pretty difficult to read so if you can when posting, be aware and do what you can to help us out on the reading end.  Thanks for 3rd time.

 

How did you proceed with Prozac and Lamictal tapering?  Were you able to do 10% or less of each previous dosage, and then hold for at least 4 weeks?  Just summarize your method and how it went for you, as to if any WD symptoms, outside of the insomnia you now mention.  And I do see this mentioned before here too.

 

Yes, definitely your present circumstances and environment do play a role.  No doubt in my mind.  And likely some more rapid tapers than we'd like are playing a part as well. 

 

I'll give you some helpful, I hope, links to topics that might have ideas for you now to help manage symptoms and cope:

 

Tips to help sleep: so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

you'll also see a link to the melatonin topic there ^

 

Early morning waking-managing the morning cortisol spike

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker

 

I would say that possibly reading about trauma while experiencing your own could be difficult.  I would find it so.  Do you have some support where you are at now?  Safe people you can talk with who will listen.  And take really good care of yourself too, treat yourself like you would treat anyone else who has been through what you have......kindness and comfort all the way.

 

Do keep us updated.  I left a couple questions for you above.  Best.

 

Love, peace, healing, and growth,

mmt(manymoretodays)

 

 

 

 

[manymoretodays]

sama's present signature:

-2002 :amiram tricycle antidepressant 

-2007-2015:amiram

-2015-2020 seroquel 300 mg prozac 20 mg lamotrigine 400 mg .

-Sep 2020 lithium 1000mg 

-Nov 2020 i stopped lithium and prozac ct

-Dec 2020 i start tapering seroquel and lamictal 400mg and i take last dose in 23 Jan.

- 6 April 2021 i reinstate seroquel 400 mg prozac 40 mg ,lamotrigine 50 mg and diazepam 15 mg. I leveled fine after a month.

-Seroquel: 9 Sept 360 mg ,22 Oct 300 mg, 11 Dec 250 mg ,16 Mar 2022 150 mg , 20 Apr 125 mg , 3 Jun 100 mg ,27 Jun 90 mg,16 jul 81 mg, 27 sep 65 mg,11 Oct 60,9 Nov 50,8 Dec 40,10 Feb 25 ,16 Apr 15,13 May 7.5 ,5 Jul 5 mg.

-Prozac : 10 Oct 20 mg,2 Feb 2022 16.65 mg, 3 Mar 15 mg , 7 Apr 13.12 mg, 20 Apr 10 mg , 30 May 8.40 mg,6 Jun 8.18 ,13 Jun 7.9 mg ,28 Jun 7 mg,4 jul 6.62 ,21 jul 5.6, 3 aug 5.3 mg ,27 sep 4 mg,1st Jan 0 mg

-Lamictal :2 Feb 2022 47. 5 mg , 3 Mar 43.8 , 7 Apr 38.48 , 20 Apr 25 mg , 30 May 20 mg ,15 Jun 18 mg,29 jun 16,5 mg,13 jul 15.5 mg, 21 Jul 14.5 mg,27 sep 9,4 mg,4 April 0 mg

-Diazepam:  6 Apr 2021 15 mg,28 Jun 12 mg ,28 Jul 9 mg , 7 Sept 8.1 mg ,18 Dec 3 mg ,15 Mar 2022 0 mg.

[sama]

Thank you for replying.I updated my signature.but towards the end of Prozac and lamotrigene I can’t say I was following the 10% methods I just didn’t have any withdrawing symtoms reducing these two.

a little update.two days ago I took 5.7 mg and I slept for around 8 hours I wake two times but I was back to sleep and I napped for two hours. but yesterday I only slept for an hour and it’s 5 in the morning and haven’t slept yet.but I ate  late yesterday which I didn’t the night I slept well and l have an avocado lately which I shouldn’t eat at all I believe. is this pattern going to continue.other symtoms I have I think I am a little depressed sometimes, and after the  four days of 2 hours sleep l had slight akasithia but I think of thinking too much of what is going to happen and imagining bad outcomes.should I continue tapering or just stop it.

I don’t have any one to talk to.

[JanCarol]

Hey Sama, is it possible to let go of "sleeping times?"

 

In a perfect world, you would sleep when everyone else does, awake refreshed and have a productive day.

 

But this isn't a perfect world, it's antidepressant withdrawal.  Your sleep troubles are likely temporary.  OnMyWay gave you a great link about sleep - finding a good sleep hygiene which works for you is a great thing to learn.  Learn now, so that as your sleep gets better, you fall into a pattern of good sleep (the rest of your life will thank you).

But for awhile, while you are healing - your body will be out of whack in a number of systems.  This month (or season) it's sleep, maybe next season will be something else.  

Let's see if I can find the quote (quoting myself from somewhere else on site):
 

Quote

...parts of your brain are closed down.  Imagine very complicated road works with about 25 intersections coming together.  This week, the traffic lights are shut down, and you need a cop to manage the intersection.  When that is repaired, well, maybe they need to re-do the shoulders, so they can divert traffic onto them for later when the lanes are being repaired.  Then there's the repairing of the lanes - it doesn't all happen at once.  Sometimes they need to rip up the old tarmac, change all the drainage routes, relocate the services for electricity and plumbing, get down to the foundation, and re-grade it, lay new gravel, then steel rebar, pouring concrete foundation, then laying the asphalt.  Sometimes you will go for 5 months, and the road is still closed, but you can't see what they are doing to it!  Each phase requires time to set and dry.  Then you can paint the lines on it, and go to another part of the intersection - perhaps one of the other incoming roads needs the same treatment.  Perhaps there are exit ramps and roundabouts and flyover lanes that need repair.  Each of which takes time.

 

Now imagine the millions of networks in your brain healing - they don't just, "heal" and be done.  It's a construction process, like Bubble was saying.  Road works for the brain. 

 

Just my way of saying, be patient with yourself.  It might be the tarmac this week - but the lines aren't on the road and you're disoriented.  Maybe the signals are crossed at the intersections, or the signs are removed or there are detours.  Be gentle with yourself, be patient with yourself.  It's a complex process, and the gentler you are, the more easily you will heal.  It does no good to shake your fist and yell at the construction guys while they are doing their work!  So just wave (lol, wave!) at the worker, declare to yourself, "This is yet another symptom of withdrawal," and drive carefully past the obstacle.

 

If I were having the symptoms you describe, I would allow myself to sleep when sleepy and tired, and find appropriate distractions for when I am awake.  I love sitting up with a book at night.  Or watching Bluey (a children's show).  Or, if I need to rest my body - laying in bed, in comfortable positions, just meditating on "this rests the body," and working through any tensions I may have.  Sometimes, I get some sleep when I do that.

Your sleep may be wacky for a short time, or a little longer (everyone is different).  Eat when you are hungry, sleep when you are tired.  It may be out of sync with the rest of the world (if you can do it) - but be kind to yourself, your body.  Don't judge it for being tired at the wrong times.

In a few years' time you will feel differently, you will have seen the windows and waves, come and pass.  You will survive, and hopefully, thrive (I'm still working on that part).

 

I hope you see the sun today,

JanCarol

[sama]

Thank you for answering it is very encouraging.yes I have always being hard on myself.I know that but I don’t know how to be kinder.

[sama]

I have extreme thirst I think it’s due to high cortisol level could I be having the Cushing syndrome.and is this syndrome permenant? and if so what to do to treat it?

[JanCarol]

Hey Sama - 

 

Extreme thirst can be due to a number of factors.  The easiest is dehydration - adding electrolytes to your water may help with that.  

 

More extreme are conditions such as diabetes.  If this persists, and is added to other symptoms like sweats, frequent urination - you may want to get a doctor to run blood panel just to rule this out.

 

Please don't rush to  make a diagnosis - I had severe "adrenal fatigue" (some people don't recognize that as a thing) for years, and with some nutritional support, was able to turn it around.  We don't know what to do here to treat Cushings or any other diseases.  We're not doctors.  Likely, this is a phase that you are passing through on the way to getting better.

When the symptoms come up (read "road works" quote, above!) give them time to resolve before you rush to a diagnosis.  First of all, most of these symptoms will be transient.  They will come, and then pass.  If you run to diagnose and treat all of them, you will go crazy!

 

Health Anxiety, Hypochondria, and Obsession with Symptoms

If, after a week or two, the electrolytes haven't helped, then you might consider going to a doc for bloodwork to rule out diabetes.  However, by then, your symptoms may not be about dry mouth - but something else.  These things come and go.

But I did want to alert you to keep an eye out for diabetes.  These drugs mess with endocrine & metabolism.  Minding your blood sugar is also important for minding your mood.  I know some people who do all their mood stabilisation with a blood sugar monitor (I tried it for awhile, but didn't have much luck with a cheap monitor).

 

The diet to help with diabetes & metabolic disorder is also good for your brain.  Good quality fats, fish, proteins and low carbs.  That's what I had to go to in order to heal.  Everyone is different, but the low carb high fat diet is good for your liver, pancreas & brain.  Intermittent fasting, also.  

 

Breathe, you can do this.  Get plenty of water, and at least 1-3 serves of electrolytes a day (I don't know what form you have in your country - I get tablets that dissolve in my drink and give a little citrus or blackberry flavour), and see where you are in a week or two.  Look at your diet, as well, eliminating "fast" (not like Fast Food, but food that your body digests too quickly - like sugars) & processed foods, and finding foods which are nutrient dense.

And let go of the "this is permanent" fear.  It's gonna be a lot of things before it's done.  You can consider a symptom to be more permanent after you've been off the drugs for at least 3 years.  You have a ways to go before you can say "It's this!" or "It's that!"

 

I hope you see the sun today (how's your Vit D3?)

Edited July 10, 2023 by JanCarol
added link

[sama]

Thank you for answering the thirst come and go but it’s there I get it in the morning especially,I got a magnesium citrate that I added and I try to take some low salt.but my symtoms hasn’t emproved.and I urinate a lot.I can’t complain about my symtoms to my family I am afraid they will take me to a doctor and be forced to take something.I am monitoring my blood sugar but it’s low.the last time I found this page but I didn’t refuse to take the bills my situation was bad and I wanted a quik relief i am afraid I’ll fall again and this time wouldn’t be able to handle it.

[sama]

Today since I woke up I couldn’t stop pacing.I think since 5 days I have been taking 6 mg. I am hiding the symptom of pacing from my family am afraid I’m I’ll be forced to see a doctor.

[sama]

I only slept for half an hour yesterday.please tell me what I should do I feel so tired and weak.

[Onmyway]

Just rest even if you can't sleep, you will be fine, just don't drive or operate heavy machinery or make big life decisions (like gambling your house away). I used to be able to sleep on trains and using Sleep Hypnosis by SleepCove on Spotify. For some reason they helped. You will likely wake up quickly again but get whatever you can. 

[sama]

You mean I will get a psychosis episode or what. I am in a third world country I live with my parents.

[sama]

There are children in the house, please help me.should I updose or should I check into hospital,I could take 12.5 mg to see if it will help

[sama]

help me

[sama]

Is pacing a distraction for me or why I am doing it?does it help? I do it especially in the morning sometimes I get a short window in the evening finger cross that continue because whenever I focus in something it disappear.

[sama]

I saw people saying they can watch the tv to distract I can’t do that

[sama]

second night sleeping only half an hour between 10.30 and 11 by how much should I up dose?

[Onmyway]

@sama which drug are you asking to updose? You will not get a psychosis from not sleeping - just try to sleep when you can even for a few minutes on a chair makes a difference. The more you worry about sleep the more likely you are to not sleep well. Try to follow the tips in this thread - maybe something will help. 

 

 

Edited July 19, 2023 by Onmyway

[sama]

Updose the seroquel,I gave up yesterday and I took 10 mg immediate release melatonin I slept but now I am depressed. As I mentioned before it gave me depression even when I am not withdrawing and at only .3 mg. It seems that I just can’t face any emotions neither fear or depression.now my body is very tired from all this melatonin should I stop it.

[Onmyway]

I am glad that you managed to sleep. This is great news

 

You need to be careful to not do such drastic amounts - you should always start with the least - so even if you are low the next day it isn't too bad. Would it be helpful to take 0.3mg every night for a few days so that you can get accustomed to it. How is your sleep hygiene (no blue light before bed, dark and cool place to sleep etc.)

 

 

 

[sama]

I only slept for one hour yesterday with the melatonin so I am going to stop it.want to hear stories from people recovered around small doses of seroquel or any psychiatric drugs and then they continue tapering.I am thinking of stopping it Al together and then continue healing.or updose to get some relief.

[Altostrata]

@sama are you in a stable living situation where you have control over your drugs?

 

Quote

-Seroquel: 9 Sept 360 mg ,22 Oct 300 mg, 11 Dec 250 mg ,16 Mar 2022 150 mg , 20 Apr 125 mg , 3 Jun 100 mg ,27 Jun 90 mg,16 jul 81 mg, 27 sep 65 mg,11 Oct 60,9 Nov 50,8 Dec 40,10 Feb 25 ,16 Apr 15,13 May 7.5 ,5 Jul 5 mg.6/Jul/2023 6 mg.

 

Apparently your sleep broke up in July, after the reduction to 5mg? Was anything else disruptive going on in early July? Were you moving from place to place? Did you accidentally skip any doses or take any off-schedule? Is it very hot where you live?

[sama]

Yes,war erupted in my country in April.so I have to move to another contry.I didn’t skip dose but I began waking with high cortisol.then I told my self to just stop at 5 but by 3´clock I took it .and yesterday after gaslighting from my uncle who is a Psychatrist I took 100 mg but today I am determined to get back to 6 mg. How long this dose going to affect me? Yes now I am in stable country.but I have urge to move especially when I can’t calm my self.sometimes it go if I go for a walk or I talk to family member it ease for a couple of hours then began the rumination and I pace till my leg hurts.also I have catastrophic thinking.

[Altostrata]

12 hours ago, sama said:

I took 100 mg but today I am determined to get back to 6 mg. How long this dose going to affect me?

 

To what drug are you referring?

 

What are the drug and dosage changes you've made in the last month?

[sama]

Seroquel.

25/6 5mg

1/7 4.3 mg

4/7 5 mg

6/7 6 mg

23/7 100mg

24/7 100 mg

[sama]

can you get a paradoxale reaction from upping your dose because I can’t stop walking .

[Altostrata]

15 hours ago, sama said:

can you get a paradoxale reaction from upping your dose because I can’t stop walking .

 

Yes, you this is a common effect of too much quetiapine.

 

This is a site for tapering off psychiatric drugs. We do not provide monitoring services for drug additions or increases. I don't know why you are increasing your quetiapine dose, but if your inclination is to continue it, please take your questions to your prescriber.

[sama]

What I should do now?

[Altostrata]

Please talk to your prescriber.