Barbarannamated: pain<-->depression...chicken<-->egg

May 26, 2013

I think that the drugs helped me in the beginning, but if you read the beginning of my thread you'll see that everything I was on eventually quit working. Things didn't get better for me until I moved to Colorado. Don't know why - it could have something to do with the elevation above sea level. It wasn't perfect, but I didn't seem to have the deep lows that I had experienced before when I lived at sea level.

I think that years of ADs and benzos have disrupted my endocrine system and it has taken a bit of work to try and get things back in line. Alternative treatments have been very important to my healing, but it takes a lot of effort to track down providers that are willing to support alternative treatments.

It is hard and you aren't getting any support at home. I worry about you ... I'm sending you lots of love and light and hoping that you get a window of relief.

Karma

Karma and everyone... thank you so much for your support and input. I'm not sure why I'm so bad right now, but can't think thru the fog and the time is dragging by (dyschronometria?). Tried to get away to visit friend back east, but couldn't get organized. I freeze when I try to make plans. The airlines probably love me; I've paid for and wasted several airline tickets in last year.

Just to clarify... I'm not suggesting that SS/NRIs should be used. I was never helped and I suspect that my disabling TMJ and gead/neck pain that started shortly after I started Zoloft in 1993 were caused, at least in part, by the Zoloft. I got on the chronic pain train in '93 and became unable to work at all in 2001. Ive never found my place in this world since then and am especially ungrounded now. I wake up every day with nothing to do and I'm a person who needs structure or at least something to look forward to. Holiday weekends are especially difficult. I've been fighting since 1993 and have nothing left. I have none of those pieces of life that keep people going.

Also, dealing with 2 "Frenemies". It seems the most unhealthy of my acquaintsnces are the only ones who communicate with any regularity, possibly getting warped satisfaction out of someone else's situation being worse than their own..? It's difficult when I go for days with no human interaction aside from husband. Tend to settle for wharever is available.

Karma, that's very interesting about the altitude effect. Any theories? Possibly vasculature or oxygenation..?

My point about friend on multiple drugs was only that after many years on many drugs, the body has been so destabilized that it may be more dangerous to try to withdraw. NOT saying that the drugs are correcting anything. I tapered (very sloppily) off of Pristiq because I was feeling good on a dopamine agonist and was never helped by the serotonergics. My doctor did admit that the seronergicz could be "depressogenic" for me. Different than the poopout that most of you experienced.

I would be cautious about suggest tapering to someone like myself who has no support system. To attempt to build a new life under these conditions feels impossible.

Thanks for listening to this broken record, everyone.

May 26, 2013

Hi Barb....

Want to see you get thru the fog Do you perceive, even thru this that there has been some recovery?

About altitude. There may be something to that. I remember a married couple here who both had CFS (EBV)...they moved to Colorado and they got well.

With humidity comes alot of mold. The air is thick. In Colorado the air is dry and the majority of the time it is nice and crisp. Even if it hot during the day, the night air is cleansing and chilly.

The southeast is the mold capital of the world.

Babar for some reason I thought you were in a mountainous region in norther California. How did you feel in Nevada (dry)?

May 26, 2013

Nikki,

Overall, yes I do feel better and more functional. I think that's pushing me to a point of "ok, now move on with life...get it together... make the changes that are long overdue..". Then, I freeze.

I live at about 3000' altitude. I don't like dry weather which we have here and also in Nevada. I already have dry eyes, dry mouth, etc. and feel better with some humidity. I feel comfortable in Florida even in the summer. Strange, I know.

May 27, 2013

I saw the term "existential whiplash" today. Yup. Feels right.

May 30, 2013

Just a note to self..

Tried Armour thyroid 30mg and reacted badly again: anxiety / speedy feeling and confusion / disorientation.

Not tolerating Vyvanse anymore. Have not taken for several months and took one of husband's a few weeks ago. Feels like SPEED whereas it used to bring me up to feeling *normal*.

More family drama that I'm trying hard not to engage in. I feel so ALONE and afraid. Should something happen to husband, I have no idea where I would go. Bag Lady Syndrome...fear of homelessness. I don't know why this strikes me at certain times ~ probably the flare up of family stuff and having no other. Houston is only apparent possibility. Still hoping to get there soon. Girlfriend from Houston may come to California to do a little road trip together. I feel unsure of myself and a little afraid to travel alone.

May 31, 2013

Barb is the Amour too high a dose?

I have the 'bag lady syndrome' every day. It's not likely that it would happen but it scare me too. Many, many women have it.

If you have dry skin, dry eye, yes the humidity would help. It has been raining here for days and days now. Plants love it.

Barb have you and your husband thought about downsizing. I sold my 'big' house right after I lost my job in 2009 and bought a Townhouse right around the corner. Barb I was a nervous wreck back then. My former spouse lost his job, then I lost mine...thank God I sold my home.

I do not have a mortgage any longer.

I understand the housing market in Texas is very good. Alot for your buck

Hugs

May 31, 2013

Nikki,

We can't downsize much more... we live in a 2 room house, about 700 sq. ft.and we're upside down on the mortgage. Lost one house already in the market. We're stuck unless we decided to walk away and then it would be to a senior community of some sort.

It's more complex than the money for me. I have no survivors (assuming I outlive father and sister)... the family ends with me. Feeling the circle of life ending.

June 2, 2013

Hi dear B ..

I am saddened that you have gone through so much ..

But by all accounts things change and they get better..

I know it is hard to think pleasant thoughts when we are suffering, but we must keep walking ..

You are in my prayers ..

Sending you much love, and healing thoughts ..

Xx, Lexi

June 2, 2013

Just to document..

Got my period again for the 2nd month after 2-3 years thinking I was menopausal. I assume it's due to the estrogen I'm on. I got one when first tapering in late 2010 prior to estrogen therapy. It's possible that the SSRIs caused amenorrhea.

June 2, 2013

Barb I don't know the answer to that. Could it just be part of menopause? Not sure at all.

Can ssri's affect our reproductive systems....why not they affect everything else.

Let us know what you find out

June 2, 2013

Nikki,

Serotonin is a neurohormone and effects all hormonal balances, including those governing the reproductive system. Amenorrhea (cesation of menstruation not due to menopause) and infertility are side effect of SSRIs.

June 11, 2013

In Vegas spending time with inlaws... MIL on hospice but still going out shopping, dining, churching, bingo, a few times per week. Family thinks she is in "last days". I feel like I'm being the crazy b*** of the family because she seems quite strong to me. All her labwork is normal, even LFTs (liver cancer). Been going through these "last goodbyes" every holiday and birthday and anniversary for over a year. Extremely draining and triggering my own guilt about family issues and not being there when my mom died last summer. It's all really messing with my head. An 87 yo with cancer maybe shouldnt be going out shopping in 105+° bone dry heat. I've been in bed with terrible migraine and vomiting for 2 days. Living in basic motorhome (not a luxury slide-out rig) with husband and 2 dogs. AC not handling heat well.

When did I become such an ugly, angry person??? Is this drug effect or withdrawal?? This is really messing with my head.

Thanks for listening.

I think my screenname should be "Still Here".

about me · June 12, 2013

87 yo with cancer maybe shouldnt be going out shopping in 105+° bone dry heat. I've been in bed with terrible migraine and vomiting for 2 days. Living in basic motorhome (not a luxury slide-out rig) with husband and 2 dogs. AC not handling heat well.When did I become such an ugly, angry person??? Is this drug effect or withdrawal?? This is really messing with my head.

Cancer goes more slowly as we get older.. seems a little premature for people to be writing your MIL off. I would not feel guilty for not wanting to join the pity party. Actually, I'm surprised she qulifies for hospice.. guess the prognosis is not so good, but that's been for some time and she keeps treckin.

Sorry to hear you are have a miserable headache.. Not sure about any WD related stuff, sounds like the heat, family baggage and close quaters are more than enuf.

June 12, 2013

Hey Barb

I think that doing the last good byes over and over is wearing on a person, even a healthy person. You aren't feeling well and it appears to me that no one has a great deal of concern for you or how you are feeling. I think it is normal to be angry in that situation.

Wish you felt better ... sending you love.

Karma

June 12, 2013

Barb,

I was thinking of you today. Hope you are doing ok.

June 12, 2013

Thanks, everyone. I just can't see any light anvd it's been so long that I've been battling pain off and on - since 1993. Just realized last night that the psychiatrist I went to was a Headache and ADD Specialist. I went to him for headache treatment, not mood. Not sure why that struck me last night.

June 12, 2013

Barb, an ugly, angry person? That's the most ridiculous statement, we all know that. You are so kind, caring, beautiful, compassionate and I love you. You have been so strong through all this time, I really look up to you and you have certainly given me encouragement. Hugs. Xxxxxcc

June 12, 2013

Brab,

Are you feeling a liitle better?? I always enjoy your comments on my thread and appreciate your concern. Please take care.

Aria

June 12, 2013

Thanks, Aria and Fizz.

The pain is a bit better but my mood is really low. I think about death constantly - mine, others - not fear, but anticipation. I've been having a recurring dream in which I see my obituary - my name with age 52 beside it (I'll be 51 in August). It doesn't scare me but seems like a long way off. Who knows...maybe it's symbolic of the start of a new life.

Love you all.

June 12, 2013

Barb you are not an angry, ugly person, most likely you are frustrated and tired or being tired. This may relate to your MIL and the good-byes. First of all they are sad. No question. To revisit sadness over and over again is a draining experience.

For years my mother told us she had congestive heart failure. I was with her at the Cardiologist last year and he told me she does not, nor has she ever had congestive heart failure. For a very long time, we thought she was at the end of her life, and she wasn't.

There were many other instances like this. It was a continuous reminder that 'this was it' and it wasn't. She made up and greatly exagerated health issues. The stress from this has taken a toll on my brother and myself and has gone on for years. My daughter remarked yesterday that she doesn't like when Nana tells us she is going to die. She has been saying this for years. The result is she gets attention (negative kind) and the rest of us feel terrible.

Your MIL really has cancer and how she has gone on this long is amazing. It is tough....forget about WD this is real-life stressful stuff.

Hang in there

June 17, 2013

Just to document..

Got my period again for the 2nd month after 2-3 years thinking I was menopausal. I assume it's due to the estrogen I'm on. I got one when first tapering in late 2010 prior to estrogen therapy. It's possible that the SSRIs caused amenorrhea.

The answer is yes they do... I have many reports from women including myself early menopause and some woman in early 30s included in the list. The Mayo clinic now lists antidepressants as a cause...

"Medications

Certain medications can cause menstrual periods to stop, including some types of:

Antipsychotics
Cancer chemotherapy
Antidepressants
Blood pressure drugs"
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/amenorrhea/DS00581/DSECTION=causes
Nice to find it some place but I believed it before I found it as I have talked to so many who have this problem.

June 17, 2013

Barb,

I was thinking of you today. Hope you are doing ok.

Because these drugs affect our memories when things come back to us this is how it goes... I think it common.

June 17, 2013

In Vegas spending time with inlaws... MIL on hospice but still going out shopping, dining, churching, bingo, a few times per week. Family thinks she is in "last days". I feel like I'm being the crazy b*** of the family because she seems quite strong to me. All her labwork is normal, even LFTs (liver cancer). Been going through these "last goodbyes" every holiday and birthday and anniversary for over a year. Extremely draining and triggering my own guilt about family issues and not being there when my mom died last summer. It's all really messing with my head. An 87 yo with cancer maybe shouldnt be going out shopping in 105+° bone dry heat. I've been in bed with terrible migraine and vomiting for 2 days. Living in basic motorhome (not a luxury slide-out rig) with husband and 2 dogs. AC not handling heat well.When did I become such an ugly, angry person??? Is this drug effect or withdrawal?? This is really messing with my head.Thanks for listening.I think my screenname should be "Still Here".

Sounds like withdrawal to me... angry B that was me in withdrawal there is no way in hell I would put myself in a trailer in 105 degree heat ...out of not wanting to suffer and not wanting to hurt anyone else... I have been and at times continue to be a relative hermit when things are bad I stay home or some place where I can get all my personal needs meant ... I am amazed you attempted to be there to support you spouse..? MIL? is that why... when you obviously are in more need than she is right now... or at least feel worse.

There are some words that come to mind but like I have said anger and B are a huge part of this and I do not want to be either here.. to you when your already feeling so bad. I hope your home soon and just say no when further demands are made on you...

June 17, 2013

Barb, an ugly, angry person? That's the most ridiculous statement, we all know that. You are so kind, caring, beautiful, compassionate and I love you. You have been so strong through all this time, I really look up to you and you have certainly given me encouragement. Hugs. Xxxxxcc

Have to agree. Maybe appropriately angry, which is healthy, not ugly. Maybe frustrated and hurting and dealing with a lot of hard stuff already, and not getting much support, and struggling sometimes. But still always courageous and compassionate. You're an inspiration and a friend, Barb.

June 19, 2013

Sorry if I've asked this before Barb, but what anaesthesia did you have for the oral surgery and did you have any pain relief. Would be grateful for a reply. Hope your day has been doable, are you feeling any better? Much hugs and love. Xxxxxxxx

June 19, 2013

Sorry if I've asked this before Barb, but what anaesthesia did you have for the oral surgery and did you have any pain relief. Would be grateful for a reply. Hope your day has been doable, are you feeling any better? Much hugs and love. Xxxxxxxx

Fizz,I was put to sleep with IV sedation/ anesthesia containing Versed, Propofol, fentanyl. The fentanyl is for pain. I'm not familiar with what anesthesia is used for longer procedures. For post-op pain, I was given hydrocodone which I do fine with. It helps a bit with anxiety also. I hope this helps a bit, Fizz. I suspect your blood loss must be making you feel dreadful. I'm still battling headache that began when away. Off to acupuncture appointment shortly. Mother in law is expected to pass in day or two so preparing to travel again. I admit that I'm a bit surprised as she was still going out of house to a doctor appointment 2 days ago.

June 20, 2013

Thanks a million Barb, hope the acupuncture gives you some relief. So sorry about your mother in law. Take care. Lots of hugs. Xxxxxxxxxx

June 22, 2013

My mother in law passed away peacefully a few days ago. She lived a very full life up until the very end. I wasn't the only one shocked at how quickly she went downhill over the last week. Their neighbors had seen her out and about and were very surprised. Husband was sad, but the family seems relieved most of all. We will travel in the next few days so husband can attend the brief, private identification ceremony prior to cremation.

I have a lot of intense mixed emotions. My own mother died almost a year ago but I was too weak with WD to travel to see her or attend funeral. Lots of family emotions being dredged up including rage (discussed in Toxic Family thread). I feel angry that my mother suffered for so long, alive but not living... too weak to get out of bed or house except for once every few weeks for years. She lived an awful life, isolated in a pretty house.

Rage is a totally unfamiliar emotion to me. Very scary. I can definitely understand how violence can result. I'll be ok.

June 22, 2013

I dont know what is going on but very scary. Had acupuncture for pain on Wednesday. Maybe too stimulating. Couldn't communicate well with acupuncturist. Thursday had hair colored and broke down in salon. Not many people there and I had already told them my MIL just died, so assumed it was that. But have been EXTREMELY disoriented and rageful and overall weird feeling since then. I feel like something has snapped in me.

Please help. Any veterans experience things like this?

about me · June 22, 2013

I dont know what is going on but very scary. Had acupuncture for pain on Wednesday. Maybe too stimulating. Couldn't communicate well with acupuncturist. Thursday had hair colored and broke down in salon. Not many people there and I had already told them my MIL just died, so assumed it was that. But have been EXTREMELY disoriented and rageful and overall weird feeling since then. I feel like something has snapped in me.Please help. Any veterans experience things like this?

Barb, it sounds like somehow your MILs death brought out some of the rage you have been suppressing. Sorry this is being so difficult.

Skyler

June 22, 2013

Oh Barb, I'm so sorry for the loss of your MIL. I agree with Skyler, I think that something in her passing is bringing up issues that you may have buried and not dealt with.

Do you feel guilty that you can go to your MIL's ceremony, but you weren't well enough to go to your mother's service? I think that may be normal, but I don't think it is right. You were very fragile when your mother passed, it was much further away and the environment was laced with intense toxic family issues. I think the toxic family issues alone would have kept me away.

I also wonder if there is some anger because your spouse expects you to go to your MIL's service, but evidently was not that helpful or supportive when you were dealing with your mother's passing.

When you draw parallels between your MIL's life and your own mother's life ... well, I'm not sure that is helpful other than as an observation. If it makes you angry take a look at that to see what it reflects in your own life.

I hope I'm not triggering issues for you, I'm just trying to draw out some possibilities that you can take a look at.

I'm sending you lots of love and light to help you through this difficult time.

Karma

June 22, 2013

Barb, my sympathies are with you both in the loss of your MIL and in dealing with this aftermath. I'm sorry. Meimei

June 22, 2013

Barb, I wouldn't give the rage a second thought. I have always been the most placid, laid back person BUT, just a couple of times in the past few months I had intense feelings of rage in the evening which came out of the blue. I can't even remember what was going on prior to it, a small domestic disagreement I think. The emotion only lasted a few hours, it was boiling up in me and I didn't say much about it, think I just went to bed early. It was scary though and just so alien to me, told myself it was wd and next day it had gone. That's my experience. Thinking of you. Hugs. Xxxxxxxxx

June 22, 2013

Karma.... yes yes yes to all. But you didn't trigger anything. It's all *right there* always haunting me. I feel like nobody in my real life has my back. My dad accused me of making up all of the health stuff, MRI included, and said I disgraced the family by not being at funeral (that my mom did not want). Husband barely acknowledged her death. My MIL, OTOH, demanded attention every step of the way for the 17 years of her cancer. It's not that she did anything wrong, just very different from my mother who made herself as non intrusive as possible at all times. I'm very much like her.

Thanks, everyone. I'm still very anxious and disoriented. The worst I've been in a long time..

I am not invited to the brief identification ceremony. Only the immediate family, no inlaws or grandkids. It's ok with me.

June 22, 2013

I often have the sensation of not knowing what is real and what isn't. I assume that's courtesy of drugs and withdrawal. It's very strong right now. I dont recognize my own life.

June 23, 2013

"Derealization" as it's somewhat clumsily called. It'll pass I'm sure. Very sorry for your loss Barbara, please allow yourself to mourn however much you need to.

Barbarannamated: pain<-->depression...chicken<-->egg

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