The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

[LostInCanada]

5 minutes ago, itsalyssadood said:

how hard do you push yourself?

@itsalyssadood I don't push during a wave. I liken it to running a marathon with a broken leg. You just wouldn't do it. A wave means the body is working hard to realign therefore I think it is counterproductive to put more strain on it. 

[itsalyssadood]

4 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@itsalyssadood I don't push during a wave. I liken it to running a marathon with a broken leg. You just wouldn't do it. A wave means the body is working hard to realign therefore I think it is counterproductive to put more strain on it. 

Thats a wonderful analogy!
This is definitely what I needed to hear.

It’s almost as if I need to treat myself gently to protect my CNS. I’m assuming once my WDnormal starts to return back to baseline and I’m able to function, I will be able to do more things? Still not pushing myself though 😊

[LostInCanada]

16 minutes ago, itsalyssadood said:

I’m assuming once my WDnormal starts to return back to baseline and I’m able to function, I will be able to do more things?

I am sure you will. Your body will let you know. At all times now I try not to over activate myself. It really is important to be accepting of our limitations and treat ourselves kindly. ♥️

[itsalyssadood]

1 hour ago, LostInCanada said:

I am sure you will. Your body will let you know. At all times now I try not to over activate myself. It really is important to be accepting of our limitations and treat ourselves kindly. ♥️

Thank you @LostInCanada ♥️ I appreciate you and your insight. You are 100% right! 

[Ariel]

7 hours ago, itsalyssadood said:

I like to call those “muted” windows; symptoms are there but not super loud  

 

That's a good one @itsalyssadood I like "muted" windows

Thanks for sharing!

[Ariel]

7 hours ago, itsalyssadood said:

Question for anyone here. During waves, how hard do you push yourself? For example, getting out of the house for some exposure therapy, shopping, driving, etc. 

 

Absolutely agree with @Dee12h and @LostInCanada and Dee's WD counselor!

 

I don't push myself in waves. Better to err on the side of doing less. 

 

We have some ideas in our culture that are inherently violent, among them the idea that we need to push ourselves past pain to accomplish anything. Think military boot-camp, a sergeant yelling at cadets, etc. It's abusive. Many of us have been groomed throughout childhood to ignore our body's innate wisdom around limits, discomfort, alarm. Many of us learn through socialization (family/parents, school, organized religion, sports, cultural messaging around beauty ideals, etc.) to not only deny but also overrule very real red flags that our body is trying to give us. We're told it's for our own good, don't be a baby, don't be a wimp, push through it, pressure makes diamonds, etc. etc. There's no end to the slogans. It's no wonder then that when we find ourselves in the psychiatrist's office, we are already pre-groomed to believe the message that there's something wrong with us for a) whatever it is we're feeling; and b) not being able to "function" in the way society expects of us; we're pathologized, diagnosed, and drugged with chemicals that are designed to remove ourselves even further from our own wisdom, intuition, and natural signposts. And thus via psychiatry and psychopharmacology we perpetuate the cycle of abuse by not listening to ourselves, violating our integrity, not protecting and caring for ourselves, chemically cutting connection(s). 

 

While it's true that there are certain principles of growth revolving around expanding one's boundaries, it's different in WD. That's because in WD we're dealing with a complex injury. So for example, to use the analogy of muscle growth. In order to build muscle we first lift heavy weights to overload the muscles and induce microscopic tears; followed by ample rest and a nutritional surplus to provide the body with energy and time to recover. It is in the healing of the self-imposed stress on the muscle fibers that muscle is built. 

 

Now, keep in mind that, in the above analogy, we're talking about a healthy body and also the appropriate ratio of training : rest : sustenance. If the load is too high, you will get injured. If you don't eat enough or rest enough you will not grow muscle, you will suffer from fatigue and set yourself up for increased risk of injury. And if you ever try to ignore and push through an injury, you risk not only making the injury worse but possible incurring longer-lasting damage. What is needed is acceptance of the injury, along with patience (recovery will take as long as it takes) and adequate support (for the injury and also for our being/mind/spirit in the process). As the injury heals, we can gradually, carefully begin to rehabilitate and work our way back to training capacity. 

 

WD is caused by iatrogenic harm. We are injured. Waves are evidence of the body responding to its injury, working hard to heal itself. Thus, the wave is in and of itself rehabilitative. The wave is, arguably, the body in an active push, repairing itself. Anything we do to push on top of that is not only superfluous, it's contraindicated as it interferes with the body's job (imagine a very annoying micromanaging boss who is clueless and nevertheless insists on getting in the way and nitpicking and undermining the efforts and expertise of the team -- that's the monkey mind!). There's simply no reason to insist on getting out of one's comfort zone when one is already well out of one's comfort zone. That's just a bunch of self-sabotaging gaslighting (i.e. a pattern of abuse we've been socialized to internalize and inflict upon ourselves). 

 

As we heal and symptom intensity becomes more manageable, and as we have more muted windows ;-) we experience a shift where, if we're listening, we know that we are gradually capable of doing certain things we couldn't before. It's ever evolving and, as with everything in WD,  unpredictable in its fluctuations; however, part of healing is strengthening our connection to ourselves, strengthening connecting to our bodies, and getting better and better at listening to the body's signals, heeding them and taking gentle, tender loving care of ourselves. It's a process and one that restores more than just physiological integrity, it also builds psychospiritual resilience and wholeness. 

 

7 hours ago, itsalyssadood said:

I feel like during certain stages of WD (acute or bad waves), focusing on guarding your CNS from further dysregulation/overstimulation seems to be a stable thing do to- that way the CNS doesn’t overload and get stuck longer where it is. Would you consider this to be true?

 

Yes @itsalyssadood 100% true. Your instincts are right on! Which is such a great sign of healing. 

You're doing a great job listening to yourself and caring for yourself. Give yourself so much credit!

 

Healing is happening all the time, wave or no wave, whether or not we consciously perceive it.

It's all about creating favorable conditions, and then getting out of our own way. <3

 

[jon1]

7 hours ago, itsalyssadood said:

Question for anyone here. During waves, how hard do you push yourself? For example, getting out of the house for some exposure therapy, shopping, driving, etc. 

 

I ask because I feel like during certain stages of WD (acute or bad waves), focusing on guarding your CNS from further dysregulation/overstimulation seems to be a stable thing do to- that way the CNS doesn’t overload and get stuck longer where it is. Would you consider this to be true? Or should you be pushing yourself for those exposures and outings because that may actually help you and your CNS recover faster? 
 

I hope this question made sense 🥺

 

 

I agree that you shouldn’t push yourself at all.

 

Exposure therapy, etc, works well for treating ‘normal’ non-withdrawal conditions like anxiety. But as withdrawal is a physical symptom (even the mental side effects are in essence caused by physical brain damage needing to heal), normal rules don’t apply.

[missy27]

So from what I understand, windows will eventually get bigger and waves will get less. I'm assuming you will know when you can start rehabilitating safely? I've been SSRI free since late October and I know not to put a timeline on this journey because everyone is different. Just wondering when others noticed a improvement in waves? 

[Ariel]

4 minutes ago, missy27 said:

I'm assuming you will know when you can start rehabilitating safely?

 

What do you mean by "rehabilitating safely"? @missy27

[Ariel]

@missy27

 

 

[missy27]

6 minutes ago, Ariel said:

 

What do you mean by "rehabilitating safely"? @missy27

When you can start doing some of the things you did before withdraw like exercising. I'm assuming you start small and see how much you cam handle? 

[missy27]

1 hour ago, Ariel said:

@missy27

 

 

Thank you for this.

[Ariel]

1 hour ago, missy27 said:

When you can start doing some of the things you did before withdraw like exercising. I'm assuming you start small and see how much you cam handle? 

 

Yes exactly. Work your way up very gradually, giving yourself plenty of time in between "challenges" to check how your system reacts and also allow for rest. If you scroll up through the last few pages of this thread you'll find a number of very recent posts between members about how not to push through waves. Same goes for exercise. 

 

Here's something I wrote to another member the other day: 

 

At first exercise was very challenging because of the discomfort and intensity of sensation. I had to go gradually, also because I'd become deconditioned after an extended period of inactivity during acute WD, as well as the symptom of exercise intolerance. In the beginning I could only manage very short walks (approx. 2000 steps total) and about 10-15 minutes of gentle Pilates or yoga at a time, followed by many days of rest. Over time I built up to being able to walk a little every day and doing gentle Pilates/yoga 2-3 times a week. As time went on, my walks got longer, exercise sessions got longer. The first year I focused on frequency and regularity. My goal was to be able to move a little every day, without having to take whole days off. I got stronger over the course of a year, and this year (second year of my self-programmed physical fitness rehab) I've been working on gradually increasing intensity and doing weight training. I find that lifting weights is the most effective "treatment" for my muscle and joint aches and pains. For a while I was lifting about 2-3 days a week, and experiencing significant relief, all without drugs. I recently overdid it and crashed, so now I've been taking a break from weight-lifting to give nervous system a rest.

 

Only you know what works for you, and, as with other aspects of WD, that may be a process of discovery based on trial and error.

Go gently <3

[itsalyssadood]

20 hours ago, jon1 said:

I agree that you shouldn’t push yourself at all.

 

Exposure therapy, etc, works well for treating ‘normal’ non-withdrawal conditions like anxiety. But as withdrawal is a physical symptom (even the mental side effects are in essence caused by physical brain damage needing to heal), normal rules don’t apply.

I agree 100 percent.  Yesterday I gave myself grace, and you know what happened? I had a window in the evening! Same with today, and another window came. I think all the stress of pushing myself really was making my WD worse! You’re so right- normal rules don’t apply. 

[itsalyssadood]

20 hours ago, Ariel said:

Many of us have been groomed throughout childhood to ignore our body's innate wisdom around limits, discomfort, alarm. Many of us learn through socialization (family/parents, school, organized religion, sports, cultural messaging around beauty ideals, etc.) to not only deny but also overrule very real red flags that our body is trying to give us. We're told it's for our own good, don't be a baby, don't be a wimp, push through it, pressure makes diamonds, etc. etc.

 

100 percent, this was me. I grew up being treated this way to an extent and it’s really burned into my brain. As an adult I am learning more and more how wrong it is. There is nothing wrong with caring for yourself in times you need it- giving yourself that extra space and healing. This whole experience has definitely helped me realize and accept that. 
 

20 hours ago, Ariel said:

And if you ever try to ignore and push through an injury, you risk not only making the injury worse but possible incurring longer-lasting damage. What is needed is acceptance of the injury, along with patience (recovery will take as long as it takes) and adequate support (for the injury and also for our being/mind/spirit in the process). As the injury heals, we can gradually, carefully begin to rehabilitate and work our way back to training capacity. 

Couldn’t agree more. The last 1.5 days have shown me the truth in this statement. I have started giving myself grace and not forcing things. And guess what?! Last night I had a wonderful window! And today as well! This further proves that we need to let our body take the lead in these times. It knows what to do.. we should not push or interfere ❤️‍🩹

 

20 hours ago, Ariel said:

There's simply no reason to insist on getting out of one's comfort zone when one is already well out of one's comfort zone.

YES!!! This, one thousand percent. It’s way too much of risk. 

 

20 hours ago, Ariel said:

Yes @itsalyssadood 100% true. Your instincts are right on! Which is such a great sign of healing. 

You're doing a great job listening to yourself and caring for yourself. Give yourself so much credit!

 

Healing is happening all the time, wave or no wave, whether or not we consciously perceive it.

It's all about creating favorable conditions, and then getting out of our own way. <

You are seriously an angel, I appreciate your kind words so much. 🥹♥️ 

 

“creating favorable conditions and then getting out of our own way” 

THAT STATEMENT RIGHT THERE!!! SO MUCH TRUTH! 
 

You are amazing Ariel! *hugs*

[paulk23]

I am currently one drop of 10 mg effexor away from being off this evil drug I had a good week last week this week I feel awful,iam aggressive agitated no energy tense constantly feel like iam vibrating , I had it in my mind that when I level off my last drop that I would of achieved what I never thought was possible and be free of this drug it's taken me a year to get to here ,my question is from reading a lot of this forum is this just the beginning of the battle when I finally get the final drop ,I have to say that is making me feel very disheartened dont think I can do another year or two of this pain

[Ariel]

Excellent post by Rosetta:

 

On 9/17/2023 at 8:51 PM, Rosetta said:

I wrote this to someone today:
 

I understand why it matters so much to you WHY what is happening is happening.  I was obsessed with how and why my waves happened, what had happened in my brain to create the torture, and trying to figure out a way to control it.  Whether it was simply an OCD type reaction to my predicament or my natural personality, I read as much as I could and thought about the issue non-stop.  My brain did not reason very well, did not retain information very well, and the recurrent anxiety attacks made it very hard to think.
 

My understanding is that sometimes there may be a change in the brain that does not cause too much turbulence on the surface — where the symptoms show.  Maybe you feel worse, but it’s manageable.  Then, the healing brain makes a change that is quite consequential or possibly, several changes intersect, and wham! Suddenly, you are feeling much, much worse.  That is what seemed to be happening to me.  Whether the change was more significant or the result of the change was more intense, there were some waves that were devastating.  Many, many people report this phenomenon.  Because this pattern is different than most other types of healing (and because mental symptoms are often significant components), we are very distressed by the fact that we are feeling worse.

 

Personally, I think it’s likely to be the case that several changes intersect or pile up to make a particularly bad wave.  The reason I think this is because when someone is tapering, and they reduce the drug dose too soon after a previous reduction, they may feel stronger symptoms that would not have occurred if they had waited longer between reductions.  The only control the person has over how fast the brain is making changes is the timing of the dose reductions and the amount of the reductions.  

As cold turkeys 🦃, we have no control.  As adverse reaction people, we have no control.  The brain is doing its thing, and we are along for the ride.  Changes happen when the brain makes them.  They pile up or happen too fast, and it’s truly awful😞.   There are probably not too many natural substances that could put us in this type of danger.  Our bodies were never designed/never evolved to handle this situation.  They are carrying out a systematic repair procedure that is inadequate to provide a smooth or less rocky transition to normal brain function.  
 

The best analogy to what is happening to us is the healing of traumatic brain injury.  If you read the possible consequences of TBI, you will see a lot of similarities.  Of course, for us, the good news is that no structures have been destroyed permanently, but the trajectory of healing is very similar and just as frustrating and scary.  The neuroplasticity is the saving grace for both conditions. ductions.  The only control the person has over how fast the brain is making changes is the timing of the dose reductions and the amount of the reductions.

 

[Tolk90]

On 5/23/2024 at 12:59 PM, paulk23 said:

I am currently one drop of 10 mg effexor away from being off this evil drug I had a good week last week this week I feel awful,iam aggressive agitated no energy tense constantly feel like iam vibrating , I had it in my mind that when I level off my last drop that I would of achieved what I never thought was possible and be free of this drug it's taken me a year to get to here ,my question is from reading a lot of this forum is this just the beginning of the battle when I finally get the final drop ,I have to say that is making me feel very disheartened dont think I can do another year or two of this pain

When I lowered the dose, I was most afraid of 0mg. What you are feeling now is familiar to many. But believe me, even if you feel bad for a year or two, it will not be torture 24/7, your health will change every month, you will be stronger and stronger. The most correct thing is not to count time as hours or days. For the next year, try to assess your condition at least once every two weeks.

[6Eggs]

4 hours ago, Ariel said:

Excellent post by Rosetta:

 

 

 

Very much so! Very well put, sorry I saw you quote this in my email notification and I haven't checked in for a few weeks so I couldn't be bothered quoting that my self, so quoting the quote haha.

I might add on the mention that neuroplasticity is not only the saving grace by the double edged sword that allowed us to get so sick in the first place, it is hypothesis that neuroplasticity is the primary mechanism for a lot of the conditions seen post drug withdrawal as a result of the brain trying to adapt around the drug/s in order to return to it's normal function.  Some psych meds can promote/induce neuroplasticity themselves.

But the level of plasticity in individuals seem to have a big effect on outcome on a persons reaction and withdrawal to said drugs.

Prior to having used meds before, I have not been aware of my own excessive neuroplasticity until more decently when I reflect on my life's neurological quirks that I never knew where not typical.  Most were just interesting, but I recall a particular negative case where I got the reverse of motion sickness opposite to such like sea sickness, car sickness etc... I had a trip to Switzerland from Australia for training for my job at the time.  I got "Mal de débarquement syndrome" according to google. It's land sickness in simple terms.  I would only get this movement sensation and balance issue when standing in front of anything flat and stationary from about half a meter away, it was debilitating, and it took more than a year to resolve and I still get triggered with episodes for about 5-10 min after when I use an elevator to this day, this occurred nearly 15 years ago now.  What I think it was, that my brain adapted to having the back of the seat in front of me fixed for hours at a time as the visual reference and the sensations of the plane moving constantly, and the movement sensation was cancelled out by my brain. So when standing or sitting in front of something flat that is the same distance as the seat was in front of me, I would wobble and get vertigo until I stopped seeing what ever it was in front of me, closed my eyes or changed the distance, I believe my brain was trying to apply this adaptation of cancelling the movement of the plane and since there was no actual movement, the cancellation was felt as real movement.

There are numerous things like this I have always experienced in my life, nearly all weren't negative like this but interesting sensory illusion type stuff.  This makes a lot of sense to why drugs have always had unexpected results for me and symptoms are odd or severe. I probably have a much higher or perhaps deeper neuroplasticity than neurotypical people. I have many ASD traits that I am actually going to have an official assessment and diagnosis for it on Thursday.  If indeed I have ASD, which the pre-assessment screening highly suggests, ASD is thought to have excessive levels of neuroplasticity and impaired synaptic pruning. It's just a hypothesis , but fits well to all my experiences with life and the use of these drugs and the WD and ADRs that all gave me.

There is suggestion that ASD people have better recovery to TBIs than typical, part of that neuroplasticity hypothesis.  Some really fascinating stuff!

[Gussy]

On 5/23/2024 at 7:59 PM, paulk23 said:

I am currently one drop of 10 mg effexor away from being off this evil drug I had a good week last week this week I feel awful,iam aggressive agitated no energy tense constantly feel like iam vibrating , I had it in my mind that when I level off my last drop that I would of achieved what I never thought was possible and be free of this drug it's taken me a year to get to here ,my question is from reading a lot of this forum is this just the beginning of the battle when I finally get the final drop ,I have to say that is making me feel very disheartened dont think I can do another year or two of this pain

Hi. I don't know your history etc, I just saw your post in an email and wanted to reply. Based on my experience coming off the same drug, if I was to do it again (fat chance) I sure wouldn't jump off at 10mg once stable from your most recent drop as it sounds like you plan to do. Maybe I read your comment wrong too. This is the business end and the curve is steep at your dose too. Just me but I'd take however long needed to be as gentle as possible on my brain, body, n.s, gut and everything else that goes to hell when some of us think we can come off at too higher dose or too quickly, I did and I only wish what happens on those who deny it.

[missy27]

2 hours ago, Gussy said:

Hi. I don't know your history etc, I just saw your post in an email and wanted to reply. Based on my experience coming off the same drug, if I was to do it again (fat chance) I sure wouldn't jump off at 10mg once stable from your most recent drop as it sounds like you plan to do. Maybe I read your comment wrong too. This is the business end and the curve is steep at your dose too. Just me but I'd take however long needed to be as gentle as possible on my brain, body, n.s, gut and everything else that goes to hell when some of us think we can come off at too higher dose or too quickly, I did and I only wish what happens on those who deny it.

Gussy, it looks like you and I were on the same thing (I was on the generic form of effexsor) for the same amount of time. I also went off of it to quick. I totally agree, I would of done it way slower if I had to do it again. 

[ShantyO7]

I still can't really tell the difference between windows and waves and I'm almost 4 months in. I either feel crappy or feel blah, don't ever really feel better. Things have gotten better but I just  haven't had a "symptom free" day yet and the nausea is always there. Just ready for some relief and windows where I actually feel better and no nausea. I think if the incessant nausea would just go away, I would be doing a lot better. Anyone else feel like they don't really have windows/waves?

[jon1]

9 minutes ago, ShantyO7 said:

I still can't really tell the difference between windows and waves and I'm almost 4 months in. I either feel crappy or feel blah, don't ever really feel better. Things have gotten better but I just  haven't had a "symptom free" day yet and the nausea is always there. Just ready for some relief and windows where I actually feel better and no nausea. I think if the incessant nausea would just go away, I would be doing a lot better. Anyone else feel like they don't really have windows/waves?

Yep. The windows and waves thing doesn’t really feel like it applies to me. Over two years in, and I do get what I’d call ‘mild’ improvements now and again, but they’re usually for one symptom, and other symptoms will be just as bad. It does seem that for a lot of people, it’s a very, very slow, almost imperceptible recovery.

 

So while I don’t feel much better, I know that if I look back a year, I have improved in some respects.

 

Importantly, don’t put any pressure on yourself to feel better. Four months is still very, very early days.

[missy27]

1 hour ago, ShantyO7 said:

I still can't really tell the difference between windows and waves and I'm almost 4 months in. I either feel crappy or feel blah, don't ever really feel better. Things have gotten better but I just  haven't had a "symptom free" day yet and the nausea is always there. Just ready for some relief and windows where I actually feel better and no nausea. I think if the incessant nausea would just go away, I would be doing a lot better. Anyone else feel like they don't really have windows/waves?

When i was at 4 months i felt terrible all the time. My windows and waves started more at 5 months. I am 7 months out and I am just now starting to have bigger windows then waves. My nausea seems to only happen a couple days in a wave instead of the whole wave. So there is much improvement that way. Every one is different and goes at a different pace. I know it's so hard and feels like forever. Give yourself lots of grace.

[paulk23]

9 hours ago, Gussy said:

Hi. I don't know your history etc, I just saw your post in an email and wanted to reply. Based on my experience coming off the same drug, if I was to do it again (fat chance) I sure wouldn't jump off at 10mg once stable from your most recent drop as it sounds like you plan to do. Maybe I read your comment wrong too. This is the business end and the curve is steep at your dose too. Just me but I'd take however long needed to be as gentle as possible on my brain, body, n.s, gut and everything else that goes to hell when some of us think we can come off at too higher dose or too quickly, I did and I only wish what happens on those who deny it.

Because I was on the generic version of venaflaxine or effexor there where only six beads in my tablet so I have come down by roughly twelve mg I've dropped about every 3 months for this recent drop from 25 mg to 12.5 mg I done this 5 weeks ago I am really struggling can't concentrate constantly emotional my body keeps tensing unbearably my problem is I don't know how to drop any slower because iam now down to just one bead in the capsule my thinking was when I finally get to the point where iam no longer on this medication I thought it would take a few weeks to get over the worst of it but by reading some stories on here it seems this can go on years I really don't know if I can face that iam in hell I have a two year old and a job to deal with and iam really struggling to deal with either all I had was a small bit of anxiety and I've found myself in a world of hell

[Gussy]

Are you familiar with the work of Mark Horowitz and Anders Sorenson, along with the knowledge of the admins and mods here? Yes these drugs aren't made in a friendly way to come off them and going from 25 to 12.5 mg is huge. No wonder you feel the way you do. I really sympathize with you, trying to work and with a little one while this is happening to you. I only had to keep working, i didn't have a little one until 18 months or so after I was off so the absolute worst for me was over. If symptoms are unbareable it could be an idea to get the opinions of the admins and mods here about reinstating a certain amount of your recent reduction although that might be difficult with mini tabs that are probably extended release.

[ShantyO7]

I'm almost 4 months in and I feel like things are getting worse instead of better. I am trying to stay positive and all, but these last couple of days are really getting to me. What do I do if my symptoms are getting worse and not better? The insomnia, nausea and anxiety are so elevated. I haven't really had a window per se so I feel like I have no hope of things improving at this point. When will I start seeing improvements in my symptoms?

[ShantyO7]

Also, I keep seeing stuff about the "famous fourth month wave" and peaks around 4-5 months. What does that mean? Could that be why I'm struggling so much right now as I'm getting into my fourth month?

[jon1]

There’s not really much you can do but ride it out. There will be times where you feel worse - often for no reason - but there will be times where you feel better. You may not feel great, but you’ll feel better.

 

Put yourself first, treat yourself with compassion, and be sure that things will improve, even if it doesn’t feel like it right now.

 

A fair few people do seem to hit a wall of symptoms a few months in. For me it was around 5 months. This can happen with quite a lot of drugs, like Benzo’s and alcohol.

 

I’ll repeat what I said earlier in this thread. You’re still in very, very early days of recovery (early days is about two years), so it’s completely normal for you to still be feeling rotten right now.

 

It’s also normal to feel worried, scared, and have health anxiety about your symptoms. I think we all go through that.

 

It will get better.

[2cats2272]

16 months off Effexor. I was on it for 17 years. Tapered from 150-0 in 3 months. I went from 37.5-0. I’m most certainly in a wave. It’s pretty awful. I’ve had some good windows. When I’m in a wave, I consider reinstating. I won’t though.