Tips to help sleep: so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

[yoshi4844]

 

16 hours ago, Rhernan said:

Hi all, been off Mirtazepine after a long slow taper since July 2022 (so 7 months) and instead of my symptoms improving they are becoming worse and worse, my sleep being the most dramatically affected.  I am unable to get more than 1 hr sleep a night and it’s been 2 weeks.  I’m unable to nap as my body won’t allow it.

 

This is what is happening to me, I start to fall asleep but have a rush if adrenaline of cortisol that comes into my head and wakes me up followed by nausea, tingling through my body, dizziness, heart palps and a severe increase in anxiety. I also suffer from jerks and random twitches as well. It takes about 1/2 hr to resolve and then happens over and over again.

 

I got into AD's because of similar symptoms. When I was beginning to fall asleep, my body would have panic attack like symptoms (strong heart palp, nausea, sweating, shaking, adrenaline rush, and dizziness) but my mind was just getting cozy. This caused me to have actual panic attacks because I was just confused that it started out of nowhere. Eventually they went away but they recently came back a few weeks ago (similar symptoms and yet different)

 

I have a system now kind of.

 

First I get into bed laying on my back. Next if I do not fall asleep or start having funny stuff happen, I sit up until my body calms down. If sitting up doesn't work, I go sit somewhere else until my body calms down. I try again and lay down. Then I just repeat the process until I eventually fall asleep (trying different positions, relaxing, and having my eyes closed the whole time.) 

 

Last night I tried to force my body as best I could to calm down and it kinda helped??

 

It is very important to train oneself to have a zen-like mindset because for some reason getting anxious or any emotion makes it all worse (it is hard but it is important). I hope this helps.

 

Honestly, it probably just goes away on its own as well with time so I guess we just got to survive it.

 

 

 

 

[FeralCatman]

I swapped out all of the light bulbs in my house before bulbs that don't admit blue height so when I have the lights on at night it's not disrupting my rhythm as badly. They are expensive but you don't have to do what I did and replace every bulb in the house. You can do it selectively. Not sure if it's helping or not what it is something that you could try to help things along.

 

Healthe Goodnight Sleep Enhancing A19 LED Bulb

 

https://a.co/d/dv5fL0i

 

I also bought some night lights that don't admit blue light that automatically shut off during the day so I can find my way around at night without turning the lights on if I need to.

 

LOHAS Amber Night Light, Dimmable Plug in LED, Yellow Night Light with Dusk to Dawn Sensor, Kids Night Lights for Bedroom, 5-80LM Sleep Aid No Blue Light for Nursery, Hallway, Kitchen, Stairway, 2Pack

 

https://a.co/d/fEpHicv

 

[Catina7]

Reading FeralCatman's post made me think of something very important: 

 

Make sure that you are using blue light filters on all your devices.  Blue light suppresses melatonin and can disrupt your normal Circadian rhythms.   You can also buy glasses that block out the blue light.  Some devices have a built-in setting where you can just turn it on.  Otherwise, you'll want to use an outside app or program.  On my computer I use f.lux, which I really love.  I have it turned on all the time.  

 

https://justgetflux.com/

 

 

[FeralCatman]

3 hours ago, Catina7 said:

Reading FeralCatman's post made me think of something very important: 

 

Make sure that you are using blue light filters on all your devices.  Blue light suppresses melatonin and can disrupt your normal Circadian rhythms.   You can also buy glasses that block out the blue light.  Some devices have a built-in setting where you can just turn it on.  Otherwise, you'll want to use an outside app or program.  On my computer I use f.lux, which I really love.  I have it turned on all the time.  

 

https://justgetflux.com/

 

 

Here is a review of blue light blocking glasses.

 

https://www.verywellhealth.com/best-blue-light-blocking-glasses-4579815

 

[FeralCatman]

6 hours ago, FeralCatman said:

I swapped out all of the light bulbs in my house before bulbs that don't admit blue height so when I have the lights on at night it's not disrupting my rhythm as badly. They are expensive but you don't have to do what I did and replace every bulb in the house. You can do it selectively. Not sure if it's helping or not what it is something that you could try to help things along.

 

Healthe Goodnight Sleep Enhancing A19 LED Bulb

 

https://a.co/d/dv5fL0i

 

I also bought some night lights that don't admit blue light that automatically shut off during the day so I can find my way around at night without turning the lights on if I need to.

 

LOHAS Amber Night Light, Dimmable Plug in LED, Yellow Night Light with Dusk to Dawn Sensor, Kids Night Lights for Bedroom, 5-80LM Sleep Aid No Blue Light for Nursery, Hallway, Kitchen, Stairway, 2Pack

 

https://a.co/d/fEpHicv

 

I should add that I am not a sales person for these particular products and there are similar products out there that may meed your needs so be sure to shop around and look at reviews.

[fightingbrit]

Hello; I'm currently tapering off Sertraline, using liquid, on 8mg after dropping from 9mg recently. 

 

The past week, I've noticed that while I have no problems falling asleep, I wake around 4 hours into the night to use the loo and then after that I wake very frequently, at least every hour or so. I have tried cutting off my liquid consumption earlier to stop that first disruption but it hasn't made a difference. 

 

I also have pretty good sleep hygiene, same time to sleep and wake and no devices in bed. I wear ear plugs and our bedroom is really dark. I got my husband to listen to my breathing while sleeping to see if there were any signs on apnea, but none. 

 

Wondering if this is common with sertraline tapering/withdrawal or if it's something I should raise with my doctor again? When I spoke to my GP recently they just gave me the talk about devices in bed... good sleep hygiene... no fluids before bed etc.  I'm in otherwise good health, since working with a coach my diet and exercise levels good (before this I used to take ages to fall asleep whereas this isn't the case anymore). 

 

It's starting to impact my working day as by mid-afternoon I'm really tired and struggling to focus. Any insight or reassurance that this is normal would be useful - thank you! 

[KenA]

Hi @fightingbrit, the waking in the middle of the night and having a hard time falling back asleep is sadly pretty normal for WD. 

 

Here is a great topic for more information and tips to help with sleep!

 

 

I too had sleep problems going through WD, but all of them faded away and I am back to a completely normal sleep pattern now. You will heal as well!

 

Ken

 

[fightingbrit]

Thank you, right now I’m just frightened wondering how I’m going to keep my job when I’m too tired to function. 
 

I didn’t sleep at all last night and have had to take the day off work. I can’t live like this.

[FeralCatman]

Just read this article about eating before bedtime and it's actually bad for sleep for a number of reasons so I thought I would post it and hopefully people will find it helpful. I will be moving my supper time up by 1 hour to give myself plenty of time before bed and see if it helps with sleep.

 

https://sleeperholic.com/sleeping-when-full-reasons-why-you-should-avoid-it/

 

[Mittenraised]

11 hours ago, FeralCatman said:

Just read this article about eating before bedtime and it's actually bad for sleep for a number of reasons so I thought I would post it and hopefully people will find it helpful. I will be moving my supper time up by 1 hour to give myself plenty of time before bed and see if it helps with sleep.

 

https://sleeperholic.com/sleeping-when-full-reasons-why-you-should-avoid-it/

 

Great info. I have a habit of eating too late.

[Chompoo]

Improve your gut health for better sleep - take prebiotics, probiotics and antimicrobials.

New Study Shows What’s in Your Gut Influences How and When You Sleep
https://www.sleepfoundation.org/sleep-news/gut-microbiome-affects-sleep

Gut microbiome diversity is associated with sleep physiology in humans
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6779243/

 

[Chompoo]

Butyrate, a metabolite of intestinal bacteria, enhances sleep

Abstract

Emerging evidence suggests that the intestinal microbiota is a source of sleep-promoting signals. Bacterial metabolites and components of the bacterial cell wall are likely to provide important links between the intestinal commensal flora and sleep-generating mechanisms in the brain. Butyrate is a short-chain fatty acid produced by the intestinal bacteria by the fermentation of nondigestible polysaccharides. We tested the hypothesis that butyrate may serve as a bacterial-derived sleep-promoting signal. Oral gavage administration of tributyrin, a butyrate pro-drug, elicited an almost 50% increase in non-rapid-eye movement sleep (NREMS) in mice for 4 hours after the treatment. Similarly, intraportal injection of butyrate led to prompt and robust increases in NREMS in rats. In the first 6 hours after the butyrate injection, NREMS increased by 70%. Both the oral and intraportal administration of butyrate led to a significant drop in body temperature. Systemic subcutaneous or intraperitoneal injection of butyrate did not have any significant effect on sleep or body temperature. The results suggest that the sleep-inducing effects of butyrate are mediated by a sensory mechanism located in the liver and/or in the portal vein wall. Hepatoportal butyrate-sensitive mechanisms may play a role in sleep modulation by the intestinal microbiota.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31065013/