ajay Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Nadia, I am so sorry to hear about your father. I am thinking of you and wishing you rest and support. Please be gentle with yourself. Of course some of your feelings are "less than honorable," but they are honest and still deserve to be acknowledged... You are amazing. Even when you don't feel that way. [more big hugs] History is approximate; I didn't track my dosages. 1995 - started zoloft/sertraline for depression 1995-2008 - sertraline ranged from 100-200mg, may have gone as high as 250mg 2006 - 2009 - added welbutrin/budeprion SR, 150 mg sometime in 2009-2010 - stopped budeprion c/t sometime around 2009-2010, Tapered down sertraline w/o guidance to 50 mg, then 25mg. ~ feb 2010, stopped sertraline. ~ Apr 2010, resumed 25mg low dose (really bad business trip) Oct 2010, stopped sertraline Jan 2011 - another bad business trip "breaks" my sleep. current issues include insomnia, anxiety, GI distress, depression. Taking multivitamins, Vitamin D, fish oil, Chinese herbs, ~ 0.5mg melatonin in the evening. Going to therapy and acupuncture once a week. Link to comment
Administrator Karma Posted May 18, 2012 Administrator Share Posted May 18, 2012 Hi Nadia, Elizabeth Kubler-Ross tells us there are five stages of grieving: 1) Denial, 2) Anger, 3) Bargaining, 4) Depression and finally 5) Acceptance. You may move back and forth between anger and depression before you can get to acceptance. The only way to deal with this is to experience the emotions until you get to the other side. I noticed that you said you think your mother is frustrated that you cannot do more for her ... do you know this? Have you had the honest discussion about it? I ask because we tend to tell ourselves stories ... you may be telling yourself a story about what your mom feels or believes and it may not be true. It sounds like your story is that you are frustrated that you cannot do more for you mom - but you may find that your mom is more resilient than you currently believe or that what you think she needs is not really what she needs. I find that if I have an honest conversation and explain what I'm feeling, starting with heart, and asking others what they are feeling and what they need that I often find out that my stories are fiction and I can do more to help another person than I thought. I also find that when I understand what the other person's story is that I can understand behavior better. There is nothing you can do to relieve your mom's pain at losing her life partner, but if you provide an opening for an honest conversation you may be able to help her deal with her own feelings and get to the other side just by being willing to listen. I hope something here is helpful to you. Karma 2007 @ 375 mg Effexor - 11/29/2011 - 43.75 mg Effexor (regular) & .625 mg Xanax 200 mg Gabapentin 2/27/21 - 194.5 mg, 5/28/21 - 183 mg, 8/2/21 - 170 mg, 11/28/21 - 150 mg, 4/19/22 - 122 mg; 8//7/22 - 100 mg; 12/17 - 75mg; 8/17 - 45 mg; 10/16 40 mg Xanax taper: 3/11/12 - 0.9375 mg, 3/25/12 - 0.875 mg, 4/6/12 - 0.8125 mg, 4/18/12 - 0.75 ; 10/16 40mg; 1/16 0.6875 mg; at some point 0.625 mg Effexor taper: 1/29/12 - 40.625 mg, 4/29/12 - 39.875 mg, 5/11/12 - Switched to liquid Effexor, 5/25/12 - 38 mg, 7/6/12 - 35 mg, 8/17/12 - 32 mg, 9/14/12 - 30 mg, 10/19/12 - 28 mg, 11/9/12 - 26 mg, 11/30/12 - 24 mg, 01/14/13 - 22 mg. 02/25/13 - 20.8 mg, 03/18/13 - 19.2 mg, 4/15/13 - 17.6 mg, 8/10/13 - 16.4 mg, 9/7/13 - 15.2 mg, 10/19/13 - 14 mg, 1/15/14 - 13.2 mg, 3/1/2014 - 12.6 mg, 5/4/14 - 12 mg, 8/1/14 - 11.4 mg, 8/29/14 - 10.8 mg; 10/14/14 - 10.2 mg; 12/15/14 - 10 mg, 1/11/15 - 9.5 mg, 2/8/15 - 9 mg, 3/21/15 - 8.5 mg, 5/1/15 - 8 mg, 6/9/15 - 7.5 mg, 7/8/15 - 7 mg, 8/22/15 - 6.5 mg, 10/4/15 - 6 mg; 1/1/16 - 5.6 mg; 2/6/16 - 5.2 mg; 4/9 - 4.8 mg; 7/7 4.5 mg; 10/7 4.25 mg; 11/4 4.0 mg; 11/25 3.8 mg; 4/24 3.6 mg; 5/27 3.4 mg; 7/8 3.2 mg ... 10/18 2.8 mg; 1/18 2.6 mg; 4/7 2.4 mg; 5/26 2.15mg; 8/18 1.85 mg; 10/7 1.7 mg; 12/1 1.45 mg; 3/2 1.2 mg; 5/4 0.90 mg; 6/1 0.80 mg; 6/22 0.65 mg; 08/03 0.50 mg, 08/10 0.45 mg, 10/05 0.325 mg, 11/23 0.2 mg, 12/14 0.15 mg, 12/21 0.125 mg, 02/28 0.03125 mg, 2/15 0.015625 mg, 2/29/20 0.00 mg - OFF Effexor I am not a medical professional - this is not medical advice. My suggestions are based on personal experience, reading, observation and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers Link to comment
Administrator Karma Posted July 25, 2012 Administrator Share Posted July 25, 2012 Nadia You've been missing for over a month, please pop in and tell us how you are doing. Karma 2007 @ 375 mg Effexor - 11/29/2011 - 43.75 mg Effexor (regular) & .625 mg Xanax 200 mg Gabapentin 2/27/21 - 194.5 mg, 5/28/21 - 183 mg, 8/2/21 - 170 mg, 11/28/21 - 150 mg, 4/19/22 - 122 mg; 8//7/22 - 100 mg; 12/17 - 75mg; 8/17 - 45 mg; 10/16 40 mg Xanax taper: 3/11/12 - 0.9375 mg, 3/25/12 - 0.875 mg, 4/6/12 - 0.8125 mg, 4/18/12 - 0.75 ; 10/16 40mg; 1/16 0.6875 mg; at some point 0.625 mg Effexor taper: 1/29/12 - 40.625 mg, 4/29/12 - 39.875 mg, 5/11/12 - Switched to liquid Effexor, 5/25/12 - 38 mg, 7/6/12 - 35 mg, 8/17/12 - 32 mg, 9/14/12 - 30 mg, 10/19/12 - 28 mg, 11/9/12 - 26 mg, 11/30/12 - 24 mg, 01/14/13 - 22 mg. 02/25/13 - 20.8 mg, 03/18/13 - 19.2 mg, 4/15/13 - 17.6 mg, 8/10/13 - 16.4 mg, 9/7/13 - 15.2 mg, 10/19/13 - 14 mg, 1/15/14 - 13.2 mg, 3/1/2014 - 12.6 mg, 5/4/14 - 12 mg, 8/1/14 - 11.4 mg, 8/29/14 - 10.8 mg; 10/14/14 - 10.2 mg; 12/15/14 - 10 mg, 1/11/15 - 9.5 mg, 2/8/15 - 9 mg, 3/21/15 - 8.5 mg, 5/1/15 - 8 mg, 6/9/15 - 7.5 mg, 7/8/15 - 7 mg, 8/22/15 - 6.5 mg, 10/4/15 - 6 mg; 1/1/16 - 5.6 mg; 2/6/16 - 5.2 mg; 4/9 - 4.8 mg; 7/7 4.5 mg; 10/7 4.25 mg; 11/4 4.0 mg; 11/25 3.8 mg; 4/24 3.6 mg; 5/27 3.4 mg; 7/8 3.2 mg ... 10/18 2.8 mg; 1/18 2.6 mg; 4/7 2.4 mg; 5/26 2.15mg; 8/18 1.85 mg; 10/7 1.7 mg; 12/1 1.45 mg; 3/2 1.2 mg; 5/4 0.90 mg; 6/1 0.80 mg; 6/22 0.65 mg; 08/03 0.50 mg, 08/10 0.45 mg, 10/05 0.325 mg, 11/23 0.2 mg, 12/14 0.15 mg, 12/21 0.125 mg, 02/28 0.03125 mg, 2/15 0.015625 mg, 2/29/20 0.00 mg - OFF Effexor I am not a medical professional - this is not medical advice. My suggestions are based on personal experience, reading, observation and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers Link to comment
ajay Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Hi Nadia, I am thinking of you. I can't imagine what it's like to have to deal with such grief on top of everything else. I am so sorry. I know it can be hard to check in here, especially when you feel like you don't have good news. Please know I am wishing you moments of sunshine and quiet and whatever could possibly help and heal. Hugs, ajay History is approximate; I didn't track my dosages. 1995 - started zoloft/sertraline for depression 1995-2008 - sertraline ranged from 100-200mg, may have gone as high as 250mg 2006 - 2009 - added welbutrin/budeprion SR, 150 mg sometime in 2009-2010 - stopped budeprion c/t sometime around 2009-2010, Tapered down sertraline w/o guidance to 50 mg, then 25mg. ~ feb 2010, stopped sertraline. ~ Apr 2010, resumed 25mg low dose (really bad business trip) Oct 2010, stopped sertraline Jan 2011 - another bad business trip "breaks" my sleep. current issues include insomnia, anxiety, GI distress, depression. Taking multivitamins, Vitamin D, fish oil, Chinese herbs, ~ 0.5mg melatonin in the evening. Going to therapy and acupuncture once a week. Link to comment
Nadia Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 Hi everyone... so sorry to have disappeared for so long. I'm just now reading some of your responses and I want to thank all of you for your support and kind words. I had a very rough couple of months after my dad died. Lots of stress at work coupled with even more stress at home. Lots of having to deal with my dad's debts and all sorts of bureaucratic stuff like the power company wanting thousands of dollars in back payment since they've been giving us estimated readings for two years (long story), trying to sell some stuff, trying to figure out stuff for my mom. I somehow managed to make it one day to the next though not much has really been solved... just plowing ahead and doing whatever possible each day. It's kind of a one step forward, two steps back situation. Then I went away for an incredibly wonderful vacation. It was something I had planned before my dad died, scheduled at the end of my current job. I had already bought the ticket and everything. I almost cancelled because I was afraid to leave my mom on her own and because my job didn't actually end when it was supposed to. But then I realized I was really at the end of my rope and in dire need of a break. So I arranged for my mom to visit my sister and I went to see friends far away and it could not have been better. I was able to process a tiny bit of my grief (which I have not really had the space to do), but most of all, rest. The most incredible part is that I was able to sleep, and for two weeks. my anxiety vanished. For about a week I was sleeping like 9 hours a night and then taking two hour naps in the afternoon. I felt exhausted, like I was coming down with something, but it felt GREAT. And then I started to really enjoy myself. Biking, swimming, lying in the sun, being surrounded by positive friends... it was like I was transported to another life where I was the old me again. During this time I didn't take ANY of my supplements (magnesium, fish oils, vit. B-12, etc.) and I ate tons of chocolate, had caffeine, ate lots of carbs, etc. I was gone for three weeks, and the last week I started having some anxiety again, but was still feeling fairly positive. Then I got back home and it all slammed down hard on me again. I think I'm in the depression and anger stages in the grieving process... Some anxiety, too, but better than before I left on vacation (still, it is so discouraging after having been free of it for a couple of weeks... you really get used to feeling good fast!) I was really berating myself for not being able to be happy (everyone says, you have everything you need in life to be happy, just be happy!), then I realized, you know what? I AM dealing with a pretty big load. I had struggles of my own and then my father died. A heartbreaking even in itself, but also one that means my freedom has been severely limited. I tell myself I wasn't going to do anything to change my life anyway, that now this is just my latest excuse, but to be fair to myself, this IS really a huge thing. I'm terrified about everything I have to do, how to help my mom make the right decisions, what we are to make of ourselves, etc. Yes, of course I could just walk away and leave her, but I wouldn't. She's my mom. So, anyway, I've been feeling really tired and really depressed, but I'm still fighting, as much as I can. At the same time I'm trying to cut myself some slack. I wonder about the two weeks I was well and when the anxiety started again. It coincided with the latter half of my menstrual cycle, and I still think that I'm having hormone issues no matter what the doctor says. My cycles are totally weird now. One month 25 days, another 29, another 34. I feel so tired, if someone told me I had some horrible degenerative disease it would make so much sense. But maybe it's all psychosomatic. Why else could I be so OK for two weeks? Of course, it's easy to be OK when you're away from your regular life and all the stresses. I did notice toward the end, when I started feeling anxiety again, that it would grip onto whatever it could. For example, I'd get stressed about which friend I should hang out with, or not having bought any souvenirs, or knowing my vacation was coming to an end. On the positive side, I wrote in my journal on my birthday, and read what I wrote last year on my birthday, and it's amazing how much better I am now than I was a year ago. I'm clinging onto that. I have a more clear sense of self than I did, I only get dizzy occasionally, I sleep at least four to six hours... and generally less weird. Or maybe I'm just used to feeling weird, heh heh. In any case, there's nothing to do but go forward... I really hope to be able to post on here sometime that I'm totally out of the woods. I DO think that I'm almost out as far as the discontinuation side effects go. Although it's clear my nervous system is still pretty sensitive and can be set off in a negative direction easily. Maybe that's something that's going to stick around for good, though I sure hope not! '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus tezza Posted July 31, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted July 31, 2012 Hi Nadia, so nice to have you back, we've missed you. It's great that you were able to get a break and enjoy yourself for a couple of weeks. I'm just sorry it didn't continue to improve but I'm gonna pray and believe that you are on the mend, after all, you do see improvement from last year. Let's hope for the best, you deserve it. I'm sending healing energy and lots of love your way, and BIG hugs! Tezza http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1644-tezza-risperdal-withdrawal/ Seroquel and Mirtazipine Link to comment
Administrator Karma Posted July 31, 2012 Administrator Share Posted July 31, 2012 So happy you checked in with us Nadia. I was delighted to hear that you had a great vacation - you deserved it. Sending you healing energy, love and light Karma 2007 @ 375 mg Effexor - 11/29/2011 - 43.75 mg Effexor (regular) & .625 mg Xanax 200 mg Gabapentin 2/27/21 - 194.5 mg, 5/28/21 - 183 mg, 8/2/21 - 170 mg, 11/28/21 - 150 mg, 4/19/22 - 122 mg; 8//7/22 - 100 mg; 12/17 - 75mg; 8/17 - 45 mg; 10/16 40 mg Xanax taper: 3/11/12 - 0.9375 mg, 3/25/12 - 0.875 mg, 4/6/12 - 0.8125 mg, 4/18/12 - 0.75 ; 10/16 40mg; 1/16 0.6875 mg; at some point 0.625 mg Effexor taper: 1/29/12 - 40.625 mg, 4/29/12 - 39.875 mg, 5/11/12 - Switched to liquid Effexor, 5/25/12 - 38 mg, 7/6/12 - 35 mg, 8/17/12 - 32 mg, 9/14/12 - 30 mg, 10/19/12 - 28 mg, 11/9/12 - 26 mg, 11/30/12 - 24 mg, 01/14/13 - 22 mg. 02/25/13 - 20.8 mg, 03/18/13 - 19.2 mg, 4/15/13 - 17.6 mg, 8/10/13 - 16.4 mg, 9/7/13 - 15.2 mg, 10/19/13 - 14 mg, 1/15/14 - 13.2 mg, 3/1/2014 - 12.6 mg, 5/4/14 - 12 mg, 8/1/14 - 11.4 mg, 8/29/14 - 10.8 mg; 10/14/14 - 10.2 mg; 12/15/14 - 10 mg, 1/11/15 - 9.5 mg, 2/8/15 - 9 mg, 3/21/15 - 8.5 mg, 5/1/15 - 8 mg, 6/9/15 - 7.5 mg, 7/8/15 - 7 mg, 8/22/15 - 6.5 mg, 10/4/15 - 6 mg; 1/1/16 - 5.6 mg; 2/6/16 - 5.2 mg; 4/9 - 4.8 mg; 7/7 4.5 mg; 10/7 4.25 mg; 11/4 4.0 mg; 11/25 3.8 mg; 4/24 3.6 mg; 5/27 3.4 mg; 7/8 3.2 mg ... 10/18 2.8 mg; 1/18 2.6 mg; 4/7 2.4 mg; 5/26 2.15mg; 8/18 1.85 mg; 10/7 1.7 mg; 12/1 1.45 mg; 3/2 1.2 mg; 5/4 0.90 mg; 6/1 0.80 mg; 6/22 0.65 mg; 08/03 0.50 mg, 08/10 0.45 mg, 10/05 0.325 mg, 11/23 0.2 mg, 12/14 0.15 mg, 12/21 0.125 mg, 02/28 0.03125 mg, 2/15 0.015625 mg, 2/29/20 0.00 mg - OFF Effexor I am not a medical professional - this is not medical advice. My suggestions are based on personal experience, reading, observation and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Hi Nadia! So good to hear from you! Your vacation sounds wonderful. Glad you were able to enjoy. The statement from person who said "you have everything ... just be happy".... Pffft!! Those statement show people's insensitivity and ignorance, that they know exactly what makes you happy or content is the same as what makes them happy. It does sound like your cycles are involved. My PMS got much longer as I got older, which I understand is normal. My doc said that PMS starts to last half the month as we get toward peri-m and menopause. You are a wonderful light, Nadia! Thanks for the update. You are dealing with alot. Did you feel us all say. "Look, Nadia's here!!"? Sending love. B Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Nadia Posted July 31, 2012 Author Share Posted July 31, 2012 Thanks, guys! I hope you have been seeing progress! I guess the frustrating part of this is how it's not linear... one minute you think you're out of the woods and then BAM, you have a setback. Today I have the flulike feeling and the weird back muscle aches. The only thing that kind of helps is stretching. I really wonder if this is just psychosomatic... but I also had muscle stiffness and pain and tiredness when I was on vacation. The difference was my mood was so much better and I had no anxiety. I've started taking the ginseng again and I do think it helps a bit (I didn't take it at all while I was away, but I also didn't take it for three weeks before my vacation... there doesn't seem to be any relation with the anxiety. It does seem to help my depression, though. I'm thinking of taking vitex or maca as well... apparently they can help stabilize your hormones or help you through hormonal changes. I'll report back if I have any success! I wish I could do some serious analysis of my notes to figure out patterns. One thing I did notice is that every time I've had a window of feeling well I've been out of town AND every time my menstrual cycle has been longer (in the 32 to 34 day range. I wonder if there is a relation between those two. I do live in a very high altitude, and sometimes wonder if that contributes to my symptoms. Sometimes I think maybe I shouldn't write anything down, maybe monitoring what I'm going through makes it worse or makes symptoms stick around. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
alexjuice Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Hey Nadia, Glad to see you updating your thread. I've been wondering how you were doing. I'm sorry to hear about your dad. It's a challenge, putting it mildly, to live life w/ little way of predicting symptoms from hour to hour, day to day. It's horrible, even worse, because my mind plays tricks on me. When I am feeling ok, I start to believe I've reached the pinnacle, permanent okay ness. And I get excited and ready to move on with life. Then shortly thereafter, I fall back. Sometimes I know what triggered the "relapse" sometimes it seems just the random nature of the recovery. But, the worst part, is I now feel like the badness is permanent, that I'll never be better. It's very difficult to live like this. Obviously, as you know, it's a huge challenge to keep perspective and an attitude that fosters movement towards the healthy. It's so hard for me to even care when Im in the pit of misery. Also, I have a take on the journalist. I think it's a good idea to keep track of how you are feeling, symptoms, activities, foods, supplements, sleep, etc. I haven't always done the best job of this and I wish I had better records. Maybe on many good days I have eaten a particular food or spent more time speaking with friends than I typically do? That's something I try to do. Alex "Well my ship's been split to splinters and it's sinking fast I'm drowning in the poison, got no future, got no past But my heart is not weary, it's light and it's free I've got nothing but affection for all those who sailed with me. Everybody's moving, if they ain't already there Everybody's got to move somewhere Stick with me baby, stick with me anyhow Things should start to get interesting right about now." - Zimmerman Link to comment
ajay Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Hi Nadia! I'm so happy to hear you had a wonderful vacation, and were able to catch up on some rest! I know it's incredibly frustrating how quickly that feeling goes away. Maybe it's a window to how things can be, and may be again in the future. If nothing else, it's a reminder that the "old you" is still in there and hanging on. I understand your concern about monitoring everything. I stopped tracking my sleep (or lack thereof) because it got so depressing to actually see how little sleep I was getting. Still, it is very helpful to have a record if you can find patterns. For some reason, days 2-3 of my cycle are just awful, and knowing that ahead of time helps me keep it in perspective so I don't fall into The Pit of Despair. You've got a lot on your plate and you're handling it well (probably better than you think). Do give yourself *plenty* of slack. History is approximate; I didn't track my dosages. 1995 - started zoloft/sertraline for depression 1995-2008 - sertraline ranged from 100-200mg, may have gone as high as 250mg 2006 - 2009 - added welbutrin/budeprion SR, 150 mg sometime in 2009-2010 - stopped budeprion c/t sometime around 2009-2010, Tapered down sertraline w/o guidance to 50 mg, then 25mg. ~ feb 2010, stopped sertraline. ~ Apr 2010, resumed 25mg low dose (really bad business trip) Oct 2010, stopped sertraline Jan 2011 - another bad business trip "breaks" my sleep. current issues include insomnia, anxiety, GI distress, depression. Taking multivitamins, Vitamin D, fish oil, Chinese herbs, ~ 0.5mg melatonin in the evening. Going to therapy and acupuncture once a week. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus tezza Posted August 1, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted August 1, 2012 Nadia, Thank you for trying to comfort me yesterday. You are a special person and I know you've suffered a lot recently. I'm sorry I was so scared, I was so afraid I had made a huge, unfixable mistake. I must admit I'm still a little scared but Alto said I will get stable again. The shakiness is what's scaring me the most right now. I just wanted you to know how much it meant to me that you replied to me when I really needed it. Thank you so much! Big hugs and love you! Love, Tezza http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1644-tezza-risperdal-withdrawal/ Seroquel and Mirtazipine Link to comment
Nadia Posted August 13, 2012 Author Share Posted August 13, 2012 It's a challenge, putting it mildly, to live life w/ little way of predicting symptoms from hour to hour, day to day. It's horrible, even worse, because my mind plays tricks on me. When I am feeling ok, I start to believe I've reached the pinnacle, permanent okay ness. And I get excited and ready to move on with life. Then shortly thereafter, I fall back. Sometimes I know what triggered the "relapse" sometimes it seems just the random nature of the recovery. But, the worst part, is I now feel like the badness is permanent, that I'll never be better. [...] Also, I have a take on the journalist. I think it's a good idea to keep track of how you are feeling, symptoms, activities, foods, supplements, sleep, etc. I haven't always done the best job of this and I wish I had better records. Maybe on many good days I have eaten a particular food or spent more time speaking with friends than I typically do? That's something I try to do. Great way to put it, Alex! I guess I have a sneaking suspicion all the time that I'm somehow creating my bad symptoms, even when I don't have any control over them. And it's so disappointing to feel so normal for a couple of weeks, and then have it taken away. But Ajay is right, I have to stop seeing it as a cruel taunt, and think of it as a good sign that somewhere inside me there is still a me that can enjoy life, sleep, and want to live. Right now I am fighting back the pit of despair, and feel so much like throwing in the towel, because I don't know how to reach that state of OKness in any realistic way. I think this is the closest I've been to really just giving up, even if it meant really hurting my mother (for some reason, I don't worry as much about boyfriend and friends). I know that is just digging my heels in, but I've got that horrible combo of anxiety and depression that makes it hard to have any desire to do anything. Every moment what I most wish for is desire and willpower. But my mind seems to be stuck in denial of the situation I'm in. My mom, on the other hand, is doing very well, considering her situation. She says it finally sunk in for her on an emotional level that my dad's death is something irrevocable and she just has to go on. She gets out of bed even if she didn't get sleep, she's started to organize drawers, she goes out with friends. I spend my time thinking of escape, not wanting to deal with work, or with all the things that need to be done in my dad's absence. Everything weighs on me terribly and it all seems like dreadful work with nothing to look forward to. I hate my life here, but I have no gumption to change it. The small moments of push forward that I muster seem to fail. Then sometimes I think my life here would not be so bad, if I would just own it. It is clear that psychological issues are affecting my progress. At the same time, I can look back and it can seem like I've never been happy in life, that there really is no hope for me, on or off drugs. I guess the main difference between me now and me a few years ago is lack of desire to do anything. I feel like I could put up with all the crap life seems to be 90% composed of if there was at least something to make it worthwhile, something to give it meaning. I am really divided on the journaling as I think concentrating on my symptoms can exacerbate them. I have an issue with control... I realized this when I was on vacation. The moments I was OK I wasn't trying to control everything. I think I need to work more on letting go and accepting. I'm planning on reading The Happiness Trap to see if I can get some reinforcement. On Friday I woke up from very broken sleep (the kind where I'm only lightly sleeping and wake up every hour or two) with the burning in my veins feeling. I thought: oh no, I'm taking a turn for the worse, I need to do something about this. (This was probably brought on my stress and strong emotion... anger in particular.) I planned to go away for the weekend. However, preparation for leaving ended up being even more stressful for me (car accident with confrontation, among other setbacks). I stayed home, knowing it was just random, but feeling "punished" for my attempt). Next day, I decided to try a different tactic. Magnesium bath and I made a project of making blackout curtains for my room, which I'd meant to do forever. It was a good distraction and I felt a small iota of accomplishment, which is amazing because mostly I feel like no matter how much I do I feel no sense of accomplishment (there is such a long list of things to do to get my life in order that reasonable amounts of daily progress only make me feel despair as I feel no closer to the goal). That night I slept slightly better, in that I got 3 continuous hours of sleep and then was able to fall asleep again for another couple of hours, and then I stayed in bed resting. But all yesterday I felt awful. I felt depersonalization and derealization for the first time in a long time. That feeling where everything seems coated in horribleness and I have no sense of self, and really start to doubt my sanity (today though, I'm just back to regular dread and doom). Last night I didn't take a magnesium bath. Totally broken sleep again, waking up every few minutes or hours. The blackout curtains make the room more pleasant to be in, but they don't seem to help at all with the waking. I start wanting to go over my notes, find some kind of pattern, some "answer", but if there is one in them, it is obscure and uninterpretable. That is why I think I should stop, or at least take lighter notes. At the same time, I wish I had written while I was well, so I could see what made me well. But I'm pretty sure the answer to feeling better is getting out of my head and just doing things. Sometimes the journaling or writing on this site IS the doing something, and it can make me feel some measure of control. But maybe it's counterproductive in the end? OK, let me put it another way... if our amygdala is out of whack, sensing danger where there isn't any, and that is why we are in a hyperalert stage that causes us to malfunction... it seems like consciously focussing on what is "wrong" with us is going to feed the amygdala's sense of danger. It seems like a lot of techniques involve distraction (EFT, for example) and refocus. I think maybe one of the reasons I was better when I was away was because I was staying as a guest in people's houses and had to pretend to be OK or functional... and go with someone else's flow. Of course, there was also no work or life stress, and I was staying with happy, positive people who enjoy life. Oh, I don't know. And I'm sorry for being so long-winded. Something is broken in me. I have and don't have control over it. I'm like a caged animal, hurting myself in an attempt to escape, but feeling like there is only a larger cage outside of the smaller one I can see now. I don't know if I should do something radical to break out. I don't know if I am unwell because I'm doing something wrong, because I'm attempting to live a life that I know does not make me happy, or if this life does not make me happy because I am not well. I'm afraid to make radical changes when I'm not well. I'm afraid that I can only get well if I make a radical change. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted August 13, 2012 Administrator Share Posted August 13, 2012 I think you're right, Nadia. The hyperalert condition seems to amplify "bad" feelings. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Hey Nadia. I hope you're doing ok. Just wanted to drop in and tell you im thinking about you. B Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 6, 2012 Author Share Posted October 6, 2012 Thanks, Barb! I'm doing... weird. I think it might be the change of season, and that I've made same quick changes in my daily routine that require me to leave the house much more, but I'm flooded with sensations. It reminds me of what it was like when I was a kid, and everything was just so charged. Smells, sensations, are just so strong. Being next to the dishwasher a while ago, the smell and feel of the steam as it dried the dishes just took me back to what seemed like a congregate of every experience of that I've ever had. Childhood, especially. Things feel foreign and yet familiar. This is way different from the DP/DR I got last year. It doesn't involve dread or the limbo feeling, only the "Sunday feeling" (perhaps I invoked it because I was talking about it in another thread). I feel as if my whole world was replaced with a different universe that is exactly like it but feels entirely different. And maybe it's all just the weather! Even on ADs, I always had a strong reaction to the arrival of fall. I'm taking some art classes and doing new things, so that could be part of it, too. I'm also exhausted from the extra (or different) activity, and barraged by random memories. My sleep has been bad, and anxiety has been moderate. Depression, bitterness, and negativity have improved, but I fluctuate between being so exhausted I can't function and being so wired that I can't rest. This is better than where I was, but I'm looking for something familiar at the same time. I'm very, very tense. But I'm just going ahead. I plan on majorly reducing work for the next three months. I'm hoping I can get my stress levels down. But right now I'm stressing about the most random things, not just work anymore. It just feels like there is a ton of activity going on in my head and nervous system. Is this what I was like before ADs? If so, I can understand why I took them, just wanting things to quiet down. I thought for the first time that I don't want to go back to how I was before ADs anymore (I now vividly remember how tortured I was most of the time). I don't want to get better, I want to get "super better" (someone posted about superbetter on here). Another theory of what has happened to my brain: I have become completely intolerant to stress. The problem is not that I have a stress response sometimes, which is normal, but that once it turns on it stays on and takes way longer than normal to turn off. Any small setback can send me in the wrong direction for months. I'm hoping my recovery times are improving, but I'm not sure. Can't think clearly now. Sometimes I think I'm not really getting better, that maybe I'm getting worse. But, like I said, I'm weird now. Maybe I'm overdoing my activities. Or maybe this is another, new step in the recovery process. Hope you're doing OK, Barb... reach for the light! 1 '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Nadia, You capture the weird feelings and sensations perfectly with your words. The "different universe that is exactly like it but FEELS entirely different" especially. That is the most disturbing aspect. About the season change... the SOUND of football on TV at the start of the season sends me to a dark place. Similarly, hearing the 'crack of the bat' in the spring immediately lifts me up in a nostalgic way (although I have no history with either sport). It's visceral, the reaction happens before I have a chance to think about it. Thanks for sharing your experiences, Nadia. Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 10, 2012 Author Share Posted October 10, 2012 Oh, I totally understand about the sports sounds! Well, I'm back to where I was before the universe was replaced. I guess it's because the weather change and new activities became more familiar, but back are the bitterness, lack of finding any sense in living, etc. It could be that I had higher anxiety this morning and I'm just so tired. Or it could be my menstrual cycle. On a positive note, I've had three nights in a row of sleeping about 6 hours straight. Well, last night I woke momentarily because I was too hot, but I kicked off the covers and fell right back asleep. I just have to keep going. Thinking of getting bloodwork done again since it's been over a year. My mom is pushing me to do it, since she can't understand how I sleep worse and have less energy than she does at 70. Sometimes I must admit I think maybe I have some crazy degenerative illness... Monday and Tuesday were extremely busy... I might be overdoing it with the activity. I just realized that even though I felt I was doing a lot the past year, working mostly from home really involved much lower levels of physical exertion. I'm feeling frustrated and scared about not being well. Wondering again if it's all in my head, wondering if there is a specific thing that I'm not doing that could make me well. It's really a reflection of the frustration I feel from friends and family, who keep pushing me to go to therapy and see more doctors. Not sure if I'm being stubborn by trying to treat this with moderate exercise, nutrition, and art classes! It's hard to ask for breaks when I'm not OK, but have to defend not going to more doctors. I think my mom is at wit's end. I just don't even want to tell her anymore when I'm not well. But as soon as she sees I am OK she asks for stuff that I can't always handle at the moment because my stability is so fragile. Reducing my stress level is hard under these circumstances. Anyway... I'm just, again, going to try to accept where I am and put one foot in front of the other. I will do my best not to engage negative thoughts, and to stick to a routine no matter how tired I am. Including being gentle with myself. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus tezza Posted October 10, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 10, 2012 Hi Nadia, From time to time, I go back and re-read intros because I can't remember all. I just looked over your first pages again. I got anxiety reading all you've been through. I'm so sorry for your suffering, it makes me sad. I remembered that you were wanting to get pregnant and I remembered the intro while I was reading it again. You've been through a lot and I sincerely hope you get past all this real soon. Hugs, Tezza http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1644-tezza-risperdal-withdrawal/ Seroquel and Mirtazipine Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 Thank you for your kind words, Tezza! It means a lot... '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 Sooo... I just got my period. That explains the steps backward. Also, had some things happen that really stressed me out. Trying just to plow ahead. Something in me is yelling DANGER. I used to be able to trust my instincts. I honestly can't say if this is real or not. It's not a physical danger warning I feel. It just feels like I should leave, now, get out, this place is bad for you. Like slowly my soul is being sucked out. I'm fighting it, but I'm tired of always just surviving. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Nadia, I really think you're my twin separated at birth. I KNOW that visceral feeling of DANGER...RUN! Just posted similar message last week. Is is related to the fight or flight response, cortisol, perhaps? Thank you for putting these feelings into words. B Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 Hi Barb... I came on here to confess destructive behaviour, and wanting to throw in the towel. I know I should keep a positive attitide, but some days I just can't muster one. Facebook makes it even more difficult, as do friends' advice (never give up! everything has a silver lining! etc.) I was trying to reduce my stress levels, to take some time for myself, taking some classes and working on some personal projects to see if it helps me heal from depression and anxiety. But of course, there is still everyday crap that creeps in. One of my biggest stressors is my relationship to my mom and to all the things my dad left behind when he died. My dad did everything, and my mom is now barely learning to do things like balance a checkbook and send computer files, scan and print documents, etc. She is a very strong, impulsive woman, exactly the opposite of me in many ways, and we butt heads about how things should be done. And in our conjunct inexperience we mess up. And **** happens in life, anyway. And there are the very real stressors of how we're going to manage my mom's finances for the rest of her days. (How am I even going to manage my own? I'm in a field and in a country where "retirement" is unheard of.) It looks like I'm nt going to have kids, I really shouldn't if I can't even handle taking care of my mom. Even though she confesses that she often doesn't sleep at night with worry, my mother thinks I'm being ridiculous and hysterical, this without me even saying anything, just from the exhausted and stressed look on my face. It is true that everything is looming larger than life. I feel incapable of dealing with the most trivial things, nevermind the ones that ARE big! I feel a really deep fear, a fear that obviously goes beyond the situation at hand... the little stuff in my head becomes representative of the big stuff. I hate having my mother think I'm weak, she does anyway, but I wish someone would just hug me and tell me things are going to be OK. I feel so small and childish about it. Not a whole lot of help from my boyfriend, either, as he's wrapped up in work and is a loner of sorts and kind of just does his own thing. He doesn't have a whole lot of time, I know, and he does offer moral support... but sometimes I wish he would help me take control of this huge ship we're on, or at least offer to be a problem solver. Since it's my family, not his, I guess he feels it's not his realm. I got so many responsibilities dumped on my lap when my dad died, and I feel so pressured to deal with them as well as my dad did. Even before he died I felt I had more than I could handle, so some days I just feel so overwhelmed. My mom thinks I'm being ridiculous, but of course she is scared as well and sometimes breaks into tears. We alternate our fears, or sometimes they compound. We go back and forth between clashing and then working together in a more effective way. The fact our personalities are so different makes it difficult. In between the exhuastion of leaving the house for classes, which in all is a good experience that helps with the depression and working on wanting to live, and the anxiety from having to deal with responsibility, mostly inherited stuff from my dad dying, and hormonal ups and downs with my period, the past couple of days I feel I have folded over. Something happened the day before yesterday that was really stressful to me... some work we had done on the house turned out terrible. The original problem was not solved and it cost a lot of money and damaged some other stuff. And left a mess in a wall that was incorrectly patched and now I have to find someone to fix it. I KNOW THESE ARE EVERY DAY LIFE THNGS! But they sparked my anxiety in a major may. They are tied in for me to feeling like my mom's house is going to go down the drain now that my dad isn't here. That it's all on my shoulders to deal with it, because my mom is so impulsive and doesn't think things through... that I promised my dad when he was dying that I would take care of things, and I'm failing at it. In the end my mom says she knows she can't count on me in this weakened state. In any case, all this to say that in the depth of my anxiety the other night, I took half a lorazepam. And this morning another half. They seem to kind of drug me but don't get at the source of the anxiety and will only probably make things worse later. My mom encouraged me to take it, I shouldn't have, though! I should know better. I took it out of fear that I had a really tough day the next day of dealing with the house chaos and knew I wasn't going to sleep a wink. At least the 1mg of lorazepam I took let me sleep 3 1/2 hours. I was exhausted all day, but dealing, but then I came home from classes and this one thing was repaired so poorly it needs to be completely redone. I need to think of this as a normal person would... find a capable person to do it, I know it's going to cost money we don't have. Stand there while they do it and correct, insist on the job being done right. How my dad did it. But I'm feeling weak in the knees and parazlyzed with fear. So I took the other 1mg of lorazepam. It helped me doze off a little with my bad menstrual cramps, but it has resolved nothing. I need to kick myself in the butt and get in action and just keep going, but here I am whining and being wimpy and digging in my heels. Wanting the impossible, wanting not to have this extra adult load dumped on me, wanting to escape to a life where I can find happiness for myself. There is no use! I know I have to accept, I know I have to go on and not take shortcuts that will be more harmful in the end, like the lorazepam. I shouldn't beat myself up about this either, but.... argh. Sorry, I had to vent with people who possibly can relate to what I'm going through. If I had cancer or some non-invisible disease maybe I'd get more slack from the outside. But anxiety and depression are just seen as weaknesses. And my mom, every time she sees me breaking apart, wants to take me to a doctor and says it's not normal that I'm not well yet. My solution is mostly to just fake being OK, but sometimes I get so bad that is not possible. These are things that would be a challenge for me anyway... Iv'e always been really sensitive and had self-esteem issues, but with the crippling anxiety and lack of sleep, it's just so much worse! How to practice the right combination of auto-compassion and kicking myself in the but to keep going? Thanks for reading my stupid venting... I hope to get back on track soon! '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 I just read this quote on one of GiaK's Beyond Meds pages (from a post by Toni Berhard). [Check out the whole Beyond Meds website if you haven't already!] Healthy people tend to assume it’s all or nothing: we’re either sick or we’re not; we’re either in pain or we’re not. And so, if they see us doing anything “normal,” they assume we’re 100% well. This has happened to me many times. Someone will see me at an espresso place with a friend and assume I’ve recovered, unaware that I came from the bed and will collapse on it after the visit. People aren’t deliberately being insensitive. They just don’t know. This is a dynamic that happens with me with my mom. Granted, I'm not severly physically ill. I consider myself to be farily well-functioning and am deeply grateful for that. But I can't handle stress and physical exercise even as well as my 70 year old mom, and I have to really follow a routine and know when to push and when to be gentle to guide myself to wellness. What happens often, though, is that since I'm pretty smiley and bubbly and eager to help as soon as I'm feeling even somewhat OK (though even as I write this I confess sometimes I think I'm a lazy wimp), my boyfriend or mom think, oh, she's fine now, and start pressing for me to do things that often just the THOUGHT of sends me right back to shaking with anxiety and days of ruined sleep. Sometimes the triggers are so subtle my mom thinks it's ridiculous. For example, I'll have gone to walk, ate well, gone to classes or done work, and come home exhausted, the "coming down with the flu" feeling, and my mom sees I've been really active, so she thinks, "she's fine now"... and starts telling me about the things that need to be done or the stressors that are going on, or asking me to help her scan and send some pages or compose an email, and I tell her, oh, not now, I'm really, really at the end of my rope. And then comes the whole "oh, you're always at the end of your rope", or "I'm just commenting on normal stuff, how could this possibly stress you out?" I don't even know my own limits sometimes, so how can I possibly expect her to know them? These are really hard things to navigate. I do end up feeling that I'm a wimp. For my mom it's always all or nothing, too. If you are this fragile, something is terribly wrong, she says, and you need to go to the doctor. I think I'm going to go get another checkup to satisfy her. Also, it's been over a year since I had blood work, and it will set our minds to rest to make sure there are no new developments . Sometimes I wish I could just go somewhere alone and really isolate. I want to find the strength to find a path to being well and happy. I don't want to coddle myself, but I want to be gentle with myself as well, and respect my limitations even if they seem ridiculous to others. Even before all of this, I've always struggled between being too hard on myself and being too easy on myself. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Your butt MUST be black-n-blue with all the self a** kicking you're doing. Is it safe to assume your mom was NOT on mind and body-altering drugs for over a decade as you were..? When my dad visited in August, he said "your mother and I were out dancing every weekend at your age". Apples and oranges. We (on forum) took drugs that battered our bodies in ways that we're not fully aware of yet. There is no baseline for comparison, even a 70-year old. You are singlehandedly navigating an oceanliner through a brutal storm while taking care of others and doing an amazing job with a boatload of stuff thrown at you. [i like the nautical theme of your earlier post ] You're extremely tough on yourself, my friend. Try to lean more toward the self-compassion. Take care of "Little Nadia". And don't beat yourself up for an occasional lorazepam. {{{HUGS}}} Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
spectio Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Nadia, just read your two latest posts and I just want to put my arms around you and hug you! Barb is right. You really are TOO hard on yourself. But I really do know EXACTLY what you're talking about. I find myself traveling the same stormy sea with the same infirmities. One of my oars is gone, Ive got one eye, and every wave is a sea monster. I know how hard you're trying but maybe just allow yourself to be Nadia. I really think you should do something JUST FOR YOU! It sounds like your mom would be ok for a few days, Nadia. Don't you have a friend or even just a quiet place you've always wanted to go. I think a week in a quiet place would allow you to see how things are without the added stress of carrying the load. Just for a few days, Nadia. I'm sure everything you're feeling is still this monster. I know you. You're tough and youre strong. Isn't there any other family member that can help with your moms household stuff. Does your mom or dad have brothers. I feel your pain, kiddo. CYBERHUGGS!!!! I started withdrawing off remeron in August of 2009, with the help of a holistic physician.The reason for the withdrawal was a year or two of off and on nausea, deterioration in my thinking, and more depression. It took me a full year to work from 135 mg down to 45mg. At that point, more drops were causing more depression. Unfortuately, the nervousness that I was also feeling for the last year continued with the 45 mg. Thirty one days ago, I stopped the remeron. I am still feeling the nervousness every day and the last week, I am feeling what I think is depression but not sure. In bed in the morning, I'm already dreading another day feeling this way. I am intensely unsure of myself and find it very hard to do anything. I was a practicing veterinarian for 29 years until I found I could not practice anymore. First of all I couldn't think, or remember, and I had absolutely no confidence in anything I did. These were things I did with relative ease for twenty+ years. So, this feeling of no confidence has been during the time I was on the AD(the last 2 years) and today. I take no other medication other than my blood pressure meds. I tried supplements with my holistic dr. but they seemed to make the intense nervousness even more intense. Anyway, I truly feel stuck. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 RE: Facebook - agree! I have to limit my exposure and feel more comfortable interacting with groups of people I don't know well. Interactions with close or longtime friends inevitably spurs comparisons and jealousy (real or imagined). Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus tezza Posted October 12, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 12, 2012 Nadia, I don't think you are the least bit weak. You are doing an amazing job taking care of everything the way you are. You have had A LOT dumped right into your lap all at once and you're handling it as well as anyone could possibly do. Don't feel bad for taking the lorazepam, I've taken an extra .5 of Xanax during the day sometimes, lately. I'm just careful not to allow myself to do it so often that it will hurt me. Days like today, it was really hard not to take half a Xanax, so don't beat yourself up. You are human, not Superwoman but you're a lot closer to being Superwoman than I. {{{hugs}}} http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1644-tezza-risperdal-withdrawal/ Seroquel and Mirtazipine Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 13, 2012 Author Share Posted October 13, 2012 Wow, thanks, guys... I was just getting ready to apologize for all the complaining... Feeling pretty weak still, I'll check in soon. Thank you for your words, it helps so much. Hugs to you, Barb, Spectio and Tezza. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 15, 2012 Author Share Posted October 15, 2012 Hi everyone, I'm going through a really rough patch, and I think taking the lorazepam was a real setback. I'm not really sure what is going on with me now. It feels new in some ways... that feeling I described of everything seeming so intense and yet unfamiliar, the flood of memories, etc.... in a lot of ways it is completely new and different to what was going on for me before. I don't know if it's just that I am starting new activities, because I've been away from home and actually felt better and more in touch with reality in those cases. Or maybe it's that going away, I EXPECT for things to be unfamiliar, so it doesn't affect me. I don't know. In any case, it seems there is a lot going on in my brain, tons of activity... and I hope it is a sign of healing. But when I got my period, I hit a really rough spot. It was coupled with some stress regarding stuff I had to deal with... stuff that normally would have made me angry or nervous, but which I could have handled when I was on ADs or BEFORE ever taking them. It seems no matter how hard I try to reduce my stress, life just brings stuff up... we can't pretend to control our lives completely. The past few days I can't stop crying... I think I'm mourning my dad's death now more than ever. Like I can really feel the full extent of the pain. I suppose this has to be a good thing in the end. I think I was numb to the pain for a lot of the time before. In any case, I've committed to staying away from "quick fixes" like the lorazepam, which only destabilize me more in the end. I hardly slept last night, I felt dread again. But the patterns are changing. I feel worse in so many ways, like this is one of the roughest parts I've gone through since I quit, but it also feels different, and maybe that is a good sign. The thing is, reading up on the scientific articles (Harvey in particular) and other stories has me so worried that I'm damaged for good. I know the only path is acceptance, but I'm having a really tough time with that now. Harvey's assessment about the neuronal changes that occur with discontinuation make sense... I hope more people research this. At the same time, it's not like I'm going to "find a cure" by reading this stuff. It's really only making me more fearful. So I think I need to stop obsessing about the details of it, and try to think positive. I need to get out of the vicious cycle of worry that can only impede my progress. This is a physical thing, I'm sure of it, but of course, like with any illness, more than with any illness, psychological factors matter. Stress from outside, how I think about my life and myself. I think the only path I can take is healthy eating, exercise, meditation. AND NOT THINKING TOO MUCH ABOUT IT. I think the more I obsess about withdrawal, the less likely I am to heal. I have the find the right balance between taking care of myself with a routine and not overcontrolling every detail (for example, worrying about the effect of every little thing I eat or do). The times I've been better over the course of the past two years has been when I was thinking about all this the least. When I was among people I COULDN'T talk to about withdrawal. Getting to that point of "carefreeness" is not automatic. Right now, for example, I can't stay up late or watch violent things. I do have to control that to an extent... but slowly I can spiral out. It's so hard... it's like tricking your brain into relaxing. The harder you try the more you fail. It's a zen thing in the end. Not sure if I'm making sense... Anyway, all this is to say that I may stay away from the site for a little while. The support of all you caring people has been invaluable to me, and I want to be here to support you guys back. But I'm feeling at an all-time low in terms of energy and optimism, and I feel like I won't really help anyone out if I don't group together first. So I hope to gain back my strength, and then come back here with renewed energy to share. I don't know how I got here... if it's the fact that I'm nearing on two years and can't see the light, if it's that I expected to be better by now, or if I'm just tired of fighting. In any case, I hope you will forgive my absence. Know that I am thinking about all of you, that I wish the best for us. May we all be able to post in the success stories as soon as possible! '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 17, 2012 Author Share Posted October 17, 2012 So that didn't last... I'm too freaked out and miserable to stay off of here. I am looking for a sense of reality, groundedness. I don't know why but I feel almost as bad as I did at my worst point last year, although totally different at the same time. I'm even thinking about going back to the doctor, getting some blood work to rule out anything physical. This morning I was so freaked I couldn't get a grip, I just wanted someone to save me from my intense fear. I had gotten good at not listening to the anxiety, I thought. Maybe it just hadn't been this strong. Though my sleep is not as broken as it was last year. In some ways what I feel now is better... but in some ways it feels more real. Like my life truly is really horrible and there is absolutely no escape. Like I just don't have what it takes to be a functioning adult. Like happiness will never be possible for me. Maybe I'm just freaking out because this is a new kind of bad, not the bad I was used to. And I am hardly working, so I don't have that to anchor me. I feel extremely tired and dizzy, and nothing seems familiar. Even the unfamiliarity seems unfamiliar, if that makes any sense. Two things happened that seemed to make me worse... my period and some work done on my mom's house that was just a disaster (and which brings up a lot of anxiety for me... me having to take my dad's place). I'm hanging in there, trying to get on with the program. I think what is making it harder is that I don't feel the respite I did in the afternoon. I feel maybe 20% better at most. I am really frightened, and can't seem to convince myself that there is nothing to be scared about. This isn't the amped feeling anymore, or the adrenaline rush (though that is there in the am as well). I am scared about some real things, but disproportionately so. I'm struggling with really basic tasks. My mind is completely muddied, like I'm thinking through molasses. I'm getting another cold sore, which is really unusual for me to get them so frequently. When I got them a lot years ago, it was at most every six months or so. I haven't managed to work up the courage to make a doctor's appointment (and what doctor??), but I might do it so I can set my mind to rest about not having something besides withdrawal. Is this silly? I think about Alex, and Barb, and that person who had Lyme's. I think about how I had chronic mono... and actually, that seemed a breaking point in my life, when I went from being a pretty active person to struggling and having deeper and longer depressions. It seems after the mono I was only really OK for a few months in my senior year in college and then after I started Zoloft, and the times I started up on Zoloft again. No, it is more complicated than that, surely. I'm feeling very crazy. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
moonbow0202 Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Nadia, I am so grateful to have found this discussion board! When i'm reading posts, I frequently feel like I am reading something I could have written. I have burst into tears twice after reading posts because I relate so strongly to the person posting. I've panicked and went back on 75 mg of effexor a couple of times. I am lucky to have a therapist who has been very supportive of my efforts to get off psych meds. He frequently tells me I am succeeding at this. A lot of the time, I don't feel like I'm succeeding. As I read posts, I think about how brave and courageous we are. I guess that has to include me. I've read alot during the last week about tardive dysphoria, Persistent adverse neurological effects from SSRIs (PANES), and chronic brain impairment from psych drugs. Although this info is somewhat disheartening at least I have a better idea of what I'm dealing with. Besides, I already suspected a lot of what I learned this weekend. I really related to a lot of your recent posts but son't have the attention span to write more now. 15+ years on various ADs and combos. Spent 3 yrs tapering (off & on ) off 225mg Effexor venlafaxine) XR & Remeron (mirtazapine). Finished tapering Oct 2014. Link to comment
Barbarannamated Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Nadia, I wish I knew something helpful to say. I realize it's been awhile, but have you considered reinstating a microdose of Zoloft (or Wellbutrin?)? I'm on mobile and can't see your sig. If I knew what would help me at this point, which sounds very like where you are at, I would try. Love, Barb Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus areyouthere Posted October 18, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 18, 2012 Hi Nadia. It must be very frustrating to have to be going through what you are. I would be afraid too and we all know that can snowball. We also all know that some of the coping skills, self help strategies etc that we used to get through the bad spells might be of use when we fall back down. Actually, I know not of which I speak in as much as it relates to drugs because I am a newbie and just starting out. BUT. I also know that FOR ME just walking ( exercise) or doing a bit of yoga or pilates , and listening to my favorite music are mood boosters/ anxiety dampers. Right now I feel somewhat the same as you in the sense that I feel that my life, mood ( and I am ON drugs!) are out of my control and in a large part it is. But there are parts that I DO have control over and that is how I choose to respond. Can you think of any coping skills that helped you through the difficult parts of your taper that you can try again? Just a thought. Fall 1995 xanax, zoloft. switched to Serzone 1996- spring 2003serzone/ xanax/ lightbox. b]Fall 2003- Fall 2004? Lexapro 10 mg. Light box /4 mg. xanax.[/b] 2004 - Fall of 2009 10 mg Lex, 150 mg Wellbutrin XL % 4 mg xanax November 2009- Sept. 2011 10 mg lex., 300 Well. XL, 4 mg Xanax [/b Sept.2012- July 2012 20 mg Lex 300 Well. XL, 4 mg Xanax My mantra " go slow & with the flow " 3/2/13.. Began equal dosing 5 Xs /day xanax, while simultaneously incorporating a 2.5 % drop ( from 3.5 mg/day to 3.4 mg/day) 4/6/13 dropped from 300 mg. Wellbutrin XL to 150 mg. Difficult but DONE! Down to 3.3 mg xanax/ day / 6/10/13 3 mg xanax/day; 7/15/2013 2.88mg xanax/day. 10/ 1/2013...... 2.5 mg xanax… ( switched to tablets again) WOO HOO!!!!!! Holding here… cont. with Lexapro. 1/ 2/2014.. tapered to 18mg ( by weight) of a 26 mg ( by weight) pill of 20 mg tab. lexapro. goal is 13mg (by weight OR 10 mg by ingredient content) and STOPPED. Feeling very down with unbalanced, unpredictable WD symptoms. 1/2/2014- ??? Taking a brain-healing break from tapering anything after actively tapering something for 1.5 years. So… daily doses as of 2/2/2014: 18 mg by weight Lex, 150 mg Well. XL, 2.5 mg xanax, down from 26 mg by weight Lex., 300 mg well. XL, 4 mg xanax in August, 2012. I'll take it. 5/8/14 started equivalent dose liquid./ tabs. 5/13/14 1.5 % cut. Link to comment
Nadia Posted October 18, 2012 Author Share Posted October 18, 2012 Thank you for your responses! Areyouthere... you are totally right, I need to not panic and just start working on my skills... I walk every day, but I have been slacking on meditation and need to work more on just observing what in going on with me without engaging it. I feel silly since I've given this advice to others and then here I am finding it so difficult to implement again. I think this whole thing took me off guard for two reasons... 1. It is by far the worst I have felt since my worst crisis last year, and it is very disheartening as I had hoped to be better; HAD been so much better at points. 2. I feel in some ways different than before... I realized last night I was suffering from the strongest depersonalization and derealization, followed by intense dread, than I had since my worst point last year... but that it crept up on me slowly and in a disguised manner... so I was not able to distance from it. Also a lot more emotional... something has been untapped in me and I keep breaking into tears. I am getting more of a grip today... I feel again like I have fire burning in my veins, I feel strained, and an intense dread, but I am breathing through it. Not managing not to think through it, but catching myself at failing, which is a start. Trying to observe the intensely uncomfortable sensations and not push them away... maybe even embrace them. Well, that is what I aim for. It's taking everything I've got to find the strength. I know on the outside it seems like a ridiculous battle (Spectio described it so well)... but it seems so real to me. Moonbow, I wish I had a good therpist... I am glad you found us. I have tried going off ADs so many times, each time has been worse. Thank god you found this site while you are still tapering. I wish I had! I think things could have been much better for me if I had tapered. I am going theough a rough time now... but I have also glimpsed being well, and I want to take heart in that. Thanks for bringing up PANES... had not heard that term, though the paper seemed familiar... I find I have lots of holes in my memory so maybe I had read it and just don't remember. I think this is a very good term... better than discontinuation syndrome or withdrawal for us long term cases. Barb, I have actually thought of reinstating, but that would be Russian Roullette... i've been off all meds for 2 years, except for very occasional benzos and one day about 8 months after CTing that I took one sertraline and one bupropion. I got so agitated I didn't continue. I believe there is a possibility that I would stabilize if I tried reinstating, but I think what is happening to me now is evidence of neurological damage that would not be healed, but probably only covered up, if I went back on. Sometimes I wonder about Lamictal. '94-'08 On/off ADs. Mostly Zoloft & Wellbutrin, but also Prozac, Celexa, Effexor, etc.6/08 quit Z & W after tapering, awful anxiety 3 mos. later, reinstated.11/10 CTed. Severe anxiety 3 mos. later & @ 8 mos. much worse (set off by metronidazole). Anxiety, depression, anhedonia, DP, DR, dizziness, severe insomnia, high serum AM cortisol, flu-like feelings, muscle discomfort.9/11-9/12 Waves and windows of recovery.10/12 Awful relapse, DP/DR. Hydrocortisone?11/12 Improved fairly quickly even though relapse was one of worst waves ever. 1/13 Best I've ever felt. 3/13 A bit of a relapse... then faster and shorter waves and windows. 4/14 Have to watch out for triggers, but feel completely normal about 80% of the time. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus dalsaan Posted October 18, 2012 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 18, 2012 Nadia You'll get through this. You have got through hard times before. Bring out all your skills and strategies to dampen activation and lift your mood. When you go for a walk challenge yourself to really focus on the environment around you and get into a rythum of deep slow breathing. Search out nice things, look for flowers. Feel the sun. Etc Have a look at your diet. Is there anything activating that you could cut out like caffeine or sugar Allocate sometime to engage with your symptoms and then for the rest of the time think of ways to look outward and distract yourself I know this is all much easier said than done but these are things within your control. You can take some power in this 1 Please note - I am not a medical practitioner and I do not give medical advice. I offer an opinion based on my own experiences, reading and discussion with others.On Effexor for 2 months at the start of 2005. Had extreme insomnia as an adverse reaction. Changed to mirtazapine. Have been trying to get off since mid 2008 with numerous failures including CTs and slow (but not slow enough tapers)Have slow tapered at 10 per cent or less for years. I have liquid mirtazapine made at a compounding chemist. Was on 1.6 ml as at 19 March 2014. Dropped to 1.5 ml 7 June 2014. Dropped to 1.4 in about September. Dropped to 1.3 on 20 December 2014. Dropped to 1.2 in mid Jan 2015. Dropped to 1 ml in late Feb 2015. I think my old medication had run out of puff so I tried 1ml when I got the new stuff and it seems to be going ok. Sleep has been good over the last week (as of 13/3/15). Dropped to 1/2 ml 14/11/15 Fatigue still there as are memory and cognition problems. Sleep is patchy but liveable compared to what it has been in the past. DRUG FREE - as at 1st May 2017 >My intro post is here - http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2250-dalsaan Link to comment
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