Alan1234: desperately seeking help

[Alan1234]

24 minutes ago, Faure said:

Hi Alan just done a search of SA and found this here:

 

“we recommend a direct, gradual taper from Ambien and other Z-drugs. As they all have very short half-lives -- meaning they wear off during the day -- you might try a 25% reduction perweek.

 

If you get rebound insomnia, reinstate the full dose for several nights and then reduce by 12.5% or less per week, according to your own sensitivity.” From Altostrata 

 

How are you?

 

Hey @faure 

thanks for this.

How are you ?

 

well rebound Insomnia isn’t a problem it never took it away. It just confused the withdrawal more. 

 

im awful still in the worse wave ever. 
added symptoms horrific tinnitus in one ear and mostly deaf in that ear and facial rashes.

 

Vortioxetine gave me nightly panic attacks although it has taken away my suicidal thoughts but the anxiety and insomnia has gotten worse. I have stopped taking them. 

 

I have realised exactly how bad my withdrawal really is, I want to get off all the drugs for good but somehow I need to balance the symptoms I’m having now without getting the suicidal thoughts back. A low low dose of something is definitely needed I think.

 

 

[Alan1234]

Has anyone had a short synacthen test done?

The cardiologist who I was under has referred me for it as it could be the cause of my VT. 

 

my nervous system is in such a mess I don’t know if i should postpone it as this might make me even worse ?

[Faure]

I’m doing well thanks Alan. Sorry to hear you’re still in this awful wave. I saw Dr David Healey mentioned on here today. He is based in Bangor, Wales and has a company offering advice (via video consult) for people having problems with prescription drugs. It’s expensive but may be of some help.
 

The company website is https://econsult.rxisk.org/how-does-it-work/

 

His own website is https://davidhealy.org

[Alan1234]

1 hour ago, Faure said:

I’m doing well thanks Alan. Sorry to hear you’re still in this awful wave. I saw Dr David Healey mentioned on here today. He is based in Bangor, Wales and has a company offering advice (via video consult) for people having problems with prescription drugs. It’s expensive but may be of some help.
 

The company website is https://econsult.rxisk.org/how-does-it-work/

 

His own website is https://davidhealy.org

Hi @Faure 

im so glad and grateful that you are doing well.

 

Ive had personal communication via email with David Healy he was only one of two Psychiatrists who are aware of withdrawal who has gotten back to me. He is now based in Canada. He was helpful but frank. He says I have been poisoned and there is no know cure and anything treatment wise is just a guess/science experiment but will most likely make me worse. He did tag me into a lady who got relief from Duoxepin but he said it doesn’t mean it would work and doesn’t mean my GP would prescribe it as most aren’t aware of the drug as it’s very old.

 

other than that he said unless band together to get governments to listen there’s nothing that can be done. He acknowledged there are thousands of us 

 

[Faure]

Alan, I don’t if you’re well enough to go to this but it looks very interesting. A screening of the film Medicating Normal and a 3 day discussion over the weekend. Only £5. https://ranisuraj.mykajabi.com/registration-page

[Alan1234]

15 hours ago, Faure said:

Alan, I don’t if you’re well enough to go to this but it looks very interesting. A screening of the film Medicating Normal and a 3 day discussion over the weekend. Only £5. https://ranisuraj.mykajabi.com/registration-page

Yes it looks really good. 
Your right I’m not sure if I’m well enough. My anxiety is horrible the slightest thing triggers it. 
 

can I ask how you are managing to taper Mirtazapine?

 

are you crushing tablets and weighing powder ?

 

ive been on yet two more drugs and each one is just aggravating the anxiety further since the Psychiatrist did the abrupt switch from 15mg Mirtazapine in March.

 

im really looking how to reduce the dose of 12.5mg of XR Venlafaxine mini tablet I’m currently taking. I would like to half this dose as the sides are clearly too much and I can’t tolerate the dose. If I crush the tablet there’s practically no powder so I’m not sure how I will get half a dose. I also believe that this then turns the dose into instant release so then needs to be taken half again x 2 per day. 

[Faure]

Hi, I can’t advise you on any drug related questions. But to answer what I am doing with the mirtazepine, I bought a very nice pill crusher (as I’ll be using it several years I treated myself!) and crush the pills then weigh the powder using the Gemini scales recommended here.  Then put the powder into a slip of paper folded in half and pour it into a size zero gelatin capsule. 
 

Here’s the topic on tapering your drug: 

Have you read the success story by Hudgens on tapering Effexor? It’s very encouraging ☺️ She did taper and even so had big trouble with insomnia, it did get better for her, she made a full recovery ☺️

[Faure]

I was just following up some of the speakers on tonight’s panel and found this website called The Withdrawal Project. There is a forum (I haven’t looked at it) where you can connect with others and possibly meet up, tons of information and the option to submit an essay on your own experience for their blog. I don’t expect you’re up to that right now, but you’ve said before you want to do something in the longer term, so maybe something to bookmark. 

[Alan1234]

1 hour ago, Faure said:

Hi, I can’t advise you on any drug related questions. But to answer what I am doing with the mirtazepine, I bought a very nice pill crusher (as I’ll be using it several years I treated myself!) and crush the pills then weigh the powder using the Gemini scales recommended here.  Then put the powder into a slip of paper folded in half and pour it into a size zero gelatin capsule. 
 

Here’s the topic on tapering your drug: 

Have you read the success story by Hudgens on tapering Effexor? It’s very encouraging ☺️ She did taper and even so had big trouble with insomnia, it did get better for her, she made a full recovery ☺️

@Faure hey thank you so much!

that’s an amazing find of @Hudgens it’s such an inspirational and motivational story and exactly what I need to read and keep referring back to, to know it can be done and it hopefully will give me strength.

 

Are you doing the 3day discussion and movie on medication this weekend? If you do please let me know how you find it.
 

I do want to do it but I think In one go it would be too much.

 

it would be good if they recorded it so you can watch it in small chunks.

 

hope you have a great weekend 

[Rosetta]

MODS: Please check this advice:

 

Alan,

 

Have you stopped taking Venlafaxine? With good results?  What symptoms are gone?  Any new ones since stopping?

 

I think would stop almost everything that you started taking in November.  As for the Zopiclone —- That I would taper by about 5 to 10 percent.

 

Taking testosterone (and that other hormone - exemestane) is a mistake I have seen before.  How long have you taken those? Since Oct 19?  Maybe you can stop them without tapering.

 

Have you been taking the buspar generic consistently everyday?  If so, you may be stuck on that and need to taper later.  Same with Vortioxetine?  Consistently every day?  Or did you stop either of those?

 

You should change your drug signature right away.

Tadifil — I would stop.

 

Propranol might be ok to keep if you are getting no bad symptoms from it.

 

Rosetta

[Rosetta]

No more new drugs even if you have taken them before, such as mirtazapine.  Your system is too fragile.  Anything could happen.  It’s not worth the risk.

[Rosetta]

I will keep all my advice out here on your thread.  It will sound curt because I don’t have time to be sweet about it.   I have tried to be kind in PMs.  If my PM rejects a message say so on this thread, and I will clear out space.

 

Many people have been where you are - afraid to reject doctor’s advice.  I think you can now see that they hurt you.  You can slowly climb out of this  if even if you don’t have a supportive doctor who will stop poisoning you.  Accept the prescriptions, be polite, but don’t take anything you are not already dependent on.

[Alan1234]

5 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

MODS: Please check this advice:

 

Alan,

 

Have you stopped taking Venlafaxine? With good results?  What symptoms are gone?  Any new ones since stopping?

 

I think would stop almost everything that you started taking in November.  As for the Zopiclone —- That I would taper by about 5 to 10 percent.

 

Taking testosterone (and that other hormone - exemestane) is a mistake I have seen before.  How long have you taken those? Since Oct 19?  Maybe you can stop them without tapering.

 

Have you been taking the buspar generic consistently everyday?  If so, you may be stuck on that and need to taper later.  Same with Vortioxetine?  Consistently every day?  Or did you stop either of those?

 

You should change your drug signature right away.

Tadifil — I would stop.

 

Propranol might be ok to keep if you are getting no bad symptoms from it.

 

Rosetta

I am currently taking 12.5mg Venlafaxine a day. I have been taking it for 7 days.

 

it’s too early to say about results as the adverse affects from the 3wks of Vortioxetine have only stopped a few days ago. I would say I’m not suicidal on it so that’s a positive but my bladder is generally worse. I took Vortioxetine consistently every day at 5mg but had to reduce down to 2.5mg which helped reduce the severe side affects but I still had them. 
 

ive been on testosterone since May 2020. I must of been in withdrawal then. when i thought when I got diagnosed with the low testosterone was the cause but it must have been withdrawal. I didn’t know what withdrawal was I just tapered Venlafaxine as my GP suggested. I have been told that my testosterone was less than a ladies and it couldn’t have been any lower. They have told me that I must continue to take it for a number of reasons. I take the tadfil and exemestane as I have too much estrogen which was the problem before the testosterone. Endocrinologist has said probable cause Venlafaxine as known to cause high prolactin. 
 

Im no longer taking Buspirone, it made my Akathisia worse after 4days. 
 

im ni longer taking propanol it makes my insomnia worse and also I’m worried about rebound affect 

 

 

 

[Rosetta]

Ok, then you must keep the testosterone or you could suffer from stopping it too quickly.  I would stop the Venlafaxine immediately.  
 

Please list out exactly what you take everyday and the dosage and the time of day here on your thread.  We need to get your signature cleared up.

[Alan1234]

I have had yet another very bad experience of our so called health care system.

 

I have seen the light and I can no longer trust or put my faith in these people to get me better. I am no longer going to listen to these people as they are just injuring me more. I can’t believe how much damage and how I nearly died off the Vortioxetine recently prescribed. When I complained and told them about the symptoms they said it was impossible that the drugs are doing this. The Pysciatrists discharged me abruptly with no medication on a Friday to me GP via a phone call from a nurse saying I was non compliant. My GP isn’t open on a weekend. 
 

My GP reinstated me on Venlafaxine 75mg as he didn’t know what to do. The dose is far to high so all I can tolerate that seems not make me worse is 12.5mg mini tablet XR. 
My GP is very supportive but clearly hasn’t a clue what to do. But I feel he will support me. 

[Rosetta]

Ok, if you can trust us, we can support you through your recovery.  Your body can heal if you stop increasing the dysfunction with new drugs.  There comes a point when certain members are asked to leave because we can’t help them if they keep taking new drugs the doctors prescribe.  If you can stay on only the drugs that you are dependent on and not add anything while you are home, we can support you through this.  This includes old drugs you used to take.
(The exception, of course, is if you go in hospital for an accident or because you are suicidal.)

 

We would like to help everyone, but with the number of people who help being finite, if members are making their nervous systems even more unstable, then we can’t keep going.  At times, it takes a while for a member to accept that their doctors make things worse.  Fortunately, Dr. Healy himself told you that.  I wish he could be everyone’s doctor.

[Rosetta]

It is important that you do not get dependent on Venlafaxine again.  It is very hard to taper off Venlafaxine.  You are still in WD from it, but at least you are not recently dependent on it.  You have enough dependencies as it is.

[Alan1234]

11 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

Ok, then you must keep the testosterone or you could suffer from stopping it too quickly.  I would stop the Venlafaxine immediately.  
 

Please list out exactly what you take everyday and the dosage and the time of day here on your thread.  We need to get your signature cleared up.

I have the severe degeneration in my spine and OA in my Knees, shoulders and elbows. The Othapeadic and 3 separate endocrinologists all appear to agree that at my age the severity of my OA has been probably accelerated by having chronically low hormones for some time. Interestingly I have researched and Venlafaxine is structurally very similar to tramadol. I wonder that I was able to function so long with relatively low pain because of the Venlafaxine masking the pain and symptoms. As soon as I withdrew my pain levels reached a whole new level. 
 

To confirm I should go from taking Venlafaxine 12.5mg today and stop it completely now ?

[Alan1234]

26 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

It is important that you do not get dependent on Venlafaxine again.  It is very hard to taper off Venlafaxine.  You are still in WD from it, but at least you are not recently dependent on it.  You have enough dependencies as it is.

No I don’t want to be dependent on it. 
I’m just mindful that I was severely suicidal up until 5wks ago. As much as the Vortioxetine caused me severe side affects it has numbed or taken away the suicidal thoughts. If I stop Venlafaxine now straight away no taper after 5wks on meds is this right ? I was on 1.75mg of Mirtazapine since March I haven’t been Anti Psychotic drug free since Sep/Oct 2020 when I was suicidal on out on Mirtazapine. I’m not trying to know better I’m just scared 

[Alan1234]

22 hours ago, Faure said:

I was just following up some of the speakers on tonight’s panel and found this website called The Withdrawal Project. There is a forum (I haven’t looked at it) where you can connect with others and possibly meet up, tons of information and the option to submit an essay on your own experience for their blog. I don’t expect you’re up to that right now, but you’ve said before you want to do something in the longer term, so maybe something to bookmark. 

Thank you again @Faure

When I’m feeling abit better I will look into it. I’ve realised this last few months that being online a lot stresses me and seems to feed my derealisation/personalisation symptoms, it makes me feeleven more powerless. I’m going to have to find a balance to use it to get the help and support I need but limit my use 

[Alan1234]

2 hours ago, Rosetta said:

MODS: Please check this advice:

 

Alan,

 

Have you stopped taking Venlafaxine? With good results?  What symptoms are gone?  Any new ones since stopping?

 

I think would stop almost everything that you started taking in November.  As for the Zopiclone —- That I would taper by about 5 to 10 percent.

 

Taking testosterone (and that other hormone - exemestane) is a mistake I have seen before.  How long have you taken those? Since Oct 19?  Maybe you can stop them without tapering.

 

Have you been taking the buspar generic consistently everyday?  If so, you may be stuck on that and need to taper later.  Same with Vortioxetine?  Consistently every day?  Or did you stop either of those?

 

You should change your drug signature right away.

Tadifil — I would stop.

 

Propranol might be ok to keep if you are getting no bad symptoms from it.

 

Rosetta

Just to clarify What Tadafil has been prescribed for. It was prescribed surly to aid my prostate/bladder problems and help reduce my estrogen levels balance my hormone profile. I am on microdoses of hormones. I have had 3 separate opinions on this and gone with the least amount possible to get normal levels.

 

Tadafil certainly was not prescribed for ED. Libido and sexual activity just isn’t something I’ve even felt well enough or desired for the last 20mths 

[Alan1234]

21 hours ago, Alan1234 said:

@Faure hey thank you so much!

that’s an amazing find of @Hudgens it’s such an inspirational and motivational story and exactly what I need to read and keep referring back to, to know it can be done and it hopefully will give me strength.

 

Are you doing the 3day discussion and movie on medication this weekend? If you do please let me know how you find it.
 

I do want to do it but I think In one go it would be too much.

 

it would be good if they recorded it so you can watch it in small chunks.

 

hope you have a great weekend 

 

1 hour ago, Alan1234 said:

No I don’t want to be dependent on it. 
I’m just mindful that I was severely suicidal up until 5wks ago. As much as the Vortioxetine caused me severe side affects it has numbed or taken away the suicidal thoughts. If I stop Venlafaxine now straight away no taper after 5wks on meds is this right ? I was on 1.75mg of Mirtazapine since March I haven’t been Anti Psychotic drug free since Sep/Oct 2020 when I was suicidal on out on Mirtazapine. I’m not trying to know better I’m just scared 

Should I consider a much lower dose than 12.5mg Venlafaxine as opposed to stopping it altogether from this dose? I’ve looked at SERT occupancy studies and approx 7mg of Venlafaxine occupies about 50/60 of the brain that is equivalent to 5mg of Vortioxetine. 5mg of Vortioxetine caused me massive side affects so maybe i should try 3.75mg of Venlafaxine instead of stopping altogether then wait a month and review ?

[Alan1234]

21 hours ago, Alan1234 said:

@Faure hey thank you so much!

that’s an amazing find of @Hudgens it’s such an inspirational and motivational story and exactly what I need to read and keep referring back to, to know it can be done and it hopefully will give me strength.

 

Are you doing the 3day discussion and movie on medication this weekend? If you do please let me know how you find it.
 

I do want to do it but I think In one go it would be too much.

 

it would be good if they recorded it so you can watch it in small chunks.

 

hope you have a great weekend 

@faure @Rosetta is it the Gemini 20 scale you have ? A pill crusher sounds good where did you get this from ?

 

I think I need to order both. It has been advised to only taper Zopliclone by 5/10% 

 

with the powders (Zopliclone), (Venlafaxine?) can you just ingest them with food or in a liquid?

 

I have no income you see and my benefits are very low. Money is very tight it would make life a lot simpler if I did not need to purchase gelatine capsules, capsule stands etc. I see the scales are quite expensive obviously they are a necessity.  

[Alan1234]

3 hours ago, Rosetta said:

It is important that you do not get dependent on Venlafaxine again.  It is very hard to taper off Venlafaxine.  You are still in WD from it, but at least you are not recently dependent on it.  You have enough dependencies as it is.

@Rosetta apologies again my thoughts and observations are coming in waves so I’m hoping they make sense as they come to me. This is why I’m scared and struggling to make informed decisions.

 

im scared about completely stopping Venlafaxine even though it’s only been a week at 12.5mg and 3weeks Vortioxetine at 5mg.

 

I think your right about needed to stop it or drastically reduce it.  It has made my resting heart rate elevate by 15/20bpm and sore again by 20/25 beats whilst walking this is without feeling anxious other than feeling aware of my heart rate and more breathless than normal. It’s hard to know this is entirely down to the Venlafaxine with my present state but I suspect it probably is. 
 

I don’t want to start reintroducing drugs to confuse the picture by adding in propanol when I haven’t used for a week. 
 

it’s hard to know with all my symptoms what is causing what but this has definitely got worse. However perhaps it’s some sort of long Covid in reaction to the Covid jab back at the end of May as I never had cardiac signs before or it’s a manifestation of chronic anxiety strain. 
 

im not sure if I should be asking to go to a Cardiologist again. I had a clear resting Ecg at my doctors 2 wks ago. They don’t realise my resting Heartrate used to be in the 40s until late May when this symptom started.

 

I know you can’t advise on this as your not a Doctor. I just need someone to sound it off to. If I tell my GP they just say they don’t know and offer more drugs. I know myself I don’t feel right but the Cardiologist cleared me in June  and I’ve tried to patient 

[Rosetta]

From your signature it looks like you have been taking venlafaxine since Nov 12.  If it has been 5 weeks, then you could be dependent.  That’s a shame.  Are there little beads inside the capsules or is it a powder?  In any event, tapering right now is NOT a good idea.  You need to stabilize first, and that could take months or even a year.  How are you getting 12.5 mg?

Does any MOD think that tapering the Zopiclone right now makes sense or is it a bad idea?  Alan, does it help you sleep?  You have been taking it since Oct 12, correct?  Or has it been 4 weeks for that, too?

 

At some point, perhaps after stabilization depending on the Mid’s response, I would taper the zopiclone slowly, just to be safe.  The SA topic on that drug indicates that a slow taper is not always necessary.  Maybe that’s because it has a very short half life.  I think it’s a case by case issue, and you would need to see how it affects you when you don’t use it. 
 

That’s good that your ecg was all right.  You are going to have some signs of fight or flight, including an elevated heart rate.  Those are a part of having your nervous system destabilized.  I know that will be scary given the odd heart issues you have had.  Many, many people in withdrawal have a high resting heart rate and the physical feelings of panic in their hearts.  It’s a side effect of having these drugs change our brains and nervous systems.  When to have those symptoms checked out is a question you will ask yourself as you go through this process.    As long as you avoid new drugs, you could have ecgs whenever you feel the need as they are non-invasive, but your doctor may get frustrated.

 

Well, what is done is done.  You need to go forward from here in a do no harm manner.  Stop making unnecessary changes, and you will, eventually, stabilize.

 

Rosetta

[Rosetta]

I’m very sorry that psychiatrists have treated you this way, both by prescribing all the drugs and by abandoning you after they made your condition worse.  How outrageous.  Everyone wonders why people hurt themselves.  This is why!  I hope there is a special place in Hell for them.  I’m glad that you felt that you could come here and get support this weekend.  

[Alan1234]

25 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

From your signature it looks like you have been taking venlafaxine since Nov 12.  If it has been 5 weeks, then you could be dependent.  That’s a shame.  Are there little beads inside the capsules or is it a powder?  In any event, tapering right now is NOT a good idea.  You need to stabilize first, and that could take months or even a year.  How are you getting 12.5 mg?

Does any MOD think that tapering the Zopiclone right now makes sense or is it a bad idea?  Alan, does it help you sleep?  You have been taking it since Oct 12, correct?  Or has it been 4 weeks for that, too?

 

At some point, perhaps after stabilization depending on the Mid’s response, I would taper the zopiclone slowly, just to be safe.  The SA topic on that drug indicates that a slow taper is not always necessary.  Maybe that’s because it has a very short half life.  I think it’s a case by case issue, and you would need to see how it affects you when you don’t use it. 
 

That’s good that your ecg was all right.  You are going to have some signs of fight or flight, including an elevated heart rate.  Those are a part of having your nervous system destabilized.  I know that will be scary given the odd heart issues you have had.  Many, many people in withdrawal have a high resting heart rate and the physical feelings of panic in their hearts.  It’s a side effect of having these drugs change our brains and nervous systems.  When to have those symptoms checked out is a question you will ask yourself as you go through this process.    As long as you avoid new drugs, you could have ecgs whenever you feel the need as they are non-invasive, but your doctor may get frustrated.

 

Well, what is done is done.  You need to go forward from here in a do no harm manner.  Stop making unnecessary changes, and you will, eventually, stabilize.

 

Rosetta

Just to clarify. I was taking Vortioxetine for 3.5wks as directed by Psychiatrist. Then I have been taking Venlafaxine for 1wk since then. So nearly 5wks for both drugs.

 

The Venlafaxine is 75mg XR capsules.

Inside there are 6mini tablets so each one must equal 12.5mg 

 

 

Zopliclone- I did start this on Oct 12 this was about a week before I started Vortioxetine. None of the MODS have advised on if I should taper this. It is helping me get 2/3hrs more sleep on the nights it works and it is deep sleep. I was going to try a 25% taper every 2wks whilst I haven’t been on it long.  
 

in terms of the Cardiac I think I have developed some sort of POTS syndrome on top of the withdrawal whether this was caused by the withdrawal or Covid injection it could be a coincidence. I think you said it could be POTS at the time. I think you could have been right. Your right the Ecg etc is reassuring.

 

i also think your right about I need to stop Tadafil. 
 

So I plan fo taper Zopliclone. Stop Tadafil and stabilise/stop Venlafaxine. I need MODS advice on this.

[Faure]

On 11/19/2021 at 3:23 PM, Faure said:

Hi, I can’t advise you on any drug related questions. But to answer what I am doing with the mirtazepine, I bought a very nice pill crusher (as I’ll be using it several years I treated myself!) and crush the pills then weigh the powder using the Gemini scales recommended here.  Then put the powder into a slip of paper folded in half and pour it into a size zero gelatin capsule. 

Hi again, I’ve linked to the pill crusher in my previous post. The scales are ‘digital jewellery scale GEM20’. I can’t advise about not using capsules, this is the way I was told to do it. 

 

I’m afraid I can’t offer help or advice re what to do with your current meds as I don’t now anywhere near enough. I just know that everything I read here says to keep things stable and not chop and change. I know this is *way* easier said than done.  You just want a pill that will make things better but there isn’t one 😔 your central nervous system has been badly injured and needs time and stability to start recovering. Really sadly the only thing that will help is a lot of time. I’m so sorry this has happened to you. 
 

Agree re not spending too much time online. The last few weekends I have left my devices in my bedroom for most of the day and I find I enjoy myself a lot more without them! 

[Alan1234]

50 minutes ago, Faure said:

Hi again, I’ve linked to the pill crusher in my previous post. The scales are ‘digital jewellery scale GEM20’. I can’t advise about not using capsules, this is the way I was told to do it. 

 

I’m afraid I can’t offer help or advice re what to do with your current meds as I don’t now anywhere near enough. I just know that everything I read here says to keep things stable and not chop and change. I know this is *way* easier said than done.  You just want a pill that will make things better but there isn’t one 😔 your central nervous system has been badly injured and needs time and stability to start recovering. Really sadly the only thing that will help is a lot of time. I’m so sorry this has happened to you. 
 

Agree re not spending too much time online. The last few weekends I have left my devices in my bedroom for most of the day and I find I enjoy myself a lot more without them! 

Hey thanks 

It’s hard for me as I’m going round in circles online looking for answers as I can’t seem to tolerate much at all. Struggle to even read or watch TV for more than a handful of mins at a time. 
I do know this is a vicious circle though and a trigger.

 

have a great rest for your weekend 

[Rosetta]

Ok, you should not be dependent on Venlafaxine.  That is a relief.  If you keep taking it another 2-3 weeks you could become dependent.  
 

As for vortiotexitine you only took it 3.5 and you stopped about a week ago.  I would not go back to it.

 

I would not taper Zopiclone right now IF you are dependent.  Do you take it every night —  have you been taking it every night for the past 2 weeks?  Or are you just taking it whenever you can’t sleep?  If you are missing pills a lot, you may not be dependent, but if you do not take it consistently, that is damaging to you system.  It’s a Catch 22, you see.

 

I’m not a good person to ask about saving post or messages.  I don’t know how to do that.  Sorry

[Alan1234]

8 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

Ok, you should not be dependent on Venlafaxine.  That is a relief.  If you keep taking it another 2-3 weeks you could become dependent.  
 

As for vortiotexitine you only took it 3.5 and you stopped about a week ago.  I would not go back to it.

 

I would not taper Zopiclone right now IF you are dependent.  Do you take it every night —  have you been taking it every night for the past 2 weeks?  Or are you just taking it whenever you can’t sleep?  If you are missing pills a lot, you may not be dependent, but if you do not take it consistently, that is damaging to you system.  It’s a Catch 22, you see.

 

I’m not a good person to ask about saving post or messages.  I don’t know how to do that.  Sorry

So do I need to tag a moderator to ask about Venlafaxine if I can stop it abruptly or half the dose abruptly? 

 I suspected that it would be unwise to  stop abruptly as Vortioxetine (started 21st Oct) & Venlafaxine (13th Nov) accumulatively have been taken for 4wks 2 days (I’ve just checked my diary. Both must have acted on the same serotonin receptors? Forgive me I’m not saying I know best (because obviously I don’t!) I just now know how crucial this decision is. I’m just scared of being suicidal again like 4+ wks ago.  
 

yes I’ve taken Zopliclone every night for 5/6wks. I’ve read it has a very short half life if that makes a difference to the decision? I was only getting sleep without in for 4/5hrs broken light sleep once every 4/5days before taking it that’s why I broke and went on it. Since being on it I’ve been getting 5/7 hrs broken sleep 4/5 nights if the week. Some nights it doesn’t work. I was told if my Doctor it’s half life is 2hrs so it helps to get you to sleep but doesn’t keep you asleep like diazepam. 
 

Ive come back to SA as I’ve seen the light and can’t continue like I am. As you know I’m not able to make these decisions on my own. Over the next few days 

 

thank you for helping me 

[Alan1234]

I’ve updated my signature to make it more clear to moderators 

[Rosetta]

4 hours ago, Alan1234 said:

So do I need to tag a moderator to ask about Venlafaxine if I can stop it abruptly or half the dose abruptly? 

 I suspected that it would be unwise to  stop abruptly as Vortioxetine (started 21st Oct) & Venlafaxine (13th Nov) accumulatively have been taken for 4wks 2 days

That’s a good point.  I don’t know enough about the receptor issue.  One is an SSRI (vortiotexitine) and one is an SNRI (Venlafaxine).  I hope a MOD will come by soon.  I can understand that if the SI is gone you do not want it to come back.

 

Vortiotexitine is an SSRI.  It is an agonist of 5-HT 1A and a partial agonist of 5-HT 1B.  It is an ANTagonist of other 5-HT receptors, and a serotonin reuptake inhibitor.

Venlafaxine is also an agonist of 5-HT 1A and a partial agonist of 5-HT 1B, but it is also a norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor.  It’s that norepinephrine issue that is a big difference between the two.  It also causes heart issues.  I would not want to be stuck on Venlafaxine.  

[Alan1234]

6 hours ago, Rosetta said:

That’s a good point.  I don’t know enough about the receptor issue.  One is an SSRI (vortiotexitine) and one is an SNRI (Venlafaxine).  I hope a MOD will come by soon.  I can understand that if the SI is gone you do not want it to come back.

 

Vortiotexitine is an SSRI.  It is an agonist of 5-HT 1A and a partial agonist of 5-HT 1B.  It is an ANTagonist of other 5-HT receptors, and a serotonin reuptake inhibitor.

Venlafaxine is also an agonist of 5-HT 1A and a partial agonist of 5-HT 1B, but it is also a norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor.  It’s that norepinephrine issue that is a big difference between the two.  It also causes heart issues.  I would not want to be stuck on Venlafaxine.  

Yes I hope a MOD will come by soon.

 

i really think the heart stuff is a hypradrenalgenic POTS I have all the signs with my heart rate, urination, insomnia, exercise intolerance, restless legs 

[Rosetta]

Yes, I had POTS in that my blood pressure was not steady.  I would black out when I stood up, and I had exercise intolerance, too.

 

If you don’t get any advice from a Mod today, please go to your doctor right away and talk about the Venlafaxine vs Vortiotexitine issue.  I don’t think it’s good that you get hooked on Venlafaxine.  Call on Monday to make appointment, ok?  You might need the appointment even if a Mod writes on your thread.  
 

Do you have any Vortiotexitine left?  Did the SI go away before you started the Venlafaxine?  
 

Maybe you are hooked on Vortiotexitine by now and need to stabilize on that? I don’t know enough to advise you on this, but I have a bad feeling.  None of these drugs has had enough research about longer term effects.  I would not want to make another change right now, but on the other hand, Venlafaxine has such a terrible reputation, and I feel very uncomfortable with the fact that it affects nortriptyline.  Vortiotexitine, I don’t believe, does that.

[Alan1234]

26 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

Yes, I had POTS in that my blood pressure was not steady.  I would black out when I stood up, and I had exercise intolerance, too.

 

If you don’t get any advice from a Mod today, please go to your doctor right away and talk about the Venlafaxine vs Vortiotexitine issue.  I don’t think it’s good that you get hooked on Venlafaxine.  Call on Monday to make appointment, ok?  You might need the appointment even if a Mod writes on your thread.  
 

Do you have any Vortiotexitine left?  Did the SI go away before you started the Venlafaxine?  
 

Maybe you are hooked on Vortiotexitine by now and need to stabilize on that? I don’t know enough to advise you on this, but I have a bad feeling.  None of these drugs has had enough research about longer term effects.  I would not want to make another change right now, but on the other hand, Venlafaxine has such a terrible reputation, and I feel very uncomfortable with the fact that it affects nortriptyline.  Vortiotexitine, I don’t believe, does that.

Hi Rosetta 

I can only telephone my Doctor as they won’t see you face to face in the UK because of Covid. I’ve already discussed last week and he literally does have a clue about the drugs outside of what the manufacturers recommended doses. He was the doctor that said I could withdrawal Venlafaxine over 4wks. He is a nice doctor but doesn’t have a clue. 
 

Going back on Vortioxetine isn’t an option as the heart rate, palpitations, panic and dysautomia was too severe. It had to be managed in the ER with propanol and a one off dose of diazepam. Since coming off I haven’t had the panic attacks although I have the rest of the symptoms they are not as severe, they have improved by around 15%. I don’t have any Vortioxetine left. Yes the SI went away before Venlafaxine. Since taking Venlafaxine my bladder symptoms are through the roof (30/34x a day). This has to be affecting my Blood pressure and heart rate. 
 

I have a feeling the MODS no longer will answer me or want anything to do with me. It looks like I’m on my own which is very frightening. No one understands in my family, no doctors this far. It makes you feel like your going insane. Not being able tolerate even light exercise isn’t helping my mental state.

 

it looks like I’m going to have to make my own decision on this. I think I need to come off the Venlafaxine. I’ll half my dose over a week then half again the week after and assess my mood. I can’t risk going on another drug but I am scared.