Fp1984: ready to kick zoloft to the curb!

[Fp1984]

Hi,

Im new here. Im a 54 year old male. Ive been on zoloft for the past 20 years for GAD. ( doses from 25 to 150). I was fine for 15 years or so, and then started having some sleeping issues (REMBD) as a result of the zoloft. I decided to quit the zoloft. I tapered over the course of about 3 or 4 months with no problems.  Several months later, life circumstances led to my first bout of depression. I asked the doc if I could try wellbutrin because of the sleep problems with zoloft. He agreed - BAD IDEA!

 

I experienced extreme anxiety, panic attacks, and insomnia. The doc put me on Ativan. I soon reached tolerance and was having to increase my doses of Ativan. I knew this was a bad idea, even though my doc told me it was not addictive and I would not have withdrawals. I struggled to taper for close to a year before jumping.

 

I have now been off for 17+ months. My depression comes and goes. I am on 50 mg of zoloft and do not want to increase my dose to battle depression. I want to taper off and battle the depression naturally. As I said, I never had it before  I started taking zoloft 20 years ago for GAD. The depression has only occured in the last 3 years after the bridge to wellbutrin.

 

Am I a lost cause or do I have a chance to live life depression free?

Thanks,

Fp

[Gridley]

Welcome to SA, Fp1984.  Congratulations on being Ativan-free.  

 

You are by no means a lost cause.  You kicked the benzo, which bespeaks a strong will and a lot of resiliency.  We have many members diagnosed with depression who are drug-free and doing well. 

Before the advent of all these drugs, depression was regarding a self-limiting condition that resolved on its own.  We recommend non-drug coping skills to deal with what life throws at you (more about that later).

 

Regarding your Zoloft taper, we recommend tapering no more than 10% of your current dose every four weeks.

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

This link is specifically about tapering Zoloft, including how to get the small, non-standard doses you'll need for your 10% taper.

 

Tips for tapering off Zoloft (sertraline)

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and omega 3 (fish oil). Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system. 

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker 

 

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

 

Add in one at a time and at a low dose in case you do experience problems.

 

We recommend using non-drug skills to cope.  Take a look at the links in the following link and see which you think might be helpful to you.

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

This is your Introduction topic, where you can ask questions and connect with other members.  We're glad you found your way here.

 

 

 

 

[Fp1984]

Titled:  Will I be in constant misery?

 

Im just beginning my zoloft taper. Im starting at 50mg. Im scared that I will be in constant misery. Is this the case? Or will I see small improvements along the way? Im already mildly depressed and Im worried that if the depression becomes too deep I will have to reinstate. Im looking for some hope that this taper is possible without being in total hell for years. Any thoughts or encouragement would be appreciated? 

Thanks,

Fp

Edited April 9, 2020 by manymoretodays
merged from S and SC

[manymoretodays]

Hi Fp1984,

And welcome!  No, it's not going to be constant misery.  If you just go nice and slow, and then allow in the healing too, from that benzo taper.......It should get better, instead of worse.

That's my ten cents.

 

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[Fp1984]

I quit zoloft several years ago over the course of about 3 months (at the time, I thought this was a slow taper). I felt fine for about 3 months after my taper and then I was hit with terrible depression and had to reinstate. At the time, I thought, "Well, I must really need to be on an AD." Even though I had never had depression before. I started zoloft for generalized anxiety.

Now I realize the depression was more than likely a result of tapering much too fast.

My question is: Will a 10% taper diminish my risk of experiencing a crushing depression like I experienced with the 3 month taper? I would assume that a long, slow taper will allow the brain to heal and adjust along the way, theoretically resulting in less and milder symptoms than a quick taper or CT. Does this sound correct to you guys?

Thanks,

Fp

[Fp1984]

I quit zoloft several years ago over the course of about 3 months (at the time, I thought this was a slow taper). I felt fine for about 3 months after my taper and then I was hit with terrible depression and had to reinstate. At the time, I thought, "Well, I must really need to be on an AD." Even though I had never had depression before. I started zoloft for generalized anxiety.

Now I realize the depression was more than likely a result of tapering much too fast.

My question is: Will a 10% taper diminish my risk of experiencing a crushing depression like I experienced with the 3 month taper? I would assume that a long, slow taper will allow the brain to heal and adjust along the way, theoretically resulting in less and milder symptoms than a quick taper or CT. Does this sound correct to you guys?

Thanks,

Fp

 

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Fp.

 

2 hours ago, Fp1984 said:

Now I realize the depression was more than likely a result of tapering much too fast.

 

To answer your question about "rebound depression" -- yes, we believe that gradual tapering reduces the risk of withdrawal symptoms, one of which can be a sensation widely misdiagnosed and overmedicated as "rebound depression".

 

Since you went off Zoloft in 2017, your entire prescription cascade and all the adverse drug reactions may be due to misdiagnosed and mistreated withdrawal syndrome. We see this very frequently here.

 

In fact, there may not be any such thing as "rebound depression".

 

What does your "depression" feel like? Typically, post-acute withdrawal symptoms come in waves. This pattern can last for years.

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

[Fp1984]

When I quit in 2017, the depression just appeared rather quickly. I had no hope, no desire, nothing gave me any feeling of pleasure. I did not try to fight it. I was placed on wellbutrin, which caused anxiety and panic attacks. After that, I was placed on ativan and back on zoloft. I tapered ativan over a year and a half and have been off for 18 months. Im now starting my zoloft taper. I dont know if I can handle the crushing depression for an extended period of time. If it was temporary, or in waves, I think I could manage. I hope the long slow taper will ease the depression symptoms. As I said, I have never had depression until 2017, when I quit zoloft for the first time. I did experience it during my ativan taper, but I had many windows that allowed me to keep plugging along. Do most people experience waves and windows during their taper? I really dont know if I, my family, and my marriage could survive years of unrelenting depression while tapering and recovering. Thoughts?

Thanks,

Fp

[Altostrata]

54 minutes ago, Fp1984 said:

When I quit in 2017, the depression just appeared rather quickly.

 

Yes, that is consistent with withdrawal syndrome. Real "relapse" takes a much longer time to appear, and it does not occur in waves.

 

When you are tapering, if you do it right, you should not feel much in the way of withdrawal symptoms at all.

 

When you talk about "depression", do you mean "no hope, no desire, nothing gave me any feeling of pleasure"?

 

Emotional anesthesia can be both an adverse effect of psychiatric drugs and a withdrawal symptom. Is what you're feeling now emotional anesthesia?

[Fp1984]

At this time, Im not feeling any major depression. Mild depression at times, but nothing like when I quit in 2017, and nothing like the depression I felt when tapering ativan. Im actually in a pretty good state of mind. Im looking forward to starting my taper, but apprehensive at the same time. Thanks for your responses. It gives me a little confidence and hope heading into this.

Thanks,

Fp

[Fp1984]

Permanent Damage?

 

I've been on Sertraline for over 15 years. Have I done irreversible damage to my brain? I am doing a slow liquid micro taper, but  I am concerned that I will have PAWS and never get back to my original self. I originally started sertraline for Generalized Anxiety. Has anyone successfully got off after this many years of use?

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by ChessieCat
added Intro topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

Check out the success stories forum.

 

Success stories: Recovery from psychiatric drug withdrawal

[Fp1984]

I have been tapering Sertraline, using a daily liquid micro taper. I am down to 30 mg from 50mg. I actually updosed to 31mg and have been holding here for about 3 weeks. I started the taper on June 1, 2022. When I reached 30 mg I began having a tingling face and head. Since holding I have started to experience pretty bad depression ( I did not have depression before taking sertraline. I started it for GAD) and lack of interest in activities. My question is : Should I continue to hold at 31mg until I stabilize? Also, I am planning to slow my DLMT to a much slower pace - something on par with the 10% reduction  from precious month. I used the DLMT to get off of Ativan and it worked well for me. I have been off Ativan for over 4 years. Thank you in advance!

Fp

 

Edited November 17, 2022 by ChessieCat
Resized font

[ChessieCat]

Q:  Is this correct?  You have gone from 50mg Zoloft (1st reduction 1 June 2022) to 30mg Zoloft (~27 October 2022).

 

If you are getting withdrawal symptoms then you are tapering too quickly regardless of the amount you reduce by and what method you use.

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

 

Q:  Did you feel improvement after updosing to 31mg?  If yes, then that confirms that you are experiencing withdrawal symptoms.

 

Altostrata made this comment 2 years ago:

 

On 4/12/2020 at 4:47 AM, Altostrata said:

When you are tapering, if you do it right, you should not feel much in the way of withdrawal symptoms at all.

 

It is important to listen to your body/symptoms and not make another reduction until you are stable.  You might find that SA's tapering method  Why taper by 10% of my dosage? might be better than your current method.  Or you might consider this one:  Brass Monkey Slide

 

The goal of tapering is to get off the drug with minimal withdrawal symptoms and be able to live your life as normally as possible.  Going too fast and having to updose is not good.  The brain likes consistency.  Even though updosing seems? to have worked this time, next time it might not work and could make things worse.

 

[Fp1984]

@ChessieCat yes I have tapered 20 mg sertraline since June 1st. I used a daily liquid microtaper and reduced gradually each day. I used this same method when tapering ativan 5 years ago. As symptoms appeared, I would hold until I felt my "WD normal" and then I would continue on.

I currently am experiencing mild depression and mild anxiety as well as increased tinnitus. The depression and anxiety has improved over the last couple of days. My plan is to hold at 30mg until Jan 1st, giving my CNS and chance to stabilize. I then plan on using the Brass Monkey slide to taper slowly over the next 4 to 5 years. I am in no hurry. My ultimate goal is to step off with no, or minimal, withdrawal symptoms after jumping around .01 mg. Does this sound like a good plan moving forward. 

Thank you,

FP1984

[Fp1984]

@ChessieCat Is it reasonable to expect improvements of my WD normal over the duration of the taper? It would be encouraging to know that some things will improve as I am working toward my final goal of being psych drug free.

Thanks so much 🙏 💓 

[ChessieCat]

I am under the impression that daily tapering a benzo might work okay but that for an AD it is better not to do that.

 

I think with the daily reductions you might be prone to ignoring withdrawal symptoms and carry on regardless, whereas with a 4 week hold you will most likely be better able to notice the withdrawal symptoms and notice the gradual improvement during the reduction cycle.

 

On 11/18/2022 at 5:16 AM, Fp1984 said:

 Is it reasonable to expect improvements of my WD normal over the duration of the taper?

 

There is no way of predicting what is going to happen.  The idea is to taper at a rate that keeps withdrawal symptoms to a minimum.  Listen to your body/symptoms and not reduce again until stable, hold for longer if you are sick or experiencing additional stress from any cause (even holidays which you enjoy might be stressful).  Some members find that the lower their dose gets the slower they need to go, reducing less and/or holding longer.

 

Patience and using non drug coping skills are very important.  It took my 6 years to get off 100mg Pristiq and I have been off successfully for 1 year now.

 

I would suggest that you do not drink alcohol.

[Fp1984]

Healing while tapering?

What exactly is happening to our brain when we taper at 10% (or less) from our previous dose? Is our brain slowly healing? I know some people say you can't heal until you are completely off - I'm just wondering, if during a 3 to 5 year taper, are we actually healing or does the healing take place after we make the final jump?

Thanks!

Edited December 6, 2022 by manymoretodays
title added, after merging to Introduction topic

[manymoretodays]

Hi Fp1984,

@Fp1984

Good question.  And you'll see I merged your last topic back on here, to your Introduction page and it is above.

I would ask that you put a date next to some of your entries into you signature, instead of "currently"......as sometimes, after time, that "currently" isn't really current anymore.  Note the year, month and day, if you know them.

Quick link to get you your signature to edit or update:  Signature edit or update

 

Okay, and this topic might help with your question:

What is happening in your brain?

 

Personally, I think adaptations occur all along the tapering process.  And also that there is further adaptation that occurs even after we are completely off our drug(s).

It's important too, to do things to help us cope, or maybe even things that help with neuroplasticity too.  That ability to repurpose or repair our brains, after the chemical insult.

Neuroplasticity and limbic retraining

 

I hope that answers your question. 

Are you tapering now at all, or where are you at.........please update right here when you can, in your Introduction topic.

 

Okay.  L, P, H, and G,

mmt

Edited December 6, 2022 by manymoretodays
notification added

[Fp1984]

@manymoretodays

Thank you! I have read that post before on Benzo buddies and kind of figured antidepressants were similar in regards to healing. I know that benzos deal more with Gaba  and upregulating the receptors as we taper and heal. I was just curious if the healing process was much different for antidepressants.  Thanks for the Info and pointing me in the right direction. 

Fp

[Fp1984]

@manymoretodays

Good morning,

I have had a setback. I tapered down from 50mg of sertraline to 25mg over the course of 9 months. I was hit with pretty bad depression and dizziness. Long story short, I reinstated to 50 mg and ever since I have had pretty extreme anxiety, very jittery, and unable to rest or relax. I can sleep with the help of an antihistamine. My question is should I stay at 50mg until I stabilize or should I take another course of action ? Thank you so much for taking the time to read and respond. 

FP1984

[Fp1984]

I reinstated sertraline at 50mg after tapering down to 25mg. My doctor talked me into it. I was having such depression, I was desperate for relief. I have been holding at 50mg and now for 4 weeks and realize I should have updosed only a small percentage, if at all. I am now experiencing high anxiety and a hyper sensitive nervous system. What should I do? Hold at 50 & stabilize, drop back to 25, start a new taper at what point? I'm desperate and confused as to what course I should take. 

Thank you for taking the time to reply,

Fp1984

[Fp1984]

I reinstated sertraline at 50mg after tapering down to 25mg. My doctor talked me into it. I was having such depression, I was desperate for relief. I have been holding at 50mg and now for 4 weeks and realize I should have updosed only a small percentage, if at all. I am now experiencing high anxiety and a hyper sensitive nervous system. What should I do? Hold at 50 & stabilize, drop back to 25, start a new taper at what point? I'm desperate and confused as to what course I should take. 

Thank you for taking the time to reply,

Fp1984

[Fp1984]

I'm not sure if I'm posting in The correct areas to get responses. I have not had any responses to this thread. Also the post is pink in color. Does this signify something? Not sure if I'm posting correctly or in the right place. Please advise. Thank you.

[Fp1984]

Can anyone see my previous post?

[Fp1984]

@Gridley I am curious if you are able to see my prior posts. I have not had any responses to my prior posts, so I'm not sure if they are visible. Please let me know if you are abe to view this, as well as my previous post today. Thanks so much.

[Shep]

On 4/10/2023 at 10:33 AM, Fp1984 said:

I reinstated sertraline at 50mg after tapering down to 25mg. My doctor talked me into it. I was having such depression, I was desperate for relief. I have been holding at 50mg and now for 4 weeks and realize I should have updosed only a small percentage, if at all. I am now experiencing high anxiety and a hyper sensitive nervous system. What should I do? Hold at 50 & stabilize, drop back to 25, start a new taper at what point? I'm desperate and confused as to what course I should take. 

Thank you for taking the time to reply,

Fp1984

 

You may want to decrease, but not all the way down to 25 mg. Your system has likely started to adjust to the lower higher dose. 

 

You may want to reduce down to 30 mg and see how you feel. It takes about 4 days for your nervous system to register a change and it may take a few days or weeks for your system to adjust. But over the coming days, you will hopefully feel less of the hyper-reactions as the drug level reduces in your system. 

 

On 4/10/2023 at 6:48 AM, Fp1984 said:

I can sleep with the help of an antihistamine.

 

What antihistamine are you taking? Please let us know the name of the drug, the dose, and the date you started it and place this information in your signature. A direct link is here: 

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

 

What time(s) of the day are you taking these drugs? 

 

Edited April 12, 2023 by Shep
changed "lower" dose to "higher" dose

[Fp1984]

@Shep I'm not sure I was if I was clear. I had tapered down to 25mg sertraline over about 9 months. My doctor suggested that I go back up to 50mg. He thought I may "need" the higher dose to control the lightheadedness I had been experiencing. So, currently I am back at 50 mg. I have been back on 50mg for 4 weeks. I have had high anxiety and jitters with a hyperactive nervous system for the last few weeks. It does seem to be settling down. I realize now, I should not have gone all the way back up to 50mg, but what's done is done. My question is should I stabilize and start tapering from 50mg using the 10% rule and holding for 4 weeks. Or can I drop back down, closer to 25 mg to resume my taper. My thought is I have probably been back up at 50 mg for too long and should probably start all the way over at 50. I hope I am being clear in my explanation. 

Thank you so much!

[Shep]

On 4/11/2023 at 5:36 AM, Shep said:

You may want to decrease, but not all the way down to 25 mg. Your system has likely started to adjust to the lower dose. 

 

Sorry, @Fp1984, this should say: Your system has likely started to adjust to the higher dose (not the lower dose). 

 

The rest of the post is correct - you may want to drop down to 30 mg and see how you feel. 

 

You added doxcylamine to your signature. Do you mean doxylamine? 

 

Please see:

 

Antihistamines for withdrawal insomnia (diphenhydramine, doxylamine, hydroxyzine)

 

We don't recommend adding in antihistamines for sleep. You may develop a dependency and need to taper it. It may also cause paradoxical effects, meaning the drug will cause an alerting effect instead of a sedating effect. You'll have to weigh the pros and cons. 

 

I would decrease the sertraline and see if you can avoid the antihistamine. 

 

Also, please research your PPI - these drugs are notorious for causing vitamin B12 deficiency. At some point, you may also want to taper of it and change your diet to help with the GERD symptoms. 

 

Tips for tapering off stomach acid blockers or PPIs

 

Not something you have to decide to do today, but just placing this here for you to read over as you have time. 

[Fp1984]

@Shep Thank you.

Do you thinking dropping down 20 mg will cause a major increase in side effects. I have alot going on at work and am starting to stabilize after 4 weeks at 50mg. I hate that I have lost all the progress I have made over the last 9 months, but I also don't want to create new problems by dropping too much at one time. Have you heard of people in the past reinstating and after a month, successfully dropping back down to near their previous dose. I'm a little scared but if it can be done without major symptoms I may try. Thoughts? Thanks again for taking the time to help me out. You are a blessing!

Fp1984 

[Shep]

On 4/10/2023 at 10:33 AM, Fp1984 said:

I reinstated sertraline at 50mg after tapering down to 25mg. My doctor talked me into it. I was having such depression, I was desperate for relief. I have been holding at 50mg and now for 4 weeks and realize I should have updosed only a small percentage, if at all. I am now experiencing high anxiety and a hyper sensitive nervous system. What should I do? Hold at 50 & stabilize, drop back to 25, start a new taper at what point? I'm desperate and confused as to what course I should take. 

Thank you for taking the time to reply,

Fp1984

 

Fp, please note my advice was based on what you wrote in this quote, which I highlighted in purplse. 

 

But now you're saying that you're stabilizing. If you are stabilizing and you don't feel like you're getting an adverse reaction to the updose, you may want to hold for a few weeks and completely stabilize. 

 

Or you could make a smaller reduction, such as going down to 45 mg and see how you feel. 

 

Also, you now have added a new drug to the mix (the antihistamine). You'll need to decide if you're going to keep taking that or remove it before dependency sets in. If you do remove it, will you be able to sleep at the higher dose of sertraline? 

 

[Fp1984]

@Shep Thak you! I'm sorry I was unclear. Yes, I am definitely stabilizing. I will hold at 50 for a month or more and begin my taper using the 10% taper and hold method. It may take some years,  but I'm going to try to get off slooowly with minimal side effects. It is definitely harder for me to taper sertraline than it was for me to taper Ativan. I will also begin to taper off the antihistamine.  Thanks again!

[Onmyway]

@Fp1984, I have merged a thread you started in the Tapering forum here. Please keep posts related to your own case to your own intro topic where you can receive advice. General tapering questions can go into the Tapering forum. 

 

OMW

[Shep]

19 hours ago, Fp1984 said:

@Shep Thak you! I'm sorry I was unclear. Yes, I am definitely stabilizing. I will hold at 50 for a month or more and begin my taper using the 10% taper and hold method. It may take some years,  but I'm going to try to get off slooowly with minimal side effects. It is definitely harder for me to taper sertraline than it was for me to taper Ativan. I will also begin to taper off the antihistamine.  Thanks again!

 

Please be careful not to taper both the sertraline and the Ativan at the same time. Please see:

 

The rule of 3KIS: Keep it simple. Keep it slow. Keep it stable.

 

Holding for a month or more sounds like a great plan. Feel free to check in before you make your next reduction and let us know how you're feeling. You may even want to reduce by just 5% to test the waters after your hold. There's no rush. 

[6ofclubs19]

19 hours ago, Fp1984 said:

It may take some years,  but I'm going to try to get off slooowly with minimal side effects.

Hi @Fp1984 My taper started Jan 2022 on 20mg (I’m on Lexapro) and I’m doing a 10% taper every 6 weeks, using the Brass Monkey Slide method. At this rate, it’ll be end of 2024 maybe into 2025 when I’ll have the opportunity to “jump”. So yes, it’s going to take years. 😂I’m currently at 7.57mg.

 

Doing it this way, the slowness of it all, really minimizes the WD effects and softens the strain on your brain, body, spirit. These days, I hardly notice when I drop my weekly 2.5%.

 

Hang in there, just follow the advice of the mods here (they are great), read all the stuff in the links they provide, we got this!

[Fp1984]

3 hours ago, 6ofclubs19 said:

Hi @Fp1984 My taper started Jan 2022 on 20mg (I’m on Lexapro) and I’m doing a 10% taper every 6 weeks, using the Brass Monkey Slide method. At this rate, it’ll be end of 2024 maybe into 2025 when I’ll have the opportunity to “jump”. So yes, it’s going to take years. 😂I’m currently at 7.57mg.

 

Doing it this way, the slowness of it all, really minimizes the WD effects and softens the strain on your brain, body, spirit. These days, I hardly notice when I drop my weekly 2.5%.

 

Hang in there, just follow the advice of the mods here (they are great), read all the stuff in the links they provide, we got this!

Thanks @6ofclubs19 your reply gives me some hope. I tapered ativan about four years ago and it seemed much easier than my current taper of sertraline. I got down to 25 mg of sertraline and reinstated to 50 due to the depression and anxiety I was experiencing. 

Is the Brass Monkey Slide user friendly? I haven't looked at it in detail. I have been using a daily liquid micrtotaper, but it seems to catch up with me and knock me off track. What do you see as the benefits of the Brass Monkey Slide? 

Thanks so much,

Fp1984