success ☼ Nadia: There is hope!

[Nikki]

Nadia...

 

I had a total hysterectomy in 1999. At that time we were only given synthetic estrogen...not good.

 

Suzanne Somers came out the her book on HRT, more specifically Bio-identical hormones. I went on them and felt sooo much better. I use a progesterone cream with testosterone and estradiol (estrogen tablet). Progesterone is the 'calming hormone'.

 

I am considering geting off hormones (by tapering). It's been a long time that I have been on them.

 

Unfortunately, getting off of them can cause sweats, agitation, insomnia, and a host of other issues, so I am bidding my time with it.

 

Hormone imbalances (perimenopause) can affect women with things like anxiety. that was my experience.

 

Google bio-identica hormones:)

 

Hugs

[Barbarannamated]

Nikki -

Q: May I ask why you're considering getting off of HRT

FYI - I posted a scientific journal article about Endocrine Withdrawal Syndromes that might be of interest -

Sorry to thread tread again Nadia

[Nadia]

Nadia -

can't find your post about the article "If you have to prove youre ill you cant get better" but I Googled and

it is by NM HADLER and was in Spine - couldnt get to Full Text-

Looks like it's about Work Comp back injuries and I cant read anything about that -

 

Ah! Thanks, I'll look it up! Whatever the article is about, I do think it makes sense that having to prove you are ill makes it hard for you to get better!

[Nadia]

Nadia...

 

I had a total hysterectomy in 1999. At that time we were only given synthetic estrogen...not good.

 

Suzanne Somers came out the her book on HRT, more specifically Bio-identical hormones. I went on them and felt sooo much better. I use a progesterone cream with testosterone and estradiol (estrogen tablet). Progesterone is the 'calming hormone'.

 

I am considering geting off hormones (by tapering). It's been a long time that I have been on them.

 

Unfortunately, getting off of them can cause sweats, agitation, insomnia, and a host of other issues, so I am bidding my time with it.

 

Hormone imbalances (perimenopause) can affect women with things like anxiety. that was my experience.

 

Google bio-identica hormones:)

 

Hugs

 

My mom was taking synthetic estrogen and progesterone (it has a different name but I can't recall it at the moment.. progestin?), and then because of that study that came out saying HRT was not good long term she stopped, and now only takes a small dose of the estrogen every other day (which I bet is bad tapering, just like with ADs). She was supposed to go off it entirely, but her doctor died, and now she is seeing a new doctor, and they are trying to determine what to do, because taking only the estrogen can put you at risk for cervical cancer. My mom noticed a huge difference in her energy and youth when she tapered the HRT... she feels she aged a lot. She said her doctor said something like, "it's time for you to get older now", which is sad. But I guess it's to avoid possible health complications.

 

I have heard of bioidentical hormones before, and though I've read some doctors think they are bogus, I do believe that is the route I will investigate and go with. I don't know that I can get them in my country, but I will be looking into it when the time comes! I just hope hope hope that time does not have to be right now, and that I have a last chance to get pregnant.

 

I'll look for that book by Suzanne Somers. Thanks for the info!

[Nadia]

Nikki -

Q: May I ask why you're considering getting off of HRT

FYI - I posted a scientific journal article about Endocrine Withdrawal Syndromes that might be of interest -

Sorry to thread tread again Nadia

 

You know I don't mind at all!

[alexjuice]

Ah! Thanks, I'll look it up! Whatever the article is about, I do think it makes sense that having to prove you are ill makes it hard for you to get better!

 

I agree entirely.

 

When I was younger I didn't understand humans well enough. It seems to me now that a huge part of getting better, and just being successful regardless of your specific health issue, is being surrounded by others who accept and support the basic spine of your being and experience.

 

Anticipatory stress kills me. It doesn't matter if I feel like I won't be accepted, respected, treated fairly. The notion that core elements of my experience must be defended, it generates a stress that runs me down.

 

Right now, I believe, I will recover completely from my current situation granted I am able to develop close, bonded relationships where my core beliefs are not upfordebate but simply accepted, respected and validated.

[Barbarannamated]

Brilliantly stated„ Alex -BRILLIANT

'Anticipatory stress' √

Core values and integrity questioned/doubted/mocked by those who cannot/willnot see outside of their littleboxofbeliefs but hold power -

Stealing Alex's wordcombos -

Free associating all over Nadia's thread - again

[elizabeth11]

Nadia-

 

I'm not a MD, RN, but I do like to research.

 

If it is helpful to your mom, some new research has come out that HRT may not be as bad a feared, and may help prevent a host of other health problems.

 

And as a gyn cancer survivor, the concern I've heard about estrogen from my oncologist is that might cause endometrial cancer only when it is unopposed with progesterone. I would interpret this that if your Mom and her Dr can find a natural as possible version of adding estrogen and then some progesterone at some point every month, it might be something she should really consider continuing to take. Taken as a pair, according to my oncologist, she might be just fine. Plus we know these hormones can have a terrific effect on mood.

 

Hope this helps!

 

Elizabeth

[Barbarannamated]

That's exactly what my endocrinologist said about HRT ~ the risks aren't nearly as extreme as when the big study was halted and millions of women DCd HRT --

Does that whole thing sound suspicious to anyone else „in light of what we know about SSRI dangers -- how many women became depressed when withdrawn from HRT and how many were put on SSRIs…

Call me suspicious -

[spectio]

Nadia, how are you? Haven't seen you post for a few days. Just wondering how you are??

[Nadia]

Hi everyone! Sorry to have dropped off the face of the internet.

 

I have actually been doing pretty well... Kind of a two steps forward, one step back deal. Since I have been taking the ginseng my mood has improved incredibly. My sleep and anxiety have been all over the place, but with the improved mood I am much more able to deal. I get morning anxiety but without having depression it is not accompanied by horrible dread. I didn't even have much PMS this month! Not sure how much of this is related to the ginseng, but the past three days I ran out and my mood has declined. Some moments I have felt even NORMAL. I'm afraid to analyze it to much lest it disappear.

 

I am having my hormones and fertility evaluated to know how much of what has been going on is hormonal. I'll get my results next week. Even if they come back normal, I know I am having hormonal changes because of weirdness in my cycle. This month I didn't even make it to 23 days. And there are changes and strange things, like last month I had cramps every day for most of the month.

 

Anyway... I have been slammed with work and trying not to think of things too much, so have not been on here. But I think of you all often and will try to give a clearer update soon!

 

(Elizabeth... thanks for the info on HRT. My mom right now is not taking any progesterone, so I'm going to tell her that she should either quite entirely or go back to taking the combo! And she feels so great on the HRT, it's probably worth the risk.)

 

N.

[Altostrata]

Amazing! Thanks for sharing your good news, Nadia. Very happy to hear about it.

 

Pretty soon, you'll be a candidate for a Success Stories topic.

[Nikki]

Barbara and Nadia I apologize for not answering your questions, I didn't remember participating on this post.....brain fog

 

Barbara thee ar a few reasons why I have been considering getting of HRT. Afterbeing on AD's, I feel terrible about taking too much medication. Lisinopril - Lovastatin

Celexa & HRT.

 

I would like to change my health insurane carrier someday and insurance companies turn people like myself down for medications, ER visits, you name it and it is a determining factor to be declined. This is the real reason.

 

The second reason is weight gain. AD's and hormones cause weight gain. In my case, I had a hysterectomy while on Paxil and I noticed a more significant weight gain after going on hormones.

 

I believe that every medication I have ever taken has had some adverse reactions. Antibiotics (Flagyl/Cipro/Levaquin) all the AD's - blood pressure - cholesterol lowering meds. There is some side effect or long term effect.

 

I would love to see what it is like to be med free. And then again I am scared. WD has made me so afraid off getting off meds. With hormones I wonder if anxiety would set in.

 

I have read that getting off HRT is a tapering process which is best done in six months.

 

I guess I am just disgusted.....

 

Hugs

[Barbarannamated]

Nikki ~

I understand your reasons for wanting to unmedicate - I don't know the full story on HRT because opinions have changed so drastically over the years - my endocrinologist feels that estrogen is critical for mood and I'm aware of estrogen being used in geriatrics instead of psychotropics for mood (possibly dementia-related)-

Dementia is in the females in my family big time so id rather avoid it or - some might say prevent its progression

The insurance and mental health issue is a hot button for me - as it stands now insurance companies (health and life) put people in a high risk category if ever treated for MH even psychotherapy in some cases - that is so wrong and once in medical records or prescription records it's permanent - this was info as of about 6-9 months ago - not sure if laws have changed -

So sorry AGAIN Nadia - I always seem to get carried away on your thread - didn't even realize where I was posting -

[Nadia]

Amazing! Thanks for sharing your good news, Nadia. Very happy to hear about it.

 

Pretty soon, you'll be a candidate for a Success Stories topic.

 

OH, that would be wonderful! I'm afraid to be too optimistic, as I've gotten better and then worse before, and it's only been two weeks (and not too consistent)... but something IS changing. Even when I was going through some very heavy anxiety about a week ago, I still felt I had more of a grip on reality and normality than I have had for months. Even if I have had a sore back and neck, I have not had the *weird* neck and lower back pain. I have not had derealization and depersonalization. I have had headaches and dizziness, but not that "flu-like" feeling. I have not felt suicidal even when I have felt sad. It's hard to describe, but I do feel like I'm beating this gradually and that this is some kind of important turn.

 

I should mention that I ran out of Seriphos on March 20th, and things have seemed to get better after that as well, which is exactly what happened last time (improvement after completing a cycle of taking it for two months, upon quitting it). Supposedly one of the ways it works is that it makes you more reactive to cortisol, so perhaps it helped "re-set" my response to cortisol.

 

Both Seriphos and panax ginseng have been referred to as "adaptogens"... I wonder if there is something to this. Another one is "rhodiola rosea":

 

...rhodiola modulates cortisol production during times of physical or emotional duress. Cortisol is a steroid hormone and it is often called the stress hormone. Our adrenal glands produce cortisol to help us cope with stressful situations. Unfortunately, sometimes our body produces too much cortisol, or if we experience chronic stress our body produces cortisol too often, even in times when we don’t really need it.

 

Since cortisol suppresses our immune system, counteracts insulin and metabolizes proteins, fats and carbohydrates, too much cortisol may amplify these basic functions and produce detrimental problems. Rhodiola rosea acts as a mild cortisol modulator, helping our bodies reduce the repercussions of excessive cortisol release by our adrenal glands.

 

From: http://rhodiolarosea.org

 

Also see this study on PubMed and the reference to the HPA axis: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=adaptogen%20hpa

 

However, it apparently boosts serotonin and dopamine, so it could be bad for withdrawal.

 

I find the concept of an adaptogen interesting:

 

Plant adaptogens are compounds that increase the ability of an organism to adapt to environmental factors and to avoid damage from such factors. The beneficial effects of multi-dose administration of adaptogens are mainly associated with the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal (HPA) axis, a part of the stress-system that is believed to play a primary role in the reactions of the body to repeated stress and adaptation.

 

From: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16261511

 

I'm going to keep taking the ginseng for another month or so. By the way, I take it whether I sleep well or not... I have had three days of bad sleep now, and had three days of awful sleep last week, but I kept taking the ginseng last week (not the past three days as I had run out), and then slept better than I had in a long time, with virtually no morning anxiety.

 

Of course, this could all be a fluke, some temporary improvement, related to hormones or who knows what else. I don't know, but I'm squeezing it for all it's worth. I will keep you guys posted.

[Altostrata]

I had a bad experience with rhodiola. In low doses, it is activating, not adaptogenic. Ooops.

[Nadia]

The notes about rhodiola activating serotonin and dopamine made me wary... thanks for letting me know about your experience with it, Alto.

 

I had a very relaxing weekend, with pretty good sleep, and then today I woke up with AM anxiety again, and weirdly repeating obsessions and random memories from the past. Last night I finally got a hold of some niacinamide. I tried 250mg this AM but it didn't seem to do anything for me. I also got some methylcobalamine sublingual B12, but I'm not trying it until later since I don't want to introduce more than one thing at a time.

 

Continuing with: 200mg panax ginseng, a Stress Tab B12 combo (not the best I'm sure, but what I could get), Carlson's fish oils, magnesium chloride. My mood wavers, of course, but is in general much better than where I was even a month ago, and that helps me deal with poor sleep and anxiety (which get better and worse in little cycles of 1 to 3 days). At this point I'm less scared about stuff being "activating" if it means it improves my depression... though of course it's all related and enough days of anxiety and poor sleep can make me depressed in and of itself.

[Nadia]

So I got my hormone results yesterday... the doctor says everything is normal. I asked him why I'm having weirdness with my cycle, cramps, etc., and he said that really the tests he did only tell him that this particular cycle was OK, but that what happens is that at my age you start to have hormonal variability... so that maybe when you are 20 years old, 11 out of 12 cycles are good, while at my age it might be 8 out of 12. So he didn't rule out that some of what I'm going through might be hormonal.

 

On the baby front, he thinks I'm running out of time, and he did a sperm analysis of my partner and said his Kruger morphology is only 8% and that would make it impossible for me to get pregnant naturally, so he recommends doing IUI, which means washing his sperm and depositing it directly in my uterus and giving me hormones to stimulate ovulation. I'm very wary about this... first, if my hormones are as great as he says, I don't like the idea of taking medication to stimulate ovulation. Second, I've read that the Kruger morphology test is super strict... they consider normal above 14%, but 8% is supposedly OK. Since this guy is a fertility expert and makes his money that way, I feel like I'm being pressured into buying into this.

 

Of course, this whole thing has activated my anxiety. I have had two nights of awful sleep and morning anxiety. On an interesting note, I took the panax ginseng yesterday when I was feeling so awful, and I almost immediately felt better. While I was researching if panax ginseng might have an effect on improving my hormonal balance (which apparently some people think it does), I read that in the West ginseng is considered stimulating, but in Eastern medicine it is considered calming and given as an aid for anxiety! So maybe that is why it works for me.

 

I'm still wondering about taking DHEA. My DHEA-S blood test came back as 108 mg/dL, and normal range for my age is 32 to 240, but many people seem to recommend supplementing if you're under 130 or even 200. Maybe I'll try a tiny, tiny amount. I'd rather do that than have them inject me with all kinds of hormones for the IUI.

 

Then again, I keep thinking I should just exercise, eat well, and stop taking any other kind of supplement or herb.

 

I tried niacinamide again yesterday when I was feeling very anxious (250mg) and it didn't seem to do anything for me. I've decided to not try it any more until I stabilize.

[Nadia]

Hi everyone,

 

I'd been doing so well... then a couple of weeks ago my dad died. Completely unexpected. It's hard to tell what kind of an impact this is having... I of course had sleepless nights, but that is to be expected. Amazingly I didn't feel anxious... the extreme pain of losing him seems to completely have wiped out my anxiety. I was stressed, nervous, tense, but not generally anxious. Only in the past couple of days has the AM anxiety and dread reared its ugly head again. And since I have not been walking or exercising and am so tense, the weird back pain is back. I suspect it is muscle tension. I'm still dizzy all the time, but that never did really go away.

 

I'm perplexed about how normal I feel... OK, not that I feel normal-normal, but my grief and everything that comes with it seems relatively normal... a healthy response to a traumatic life situation. Only the recent AM anxiety seems off. I'm hoping things don't get worse, because I have so much to deal with.

 

I hope everyone is progressing on the path to wellness.

 

N.

[Barbarannamated]

Nadia, I'm so sorry about your dad.

{{{HUGS}}}

[shebop]

Hi Nadia,

 

I'm so sorry to hear about the loss of your father. It sounds like you are working through your grief. Please remember to be extra-gentle with yourself.

[Skyler]

I'd been doing so well... then a couple of weeks ago my dad died.

 

I'm perplexed about how normal I feel... OK, not that I feel normal-normal, but my grief and everything that comes with it seems relatively normal... a healthy response to a traumatic life situation. Only the recent AM anxiety seems off. I'm hoping things don't get worse, because I have so much to deal with.

 

I hope everyone is progressing on the path to wellness.

 

N.

 

Hi Nadia, sorry to hear about your Dad. Sounds like he was an important part of your life. I hope your withdrawal symptoms don't get caught up as the time you need to be with your feelings is part of grieving.

 

Do you drink coffee, sometimes reducing or eliminating AM caffeine can less morning anxiety. Doing so helped me alot with anxiety that was related to benzo withdrawal. ~S

[Altostrata]

Very sorry to hear about your father.

[Karma]

Nadia,

 

I'm sorry for your loss ... it is difficult to lose a loved-one unexpectedly. Sending you courage, strength and healing energy.

Karma

[meistersinger]

Hi everyone,

 

I'd been doing so well... then a couple of weeks ago my dad died. Completely unexpected. It's hard to tell what kind of an impact this is having... I of course had sleepless nights, but that is to be expected. Amazingly I didn't feel anxious... the extreme pain of losing him seems to completely have wiped out my anxiety. I was stressed, nervous, tense, but not generally anxious. Only in the past couple of days has the AM anxiety and dread reared its ugly head again. And since I have not been walking or exercising and am so tense, the weird back pain is back. I suspect it is muscle tension. I'm still dizzy all the time, but that never did really go away.

 

I'm perplexed about how normal I feel... OK, not that I feel normal-normal, but my grief and everything that comes with it seems relatively normal... a healthy response to a traumatic life situation. Only the recent AM anxiety seems off. I'm hoping things don't get worse, because I have so much to deal with.

 

I hope everyone is progressing on the path to wellness.

 

N.

 

I am truely sorry about your father. I know the feeling, having lost my mother in November 2011.

[Nadia]

Thanks Meistersinger, Karma, Alto, Schuyler, Alto, Barb, Shebop...

 

Schuyler, I don't drink any caffeine... have stayed away from it entirely except for small amounts in chocolate now and then, and some black tea when I felt well last November.

 

I have to say I think my sleep has been pretty good all things considered. I sleep 4 to 6 hours, then wake up, and have fitful sleep for another hour or two after taking some magnesium and sometimes milk peptides. Then there are the bad nights, of course, but they are fewer and further between than they used to be. I'm amazed that I'm doing this well considering all the stress and emotional stuff I'm going through. I think it's a good sign that my nervous system is in better shape.

 

My biggest complaint now is back pain, but I've also fallen off the wagon with my exercises, so that's to be expected. The past five days I've been going downhill on the morning anxiety and dread, but I'm hopeful it's just a temporary setback. Just plowing ahead. Nothing else to be done. I've got my mom to take care of now... I have to fight against depression with everything I've got. I have to remember to take care of myself through this. I have to make sure to go on the morning walks and do my exercises and take some time out for myself (that has not yet been possible, but I need to "enforce" it soon).

[Barbarannamated]

{{{HUGS}}} to you, Nadia. You are inspirational!

[Nadia]

Pfft... not really. I think mostly I just write pep talks to myself on here. I'm really swamped with self-doubt and all sorts of other emotions often!

 

I guess the whole difference between being OK and not being OK is if you have the ability to grasp onto the positive stuff and let it help you plow through the negative stuff. For me, depression is not having it in you to fight anymore. I'm doing my best not to spiral into that! Since I have to think of others more than myself now, I guess it helps. This morning I just didn't want to get out of bed, but my mom needed me, so I had to. And that was a good thing. After a little while I got going. I can't say I'm happy or even well, but I'm hanging in there, and that is something. Lean on and be leaned on... limping we'll make it forward.

[Barbarannamated]

Lol! Ok, you're inspirational and honest!

[tezza]

Nadia,

 

I'm so so sorry about the loss of your Dad. Losing your Dad has to be one of the most awful things to go through in your life. I know because I've been there. I can't tell you enough how sorry I am to hear that. {{{HUGS}}}

 

TEZZA

[Nikki]

Nadia...sorry for your loss. Grieving brings on alot. So many emotions, and it does affect sleep, and grieving in itself is very fatiguing.

 

Nadia be gentle and kind with yourself. Give yourself lots of comfort. If you need to vent I am a click away.

 

Many hugs

[Dani]

Nadia...I am so sorry for your loss. ((hugz))

[Altostrata]

Pfft... not really. I think mostly I just write pep talks to myself on here. I'm really swamped with self-doubt and all sorts of other emotions often!

 

I guess the whole difference between being OK and not being OK is if you have the ability to grasp onto the positive stuff and let it help you plow through the negative stuff. For me, depression is not having it in you to fight anymore. I'm doing my best not to spiral into that! Since I have to think of others more than myself now, I guess it helps. This morning I just didn't want to get out of bed, but my mom needed me, so I had to. And that was a good thing. After a little while I got going. I can't say I'm happy or even well, but I'm hanging in there, and that is something. Lean on and be leaned on... limping we'll make it forward.

 

Nadia, you've become a bodhisattva !!

[Nadia]

Thanks so much, everyone.

 

Tezza, it's so true what you say about it being one of the worse things I've ever been through. I think many other people see it as a normal thing. Several people have told me "I hope you're feeling better about your dad now", like I just had the flu or something. For me, I lost not only my dad, but one of my closest friends. I feel so lost without him. And being left "in his place" in taking care of my mom and finances and their home and everything, they are some pretty big shoes to fill.

 

Alto, you make me blush, and it's so far from the truth! I am doing my best, but my strength and determination wavers. I think right now I'm hitting the depression part of grieving, and my anxiety and insomnia have taken a turn for the worse (trying not to freak out about it and contribute to the down-spiral). I'm also having all sorts of selfish feelings... like thinking I had just started feeling better, and was making plans to move away, and now I'm stuck here. Of course, this is all so much worse for my mom. I can't imagine what she must be going through, losing here life partner. They were such a fantastic pair. I think she is frustrated that I can't do more for her; I am as well. But I'm also trying to carve out space for all my less honorable feelings, I don't want them to poison me.

 

I will try to be kind to myself.

 

Hugs to everyone and thanks again.

[Nikki]

Nadia in spite of the pain & grieving you are remarkable to me. Your thoughts, words and sentiments are right on. You've got it together.

 

Many similarities...

 

My Dad was a good friend, I felt the loss for quite some time. I am my mother's care giver now. She is 88, has macular degeneration and other health issues and can no longer drive.

Ir is not selfish to have had thoughts of moving away. We are entitled to our thoughts.

I too must remain close by. It is what it is 'for now.'

 

My Al-Anon Sponsor always interjects when I am crying with the words "for now."

 

This resonated with me.

 

I guess the whole difference between being OK and not being OK is if you have the ability to grasp onto the positive stuff and let it help you plow through the negative stuff. For me, depression is not having it in you to fight anymore. I'm doing my best not to spiral into that! You are doing a great job.

[Barbarannamated]

Many big Hugs, Nadia.

Do you have a brother nearby?

I think your feelings are very natural especially after the trauma you've been through with drugs and digging your way out of that...trying to move forward into your own life and wanting to be there for your mom, also... so many conflicting emotions.

More hugs...

B